Hauer Editionhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApS5yYGovI4This thread is for the discussion of music in the Western (European) classical tradition, as well as classical instrument-playing.>How do I get into classical?This link has resources including audio courses, textbooks and selections of recordings to help you start to understand and appreciate classical music:https://rentry.org/classicalgenPrevious: >>128219675
First for Mozarthttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDjU7L5eas0
First for mozarthttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvfcQzX1tSI
>>128243718Hauer is so much better than Schoenberg.
>>128243714>Except he doesn't??? Doesn't what?>but he also adds actual variation to that repetition. This is basic musical illiteracy. Variation and development are two different things. Beethoven has variations in the exposition, Liszt does the same after introduction, the exposition is a variation and it is recapitulated only at the end of the piece.>has the main theme transform in a bunch of different ways.Liszt transforms them the same way, he uses the exact same techniques Beethoven does in the 5th and 9th, and Schubert in his Fantasy, but Liszt is even more extreme and transforms them in almost every single mood and variety imaginable. And keeps transoforming them across the entire piece, making it one cohesive whole.>If Liszt did it, it would just be the first theme,......what? Do you even understand what you're talking about?
>>128243770not really. I just shill Hauer to disprove the claim spouted by /pol/tards that atonality and 12-tone music are a conspiracy of "dA jOoz" to destroy western art or something.
>>128243770I don't think even Hauer would believe that.Also, post his best music.>>128243800You too.
>128243795You can bait and deny reality all you want, eastern composers just suck at development and variation. Be it hungarian, russian, polish, georgian
>>128243815soon.
now playing, in a RYMsister kind of mood todaystart of Messiaen: Vingt Regards sur l'Enfant-Jésushttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxQBqtnR_OE&list=OLAK5uy_kkylFrNdVl-Wh_p8Qm8iwGHiPndbrxGM8&index=4https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_kkylFrNdVl-Wh_p8Qm8iwGHiPndbrxGM8>"A giant fresco, a kind of odyssey," is Bertrand Chamayou's description of Olivier Messiaen's piano masterwork, Vingt Regards sur L'Enfant-Jésus. Written in 1944, it is a monumental, mystical and iridescent sequence of 20 gazes or contemplations on the infant Jesus. Messiaen once wrote that "The drama of my life is that I have written religious music for an audience that has no faith." Bertrand Chamayou feels that the Vingt Regards "is a mystical rather than a religious experience... It arouses the same kind of awe as walking into a magnificent cathedral or seeing a glorious sunset. You feel that time stops." Chamayou first played the work in 2008, Messiaen's centenary year, but it has been part of his life since he was nine years old. "It was revelation... I think I can say that the Vingt Regards has played a role in shaping the way I play, the sound I produce and my approach as an interpreter." To complement this two-hour landmark of the repertoire, Chamayou has also recorded five short musical tributes to Messiaen, written in the years following his death in 1992. They are by Toru Takemitsu, Tristan Murail, György Kurtág, Jonathan Harvey and Anthony Cheung.I glanced at other recordings of this work and it seems the kind of pianists who record this kind of classical aren't the kind I'm used to (with a couple exceptions, like Aimard, Osborne, and Serkin), so any other recommendations for recordings of it to check out would be appreciated.
>>128243819Perfect dogmatic non-response. I accept your concession. Now gtfo >>>/mu/
>>128243756I demand to know what the cover drawings are from this. As well as Otmar Suitner's other Mozart albums, as well as the Annerose Schmidt Mozart covers, and any other classical album cover using a drawing. I'm so tired of not getting any names.
>>128243875There's one by a Michel Béroff that looks quite good, maybe Martin Helmchen too.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEjEEft0LfA&list=OLAK5uy_mSLC-8c2SlYPZHwxdVPkoVo2M7CtcT4jQ&index=2
Liszthttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1X7iezB0P1k&list=OLAK5uy_lWjusHFp8ae15F3yie-LRrQ5aMHUTkyJg&index=2
>>128243899sorry anon :/the info could be on here, try the bottom left corneror maybe this one might be cleanerhttps://i.discogs.com/oMEI3vJfPKQ0g5BEUzK4C8DxfUGXxLwSRXQrT0kg_fA/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:577/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTQ0NzY1/NzMtMTQ3MjM5NjM0/Ny00NjE3Lm1wbw.jpeggood luck!
>>128243956Absolutely based of Brahms to intentionally pick this boring ass piece as a prime moment to snoozeReal sonata by a real composerhttps://youtu.be/EuW2WJFFh4c
>>128243997Liszt's S. 178 might just be the greatest post-Beethoven piano sonata. Certainly the greatest post-Schubert-D.960.
Anyone else wanna join me on a journey to traverse "The TC Top 200 Recommended Post-1950 Works List"?
>>128244023kill yourself.
>>128244031*dies*okay done, what next?
>>128244012You're replying to a musically illiterwte retard.But it's also idiotic to compare the greatest sonatas, since Chopin's 3rd is up there as well with D960 and Beethoven's 29-32. Nitpicking won't get you anywhere.
>>128244023I might join but for top 50 only. And I've heard some of those. But the things is, listening to them is a waste of time without dedicated and repeated listenings, and life is short, so I'm not so sure yet.
I didn't quite care for Gulda's Bach WTC initially, but something about it kept drawing me back, and each time I listen to it, I find myself liking it more and more as it steadily climbs my list of favorite WTC recordings.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FSo3NknHao&list=OLAK5uy_lTU7Y20sUpDXE89qyYXe1wXCT1xufESCI&index=34It certainly isn't the most beautiful, but it might be the most colorful. It encompasses the widest spectrum of tone and emotion, all with a powerful undercurrent of joy, as is common for Gulda.
>>128244035I'm glad you asked:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HERc9XIFZBo&t=107
>>128244047>listening to them is a waste of time without dedicated and repeated listenings, and life is short, so I'm not so sure yet.tru
>>128244040I said post-Beethoven and possibly D.960!>since Chopin's 3rd is up theremore like Scriabin's 5th and Prokofiev's 8th but I respect your choice.
I really like Bach's organ works
>>128244101I like water.
>>128244059We can go for top 5-10 first, then decide how to proceed. But I want discussion, analysis, not just comparsion of recordings. Nothing too academic, just outlining sections, themes etc.>>128244066Scriabin's 4th and 7th > 5th
Akiko Suwanai's Bachhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHR3yBzQSRk&list=OLAK5uy_nAd5x6RH7r6u5h2KXivZC9jGllmrw6IZU&index=29
>>128244127>We can go for top 5-10 first, then decide how to proceed. But I want discussion, analysis, not just comparsion of recordings. Nothing too academic, just outlining sections, themes etc.For sure, we'll see, I'll let you know. Maybe I'll just stick to exploring Messiaen's solo piano music for now, that's the source of the bulk of the itch. Are you familiar?
Mozart is boring if you observe the repeats
>>128244144>Are you familiar?Nope.
Liszt... at the opera!Liszt: Pilgrims' Chorus from Tannhäuser, S. 443 (1st Version, After Wagner)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aJFW4KCsfM&list=OLAK5uy_mpHNJ1ho-Tg72wAic6k6iWjMjadxXWOnQ&index=12Something for the W-sisters to enjoy.
>>128243875Every solo piano Messiaen piece is best performed and recorded by his wife.
>>128244169might be time to venture forth!>>128243915>>128243875>>128244179Ah, that is one of the names I saw and didn't recognize. I'll add it, thanks.
>>128243875>>128244179Also this.
>>128244189Thanks. I'm liking Beroff's quite a bit but I'll check hers out next.
now playingstart of Bruckner: Symphony No. 8 in C Minor, WAB 108https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OSTR_Tt6cTA&list=OLAK5uy_kW7CrYmH6YGdc9FzGPuQdEpP0wtb-R6yE&index=30start of Bruckner: Symphony No. 9 in D Minor, WAB 109https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDN-hkLMCb4&list=OLAK5uy_kW7CrYmH6YGdc9FzGPuQdEpP0wtb-R6yE&index=33https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_kW7CrYmH6YGdc9FzGPuQdEpP0wtb-R6yEI don't think I've actually heard these performances before, only Jochum's 8th and 9th with the Staatskapelle Dresden. What's interesting is while Jochum has a 26:43 Adagio in the 8th, well within the standard runtimes, his Finale dips to 19:51! Don't think I've ever seen such a gap between the final two movements of the 8th before; Finales of the 8th which dip below 20 minutes is rare enough, but coupled with an Adagio almost 27 minutes is unheard of -- you'd expect a Finale of roughly 25-26 minutes. But hey, that's Jochum's Bruckner, where personalized, idiosyncratic tempo decisions abound.
>>128244326Did you take this? Spying on the violinist Asian woman?
>>128244518
>>128244525>using Haydn to call Mozart boring>Haydn>superior to Mozart>especially one of his middle symphoniesthere's no way this is sincere
>>128244539that symphony is an early one, it has awkard numbering. you clearly didn't listen to the two videos.
>>128244133I went to see her mozart violin concerto 5 this year. shes pretty good
>https://youtu.be/KEdoehrFL30has a meager 8.4k views after 8 years so it's you who's in the wrong on this, ridiculous
>>128244565>>128244591I'm already familiar with that one and I know it mogs any of Haydn's symphonies that aren't his London symphonies.
>>128244631retard maybe it's the recording, the composition isn't outright bad but the youtube link that anon posted was an outright fail compared to the random other thing i had playing
if it "mogs" anything it should have more than 8.4k views after 8 years, anything else is mental gymnastics and cope
>>128244651Different tastes I guess. I think almost all of Haydn's symphonies are pretty much indistinctive classicalslop, whereas Mozart's piano sonatas are superb, as is Fazil Say's performances of them. You do you.
Liszt’s piano pieces aren’t overrated. It’s just Sonata in B. Well there’s also one or two where it sounds like he’s trying to do stuff that the orchestra or small grip of instruments would make sound better and he’s just showing off
>>128244668you have maybe some mental gymnastics like a music teacher who listens to the musical notes and not much else about the sound quality, you could never become a successful musician or music producer, just a consumer or a wagecuck like a teacher
>>128244685o_o
>>128243800He outjewed Schoenberg
>>128244695the consensus is anyway that haydn is almost as good as mozart, even better than mozart in some regards especially if you compare some random average pieces of each composer, not that mozart categorically turbomogs haydn, these are your mental gymnastics
>>128244711I was only sharing my own opinions, anon. I don't think Haydn's symphonies are objectively bad, obviously, just not for me. I've listened to his London symphonies many times and not an iota has ever remained with me because it's just so indistinctive, and his earlier symphonies are much worse in that regard. And I love Mozart's piano sonatas and quite like Fazil Say as a pianist.
>>128244113I like water too homes but I don’t like walls of water crashing into my small seafront town
>>128244742In my opinion all Hayden’s symphonies are equally as good
>>128244778I'm happy for you. I hope you someday come around to Mozart's piano sonatas and perhaps Fazil Say's performance of them.
I think Mozart sucks
>>128243915The Preludes on this are really nice.
>>128244742Insane to call the London Symphonies indistinctive. By his late period Haydn was proto-Beethovenian.
>>128244789 I love ‘‘em all equally don’t make me pick. It’d be like Sophie’s Choice if she had 106 children instead of 2
>>128244817Well, I'm biased because I outright don't care for the trademark classical era sound, particularly orchestral. With some exceptions, of course. I don't even listen to Mozart's symphonies, and increasingly I find myself no longer in the mood for Beethoven's. So you can imagine how I feel about Haydn. Vivaldi too, even though he's baroque.
>>128244848You love Haydn that much, huh? I don't feel the same but I'm happy someone here immensely adores his music.
the solo piano music of Debussy, Ravel, Messiaen, Prokofiev, and Scriabin type moodalso open to Berg, Schoenberg, and Barber
>>128244658>appeal to popularity logical fallacyYour breath stinks of shit and spoiled broccoli.
>>128244943Not in this case though . Since it’s all just opinion anyway popularity may indeed be seen as an indicator of superiority
been trying to find the ideal recording of Chopin's Polonaises. This Berman set looks promising, plus it includes Gilels' performance of the 3rd Piano Sonata which is supposed to be one of the very best.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dp-FgO9LMok&list=OLAK5uy_ntvv02xPANVlKgRcnfDB5n3rIgSRlbPmE&index=2https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hJWNCdc7pE&list=OLAK5uy_ntvv02xPANVlKgRcnfDB5n3rIgSRlbPmE&index=3https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LRQxYBNuHHQ&list=OLAK5uy_ntvv02xPANVlKgRcnfDB5n3rIgSRlbPmE&index=4https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ph4ey6mIufY&list=OLAK5uy_ntvv02xPANVlKgRcnfDB5n3rIgSRlbPmE&index=5https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPGuKNTVX6I&list=OLAK5uy_ntvv02xPANVlKgRcnfDB5n3rIgSRlbPmE&index=6https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4oYkZM4zC6k&list=OLAK5uy_ntvv02xPANVlKgRcnfDB5n3rIgSRlbPmE&index=7Piano Sonata No. 3 in B Minor, Op. 58 (Gilels)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anjP6p7vv6M&list=OLAK5uy_ntvv02xPANVlKgRcnfDB5n3rIgSRlbPmE&index=7This aside, there's still Pollini, Ashkenazy, Blechacz, and Rubinstein to try for the Polonaises.
>>128244961>Since it’s all just opinion anyway By that logic, Justin Bieber can be better than Beethoven. Which we all know is false. It's not "all just opinion" and it's not subjective. It's more or less objective.>popularity may indeed be seen as an indicator of superiorityAgain, this is a logical fallacy. Superiority in what? Fame? Sure. Musical quality? Fuck off.
>>128244994There is no ideal recording listen to all of them
>>128244994o, add Adam Harasiewicz to the list of recordings to try>>128245004Ideal for me, but don't worry, I will
>>128244998>Which we all know is falseNow that really is a fallacy
>>128245019"We all" implies this general. No one here believes it's true.You are being disingenuous here.
>>128245033Who’s appealing to popularity now?
>>128245072You?
>>128237680This year I'm mainly interested in:Dvořák Symphony No. 7 and Violin Concerto Dvořák Symphony No. 8 and Cello ConcertoDvořák Symphony No. 9Tchaikovsky Piano Concerto No. 1Tchaikovsky ManfredBruckner Symphony No. 4 Mahler Symphony No. 3Stravinsky's Apollon MusagèteBartok Piano Concerto No. 3 with Vienna Philharmonic and Lang Lang Brahms Symphony No. 4 with Herbert Blomstedt - if he's still alive. Fingers crossed.Lucas and Arthur Jussen premiering new piece by Andrew Norman for two pianos and orchestraBach’s complete suites for solo cello with Yo-Yo MaItzhak Perlman - no program announced but whatever, he's not going to disappoint
Perahia's Bachhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8upU7Jhgmew&list=OLAK5uy_mnGrgylJHzxddvpdh94Hxc4qpd-DiZq6U&index=17
>>128245083Nice selection, I'm jealous.
Chopinhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ccNZFWvez4&list=OLAK5uy_kCHvt9d2tCW5hdlcdbFujwj4i3hMTBvQw&index=36
>symphoniesHaydn>concertosMozart>string quartetsHaydn>operaMozart>piano triosHaydn>sacred musicMozart>piano sonatasHaydn>wind ensemblesMozartIt's frankly impossible to not love both composers with a passion
>>128245205Which makes the fact I don't love either perfectly sensible. I do enjoy Mozart on occasion, however.
Mozarthttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOeZjtNoAWI
>>128245205I don't love either. Only Mozart's late piano concertos, quintets -- not enough for me to "love" Mozart as a composer, his style is not for me. And I kinda like some of his symphonies and sonata, and Haydn's symphonies. Couldn't care less about the rest of their works.
>>128245076No. It was you,
>>128245645>no uI was merely pointing out that you are being disingenuous, lying both to me and yourself. I did not use popularity as an argument to justify something, cretin.
>>128245696>Anon thinks philsophy is lying to oneself
>>128245737>anon misses the point yet again
>>128245461Further proof mozart is underratedhttps://youtu.be/1cZIuHeNUj4
A lot of people think they like philosophy but become quickly enraged when they discover you have to actually prove your ideas and you can't just say "Well we know all this is true anyway so are we arguing about it?". 4channers like to think of themself as intellectualy superior to what they call 'the normies' but it turns out generally they are no more immune to this than the normal person and quickly become upset.
>>128245781 Here, you are unsucessfully trying to justifty appeal to popularity fallacy >>128244961 I'm pointing out that even you don't believe your own lies, being insincere >>128244998 and the original post is still a fallacy, your smartass did not refute it.Here you try to spin that off as appeal to popularity (lol) >>128245019 - demonstrating (again) that you have no understanding of ad populum, or how logical fallacies function.
They quickly resort to insults and attempt to make themselves smarter. A lot of them see fallacies as default 'I win' stickers they can slap on their posts without really engaging with the ideas behind the fallacies. It is actually someone ironically a version of appeal to authority. Of course the true pursuit of philosophy is not about 'winning' but arriving at the truth
>the coward does not even respond directlyLogiclets really are something else.
AI Prompt: compose a 24 Preludes and Fugues piano cycle in the style of Liszt then another in the stytle of Chopin, then create a performance of each by Sviatoslav Richter
get comfy and listen to Liszt's Hungarian Rhapsodieshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TvxudWIeOs&list=OLAK5uy_kMlzvVSChLKj1Qu-U9Gbd6UhoXnNPmOVg&index=1
>>128245870Do it yourself you lazy goon
>>128243915This pianist Michel Beroff has a really nice discography. Seems worthwhile to listen to most of it.
>>128245896The made for tv version of The Matrix
>>128245969hehethe Liszt-pill and you ascend to the truth of reality or the Chopin-pill and you wake up in your bed next to a 2D waifu
A jazz thread died for this gay shit
>>128245205>>piano sonatas>Haydn
>>128245997I had a brief but intense love affair with the music of Thelonious Monk (and some other Jazz musicians) for a couple months after I got back on heroin as rebound off a really bad breakup. Good times. I really don't remember much of it but I'm sure if I started playing Monk's Live at the It Club or Monk's Dream it'd all come flooding back.anyway...
>>128246048>listening to Monk on heroinhighly authentic experience, hope you're ok now anon
>>128246048I listened to "Spiritual..." by the man they call Coltrane and it reminded me of a dream I had: I floated on the River Nile, smokin' some fresh weed, relaxin'. But I ain't ever going to see the Nile anyhow
>>128246018Not a controversial opinion. Haydn's piano sonatas are much more eclectic and forward-looking than Mozart's, although I prefer the latter overall as a composer.
>>128245997Good, jazz is shite
>>128246270Jazz is the butterfly that grew out of Classical's Chrysalis
>>128246300Jazz is post african nonsense
>>128246374post African is Stockhausen's word salad nonsense
>>128246408Stockhausen did nothing wrong
>>128246018you might actually want to listen to them before commenting.
Which Piano sonata by Haydn is the best?
>>128246559The one Lestat playshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBDkQc3qS94
>>128246559some gorgeous slow movementshttps://youtu.be/6lP22-LNvKs?si=DEQ0nlbo_3G8vbGyhttps://youtu.be/j91R-7cqKTc?si=EQ5XIitlo6DpWWXt
>>128246647 (me)This is from no.59 slow mov btw
>>128246559peep this recordinghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ruKPCmWNEI&list=OLAK5uy_nj0T-WQ-3VWEuSVgtiTCd2x-TVqnw0Cys&index=1
>>128243800>atonality and 12-tone music are a conspiracy of "dA jOoz" to destroy western art or something.It is. Hauer doesn't disprove it. CIA funded modernism.
>Hauer "detested all art that expressed ideas, programmes or feelings,"Daily reminder that not all music can express feelings, let alone emotions. And some do it better than othes.
Daily reminder that all music expresses feelings and emotions. And they all do it equally as well as each other. Listen to all of them for the best
no one:absolutely nobody:still nobody:not a single soul:literally no one:not even Mozart (still alive):not even yuja wang:random incel on 4chan: WAGNER IS LE BEST COMPOSER EVAR!!! W.[everyone disliked that]barenboim: wait that's illegalglenn gould: ok that was lowkey on pointscriabincel: slaps roof of car luke did i ever tell you about the time i wrote a piece to bring about the end of the world? it was an epic moment.luke: is retardedCIA: Bane?Wagner's ghost: hey don't google HP Lovecraft's cat name[OP googles hp lovecrafts cat name]CIA: congratulations you got yourself caught!Chopincel: flies past in a spaceship ooooh i dont care what universe you're from that's GOTTA HURT[everyone laughed]Dave Hurwitz: you're breathtaking!area 51 guards:i bet i can take HurwitzDave Hurwitz: you sure about thatDave Hurwitz: anally rapes and spitroasts all area 51 guards with his black boyfriendarea 51:wait thats illegalEveryone liked thatCIA: am I joke to you?Mahoposter: I am a gay pedophile who likes little girls[everyone disliked that]kraut: I'm gonna post notationsAlt right incels: there's no way classical can be good agai....Alma Deutscher: hold my beerBig chungus joined the chatDrumpf has left the chat/classical/lets: 'Yeah, I'm thinking this is kind of epic based pilled, maybe a bit of a coom moment?? Idk think I might post a link.
>>128247315fuck off to reddit
Any dolcimer divas in tonight?
16 Great Works Their Composers Never Heard PerformedBach: B-Minor MassMozart: RequiemHaydn: Orfeo ed EuridiceBeethoven: Missa SolemnisBerlioz: Les TroyensBruckner: Symphonies Nos. 5 and 9Rimsky-Korsakov: The Golden CockerelMahler: Das Lied von der Erde; Symphony No. 9Ives: Symphony No. 4Janáček: From the House of the DeadPuccini: TurandotBerg: LuluSchoenberg: Moses und AronBartók: Piano Concerto No. 3https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUs_GYkUbAM
>>128246408it makes sensehe's referring to the repetitive 'groove' most modern music has which came from the influence of african beats (hell, even now the younger generation calls it "a beat")
>>128245205all of those are Mozart actually
I can't take Mozart seriously. I don't think most people can.
>>128247760projection
>>128247766Mozart is for kids and groomers.
>>128247804now picturing you as Matt Walsh
>>128247825I look like A. Sultanov
Bachhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2U3m69Vluqo
>>128247722I don't believe that's true though, I don't believe Aphex Twin has any real connection derived from African percussive music. Comments like that just show how out of touch and borderline schizo folks like Stockhausen were. It's no wonder classical is dead
>>128248032Wow you're fucking retarded dude. ANYTHING with modern drums, acoustic or synthesized is post african repetitions
>>128247760you just have a bit of an edgelord in you
>>128248086Prove it, don't just call me 'retarded' and declare victory
Berlioz's Symphonie fantastique, Mahler's second symphony and the Nightmare Before Christmas quote from which Gregorian Chant?A question in University Challenge just now
>>128248630dies iraevery easy question to be honest the dies irae is quoted in a lot more works than just those
>>128248719Are there even any other gregorian chants that get quoted, ever?
what the fuck did I just read
>>128248719Maybe. I'm still haunted by the memory of last year/January of this year of hearing a piece of music on UC and confidentally identifying it as Tchaicovskys 1812 Overture only for it to turn out to be the The Gates Of Kiev From Pictures at an Exhibition by Mussorgsky-which I had heard recently
It's a longshot, but does anyone here know is there a recorded version of Mozart's Magic Flute production by Komische Oper Berlin and 1927?This expressionist design looks gigabased. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNz65kYmiW8
>>128248732uh the original requiem aeternam gets somewhat quotes in later requiem settings I think
