Niemann Editionhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=adMg7dmTUUk [Embed]This thread is for the discussion of music in the Western (European) classical tradition, as well as classical instrument-playing.>How do I get into classical?This link has resources including audio courses, textbooks and selections of recordings to help you start to understand and appreciate classical music:https://rentry.org/classicalgenPreviously, on /classical/: >>128804350
HOW LOUD SHOULD IT BE??>100WagnerBerg>90-99BartokXenakisStravinskyBeethoven>80-89MozartShostakovichSchoenbergVivaldiVerdiMontiverdi>60-79ScelsiFerneyhoughWebernSchubertGesualdoSchumannMahlerBrucknerHaydn>40-59JSBachSchnittkeBrahmsSaint SaensDebussy>20-39RavelChopinBoulez>1-5FeldmanSatie>0CageNancarrowGriseyRileyPartLisztTchaikovsky
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sEf08rtl8oHoly shit. Greatest recording of Barcarolle op.60? Moiseiwitsch is on another fucking level. His rubato is just perfection. I am overwhelmed. If this isn't the single best thing ever put on the internet then I don't know what is
THE BEST KEYBOARD COMPOSERS OF ALL TIME>ELDER GOD TIERJ.S. Bach>GOD TIERCouperin>GREAT TIERScarlattiRameau>GOOD TIERPoulencScriabinSorabjiBrahmsSchubert>PASSABLE TIERByrdMozartHaydnFauré>MEH TIERBeethovenClementi>BAD TIERChopinRachmaninoffDebussySatie>SHIT TIEReveryone else
>>128827666Never really understood why people on the internet place Evangelion characters in random pictures. The show is psychologically strenuous and spiritually seething. It swallows the attention of the viewer. Now now gentlemen, let us stop this stupidity.
The eternal, uncontested, unequivocal big 4 of /music/. You either "get it" or you don't, but this is where humanity reached its peak intellectually and thus artistically. Empirically irrefutable!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hvaOvDOhsMhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbI71_XXbl0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEDxZdDgSDEhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHmQGsbqNds
>>128827722cry about it. this is an anime website.
>>128827736stop posting romantislop
This world is so boring. So devoid of entertainment. Everything is ridiculous now. These last five years were devoid of culture. People are running out of ideas, out of source material, out of creativity, out of any kind of depth. The rising AI bubble will only serve to make things worse. The void which was filled by classical music is opening up again.
>>128827767>filtered by high IQ musicJoin your kind over at >>>/mu/, popslopperhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxu9Tx_c25M>>128827779We're returning to the dark ages. But luckily, we can still hear something from the golden age, we still have recordings of Hofmann and Rachmaninoff, makes life worth living
Classical music of the Classical music:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lH6H4ksPnc
>>128827736Scriabin is great but the rest are all söy numale-core.
>>128827856thank you popslopper, maybe try >>>/mu/ instead?
>>128827807>he thinks rachmanshitoff isn't the pop of classical musicLMAO
>>128827916thank you clueless popslopper
>>128827937my position is 100% objectively correct. rachmanshitoff's music is neoromanticist populist garbage manufactured for plebeians, the definition of l'art pompier in music.
>>128827967thank you low IQ popslopper mongrel
Rachmaninoff performed by Rachmaninoff is the Classical music of the Classical musichttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5vFFr6-IWM&list=OLAK5uy_mJanaqu4ViJZdhktHnmfDFtx96Zjnrs0I&index=1
Classical music of the Classical musichttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFKx8n2sfCM
>>128826805tru
Rate Zappa's musical taste:>In fact Zappa has always been dismissive of the aesthetic of most mainstream classical music, finding it too predictable. "lf you know where the melody is going to go, how long it takes to get there and what it's going to do when it gets there, then why bother to listen to it," he says. He makes an exception of Bach, but only if it's played by Glenn Gould, because he "twists the stuff so that at least there's a question mark inserted into the composition". Gould's "mutation" renders it tolerable for Zappa to listen to. His real love is for the unpredictable, dissonant European music of our own century, as composed by Igor Stravinsky, Anton Webern and above all-Edgard Varese. Varese's lonisation, which the young Zappa discovered when he was a boy in the mid-fifties, is a difficult. Rhythmically asymmetric work, and has remained a source of inspiration ever since.>JON WINOKUR - When you say "that kind of music," do you include Mozart?>FRANK ZAPPA - I don't usually listen to Mozart. I like Stravinsky, Varese, Webern, Schoenberg, Bartok, Takemitsu, Messien, Penderecki...>JON WINOKUR - How about John Cage?>FRANK ZAPPA - I have many John Cage recordings, but I find his writing more interesting than his music.>JON WINOKUR - Do you like rap?>FRANK ZAPPA - If it wasn't for rap there would be no poetry in America. I think we went directly from Walt Whitman to Ice-T.
>>128828057It's safe to say his IQ was double digit judging from this interview alone. Low functioning brains like rap and talk crap.
>>128828057RYMsister/10but good
>>128828001It's time to start living in the 21st century, hisssisterhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdDnIy0mHsI&list=OLAK5uy_nyjNOfRJtfWP9VwwLLgz-zIllB-pd_M3E&index=1
>>128827671I disagree but I see the logic. Except for Poulenc, that's a weird one.
Is Penderecki good?
>>128828057>i listen to Stravinsky, Varese, Webern, Schoenberg, Bartok, Takemitsu, Messien, Penderecki... the list goes on.....>proceeds to make garbagehmmm
>>128828123Through the lens of rock, the influence and similarity is quite clear I think. Of course Zappa added in other influences and ideas.
Tippett's piano sonatas finally clickedhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZUgktAAbks
>comments on classical/romantic piano music:>"it's so beautiful" "sublime" "hearttwarming" "this is life">comments on modernist and later piano music:>"it's like [idea/non-musical metaphor]"hmm
>comments on modernist and later piano music:>"this is horror movie music lol"quite telling on the quality of such "music"
>>128828200
>>128828274people are so fucking gay
Ockeghem was claimed by Webern, along with his younger Flemish contemporary Obrecht, as a source of profound inspiration. It is a basic concision which they share, but of course Ockeghem's finely spun melodies are far out of proportion to Webern's, and this is certainly the aspect of his music which appeals most directly to the modern listener.
>>128828353The melodies seem to go on forever, never losing their sense of invention or identity, and so it is this fundamental melodic integrity which can be seen as the driving force behind Ockeghem's contrapuntal prowess. This is one way in which he differs from other great contrapuntists in Western history, as Ockeghem never lets technique obscure his material, and such brilliant material it is! By adopting different phrasings in difference voices, and employing deceptive or partial cadences, Ockeghem allows his melodies to continue unimpeded by the structural design of the music. In that sense, they contribute to the architecture while at the same time being buoyed by it.
>>128828376It is only too clear that Ockeghem had mastered the idea of "never-ending melody" long before it became a rallying cry. Of course it is precisely the ambivalent cadences and essential lack of climaxes which make Ockeghem's masses so difficult to wrap one's mind around, and then it is the continuously spun legato line which makes them physically daunting. The latter is, however, more benefit than fault, as they do not require any superhuman breathing, but rather subtle and perilously gained insights into the nuances of phrasing. For anyone obsessed with the finest details of phrasing, Ockeghem's music provides a reservoir of seemingly infinite depth. Wrestle with it for a while, and anything else seems either nonsense or child's play.
>>128828097 That is just "classical music". When discusing " Classical music of the classical music", only the finest can apply. Rachmaninoff's and Medtner's pianism is as intricate relative to average pianism as classical music is to pop music. Ergo this is the classical of classical, the highest, most refined and sophisticated music available on earth, if you can't into classical of classical, might as well just listen to pop >>>/mu/https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61MiiIVTXQo
>i NEED to listen to music that sounds like coming from a shit tubewhy are classitrannies like this
>>128828494>t.filtered by real clsssical musicMight as well blast poop music >>>/mu/
What's your favorite piece and why, lads?
>>128828542like my man here >>128828512 , i dont care what it is really, as long as it comes from a real shit tube and sounds like total crap, thats all i need
>>128827636Best recording of Eugène Ysaÿe - Sonata No. 3?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oc-j4ftH2X4
>The English pianist Ian Pace describes Sorabji's music as that of "a massive ego thoroughly unaware of its crushing banality.";[191] The music critic Andrew Clements calls Sorabji "just another 20th-century English eccentric ... whose talent never matched [his] musical ambition."[192] The music journalist Max Harrison, in his review of Rapoport's book Sorabji: A Critical Celebration, heavily criticised Sorabji's compositions, piano playing, music criticism and personal conduct and implied that "nobody cared except a few close friends." I'm not really familiar with these authorities, and it doesn't prove anything, but those are assessment are consistent with what I have heard of his music.
>>128828722>pianist monkeys>allowed to voice their "opinions"why was this allowed
>>128828542Hard to pick just one, but if I had to, Chopin's 4th ballade would be my choice. It is the most perfect piece of art from the very first note to the last F minor chord. There is not a single dull, out of place measure yet it's as emotionally and expressivelly diverse as it can possibly be, and that's something so rare and exceptional that it can only exist in single movement works such as the ballade.
>>128828542Parsifal. It's what the poster above me is saying about Chopin's Ballade but genuinely true. So large, so perfectly constructed, Wagner at his most musically advanced and diverse, and not a second of music that isn't beautiful and perfect with the whole.
>128829136>poster above me is saying about Chopin's Ballade but genuinely true.Except it is genuinely true of the Ballade, yet not even true of the Parsifal overture
Sibelius' claim to revolution comes not from making the tonal center unstable (which he did, both polytonally and modally, notably in the Fourth, Sixth, and Seventh symphonies), but in his total obliteration of form. Schoenberg latched himself to form and motif as the structure of his works; Bartok did so by creating tonal centers of gravity that didn't rely on standard tonality, and the folk rhythms of Hungary and the Balkans. Szymanowski drifted to folk rhythms of Poland, Stravinsky to just about everything under the sun, but early on he drifted to repetition characteristic of Russian folk music. Ravel loved his dances; Debussy made great use of the major triad, even if it wasn't used to indicate a precise tonal center. Every work must have a precedent, something for the ears to hear and understand as the basis. The basis for Sibelius was the tonal center and the general sound of a piece. The Fifth Symphony seems to concatenate entire sections into one and in one instance it overlays two separate tempos up against one another. The Sixth is semi-structured in typical form of a symphony, but the forms of those movements is subject to severe speculation. The Seventh turns the entire structure of a symphony on its head.It's easy to deny the modernism of Sibelius because it is not obvious. But study reveals the work of an unrelenting modernist that was hiding just beneath the facade of late Romanticism. Sibelius is also a master of rhythm and form, as well of modality. He's a great "quiet" innovator. Perhaps one reason Sibelius has attracted both the praise and the ire of critics is that in each of his seven symphonies he approached the basic problems of form, tonality, and architecture in unique, individual ways. On the one hand, his symphonic (and tonal) creativity was novel, while others thought that music should be taking a different route.
>>128829381There are things in Sibelius's symphonies that music had never done before, new kinds of sounds at the outer limits of orchestral possibility. At one pole of his imagination are the evocations of epic landscapes, as in the unforgettable big tunes at the end of the Second or Fifth. At the other, there's the microscopic detail of his orchestration, the subtlety and shimmer of his string-writing-- as if Sibelius had taken the lens of his musical imagination and zoomed in on individual pine needles in the vast forests of his Finnish homeland.The quarter-century journey from the hyper-romantic four movements of the First, written on the cusp of the 20th century, to the convention-smashing single-movement of the Seventh, is one of the most astonishing stories in the history of music. Sibelius started his symphonic life in the throes of a love affair with the Russian and German Romantics, like Tchaikovsky and Bruckner, and ended it by opening up a new way of thinking about musical space and time. His symphonies didn't just brilliantly capture the ghostliness of the Finnish landscape-- they were also way ahead of their time.Sibelius's later symphonies plunge into a darker, interior world, above all with the agonised dissonances of the Fourth. While it's true the Fifth ends with another big tune, a majestic horn melody that Sibelius conjured after seeing a flock of swans in flight, the piece also contains some of the strangest textures in the orchestral repertoire: shimmers, tremors, and shades. The avant-garde experiments of György Ligeti and Iannis Xenakis are simply extensions of what Sibelius was up to in the likes of the Fifth. Sibelius was such a brilliant creator, we are still trying to find out what he really did.
>>128829389Sibelius progressively stripped away formal markers of sonata form in his work and, instead of contrasting multiple themes, focused on the idea of continuously evolving cells and fragments culminating in a grand statement. His later works are remarkable for their sense of unbroken development, progressing by means of thematic permutations and derivations. The completeness and organic feel of this synthesis has prompted some to suggest that Sibelius began his works with a finished statement and worked backwards, although analyses showing these predominantly three- and four-note cells and melodic fragments as they are developed and expanded into the larger "themes" effectively prove the opposite.Symphony No. 7 in C major was his last published symphony. Completed in 1924, it is notable for having only one movement. It has been described as "completely original in form, subtle in its handling of tempi, individual in its treatment of key and wholly organic in growth". Tapiola, Sibelius's last major orchestral work, was premiered on 26 December 1926. It is inspired by Tapio, a forest spirit from the Kalevala. To quote the American critic Alex Ross, it "turned out to be Sibelius's most severe and concentrated musical statement." Even more emphatically, the composer and biographer Cecil Gray asserts: "Even if Sibelius had written nothing else, this one work would entitle him to a place among the greatest masters of all time.
The Apex of Art.The Brightest of Baritones.The Caster of Comfort.The Dionysus of Delusions.The Elater of Ecstasy.The Forth-Bringer of Fantastic-Fantasies.The Grandest of Giants.The Height of Heroism.The Inventor of Ideas.The Juggler of Jubilation.The Knight of Knowledge.The Love of Listeners.The Master of Music.The Nirvana of Nobles.The Oasis of Optimists.The Poisoner of Peons.The Quester of Quixotic.The Rattler of Romance.The Symbol of Serenity.The Tactful of Tranquility.The Up-lifter of Unbeaten.The Visionary of Vibrance.The W.The X-Factor of Xenophiles.The Yay of Youths.The Zing of Zion.Wagner.
In Meistersinger's harmonies, one hears the echoes of Bach's intricate counterpoint, as if the ghostly specter of the Baroque master had momentarily forsaken the organ in favor of the opera house.Richard Wagner once said of Johann Sebastian Bach’s music: “That made me what I am. My unending melody is predestined in it.” In Die Meistersinger von Nürnberg, Wagner demonstrated to post-Tristan sceptics his mastery of traditional musical forms. Sonorous chorales, an overture which Wagner described as 'applied Bach', a fugally-inspired toccata, an unforgettable quintet and counterpoint worthy of Bach all feature in this magnificent score celebrating the marriage of inspiration and tradition.The whole of Die Meistersinger— shaping itself before our very ears — is Wagner's answer to his critics, a song offered them to meet their specifications, filled with all the things they demanded and found wanting in his other work: diatonic structures, counterpoint, singable tunes, ensembles, folk dances worthy of Weber and chorales worthy of Bach.
>In Paris in 1858, Wagner listened to Berlioz reading the libretto of Les Troyens with a mounting anxiety, so that "I really found myself wishing that I might never see him again since, in the end, to be so utterly unable to help a friend can only become unbearably painful. The text is clearly the pinnacle of his misfortune, which nothing now can surpass.">Six years earlier, in a letter to Liszt (Wagner considered Berlioz, Liszt and himself the three most important composers of the day), he had written: "If ever a musician needed a poet, it is Berlioz, and it is his misfortune that he always adapts his poet to his own musical whim, arranging now Shakespeare, now Goethe, to suit his own purpose. He needs a poet to fill him through and through, a poet who is driven by ecstasy to violate him, and who is to him what man is to woman." But the poet Wagner had in mind for this job of violating Berlioz was Wagner himself. He thought that Berlioz ought to set the story of Wieland the Smith, a German legend of which he, Wagner, had written the prose outline.
Bach created the Cosmic Egg of music in the void, a noble blueprint for his successors;Beethoven made music flesh by bringing nature into accordance with human expression and by his art molded a Holy Grail around the Egg, awaiting insemination;Wagner with his seed of Poetry erected the Divine Cock of Music to join with its body in sacramental union with the Grail before the awed masses and complete the project of true art for all time;W.
>>128829423what about Mozart
Classical music. The highest expressive possibility of the musical medium. Since man first came to be, his progress up the ladder to the celestial spheres of musical accomplishment has been slow and halting. Here a man with a talent for fugues, here another with a talent for the instrumental drama of the sonata allegro form. The light of a single genius should be lost to the abyss of time. But then—a man appeared who would unite vision, craft, and form in the heretofore disparate domains of music and poetry, a man whose sublime expression of a drama both theatrical and musical would etch itself into the firmament, proclaiming music's everlasting completion. This man was Richard Wagner. Here, as yet more initiates are absorbed by his unceasing light, the history of that pilgrimage continues...W.
>>128829505Mozart Erected the Form of Music so that Wagner could provide the Orgasm.
>>128828057It's crazy how so many people from the midcentury talk like pod people. Oh, you have peculiar taste, do you? You don't like music the classical and Romantic eras? It's as though music between 1750 and 1900 doesn't exist to you? Wow, that is very unusual. You do like Bach but only in very very objective austere manner you understand, yes, yes, of course. And then Webern, Varese, Stravinsky? Marvellous! I have never met such a person.
>>128829507He was severely deficient in all of them.
>>128829583Wagner raped your mind.
>>128829179Chopin is children's music compared with Wagner. Get some taste.
>>128828274not only am I unable to recognize how good the music is, it'll stunt my ability to know if I'm alive or dead!? no thank you!
>How can this schema of “’The Ring’ as the drama of Wotan’s ‘kenotic’ salvation of Alberich” be filled out and made more substantial?>How do we go beyond this mere clue of the double nomenclature “Lichtalberich / Schwarzalberich”?>Well, I think that this schema begins to be filled out right from the opening scene of the opening opera. Alberich does indeed present himself in this scene not under the aspect of a villain but under the aspect of a wretch. Yhis figure of the “wretch” plays a key role in the drama of “kenotic salvation” as I have presented it.>Perhaps the portrait of “the wretch” in the canon of Western culture is Isaiah 53: "For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him.">I have repeatedly said that this marks the point in the history of soteriological thought at which such static, rather than merely pragmatic, aspects of the “man needy of salvation” as physical ugliness enter into the salvific equation. It is by no means just by chance that Isaiah 53 is the only Old Testament passage cited – and indeed one of the most substantial scriptural citations generally – in what I have presented as the really definitive synoptic statement of the Judaeo-Christian salvific problematic: Borges’s “Three Versions of Judas”.>Now Alberich, in the opening scene of “Das Rheingold”, very definitely presents himself under this aspect – as the ugly man rather than as the evil / sinful man, as the wretch rather than the villain. If this scene moves me and speaks to me, it does so as a staging of “the incel experience”: the experience of an irremediably ugly man—a man so genetically ugly that no “maxxing” is going to change his destiny—wooing “Stacies” reserved for “Chad” alone.
>>128829642thank you popslopper
I only listen to recordings by performers who are currently alive
>>128829660>This certainly, still speaking very personally, is what seals my experience of “The Ring” as a whole as a drama of kenotic salvation. For me, very much in the continuity of the Isaiah passage, it is the ugly, hopelessly needy “incel” that is the real “ideal type” of “the one who is to be saved” that corresponds to “the one who saves”. This incel is the modern type of the Bethesda paralytic.>A passage from Kafka’s diaries sums it up: "I don’t believe people exist whose inner plight resembles mine; still, it is possible for me to imagine such people. But that the secret raven forever flaps about their heads as it does about mine, even to imagine that is impossible." The incel condition drives into this terrible solitude. There is a shamefulness in being unable to satisfy one’s basic sexual needs that there is not, for example, in being unable to satisfy one’s basic nutritive needs. One may die, indeed, in the latter case and not in the former. But there is a dignity in dying of starvation that there is not in lingering on as a “sexual famelic”. In the latter there is a special wretchedness that links up to the great figures envisaged in the soteriological tradition.>It might be retorted, of course, that the opening scene of “Das Rheingold” is precisely a portrayal of the transformation of the wretch into the villain—or, in other words, the “wretch”, the “incel”. is dispatched and dispensed with in this opening scene after all. Does not, indeed, Alberich renounce his identity as “the ugly man vainly seeking the attention of beauty”? This is the meaning of the famous Entsagungsmotiv which here becomes one of the first Motivs sounding in “The Ring”. Woglinde sings it first:>Nur wer der Minne Macht entsagt,>nur wer der Liebe Lust verjagt,>nur der erzielt sich den Zauber,>zum Reif zu zwingen das Gold
>>128829677so stupid
>>128829688>And Alberich sings it again a few lines later>Der Welt Erbe>gewänn’ ich zu eigen durch dich?>Erzwäng’ ich nicht Liebe,>doch listig erzwäng’ ich mir Lust?>Alberich substitutes then, for the “incel”’s pathetic hunger for sexual love, another hunger to whose satisfaction he does have a path: namely, the hunger for gold and the power that gold brings with it. Clearly, though, this formula whereby the figure of the wretch as incel is banished from the “Ring” problematic has its problems and its internal tensions. More, indeed, for the non-German-speaker than for the German speaker. The English speaker, in particular, will be struck and puzzled by the substitution evoked in the last two lines, which seems to be the replacement of a thing with something else close to identical with it: Liebe / Lust. “Love” and “lust” are, in English, very closely affined. >But this problem seems to be solved and dissolved by the fact that in German the meaning of “Lust” is much broader. The German “Lust” covers the whole spectrum of human pleasures and enjoyments. The act of Alberich in the opening scene of “The Ring”, then, appears in this light as a very familiar one. Anyone who has been himself that particular “wretch” whose wretchedness consists in the radical inability to acquire the creaturely comfort of sexual intercourse will have had said to him many times:>“Things will work out for you if you just stop obsessing about women and concentrate on your career, on making money; when you are successful and rich the women will just fall naturally into your lap”.>There is, however, yet another twist. I would argue that much in “The Ring” suggests that the “Renunciation” evoked here through the “renunciation motif” is essentially a failed renunciation. The “swapping out” of one thing for another that it seems to thematize is in fact the thematization of a painful impossibility because there is no translatability of the two things:
>>128829675Calling someone a popslopper while holding the banner of YouTube's most listened to classical composer is a good bit.
now playing, more contemporary classicalstart of Daugherty: Metropolis Symphonyhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWKFH_D2jqM&list=OLAK5uy_m_gVdsPbDOTiVUMAPulZZlz8Il9h0kFQc&index=2Daugherty: Bizarrohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRbJ5CkGCbw&list=OLAK5uy_m_gVdsPbDOTiVUMAPulZZlz8Il9h0kFQc&index=6https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_m_gVdsPbDOTiVUMAPulZZlz8Il9h0kFQc>Michael Daugherty is one of a talented and eclectic group of American composers who have successfully worked in both rock and classical music styles. His compositions celebrate American popular culture--his latest opera, Jackie O, is based on the life of you know who. His largest and most ambitious work to date is this suite of pieces based on characters and events from the Superman comic strip. Rumor has it that the original title was supposed to be "Superman" Symphony, but DC Comics wouldn't give permission to use the name. In any case, the music is jazzy, snazzy, faster than a speeding bullet, more powerful than a locomotive, able to ... you get the picture. --David HurwitzGonna go through most of this guy's recorded discography.And as always, any and all recommendations for modern and contemporary composers are appreciated!
>>128829708>The sexual love of woman is indispensable and unsubstitutable – and any idea we have that we “have found a substitute for it” is a delusion. We have here to do with a prefiguration of Houellebecq’s idea, expounded in his first novel “Extension du Domaine de la Lutte”:>Décidément, me disais-je, dans nos sociétés, le sexe représente bel et bien un second système de différenciation tout à fait indépendant de l’argent ; et il se comporte comme un système de différenciation au moins aussi impitoyable.>In this light, the whole plot-point of Entsagung takes on a certain phantom, misdirective quality. Alberich does not carry out “the decisive act of renunciation” that he seems to carry out. He does not become a power-and-money-focused “villain” and thereby push the wretch and “incel” that he began as out of the drama of the “Ring” as soon as he had entered it. Rather, the wretch/incel lingers as central to “The Ring”.>We might read as a clue to this one of the most-remarked-on “problems” of “The Ring”. The “Renunciation motif” sounds out, as every critic recognizes, at the most dramatically anomalous moments. It sounds out, for example, at the moment of Siegmund’s seizing of Notung:>Heiligster Minne hoechste Not>Sehnender Liebe sehrende Not>What can this possibly mean? Sigmund is indeed proof of the persistence of the wretch deep on into “The Ring” and far beyond this opening scene. But long before the appearance of Siegmund in the second opera, this first work of the tetralogy already provides rich illustration of how the renunciation of love is a fundamentally flawed, “impossible” renunciation.
>>128829718thanks for your input popslopper
>>128829759Wagner raped your mind.
>>128829763thank you popslopper
>>128829759Oh, don't worry, I "get" it.
Did you know Saint-Saens has piano etudes? :Ohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=goY8Q_nfZWUhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDH5CYeFLZk
>>128829775excellet input popslopper
The Wagnersister is falseflagging to make Chopin look bad.
>>128829794excellent input popslopper
>>128829743try Alois Hába
The Chopincel is falseflagging to make Wagner look bad.
>>128829743>I began composing my Metropolis Symphony in 1988, inspired by the celebration in Cleveland of the fiftieth anniversary of Superman's first appearance in the comics. When I completed the score in 1993, I dedicated it to the conductor David Zinman, who had encouraged me to compose the work, and to the Baltimore Symphony Orchestra. The Metropolis Symphony evokes an American mythology that I discovered as an avid reader of comic books in the fifties and sixties.>Each movement of the symphony-which may be performed separately-is a musical response to the myth of Superman. I have used Superman as a compositional metaphor in order to create an independent musical world that appeals to the imagination. The symphony is a rigorously structured, non-programmatic work, expressing the energies, ambiguities, paradoxes, and wit of American popular culture. Like Charles Ives, whose music recalls small-town America early in our century, I draw on my eclectic musical background to reflect on late-twentieth-century urban America. Through complex orchestration, timbral exploration, and rhythmic polyphony, I combine the idioms of jazz, rock, and funk with symphonic and avant-garde composition. holy basedhttps://www.fabermusic.com/music/metropolis-symphony-2671
>>128829794No, the Chopinfag is falseflagging to make Wagner look bad.
>>128829810ty>12-tone composer:O
>>128829794no falseflagging needed, he looks bad on his own.
>>128829816>>128829833excellent input popsloppers
okay so, i'm not sure if anyone else will understand this but for me, the key to my transition was a weird combination of wagnerian harmony and nietzsche. let me explain.so first off, i've always been drawn to classical music, and wagner's operas in particular. there's something about the way the music builds and swells and crashes that just resonates with me on a deep level. i used to listen to the overture to "tristan und isolde" on repeat for hours at a time, and it always made me feel like i was on the brink of something monumental.and then, i started reading nietzsche. his ideas about the will to power, about overcoming oneself, about creating oneself - they all spoke to me in a way that i couldn't quite explain. it was like he was describing a way of being that i had always been striving towards, but could never quite put into words.and then, one day, it all just clicked for me. i realized that if i was going to transition, if i was going to become the person i had always known i was meant to be, i would need to harness that same will to power that nietzsche talked about. i would need to overcome my fears and doubts and insecurities, and create the version of myself that i wanted to be.it wasn't easy, of course. there were a lot of obstacles and setbacks along the way. but every time i felt like giving up, i would put on some wagner and let the music remind me of the power that i had within me. and every time i needed a philosophical boost, i would turn to nietzsche and let his words inspire me to keep going.and now, here i am, fully transitioned and living my best life. i still listen to wagner and read nietzsche, and they still give me that same sense of power and inspiration that they always have. i don't know if everyone will find the same kind of motivation in these things that i did, but for me, they were the keys to realizing the sufficiency of will necessary to self-overcome and transition.
have you noticed how the composers who had sex wrote much much better music that the composers who did not have sex?>mozarthad sex, wrote good music>wagnerhad sex, wrote good music>bachhad sex, wrote good music>strausshad sex,wrote good music>beethovendid not have sex, shit music>mahlerdid not have sex, shit music>schoenbergdid not have sex, shit music>sorabjidid not have sex, shit music>handeldid not have sex, shit music>chopindid not have sex, shit music
People call Die Meistersinger the Bach opera, and although I like the name, is it really fitting?The main reason it's called that is that, more than being set in Nuremberg and being a testament to German art history, it utilises traditional musical forms such as the counterpoint in the overture. But what else is really similar to Bach in it? Does anyone know? I can only think of the use of organ/church music in the very first scene.Meistersinger seems like the least studied opera of Wagner's because it's one of the least groundbreaking, and I think this is a negative.
For today's performance of Bach's Well-Tempered Clavier, we return to the young pianist Aaron Pilsan, whose Book 2 was released just this year.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgZqrQM-grw&list=OLAK5uy_kTFThToU2cJNfI8ogObQ8swsoYD8cYWAk&index=27>Aaron Pilsan completes his recording of the Well-Tempered Clavier, five years after the first volume was praised by critics for it's ardent, accurate and fluid interpretation. Twenty years lie between the two volumes; whilst the first is better known, 'the second book is more playful, but also more accomplished. It goes further harmonically and also demonstrates extraordinary harmonic invention with original and often exotic harmonies. The best example of what differentiates the two books is the fugue in D sharp minor in the second book, a piece whose boldness and harmonic originality never ceases to enthral and astonish me,' says the Austrian pianist, who again demonstrates his fascination for the composer: 'What I love most about Bach's music is that he expresses everything that goes to make up our lives, but in perfect order.'I just wanna say his recording of Book 1 is incredible, love at first listen, for his WTC already ranks among my favorites, and will be performances I return to for the rest of my life, joining the other masters of this work such as Richter, Hewitt, Poblocka, Crochet, and Koroliov. I highly recommend it to all fans of Bach, solo piano music, and classical in general. Check it out.
>>128829888Bach was a Romantic in spirit, and indeed they call Meistersinger the Bach opera because it’s applied Bach. Wagner was the greatest contrapuntist of the Romantic era and Meistersinger is the opera Bach wished he wrote. As Wagner said of Bach’s music, “That made me what I am. My unending melody is predestined in it.”
>Bruckner was an IncelUhmm bros? I dont know how to feel about this, I only listen to music composed by sexhavers like daddy Wagner
I wish I could go back in time and prevent opera from ever being invented, so the composers could instead use all of their musical ideas, artistic inspiration, and diligent effort on symphonies, orchestral music, or some other classical form entirely.
I wish I could go back in time and prevent Brahmscuckery from ever being invented, so the composers could instead use all of their musical ideas, artistic inspiration, and diligent effort on following in the footsteps of Richard Wagner, Master of Music and Poetry, to produce Music Dramas instead of working in dead instrumental forms.
Listening to Chopin, fuck this music touches me in the most horny way possible, I imagine myself listening to 24 preludes played by Nikolai Lugansky (the patrician choice) as I masturbate in a cemetery dressed all in black as my dead polish gf lies there on the grass. Chopin is based fuck people who hate Poland.
>>128829927Proof positive, everybody.When you listen to Chopin, you rape corpses.When you listen to Wagner, you rape heaven.W.
Wagner has to be the most rhythmically boring composer of all time, Brahms was eons ahead Wagner in rhythm but they will tell you that Brahms was the "conservative".
Lugansky's Chopinhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjqT_AkaXrM&list=OLAK5uy_nKk31e9Tsx0vKDeJxsOR_1RJkw1dMybyc&index=1
>>128829961The melodic concentration in Tristan is inseparable from the rhythmic vitality of the motives. Wagner is not often thought of as a rhythmic innovator or even as a particularly rhythmic composer. That is partly because our ideas of rhythm have been shaped by the external ostinato rhythms of popular music, so that we have to a certain extent lost sight of the origins of rhythm in a melodic line. Wagner is actually one of the great rhythmists. This is so in spite and because of the fact that he hardly ever uses percussion as a rhythm-generating device.Whereas Beethoven’s rhythmic motives have a pronounced downbeat emphasis (as in the first movements of the violin concerto, the third piano concerto, and the Fifth Symphony), in Tristan the emphasis is almost invariably off the beat or cancelled by a syncopation. Indeed, it is no exaggeration to say that Wagner’s treatment of rhythm in Tristan has the same subversive effect as his treatment of melody and harmony.
speaking of Lugansky and Wagner, check this out, where the two meet:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TApEdMQKjvY&list=OLAK5uy_ny5oGDLCx8mRknDqST4M7DWkFIF6fn_Sg&index=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nkI_PKdgTQ&list=OLAK5uy_ny5oGDLCx8mRknDqST4M7DWkFIF6fn_Sg&index=8>Wagner's genius is often associated with his unique feeling for orchestration. Yet the transcriptions and paraphrases for piano solo recorded here lay bare the beauty and boldness of his harmonic language, with an evocative power unrivalled at the time. Nikolai Lugansky, at once narrator and virtuoso, immerses us in a world where the heroes of legend tell us - and with what loftiness of spirit! - of the torments and aspirations of humanity.I'd be curious to know what both the Chopin and Wagnersisters alike think about it. Sounds great to me.
>I remember Boulez coming to a concert of Bruckner’s Eighth which I conducted in Paris, and he said oh, this music is so simplistic. And I said, but the slow movement should provide interest for you with rhythms which go two against three. Oh, he said, that was done much earlier and much better by Wagner in the second act of Tristan. And with that sentence, he finished off Bruckner.
>>128829992But Boulez himself later recorded the piece! Wonderfully too, I might add. He was just flexing his snobbish impulse here.
>>128829987Will listen tomorrow and reply. Thanks for the rec.
If one were asked to name one musician who came closest to composing without human flaw, I suppose general consensus would choose Richard Wagner.
>>128830009<3
Wherefore does the enchanted forest sing its secrets to me? It tells me now that I am the king of the once and future world. The lark trills, the eagle screams, and the giggling nymphs bathe in the supernaturally blue waters of the Oracular Pool. I step forward to receive their vision, and lo! Ancient dragons, fairy castles! The yodelling bard walks a weary road, calling out for knights of faith to hear his melancholy and redeem the tragic renunciate with a sword of justice! The whole world is lost and reconquered before my very eyes.Alas, it is over too soon! This is but a foretaste of what awaits the pilgrim soul when he surrenders to the genius of Richard Wagner.https://youtu.be/iXUjuxF2oIY
Rachmaninoffhttps://youtu.be/ycK1mZiZmo0
now playingstart of Beethoven: Piano Sonata No. 8 in C Minor, Op. 13 "Pathétique"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=akAYsnc2eFE&list=OLAK5uy_l0G4ysfxJaw5g1r-J3khIyjGjikSN1VTM&index=15start of Beethoven: Piano Sonata No. 5 in C Minor, Op. 10 No. 1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3C5tmeorTU&list=OLAK5uy_l0G4ysfxJaw5g1r-J3khIyjGjikSN1VTM&index=18start of Beethoven: Piano Sonata No. 6 in F Major, Op. 10 No. 2https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAzx5Y8jIxk&list=OLAK5uy_l0G4ysfxJaw5g1r-J3khIyjGjikSN1VTM&index=21start of Beethoven: Piano Sonata No. 7 in D Major, Op. 10 No. 3https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0EYIuJ_1sI&list=OLAK5uy_l0G4ysfxJaw5g1r-J3khIyjGjikSN1VTM&index=23https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_l0G4ysfxJaw5g1r-J3khIyjGjikSN1VTMOne of my all-time favorite cycles of the piano sonatas.
Come now to the fairy circle!Come now and dance with phantasy and phantoms!Come now to the bosom of the genius!Richard Wagner!He is the Venusberg and the release from the Venusberg.He is sex and he is renunciation.He is the Orgasm and the Chastity.There is no need for another.Find your vril.W.https://youtu.be/9GhGuEW4k5w
>>128830466Why do some Wagner fans on discord and here always look down on me for listening to Solti's recordings?There's nothing wrong with Solti
Baxhttps://youtu.be/nE9m_Brs040
Who's the better conductor plus had the better output, George Szell or Sir Georg Solti?
>>128830622Szell overall but Solti has some great recordings too. Great Tannhäuser, great Richard Strauss.
Wagner wrote more than anyone else, therefore he must have been the greatest.
>>128827736embarrassing
now playingstart of Schumann: Piano Trio No. 1 in D Minor, Op. 63https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D40-WUYLugE&list=OLAK5uy_kdcfHc1xX33sCPJy3vYdSWmI5b_8vXdug&index=2start of Schumann: Piano Trio No. 2 in F, Op. 80www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkWtYxQPxpw&list=OLAK5uy_kdcfHc1xX33sCPJy3vYdSWmI5b_8vXdug&index=5start of Schumann: Piano Trio No. 3 in G Minor, Op. 110https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCpTEKxp3Hg&list=OLAK5uy_kdcfHc1xX33sCPJy3vYdSWmI5b_8vXdug&index=9https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_kdcfHc1xX33sCPJy3vYdSWmI5b_8vXdugI love listening to these pieces whenever I'm planned to go out and about, they have a real sense of verve, inspiring you with exuberance. As opposed to, say, Brahms' or Rachmaninoff's piano trios, which are best at the end of the day, in my opinion.
>>128828001Rachmaninoff is seen as the 'Nickelback' of composers in the classical music world. Never admit you enjoy him if you don't want to be insulted and ripped apart. Even the rock crowd has a bit of humor towards the noob who likes Nickelback. The classical music world is a lot more ruthless.
Kicking the day off with Berg's Violin Concerto.
>>128830772This only supports Rachmaninoff's greatness to be honest, in that he was able to compose wonderful art music that is also easily enjoyable and emotionally transparent to all.
>>128830800are you implying that Nickelback composed works of genius
>>128830798>Tetzlaff/Ticciati performing Brahms+BergNeat, I'll give that one a try. Good shout.
>>128830806No because they failed at the first thing I said. They were, however, good at what they did, which was writing mindless, appealing pop.
>>128830820why would you interpret the analogy to mean otherwise then
If Rachmaninoff is good, then the standards of musical quality as richness of relationships, articulation, unity in manifoldness, diversity in oneness, which perennate from Wagner to Schoenberg, are obsolete.
>>128830843>Look mom I bought a dictionary!
>>128830839I'm saying Rachmaninoff was able to do the massively appealing and emotionally transparent thing Nickelback did while also composing fantastic art music, which is highly impressive and difficult. Those who look down on Rachmaninoff wrongly disdain the first two traits which causes them to be blind to the third.
>>128830859but it's implied in the analogy to a bad rock band that rach did not in fact compose fantastic music
>>128830856>not knowing what that's riffing on>>>/mu/
>>128830856All this is betrayed by Rachmaninoff to a nature which isn’t natural, but rather a shabby photography of his parents' home. He has his part in the wearing-out in art music, even though he is easily bested by industrial light music. But in his symphonies such destruction is masked as creation. Its effect is dangerous.
>>128830694>>128830772>>128830806>>128830839>>128830983thank you posloppers
Getting into aristocratic incest. What are some relevant "core texts" in the classical canon besides Die Walküre?
No one but Rachmaninoff understands the burden of my misery. I imagine he felt deep and noble feelings as he composed the last music of the Western tradition before it fell into degeneracy. The most perfect soul whom we did not deserve.
>In the arts, there are genuinely great reactionary authors and composers, for example Tolkien and Rachmaninoff. That’s probably what reactionary art looks like at its best. Rachmaninoff continued not just the style, but stubbornly stuck to reproducing the feel of the world he had loved around 1900-1910, and lost completely in 1917. If you want to hear and feel not just the court of the Tsar, but of the international European aristocracy of around that time, you can see it in Rachmaninoff. This appears most clearly in his second sonata, which is just very high class lounge music, or in the Etude-Tableau opus 39 number 5, a flight dream of fin de siecle glamorous decadence remembered and exalted to otherworldliness by a man in exile from it. It was real and vital in him even after 1917 because it was animated by a nostalgia for something he had known and loved, and remembered dearly as something lost. A similar nostalgia and sense of loss I am told is throughout Tolkien’s books. But even he engaged with modern styles and feels in his later music, and so did a reactionary author like Tolkien. And in any case, the European aristocracy around 1900 was already modern and changed by modernity, and this is reflected in his music from the beginning. It’s the reason his music is an appropriate setting to the decades later Old Hollywood and in fact to almost any half-glamorous scene in Western modern life up until around the time suits stopped being worn as universal style in polite society.
When the singing starts, the libretto continues from here:LANDGRAVEA fearful wrong has been committed.With dissembling mask, the accursedson of sin came crawling to us.We cast you out from among us: with usyou may not tarry; our hearth is stained with shamethrough you, and heaven itself looks threateninglyupon this roof, which has sheltered you too long already.However, a way to deliverance from eternal damnationstands open before you: rejecting you,I point it out to you. Make use of it for your salvation!Gathered together on my landsis a great concourse of pilgrim penitents.The older ones have gone on before already,the younger are still resting in the valley.Trifling though their transgressions be,their hearts will give them no rest;to still the devout distress of repentancethey are marching towards Rome for the feast of grace.LANDGRAVE. SINGERS. KNIGHTSYou must go along with them on pilgrimageto the city of clemency and grace,in the dust there to fall prostrateand atone for your sin!Before him who pronounces the sentenceof God, cast yourself down;but nevermore return,if you do not receive his blessing! Though our anger has been forced to soften,because an angel checked it,this sword will despatch you,if you linger in sin and disgrace!ELISABETHLet him journey to thee,Thou God of clemency and grace!Forgive him, who has fallen so low,the guilt of his sin!For him only will I pray,may my life be prayer;grant that he may see Thy light,before he is lost in night!In joyful trepidation,let a sacrifice be dedicated to Thee!Take, oh, take my life:I no longer call it mine!... And so on. Just a very beautiful moment.If you want to check it with the German, or read on, here's the libretto with English and German:http://www.murashev.com/opera/Tannh%C3%A4user_libretto_English_GermanWagner is so infinitely sublime.
>>128829743>And as always, any and all recommendations for modern and contemporary composers are appreciated!Dallapiccola, PetrassiTry those
>>128831228Tannhäuser is sometimes ignored or dismissed because of its relative immaturity compared to later works on similar themes, but I personally found it a great entry point for Wagner. The very stark and palpable contrast between the chaste pilgrim chorale and the erotic and ravishing Venusberg music is very generative and stimulating and makes for a clear expression of the ideas, musical and philosophical, that you'll find Wagner preoccupied with in later works.
>>128831218Based and correct.
I think this is going to be my last post here, this new captcha is too hard for me. I like Chopin
Do you guys believe in the idea of sexual transmutation and do you think great composers like Mozart and Beethoven or even writers like Nietzsche used it to create?I actually just learned there was a term for this but it's a concept I intuitively felt could exist though I never practiced it.Basically I think it's about tunneling your sexual frustration towards creative work rather than directly satisfying your urges (masturbating for example).Please do share your experiences if you've tried it.
>>128831358ive tried retaining goon and then i become feral, super aggressive, a pervert in the streets too. so i need to get off it and then i can be properly creative, its distracting if your retain too much the coom, besides undying erections can be a problem.
>>128831358It's a pretty old concept, although not necessarily applied exclusively to creative work. The whole semen retention thing has become associated with masculinity bro types, but they took it from antique sources. It was a Vedic practice. Probably something to it even if you don't buy into the mystical stuff.
Medtner Piano Concerto No. 3Demidenko, Tozer, or Sudbin?
>go to https://mensa.dk/iqtest/>take the test>post results>post top 10 composersgo!
Wagnerite sistergf who makes you cumtribute to the Liebestod.
Wagner is so boring. Although you can sense some musical talent, he dedicated the entirety of his career to being a second-rate Meyerbeer.
>>128831622What's your fav grand opera, Meyerbeersis? I like to listen to Rachel quand du seigneur when I'm cleaning my teeth of the pubes of the current whore whose lifestyle I'm financing.
>>128828120kind of
>>128830622Szell, obviously.
>>128828722>by the way, in terms of the comments on the other thread re Sorabji and his political views - I can imagine little music that more palpably expresses this ultra-right-wing outlook - also no music more founded on hyper-misogynistic principles; elimination of the 'feminine' was intrinsic to the compositional aesthetics of many composers at the time. This is why I take objection to it, though I'm increasingly aware of the extent to which many are drawn to this and other music precisely because of such factorsWhat's with this Pace guy's obsession with Sorabji. He talks about him the way some people talk about Wagner.
>Perhaps the most discussed and most controversial issue relating to Gould’s health and personality is the claim that he had Asperger syndrome (now included within autism spectrum disorder). This claim has been passionately accepted, tentatively considered, or flatly denied by people who knew Gould personally and by doctors and scholars who have studied his life.>His ingestion of drugs increased over the years, especially after 1980; between January and September 1982, he was prescribed more than two thousand pills, including benzodiazepines, which have a high risk of dependency when taken continuously for a long time. It is very likely that he became addicted to some drugs, especially diazepam.>In such situations, when feeling some kind of physical or psychological discomfort, he tended toward pharmacological solutions, especially abusing tranquilizers; Cornelia Foss, as she noted in interviews, observed him taking up to ten Valium tablets a day.
>>128830691Wagner's music had never been particularly relevant but somehow the mainstream media realized it only after his embrace of racist, antisemitic and white-supremacist language. The fact that so many classical critics thought that Wagner was a great composer only shows how far Gesamtkunstwerk was from becoming a major art.Hopefully, one not-too-distant day, there will be a clear demarcation between a great musician like Mendelssohn, who never sold much, and bloated messes like Wagner. At such a time, critics will study their history and understand which artists accomplished which musical feat, and which simply exploited it politically.
>>128828722can't really say they're wrong tbqhstill, at least he's not scriabin
>>128829743>>128829820lol fuck off retards
>>128831733>Recently, I was calling a tech guy because of a computer problem. After giving my name, he looked me up online and regaled me with lots of stuff about how he loved goth metal and also Sorabji, with rather pathetic talk about the dark, mysterious, other world, free from human concerns, it presented. I could imagine him being the type who likes occultist stuff to do with ritualistic dismemberment of women, as a rather sad way of releasing frustrations. You can find the same sort of outlook in various other musicians and artists that the ultra-right-wing clique of Sorabji fans gravitate towards (including most of those both pre- and post-revolutionary Russian figures - total hatred of women and of the wider masses was at the heart of their aesthetic project, and they made it explicit in their ideas and writings as well as it coming across loud and clear in their work. Same is true of a large number of British artists of the same period). This music provides solace for certain types of people who yearn for the return of an age where their type were granted automatic awe, deference, and mystical admiration, where women knew their place, and where a feudal system was absolute. If you read just a little of Sorabji's writings, you'll find these messages come through unequivocally. It's palpably clear to me how the music reflects this, and I felt that before I'd ever read the writings. But the displacement of human interests, feelings, wider society is endemic to a lot of writing about certain music, displaced in favour of fetishised technical and exoticist stuff. That speaks a lot about those who make a cult of certain guru like figures. I respect it about as much as I do those who stalk film stars, or who idolise celebrity. More to the point, the more I encounter such things, the more I'm convinced that feminist critics definitely do have a point in some respects.
>>128831733>also no music more founded on hyper-misogynistic principlesSeeing as Sorabji was gay that's not really that much of a stretch. Homosexuals deeply resent women, maybe even more than incels do.
>>128832104I think this and especially this >>128832084 exceeds reasonable suspicion of gay misogyny, and it's a little absurd in the first place to hear hatred of woman in abstract music. I doubt this guy would say the same about Tchaikovsky or Saint-Saens.
The triangle is the cowbell of the Western orchestra. Used sparingly and at moderate volume it can enhance the music, but most of the time it's just annoying.
Very cummy day in /classical/. Must be all the Wagner.
all these romantisloppers can pretend Bach Mozart Beethoven isn't the trinity as much as they want but it won't change reality
>>128832104anon every gay I have ever met in my LIFE has had vastly more female than male friends and almost exclusively hangs out witg girls, where the hell do you live?
>>128832289I'm the anon they responded to, and although I disagree, I do see his point since there is a certain gay type who hates or at least keeps profound distance from women. Mishima is obvious modern example. But I think Pace's extrapolations on a cult of world-hating woman-dismembering occultist Sorabjincels based on his emotional coolness towards Gulistan is a little outrageous and smacks of some of the excesses of that postwar generation. Ironically the occultists he lambasts probably agree with him; I'm reminded of Robert Graves in The White Goddess chastising the idealistic homosexuality of classical Greece and its modern imitators in favour of some imagined Celtic mother goddess. I've also never encountered a Thelemite who wasn't a feminist opposing Christian patriarchy etc.
>>128831065>In a letter written in the spring of 1882, Marx expresses himself in the strongest terms about the complete misrepresentation of primitive times in Wagner's text of the Nibelungen: “Have such things been heard, that brother embraced sister as a bride?” To Wagner and his “lecherous gods” who, quite in the modern manner, spice their love affairs with a little incest, Marx replies: “In primitive times the sister was the wife, and that was moral.”
>>128832352well yes but "a certain gay type" is worlds away from the generalization of all gays as being that way
>>128832283Word.
>>128832360Uhhh communism based actually?
Now look what you've done. All these women are now laughing at you because you evinced an interest in Academic Art and Salonslop instead of grownup things like Impressionism and Wagnernism. No one will take this general seriously in polite society anymore.
Scriabi's Diner
>>128827671Bach's keyboard music all sounds like exercises and not real music
Scriabi's Salon
>>128832623Grope about in the fryer of Being all you like, hylic
>>128827646There is actually a very loud classocal album. It's very good as well
>>128832658Thanks Dave
>>128832641>hylicThis nigger thinks we're living in a Zelda game
>>128832667I learned about this myself
>>128832693Hah! Uppity pup thinks he grasps the Atman who am the dark God?
>>128832658that CD has an excellent line up.
Liking Romantic composers such as Wagner, Tchaikovsky, Schubert, Rachmaninoff, and Berlioz is an indication that you are twice-born and possess an Aryan dharma. Active within you is the natural response of the noble being to the hemmed-in domesticity of the contemporary world, the lofty need to seek out an antinomian emergent instinct, the surging wave in the soul that crashes against the barriers of morality and convention. This is also why you love incest.Liking modernist composers like Boulez, Nono, Stravinsky, and Penderecki indicates that you are Anayran and probably have bad karma. The desire to eat excrement is quite common among those with bad karma. You feel comfortable following the rules and expectations of society and think yourself very wise for keeping up with "the times". You are perilously concerned with being perceived as a "midwit" and believe incest is evil and disgusting.
I love goth chicks.
>>128832950the Aryans were steppe niggers.
All these Andreyev interviews with contemporary composers are so comfy, I wish I was an intellectual contemporary composer like those guysInstead of having cool friends to talk about contemporary music i'm stuck here with a bunch of midwits who only listen to the same 10 romantic/classical composers
On this episode of the Jordan Peterson Podcast, Jordan was joined by Samuel Andreyev. Samuel Andreyev is a Canadian composer. He writes music for orchestras, soloists, chamber groups, singers, and other ensembles throughout Europe and the world. He also hosts the Samuel Andreyev Podcast, a professor at the Hochschule für Musik Freiburg. He is also known for his YouTube Channel, presenting an analysis of works that he believes are interesting and important.Dr. Jordan Peterson and Samuel Andreyev discussed skills needed to be successful as an artist, where to start if you want to compose music, the hierarchy in western music, the relationship of music and language, the importance of genres, tips on learning composition, how having a family is helpful to his career and more.https://youtu.be/rNcqLN42l8s
>>128833087buy an ad, faggot.
>>128833100refer to: >>128833101
>>128833100does peterstein cry? if not im not watching
>With the advent of the First World War, Debussy became ardently patriotic in his musical opinions. Writing to Stravinsky, he asked "How could we not have foreseen that these men were plotting the destruction of our art, just as they had planned the destruction of our country?"[144] In 1915 he complained that "since Rameau we have had no purely French tradition [...] We tolerated overblown orchestras, tortuous forms [...] we were about to give the seal of approval to even more suspect naturalizations when the sound of gunfire put a sudden stop to it all." Taruskin writes that some have seen this as a reference to the composers Gustav Mahler and Arnold Schoenberg, both born Jewish. In 1912 Debussy had remarked to his publisher of the opera Ariane et Barbe-bleue by the (also Jewish) composer Paul Dukas, "You're right, [it] is a masterpiece – but it's not a masterpiece of French music.">I remember Mahler's Second Symphony. It was so unbearable for me that I left the hall during the performance and wrote the next day: "Let's open our eyes (and close our ears) ... French taste will never admit these pneumatic giants to any other honor than to serve as a publicity stunt for Bibendum."
>>128833126no but he does take a drug overdose while telling people how they should live. truly a man of integrity and self-awareness.
>>128831252tyty
>>128832070:( you didn't like it?
>>128833186I liked it.
Mahler is the epitome of "epic" in music.
>A friend recalled that in August 1914, shortly after the outbreak of the First World War, he vented his spleen on Germany and German music:>‘Ouf,’ he said with disgust, ‘those people drink whether they are thirsty or not! Everything with them is ‘en gros’. A theme must be long, regardless of its contents or value; the longer the better. Then another interminable episode and then another endless theme. Then, after sixteen quarts of beer, they begin a development so long, so long, that there is scarcely room in this house to hold it. Take, for instance, the symphonies of Mahler (which he, of course, pronounced Mal-air), with its thousand voices and whips, submarines and whatnot... Or Monsieur Strauss, who is clever in that he knows how to write nothingness itself... Well, my friend, with it all, their noise does not sound any louder than the finale to Beethoven’s Fifth, produced by a small orchestra with only the addition of a contrafagott!’
>>128833369>Take, for instance, the symphonies of Mahler (which he, of course, pronounced Mal-air), with its thousand voices and whips, submarines and whatnot...that's funnyAnyway this is just standard poet v. novelist perspective, of course Debussy would find Mahler excessive and longwinded.
now playinghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QotM8febKDw
now playingstart of Franck: Prélude, Choral et Fugue, FWV 21https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ju3rdZ4O60&list=OLAK5uy_nzMJ6X6sGB3VOchc1CE1IWY7_jf7mo2ao&index=2start of Franck: Prélude, Aria et Final, FWV 23https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAtW-utGElI&list=OLAK5uy_nzMJ6X6sGB3VOchc1CE1IWY7_jf7mo2ao&index=5start of Franck: Prélude, Fugue et Variation, Op. 18https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7x2Vb-uTUU&list=OLAK5uy_nzMJ6X6sGB3VOchc1CE1IWY7_jf7mo2ao&index=8Franck: Trois Chorals pour grand orgue, FWV 38-40https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UuPcFI9ks4&list=OLAK5uy_nzMJ6X6sGB3VOchc1CE1IWY7_jf7mo2ao&index=10https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_nzMJ6X6sGB3VOchc1CE1IWY7_jf7mo2ao>Given the paucity of César Franck's piano music on disc, Nikolai Lugansky's focus on this composer is to be commended. On his third release for harmonia mundi, the Russian pianist reveals an organ master strongly attached to the musical forms inherited from J.S. Bach: the prelude, the fugue, and the chorale. Translated to the piano keyboard, Franck's music, with it's expansively conceived structures, requires a completely fresh approach that puts the greatest performers to the test: here, Lugansky took on an additional challenge by preparing his own transcription (a brilliant one, at that!) of Franck's celebrated Choral pour grand orgue No.2.
>Besides describing some of Alexander Scriabin's music as "languishing junk," he wrote of Robert Schumann's Symphony No. 4 that it was "boring," that Carl Maria von Weber's Konzertstück in F minor was passé, and that he found Johannes Brahms's Symphony No. 3 "cold and without particular inspiration, ... badly orchestrated–grey on grey."
Classical music for mesugakis?
>>128833849If musicians' shitposting abilities were proportional to their compositional skills, then Boulez would be the world's greatest composer.
brahms is the classical equivalent of a beer fart
Brahms appeals only to longhoused freaks and repressoids. The well-turned out and aristocratic man is naturally repulsed by him as he is by other items of academic bourgeois kitsch. He is the musical equivalent of a stag painting. I'm sure he goes nicely with your fat wife's fish jelly but he cannot speak to the soul of a Caesar.
brahms is the classical equivalent of John 50wagner is the classical equivalent of Hunter Schafer
Brahms is the classical equivalent of a fine 19th century novel.Wagner is the classical equivalent of My Secret Life.
Siri, who are John 50 and Hunter Schafer?
brahms is the classical equivalent of "mature" battle shounen manga like HxHwagner is the classical equivalent of serious seinen manga like Berserk and Monster
Brahms is the classical equivalent of a widely beloved film of Golden Age HollywoodWagner is the classical equivalent of an erotic French art film
Mmmmm! I love Brahms! I love being a constipated cuckold! I love to watch fat women get fucked by Aryan Wagnerites and then discarded for being fat!! ! I love to say things like "One who reads lives many more lives than one who does not" as a cope for my smelly academicism! When my fat wife lets me touch I cockle like a gay bonobo and say "Hnnnggg! Death by snu-snu!!"
WagnerReligious patriotic gun violence enjoyers without state healthcareBrahmsNihilist train riding walkable city dwellers with state healthcare like we have in GermanyThe answer is obvious.
>>128834114both sound cool.
>>128833849All while never writing a good piece in 40+ years of miserable and uninspired life
This lardass ruined my life by being too good at music.
The Holy Grail... Amazing how I am beset by these medieval visions when I listen to the mythic compositions of Wagner, Master of Music and Poetry. I am fighting alongside Richard the Lionheart and drinking wine with the Knights of the Round Table... I hear the call of the Black Forest, the rustle of trees, the scream of the eagle, the clatter of steel... Truer than the truth, the Spirit of Western Man is animated towards infinity in the most epic of legendary music. We are going to make it bros.https://youtu.be/a53s4jyCqqU
https://youtu.be/b80Jw8MuZxoShatter...! The spirit of the Black Forest... it will disperse the crude hootenanny of the modern man. How did Wagner do it? He completed history in his art... he discovered the Holy Grail: the Myth of Prometheus which is the enduring affirmation of Life and the Aryan spirit.THE EROS WHICH MAKES WAR ON THE GODS!! CAN YOU "FEEL" IT?
All roads lead to Wagner.
>Imagine a great, beautiful, intricate tapestry of infinite colour, that has been stained indelibly. It's still a beautiful tapestry, with miraculous workmanship and gorgeous colour and silken texture, but that stain is real, and, I'm afraid, Hitler and Nazism have stained Wagner. For some people, that stain ruins the whole work. For others, it is just something you have to face up to. But here, as storm clouds gather in Nuremberg... Here is a place to think about such things
All roads lead to the Vagner meme.
>>128834283Stephen Fry is a gay retard.
>>128834325Goodness me. Well, it's all music in the end, isn't it now? Notes and chords and all those lovely things. And Wagner, you know, believed that love was greater than power. So he's on the side of the angels, I think. Just take a listen to the shimmering lights of Parsifal. If you ask me, the light's winning.
>>128834352You're alright in my book, Steve. Sorry about what that other guy said.
I remember still the first time I saw the Vagner meme.It was 73, Brahmscuck was on /classical/ with the trusty Sibelius. I'd never seen Vagner before, and found myself thoroughly entertained. I'd heard Vagner was a tranny meme, and it certainly showed in its humor. I distinctly remember smirking to the memes. But nothing could prepare me for the absolute show of wit that was about to come in first syllable of the word Vagner, when happened the eponymous vag.Vagina! A single pun, and just after Wagner’s name! I burst out laughing. "Oh Brahmscuck" I remember thinking, barely managing to think straight at all between my chuckles and wheezing. "What a prankster! What a jokester!"/classical/ attemped to calm me down, some even asking how I'd not known about the famous Vagner by then, popular as it was. Were they not happy one had been lucky enough to live to that point and still feel the pure, unadulterated Brahmscuck genius? Were they jealous? I did not know then, and do not care now.I tried to calm myself, but kept chuckling all throughout the Vagners in the next post. At the edge of my seat, I waited for the repeat of the Vagner, this time hoping to control myself. Imagine my surprise then, during the next Brahmscuck post, when the Vagner surprised me further by not showing up at all! At that point I feared for my life, such was the lack of oxygen from my guffawling fit.They only managed to removed me from the thread putting an end to my disruption after I'd already soaked the board in urine.
All Romantic fans are transgender. They want to be giggly little girls ravished by big orchestral swells and swoony melodies and dense instrumentation that "sounds hard" and makes them all squirmy and ready for the composer's robust creative will to penetrate them. They understand creativity as basically the same as rape, and they want to be the victim.
Daily Reminder:The Boston Six is America's great contribution to the Western classical tradition.https://youtu.be/vu50DjAZiMc
Scriabin is so boring. Although you can sense some musical talent, he dedicated the entirety of his career to being a second-rate Chopin.
>>128834576how unfortunate for America
>>128834607The ultimate... you have no idea what you're saying about Lord Scriabin, whelp. Continue down this path and you'll feel the heat of my demon left hand searing your insides. Don't tempt the shadows little puppy... LOL!
Only girls like Rachmaninov and this is entirely because of his tall height and yaoi hands. If you like Rachmaninov and you are thinking that you are not a girl, you're mistaken.
Classical music for hags?
>>128833152>>128833369Based, the French absolutely cucked the Germans in terms of the quality of music they put out during La belle epoque
>>128834635You're a tranny
>>128834680Brahms.
Fauréhttps://youtu.be/QMwcmX7bOxo
>>128834021Wagner
The CIA turned me homosexual using Wagner. It happened during the War on Terror. A man in black kidnapped me and took me to their front organization, a brothel in San Francisco where they fed me LSD and played me Wagner's operas from Tannhäuser to Parsifal over the course of several days while I was strapped to the bed naked. I had dozens of exhibitionist orgasm merely from this process, before they even began the provocation of my bussy. The latter predominantly took place during Tristan, over the course of which Daddy allowed me one orgasm after ruining two at the prelude and Liebesnacht. I apologize for my infantile language. Because of my conditioning I am now unable to refer to my sexual needs in any other terms except for the craving for Daddy in my bussy. Be careful when you listen to Wagner.
>>128834744Only girls post the Nordic Gamer Chad and this is entirely because of his tall height and yaoi hands. If you post the Nordic Gamer Chad and you are thinking that you are not a girl, you're mistaken.
*puffs on pipe**sips whiskey**adjusts waistcoat*It's Rachmaninov time
Brahms? Wagner? Who cares. Music clearly ended with Beethoven.
>Attempting to reproduce the feelings of the court of Louis XIV and continue the—forget the style!—just the vision of life of Couperin, as if the last hundred or two hundred years hasn’t happened, would be a wonderful act of defiance but ultimately it could only work as some very cruel parody. I have many bad memories of driving through the desolation of the northeast United States and looking out the window at this mud-colored bleak world, abandoned by everything beautiful, with just senseless jumble of dilapidated almost-Soviet shingled shacks and grim utilitarian shops, and disjointed architecture built according to no plan; or worse, with a thin rape of agricultural production spread widely across the land...and of trying to listen to Couperin with this gray apocalypse out the window. I always had to turn off such music. It’s an insult to the music and to yourself. It’s worse in other parts of America—imagine looking out now on obese lardmother with mystery meat kid sweating at bus stop. And you listen Rameau while you see this...I encourage you do this; listen to his “Cyclops” while you look this. You will only wish for total nuclear wipeout; I mean the contrast is so severe. I am exaggerating. There were scenes of desolation and poverty in Couperin day too, maybe even worse than now. But the music would feel inappropriate as a program even to the greatest opulence of today. “It doesn’t fit.” It’s like trying to wear powdered wig; I know such things are titillating for many men now who call themselves reactionaries. They have other motivations. But at its worst the “reactionary mind” is just this vulgar pretense, in the middle of our total desolation, that you can just carry on going through the motions and that merely aping the past and its forms is going to revive it.
Baxhttps://youtu.be/TGvV82zdRHc
>In his diaries, he kept lists of the girls he fancied (usually in their late teens), he had a mania for counting the bricks and windows of buildings, and for counting the numbers of bars in his gargantuan orchestral scores, making sure their proportions were statistically correct. And there were even stranger sides to this kind of behaviour: when his mother died, Bruckner commissioned a photograph of her on her death bed and kept it in his teaching room. He had no image of his mother when she was alive, just this grotesque-seeming token of her death staring out at him as an unsettling memento mori. Butt also recalls accounts of Bruckner having "fingered and kissed the skulls of Beethoven and Schubert" when their corpses were exhumed and moved to a different cemetery; that Bruckner had requested permission to see the skull of a dead cousin (he was refused), and also that of the Emperor Maximilian, whose body was returned to Vienna after his execution in Mexico in 1867.
So it has come to this. Truly it is dismal that /classical/ clings even today to nonentities. Haydn and Mozart? Pop for noblemen. Beethoven? Kitsch for Jacobins. Schubert? The wojak composer who today would court his audience on /r9k/. Wagner? He is the MCU of the 19th century. Brahms? You may as well put on a Disney OST and host a hootenanny at your trailer park for all it will edify you. With his satirical La Valse, Ravel humiliated the whole soi-disant "classical tradition" formed since the upstarts of the eighteenth century took the luminous glory of the baroque and made it into a festival of FARTS (see the second movement of Haydn 93 if you dare defile your ear... your good taste may not recover).Simplicity, vulgarity, poopy parpy bassoon sounds, dippy whistling fagflutes, and swoony superficial strings so dizzied the lethargic libidos of both the degenerated aristocrats and the rising tide of dull-minded common stock that a century was not sufficient to exhaust their ignorant hunger for this tripe. And yet, even today, when no barrier prevents the worthy pilgrim from seeing what dwarves are those composers, compared to their baroque predecessors and to the modernists who finally put a plug in those tooty little poots, still /classical/ concedes to the nonentities.The unique characteristic of this writer's soul that he never recognized the validity of the music designated as Classical and Romantic even as a child. Puzzlement and concern were his response to the claims of journalists that this was the acme of art music. Yet when I held in my ear the rich and lofty counterpoint of Bach or soaked in the profound and advanced sonorities of Ravel, Debussy, and Scriabin, my heart was set to rest at the cost of a mind put to flame by the injustice of the situation. Were it not for this injustice, I would take no notice of those composers who are beneath the dignity of consideration for any truly musical person.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDk2RUaoEJQ
Another dark night of the soul beckons... Rachmaninoff it is. The waves lap at my worn boots already. This is not the twilight of European genius, no... It is the midnight. Much has been lost, but much abides. Let us pass.https://youtu.be/ssRiH9Np2IA
Have you listened to Lettberg's Scriabin today, /classical/?
Wagner.
In 1921 Arnold Schoenberg declares that because of him German music will continue to dominate the world for the next hundred years. Twelve years later he is forced to leave Germany forever. After the war, in America, laden with honors, he is still convinced that his work will be celebrated forever. He faults Igor Stravisnky for paying too much attention to his contemporaries and disregarding the judgement of the future. He expects posterity to be his most reliable ally. In a scathing letter to Thomas Mann he looks to the period “after two or three hundred years,” when it will finally become clear which of the two was the greater, Mann or he! Schoenberg dies in 1951. For the next two decades his work is hailed as the greatest of the century, venerated by the most brilliant of the young composers, who declare themselves his disciples; but thereafter it recedes from both concert halls and memory. Who plays it nowadays, at the turn of this century? Who looks to him? No, I don’t mean to make foolish fun of his presumptuousness and say he overestimated himself. A thousand times no! Schoenberg did not overestimate himself. He overestimated the future.Did he commit an error of thinking? No. His thinking was correct, but he was living in spheres that were too lofty. He was conversing with the greatest Germans, with Bach and Goethe and Brahms and Mahler, but , however intelligent they might be, conversations carried on in the higher stratospheres of the mind are always myopic about what goes on, with no reason or logic, down below: two great armies are battling to the death over sacred causes; but some minuscule plague bacterium comes along and lays them both low.Schoenberg was aware that the bacterium existed.
>>128835230As early as 1930 he wrote: “Radio is an enemy, a ruthless enemy marching irresistibly forward, and any resistance is hopeless”; it “force-feeds us music … regardless of whether we want to hear it, or whether we can grasp it,” with the result that music becomes just noise, a noise among other noises.Radio was the tiny stream it all began with. Then came other technical means for reproducing, proliferating, amplifying sound, and the stream became an enormous river. If in the past people would listen to music out of love for music, nowadays it roars everywhere and all the time, “regardless whether we want to hear it,” it roars from loudspeakers, in cars, in restaurants, in elevators, in the streets, in waiting rooms, in gyms, in the earpieces of Walkmans, music rewritten, reorchestrated, abridged, and stretched out, fragments of rock, of jazz, of opera, a flood of everything jumbled together so that we don’t know who composed it (music become noise is anonymous), so that we can’t tell beginning from end (music become noise has no form): sewage-water music in which music is dying.Schoenberg saw the bacterium, he was aware of the danger, but deep inside he did not grant it much importance. As I said, he was living in the very lofty spheres of the mind, and pride kept him from taking seriously an enemy so small, so vulgar, so repugnant, so contemptible. The only great adversary worthy of him, the sublime rival whom he battled with verve and severity, was Igor Stravinsky. That was the music he charged at, sword flashing, to win the favor of the future.But the future was a river, a flood of notes where composers’ corpses drifted among the fallen leaves and torn-away branches. One day Schoenberg’s dead body, bobbing about in the raging waves, collided with Stravinsky’s, and in a shamefaced late-day reconciliation the two of them journeyed on together toward nothingness (toward the nothingness of music that is absolute din).
>>128835235This is what my father told me when I was five: a key signature is a king's court in miniature. It is ruled by a king (the first step) and his two right-hand men (steps five and four). They have four other dignitaries at their command, each of whom has his own special relation to the king and his right-hand men.Since each of the twelve notes has its own job, title, and function, any piece we hear is more than mere sound: it unfolds a certain action before us. Sometimes the events are terribly involved: princes from other courts intervene, and before long there is no telling which court a tone belongs to and no assurance it isn't working undercover as a double or triple agent. But even then the most naive of listeners can figure out more or less what is going on. The most complex music is still a language.One day a great man determined that after a thousand years the language of music had worn itself out and could do no more than rehash the same message. Abolishing the hierarchy of tones by revolutionary decree, he made them all equal and subjected them to a strict discipline: none was allowed to occur more often than any other in a piece, and therefore none could lay claim to its former feudal privileges. All courts were permanently abolished, and in their place arose a single empire, founded on equality and called the twelve-tone system.Perhaps the sonorities were more interesting than they had been, but audiences accustomed to following the courtly intrigues of the keys for a millennium failed to make anything of them. In any case, the empire of the twelve-tone system soon disappeared. After Schönberg came Varèse, and he abolished notes (the tones of the human voice and musical instruments) along with keys, replacing them with an extremely subtle play of sounds which, though fascinating, marks the beginning of the history of something other than music, something based on other principles and another language.
Boulez on other composers (direct quotations):>Brahms"a bore”>Tchaikovsky“abominable”>Verdi“stupid, stupid, stupid!”>Schoenberg"most ostentatious and obsolete romanticism”>Webern“too simple”>Berg“bad taste”>Ravel“affectation”>Shostakovich"a second, or even third, pressing of Mahler">contemporary twelve-tone music"overrun by number-fanatics engaging in frenetic arithmetic masturbation”>Messiaen“brothel music”>John Cage“performing monkey">Stockhausen“hippie">American minimalism“a supermarket aesthetic”>American serialism“a cashier’s point of view”
Chad Schumann could've prevented all this but he lost his mind unfortunately.
>Neither Schumann, Wagner nor I were properly schooled. Talent was the decisive factor. Each of us had to find his own way. Schumann took one way, Wagner another, and I a third. But none of us really learnt what is right.
>>128835347>But none of us really learnt what is right.But what does that even mean?
>>128835408achieving classical holism
>is nicknamed the Russian Brahms>looks like Brahmswao
>>128835429He's a lot better than Brahms.
>>128835453so true slaveslopper
Life without Wagner is like a Woman without a Vagina, "useless".
"Mozart is the incarnation of music."Joseph Haydn"The fact that most people do not understand and respect the very best things, such as Mozart's concertos, is what permits men like us to become famous."Johannes Brahms"I have always reckoned myself among the greatest admirers of Mozart, and shall do so till the day of my death."Ludwig van Beethoven"Mozart is sweet sunshine."Antonin Dvorak"Oh Mozart, immortal Mozart, how many, how infinitely many inspiring suggestions of a finer, better life you have left in our souls!"Franz Schubert"Does it not seem as if Mozart's works become fresher and fresher the oftener we hear them?"Robert Schumann"Mozart is the highest, the culminating point that beauty has attained in the sphere of music.""Mozart is the musical Christ."Pyotr Ilyich Tchaikovsky"Give Mozart a fairy tale and he creates without effort an immortal masterpiece."Camille Saint-Saens"Mozart's music is particularly difficult to perform. His admirable clarity exacts absolute cleanness: the slightest mistake in it stands out like black on white. It is music in which all the notes must be heard."Gabriel Faure"Certain things in Mozart will and can never be excelled.""The most tremendous genius raised Mozart above all masters, in all centuries and in all the arts."Richard Wagner"The most perfect melodic shapes are found in Mozart; he has the lightness of touch which is the true objective. Listen to the remarkable expansion of a Mozart melody, to Cherubino's 'Voi che sapete', for instance. You think it is coming to an end, but it goes farther, even farther."Richard Strauss"I owe very, very much to Mozart; and if one studies, for instance, the way in which I write for string quartet, then one cannot deny that I have learned this directly from Mozart. And I am proud of it!"Arnold Schoenberg
Anonymous Thu 27 Nov 2025 10:14:47 No.128606709 ViewReport>Hugo Wolf was a student at the time of the 1882 Festival, yet still managed to find money for tickets to see Parsifal twice. He emerged overwhelmed: "Colossal – Wagner's most inspired, sublimest creation." He reiterated this view in a postcard from Bayreuth in 1883: "Parsifal is without doubt by far the most beautiful and sublime work in the whole field of Art.">Gustav Mahler was also present in 1883 and he wrote to a friend; "I can hardly describe my present state to you. When I came out of the Festspielhaus, completely spellbound, I understood that the greatest and most painful revelation had just been made to me, and that I would carry it unspoiled for the rest of my life.">Max Reger simply noted that "When I first heard Parsifal at Bayreuth I was fifteen. I cried for two weeks and then became a musician.">Alban Berg described Parsifal in 1909 as "magnificent, overwhelming,">and Jean Sibelius, visiting the Festival in 1894 said "Nothing in the world has made so overwhelming an impression on me. All my innermost heart-strings throbbed... I cannot begin to tell you how Parsifal has transported me. Everything I do seems so cold and feeble by its side.That is really something.">Claude Debussy thought the characters and plot ludicrous, but nevertheless in 1903 wrote that musically it was "Incomparable and bewildering, splendid and strong. Parsifal is one of the loveliest monuments of sound ever raised to the serene glory of music.">He was later to write to Ernest Chausson that he had deleted a scene he had just written for his own opera Pelléas et Melisande because he had discovered in the music for it 'the ghost of old Klingsor, alias R. Wagner'.He was simply the greatest. Wagner for all eternity.
Waltonhttps://youtu.be/ozL-R0yWhPs
too much spam in this one, c'mon
>I think there is no work of art which represents the spirit of a nation more surely than Die Meistersinger of Richard Wagner. Here is no playing with local colour, but the raising to its highest power all that is best in the national consciousness of his own country. This is universal art in truth, universal because it is so intensely national. At the end of that opera Hans Sachs does not preach about art having no boundaries or loving the highest when he sees it, but says what I may slightly paraphrase thus:>‘Honour your own masters;>Then even when Empires fall>Our sacred nation’s art will still remain.’
>>128835496>Anonymous Thu 27 Nov 2025 10:14:47 No.128606709 ViewReportwhat did he mean by this?
>>128835561Wagner raped his mind.
At times like these I think of the Master of Music and Poetry in whose name this general was consecrated. Wagner would not have allowed his discord kittens to grow so unruly. With his integral and organic conception of the artwork he would, while paying the respect due to those composers out of whose genius was formed these pristine instruments of musical understanding, recognize these matters as beneath the dignity of the true artist for whom they are but tools of his unified expression. Come, let us embrace one another as sisters and retreat to the seraglio to repose in profound meditation upon the works of the Master.https://youtu.be/yF0pwSC7qWg
Man this guy really loved making music about random crap in nature exploding. Guess that's what it's like being Icelandic.https://youtu.be/W2obLTN0gYc
okay so. one trick I've found to calming my BPD is Ligeti actually. like the dissonance at that level, like microlevel? that's the stuff babe. i need to feel the needles in my eyes, I need to feel the hate and the eyes and the nonexistence. like i am the hole in me and the hole becomes me, and Ligeti expresses thhat so well guys. im so serioushttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qPr4vRRQKvQ
>>128835624If I listen to Ligeti will I become BPD and/or transgender?
>>128835659No, you will become schizophrenic and deterritorialized. And that's a GOOD thing
>>128835659no i do not think it works like thatbut maybe it will happen to you or maybe u will see God
>>128835678I wonder what kind of music Deleuze liked...
Is Hamelin's Medtner Piano Concerto No. 2 the best recording?
>>128835697Probably, but you should also trySUDBINUDBINhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPyesqEzEZo&list=OLAK5uy_lwYYGkLP7zL4PEPUKmKWfEoAxkmqLQJXw&index=1He has recordings of all three.
>>128835692Think Schumann and Messiaen are brought up in his writing.
>>128835708Is he the best for No. 3 or do you prefer Demidenko or Tozer?
>>128835720I've only heard Sudbin/Litton's for the 3rd. I see Scherbakov also has one that might be worth looking into.
Schoenberg was aware that the bacterium existed.
>Famously, in his published writing Nietzsche sets up Bizet against Wagner, declares Carmen to be the greatest of all operas, and compares its music favourably with Wagner's in a certain amount of detail. But he does not believe this either. Privately, in a letter to a friend he writes: 'What I say about Bizet, you should not take seriously the way I am, Bizet does not matter at all to me. But as an ironic antithesis to Wagner, it has a strong effect' (27 December 1888). It does indeed, and has been quoted ever since. We begin to realise who, as between Nietzsche and Wagner, is the actor, the master of insincere effect. As for Wagner the man, although Nietzsche heaped almost incredible public abuse on his head ('Is Wagner a human being at all? Isn't he rather a sickness?' — this remark in The Wagner Case is representative of dozens such to be found in his writings) he never, in spite of himself, lost a vivid sense of Wagner's greatness. In the last year of his effective life he wrote to a friend: 'Wagner himself, as man, as animal, as God and artist, surpasses a thousand times the understanding and the incomprehension of our Germans. Whether it is the same with the French I do not know.'
>>128835624o this one is gud toohttps://youtu.be/2tfHXqUTdaAlike ia m the torn nightdress itselfor the incsect crawling out of my bod y and scarthing me with raptorial forelimbs
>By the way, in all my life I have only seen one true conductor — and that was Wagner, when in 1863 he came to Saint Petersburg to give some concerts, at which he also conducted a number of symphonies by Beethoven [Nos. 3 and 5–8]. Those who haven't heard these symphonies in Wagner's interpretation cannot appreciate them fully and understand all their unattainable greatness.- Tchaikovsky
Danganronpa video game spinoff scored by Ligeti and Schnittke.
>>128835908gud ideai like the UDG r*p*d girl i think she'd go gud with schnittke in hi s polystlistic edgy phase like this https://youtu.be/X6HrkhYj_rU
>In 1915 the actress Lena Ashwell asked Elgar to write the incidental music for a play she was producing. The Starlight Express was based on the recently published novel A Prisoner in Fairyland and the adaption was by the books' author Algernon Blackwood and Violet Pearn. Elgar's original intention was to reuse music from his early composition The Wand of Youth, but as the project progressed he added a substantial amount of new music to the score. The Starlight Express opened in London on 29th December 1915 to mixed reviews. The critical consensus was that the play was too long and the staging inappropriate; however Elgar's music was enthusiastically received.>Of course The Starlight Express can be as viewed simply as a wonderfully entertaining piece of music theatre. But, for those who want to dig deeper the symbolism starts with the play's title which expresses the tension between the forces of light (good)) and darkness (evil). At the centre of the story is the dramatic opposition of children and adults representing innocence and experience. Jungian themes of dreams and the feminine archetype also appear and the tensions of the play are finally resolved in the tableau pictured above by the discovery of the inner light, or gnosis, which the libretto describes, with capitalisation, as - "the rising of the Star". All these symbols are the currency of dualist religions and in particular of the various strands of Gnosticism which view the universe as a battleground between the gods of good and evil.>Lena Ashwell's attention had been drawn to [the novel] by Muriel Pratt, an actress who was a member of the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn together with Algernon Blackwood and Aleister Crowley. Lena Ashwell shared with Blackwood a deep interest in mysticism, spiritualism and all aspects of the occult. Shortly before the Starlight Express production she had become a follower of the Fellowship of the Way, a system of psychic development.https://youtu.be/AXr7YVDd4Vg
>>128836083Like Mozart's Masonic Singspiel The Magic Flute
>>128836096Sibelius also wrote Masonic musichttps://youtu.be/BBxPJI1MPgU?list=PLeFYcsAQ_5oJFsrcl0ZJ2KcwOMATc557u
>>128836083>>128836096>>128836102If I listen to Occult music will I become BPD and/or transgender?
>>128836116You have to "clean" the spirit with Wagner afterwards.
>>128836083no english composer ever produced anything worthwhile
>>128836153*teleports behind you*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IM7-OmdZQNM*teleports above you*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFuIGh57INo*appears in the tree*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQg84UwiftIsorry to embarrass you in front of your girl and friends, nothing personnel, kid
>>128836186
>>128827736This has somehow played perfectly on my phone with no ads for 20 minutes now, yet that Schoenberg, Webern, Berg trash loaded them every 2 minutes. And this is MILES better. It kinda sounds like Star Wars
>>128835716Messiaen does seem like the quintessential Deleuzean composer.
>>128836083Interesting, didn't know about this, thanks.>>128836186I don't get how anyone can not like these pieces.
Trying to become schizophrenic.https://youtu.be/Ws1kv05C1XE
>>128836222try Reger>Just what the blazes is going on in the "Fantasie and Fugue on BACH"? It's not like you can even hear melody or any melodic lines as everything is mishmashed together in such clouded harmony. Apparently tonal, yes, no, who the heck knows? Who knows what the beat even is? It's like the music evokes fog blending into a blizzard with occasional lightning, cyclones and earthquakes thrown in. The chromatic fugue, at least initially, takes us back to the Reger we normally know, but then heads into to those humungous blurred sound walls (wave after wave of 50-note chords...seemingly at least). One wonders what Reger's esthetics at this point are? But I could imagine that in a dimly lit cathedral this would probably be as uncanny as hell. Is this music beautiful, grotesque, ugly, all or none of the above? What's more it doesn't sound like stereotyped avant-garde but rather schizo or psychotic late romantic music, like if the composer composed this with a 5 pound tumor pressing into his brain but not impairing him severely.https://youtu.be/miLzJv3frTk
>>128836222BECOME ANTI_OEDIPAL
>>128836234>schizo or psychotic late romantic musicHonestly a great description of Reger. He's so formally strict and yet so harmonically radical that it's bewildering, like something that sounds like it ought to be comprehensible and yet isn't. All strangely spiced broth and no noodles.
>>128836222wtf I love the organ now???https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5w6k4DQeb9s&list=OLAK5uy_nsCMHMaaaxvr-eISFTMlCxgvhVqchldLk&index=11
>>128836218It's oddly overlooked for such a notable collaboration between prominent artists.
>>128836276French organ composers are the bombhttps://youtu.be/igqZ8PQvzX8
the WTC is best on the organ
>>128836290anon did you even peep? >>128829889
>>128836293That's a piano recording?
>>128836296yes :)to convince you of its superiority
Somepony bake
What is a great organ WTC anyway
Wagner
How come no one talks about Rachmaninoff's Suite for Two Pianos?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GrVnlJ8fpPs&list=OLAK5uy_m2-GT84Ap0nRcQTdkGVUB1hWqnRDU2mAY&index=1
>>128836315>How come no one talks about Rachmaninoffquestion answered
Wagner raped this thread.
>>128836320That's a snappy reply, but you can't seriously listen to that and tell me it's not good and you don't like it, c'mon
new>>128836326>>128836326>>128836326
>>128836308Has Latry done one
>>128836304>asian
>>128836308Daniele BoccaccioJohn WellsLouis ThiryRobert Costin
>>128836403thx
>>128834028>>128834155>filtered
>>128834607>>128834619languishing junk
