Why are people on 4chan so uninterested in learning languages? I can understand that anglophones don't care about languages, because they're fluoridated anti-intellectuals, but there are many ESLs on 4chan too. This entire website only has four threads for languages. The one that's on this board is just a handful of trannies that don't discuss learning at all, post degenerate shit and troll anyone who attempts to discuss learning. The thread on /int/ is just as braindead, and then there are two threads for Japanese only on the same board, which are also coombrained shit.Let's have a thread that's actually about language learning, free from degeneracy, trolling and anti-intellectualism. But I doubt there are enough people on this site that are interested. Anytime there is such a thread it gets no traction.
Hi, swedejeet!
>>25521735fuck off and kys, fluoridated subhuman
Hey bro. Continuing my jap journey although very very unmotivated to be honest. Last thing I read and finished was some gay light novel. Right now taking it easy with another light anime-ish shit but as I said I'm heavily unmotivated. I think I'm slightly depressed. Right now taking some solace in some spanish literature. I want to read french more though, I have some Mallarme lying around in my kindle. I just finished Ariel by Plath. First time I feel moved by anglo-pig shit. >Anytime there is such a thread it gets no tractionYeh, I tried discussing jap literature a couple of times but american anglo-swines just want to discuss dosto for the 999th time. Sad really.
>>25521754No way, Swedejeet! You'd have to keep replying to yourself! Don't worry, I still love you.
I’m trying to improve my English so I guess it fits and ships in this thread. What is the value behind learning these? I dived into hoping it improve my sentence building skills, but so far it’s hella laborious, and I’m not sure if I picked the right course.
>>25521785>studying fucking englishNgmi bro
>>25521785Sentence diagramming is a useful skill for when some author drops a mondo long sentence on you and you struggle to untangle its structure
I'm too old to learn a language, should've started when I was 8.
I am learning Romanian to read Eminescu and Eliade.
>>25521913You'll have difficulty attaining true fluency but you can absolutely learn to read a language at any stage in your life.
>>25521785Linguistics is cucked shit. Don't bother. Study Latin and German if you want to understand grammar. There are tons of textbooks and readers in the public domain. Here are a few but you'll have to experiment and find something that works for you.***Latin***>Latin for Beginnershttps://archive.org/details/latinforbeginner0000benj>Latin Via Ovidhttps://archive.org/details/latinviaovidfirs0000gold_l0u3>Familia Romanahttps://archive.org/details/familia-romana>audiohttps://archive.org/details/familia-romana-and-colloquia-personarum-audio-files>Neumann Companionhttps://archive.org/details/lingualatinalatinbooks/Lingua%20Latina%20-%20Companion%20to%20Familia%20Romana>Exercitia Latinahttps://archive.org/details/lingualatinalatinbooks/Lingua%20Latina%20-%20Exercitia%20Latina%20Pars%20I/>Colloquia Personarumhttps://archive.org/details/lingualatinalatinbooks/Lingua%20Latina%20-%20Colloquia%20Personarum/>answer keyhttps://archive.org/details/lingualatinalatinbooks/Lingua%20Latina%20-%20Teacher%27s%20Materials%20and%20Answer%20Keys/>Latin from the Romanshttps://archive.org/details/learn-latin-from-the-romans>Latin An Intensive Coursehttps://archive.org/details/LatinAnIntensiveCourse>Ecce Romanihttps://archive.org/details/ecceromaniialati00scot>PBS videoshttps://www.pbslearningmedia.org/collection/latin-grammar/***German***>A Progressive German Readerhttps://archive.org/details/progressivegerma00adle>German for Readinghttps://annas-archive.gl/md5/d041c9cfe501cacecdac11cdc3af46b3>Basic German A Grammar and Workbookhttps://mercaba.org/SANLUIS/IDIOMAS/Alem%C3%A1n/Basic%20german.pdf
>>25521913Total bullshit. You're just brainwashed. Try this.https://archive.org/details/childsillustrate00keet/page/20/mode/1up
>>25521720What was structuralism is the thing that I am wondering and although I have nothing strictly cogent to add to that conversation what I would add to this thread is that in someway imageboard kultur is the kultur of the image along with also being the culture of the text and the language also but that this is above all a relation to text and the image and the image and the book and the divisions existentially that are entered into by the self and that is what I am thinking where the attention that I have is like focused between the text and the image and the language
>>25521922>>German for Reading>https://annas-archive.gl/md5/d041c9cfe501cacecdac11cdc3af46b3That's the second edition. The first edition is on archive.org:https://archive.org/details/srwiuwewfrpf
>>25521927I've been learning German for 4 years and I'm still nowhere near fluent. I'm permastuck at a mediocre level forever because I started at 24. Shit's rigged.>>25521916True, reading and listening is a lot more doable.
>>25521950>The first edition is on archive.org:>>https://archive.org/details/srwiuwewfrpfThat one is missing the glossary of grammatical terms at the end, while this one has it:https://archive.org/details/german-for-reading-a-programmed-approach-for-graduate-and-undergraduate-reading-_202101
>>25521957Actually it's missing all of the appendices.
>>25521954>I've been learning German for 4 years and I'm still nowhere near fluent. I'm permastuck at a mediocre level forever because I started at 24. Shit's rigged.skill issue i started learning spanish at 25 and by 28 i was very fluent
>>25521970I doubt it, you probably had one convo with a Mexican and you don't even realize how large of a gap it is till fluency. People overestimate their ability all the time.
>>25521970Spanish is easier for an English-speaker to learn than German, but it's good that you're doing well.
>>25521974you can keep being retarded if you want. i do have a genuine knack for languages but it is possible. in my job now i spend 90% of the time speaking in spanish both internally and externally. people mistake me for someone born in spain because of my accent. anyway im here to tell that german anon that it is possible but it is a lot of work and commitment. the first 8 months were demoralising af
>>25521980>people mistake me for someone born in spain because of my accentThey're bullshitting you, gringo. People love to blow smoke up your ass for managing to say the most basic shit in their language.
>>25521954>I've been learning German for 4 years and I'm still nowhere near fluent. I'm permastuck at a mediocre level forever because I started at 24. Shit's rigged.Stfu. First of all this is the literature board, not the talking board. Secondly "learn" has two meanings, #1 to study, #2 to master whatever arbitrary level. You default to the latter interpretation because you're an incurious utilitarian. This thread is for #1. Fuck off if you want to discuss #2.>>25519752
>>25521984this is after a full conversation. anyway not sure why i bothered coming to this shit hole thread on this now retarded board. kys
>>25521985So you don't care about making progress? You just wanna jerk yourself off about how you're such an intellectual for reading graded readers?>>25521987Adios, amigo.
>>25522008seriously fuck off fluoridated american
currently learning german... is learning both latin and german doable...
>>25522025It's doable I recommend saving content like authors and books in German that you wish to read in the future as a reward and goal. Motivation is very hard after the 4 to 5 year mark when the language loses novelty and the culture doesn't interest you anymore.
>>25522025Absolutely. Here's another textbook, similar to Latin for Beginners by D'Ooge which I linked earlier.https://archive.org/details/collardaniellsfi00collrich
>>25521785Copy Tufte Twice.
I’m trying to find out some easy way to remember definite articles in AG. What I came up with is to form sentences that follow this Nom Acc Dat structure for say only masculine singular nouns, and so on (gonna plow through Gen individually). Can someone please tell if the sentence like this is grammatically correct, so that I can form others in similar fashion?ὁ στρατηγός τον στρατός προς τῷ ποταμός αγειAlternatively, are there existing phrases like that so that I don’t need to invent the bicycle?
>>25523208>linguisticsIt's all cucked garbage. Take the Trivium pill.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3U6MsdBalg
>>25523208Alright, that might not be linguistics, but it's still english, which makes it shit. I should have said in the OP that this thread is for language learning EXCLUDING that garbage language english.
does anyone actually write something in Latin nowadays, like some sort of newspaper for illiterate children (like me).
>>25523369>>25523433kys
>>25521720are they? i see people on this board all the time say you're getting cucked if you don't read a novel in its original translation. i'm personally learning spanish and german. (i know english and serbo-croatian.) i agree with anon who said that the first few months of language learning are demoralising, but it's genuinely possible to learn any language if there are enough resources and you spend enough time doing so. you don't need to be gifted or have a brain for languages if you're trying to be trilingual.
>>25523470fuck off fluoridated anglophone
>>25523483>first few months of language learning are demoralisingno, stfu>spend enough timesee >>25521985, fluoridated shithead
Damn. Different opinions on translation have really set the fluoride autist off.
>>25521735I wonder if he'll ever take his own advice and learn at least 1(one, uno, eins, unus, εἶς) language besides englishwe'll never know
>>25523492i don't get the point you're trying to make. i think if you're learning a language, you're always going to grow an appreciation and love for it, and you'll always learn more about the world and the culture behind the language. why would i care about being "cultured"? that term has so many different meanings across people who are readers that i don't even know what it means for you personally. besides, wouldn't that also be a "tangible result" by your own standards?is this just a very odd way of speaking about right and wrong attitudes for learning?
>>25523509Again, the word "learning" has two meanings1) studying, the process in itself2) mastering, at an arbitrary levelThe latter is the utilitarian way of viewing things.This thread is about the former.Having a results-oriented mentality is a mark of the plebs, the uneducated, the uncultured. Anglophones are the most utilitarian people on the planet and this virus is spreading. Utilitarianism is death.>the point you're trying to makeI'm not trying. I made a point. You're the one that's trying. Read the image, shithead.
>>25523520i get you make a distinction between two types of learning, i just don't understand what exactly you think is the meaningful difference between them or what makes you value them differently beyond the vague sense you believe the 2nd one leads to an uncultured populace. it seems counterintuitive to me that learning more about languages and cultures (again, if you're learning a language, you will learn more about the culture behind the language, it's baked into the language itself) would inadvertently make someone less educated or less cultured.are you able to explain in concrete terms why the 2nd type of learning is wrong or harmful?
>>25521720>Why are people on 4chan so uninterested in learning languageslike you said anglos are too stupidand non-anglos are content with english
AI translation glasses and ear pieces will be a thing soon
>>25523674kys fluoridated anglophone
>AI translation glasses and ear pieces will be a thing soon
>>25523697I wish I was the dude in the chair.
>>25523697Note how it’s specifically wine and not Red Bull or something. /lit/ just had to have some air of sophistication to it.
>>25521720Reading to learn it hasn't taken with me after many years. I still have my job that involves reading, I have novels to write, at least two other writing projects at any given time, and any of those may require reading/research. I'm going to sit there and read grade 1 level stories in French? It makes a lot more sense to listen to the language passively while I relax or sleep, and I still don't want to do that more than what I typically do as part of my routine.
I would not recommend learning a language with only books in mind, because you're not going to feel very accomplished for some time.I decided I'd learn Russian after reading, and probably barely comprehending, Crime & Punishment at age 16, but I only kept going since then because I eventually got into Russian music and am interested in their current events. Reading comes slowly, because after nailing down the basics and beginning to understand ordinary conversation, you realize the literary langauge can be almost entirely separate from the spoken.I can read Navalny's biography fine now, for example, also because it's mostly about politics, where I have a good store of vocabulary from reading the news. But it's not very fun to read an old book and learn new words only for that purpose while not making much progress as far as pages read go.It's all about endurance and genuine interest in the culture and literature. I also have some Russian/Ukrainian-background friends I can send brainrot to, which is fun. I guess that makes spoken languages a lot more accessible than Latin or Greek, which you could only improve when in the mood for genuine scholarship.I guess starting with literature in mind I moved on to learning for communication with and access to the genuine emotions of native speakers, which is more sustainable and useful
>>25524014fuck off
French speaker here Español more or less solid,i've been able to have real conversations with both spaniards y latinos Italian,posso parlare pero molto difficile,ho perduto tutto a cosa di non practicare la lengua Latin,i've been able to read some gesta romanorum (more like deducing things and the meaning generally speaking,never practised writing)N'on ket komz a ran brezhoneg met studial a ran e karaez gant roudour epad ur bloazAnd ofc english
I'm learning Latin and I plan to learn German and French, then possibly Italian and Ancient Greek. I have no real good reasons to learn these, I just like languages, history, philosophy, stuff like that
>>25523697/lit/erally me after I get off work
>>25524014Sounds like a skill issue. Russian is a super easy language to learn, I got to native speaker level back when I was like five.
I found this radio drama in German and wanted a transcript or subtitles in German.I copied this urlhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_9P1FX15f4into thishttps://app.ytdown.tothen downloaded the 48k m4a filethen uploaded that file to thishttps://turboscribe.ai/dashboardI don't know if you can access the result through this url but this is pretty cool.https://turboscribe.ai/transcript/5818650718699983561/ytdown-com-youtube-horrorklassiker-folge-5-der-angriff-der-media-k-9p1fx15f4-003-48kI'm using that together with these:https://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/google-translate/aapbdbdomjkkjkaonfhkkikfgjllclebhttps://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/quick-search-wiktionary/kgchoibflodmphihffmogncijonmpmcehttps://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/simple-translate/ibplnjkanclpjokhdolnendpplpjiacehttps://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/wikipedia-search/lipakennkogpodadpikgipnogamhklmkI also downloaded the transcript as a PDF.
>>25525625>Russian is a super easy language to learnall languages are easy to learn, I was just saying the investment required to perfect a language purely for /lit/ circlejerking would not be worth it to me
>>25525708another onehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6jopsvjuuAhttps://turboscribe.ai/transcript/7430939385297779672/ytdown-com-youtube-perry-rhodan-folge-1-unternehmen-stardus-media-z6jopsvjuua-004-48kYou can just search youtube for Hörspiele/Hörspiel/Hörbücher/Hörbuch/etc.
I've been passively trying to learn spanish for 20 years. I used to fall asleep to an audiobook of 2,000 most common words in spanish. I tried to flirt with a colombian chick at the bar in spanish only, and she laughed at me, but I got a number.
>>25521720I just started a real concerted effort to learn Japanese after a near decade of half(if that)-trying. I won't delude myself into thinking I have made any amount of real headway just because I can 10% understand anime or the weebshit on my mp3 player, but I am at least seeing real progress in finally memorizing kanji after the last month of effort. It's already too late for me to write but I'll at least know how to read in a year or so. I hope to be able to understand Nisio's work before I'm old enough for it to be cringe (I am 26 so I figure it's already borderline).
>>25521720>Why aren't there threads on Xthis is asked on every board and the answer is always the same: because you haven't made them. The biggest problem with this site, and the easiest problem to fix, is people who don't make threads.Inevitably the response is "muh 300s timer," which definitely is a pain in the ass, but you can just tab away for 5 minutes and come back, and you only need to sit through it once or twice.
>>25526779>>Why aren't there threads on XDidn't say that. Learn to read. I said:>Why are people on 4chan so uninterested in learning languages?
Anyone know of similar courses to this but for other languages? https://www.russianthroughpropaganda.com/propaganda. Don't be misled by the whole propaganda thing. It's not as cringe as it might sound. It's just a theme (which moves on to poetry, art, novels as the levels increase). Made by this guy: https://slavic.princeton.edu/people/mark-pettusI like the idea of using 'serious' culture as the theme in a language learning course. It's a nice change to the boring and repetitive school textbooks.
What's the best way to learn French?
>>25525708>>25525739After trying these radio dramas for learning for a bit I've got to say I'm disappointed, I don't recommend them, and I'm abandoning them. Why? Because unlike books and audiobooks they rely on you recognizing voices to tell characters apart, and the voices are not different enough. Maybe some radio dramas are good but at least the first one there, Der Angriff der Horrorameisen, is not good. Haven't done much work with the second one, Perry Rhodan.>Hörspiele (radio dramas)nein>Hörbücher (audiobooks)jaget something like this insteadhttps://archive.org/details/siddharthaeinein00hesshttps://archive.org/details/siddhartha-3v-3(it says Hörspiel but it appears to be a Hörbuch)https://turboscribe.ai/transcript/1107885508467026147/siddhartha-1v3
>>25527696https://archive.org/details/childsillustrate00keet/page/20/mode/1uphttps://archive.org/details/jensen-arthur-le-francais-par-la-methode-naturehttps://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLf8XN5kNFkhdIS7NMcdUdxibD1UyzNFTPhttps://archive.org/details/progressivepro00coll/page/1/mode/1uphttps://archive.org/details/basicfrenchreadi00bond
>>25521720language learning was already solved by Stephen Krashen and James Marvin Brown. anyone who disagrees is simply ignorant.
>>25527746which means there's nothing else to talk about it if you didn't understand the first message. just learn the method and go learn the language.
>>25527694If you want to use serious culture for learning, this textbook for Latin does that with Ovid's Metamorphoses.https://archive.org/details/latinviaovidfirs0000gold_l0u3Using serious culture for learning is also what most interlinears and parsed readers do. Just beware that some interlinears out there alter the word order for pedagogical purposes.***interlinears in various languages***https://www.latinum.org.uk/shadowing/interlinear-method***Latin parsed readers***https://archive.org/details/CommentariesOnTheGallicWarCaesarCompletelyParsedBookIhttps://archive.org/details/completely-parsed-cicero-oration-1https://archive.org/details/fully-parsed-horace-odes-translation-pub-cohttps://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=uc1.31822003632080***German interlinears***https://archive.org/details/germanforenglis01stalgoog/page/92/mode/1uphttps://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=hvd.hwsrk2&seq=21https://archive.org/details/liederlinebyline0000phil***German parsed reader***https://archive.org/details/progressivegerma00adleI posted a bunch of German interlinears in this thread.https://warosu.org/lit/thread/25473138
>>25527788I was thinking more as a unified theme for a course in the model of modern language learning. Mark Pettus has put together a really great collection of resources. I checked the books and many of the vids. They're high quality and it's all targeted at people looking for a decent academic challenge. I'm just curious why I've never seen similar for other languages. Thank you for the resources though. Latin is not on my radar (it's cool, but I lack the time), but I do want to take up German at some point.
>>25521720Because I grew up bilingual and realized it hardly matters compared to the amount of investment it requires. It's good and fun but not very important and the pretention of multilingualists (or perhaps just their fetishistic imitators) is unbearable.
>>25527746>muh solvedfuck off, fluoridated utilitarian>>25521985>>25523697
>>25527878>amount of investment it requiresfuck off, fluoridated utilitarian>>25521985>>25523697
>>25527875>muh serious culture>muh unified themewell, you're being extremely fucking vague>in the model of modern language learningDon't know what the fuck that's supposed to mean. Modern teaching is garbage through and through. 19th century and early 20th century is where the good materials are.>lack the timefuck off, fluoridated utilitarian>>25521985>>25523697
German for Reading Knowledge, Hubert Jannachhttps://archive.org/details/issn_72136596German for Reading, Karl Sandberghttps://annas-archive.gl/md5/d041c9cfe501cacecdac11cdc3af46b3https://archive.org/details/german-for-reading-a-programmed-approach-for-graduate-and-undergraduate-reading-_202101
25527901Absolutely desperate effort for some (you)s It's actually depressing to think some people out there are so starved of attention they're forced to try and rage bait people on 4chan just to feel a human connection. I hope your life gets better, anon.
>>25528063Kys
25528068'To a man with a hammer every problem is a nail'Only a man who is truly miserable and alone would say 'KYS' because to such a man suicide appears to be the sole remaining solution within his grasp.It doesn't have to be that way, Anon. Life is too precious to waste screaming for (you)s and telling people to KYS. You can get help with substance abuse and you have the capacity to build a better life. Clean yourself up and become a man. Take the first steps. There are good people who will help you.
>>25528082Fuck off faggot
25528098Nothing you could say to me could ever hurt me more than how you are hurting yourself. I am not the one who will have to live your life.
I'm a trilingual ESL and always choose English translations, anglophones have zero reason to learn another language and I couldn't care less.
>>25528118Stfu tranny
>>25528125Fuck off retard
>if I screech insults then nobody will notice I've been massively triggered by the very accurate assessment of the misery that is my existenceInteresting move (I don't think it's working lol)
>>25528158nta, but end your pathetic life already
Not even the people who agree with you like you, Sven. If you want people to take you seriously, you need to reconsider your approach.
>>25528758fuck off fag
>mentally ill OP>it's the fluoride anglo hater>samefag / pretends to be different posters>isn't smart enough to stop the anglo hate and kys insults whilst pretending to be another person>it's very obvious it's all the same guy>so mentally ill he's lost the ability to respond normally to those posters who actually engage honestly him>gets called out on his behaviour>spirals into a flood of short, repetitive insults >clearly hasn't been sleeping - off his meds or drinking>ALL OF THIS CONDUCTED IN ENGLISHHe's spent his live learning and using a language he hatesUltimate humiliation ritualMFW I realise he's just another savage pajeet, buck broken by the British Empire
>>25528820fuck off and kys faggot
>>25528822hey c'mon here.... fuck off... listen to me... kys... ARGGHHHH.. what do you think about... FUCK U!!! ... sorry.. CUNT... KYS... do you have any spare change? .... KYS KYS KYS .... it's lovely weather today, isn't it?.... SHIT FUCK WANK COCKSUCKER... don't be afraid kids... KYS.. KYS KYS....- most mentally stable swedejeet
>>25528903Can someone explain swedjeet lore, I came here looking if this lang was better than /int/s but it seems it's utterly trash here.
>>25529370calling this a /lang/ thread is a stretch, the only years long standing language related general on /lit/ is /clg/, it's just one swedish poster obsessed with cleaning your mind from english and learning foreign languages which wouldn't even be bad as far as the encouragement part but does it in the most schizo way making provocative threads and calling anyone who slightly deviates from his opinions names even if they do and did what he wants, unlike himself, which as far as I can tell knows none of the languages he shills anywhere close to proficiencyhttps://archive.4plebs.org/pol/search/text/utilitarian%2A%20anglo%2A/country/SE/
>>255294004chan is primarily spoken with english. Why is he doing it here of all places. Int has several non-english threads. Even if he wants english speakers to learn another foreign language, he shouldn't sperg out at new comers. His work seems counterproductive.
>>25529370>role-playing again - but he lets it slip by adding the little insult jab at the endyou are swedejeet
>>25529400>>25529430>>25529436fuck off utilitarian anglophones
>>25529436Yeah, this thread seems dead in the water. I beg god that the swed doesn't invade regular /lang/ but at /int/ they actually moderate their shit so it probably won't be a problem.
>>25529439warum sagst du das NIEMALS entweder auf Deutsch, vel Latine, ἢ Ἑλληνιστί, o in qualche altra lingua? bist du vielleicht selbst einer der sogenannten utilitati deditorum? ἄγ' ἀμέγαρτε, πάρεχ' ἡμῖν παραδείγματα τῆς κέκτησαι ἐμπειρίας κατὰ γλωττομάθειαν
>>25523505I think he’s just gonna keep giving advice and posting textbooks in langs he can’t read forever.
>>25523461Yes there’s a ton of stuff. There’s even a fairly large Wikipedia. But there’s heaps of stuff generally. Ephemeris maintains a small news site, but it has archives of periodicals going back to the 1800s that would be essentially full newspapers in Latin with jokes, stories, news, etc. It unironically has way more to read than a large chunk of modern langs.
>>25527878>Because I grew up bilingual and realized it hardly matters compared to the amount of investment it requires. It's good and fun but not very important and the pretention of multilingualists (or perhaps just their fetishistic imitators) is unbearable.I taught myself a language, it was good and fun, and important, but also not “useful” in the way people think. Very edifying. Yes many involved in “language learning” spaces are unbelievably pretentious but if you can ignore them it’s not so bad since it’s really quite an isolating and individual hobby.
>>25529430Actually even more than that he mass reports anyone who disagrees with him or just even posts in a way he dislikes so you had stuff like Latin posts getting removed from /clg/
>>25529650It's comical how many boards has one regard that spams constantly and everybody hates them but can't do shit about it. That explains why latin and ancient greek nerds leak into regular /lang/ if he makes /lit/ garbage
Fuck is this shit? All the chads are on /int/ - /lang/
>>25521720>Why are people on 4chan so uninterested in learning languages?There's always a language learning thread on /int/. You're just in the wrong board.
1/2The short story Germelshausen was clearly commonly used in German teaching in English-speaking countries in the past.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GermelshausenThere are many editions with notes, exercises, vocabulary, etc. These are just a few of them. There are others on archive.org. (Haller, Lewis, possibly more)>Lawrence A. McLouth, Henry Holt and Companyhttps://archive.org/details/gerstackersgerme0000lawr>Richard Alexander Minckwitz, Allyn and Baconhttps://archive.org/details/germelshausen01gersgoog>Carl Osthaus, D. C. Heath & Co.https://archive.org/details/germelshausen00gers_0>B. C. Straube, The Bruce Publishing Companyhttps://archive.org/details/germelshausen0000bcstthis is an interlinearhttps://archive.org/details/germelshausen-gerstacker-interlinear-translation-isaac-bachman-1916>The Intelligent Student’s Guide to Modern German: A Methodical Study of German Vocabulary and Grammar Based on Gerstäcker’s Well-Known Story "Germelshausen"This book sticks out and seems like a gem. It's far more than just a reader with notes, vocabulary, and exercises. It's basically a full-fledged textbook with the Germelshausen text as the center point.https://archive.org/details/the-intelligent-students-guide-to-modern-german-germelshausen-weber-1938English translation in Harper's Magazinehttps://archive.org/details/germelshausen-gerstacker-translation-charles-carroll-harpers-magazine-1876I also recommend getting these browser extensions:google translatehttps://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/google-translate/aapbdbdomjkkjkaonfhkkikfgjllclebsimple translatehttps://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/simple-translate/ibplnjkanclpjokhdolnendpplpjiacewiktionaryhttps://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/quick-search-wiktionary/kgchoibflodmphihffmogncijonmpmcewikipediahttps://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/wikipedia-search/lipakennkogpodadpikgipnogamhklmkthis is pretty good for learning how to read the Fraktur fonthttps://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=hvd.32044102864030&seq=11this is good but it's temporarily downhttps://www.pgdp.net/wiki/Anyone_can_learn_Frakturthese don't look great but it's something (for learning how to read Fraktur)https://soklug.substack.com/p/how-to-read-german-blackletterhttps://roberge.mus.ulaval.ca/gdrm/08-frakt.htmhttps://germanologyunlocked.com/how-to-read-fraktur-german-printed-text/https://de.wikihow.com/Frakturschrift-lesenI also recommend using google lens: right-click, "search this image/tab with google lens", then drag the selection tool around what you want deciphered.
2/2Another thing that's awesome is that these books, and other old textbooks and readers, have references to grammar books, many of which are on archive.org. So for example I started working with the first book I linked in the previous post, this book:https://archive.org/details/gerstackersgerme0000lawrI opened the page where the notes begin, this page, picrel.https://archive.org/details/gerstackersgerme0000lawr/page/65/mode/1upAt the top of the page it says:B. Bierwirth's Beginning German, H. Holt and Co.C. Collar's Shorter Eysenbach, revised. Ginn and Co.J. Joynes-Meissner's German Grammar, 1901. D. C. Heath and Co.T. Thomas's Practical German Grammar, revised edition. H. Holt and Co.V. Vos's Essentials of German, H. Holt and Co.These are five grammar books that are referenced in the notes. The first reference that comes up in the notes is this:See T. § 267; B. § 115; J. § 446.The first book there is this:https://archive.org/details/apracticalgerma03thomgoogThe reference tells you to read section 267, which is here:https://archive.org/details/apracticalgerma03thomgoog/page/n239/mode/1up
>>25531071>this is pretty good for learning how to read the Fraktur font>https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=hvd.32044102864030&seq=11This book is also on archive.org if someone prefers that:https://archive.org/details/comforts-german-series/Comfort%27s%20German%20Series%2C%201.%20A%20German%20Primer%20%281880%29/page/n12/mode/1up
>>25531075Those notes aren't footnotes. Instead it has numbers in the margin of the main text, see my red highlights.The main text begins on this page.https://archive.org/details/gerstackersgerme0000lawr/page/1/mode/1upThose numbers denote the line number.
>>25531114The larger bold numbers refer to the page in the main text. See my red highlight.The smaller numbers refer to the line in the main text. See my blue highlights.
What ho! It's old Swedejeet!Still speaking the King's English I see.Jolly good. Extra ration of fluoride for our dear Swedejeet
>>25531075>>25531125Then whenever the text in the grammar book/books is hard to understand I use google lens or google AI. For example I copied the page from that grammar book I linked and pasted it into google AI, and typed "help me understand section 267". This page:https://archive.org/details/apracticalgerma03thomgoog/page/n239/mode/1upPicrel is what AI said, next to the text in the grammar book.
>>25531177If this convoluted, AI-driven mess of a system is how you study languages then it's no wonder you're not making progress. lol.
>>25531185I'm making a lot of progress. Fuck off to your coomfriends at /clg/ and /lang/ where you can keep jerking each other off.
>>25531199this is /lit/it's not our fault the 4chan lang community applied for a restraining order and got rid of yougo shit up another board with your retarded lang failings
>>25531199Why can't you read and then take a break and rub one out?
>>25531199>I'm making a lot of progress.
>>25531075Here are links to all five grammar books:>B. Bierwirth's Beginning German, H. Holt and Co.https://archive.org/details/beginninggermans00bierrich>C. Collar's Shorter Eysenbach, revised. Ginn and Co.https://archive.org/details/collarsshortere00curtgoog>J. Joynes-Meissner's German Grammar, 1901. D. C. Heath and Co.https://archive.org/details/germangrammarfor00joynrich>T. Thomas's Practical German Grammar, revised edition. H. Holt and Co.https://archive.org/details/apracticalgerma03thomgoog>V. Vos's Essentials of German, H. Holt and Co.https://archive.org/details/essentialsofgerm0000bfvo/page/13/mode/1up>See T. § 267; B. § 115; J. § 446.Below are links to the pages for these sections of these three grammar books:>T. § 267>T. Thomas's Practical German Grammar, revised edition. H. Holt and Co.https://archive.org/details/apracticalgerma03thomgoog/page/n239/mode/1up>B. § 115>B. Bierwirth's Beginning German, H. Holt and Co.https://archive.org/details/beginninggermans00bierrich/page/241/mode/1up>J. § 446>J. Joynes-Meissner's German Grammar, 1901. D. C. Heath and Co.https://archive.org/details/germangrammarfor00joynrich/page/253/mode/1upPicrel shows all these three sections. I find that reading about the same thing explained by different authors deepens the understanding.
>>25531265You know, you could just make a repository for these links, but then you couldn’t pretend to be posting something worthwhile when it takes you 20 posts per thread to post them all.
Sometimes after weeks or months of reading in foreign languages it feels so good to go back and read in Spanish again. I wish it felt the same with other languages but it never actually gets even close in terms of soul-cleansing as with your native language right?
>>25521720>waaaaah! why won't you learn my dead language?
Can anyone suggest some basic resource to learn German? I speak Dutch at a B2-C1 level, and I can already recognise simple sentences, so I'd like something that follows the natural method as much as possible. I mostly want to be able to read the language, speaking would only be a nice plus.
>>25532886Pick any fucking book and read it nigger.Der kleine Herr Friedemann for instance
>>25532886theres a german natural method bookA Guide For Learning The German Language, According To The Natural MethodA Guide For Learning The German Language, According To The Natural Method: Leitfaden zum Erlernen der Deutschen Sprache nach der Natürlichen MethodeEdwin F. Bacon
i was kinda interested in japanese back when i was 16 and learned enough to browse 5channel and read japanese tweets. however i totally lost interest in japanese once i had felt that i'd penetrated the soul of japanese culture to the fullest extent of my abilities. it felt like i was a miner and i eventually just hit bedrock, and then it was like "ahh well that was fun. journey's over, folks!" and now i'm thinking, ehh, I could repeat the process with german or latin or chinese, but we all know the same thing would happen right? you make some fun superficial little observations about the culture, read a few books, and then hang up your hat. language learning is not transformative, not really. i'm not a different guy for knowing japanese. not really.
trying this method with chretien de troyes "yvain". at first i was just copying line by line, but that wasn't teaching me much so i started highlighting the different parts of speech in different colors. i think i'm going to start over and do it double spaced so that i can add notes about the words that didn't make it to the english translation. i'm using the verse translation by ruth cline and it's pretty close to 1:1 but obviously some things have to be reworded to maintain a rhyme scheme.a few problems>this book is only 1/6th the length of the divine comedy>i do not like chretien de troyes>a few of these words don't appear in wiktionarythe french version i have has modernized french on the alternate pages, which helps fill in the gaps. my mom owns a very old english to french dictionary with language from this period, but it's falling to pieces and i would have to get it rebound before i could put it through this kind of continuous use
>>25532886These two books are the natural method:https://archive.org/details/deutsch-nach-der-naturmethodehttps://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLf8XN5kNFkhc0J7rC_vQMUBIVdaj---V5https://archive.org/details/erstesdeutsches00wormgoogI personally think this is better though, but it's not the natural method. It's by Peter Hagboldt:https://archive.org/details/elementarygerman0000unse_x6b0https://archive.org/details/germanthroughpic01richThis book is the natural method but it's different from the other two. It's actually a good addition to Hagboldt's book, but more like bonus material. It's not good as a primary material. Natural-method books were originally meant to be used in a classroom, and they often say things like "this is an apple", which is useless without having a teacher pointing at an apple or having a picture of an apple in the book. The idea was that the teacher would read it while illustrating by pointing, gesturing etc. Then people took these books and used them for self-teaching. Especially older natural-method books suffer from this, but even the newer ones have it to some degree. This book is different because it's centered on having pictures doing the illustrative work.I suggest starting with Hagboldt's book. Read that for a few chapters to feel that you get going. Then add some grammar book to read alongside it. I suggest picking one of these:https://annas-archive.gl/md5/d041c9cfe501cacecdac11cdc3af46b3https://archive.org/details/issn_72136596Adlerhttps://archive.org/details/progressivegerma00adleWeberhttps://archive.org/details/the-intelligent-students-guide-to-modern-german-germelshausen-weber-1938Then after some time, possibly before finishing Hagboldt's book, read this by McLouth:https://archive.org/details/gerstackersgerme0000lawrIt's good because it's a reader but you learn grammar, so it's a little like Adler's book. See these posts for a breakdown of how to use it. If you use Weber's book you don't need this though because it's the same novella. McLouth's book is a reader with notes. Weber's book is a textbook with that same novella as the center point, meaning it has more extensive explanations. It's McLouth's book on steroids.>>25531071>>25531075>>25531082>>25531114>>25531125>>25531177>>25531265
>>25532886>>25533125Get these browser extensions for pronunciation and more:https://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/google-translate/aapbdbdomjkkjkaonfhkkikfgjllclebhttps://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/quick-search-wiktionary/kgchoibflodmphihffmogncijonmpmcehttps://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/simple-translate/ibplnjkanclpjokhdolnendpplpjiacehttps://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/wikipedia-search/lipakennkogpodadpikgipnogamhklmkI also recommend using google lens: right-click, "search this image/tab with google lens", then drag the selection tool around text. This is useful for many things. One thing is that the OCR that's built into archive.org is worthless. This is much better for copying text. You can also use it for deciphering text in the Fraktur font. You can use it to hear the text spoken. etc.
>>25532886This is good too, not just for learning to read Fraktur.https://archive.org/details/comforts-german-series/Comfort%27s%20German%20Series%2C%201.%20A%20German%20Primer%20%281880%29
>>25533125This is what a lot of natural-method books are like.>Here is my book. My book is brown. This book here is green; my book is not green.>Bella, is the rose green?>Oh no, the rose is not green.>Is the rose red?>Yes, the rose is red.This is meant as a script for a teacher to read from while having a brown book, a green book, and a red rose as props.
>>25532935Your problem is that you have a misconception about what culture is. There is no such thing as Japanese culture or German culture. Culture is culture. Culture is not whether you eat sushi or currywurst for lunch. Culture is refinement of the spirit. Beethoven is culture, Scott Joplin and Gershwin are not. You should learn languages for culture, but in the sense of refinement of the spirit, not in the sense of sushi vs currywurst. Becoming cultured has nothing to do with learning about "cultures" or experiencing "cultures". Yes, learning about "cultures" is absolutely not transformative, you're right about that. Culture in the proper sense of the word however is.
>>25533188the world does have different cultures and they do lead different places. i think you'd be mental to believe otherwise. are the heights to which bach can take you the same as the heights to which the study of ancient china can? i really don't think so. i think there are certain rare and refined attitudes and moods that are only recorded in old foreign texts, and i want access to them, it's why i learn.and if you say that's crazy, well, is it any different from bach? there's a certain emotion, a certain perspective on life and God that can only really be conveyed to us through bach. are you saying that if bach were lost to us, it wouldn't matter because all culture is the same?
>>25533101That's the analytic approach, top-down, breaking down complex text into its simpler constituent parts, as opposed to the synthetic approach, bottom-up, building upward into greater complexity from simpler elements. I mix analytic and synthetic learning. If you like the analytic approach I think you're going to like these books, especially the first link, as it has some grammar explanations in the footnotes.https://archive.org/details/easyfrenchreadin00fish/page/5/mode/1uphttps://archive.org/details/progressivepro00coll/page/1/mode/1uphttps://archive.org/details/selectionofonehu00perr/page/1/mode/1upUse these browser extensions and google lens with those books:>>25533127You could also add this book to add a bit of synthetic learning into the mix while sticking to the general idea you're going for.https://archive.org/details/basicfrenchreadi00bond
>>25533188One of the most retarded takes I've ever read on 4chan. On any board. ImpressiveHow long have you been huffing paint thinners?
>>25533200I'm not saying listening to Bach makes you cultured, I'm saying Bach was cultured. You complained about language learning not being transformative. I said yeah it's not going to be transformative if you go into it with the idea that you're going to experience "cultures" in the very mundane sense of sushi vs currywurst. This is not actual culture. Actual culture is about learning in order to move your mind into the realm of pure eternal ideas. That realm is the cultured realm. There is no yours vs mine in that realm. The Pythagorean theorem is not Greek. But not all people care about actual culture. I'm just saying it's not surprising that your mundane adventures are not transformative.
>>25521913how do 8 year olds even learn languages?when i was 8 i was barely learning the alohabet and basic math
learning a foreign language is just memorizing words and their meaningnothing else matters, all you need is anki and practice
This looks nice. Found it on archive.org just now.https://archive.org/details/readingfrenchflu0000poli
>>25533288For brainlets and people who have never studied languages it is, yes. It's the incurious utilitarian's idea of what language learning is. There is a lot more to language learning than just hypnopaedia in Brave New World.
>>25533285Exposure. I picked up English from watching cartoons way before we had a class in school.
clean-looking online "open access" textbook for German grammar>A Foundation Course in Reading German by Howard Martin and Alan Nghttps://wisc.pb.unizin.org/readinggerman/
>>25533308i love how this simple fact aligned with reality makes you shills madthis language learning industry is literally not needed or useful, otherwise immigrants would fucking learn the language
Reading French by Mary Borellihttps://archive.org/details/readingfrench00bore
It's amazing how all the language learning experts spend all their time:A) arguing online in English only, and B) never actually providing evidence of their skillsPure LARPing
>>25533431Your very empty shallow idea of language learning as being just a one-to-one translation and something you just flash in your awareness enough times, again, is how some people view it. Mainly anglophone monolinguals. But, again, it's far from the only way to view language learning. I for example prefer to learn a little about etymology instead of using flashcards. When I learn that tatsächlich is derived from Tatsache, which was made up by Johann Joachim Spalding in 1778 because he didn't know a good word for translating "matter of fact", that makes me remember Tatsache and tatsächlich better than just flashing cards 30 times.
https://archive.org/details/shortcomparative00henrrich/page/1/mode/1up
>>25533550>have to doI don't have to do shit. I don't study for some gay exam like you.
>>25526724>It's already too late for me to writeSo your hands not work? Did you type this with your feet?
>>25533451Honnêtement, c’est l’un des aspects les plus drôles des discussions sur l’apprentissage des langues en ligne.Tu tombes sur un gars qui affiche une collection de drapeaux dans son profil, qui a 47 applications linguistiques installées et qui tient un tableur pour suivre ses « heures d’apport linguistique », mais dont 95 % de ses contributions consistent à débattre avec d’autres anglophones pour savoir si l’apport compréhensible est meilleur qu’Anki.Demandez-lui d’écrire 300 mots dans la langue où il est censé avoir un niveau B2/C1, et tout à coup, ça déclenche tout un débat sur le fait que les certificats ne servent à rien, que le CECR est eurocentrique, que les locuteurs natifs sont nuls en grammaire, que « la véritable aisance linguistique ne peut pas être mesurée ».D’accord.Y, para ser justos, también existe el LARP opuesto. Alguien dice que habla seis idiomas porque sabe presentarse, pedir un café y decir «no entiendo» en cada uno de ellos..Hay una forma muy sencilla de distinguir la mayor parte de estas tonterías de la habilidad real: usa el idioma (sin "He mantenido una racha de 900 días en Duolingo"... "Veo anime sin subtítulos").Fanya mazungumzo.إن القدرة على شرح سبب عدم كفاءة طريقة شخص آخر لا تجعلك بارعًا في اللغة بطريقة سحرية.Chayrayku, arí, iskayrayayqa allinmi.Todisteena riittää yksinkertaisesti kielenkäyttö.नाटक करने की कोई ज़रूरत नहीं है।A internet está cheia de pessoas que passaram anos aprendendo a falar sobre o aprendizado de idiomas.Muito menos pessoas passaram anos realmente aprendendo esses idiomas.Esses não são os mesmos passatempos.
