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From a book I'm working on. A girl's trying to fix her beloved stuffed animal.

>>25407487
generally, it's okay, although you might want to rethink the pacing. however it's hard to judge that without knowing what you've planned for the whole

that said,
>present tense
no no no no no
>the hurt brother
this sentence was a bit weak for the emotional impact
>the attempt after
urgh no
I get what you mean but no
>like warm butter
a horribly overused cliché, and not a very sensible one at that. you are clearly trying to speak with a little girl's voice, but this isn't something a little girl would naturally say

>>25407493
>without knowing what you've planned for the whole
yeah. this part comes after a long tirade of exhaustion and frustration by the girl of doing chores all day, so I was hoping "the hurt brother" comes off as dismissive because she doesn't care right now. She's usually a very sensitive person, but her stuffed animal is the most precious thing in the world to her.

The narrative voice is 3rd person omniscient, and the character narrating is literally omniscient, describing to the audience what is happening in real time. I understand how not everybody likes present tense and I'm willing to accept that.

what other kind of simile would you suggest, other than warm butter?

>>25407507
> this part comes after a long tirade of exhaustion and frustration by the girl of doing chores all day, so I was hoping "the hurt brother" comes off as dismissive because she doesn't care right now.
I sensed that, and I feel that as the emotional climax to which you've been building up to,
It makes very little sense to spend so many words on the room and on the basket, but dump the brother in all of 7 words. and in fact, so impersonally that you didn't even use his name, give it its own paragraph, or even capitalise Wesson's 1-word dialogue. Furthermore, you told Wesson's reaction - hurt - rather than showed it, despite copiously showing lots of other details.
I feel that this is misplaced emphasis.

>what other kind of simile would you suggest
I would write: Hesitantly, her skin suddenly nervously damp, she pokes Beary, and is surprised to find the needle point slide right through Beary like he was hardly there. She will have to be careful not to prick herself.

>>25407487
Trying way too hard to get cutesy, have some respect for your character

>>25407520
I appreciate the feedback. Wesson is typically very talkative and imposing, so the plain "okay" is meant to contrast that. The contrast (not present in the exerpt) is the intended emphasis. Dottie is the exclusive viewpoint character.

>I would write...
oh, uhm, that's four adverbs in one sentence. I subscribe more to brevity, and only add descriptions which clearly impact character choices. The lists of objects are written to imply length and thoroughness of the search. When it comes to carefulness and pricking, well, that's just spoiling it...

>>25407532
Dottie is a sheltered, oversensitive eight-year-old with an unhealthy attachment to her stuffed animal.

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against my better judgement i submit my naked writing to you people once again. i got feedback from a friend about the ‘I have nothing’ repetition at the beginning being unnecessary, just haven’t gotten around to figuring out how to replace it yet.

>>25407546
well, I *am* writing off the cuff here
>that's four adverbs in one sentence
I know
I considered "Hesitantly, her skin now damp with nerves", simply to avoid that, but I felt it would not flow with the tone and pace of your excerpt. also, I felt that the overall excerpt sorely needed some emotion.

the usual advice for adverbs applies when they are used in lieu of stronger description, or in ways which tell rather than show. in my opinion, it does not apply to "X was hardly there" because this is a common turn of phrase.

>I subscribe more to brevity, and only add descriptions which clearly impact character choices. The lists of objects are written to imply length and thoroughness of the search.
I found that paragraph too short, and lacking description of the bedroom, leading to white room syndrome.

>When it comes to carefulness and pricking, well, that's just spoiling it...
you spent a whole paragraph yourself trying to bring the reader into the mind of a little girl. I wrote just 2 sentences, and not only does it tell us what Dottie is feeling at this very moment, it also breaks up the monotony of narrating action alone for a whole paragraph.
characters' actions and their thoughts, emotions, and reactions should be interspersed in every other line.

recently I re-read Coraline. the longest segment in the book without an emotion being described is 16 sentences, and its absence is clearly intended the absence of Coraline's parents. in your entire excerpt, you've only described emotions with 3 words: "mad", "hurt", and "muted".
I know you are trying to signal emotion by showing actions, but it's a very demanding style, and I'm not sure it works for you.

>>25407548
lots of poor word choices, because firstly you don't know what the words you use really mean and then you compound that mistake by trying to write poetically but because you don't know what the words really mean, they make even less sense.

for example,
>innskeeper
innkeeper
>chimes
?
>an order for dinner
a dinner order
>paddle
oar
>fizzing
bubbling
>but I've already used that
yes, so it should be a hint that the entire sentence is too purple when you start running out of synonyms to say the same thing over and over
>tidily
neatly
>and lays of the land
and the lay of the land
>seen
watched

are you ESL?

>>25407583
The past several pages were setting up bringing them into her mind, and this is the natural conclusion. It's a symptom of sharing excerpts.

>characters' actions and their thoughts, emotions, and reactions should be interspersed in every other line
I fundamentally disagree with this, or at least how you think it should be executed. It's important to give cause to every effect, but those correlations transcend line structure. Inference carries the load of every nuanced story.

>>25407590
>a dinner order
It’s supposed to be an order for ingredients to serve dinner to guests that night. An innkeeper wouldn’t be ordering dinner at their own inn.
>neatly
I think tidily fits well here, his paddling is meant to be deliberate and clean in form as if it’s something he does often. Actions can be done tidily.
>chiming on
This is a common phrase used to convey someone going on and on about a topic or discussion. Harping on might be better here, though.
>bubbling
Bubbling is the visual, fizzing intended as the sound, though I’ll admit this is all first draft and that part feels convoluted.
>watched
Seen is used for a moment of unintentional observation, watched would be deliberate. As the man in the boat is seen only fleetingly and unintentionally, I used seen. The whole point is whether the viewing attention is deliberate or not, reflected further in the emphasis of ‘being unseen’ in areas with low populations or no human traffic.

I agree with the rest, though. Some typos and extrapolating plurals where they’re not required. Oar is the word I was searching for but escaped my mind so thanks for pointing that out.

>>25407590
Actually paddle is the correct word here. Made me look up paddle vs oar, paddles are free handed and oars are fastened. The visual I had in mind was a single paddle free-handed by the man in the boat.

Thanks for reading and your response anyway.

>>25407609
>It’s supposed to be an order for ingredients to serve dinner to guests that night. An innkeeper wouldn’t be ordering dinner at their own inn.
that just makes it worse, because now the words chosen are even further away from what you had in mind
and once again demonstrates that you don't know well enough how words are used, because "a dinner order" is also commonly used to describe a chef's direction to his kitchen to fulfil a guest's order
>I think tidily fits well here, his paddling is meant to be deliberate and clean in form as if it’s something he does often. Actions can be done tidily
I know that was what you meant, and I am telling you that "neatly" is the usual word that native English speakers would use
the 2 words are synonyms but in this context "neatly" is more commonly used
>This is a common phrase used to convey someone going on and on about a topic or discussion
"chime in" is the common usage in the context of describing conversation, and it means to join a conversation suddenly
chime in, Oxford: to join or interrupt a conversation
it is exactly the opposite of what you thought it was, which illustrates my point perfectly
>Harping on might be better here, though.
yes
harp on, Oxford: to keep talking about something in a boring or annoying way
>Bubbling is the visual, fizzing intended as the sound, though I’ll admit this is all first draft and that part feels convoluted.
fizz is the onomatopoeic word commonly used to describe high-pressure gas escaping a container, e.g. the fizz of opening a soda can
Oxford helpfully adds: makes a long sound like an "s"
rivers definitely do not fizz
T.H. White said "burbly"; Wordsworth "murmur"; and Tennyson bicker, bubble, and babble
but not "fizz"
>Seen is used for a moment of unintentional observation, watched would be deliberate
not at all. "seen" is neutral.
a moment of observation, sometimes implied to be unintentional, would be "glimpse"
glimpse, Oxford: a sight of somebody/something for a very short time

>>25407675
>used to describe a chef’s direction to his kitchen
Which isn’t what’s happening here.
>just use the most common word
I prefer tidily. I don’t think one ‘neatly paddles’.

Chiming in and chiming on are two different terms. Chiming in is to interrupt or join a conversation, chiming on is to go on about something.

Correct, that is one use of the word fizz.

Glimpse isn’t correct here.

Thanks again for reading.

>>25407675
Also the ‘fizzing’ would be the bubbles rising to the surface from his paddle churning the water. Anyone who has jumped in a pool can tell you water does, in fact, fizz.

>>25407695
>Glimpse isn’t correct here
because "a moment of" suddenly did not mean "a very short time"?
>chiming on is to go on about something
[citation needed]

>>25407709
and anyone who has actually paddled neatly can tell you that it doesn't make any sound anywhere near approaching a fizz

thinking about posting some of my screenplay

>>25407715
I consneed. Try not to be such a dick, eh?

>>25407740
I wasn't being a dick. if I was being a dick, you'd know. and even if I was being a dick, who's trying to help who out here, eh? you know what's the dickiest move I could've done? to tell you that what you wrote was fine, knowing full well it wasn't.

by the way, the reason why "neatly" is more often used than "tidily" is that "tidy" is the same in verb form whereas "neat" is not. hence when forming an adverb, as in this case, we instinctively use the word that is more explicitly an adjective. and to avoid the following:
>she tidied everything away tidily
>she tidied everything away neatly

>>25407754
Well I want critique but the ESL comment was unnecessary. Especially since I am a victim of the Texas education system and actively trying to improve my grasp on English by my own motivation! Yeah tidily doesn’t work I looked into why and I’ve revised a few sentences throughout the section. I think as a first draft what I was more after was whether the philosophical aspect was coming across at all, but probably not considering the inaccuracies you pointed out. I know what I’m after though, and those critiques do help.

>>25407754
Btw what’s the best way to get a grasp on this type of nuance without going to university for English? Just reading more?

>>25407762
Cheers
>>25407771
Read more, lots more, and of the good stuff, the classical stuff, not current YA slop. Actually learn the formal basics of English grammar (university not required, just google it) and apply it to what you read, instead of winging it like most people do. Analyse the use of every unfamiliar new word, phrase, and idiom, applying what you know of grammar rules, and especially noting context and tenses. Question everything, ask of everything, "why?" And of course, remember the answers.

Applies to life in general, not just language.

If I post some of my screenplay, will anyone read it?

>>25408013
Only one way to find out. Be sure to give details on what it's about and what commentary you're looking for.

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Okay, here we go. It's about women on a weird hike. It's most of act 1, but not "the inciting event" yet. I've already finished a first draft of the whole story, and I'm on a second draft now.
Mainly interested in feedback: does it make sense? do you get what's happening? And is it interesting to read? something where you want to know what happens?
thanks

>>25407801
>not current YA slop
What if that's what I want to write?

>>25408108
then you still should read classics instead so your YA slop is at least better than others duh! the copy is never better than the source material.

>>25408030
Nothing interesting is happening. You need to hook your viewer and keep them hooked. There's a lot of competition for viewers. Also, transitions are right-justified.

>>25408030
I agree with >>25408202. Are you sure all of this semi-exposition is important to the plot? Will any key information be lost of you take, say, half of this out? It's hard to discern anything remarkable about these characters in their given situation; they're unexceptionally ordinary.

My opening chapter is just a giant wall of fucking exposition and it's boring as shit
What do

>>25408250
The classic solution is to reveal the details contained in the exposition through action and character development.

>>25408252
That is a good solution for how to communicate expository details, but not for how to start a story

>>25408255
You obviously don't simply transform the exposition, in place, into action and character development. You spread it out throughout the story so that the details contained in the exposition are revealed as needed, in an order that hooks the reader and makes them want to know more. C'mon, this is basic stuff.

>>25408202
>>25408231
Thanks for reading, I appreciate the feedback.
Yes, one of my concerns is that it takes too long to get to the action (it starts the very next scene actually, hopefully the suspense felt built up?). But my goal is to show the characters changing over the course of the script. They'll be forced to become different, non-ordinary people by the end (one of them more than the others). I'll probably need to cut/condense some of this though, or find a way to break it up somehow.
Any thoughts on the writing quality?
Also, I don't have any transitions? (Other than FADE IN, which I've always seen left aligned.) I do use mini-slugs though.

>>25408262
>C'mon, this is basic stuff.
And this is why you're alone on a 4chan thread in 2026 instead of out in the real world with actual friends

>>25408269
And this is why you can't write for shit (by your own admission >>25408250 BTW)

>>25408263
No one is going to wait 20 minutes for something to happen. You need to engage your viewer much sooner, and keep engaging them.

>>25408274
Trying to argue with me by agreeing with me is a pretty shitty strategy to fulfill your incessant need for conflict and disagreement so you can feel superior, man

>>25408255
You should start the moment (or moments before) your main character begins to devote themselves to their story-long goal. Not with them waking up, but picking up the sword for the first time. Not waiting at the table at the restaurant, but when they see the love interest. Not when they get elected, but when they enact their first government order. Do you see where I'm going with this? It would demand that you thoroughly comprehend the setting outside of the novel, because those details won't be easily accessible in the text itself. The reader should only learn the setting details when they impact the plot/characters' actions.

>>25408310
I wasn't arguing with you; I was trying to help you. Then you came out of nowhere >>25408269 with nonsequitur seething.

>>25408321
That might actually be really great advice
Thanks man

>>25408294
Thank you, you're right
I have some ideas

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>>25408330
>>25408340
Both of you could probably be helped by a book that explains how to maintain reader engagement.

>>25408352
Thanks Mr. Swain

Is Victoria out yet?

>>25408352
Thanks, I'll add it to my list.
I realize how badly I fucked up now

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>>25408368
He died in 1992, genius. Also, this book gets great reviews.

>>25408375
Its on LibGen. Also, if you're willing to learn and grow, then you're already in the top 5% of people in this thread.

>>25408377
>Also, this book gets great reviews.
Why would that matter? 99% of writers fail so why would I care what those same 99% think?

>>25408383
Eh, I'm old and prefer hard copy. My local used store has a copy for $10, I'll grab it tomorrow

>>25408352
Swain had shitty commercial success especially given his industry connections and he's also decades out of touch with the modern audience and publishing industry.
You're a rube if you take grifters like this seriously, but especially if you hold up Swain as gospel.
At least Sanderson sold books and is modern

>>25408392
By that logic, we shouldn't care what you think.
>>25408403
The principles outlined in that book are timeless. You haven't even read it. And, unlike Swain, you have no advice to offer us.

>>25408406
>By that logic, we shouldn't care what you think.
You shouldn't. Just like we shouldn't care about yours. That was obviously the point, yes.
If you want advice, get it from authors you respect. Not self help gurus who write about how to do X when they couldn't do X themselves.

>>25408108
Then you'd still need to do all that in order to know what words mean and use them well

>>25408180
This too however
JK Rowling had a classical education and it shows

>>25408321
This

>>25408250
People tend to forgive the 1st chapter if it explains a bit more than it should, but you should already set the stakes and the personal impact of the plot hy the end of chapter 1.

I am one of those who hate the post-modern style where the very first couple of sentences are:
>The battleship USS Enterprise had been at action stations for three hours, and Gunnery Officer Bruce Wayne was dying for a piss. But you couldn't stop Operation Pacific Rimjob, the largest naval assault the US Navy had attempted since Desert Storm, just for one sailor to hit the loo. He turned to Captain Leia Organa and reported, "I have a firing solution on those Korean cruisers, Captain."
No, you needn't and shouldn't begin a novel like this, I believe. But by the end of the first chapter your character should be introduced and have begun the plot arc with the first crisis.

>>25408423
>No, you needn't and shouldn't begin a novel like this, I believe.
Can you elaborate? What is the "this" you're objecting to here?

>>25407695
Nobody has ever said "chiming on" to describe somebody making noises anon, unless those noises are particularly chime-like. I think of a lot of anon's other points are nitpicky but that is an odd turn of phrase

>>25407487
The door comes open. Dottie searches the nightstand while Wesson opens the closet.
"Won't they be mad?" he asks, glancing over his shoulder. His sister doesn’t reply.
They finger through the drawers but only find keys, papers, books, toiletries, shoes, belts, mom’s perfumes, dad’s deodorants. Wesson holds up a pair of underwear and his face feels hot, when Dottie yells, "Here!" and pulls out a basket from under the bed.
They sit together on the carpet, legs folded beneath them.
"Do you need help?" he asks her, watching as she unwinds a spool of thread.
After missing the eye of the needle again and again, Dottie sighs.
"I know how mom does it,” she says, scrunching her fact at her younger brother.
"Let me try,” he says.
Dottie slaps his hand away, and says, "I've got it.”
The boy gets to his feet and leaves the room. When the thread refuses to obey, Dottie throws the implements against the wall. It clatters and settles onto the floor.
She stares at the bedroom, at the colors around her which seem dull in comparison to her pink painted walls.
Why do my parents prefer this? she wonders. Doesn’t dad want a bed in the shape of a rocket too, like Wesson?
She runs her fingers along the skirting until they find the needle, then starts again.
Now the thread slips through the needle, and the needle sails through the thread. She holds up Beary, whose bindings have lost adhesion, and pokes him. The needle goes through his furred abdomen, out the other end, then the thread follows, and she tightens it all.

I'd like to observe that way women talk to each other when they hate each other but can't make it obvious since women are not confrontational.

>>25408444
A very fascinating iteration. More than anything, it eases me to know that the fear of present tense is nothing but an exaggerated preference.

In your opinion, what does this version structurally succeed at better than the original? I have an understanding of its tradeoffs myself, but I want to know your process. I plainly admit that the room description could use tweaking on my end.

>>25408467
>the fear of present tense is nothing but an exaggerated preference.
It's justified because it's difficult for most writers to pull off
Your excerpt is one such example

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Guys, should I buy Microsoft Surface tablet for writing? I'm not using my laptop anymore because it's boring. My laptop still runs Windows 10 anyway.

>>25408510
No

>>25408510
>microslop
no
pen and paper, like the great masters used to do
then type out your work when you edit your draft

>>25407493
Some of the stuff you are complaining about is literally just matters of personal taste.
Like dislike of present tense.

>>25408013
I will fully admit I won't read the whole thing.
I will read single scenes + context add on.

>>25408250
Earn the exposition and save explanation for later when the reader is already invested.
Start instead with a mini-story or mini-arc that has a hook for the rest of the story.

>>25408510
No. Why would typing on a windows tablet aid your writing?
Unless you are doing digital art I would recommend against using a tablet for drafting.

>>25408540
>Some of the stuff you are complaining about is literally just matters of personal taste.
I explained why I objected, however, so you can judge by the reasoning I gave rather than simply dismiss it as "because I prefer the tate of duck, not chicken"
>Like dislike of present tense.
I don't mind present tense. I've even read and enjoyed 2nd person present tense. but I know it's hard to write well, which is why most published novelists don't write in present tense, and why I strongly suggest not writing in present tense.

Most anons here - myself included - would be far better off learning to walk before trying to climb K2.

>>25408448
Lots of backhanded compliments or comments that sound normal on the surface but point out a flaw of the other person. Insincere apologies when they go a step too far. Long cold silences when they're both on the verge of violence but can't because they're in public and don't want to cause a scene. To anyone not in the know they may seem like incredibly good friends with the 'compliments' and fake fawning.

>>25408564
The ego on you is enormous.

>>25408448
Where are these non confrontational women at?
Most women I have know decently well are confrontational to the point of lacking self preservation instincts.

>>25407590
>are you ESL?
>>25407762
>Well I want critique but the ESL comment was unnecessary

I don't know if its the same autist, but people on this board will slap you with the "Are you ESL?" on a perfectly functional piece of english writing with only a few spelling errors. More proof that the morons on this site are just crab's in a bucket

Take that anon's advice with a grain of salt. "Read more classics, read more classics," Just elitist garbage.

>>25408748
No this is what Hollywood thinks it is. I'm trying to find some well-written examples of the real article.

>>25408411
He wasn't a mere self-help guru; after a decent career writing short stories (which paid in those days), he became a college professor, was in demand as a speaker at writers' conferences, and was eventually inducted into a Professional Writer's Hall Of Fame. You're simply crapping on him for no defensible reason at all.
And if you really believed no one should care about your opinion, and vice versa, then why are you even in this thread? Just to troll?

>>25408510
You can use Rufus to migrate pretty much any Windows 10 machine to Windows 11, if that's your concern. Just check for unofficial reports of compatibility and go for it!
>>25408539
The "great masters" did that because they had to. There's no reason not to use technology, unless you're a masochist.
>>25408549
"Tablets" come with attached/detachable keyboards. Did you really not know that?

>>25408542
I posted the first few scenes here: >>25408030

>>25408492
I didn't say yours was *easier* to read, I said it was easy to read, and I could confidently say that because I don't have the bias of having written it.

I don't think you know why it's difficult, either. To you, it's a vague instinct that you've never tried to elaborate on. A notable contrast is the length of the sentences and the placement/number of prepositions. Perhaps that improves the flow, instead of a start and stop, which is contradictory to the idea of present tense. I think if force-feeds perspective a little much, with "His sister doesn't reply" and "scrunching her fact at her younger brother," but their placement contributes to the healthy pacing.

You should try explaining your opinion sometimes, no?

>>25408467
>In your opinion, what does this version structurally succeed at better than the original? I have an understanding of its tradeoffs myself, but I want to know your process. I plainly admit that the room description could use tweaking on my end.

I was the person who posted your edited excerpt, so I’ll reply to your question. In my opinion it removes the fluff and keeps the flow moving. Keep in mind I edited your work in minutes, so there’s always room for improvement. Biggest issue I personally saw in your excerpt is unnecessary detail, right off the bat we begin with: “with a chunky twist, the door comes open.” The “chunky twist” adds nothing to the sentence and actually comes across as weirdly worded.

There’s also the issue of over explaining, even though it’s shown not told, that drags the story down.

For example when the kids pull out the tools to stitch the bear back together: “"Here!" Dottie pulls a basket from under the bed. A knit in progress, a full pin cushion, thimbles, scissors, and three colors of thread. They sit together on the carpet floor, Wesson watching her fiddle with a spool. She's not dextrous.”

You can remove all that unnecessary detail and just have one observing the other fiddle with a spool, the reader will confer what they’re playing with. Also adding “she’s not dexterous,” is already explaining what we’re told, we see she’s fiddling with the spool, fiddling as a word choice gives us the sense that she’s not adept at what she is doing. It’s the equivalent of saying: “She struggles with using the spool. She’s not good at it.”

The whole “adulting” section needs no explanation. And lastly, you have good rhythm in sections, but its placement doesn’t make sense. For example: “She squints harder, switches hands, switches angles, switches poses.” Sounds nice, but the rhythm has flow, which is in contrast to what’s actually happening, she’s stilted, awkward, struggling, not free-flowing. It also comes very shortly after this: “They see keys, papers, books,
toiletries, shoes, belts, perfumes, deodorants...” Having this coupleting so close together is distracting in my opinion, use one or the other.

At the very end, the girl threading the bear can also be condensed to carry the same message.

My advice would be to read the whole passage out loud, preferably to someone, and watch their reaction.

>>25408785
>same autist
no
>only a few spelling errors
if in one paragraph I count three outright mistakes or misused words, how many would then appear in a typical 100,000-word novel? "a few"?
>crab's
crabs

i have scrapped more pages than i have kept. 98 pages scrapped, 47,000 words. only ~30 pages still remain. my story will be better for it.

>>25408872
If that's really what you want then it's not going to be very interesting. In reality they'd ignore or avoid each other entirely. A situation where they're forced to be next to each other would have them talk about nothing but the most surface level shit to avoid escalation or just sit in silence.

>>25408872
>examples of the real article
they would be gushingly polite to each other and compliment each other but throw in just one or two little barbs after many minutes of conversation, like
>oh I'm sorry my husband is not on good terms with yours, he's not very good at suffering fools
or
>you must take good care of yourself dear, we should hit the gym more often, we're all getting old [said by the youngest and skinniest of the lot]
but it's really more about what they say to their friends rather than to each other, i.e. talking shit about the woman they dislike to everyone else, just not to that woman's face

'Sup nerds, first time writing and sharing stuff. The bots described this as a prose poem or lyrical vignette. I hope you destroy me to the best of your abilities. Enjoy, or not:

We are walking through the city on a road paved with stone. Going nowhere. The sky is greying and a drizzle starts. We look for some cover. A tower is near, open, and we go inside. It is kind of filthy, but at least we're sheltered. We look around, trying to piece together what this place is. The rain picks up, but some stray rays of sun still make it to the tower. Water begins to flood the tower, so we decide to go upstairs. With no rush, though. The water has been taking its time, too. The walls are yellow ochre. Probably enhanced by the light that's coming in. It feels like such a warm place, these stairs. We reach the end of them and there's a door, leading onto a little terrace with a couple of tables, with wrought-iron café chairs. The rain has stopped at this point, and the terrace is lit by the sunset, making everything look like it's made of gold. I look at you and notice your straight brown hair catching the light, your pale skin, gentle smile, and your warm brown eyes. And I'm hit by such a feeling of melancholy. Yet I wish nothing more than to be here with you. And you here with me.

>>25408985
I can understand the frustration with constantly only ever reading first drafts on this board, because 99 percent of the time they ARE going to read like shit and have tons of errors, but the whole "Are you ESL?' thing is the equivalent of going up to people in the gym and asking if they're disabled because they can't bench 300

>>25407487
this is a weird fetish

>>25409088
I concur. This is definitely a prose poem or lyrical vignette.

>>25409090
>the whole "Are you ESL?' thing is the equivalent of going up to people in the gym and asking if they're disabled because they can't bench 300
I asked because the number of misunderstood words was unusual

>>25408881
>a decent career writing short stories
No he did not have a decent career in actually selling fiction. Not by any definition.
He explains how to sell but he couldn't sell himself. You are such a rube.

>>25409097
do you often associate children with sexual arousal?

>>25409153
what are some of your favorite books

>>25409163
Brandon Sanderson's The Way of Kings
Twilight
Harry Potter
50 Shades of Grey

How about you?

>>25409179
ugh. you're so normal, your normalcy makes normality the norm

>>25409179
:\ i was legitimately asking.

>>25408981
A very sincere and logical evaluation. I will adjust accordingly.

>>25409187
With some kind of ulterior motive, given the reply chain

>>25409179
that hideous strength
the map and the territory
prometheus and atlas
>>25409198
that wasn't me sir, and your replies aroused my curiosity.

>>25409153
You are completely missing the point, I suspect deliberately. There are all sorts of way one can write that will turn off the reader and cause them to drop your work. Swain's book covers those anti-patterns, explains why they're anti-patterns, and guides the reader to more productive modes of expression. Since recent writing samples included the anti-patterns of exposition, melodrama, and not hooking the reader immediately, I believed that mentioning Swain's work would be helpful. It's impossible to write a book that guarantees something will sell; even if one produces good work, there are many other factors, e.g. publicity, being aligned with the zeitgeist, sheer luck, etc. J.K. Rowling was on track to being a failure until a publisher's young daughter read the Harry Potter books and loved them. Herman Melville was completely unsuccessful in his time; Moby Dick was reevaluated on the 100th anniversary of his birth (by which time he was long dead) and now it's part of the Western canon. I could go on. Your argument is a red herring, and reeks of arrogance.

>>25409234
I was annoyed because you repeatedly insisted Swain wrote fiction that sells. He didn't.
You yourself snuck in his credentials in selling fiction (credentials that dont actually exist) as if they're a reason to listen to his advice.

>>25409157
I aint the one who wrote it freak

>>25409253
Getting a short story published counts as a sale. He also managed to get ten novels published. Are you expecting him to be a billionaire, like Stephen King? The bottom line is, Techniques of the Selling Writer has a lot of good advice that anons in this thread would be wise to heed.

>>25409264
>Getting a short story published counts as a sale. He also managed to get ten novels published. Are you expecting him to be a billionaire, like Stephen King?
So disingenuous
He published ten novels and none of them have more than 15 ratings on goodreads? That's way worse than I thought.
If you can't see why doubting a book called "Techniques of the Selling Writer" authored by someone who so catastrophically failed to sell his own fiction - even despite his connections - then I dont know what to say to you. It is obviously something to be wary of.

I dont expect him to be King but I do expect a few thousand goodreads ratings like a normal working author in the midlist.

>>25409285
If you know you don't need any of his advice without even reading it, then more power to you. I still think you're being pointlessly arrogant.

>>25409304
I think there are better places to get advice if your goal is to sell, because Swain couldn't sell
And how am I being arrogant? Nothing I've said relates to me personally whatsoever, genuinely bizarre choice of insult

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>>25408872

>>25409314
You're being arrogant because you have a very narrow and idiosyncratic definition of "success" and you've unilaterally decided Swain doesn't meet it, despite a long career of writing short stories accepted for publication, being a professor of writing, being sought after for speaking engagements, and being inducted into a Professional Writer's Hall of Fame.
Notably, you haven't shared these "better places to get advice". So why don't you share them, so we can crap all over them.

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>>25409256
you don't get out much do you

>>25409341
Most of those credentials aren't actually selling books which is what matters if he's giving advice on how to sell books lmao. I'm not sure why I have to keep typing that
Swain is certainly successful in other domains. He just didn't fucking sell books
>notably, you haven't shared
I did. I said Sanderson actually sells books and is a modern writer, so if your goal is to sell books in the modern age, he's a much better starting point.

>>25409344
you outed yourself

>>25409351
He sold a lot of short stories. You're the one that arbitrarily constrained your notion of success to books.
>Sanderson
I don't want to write like him. It'd be like taking advice from Andy Weir.

>>25409380
You want to write like Swain?

>>25409385
Swain's books don't teach one to write like him. Which you would know if you had read one.

>>25409389
wtf
you JUST said you dont want to listen to Sanderson's advice because you don't want to write like him. So I turned it around on you, quite obviously, and you responded like a clueless dullard
Hysterical

>>25409396
I came here to try to be helpful. You came here to be argumentative and unpleasant.

>>25409360
how?

>>25409351
I found a 41-page PDF called "Sanderson Lecture Series Notes". I noted a lot of refrains from Swain's advice. Also, Sanderson starts off with general advice, then it veers into fantasy-specific advise, which was unthrilling. If I had to summarize, I'd say Sanderson is targeting beginning writers, and Swain is targeting intermediate writers.

Evaluate this passage critically

Welcome to The Agency - ‘We Mean Action’. Our mission is to act on information provided to us by The Association. We take the additional datapoints they provide, and superimpose them over our radar scans of the area. This additional data, retrieved from The Association archives, allows us to plot a line, or a vector, and there a course of action which we then swiftly deploy. In this way we are able to act and survive and provide security and prosperity to our constituents. We keep them safe through any act of cleanup, and are thankful to do so by any course of action. And that’s where the motto comes from, ‘We Mean Action’.

The Associate - ‘The archives? We made them up. Keep it to yourselves, though. The guys over at The Agency are a bunch of moralists, so we work around that. Sure they do whatever dirty work but they always tell themselves it’s cleanup. A soldier like that, if its not a *fact* that the mission is imperative, they just won’t do it (paranoid of ‘bad action’, I guess). So we take a look at their readings and draw a new point just where we like, to get them going in any direction that suits us, and then send them off to kill and die thankful for our guidance. They’d be paralyzed without us. I mean look at ‘We Mean Action’, no matter how many times they say that, nobody seems to get it. Oh, our motto? How about ‘Get the Fuck Out of my Office’? How about ‘Security Escort This Man to Re-Education Immediately’?

>>25409548
schizo babble

>>25409548
Exposition dump. Teenage edgelord viewpoint. Suggests an omnipotent government, which is about as far from the truth as one can be. I'm not deliberately trying to be mean-spirited here.

>>25409565
>>25409569
It was designed to use pulp conspiracy metaphors to elucidate the way the different parts of our brain create information to satisfy our desire for action. More clarity is necessary? I have no worry about harsh criticism except where it is dishonest and weaponized for mere fun

>>25409574
If the whole thing was a metaphor, that's fine. But it betrays a mind with a lot of deep-seated subconscious problems.

>>25409588
Should we cover that up, you think? Is that what we're here to do?

>>25409592
Should we cover up what, exactly? Did I forget to use a spoiler tag? Are you advocating for repressing problems? Please explain.

>>25409597
Do you think it'd be better to cover up the subconscious problems in this text, or was the text elucidating of metal problems by process of self-conciousness?

>>25409597
and to be even clearer, expression is the act of denying repression, not sure how you took what I understand as a surrealist journal entry as a repression

>>25409602
>>25409613
I never said anything about repression. I was trying to convey that, if the text is supposed to represent a state of mind, that I would consider that mind to be ill. I tend not to write about mental illness, and feel cheated when a character is revealed to be le heckin' crazy. But you do what you want. I don't think my tastes are fashionable.

>>25409624
>advocating for repressing problems
that's what had me talking about repression, anyways. no hard feelings
>if the text is supposed to represent a state of mind, that I would consider that mind to be il
Can you say your mind doesn't work this way? What if you are merely in the realm of 'The Agency' and never met 'The Association' except by their own reports?
> and feel cheated when a character is revealed to be le heckin' crazy
What character? That was a complete short story piece, no characters entered the room or left but you and the two separate bodiless entities that controlled each paragraph, they were just ideas explaining themselves. Nobody is listening except for you.

>>25409632
>doesn't your mind work this way
Not any more...that's what a lifetime of meditation and other esoteric practices will achieve.
>what character?
I meant other writing, not yours. It's why I dislike the horror genre immensely—far too often, the twist turns out to be "oooooh he was le heckin' crazy the whole time!!!1!" which I consider lazy and boring.

>>25409644
>Not any more...that's what a lifetime of meditation and other esoteric practices will achieve.
I'm a little surprised you'd hold such exploration in question then, though when I think about it you probably meant it when you meant 'you probably need some growing to do'. I appreciate that.
>far too often, the twist turns out to be "oooooh he was le heckin' crazy the whole time!!!1!" which I consider lazy and boring.
That's what I'm trying to avoid, though I am attempting surrealism. I really like the way literature can obfuscate or remove narrators, characters, anyone, and operate in the realm of pure ideas. I'm thinking of next working on a paragraph which explains this ahead of time, or perhaps later for effect

>>25409650
I have no problem with your writing sample as an exploration of metaphor. It's not my kind of thing, but that's irrelevant. (I don't know who posted >>25409565 but I found it arrogant as well as unhelpful.)

If you could get three currently alive writers under the age of 80 to privately tutor you and help you write who would you choose?

>>25409699
>currently alive writers under the age of 80
Can I resurrect Lovecraft instead?

>>25409675
If we keep the passage largely 'characterless' and abstract in the way I've presented it, do you think it'd serve well to introduce this with paragraphs introducing this idea of mental abstraction, and ones that follow from it afterwards? Could be worth expansion

>>25409764
You said earlier that this was supposed to be a standalone piece? If so, no, don't add exposition—that'll distract from your point.

>>25409785
Well it took us some dozen posts to get the clear picture so I figure some integration of this explanation is necessary to get where we both are now don't you agree?

The Operative looked around paranoid for an objective. It had been forever since he had received command. He was operating on an abandoned signal, figuring he'd finish the jigsaw after the fact.

>>25409813
"I wanted a mission, and for my sins, they gave me one...but when it was over, I never wanted another." -Capt. Willard, "Apocalypse Now"

>>25409789
No, then you're overexplaining it. Either leave it as is, or expand it into a much larger work. Don't merely add paragraphs.

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>>25409699
Sarah Andersen, Alissa Nutting, and Savannah Brown.
Reason: LE SEXOOOO

>>25407484
>look inside
>disturbing lack of lobster tales
My disappointment is slightly higher than what is reasonable.

>>25409821
Well you can write a work by expanding from scenes in any direction cant you

>>25409895
Then write your own! No need to be helpless.

A teacher in high school (though not an English teacher, a Latin teacher) once told us that you should never use the word 'ones', as in "You have problems and some are big ones," as it doesn't make logical sense or 'one' to be used plural.
Is this true?

>>25410001
This is the problem with Latin teachers --by definition, then are men of fixed thinking, of written in stone. They see language, and life in general, as a fixed set of rules for the purpose of following rules
Language doesn't need to make logical sense. It needs to be clear, precise, and expressive
tl;dr he's retarded and so are all latin teachers

>>25410001
He was a latino teacher, wasn't he?

>>25410006
thanks that helps
i think hes deceased by now, it would have been 20 years ago and he was old then
>>25410011
no, a very frail old white man

>>25407484
This place is in Narragansett

What is the best drink for writing? Coffee or tea?

>>25410015
straight espresso

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>>25410015
This.

Or cum.

>>25410013
Him being an old man 20 years ago makes this even worse
Can you imagine the kind of life one must have lived to end up being a Latin teacher circa the back half of the 20th century?

>>25410015
To say liquor sounds edgy and tryhard, but a whole lot of writers swore by it

>>25410018
>but a whole lot of writers swore by it
Booze makes me write better and faster, but it's very easy to overdo it and completely flip it around.

And by very easy I mean the tolerance is literally an extra sip too much.

>>25410015
>>25410023
I don't drink, but for a long time, I used melatonin and chamomile-based sleep tea to help me sleep at night. During a recent vacation from work, I stopped doing both, since I didn't need to fall asleep or get up at any particular time. I was surprised to find, after a few days, how much easier it was to write! Melatonin and chamomile may be mild sedatives, but they're still sedatives. I just deal with the lower sleep quality now. In conclusion...avoid all sedatives!

>>25410015
Caffeine on an empty stomach.

>>25410015
If it's night, alcohol. If it's the day, coffee.

Inverse also works well depending how much of a degenerate you want to be.

>>25410134
>melatonin
How to sleep 16 hours 101.

>>25410001
>>25410013
perhaps he was just ranting about the illogicality of things

as a teacher, I too have such views about similar illogical contradictions in my field, and I'm afraid of influencing kids the same way because even though I know I'm right, the world thinks otherwise, and there's nothing I can do to change that
so I try not to make such remarks in class, or when I do, I add a disclaimer that these are just my personal views and they absolutely should not write that in exams
I have also learned that students only take in 50% of what you say so it's better off not to say anything like that in case they forget the disclaimer

in other words, he might have been right, but don't take it too seriously

>>25410015
I prefer tea.
Specifically earls gray with lemon juice and two scoops of sugar.
Though plain green tea blends are good too. Like I have one with ginseng and ginger that is nice when I am not in the mood for strong flavors.
Coffee makes me poop.

>>25409133
Bullshit. It's been your go to insult you throw out half a dozen times in every writing thread.

>>25408883
"Tablets" come with attached/detachable keyboards. Did you really not know that?
Those keyboards suck ass through a silly straw.
Did you not know that?

Read my nonfiction in the NYC meetup thread
>>25410421

>>25410015
watah

>>25409699
I don't need a tutor, I'm good with my own voice

>>25410395
This is the 1st time I've posted that
And this is maybe only the 2nd review in /wg/ I've written this year
I don't know who you're talking about

>>25410524
I don't believe you even a tiny bit.

I'm in a situation where I realise there is a better story beneath the 60k words I have, but finding it would be a mountain of work. I'm not even sure how it fits together, and I don't know where to begin uncovering it either.

>>25410538
Rewrite from scratch, or assemble the chapters/sections you think are the "good" story and then figure out how to connect them.

t. Currently rewriting the first 6 chapters of my novel from scratch

>>25410533
And I give even less of a fuck for your belief.

Why continue? AI and human guided stories are #1 on Amazon and readership.

>>25410586
because some people still prefer oil paintings over digital. and you need to enjoy it. do it for yourself above all else.

>>25410586
You really think that would have been your audience? What are you writing anyway?

>>25410400
If you like, you can hook up an external USB keyboard very easily. You still pay a lot less than you would for a laptop, which is important if you're a poorfag like most of the people on 4chan.

>>25410586
Commercial success is already so unlikely; don't write with that as a goal, unless you're willing to do all that market research & constrain your output to pablum and treacle. There's no chance my cynical/hyperrealism style will ever be popular, or even be a cult favorite, like PKD, Ligotti, or VanderMeer. I just write so I can print out copies through Amazon, put a collection of my novels on my desk at work, and notice that literally none of my co-workers ever ask about them.

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How do I make aure my medieval fantasy book actually feels like it takes place in a medieval setting and not just a modern setting with swords and horses?

>>25410703
Research on what medieval life was actually like?

>>25409330
>look up a few quotes from this
>it's fucking terribly written

>>25410703
What other anon said.
If you are writing historical fiction, you have no other avenue.

Alternatively you can leave things pretty "standard" and then have some medieval insanities left in which would make readers go "what the fuck?" and then look it up, only to find out that stuff really happened. Like paying a coin to sleep on ropes.

>>25410252
Yeah. He was the kind of guy who ranted about shit. That statement, about "ones" has been stuck in my head ever since, and I try to avoid the word, and every time I hear it, it sounds weird to me now. I guess I've been mind broken.

>>25410716
there is nothing wrong with saying
>You have problems and some of them are big
or
>You have problems and some of them are big problems

>>25410703
i don't mean this in a dickish way, genuinely, but why not write about what you actually know? i feel like many people here try to write simply about what entertains them, but that can be a very wide net.

>>25410766
>why not write about what you actually know?
the things we know are very mundane and nobody would be interested

>>25410777
nothing wrong with the mundane. medieval fantasy can be mundane. i just mean topically. if you don't know anything about a topic then why write about it? i'm not going to sit down and decide to write a manual about how to mod a 1986 supra just because i like them. especially if i don't have one and have never worked on one.

like i said, i mean this genuinely. if you want to write a complete and compelling work, it's probably not going to happen writing about something you don't know.

though i get the experience of learning about a topic is fun, and it can provide an inroad to studying something you've always been interested in. i just think the writing should come after that process, not before/during.

but that's my opinion and opinions are like assholes eh? it's just something i have been through with my own writing and it's been on my mind so i'm curious about it from that standpoint.

>>25410777
Speak for yourself. My story has the MC inform the reader that you can make explosives out of hydrogen peroxide, and then that you can buy amoxicilin for bacterial infections at a pet store.

>>25410809
for example - hermann melville had experience with whaling, thus he could create an epic novel that centered around the technicalities of whaling. bret easton ellis was a fag obsessed with status, so he had a lot of experience with fashion and cliques, the eccentricities of culture. david foster wallace experienced addiction and had relationships with people who were addicts, thus he was able to create the characters in his works that he did.

i think anons who are approaching writing anew should consider what type of things they already know about when putting pen to page (or keyboard). i mean this to be helpful, not discouraging. and normal life can be so interesting, people love shared human experience or to feel like they're not alone.

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>>25410818
>or to feel like they're not alone.
>writing about an MC dealing with crippling loneliness
Fuck.

>>25410818
That's why my MC is a giga-chad who fucks a lot of milfs. He's a pool cleaner and ends up on the run after one of the hags he's boning has a heart attack while they fuck.

>>25410809
>i just mean topically. if you don't know anything about a topic then why write about it?
Of course a certain amount of knowledge and research is necessary to get a certain amount of verisimilitude and engagement

>>25410824
More important than "write what you know" is the importance of wish fulfillment, i.e. show your readers someone they wish they could be, if they only dared. In the old days, writers were people who went out into the world, led interesting lives, then came back to write about them. Now, it's a bunch of MFAs with no real world experience, and (even worse) NEETs who try to write solely because they have the time. You can write about your NEET life if you like, but make sure you do something different with it than Dostoevsky.

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>>25410859
Finally, an excuse to make this video clip!

>>25410812
You can use the powdered equivalent of hydrogen peroxide, i.e. sodium percarbonate. Just a little research will perk up your story.

>>25410818
>hermann melville had experience with whaling, thus he could create an epic novel that centered around the technicalities of whaling
I haven't lived an interesting life. I'm a night-shift security guard so at work all I do is read books and when I'm home all I do is read books.

>>25411340
Can't you make up a story about a guy with a sword hired by some merchants to defend their storehouse from bandits, and nothing ever happens, and then one day the bandits attack?

>>25411351
Yes but literally anyone could do that, it's not like there's some esoteric security guard knowledge that only a guard knows.

>>25411363
Anyone could make any story pulling from their own life. There are only so many unique lives to be lived. That’s not the point. The point is you have unique experiences you could pull from. Being a night security guard is actually an interesting perspective. Like I said mundane doesn’t mean uninteresting. You’re allowed to embellish as well. Idk I just want people to consider that their own experiences are good enough to write about. You don’t need to have been an adventurer or secret agent or some shit.

>>25411340
What do you read? It sounds like you're in an ideal position to do research on anything you want to write about. I haven't led an interesting life, but I have an imagination, and I can read about other settings the point where I can plausibly write about them.

>>25411394
this is the other half of 'write what you know'. if you have a good enough imagination you can really just make shit up. and if you're smart enough you can work through the logic to make it believable enough. after all, that's where fantasy began.

also, i think that's why i dislike genreslop so much. those writers just latch onto pre-existing world mechanics, races, characters. i get the appeal and the convenience of having an audience who is already receptive to that, but it's important to at least TRY to create something somewhat unique.

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>>25411428
Being an information sponge serves me well in my STEM career, and is absolutely vital for my writing as well.

>>25411437
I wish I was smart. I can barely remember the plot of the books I read.

>>25411457
Did your parents have you "medicated"? That picked up in the early 1990s. So glad I was well into adulthood by then.

>>25411477
No I'm just getting dumber and more mentally tired as I age.

>>25411479
Assuming you're not on drugs (both pharmaceutical and recreational), and don't eat slop (e.g. refined sugar, simple carbs, and seed oils), you may want to look into supplements. Glutathione is good for inflammation, which may be behind your mental fog. NMNH did quite a lot for my energy and focus. Gingko and ginseng are good for perking up without the drawbacks of caffeine. I could go on. I'm at the age where I resemble that Pepe and my mind is still firing on all cylinders, but it hasn't been easy.

>>25411488
I guess I'll try with those two you mentioned (no idea where to buy them) but otherwise I am permanently fucked due to thalassemia minor, SSRIs, vitamins, exercise, caffeine, creatine and so on don't seem to have any effect

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>>25411340
There's literally tons of shit I could write with the premise of a night security as MC.

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>>25411496
SSRIs are poison. I asked about pharmaceutical use. My condolences.

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>>25411513
Just as long as it's not Hobgoblins.

>>25411539
I was thinking Goosebumps. And knowing me, I'd add cute girls.

>>25411513
True, but my point was that anyone could do that, it's not like I have any special insight into the world because I'm a security guard.

>>25410859
what's it about

write what you know, but also show don't tell

>>25410586
How else will the mind created people and worlds get out of your head?
Won't they keep tormenting you otherwise?
Let them out!

>>25410684
You can get a laptop for 100 bucks. A surface cost around 1000 last I checked.
So that's bullshit.

>>25411795
>comparing low-end laptop with high-end Surface
At least *try* to be honest.

>>25411850
How about you be honest about exactly why you want a windows tablet, because it has nothing to do with using it as a writing tool.

The low end laptop can run any word processor on the market.

I'm writing a book as we speak called The Iman Chronicles the Revolver it's about a magical revolver that's been passed down to all kinds of people causing all kinds of problems connected to my gensokyo inspired setting the Iman since this may be the only book I ever write I'm putting my all into this if i ever get to four chapters id like to send y'all these four chapters to see what y'all think

>>25411866
I wasn't the anon that wanted a laptop/Surface; I was trying to advise said anon. I can write on anything; I author all my fiction in text files in Markdown format, and convert them to various formatted-books documents using pandoc.

What's the best place to practice short form writing? I've been debating about making a Tumblr account where I don't expect anyone to recognize or know me on there, and every day I will write either a self-contained short story or maybe a series in post form. But I'm wondering if there's a better website for that

>>25411905
I got a surprising amount of practice in the wish/monkey paw thread on /d/.
I am not joking.
Those horny goblins will force you to get creative and think outside the box with their odd prompts .

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it's happening

>>25411536
I might stop taking them as they don't do anything. I'm not even sure I'm depressed.

>>25412186
Taper off slowly, they can fuck you up if you just stop.

Depression is a symptom of deeper structural problems with your life
Fix those and everything else follows

>>25412303
Except when it isn't.
Only a idiot would make such a blanket declaration.

>>25412313
>omg I'm sad in my brain
Isn't real depression. You are a foid if you think so.

>>25412303
That's called being unhappy not depression.

>>25412341
>proves himself to be a idiot
lol

>>25412347
what's the biological difference between chronic unhappiness and "depression"?

>>25412435
Dunno, why does one go away when you 'fix the deeper structural problems with your life' and one doesn't?

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>it's a hit
when will /lit/ apologize to NJB?

So I skimmed a bit of the rancorous fighting in this thread. You should just read advice and try it and see if it's useful. It's not like you're locked in forever. Swain is just one of many many guys pointing out stories have a loose structure to them that you should keep in mind. He's not even that dogmatic in the book.

>>25412384
>jumps to thinly-supported conclusion like an insecure idiot
lol

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>>25412475
I don't mean to shit on his ratings, but whopping 4.5 with 10 ratings isn't exactly a hit.

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>>25412475
all the new /lit/ content has reviewed well

>>25412484
it came out 4/1/26 and has sold 70+ units so far
first work from a total unknown author

>>25412496
Based. Best author we have here

>>25412473
if you can't differentiate one from the other, how can you tell that one has different clinical results than the other? swap the labels and you wouldn't know the difference, after all

>>25412484
That's a better rating, and more sales, than over 99% of the "authors" here. Stop being such a bucket crab. Your jealousy is palpable.

>>25412490
new cover art is brilliant and will be pushed as soon as it's finished

How would you describe the ideal reader for the current thing you are working on?

To put it another way, who are you writing for?

>>25407487
I'd just caution how much you're slipping in and out of the child's perspective. It's hard to maintain the latter without it becoming grating, but even italicizing the whole 'adulting' section might make it seem less like a slip in writing

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>>25407484
lol

>>25412601
>who are you writing for?
A borderline schizophreniac with high IQ who has enough extremely niche knowledge and likes reading into symbolism and foreshadowing a lot.

>>25410424
I read it. Not the most interesting thing that's ever happened. Or even a contender in that category.

>>25412473
maybe the ‘deeper structural problems’ aren’t relevant to happiness.

>>25412475
Nice job, I’ll support any anon here who actually releases something.

>>25412587
Glad to hear. The current art is keeping me from reading it.
>>25412865
Hey me too

>>25409699
Jerry B. Jenkins: fundamentals and workmanship
Clive Barker: He is one of the masters of horror and it would be really cool to learn from him.
Hiroaki Samura: Learn art as well as how to strike a balance between good when it comes to edgy material and good story

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>>25412500
>>25413793
thank you, lads.
pre-order is live for the second story ebook, pic related. full release August 1.
keeping prices as low as possible for now.

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Do you guys take any brain supplements for writing? You know like fish oil capsules with Omega 3 and DHA that kind of stuff. I need to take something to make my brain work.

>>25414210
I take unhealthy and poisonous amounts of caffeine.
Magnesium and fish oil is placebo.

>>25414210
cat is addicted to the treats with omega3

How do you guys deal with writers block and no mental energy to be creative. i churn words out and sometimes its okay but lately its been awful

>>25414279
I usually stop and try to enjoy life for a minute. Consume some media and research. Discuss with friends.

>>25414279
>How do you guys deal with writers block
Maladaptive daydreaming and make believe time.

> no mental energy to be creative
I recharge my creative energy by consuming creative stories and art.
I recharge mental energy with good sleep and relaxation practices. Though a little bit of caffeine or other stimulants help in the short term. Though that has to be payed off later with good sleep otherwise I will burn out.

>>25412865
Hey, that's my market too! Damn. Maybe Amazon will link all our books together in its "you may also like" section beneath our entries.

>>25414210
Do I ever. NMNH, Zinc-L-Carnosine, and Wellness Company's Recharge, first thing in the morning, on an empty stomach. Glutathione and Thyrite with breakfast. Cordyceps and berberine with mid-morning snack. Multivitamin, B-50 vitamin, CoQ10, gingko, and ginseng with lunch. I've actually cut way back on caffeine in recent times; remember, it doesn't actually get you wired, it just blocks the "tired" receptors.

>>25414279
I got rid of my writer's block when I stopped taking sedatives. I never really drank, but I used to take melatonin and chamomile-heavy sleep tea at night. Those might be mild, natural sedatives, but they're still sedatives. I stopped them and my muse came roaring back.

How gay can a story get before it turns off the average male normalfag reader?

“Where’s mah alien babes ya damn STEWPID idjits?” He demanded poking a grease stained finger at the ad in the back of a dishevelled copy of Guns and Ammo.

“Here this you methanol swilling inbred. We were promised forty percent of this planet’s natural resources and we did not travel fourteen thousand light years to leave empty handed.”

He hocked a filthy mouthful of tobacco at the General’s foot. “Aw I ain’t dun promised y’all SHIT. Youse alien bastards can take forty percent’a mah a...” Before he could finish his foul mouthed tirade seventy thousand volts coursed through his body, sending him into a convulsive fit in the dirt.

“Put that in storage and let’s get off this mud heap. We’ll find something else to gift the Emperor”

A hulking workhorse of a creature dragged his lifeless body up the ramp by one leg as smoke curled out of his mouth, nose and ears. The ramp closed behind them and within minutes they were back in orbit. On the way jettisoning a cargo pod containing a pathogen that killed roughly one third of the state of Oklahoma.

>>25414594
I enjoyed The Picture of Dorian Grey. Any gayer than that and I might not stomach it.

>>25414610
Hmm, I haven't read that yet. How does it compare to Brideshead Revisited in terms of gayness?

>>25412601
I'm writing for straight guys who like cute girls doing cute things.

>>25414615
You can just read the first chapter. Two guys in a garden, drinking strawberry Margheritas, discussing which is more important, beauty or brains, and wilting on lounge chairs. It's pretty funny. But it balances out because Dorian has a hot girlfriend.

>>25414616
Straight guys don't want to READ about cute girls doing cute things, they want to watch it. Preferably with them in various stages of undress.

>>25414594
gay sex and gay romance are an instant discard for me
faggy attitudes, depends on whether they are portrayed as a character weakness or as a yass-queen strength. the latter is also a discard, the former is classical.

>>25407484
How do I add literary allusions that normal people can be expected to understand? I'm a pretentious twerp that can't bear not making an Illiad reference, specifically this one:
>Come, you gods, make this endeavour, that you all may learn this.
>Let down out of the sky a cord of gold; lay hold of it all you who are gods and all who are goddesses,
>yet not even so can you drag down Zeus from the sky to the ground, not Zeus the high lord of counsel, though you try until you grow weary.
>Yet whenever I might strongly be minded to pull you, I could drag you up, earth and all and sea and all with you,
>then fetch the golden rope about the horn of Olympos and make it fast, so that all once more should dangle in mid air.
>So much stronger am I than the gods, and stronger than mortals.’

- by having a character literally catch Zeus with a chain and drag him down to earth. I want it to be viscerally entertaining, but in a way that shows I did make a deliberate reference.

>>25414820
The only thing that'll tie down this boar is Wonder Woman's Lasso of Truth.
Holy Batarope, get that pig!
Think Tony Stark can build this in a cave?
D'oh!
If this keeps up, I'll need to live in a pineapple under the sea...
Just gotta master the four bendings.

You're going to have to cape shit it. That's the new literary references for normies and our modern day Odyssey.

Tips on how to structure the 'major' events in a story?
I can make a bunch of shorter, almost unrelated stories but trying to tie them all together in coherent sequence of events with progression seems bit daunting

>>25414918
Three act structure

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What terms would you use to describe futuristic white hallways like inside the rebel ship or sci-fi in general

"Polished white steel" doesn't seem to be sufficient

>>25414918
>trying to tie them all together in coherent sequence of events with progression seems bit daunting
figure out how to make one lead to the next
this will also help you write shorts to bridge the bits in between

>>25407484
i cannot listen to female writing advice, period. They are utterly disgusting creatures, self absorbed and traitorous, every single one.

>>25414944
Damn nigger, just be creative.
Is plasteel, astropolymer, or just adamantium too good for you?

What do you think are the best ways to improve your writing skills beyond writing, because sometimes I feel like when i'm just writing, I'm making the same mistakes over and over again and not learning

>>25414989
just as with every other skill, read guides on what to do and what not to do, and then edit your draft / write new shit consciously trying to put the advice into practice
start small, like writing a 1,000-word scene just to practice one particular do/don't

>>25414944
Shiny white plastic

>>25414944
Marble, as classical as the mythical stories told inside fairy tales some eighty thousand years ago, covered the Intagalactia, a fitting decor for the capital ship.

Use some imagination. Why not have stone as their interior design? You don't have to make everything Star wars

>>25414944
'like in that redditor movie'

this thread smells like rotten curry.
can you stinky subhumans quit pretending to be writers and go mop up the local 7-eleven already?

Is it frowned upon to post story outlines or is this mostly for the actual writing

ok tranny

>>25414529
Until relatively recently I was somewhat of a pro at daydreaming, I used to zone out pretty much every time I had a moment of respite and was able to vividly visualize pretty much anything in relation to my favorite media. I don't know how or why but my brain can't do that anymore. It just shuts down and doesn't produce anything new. Just white noise and fragments of dialogues.

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>>25415047
>Until relatively recently I was somewhat of a pro at daydreaming, I used to zone out pretty much every time I had a moment of respite and was able to vividly visualize pretty much anything in relation to my favorite media. I don't know how or why but my brain can't do that anymore. It just shuts down and doesn't produce anything new. Just white noise and fragments of dialogues.

>>25415044
You can post it, but no guarantees anyone would comment on it

How many rapes is too many for children’s fiction?

>>25415136
About 8 per scene.

>>25415136
roughly equivalent to how many stomps of your head into a curb

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>>25415239
>roughly equivalent to how many stomps of your head into a curb

>>25414972
>>25414994
>>25415033
>>25415020
I should have specified that I already had written some scenes and posted examples, just wanted to see what other anons came up with. Consider it a excercise

Thanks for the input though. It's not in a science-fiction for my story, it's a thriller where the MC ends up in a futuristic lab.

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>>25415117
Ok. I keep coming up with outlines at work. I kind of like this one. I mostly decided to write it around a joke I came up with and then it kept going. I'll probably get to writing it this weekend. Idk how saturated the internet is with AI stories at this point but fuck it

Lobsterrrrrrrrr

>>25415391
This is solid. Really love the premise, please get to work.

>>25414835
Wow this is literally what classical and bible fags do with their stories. Iliad is just capefag shit from a much older generation. Tragic

>>25407487
Stopped reading at
>chunky twist