Earlier this year, I tried running a CYOA for the first time, and then I abandoned it out of nowhere. For a while I've felt bad about doing that, so instead of trying and failing to bring it back, I'm going to just give everypony some closure and say "picrel">Which one was that?It was the one where Anon reincarnates as a genie. Here are the links:Part 1: https://desuarchive.org/mlp/thread/42208915Part 2: https://desuarchive.org/mlp/thread/42282188>Why did you stop?I was honestly struggling in a number of areas when it came to running it. 1. I kept changing my mind on what type of story I wanted it to be. I came up with the idea on a whim and decided to make a thread all in the same hour. There was no long-term plan at the start, and that showed from how directionless the story was for much of its runtime. I figured that letting people decide how the story goes would result in preparation being pointless, but that only works if you keep things simple, and don’t throw in foreshadowing to ideas you’re not sure how you’re actually going to flesh out later.2. The concept of a wish-granting protagonist is hard to keep under control in a CYOA like this. Being able to straight up grant wishes was too powerful to both keep the plot where I wanted it to go and make the players feel like they're in control. That's why I came up with arbitrary rules as I went, to varying degrees of success. I feel like what I implemented caused people a lot of frustration and confusion, so if I ever try to run a CYOA again, I’ll definitely make the protagonist simpler in abilities and clearer in goals.3. I struggled to keep the CYOA from falling off the catalogue. I have no idea how anyone could run one of these things while employed, because I was constantly using my breaks to check in on the thread to either bump or add small updates to keep it from being archived. That was back when I had a part time job. Now that I have a full time job, there's no hope of me running a CYOA right now. No, I'm not quitting my job to satisfy 10 anonymous forum users.These three ended up culminating in a moment where I came back to the page, and I saw that it archived before I could respond to anyone. It was probably due to the fact that the plot had come to a screeching halt and I was just stalling because I didn’t know how to make the Crowatia wish-granting scene live up to my own expectations. I don't know why, but for some reason I felt so stressed about making it a satisfying climax that I just instinctually started avoiding it. The archiving of that thread was the straw that made the camel give up. I felt utterly demotivated and I had no drive to make a new thread.>Was it worth it?Even if it failed, yeah. I think the experience and skill development was worth it, and I like to think that for a while, I gave a few people out there a good time. That's why I really regret not saying this all sooner.
Shut up, cuh. We on 4chan! We don't give no fucks!!!
>>42800129>no pony protagonistnot interested
damn nigga who asked
>>42800129ok
>>42800129Now that I got that out of the way, if anyone has any questions or feedback on the CYOA, I'd be happy to answer/take it. I had a massive amount of plans and future additional places and characters I wanted to use, so if anypony wants closure on any detail, I'd be happy to do that while I have a weekend of free time.
>>42800129>No, I'm not quitting my job to satisfy 10 anonymous forum users.lame
>>42800129Sounds like you learned some important lessons, like that your readers aren't going to give the story a direction. You have to do that. To write a satisfying story, even in a CYOA, you have to plan it beforehand.Also, I just post mine in a general since I only have time to drop something once a week with a full time job. That way the thread isn't just a pure bumpfest.
>>42800184I sure did. As shitty as this sounds, I knew my first big writing project would suck, so I thought the right option would be a CYOA because "it sucking would be the players' fault." The fact that I even had that line of thought at all still bothers me. And yes, I probably should have just used the general. I was worried things would get messy and chaotic if I added another CYOA to a thread full of other CYOAs, but the stress it could have saved me definitely would have been worth it. Maybe I should have posted this announcement over there.
>>42800129>I struggled to keep the CYOA from falling off the catalogue.Isn't it it our job?
>>42800223>jobI'm not working for free.
>>42800223I had the same thought when I started. Plenty of CYOAs operate with their own threads just fine, so either I was writing too slow or those ones simply had greater user interest. Maybe both. Definitely a good argument for >>42800184's strategy.
>>42800129Write for yourself before you write for others. Because if you aren't enjoying it, you won't continue writing.
>>42800425How am I ever going to finish anything if I give up at the hard part?
>>42800727An issue of definitions.Who says you don't enjoy the hard part? Well, you, mostly.It's also... idealistic advice. Look, if you can make the decision to externalize your decision making process and value parsing system to an outside authority, you could have just used the same justifications and will power to execute on your own ideas.If you define good and bad based on an external standard, then you'll satisfy good by that standard, which means you'll likely not quite satisfy your own standard.However, there's also A.A. One of the primary ideas that alcoholics anonymous uses is that the willpower of its members is insufficient. They use religious ideas in order to suggest that their members surrender their own will to a god entity. So, humans have been using conceptual crutches in order to trick themselves into doing what they already want to do for basically all of history.So, you don't actually have to face the fact that frustration and difficulty are a desired part of the human experience if you don't want to. You can imagine yourself an exclusively selfless creature who works for others if that's what gets you out of bed.
>>42800270>either I was writing too slow or those ones simply had greater user interestA logical conclusion, but no that just happens
>>42800129>I came up with the idea on a whim and decided to make a thread all in the same hour. There was no long-term plan at the startthis is how phonepones started.
>>42800129Making things up as you go along isn't a terrible option, but it is rather unstable
bump
>>42800727You plan it out ahead so you know the best part is at the very end.
>>42800152reboot without green tranny when?
>>42802091>not anon filly or anon mare>still trannyno winning with some people
>>42802105>nohoovesthere has never been or ever will be a good anonhooman cyoa
>>42801415Every time I hear about an event where authors come and talk to students, there's always one guy who's got like 13 awards and makes his living writing and has tons of notes and does research and writes his story before he writes his story,and then there's another guy who's got like 13 awards and makes his living writing who's just like "lol I just kind of get this urge and then scribble and a story happens."and neither could do what the other does.>>42800129>closureThere are, just, so many of you. Most of you are never coming back. 15 years from now I'll be struck by the impression of a fuzzy rounded snoot and my mind will sprint down the lines of association past "get lemon" and "cookie quest", all the way to that one quest where a pony falls down a sudden hole, breaks their bones, and presumably slowly starves. A couple dozen times between now and death, it will be you I remember, more if I get involved with Quebec. Actually, since you picked the common subject of genies, I may remember you even more than that, despite the fact you're just two threads. I could stop running that process in the background, the one which waits and refreshes all the necessary information for a task in the future, the microscopic part of my brain which was waiting for you even when I wasn't thinking about you at all, even though I assumed you were gone already. That's what you're asking me to do. There's no need to maintain my internal documentation on the general shape of the dirt in your cyoa or the character of your characters or the structure of their personal and public politics, if it won't be used in the future.But that's wrong. They aren't data in a table or tokens on a board, only. These cute, fuzzy lies are the things I am made of, all the parts I liked enough to grab, rip from their home and staple to my self narration, the sticky parts which splattered on me from hundreds of stories. A world where the curve of a peach 15 years from now evokes in me nothing, is worse.I'll stop waiting for the completion of this game, and every little aspect of my memory of this will fade and corrode into little fragments without full names. I'll find something else to construct a narrative with, and that will be work. If I'm going to start from scratch again anyway, and we all will, then what do we gain from promising here that we'll never revisit this?So sure, you're gone, and I'll free up one one billionth of a brain cycle. Just, you never owed me a story, and you don't owe me a promise to never tell a story again, either. Even if I leave this place and never come back and you show up here 8 years from now to take a lazy attempt at narration again, someone's always ready to read something good, or even trash, and a backlog is a feature, not a bug.
>>42802205Personally, at this very moment, I'm being a shitter and playing a modded video game instead of posting my own thread while I specifically wait out hype men. I know damn well that my asking won't get you off your ass. I also have an old few hundred thousand word story that I've failed to finish a chapter of for well over 8 years now, so I also know that you can't make yourself do it either. You worried a lot about staying on the board, and yet you never fell off for two threads. You come here talking about closure. It's you who's under pressure. I watch the seasons shift under my incredibly privileged campaign to attain mastery over a long line of invented game systems, and each one contributes a little to the next, but mostly I become aware of the exact cost in time, exactly how much I can do in a season, and the void chases me.So I'll definitely finish my current projects, and I'll go back and finish some of my old ones, but that's because doing so answers the questions which are pertinent to my own psychology at this time. I gain the need to say something, even if I haven't yet figured out what it is. >2There's a question I've asked a few times, and I kind of think it might be poison. "What did you think would happen?"It should be harmless enough. The literal interpretation and answer is just to state your initial impression which can then be compared to the final result. However, there's a problem. First, it can be interpreted as rude, as though it implies that any normal competent person would have had the obvious answer. In real life, after something goes wrong, this is often how it is actually used. In narration, there's another problem. We create meaningful stories by pulling at something we do not understand, asking, executing, testing. To imply that we should have a specific question which we have crystalized into language before starting is to rip the beating alive core out of narrative. The prospective author, then, is left attempting to deconstruct their own curiosity while being denied the right to use the narrative tools which are designed for that exact job. It is demanded, then, that they begin their calculations only once they have already ascertained the answer.
>>42802208This is never my intent. At the point where I ask, the story is already passed, and hindsight should be in effect. Similarly, you've repeatedly been given the advice that you should plan ahead more, but the very thing which enabled you to start was that you didn't do that. Again, it is like you're being told to start calculating only once you have your answer. This, also, is nobody's intent, but it might even feel a bit like bullying.Well, for one final bit of bullying, improv is a skill. In the end, your plans still have to smack into reality, and you still have to land, sticking it or not.>closuremy question is yes.If I could just keep asking questions until we got to the end of the story, I would. It sucks that we exist in a world where basic subsistence requires a 9 to 5, which is more like 12 hours with all the prep and travel, 8 for sleep, and 4 for family, errands, and maintenance. It's a mystery that anyone has ever managed to complete any artistic project at all, or had a friend. But like, right now, you say you've got time. You've got a thread. You've got hecklers. If what you want is to type, you can. If you just want to linger as Timewaster once more, well, hi then. I hope my musings have been of value in any way.
>>42800129>QM and players referencing hecking /mlp/ garbage>QM making self-deprecating crap like "the writer">Main mare mentioning being used goods 'in collage'>characters break character in monologuing>Anemic skeleton world and no consequences for players godmode>Giant note nobody read, which wasn't even used as a start (do not try to help me, you are too weak)>Poor reversi hook execution of being the one who does the wishing>QM too lazy to write a story within the cyoa and thinks writing this fact makes it better>Inconsistent setup as a neet failure then dishing out advice of how they found what they were good at.>Verbatum using essay slop postsThe writing was a badly written cringe-combo of /mlp/ maymays and earth2 shittery which flopped hard at immersion, ontop of QM where players could interact with with filler shit, making decisions like picking up the lamp, or pushing past a good stopping point for players to interact with, left with dead space of waiting for shit to happen otherwise. Overall bad experience, okay for a first try, good art. but too many problems dragging it down
>>42800129Well, at least you tried. You even learned some thing, so you're better than some. So congrats.
Bump
>>42800129Sorry anons it was all my fault I forgot to bump the thread that one time
>>42800129Not sorry anons it wasn't all my fault I was the one that made the thread that killed this shit cyoa
>No post, weekend's about overhmmseems like there's a miscommunication here. I don't know, maybe your girl called and you had a blast at a skate park event, or you had to change one billion diapers. I think you figured you would have something to say, but now there's a thread sinking off the board and you're put right back in the mental state which killed your spark the first time. It probably doesn't help that fuckers are still acting like the species of your protag is a valid criticism. But those are guesses.And that's the issue, the real one, is the guessing. That's why the thread was made, according to the title. The issue is here condensed into something real and immediate instead of cured.So look, I'm gonna hold your hand on this one, and simply ask.Do you want to say things still?and Do you need me to ask specific questions instead of letting you spill in an open ended manner?
>>42802215>>42805219Sorry about the lack of posting. I was originally going to sperg out about a bunch of plans and explain what the answers to the mysteries I tried to set up were, but I don't think there's much of a point to that. If I didn't care enough to see it through despite the odds, why would anyone else? The ideas are recyclable enough to insert into something else anyway. >Do you need me to ask specific questions instead of letting you spill in an open ended manner?You can ask whatever you'd like, or if you actually do want me to spew the previously mentioned nonsense, it's possible if it's soon.
>>42805219>>42805442CYOA threads are at a constant dead or near dead state because of TWO things.>having to read all the bullshit choices others made if you’re too late to the thread lest you want to make shitty choices with no info on past events or story. >anons don’t want to read 10+ posts of story to actually follow along. Combines the worst of both worlds. The only CYOA I know that was successful was the one during /mlp/con because of two things>drawfag would quickly sketch scenes following with people’s choices (usually less then 5 mins per scene) which is way better then wordswordswords>story was dead simple (anonfilly leaving Twilight’s House after being booted out and getting up to stupid shit.)your shitty CYOA has neither.>b-buh try writefagging your own stories!I’ve already read enough fimfics and written enough of my own slop (which I shortly nuked after because it was shit).
>>42805442Well, while it's not the most immediate thing, since we're talking about mysteries, how about undead mare's friend she was gonna go visit? What da charlatin doin?
>>42805481>normie con but onlinepost discarded. you are a newfag who hasn't been around for the glory of GOOD cyoa threads which this wasnt one of them. Just look at aftercase, never makes greenman tranny fics, always puts effort into his worldbuilding, great characters and art.
>>42805583>you are a newfagThanks captain obvious, you’re one too. All the oldfags are gone poser.>who hasn't been around for the glory of GOOD cyoa threads which this wasnt one of them.The average newfag anon isn’t going to read through 10+ posts of wordswordswords, it is just how it is nowadays.>Just look at aftercaseLiteralwho? They’re irrelevant if they don’t interact with the board anymore, and have probably trooned out or turned into a furfag.>never makes greenman tranny ficsAnd you think self inserting as a mare/stallion is better? Go back to /ptfg/ faggot.>always puts effort into his worldbuildingThe most memorable stories are the simple ones, not the retarded ones where I learn about how zigger factions drink certain strains of cocaine tea and how they slit their arms and scar them before going into battle etc etc.>great characters and art.post examples >lol no newfag go find them yourself!you brought up the literalwho, you sauce.
>>42805592Right right so fury road is a bad movie got itLook, if you actually just don't like it when a story includes more than 3 moving parts, that's a you thing, but also I don't think you do. You already brought up your own failed project which you hated enough to delete. If you've got an overwhelming all-infecting hatred which attacks any narrative which you've got enough details to sink your teeth into and ruins everything which you interface with for more than a few seconds, that sucks. I'm sorry. When I meditate on the experience of a fictional setting, it is filled with my own personal zen, and so am I, instead of demanding that it answer for my personal scars.I'ma let the other guy shoot a quest at you, since he's the one you asked.
>>42805592>doesn't know a GODcase cyoa is on the board right now.You need to go back
>>42805575>Tell us about Athame's old friend down in SaugertrotNow that's a rabbit hole. The Athame subplot was by far the most complicated and thought out thing I had in the works. She would have made a much better MC. Looking back, almost every character would have been a better MC. You know how Hopeful Athame clearly had issues with the Black Mage Guild? Let's just say that a few days after splitting up from the main party, you would have gotten grim news about missing ponies over there Details would be sparse, but I think readers would pick up on things quickly and conclude that the sweet, motherly mare they met is a much more dangerous individual than what she may have let on. Essentially, this was her plot:>Be an immediate unicorn prodigy>Be completely worthy of Celestia's School, but unable to attend due to economic reasons>Black Mage Guild is a long-standing institution that takes complete interest in her and takes her in>They specialize in dark magic, which is generally more tolerated and less regulated outside of Equestria. >Get taken under the head's wing (maybe a metaphorical wing, maybe not. Design was never finalized. Could have taken the appearance of anything from a mere edgy unicorn to a full-blown lich dragon) and keep growing>BMG has permission to use criminals in their rituals. Nopony will miss them, after all. Right?>Hopeful Athame spends the majority of her life partaking in sacrificial rituals and entering pacts, which she is constantly told are justified>Eventually, she realizes that some chosen victims are falsely accused, and that she has been being gaslit for years into torturing innocent individuals by everypony around her>The head himself turned out to be lying about the purpose of the institution. He's actually a being not native to this world, banished here long ago for a crime he did not commit. He had taken on a fake form to fit in.>His native plane of existence works differently from hers. A universe with only three spatial dimensions and one time dimension is insufferable. It's crushing and suffocating, torture upon senses a pony doesn't even have. A cosmic oubliette.>Much of what's extracted during rituals is stolen by him>His end goal is to escape this plane, and the deaths of a few thousand short-lived, small-minded, and fast-breeding creatures over a tiny percentage of his possible existence barely registers on his moral compass as meaningful>Total justified crashout and disappearance>Kill yourself in a damp cave>Get brought back to life against your willHer story would have been one of revenge. Violent, brutal revenge. Whether or not the player would help her would be up to them, but I doubt the players would turn an opportunity like that down. Shame I thought having antagonistic forces like Hollowers and dragon lords present at the same time would be manageable. CYOAs never progress far enough to cover that much ground.
>>42805910Not hard to be a better MC than a blank slate
