Brahms editionhttps://youtu.be/0xKroj2SMDMThis thread is for the discussion of music in the Western (European) classical tradition, as well as classical instrument-playing.>How do I get into classical?This link has resources including audio courses, textbooks and selections of recordings to help you start to understand and appreciate classical music:https://rentry.org/classicalgenPrevious: >>130912190
>"Beethoven and Brahms I would throw into the chimney, as far as their piano compositions are concerned. They did not write for the piano. Only Bach, Chopin, and Schumann wrote for the piano. Brahms' piano things are in the organ style; they are not for the piano. I have the greatest reverence for Beethoven's orchestral compositions and string quartets, but not his piano things. No, I would throw them into the chimney."https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDg2LkXU0UYTruthpilled.
chopin fucked the piano as if it was his mother. others, like bach for example, treated the piano in a utilitarian way. they were great, but not streamlined, their piano compositions adhered to the same rules as their orchestral arrangements, it was basically the same kind of piece on a different instrument. chopin treated the piano in a special way without being so overly and needlessly sentimental, dull and naive like Debussy
>>130953874>chopin fucked the piano as if it was his mother. others, like bach for example, treated the piano in a utilitarian way. they were great, but not streamlined, their piano compositions adhered to the same rules as their orchestral arrangements, it was basically the same kind of piece on a different instrument. chopin treated the piano in a special way without being so overly and needlessly sentimental, dull and naive like DebussyThis but Debussy and Chopin in reverse
KEYBOARD COMPOSERS TIER LIST (most informed and on objective basis)>ELDER GOD TIERChopinDebussy>ELDER GOD TIER 2 (THE POWER GAP TIER)Nobody.>GOD TIERRachmaninoff>GREAT TIERLisztFauréScriabinBeethoven>GOOD TIERMozartSchubertJ.S. BachBrahms>PASSABLE TIERRegerHaydnSatie>MEH TIERScarlattiByrdSorabjiClementiPoulenc>BAD TIER>SHIT TIERMost others
>>130953696Yes but his music, like all greats, scratches an itch no other composer does.
>>130953936Byrd and Bull deserve better.
>>130953936Beethoven's 32 puts him in the highest tier by default, c'mon
>>130954019I can't remember a single tier list posted here that hasn't been bait.
huh this Pletnev/RNO Rach Symphony 1 is actually quite good, and, in typical Pletnev fashion, different than the usual performance. Less rhythmic verve and more majestic weight. Like if instead of Russian romanticism, you conducted it as if it were Brahms.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0180aiaChcs&list=OLAK5uy_kAa9K521y7BVh6oPHEIIEorFQHVDU7WzY&index=2Give it a try! Excited for how the rest of the cycle sounds now.
>>130954019I can't remember a single bar in 32 that is elegantly pianistic.
How come it took until 1911 for someone to realize that the piano is a percussion instrument?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JVHWQWjVeA
Verdihttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmn4saQbPy0&list=OLAK5uy_nC_B_4gEVnLR-ayaOkpPsmvtxpLAM0EKI&index=19
let's get hisshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7YBJ3FWGWA&list=OLAK5uy_mGcKCbNBmybN74sSnWKoshSvm1XYJZ0-g&index=27
>>130954217Good LORD this remaster is terrible. The hiss is actually LOUDERcompareRR/Bak 'remaster'https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3EMR2uqgmI&list=OLAK5uy_mGcKCbNBmybN74sSnWKoshSvm1XYJZ0-g&index=1Regishttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1YshLZxjCg&list=OLAK5uy_nBWtByoYXcOnqv6VhZzLJm4Zrrm1uXUJk&index=36what a conman. or am I the crazy one here?
>>130951782>>130951791>>130951948>>130952281>>130953260>>130953249thank you
>>130954256You are not crazy, the second version you posted is easily 100x better.
>>130954317Thank you. This is worse than fraudulent or malpractice, it's legitimate malice, the man is an audio butcher.
>>130954256hiss being louder doesn't really mean much, the second version is denoised to oblivion and loses a lot of its quality in the process, it sounds like it's underwater those old recordings are on loud tape or shellac which inevitably has background hiss as part of the signal, attempts to overly correct / no-noise them just degrade the musicthat being said, yes, RR is a scam artist, he usually just uses someone else's transfers and applies EQ to themhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4D7TsPRk8cthis is the latest art et son transfer and is a happy medium between the two, where there's still obviously tape noise so minimal denoising was applied, but it's not underwater and murky like the Regis one.
>>130954393>hiss being louder doesn't really mean much,Not for quality but it's so loud as to be distracting in its own right. I can barely hear the music there.> it sounds like it's underwaterTrue but at least there's some comfiness in that sound.>this is the latest art et son transferThanks, sounds great.
Francesco Tristano's Bachhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtPNSIRCxZo&list=OLAK5uy_nARyYNLY3AiZ9MSY71XIOpbGx0X-ZZOo8&index=1
Walter Gieseking's Bachhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FDq7b5v4u7c&list=OLAK5uy_kOrxO1C-Cc3M-rlG6KQgPHACds0kyoKsU&index=20
a small voice in my brain is telling me to spend the evening listening to Gould's WTC... should I listen to it (it being the voice, but also Gould's WTC)?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkLemkAkDRM&list=OLAK5uy_keWvxGmwrAzKnB28btqo4Fgh6mSGIp9hA&index=35
>Why yes, my favorite Brahms pieces are his Chorale Preludes, Op. 122
>>130954443sometimes the noise just comes with the territory, and it's better to leave it alone. although in RR's case, the noise is aggressive because he applied an EQ match - likely from another piano recording - and it raised those frequencies too much.no-noising became very popular in the 90s when CEDAR was introduced, which was a system that could automatically denoise old recordings to a remastering engineer's taste, and because companies spent a lot of money on that stuff, it came down from above to use it as much as possible, which is why we got horrific transfers in the 90s like Schnabel's Beethoven set, which had such aggressive no-noising that literal parts of the performance were lost. like, here's Grumiaux's famous Stravinsky VC in its 1990 iteration, with denoising: https://files.catbox.moe/5jm3b4.mp3and here it is in an earlier transfer without denoising: https://files.catbox.moe/nr5t00.mp3it's subtle, but the latter has a lot more air around the instruments that gets lost when you throw out the hiss, there's a greater sense of clarity that gets subdued with the no-noising. probably need to listen on headphones to get the full effect
>>130954393>it sounds like it's underwaterAnd that's a good thing! Debussy is a water type composer.
CPE Bach (warning: comfy)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSJSdbELRBc
>>130954596Wow, this is incredible. I'll have to do some comparisons but this might be my new favorite set of Bach's Keyboard Partitas.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSPIgZA_SQo&list=OLAK5uy_kOrxO1C-Cc3M-rlG6KQgPHACds0kyoKsU&index=7Maybe the hissAnon was right about these old school pianists...
>>130954723Doesn't really make sense considering he was a Leo.
>>130954809You failed to consider Debussy's moon sign, which is either Aquarius (air) or Cancer (water).
A stodgy autismal over-conservative music professor and piano-fetishist was teaching a class on Chopin, known lardass.”Before the class begins, you must get on your knees and worship the Romantic era and accept that it was the most productive period in the history of Western art music, even more than Viennese Classicism!”At this moment a brave, impeccably dressed, inebriated amateur pianist who had just kissed the bodypillow of his fictional wife and understood the folly of a(r/u)tistic movements such as serialism and fully supported the preservation and continuation of the true old masters' legacies stood and held up a composition notebook.”Professor, do you recognize this piece?”The arrogant professor smirked quite eastern catholically as he leafed through the notebook. "Why, there's nothing in here but blank manuscript paper, you stupid pedophile. Is it 4'33"?""No. It's an opera. If Chopin, as you say, is categorically the greatest composer of all time... then he should have written one, and it should be in this book."The professor was visibly shaken and dropped his chalk and 80-disc Rubinstein boxed set. He stormed out of the room crying Chopin fanboy crocodile tears, the same tears all autismal fanboys cry when someone else's favorite composer is different from theirs. There is no doubt at all that our professor, an anonymous craven coward who balked at accepting responsibility for his 4chan posts by using a tripcode on /mu/, wished he had taken the time to appreciate music beneath its surface aesthetics and understand the incalculable grace and poise of the great Classical masterpieces and deep intellectual current which runs beneath their simple veneer. As he gooned to blacked porn while listening to Nocturne in E-Flat in the final moments before his suicide, he wished so much for a requiem mass to be sung at his funeral, but alas! The lazy Chopin had neglected to write any of those, either!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBYwNFaNjAo
>>130954842can't believe I've made such an obvious blunder
>>130953874>>130953910>>130953936underage posters got it out of their system early so the rest of the thread should be good
>>130953936Poulenc is at least good tier
>>130955352>the rest of the thread should be goodhere's my attempt at contributing towards that goalJohann Baptist Joseph Maximilian Regerhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3JH8tBwS2Yhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKSpJhlJ0qshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVTjkYbok2Qhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yguCJ8ig4Kohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eGxORPjwRQ>Max Reger composed the fantasias on three chorales in September 1900: Phantasie über den Choral "Alle Menschen müssen sterben", Phantasie über den Choral "Wachet auf, ruft uns die Stimme" and Phantasie über den Choral "Halleluja! Gott zu loben bleibe meine Seelenfreud". They were all first performed individually by Reger's friend Karl Straube, and were first published by Breitkopf & Härtel. Straube and others regarded especially No. 2 highly, Straube called it "großartigste Leistung" (most extraordinary achievement).>Unlike other chorale fantasias, this work ends not with a fugue. It alternates stanzas with relation to the chorale tune with free stanzas. The introduction (Introduzione) presents several motifs, including a large leap downward as a Todesmotiv (motif of death), and a downward sequence of chords as an Auferstehungsmotiv (motif of resurrection).Reger wrote a copy for Straube and added the dedication: "Quite heartfelt pleasure, dear Carl! In case of deaths when listening to this 'crime', I will assume the costs of the funerals. Best greeting, your old organist, Max Reger"
>>130955668>The introduction is marked grave assai. Form and rhythm of the beginning, marked pppp, appear undecided. The sombre atmosphere is interrupted only by two forceful entries (marked fff) which have been characterized as "niedersausende Blitze" (striking lightning). Martin Weyer regarded the section as contrasting quiet night and commencing judgement".The chorale tune appears first in measure 11, in "sehr lichte Registrierung" (very light registration). The lines of the poem are interrupted by interludes. Reger establishes a contrast of "himmlische Herrlichkeit" (heavenly glory) and "irdische Finsternis" (earthly darkness). Straube notes: "Reger described the introduction of "Wachet auf" as the churchyard, and the chorale melody the voice of an angel; the dead are raised gradually; the figure "D-sharp / E / D-sharp" (measures 18 ff.) in the pedal symbolize how they move in their graves. This is how my friend explained his artistic intention."
>>130955352>>130955668>>130955679>contributes to a good thread>posts RegerYou had one job and you fucked it up on a 3rd rate G*rman incel composer.
It's kinda basic bitch but man the waldstein movement 1 is like peak piano sonata
Any keyboard music that can't be played on clavichord is worthless
>>130954680Same but arranged for piano by Busoni
>Described Reger as "a sarcastic, churlish fellow, bitter and pedantic and rude... a sort of musical Cyclops, a strong, ugly creature bulging with knotty and unshapely muscles, an ogre of composition>Igor Stravinsky Held a highly unfavorable view of Reger's music, going as far as to label it "the repulsive one.">As one notorious review in 1906 put it: "I am sitting in the smallest room of my house. I have Herr Reger's organ pieces before me. In a moment they will be behind meITT we laugh at Regercels
Stop listening to German RomanticismStop listening to ChopinStop listening to SchoenbergStop listening to StockhausenListen to Mozart and DebussyListen to Haydn and BoccheriniListen to Machaut and PerotinListen to Hildegard Von Bingen and Anon IVListen to Franco-Flemish and GesualdoListen to French Baroque and ZelenkaListen to Chabrier and Satie
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZWZ8XLdr3A&list=RDiZWZ8XLdr3A&start_radio=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijhDi-PDfLk&list=RDijhDi-PDfLk&start_radio=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4nzBNnDXrU&list=RDP4nzBNnDXrU&start_radio=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_vaRJ0TNwQ&list=RDe_vaRJ0TNwQ&start_radio=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CgCK4d7HEzg&list=RDCgCK4d7HEzg&start_radio=1What do we think of Ornstein lads? His early modernist works were in my opinion Jewish neurotic bullshit, but his later 1920's and onwards works were some of the best idiosyncratic tonality from a Rachmaninoff/Debussy adjacent composer. His Piano quintet is like if Stravinsky and Bartok had a lovechild together.
Poulenc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GE8PRXk2u8
>>221880154RIP
>>130956924A fun listen for something different. But ultimately, like all non-first rate solo piano music, kinda forgettable.
Max Regerhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uyL2slIwYxo&list=OLAK5uy_lJK6mh2J4ym1nWxzm1AqY9uT11ewdFhpo&index=2
Leo Ornsteinhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cdx8DZXyXE&list=OLAK5uy_kYh7fg74Y26ssi1r6-_17-_PTDTkYGwes&index=6
Reger's variations on bach theme are fucking good
Mahlerhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXeNJCn0dRs&list=OLAK5uy_kfWJspr5hfj-l90N68iw9iVtb8xWq5RD0&index=52>Czech Philharmonic & Semyon Bichkov present Symphony No. 9 in D minor (1909), a work that stands as one of Mahler’s most profound and searching final statements. Cast in the same key as his First Symphony, it suggests a return to origins, yet the music moves inexorably forward, shaped by a heightened sense of finality and reflection.>The first movement unfolds as a remarkable ‘liquidation of sonata form’, followed by a nostalgic Ländler and a restless, turbulent Rondo-Burleske ‘bereft of laughter’. What emerges is a deeply human work – at once intimate and vast – culminating in a slow movement of extraordinary stillness. Here, the music dissolves into D flat major before arriving at a final state of existential quiet, a conclusion that resists resolution yet leaves an indelible impression.I don't know what a "liquidation of sonata form" is but I like the way it sounds!
>>130957880https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIGnyMC3kts&list=OLAK5uy_mBPwEV1BieNgjgs7irFOk6uebDfmlJH18&index=6tru dat, double tru
There's very few modernist string quartets I like. They're all too abstract, dissonant, diffusive. What's interesting is there are several 20th century composers who wrote symphonies that are conventionally beautiful and accessible, that when you go to their chamber music and string quartets excepting perhaps more the same, it's the polar opposite, not a conventional tune or pretty sonority to be heard in miles.Maybe someday they'll click for me. I don't even like Bartok's. Shostakovich is the only exception. I think he did the blend of modernist aesthetic with a pleasing sound very well. It's like the rest couldn't figure out how to make that work so they went full abstract and academic.
>>130953936>>MEH TIER>>Byrdholy fucking pleb
>>130956379Disgusting. Don't reply to me ever again.
To help end the underrating of liszt in this general, post your favorite recording of his Dante Symphony, Faust Symphony, Poems or any of his orchestral masterpieces.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIhM0JQmKCELiszt needs to be recognized for his great contributions to orchestral literature and his hand in developing the tone poem into what it became.
>>130960387glad to see it finally clicked for you. now go outside and touch some grass.
>>130960676This
>>130960676fun fact: the maho poster has been here for at least three years.
>>130960746>newfag loves moshartColor me shocked.
>>130960387>Masur
>>130960387Obviously Bernstein is what you want for the Faust Symphony, but here's a more recent one I really liked by Karabits https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NLxCtfbZRjc&list=OLAK5uy_n_KWEi5a4p8C1CRYhf2N1qIASm8HREV9Q&index=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YujdE5rGFkY&list=OLAK5uy_lNj-G8eS8zQh-IIgxjU9QkIPlYx4YS6rQ&index=3https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88W4mVpvvdI&list=OLAK5uy_lNtVQ6zJytIpa4tv_jAjMfWB0hPdiwB0M&index=1I also really like Sinopoli's Faust and Dante. There is of course that wonderful Solti/Lopez Cobos set.As for the orchestral pieces, I like the Karajan and Haitink sets. I recently saw Noseda has recordings of all of Liszt's orchestral works too and was thinking about giving it a try.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQWuid3GnO0&list=OLAK5uy_kcLKlsGCPHD-Z8Zu0wx9eSJ4vIPs8lYAQ&index=10
>>130960907tell me more about what it was like in the great depression, gramps.
>>130960946I got bored of Mozart's entire repertoire when I turned like 10 in 2006. I could play all his late works by then. I got it all in my head unfortunately, since he has some great melodies, I'll give him that. But his harmony, counterpoint and texture are all normiecore garbage. Every single composer since him far surpassed him.
my condolences go out to all the posters who died from cringe when they read the post above.
my congratulations go out to all the posters who were born from based when they read the post above the post above.
some contemporary classical I came across, from Carlos Simonhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TG-FPsHLN0w&list=OLAK5uy_loRV2vxQm_h3YzAbZwQyd62yXYPIgrtA4&index=2>The conclusion of a digital series by Gianandrea Noseda and the National Symphony Orchestra, Carlos Simon: Four Symphonic Works brings together a collection of pieces by Kennedy Center Composer-in-Residence, Carlos Simon. Tales-A Folklore Symphony delves into African American culture and folklore. The work touches upon a wide breadth of ideas-from Negro Spirituals sung by enslaved prisoners to comics by the Afrofuturist creative duo, Black Kirby. Simon's short orchestral study, The Block, takes inspiration from the visual art of the late Romare Bearden, an artist whose work reflected African American life in urban cities as well as the rural American south. Songs of Separation for mezzo-soprano and orchestra was commissioned by the National Symphony Orchestra in connection with Simon's current residency as Kennedy Center Composer-in-Residence. The work takes it's inspiration from a set of four poems by the 13th-century Persian poet and Sufi mystic Jalal al-Din Mu?ammad Rumi. Completing the album is the composer's Wake Up! Concerto for Orchestra, which asks it's audience to consider their own awareness in an increasingly chaotic society.
some more Carlos Simon, except the description on this one made me roll my eyes to the back of my head,>American composer Carlos Simon presents a multi-genre work, Requiem for the Enslaved. This work is a musical tribute to commemorate the stories of 272 enslaved men, women and children sold in 1838 by Georgetown University. Described as a "rap opera," Carlos infuses his original compositions with African American spirituals and familiar Catholic liturgical melodies.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mzu0DLlu6CU&list=OLAK5uy_mMg4UloU0N3qQrTnK9NE7LA_NtTK6my84&index=1
>>130961187>>130961192>rap operainto escape velocity it goes.
There's something peculiar about Max Reger's music that I can't quite put my finger on. It's almost outsider classical. Like he's halfway from a different tradition entirely with his bizarre rhythms and offbeat melodies.
>>130961227it's quality slop.
>>130961227to add a little more,You listen to a little and you think, oh, this is just some standard late German Romanticism, what's the big deal? But then you listen to a little bit more and it's like no other late German Romanticism you've ever heard. It's like it was composed by an alien that came to earth, learned the classical tradition, and started to compose, bringing along the baggage of his own foreign upbringing.
>>130961236>bringing along the baggage of his own foreign upbringing.you should read about his teacher, Hugo Riemann.
>>130954683Thank you very much. I listened to more of the Regis set and compared it with the AES one and I do see what you mean about lost detail.
Melodie Zhao's Beethoven morningSonata 7, Op. 10 No. 3https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=snQzB8cozdQ&list=OLAK5uy_mBS4ZUSnN3A_Uiu6XxTbwxtoJABHgRbJ4&index=24Sonata 8, Op. 13https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUUvdy_C6uA&list=OLAK5uy_mBS4ZUSnN3A_Uiu6XxTbwxtoJABHgRbJ4&index=28Sonata 9, Op. 14 No. 1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yxx71HczIDk&list=OLAK5uy_mBS4ZUSnN3A_Uiu6XxTbwxtoJABHgRbJ4&index=31Sonata 10, Op. 14 No. 2https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NaSF7x7CPHM&list=OLAK5uy_mBS4ZUSnN3A_Uiu6XxTbwxtoJABHgRbJ4&index=33
Reger was a retarded autist that just knew the rules too well but still couldn't compose a piece worth listening to.
>>130961290You don't think something like thishttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQo7PUHlPls&list=OLAK5uy_lyi8w1EXCaDXWDrNEtr6ZzO20Mx9iJ8EY&index=11or thishttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GbhBm30t0I&list=OLAK5uy_lyi8w1EXCaDXWDrNEtr6ZzO20Mx9iJ8EY&index=12or thishttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKxi11hgzNo&list=OLAK5uy_lyi8w1EXCaDXWDrNEtr6ZzO20Mx9iJ8EY&index=34sounds good?
>>130961288>tfw same age as Zhao and don't have my own Beethoven cycledamn what have i done with my life
>>130961313you had a life?
>>130961317Briefly
>>130960913I like Masur.
>>130961290there are no rules, only facts.
>>130961360budget conductor tbqhBut I respect your opinion
hiss Meistersinger with Kempe (1951!)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nm0qd7APqw0&list=OLAK5uy_nezvKTue0R82B4VzeNV51kJL-G7O__uxo&index=1shame YouTube Music doesn't appear to have the more famous and more acclaimed Kempe/BPO recording but this might do>The present epic Dresden performance from Kempe is the finest I have heard. We hear a tremendously balanced cast singing with a spontaneous quality that one rarely encounters in studio recordings. In short this is a Meistersinger to treasure. ---- Michael Cookson
>>130961305I've listened enough and I'm convinced that he could not compose anything remarkable. Middle of the road music.
>>130961408If any Wagner fans haven't heard this recording, check it out, the singing is spectacular! Kempe is such a good conductor.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1hTFId6keA&list=OLAK5uy_nezvKTue0R82B4VzeNV51kJL-G7O__uxo&index=4
>>130961290>the rulesWhat are these 'rules' again?
now playingstart of Hamerik: Symphony No. 2 in C Minor, Op. 32, "Tragique":https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSXV692a47M&list=OLAK5uy_mKgZe7BjTBOeH1L1JcWr1YnLWNyJClcpk&index=6start of Hamerik: Symphony No. 3 in E Major, Op. 33, "Lyrique"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rbIzBxBScE&list=OLAK5uy_mKgZe7BjTBOeH1L1JcWr1YnLWNyJClcpk&index=9https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_mKgZe7BjTBOeH1L1JcWr1YnLWNyJClcpkI love symphonic cycles by lesser-known composers. Hamerik's first symphony is kind of a bust, utterly generic, which is to be expected from an immature early work. For his second and third, he's made massive improvements. For starters, they're actually listenable!
Is not observing repeats historically accurate? Can a HIP performer choose to to not observe repeats without it being a historically inaccurate thing to do?
the allure of Bach's WTC is so strong. no matter the time of day, my mood, or what I'm already listening to, suddenly the desire to begin listening to the Well-Tempered Clavier will often pop into my mindhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oelwaTXGVKw&list=OLAK5uy_mVneipKx_2fN8tVh3zc9Zq7jrhLiEXalk&index=47
>>130961288Women?
Thoughts?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfQZUt9aQr4&list=OLAK5uy_nr0GlDtojfV4yvlFjrCey0_Mcqf_q6ODA&index=1
>>130962088Yes!
>>130961566Read A Treatise on Counterpoint and Fugue by Cherubini, there you'll find most of the answer
>>130962122>HJ LimThat's a man
This is kinda interesting, a Wagner Violin Concerto arrangementhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xucSaigfws4&list=OLAK5uy_nUipZXlKhWxt1m9LUlzofu0sQi4ix4L24&index=1>Alexandre Da Costa presents us with an album entirely dedicated to the music of Wagner, both father and son. An operatic album in its style, but symphonic and instrumental in its structure. Immerse yourself in the wonderful world of Wagner’s Ring cycle and his other great operas, thanks to exclusive versions of the paraphrases on “Siegfried” and “Parsifal,” and recognize the unique sonic textures of “The Master-Singers of Nuremberg” in the Concerto for Violin and Orchestra. The musical gem “Dreams” completes this recording. On Stradivarius at the Opera II: Wagner, Da Costa shares his friendship and artistic partnership with artists from the Old Continent, namely the conductor Josep Caballé-Domenech (Spain) and his orchestra, the Staatskapelle Halle (Germany), as well as the ensemble Utrecht String Quartet (Netherlands). This album is dedicated to the music of the great Wagner family, of whom both father and son developed a writing style where love, drama, intensity, and sensibility harmoniously coexist at all times. Their music is certainly not light, but rather poignant, and has the power to awaken in each of us powerful emotions, bordering on ecstasy at times, and overwhelmingly sorrowful at others.
For the rest of summer, I'm gonna only listen to 21st century recordings. Should be fun!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9yDDx1aZfY&list=OLAK5uy_kg2WSEqnkuPUk6HItJ-edtTSfhG-SNjYY&index=16
>>130962596My condolences.
>>130962648>My>hisssssssss>con->hisssssssss>-dol->hisssssssss>-en->hisssssssss>ces.>hisssssssssCome again?It's good to spice things up.
>>130962301More importantly, did Reger read this?
>>130962695Doesn't matter. He followed the same fundamental rules. I'm sure he didn't have to read anything, just study Wagner, Bach, and whoever else.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoLVMmOBx3oWasn't there another recording of this on an Imperial Bosendorfer? I could sweat to god Lisitsa had one with the 97 keys but I couldn't find anything
Wow, people really aren't taking kindly to Reger at all. I honestly wasn't expecting such an outright violent reaction to him, such detestation. As I reached his 20th century works he more and more appeared to me as a very particular and interesting composer, but I guess that's not the consensus here.I guess I won't be sharing anymore of him. Accept however this token of farewell:Johann Baptist Joseph Maximilian RegerZwei Streichquartette Op 54, 1900https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNGt7kfEDKEhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TqxlPlj1EeAhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dwz9Qp4ZknIhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=scVwxEU7dI0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmWlWi3VowEhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KqBE48r0G_4https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eaOsqOPZTcSee you in a few months when I'm ready to shill a different composer, I guess. Hopefully it'll be to everyone's, or most people's, liking.
>>130962942There's like me and at most 1 more anon that respectfully suggested he might not like Reger, what are you talking about? Just post whatever you want you pussy. Some will enjoy it, others won't, so what
>>130960387>Dante SymphonyKirill Karabits, Staatskapelle Weimar>Faust SymphonySolti, CSO, Siegfried Jerusalem>Poemspicrel
>>130960387Oh also Maho more like My Whore
>>130963009>me and at most 1 more anonFirstly, that's not true, as anyone who's been on the general for the past week or so can attest.>so whatIt's no fun at all to share stuff if it's only going to get unambiguously negative reactions and no discussion at all. What's the point? I still in spite of *everything* come here in the hopes of having a good time, and when it becomes clear that that's not possible I just leave. Do you find this to be particularly strange?
>>130963079I've been here and it's always just one or two anons. The reaction is same as for any other composer. Don't be silly.
>>130962758I don't know nuthin' 'bout no Bosendorfer, I just know there's about a thousand recordings of the piece, so maybehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQGexKoO4wY&list=OLAK5uy_nngJn-fTYgsBApb4QCPWxm45ZuKT5maPU&index=2or if you want old schoolhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8JgasSQrrSY&list=OLAK5uy_mQtDuyocPgzXY6No8OhjvxcfAvn3F4uCI&index=1
>>130962942You should continue to update us whenever come across a Reger piece you particularly love.
>>130963261Alright, man. See you in a few.>>130963284Unless it's an immediate success then it usually takes up to a few years for a piece to go from "oh this is quite nice" to "oh, I actually love this" for me. Anyway, so far opp 28, 41, 49 and 50 strike me as particularly beautiful. I was going to be posting some of those today (already posted 49 on previous general), but hey, the point wasn't really to share a greatest hits (I usually do that however, once I'm done exploring a composer's career) but to share the journey itself. There's always next time.
>>130963359:(Don't fret, anon, sharing music here is not only always allowed, but always encouraged!
Szymanowskihttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WjdiRRm1AAM&list=OLAK5uy_le-0Ta1ThMVJ42wnFjI2FGmXD7sLlKzTk&index=21
A lot of these acclaimed contemporary conductors just seem so detached and emotionally pallid in their approach, with a emphasis rather on rich sonority and transparent architecture. Most of the recordings by them, both big names and small, leave me cold and indifferent. It's such a consistent pattern though that it leaves me to wonder is this simply the predominant taste of the classical audience today? Is it possible I'm the one in the wrong, that my own preferences are outmoded? In so many ways, I am befuddled.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2EbUK088JKI&list=OLAK5uy_l0wh48P6fOVvgnw7PmrLxtCvC3d_kGGFE&index=3Maybe this is peak performance.
>>130963579These conductors are trying to avoid sentimentality because that would "appeal to the wrong crowd."
>>130955919reger is cool
Just discovered another unfamiliar (midcentury) composer, one Hans Werner Henze, born in 1926 and died in 2012.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEErQbG-bIo&list=OLAK5uy_nVl6SDrEXeYJVkwEfz1-JxDsTiN1FxGxY&index=1This set contains his first six symphonies, and apparently he has ten total! Should be fun to explore.
>>130963589Sentimentality *and* spirituality. I get what they're going for, on the surface when I listen to Nelsons or Thielemann or Seguin or whomever, my ear does enjoy the rich sonority and driven excitement, but after several minutes of listening, I always find my heart and soul remain cold and unmoved. I listened to this earlier, one of my favorite movements in all the symphonic repertoire, and I kept spacing out it was so dull. Yet it seems to be beloved by public and critics alike,https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_4ihGpMiCk&list=OLAK5uy_kfWJspr5hfj-l90N68iw9iVtb8xWq5RD0&index=19
now playingstart of Britten: Violin Concerto, Op. 15https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GkslFae6wc&list=OLAK5uy_lX4NM_qPMRF-eLVdKUlbqEjQIMwfMZ91o&index=2start of Hindemith: Violin Concertohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvZZc4rkBVc&list=OLAK5uy_lX4NM_qPMRF-eLVdKUlbqEjQIMwfMZ91o&index=4https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_lX4NM_qPMRF-eLVdKUlbqEjQIMwfMZ91oone community reviewer writes,>These two works were both written in 1939, when each of these composers was in exile from his native land; Britten in America and Hindemith in Switzerland, and later America as well. "Only the misfortune of exile," says Stefan Zweig, "can provide the in-depth understanding and the overview into the realities of the world." There's some nostalgic sadness in each work, as there was in Zweig's own work about exile, The World of Yesterday, written in Brazil in the early 1940s. But, typically of both composers, this music is very much forward-looking, dynamic and really rather optimistic. Steinbacher plays with verve and great virtuosity, while Jurowski and his musicians provide the requisite big sound for these two 19th century-style concertos, the dramatic and lively Britten, and the lyrical, stirring Hindemith. Very highly recommended.
>>130963277>there's about a thousand recordings of the pieceTrue but not a thousand on a Imperial Bosendorfer, I could only find that single one
>>130963728I don't know how to tell if it is or isn't, but is it perhaps this one? I've posted it before,https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzMBdk1ND9o&list=OLAK5uy_mueVnDuCJZPSL6PNNt5EWi73rDmSv6Kc4&index=1
>modern Ring cycles suc--ACK!!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ls4ijgYJpY&list=OLAK5uy_l_t3UprhRUGUX7-YytcJ2jUckzoDgwWpY&index=35
>>130963766>no low G definetely not
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcTPtm5zd1YThis one has it, though it was a video, pretty sure it was just removed from youtube, like, these performances were removed from youtube: https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1Q441137Co/ (example of a blog post who linked to one of the youtube videos https://gmorder.livejournal.com/4799360.html)So yeah, maybe its in someone's hard drive out there
Max Regerhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9tAjYCYXMs&list=OLAK5uy_kY5Op7Xma-ob1TMGTyCcfYDyziWxG4Zas&index=2
Respighi.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T19mqDSR5ws
the name Max Reger reminds me of that scene in Good Will Hunting but instead of Ben Affleck singing "Re-TAIN-ERRR" I'm singing "Max REE-GERRRR"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHSYWIAAY2o
What did Schostakovich mean by his 15th string quartet? It sounds completely different from all the other 14.
>>130964830Out-avant-garding the avant-garde. Basically the modernist circlejerk.
>>130964830He went full abstract expressionist. It's like a Rothko painting in music form. And thank God he did, because it's amazing. Depressing as hell though. A string quartet requiem.
>>130962108Didn't like it but I don't like Mahler 4.
>>130964725Pretty.
now playingstart of George Lloyd: Violin Concerto No. 1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Voba8oNN5xU&list=OLAK5uy_kZgK-IS1-tujKCcDKEha78HbPc3UwS70I&index=2start of George Lloyd: Violin Concerto No. 2https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ecUHhiv4yrI&list=OLAK5uy_kZgK-IS1-tujKCcDKEha78HbPc3UwS70I&index=5start of George Lloyd: Cello Concertohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ve0FSu7b4Ek&list=OLAK5uy_kZgK-IS1-tujKCcDKEha78HbPc3UwS70I&index=8https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_kZgK-IS1-tujKCcDKEha78HbPc3UwS70I>It is significant that, when Lloyd turned his attention to writing concertante works for the violin, he avoided using full orchestral forces. His sensitivity to issues of balance and scrupulousness in scoring in his operas was matched by his determination that the solo instrument in his concertos should not be overwhelmed by thick orchestral textures. As he put it, 'I don't really like the relationship between the violin and the big modern orchestra. I hate to hear that poor little fiddle being totally swamped'.The more I listen to George Lloyd, particularly his symphonies, the more I think he might be one of the great composers of the 20th century. So let's finally find out how these concerti stack up. He also has some piano concertos too.
>>130963615I very recently discovered Henze as well. El Cimarron has a very demanding and varied score for the baritone singer and the incorporation of different styles sounds chaotic but not disjointed. Some more modern atonal bits but very colorful. Langwierige Weg in die Wohnung Der Naatscha Ungeheuer is also very solid.
>>130966350>I very recently discovered Henze as well.And you didn't tell us about it? Rude!Thanks for the suggestions.>El Cimarrón (The Runaway Slave) is a scenic vocal composition by the German composer Hans Werner Henze, written when the composer lived in Cuba>scenic vocal compositionThat's a new one.
>>130966393Yes it is quite an interesting one. As for other composers incorporating Latin American elements in a somewhat miasmic way I'd definitely recommend checking out Darius Milhaud. Bernstein did a good recording of his orchestral works.
>>130963796Sadly the orchestra is too thin and lightweight to make this a serious contender. The Ring should be lush, epic, powerful. While this has decent singing, it sounds like it was recorded in somebody's living room. No offense to the professional musicians in the orchestra. I'm sure if I saw it live I'd be more than pleased.
>Writes the same violin concerto 230 times>Its the best violin concerto you've ever heardEvery Romantic composer has 1-5 violin concertos that are excessively long and drawl on like soap operas. Through Bach into the discussion and it just gets even more embarrassing on their front
is The Beatles classical music?
>>130953797>not loving Beethoven's piano sonatas with every ounce of your being What a flaming turd
favorite chamber works?
https://youtu.be/cQJNLLjheRY
>>130967767https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzqN5IHEV-s&list=RDMzqN5IHEV-s&start_radio=1
>>130967625>*blocks your path*No matter how many he times he uses I get so giddy.
>>130967818i see
Handel was really the first Rock band if you think about it
>>130967801All of Beethoven's late string quartets.Bach's sonatas for harpsichord and violin. A bunch of Shosty's string quartets, can't remember the numbers.I'm partial to music for solo instruments when it comes to small-scale pieces, so I can't think of anything else off the top of my head.
Sibelius' symphonies are so unique. It's like they're from a different tradition entirely, like China.
>>130967801Schubert piano trio 2
>>130967801https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMwxMZaU_xUhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvcWf_pbg38https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Njap_FDpojAhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lUPqCOBgL4https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0g9JlHg5Kwhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bsGKpf41G0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HG3_qx46kZEhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0kA6yEXaG4https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01d6vr2szmYand that's just Brahms!
Boccherini! Boccherini!*Italian operatic orchestral backing plays softly*
>>130957284I definitely wouldn't agree with this at all but I respect your opinion. Maybe its because of how old he is, he's the only composer who can truly evoke a time gone by especially in his later tonal works. There is a soulful longing for the past in his works that is so genuine and touching
>>130968065Hmm, perhaps I'll give his music another run, at least the ones you linked in your first post.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkLYK_pxv18&list=OLAK5uy_m_4n-q8buY0UqpUfNZE6QCIKjtAMMN4wY&index=35damn Shostakovich sounds like THAT???
Everyday, there's like a hundred pieces I want to listen to. It's so hard to pick and choose sometimes :(And don't get me started on all the times I'll start something, switch to something else five minutes in, then repeat, then go back to the original, all because I want to listen to it all and I can't decide.
Brahms's Op. 118 No. 2 played in a dream I just had and I teared up from its beauty.
>>130967801Schubert quintetMozart clarinet quintet, concerto, string quintets and haydn quartetsBeethoven late quartetsDvorak piano trio No. 4 and piano quintetsBrahms violin sonata No. 2 and clarinet quintet
>>130968260exclude Mozart's clarinet concerto obviously. I just always list it after listing the quintet because they're a duo to me, it's force of habit.
Guys let's stop kidding ourselves here. Classical music is old and boring and I'm tired of pretending I find it interesting. I for one am putting classical aside and going back to listening to 90s hardcore techno.
favorite Beethoven String Quartet cycle?
>>130968329there's not a single cycle that satisfies me fully and I always opt for a different quartet for each piece, but if I had to pick I would go with Hagen Quartet's cycle overall
>>130953936Satie deserves good tier but I'll allow it.
>>130967801Schubert death and the maidenBrahms piano quintetChopin cello sonata
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMxoixfbMes
>>130968260>Schubert quintetthe trout quintet or the string quintet (D.956)?
>>130968409956. Borodin recording specially.
>>130968329Alban Berg
I can't imagine anyone seriously, without being under the spell of conformity, putting Beethoven's quartets above Schubert's>Inb4 Schubert loved Beethoven quartetsYeah, that doesn't matter.
>>130967801Haydn sunrise quartetMozart clarinet quintetBeethoven opp. 47, 59/1, 132Schubert string quintetSchumann piano quartetDebussy cello sonataRavel piano trioShostakovich string quartets 2, 4, 6, 10 & 15
Variation movement of Beethoven's sonata no.30 is much, much greater in every aspect to the variations of no.32. In fact it's not even comparable, yet some are acting like it is. The only advantage no.32's offers is the time signature and intricate rhythms, but that's one of the least interesting facts. And that third variation is just ridiculous.
>>130967801sticking to one per composerBeethoven Grosse FugeSchubert String QuintetBach Violin Sonata No. 3 in E major, BWV 1016Brahms Piano Quintet, Op. 34Franck Violin Sonata in A MajorDvorak Piano Trio No. 4 "Dumky"Mozart Clarinet QuintetRachmaninov Cello SonataTelemann Paris QuartetsFaure Piano Trio in D minor, Op. 120Chausson Concert For Violin, Piano & String Quartet, Op. 21 Borodin String Quartet No. 2 in D majorMessiaen Quatuor pour la fin du tempsJanáček String Quartet No. 1Schnittke Piano QuintetDebussy Cello SonataChopin Cello SonataHaydn’s String Quartet in C major, Op. 76, No. 3 ("Emperor") Shostakovich String Quartet No. 8 in C minor, Op. 110Bruch String Quintet in E-Flat MajorCorelli Trio Sonatas, Op. 5Vivaldi Trio Sonata in D minor, Op. 1, No. 12, RV 63, "La Folia"Glazunov String Quintet in A major, Op. 39Widor Suite for Flute and Piano, Op. 34Roslavets Chamber SymphonyZelenka Trio Sonata No. 6 in C minorSaint-Saens Clarinet Sonata in E-flat Major, Op. 167Martinu Nonet, H. 374 Myaskovsky Cello Sonata No. 1Dussek Piano Quintet in F minor, Op. 41 Bartok String Quartet No. 4Buxtehude Sonata No. 2 in D major, BuxWV 267Schumann Piano Quintet in E-flat major, Op. 44Sibelius String Quartet in D minor, Op. 56, "Voces intimae"Boccherini String Quintet in E Major, Op. 11, No. 5, G. 275Hindemith String Quartet No. 4, Op. 22Händel Flute Sonata in B Minor, HWV 367bStravinsky Octet for Wind InstrumentsMendelssohn String Quartet No. 6 in F minor, Op. 80Vaughan Williams Phantasy QuintetTaneyev Piano Quintet in G minor, Op. 30Reger Clarinet Quintet in A major, Op. 146Elgar Piano Quintet in A minor, Op. 84Koechlin Paysages et MarinesNielsen Wind Quintet, Op. 43Medtner Violin Sonata No. 1Hummel Piano Quintet in E-flat minor, Op. 87Britten String Quartet No. 2 in C major, Op. 36Grieg Violin Sonata No. 3 in C MinorIves String Quartet No. 2Kalliwoda String Quartet No. 3 in G major, Op. 90i probably forgot some things
>>130962723You're retarded. Hope you get better.
>>130967801Telemann Tafelmusik, Essercizii Musici, Concerts & Suites 1734, Paris QuartetsBoccherini String Quintets and Flute Quintets
>>130969052i agree. mainly because the theme from op. 109 is just so beautiful, whereas the theme from 111 is kind of bland
>>130968446Beethoven has the benefit of 16 good ones. Schubert only has the late quartets. And I prefer Beethoven's late quartets anyhow. Easy choice for me.
Liszt
Is the Faust play worth reading? Seems like it mindbroke all of the german composers in the romantic period
>>130969892One of the greatest works of literature of all-time. I like the David Luke translation.
>>130969892Yes, it's extraordinary.
>>130969892Part 1 yes. Part 2? Meh.
>>130970031Part 2 is great. The classical Walpurgisnacht alone is spectacularly beautiful writing.
now playingProkofiev: Piano Sonata No. 1 in F Minor, Op. 1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnmTxecCMRA&list=OLAK5uy_nGOOIU-ywtyCO4EX-tVvAOpOCkkUJ_m9A&index=2Prokofiev: Piano Sonata No. 3 in A Minor, Op. 28https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6LWDKdUpCDo&list=OLAK5uy_nGOOIU-ywtyCO4EX-tVvAOpOCkkUJ_m9A&index=3start of Prokofiev: Piano Sonata No. 4 in C Minor, Op. 29https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKYdLXOLpgQ&list=OLAK5uy_nGOOIU-ywtyCO4EX-tVvAOpOCkkUJ_m9A&index=4start of Prokofiev: 10 Pieces from Romeo and Juliet, Op. 75https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqCNmmotUMc&list=OLAK5uy_nGOOIU-ywtyCO4EX-tVvAOpOCkkUJ_m9A&index=6https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_nGOOIU-ywtyCO4EX-tVvAOpOCkkUJ_m9A
>>130961001Mozart is the greatest composer who ever lived, listen to it more until you get it
>>130970193Mozart is mediocrity.
>Ernst Toch: Complete Symphonieswho dathttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i73dL59-zrY&list=OLAK5uy_l0Zbe7kDI9SjT6DoBXBiGwfv1YzIhh_lc&index=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfjdQihhWvI&list=OLAK5uy_l0Zbe7kDI9SjT6DoBXBiGwfv1YzIhh_lc&index=6He also has a piano concerto and lots of string quartets. On a cursory listen, seems like music for a true modernist.
>tfw only enough time to listen to 16-20 symphonies in a single waking dayso sad
What would you say is the worst piece in common repertoire?
>>130970803Any piece by Mozart.
>>130970816
Karl is the best orchestral bach interpreter, sviatoslav is the best keyboard bach interpreter. Does that solve the Richter vs Richter debate?
>>130970803Debussy's La Mer is painfully dull.
>>130970299Obscure composer anon, tell us when you find a good 60+ minute symphony.
>>130970921>Obscure composer anonthat's why I'm sharing!>tell us when you find a good 60+ minute symphony.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGyj47lW7iY&list=OLAK5uy_kHkFu26iGj4iYvN-DksEBCUTiH2WoJo4w&index=14
Do you treat movements as disconnected parts?
>>130970955I wouldn't program a single movement or split one off on a playlist if that's what you're asking. Aside from Mahler 5's Adagietto for a funeral.
Beethoven's 8th is not even the best symphony he wrote in f major. Why do contrarians like it so much?
>>130970878No. Cortot is the best orchestral Bach interpreter, Feinberg is the best keyboard Bach interpreter. Or if we're being more honest it's likely Busoni, from what we can hear.
>>130971018because beethoven himself once remarked it was much better than the other one (symphony 7), and people appear to take that statement at face value
>>130970955i listen to movements on their own all the time
>>130970803anything by tchaikovsky
>>130971018Because it is objectively better than any other symphony he ever composed. Less dull, more appealing, simple as.
>>1309711629th and 3rd are better
>>130971282Incorrect. 3rd is arguably an equal, 9th is not.
>>1309714299th is better than the 3rd
>>130969892Only in the original German I'm afraid.
>>130971521Doesn't matter, bitch. 8th rules, fuck the 9th.
Home boy here says Haydn 76 symphony is the best he's heard. I can't read the whole article though, I suspect it sucks ass and is utterly indistinguishable from every other symphony Hadyn wrotehttps://spectator.com/article/the-greatest-symphony-that-no-ones-heard-of/
8th drools, 9th rules.
>>130971605archive breaks the paywallhttps://archive.is/TN1eOanyway that's the same critic who once called the last movement of Brahms 4 boring so take that for what it's worth.
>>130971638Sounds like he's just ragebaiting for clicks.
What is the classical equivalent of We Are Charlie Kirk
>>130969892do you know German?>No.Learn it.>Yes.Read Faust.
>>130971657Art of Fugue
>>130971657nonsensical question
>>130971665Lol. Why?
Beethoven's 9th is a masterpiece... until the last movement. The last movement is a steaming pile of shit. Painfully naive message and awkward vocal writing. Those last minutes are just endlessly wailing. A choral symphony is an oxymoron.
>>130971657Chopin ballade in G minor, similae vibes fr
Liszthttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygjuESnDMUs&list=OLAK5uy_loU0mLndrlwqAQH7W1z-3DFV1N4Oj3xLM&index=6
This Janowski Schumann cycle any good?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ku5JFUeG_ck&list=OLAK5uy_kpLPEPYKsACZEdgUBEU_E9Lw3Df5EFB48&index=16What about his Beethoven cycle?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XddfHpZSpA&list=OLAK5uy_nBe9HLy75XIxrnFSbVi9YCJL8z96XuWTE&index=28
A lot of these older piano recordings have the kind of piano tone I really dislike: tinny, clangy, cold, sharp. As if built on top of a harpsichord base. Fortunately you don't see this piano tone in modern recordings anymore. Everyone utilizes the more pianistic sound: warm, colorful, sensitive, beautiful.
this is the worst pastiche butchering of Mozart I've ever heard in my entire life. Not even youtube edm remixes would've dared.
>>130970921>tell us when you find a good 60+ minute symphonyhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJHtWl-zFto&list=OLAK5uy_kOOsQx9esfY5nWjK2KyAZiv2dVwEQ0pbc&index=1
now playingstart of Beethoven: Symphony No. 7 in A Major, Op. 92https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2k-5qqyH3-k&list=OLAK5uy_l55lBOM2SxuNQtyWgOVgVPc0WkVLdWVbw&index=27start of Beethoven: Symphony No. 8 in F Major, Op. 93https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXPx4s6KHbI&list=OLAK5uy_l55lBOM2SxuNQtyWgOVgVPc0WkVLdWVbw&index=31start of Beethoven: Symphony No. 9 in D Minor, Op. 125 "Choral"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=datUb-odq_8&list=OLAK5uy_l55lBOM2SxuNQtyWgOVgVPc0WkVLdWVbw&index=34https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_l55lBOM2SxuNQtyWgOVgVPc0WkVLdWVbwidc this sounds good to me (so far)For fun, I might do a cursory survey of 21st century Beethoven symphony cycles. Haitink/LPO, Thielemann, Rattle, Paavo Jarvi, Jansons, Chailly, Vanska, Blomstedt/Gewandhaus, Noseda, I think the Zinman and Abbado/BPO also came out in the 21st century? I've tried most of them before and have opinions, but I'm gonna approach them with a fresh perspective and a blank slate. No HIP sets tho
>>130972143The most embarrassing post in history of /classical/.
>>130969452I hate to nitpick, but works for solo instruments are technically not chamber music
>>130972522Fuck off.
>>130969452i kneel
>>130972522>>130969452Actually nvm, I realized the sonatas you mentioned aren't for solo instruments.
>>130972528Lol just sayin', chill
Has anyone here listened to all of Langgaard's piano music?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SGnU3xR3cs&list=OLAK5uy_mIi6fLVYfMcFmZP-nAnjCfNhL07mL1XSU&index=1Comfy.
Schubert is better than Beethoven
>>130972607incorrect, and in this case, i don't even respect your opinion
>>130972607lolnoMr. Repetition is most definitely not Beethoven's equal, let alone better than him.
Strausshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zt4wpsm5zmk&list=OLAK5uy_lz-awPJlktbMQj0jxex_iKy1EAh3JaYTU&index=4
>>130972607Opinions like this should be punishable by law
the ultimate debate,Prokofiev's Piano Sonata 8https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JprF658RNQvs.Scriabin's Piano Sonata 5https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDTgj_69JKA
>>130972607Correct.>>130972614>>130972615>>130972641Incorrect.
>>130972607the sheer stupidity and contrarianism of this thread has no limit.
I really wish some people would stop sharing their opinions and keep them to themselves instead
excuse me, EXCUSE me, contemporary classical coming thruuuhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjphn_1t9OI&list=OLAK5uy_njH48LYMsixNu3tqJIbjb3UN2xGxNvzbU&index=1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2U5wL_aBfc&list=OLAK5uy_njH48LYMsixNu3tqJIbjb3UN2xGxNvzbU&index=2https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OF4QBX0Ku88&list=OLAK5uy_njH48LYMsixNu3tqJIbjb3UN2xGxNvzbU&index=5>Torke (b. 1961) writes some of the more interesting minimalism being done today. His punctuated rhythms are always framed around a tonal, melodic core and are as colorful as the titles of the works. But Torke is a bit more than a minimalist; he knows jazz inside and out and makes use of syncopation and even Modern dance rhythms as in Ecstatic Orange. The performance by the Baltimore Symphony Orchestra is quite good, but the booklet notes are obscure and of no help to anyone. Still, the music is what counts. Start here if Torke is new to you. -- Paul Cook
Schubert vs Beethoven, let's see:>symphoniesWe all know it's Schubert, right?>piano sonatas and other keyboard worksSchubert.>liederSchubert.>choral musicBeethoven>chamber musicDefintely Schubert.I count 4 for Schubby and 1 for Beet, we have a winner bois.
>>130972676We get it, you're not a gentile, good for you
>>130972699>>symphonies>We all know it's Schubert, right?but anon, only three of his symphonies are even listenable, and the third one (the 5th) is pretty forgettable Mozartian slop!
>>130972687>>130972700Thank you conformist zippelfaggotist>>130972711Still better than all 9 Beethovenslop thoughbeit!
>>130972716>Still better than all 9 Beethovenslop thoughbeit!oh you're just trolling. carry on then, just let me leave first
>>130972734Well said, conformist
I listen to Schubert when I want to be mildly amused, not when I want to hear serious music.
>>130972716Considering Schubert's love for Beethoven was so intense that his dying wish was to be buried near him, it's safe to say even Schubert would have thought your preference for his music over Beethoven's is retarded.
>>130972797+ on his death bed, he requested an ensemble play Beethoven's String Quartet No. 14! he wanted to hear that even over his own music!
>>130972776>>130972797Conformism is far worse than contrarianism btw. Schubert is in fact a better composer, yet your small, hyoer-social monkey minds cannot comprehend the truth.>>130972818And I will request a Schubert quartet.
>>130972818maybe he just wanted to feign humility
>>130972833>And I will request a Schubert quartet.Which only hurts Schubert's casezing!
>>130972843How will me choosing a better composer hurt or heal anyone's case?
>>130972833>conformism is far worse than contrarianism btwThe fact that you're viewing this through the lense of conformism vs. contrarianism says a lot about you.Lemme guess, you're the moron who spams Scriabin all over the place.
Some of Buchbinder's Beethoven piano sonatas, from his second cycle with Sony/RCA11, Op. 22https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDZfz0IKvIs&list=OLAK5uy_norzNDXYGVytIuQkqE6iItJWy5_0mauqE&index=3712, Op. 26https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJjKy6Z3BRw&list=OLAK5uy_norzNDXYGVytIuQkqE6iItJWy5_0mauqE&index=4113, Op. 27 No. 1https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qegt9X3ou_I&list=OLAK5uy_norzNDXYGVytIuQkqE6iItJWy5_0mauqE&index=4514, Op. 27 No. 2https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ef97Enrptvs&list=OLAK5uy_norzNDXYGVytIuQkqE6iItJWy5_0mauqE&index=4915, Op. 28https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWcs9HAwXoI&list=OLAK5uy_norzNDXYGVytIuQkqE6iItJWy5_0mauqE&index=51
>>130972857Obviously the joke is, given the source, your deathbed mark of quality is actually a detriment. Use your head, anon!
>>130972697This sounds like nouveau riche elevator music trying very hard to impress the old money traditional classical music.
>>130972365sounds boring and lifeless like all Nelsons
>>130972940It's fun. It's like the 1812 Overture or Music for the Royal Fireworks or Slavonic Dances or Rapsodie Espagnole or Pomp and Circumstance Marches or whatever your pick of jaunty, festive, percussion-heavy orchestral piece that's very accessible for the postmodern age.
>>130972981If that's how you feel, fair enough. Here's Thielemann's 7th,https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2R3avmsvfrs&list=OLAK5uy_mqYmSuWKOWt69xtEdNCnrfQU0bG9onmi8&index=1That is an example of dull and lifeless. The Nelsons is far better in my opinion. But hey, I'm not one to defend Nelsons anyhow, so if you don't like it, then that's alright.
>>130972699>>130972711>uses "Mozartian" as a derogatory term>uses modern internet lingo ("slop")>sincerily entertaining a discussion on fucking Schubert (known for a symphony and a half) having better symphonies than Beethovencan't we ban all people under the age of like, 25? these posts make us look like morons.
>>130973052>>uses "Mozartian" as a derogatory termOnly in the sense that it's a generic version *of* Mozart.
>>130973028They're both terrible.
>>130973066*shrugs*I suppose I'm more amenable to contemporary conductors and musicians and their interpretations and performances than most.One more, what do you think of this one,https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RS1wuiwbsQ&list=OLAK5uy_n_qzTt3hHzDqdGePVHSHrniSeKVRFs23I&index=1
Pierre-Laurent Aimard's Bachhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9GSZ4kih6I&list=OLAK5uy_n4NWjgpNX1J7BnOKgSB7kySQLRAHoHQz0&index=25
if you don't like Brahms' Violin Sonatas, well, anon, I don't wanna know uhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVgyjjPPkAg&list=OLAK5uy_mO-HUHeJZKEPHPxBXXf_bogZQ5bA7BBCs&index=4>There are many recordings of these three masterpieces of the sonata literature, but if two artists can communicate a personal response to them, another one is always welcome. This recording is certainly a valuable addition to the discography. Chung and Frankl have obviously thought carefully about the music and feel it strongly; their approach shows great respect for the composer's style and intentions as well as genuine emotional involvement. Equally at home with Brahms's classical austerity, romantic ardor and autumnal mellowness, they identify completely with the expansive, wistful lyricism of the first sonata; the gracious poetry and warmth of the second; the urgent, dramatic intensity of the third. They favor flowing tempi; long phrases; discreet, subtle liberties; simple, direct expressiveness. Balance and ensemble are excellent; both players are technically impeccable. Chung's tone is beautiful at all times; warm and radiant, it glows and shimmers. --Edith Eisler
>>130973088I don't care for this either. It's just way too facile and smooth, zero grit to anything. It sounds like an orchestra going through the motions with no vision for the work at all.
>>130973052Can't we ban all the conformists instead? Fuck them.
>>130973306Brahms' chamber music is solid, but his symphonies just make me wish I was listening to Beethoven instead. Nahm sayin'?
>>130973338Both make me wish I was listening to Mahler instead.
>>130973325Fair enough, I have that same response to many contemporary/modern recordings of standard repertoire -- no heat, no passion -- so I feel you. Thanks for giving all three a try.
>>130973327Having unconventional opinions doesn't make you interesting, anon. In your case, it just makes you seem like an edgy, clueless teenager trying to find his identity.And don't get me wrong, disliking Beethoven's music isn't necessarily juvenile. Even John Cage's take on Beethoven is acceptable since it's rooted in a genuine (and, I must say, somewhat reasonable) ideology. But going so far as to say Beethoven is slop and Schubert is better while criticizing those who disagree as mere conformists is some of the most childish shit I've read on /mu/.Nta btw
>>130973338I actually find Brahms' symphonies easier listening, but that's only because I'm all about the romantic era and can listen to anything from it at any time, any mood, whereas anything from the classical era or with its influence, including a lot of Beethoven, I have to be in the mood for.Like I can put on Brahms 2 whenever and enjoy it but Beethoven 5 or 8, eh, only on certain days.
>>130973347Not a big fan of neurotic rambling, personally.
>>130973338Not really, no.
>>130973376To my ears, Brahms sounds strikingly similar to Beethoven. He even tossed in a clear reference to Beethoven's 9th in his first symphony. His symphonies became less derivative as time went on, but I don't think he was ever able to escape Beethoven's shadow.
Bach-Milone.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aczu9BBfl4k
>>130973439Brahms is in the shadow of Beethoven but not Mozart, that's the key, whereas Mozart and even Haydn is alive throughout a lot if not most of Beethoven. Not that I hate Mozart or Haydn, but again, I have to be in the mood for it, whereas anything strictly romantic I can enjoy whenever.
>>130973439Never felt this. For me Brahms occupies a very different emotional world to Beethoven. Even his Beethoven references are absorbed into this e.g. the rhythmic motif from Beethoven 5 is much more oppressive in the first movement of Brahms 1.
just cancelled my plans to go out so I can stay home and listen to classical while hanging out with ya'll
>>130973511
the ultimate debate,Edwin Fischer's WTChttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iiBkDkozwfAvsSamuil Feinberg's WTChttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzerJmdStq8
>>130973471Fair enough. I've been listening to picrel over the past few days and, while I've come to appreciate Mozart more as I've gotten older, I still find the majority of his music a bit too bouncy, joyful and frivolous. It's also rather formulaic and monotonous.
>>130973553based tragic soul anon
>>130973553When it comes to Mozart's solo piano music, I'm with Gould: not all that interesting to listen to, but incredibly fun to play yourself.
>>130973368Having conventional opinions doesn't make you interesting, anon. In your case, it just makes you seem like an edgy, clueless teenager trying to fit in with the rest of the herd.
>>130973505Any recommendations for recordings? I was listening to Chailly's recording with the Concertgebouw yesterday, which I thought was quite good.
>>130973576It does seem like it would be fun to play.>>130973583That makes no sense.I don't like Beethoven's music to fit in, child - and I think you'd be hard-pressed to find someone in the current year who does.
>>130973592>I was listening to Chailly's recording with the Concertgebouw yesterday,huh, didn't even know Chailly had a Brahms cycle with the RCO, I thought his newer one with the Gewandhaus was his first and onlyand NTA but,Levine (either this first cycle with Chicago or his later one with the VPO)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yPu09Dny1nw&list=OLAK5uy_mGRsxGtZ7-c-GNa4ElGjZxllHxS3IEOfs&index=9or if you prefer the old school, here's Jochumhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6FxvD0FqpNw&list=OLAK5uy_m95xT6FYFEirL0Mqca8ISoK8psa4ViOdw&index=7both are top-tier sets imo
>>130973638Yeah you do. You try to fit in with the classical herd.
can we stop trying to bully each other? argue over opinions, fine, but abusive claims of "you're an edgy contrarian!" or "you're a mindless sheep!" are pointless, harmful, and insipid.
>>130973640I'll check at least one of 'em out, thanks. And yeah, I actually own both of Chailly's Brahms cycles as they're included in picrel. It was one of the best music purchases I've ever made - Chailly even makes some of Mahler's work tolerable to me.
>>130973470Not sure what the point of this arrangement is, the orchestra was so subdued it might as well not have been there. The lackluster interpretation didn't help either.
>>130973669Pff just what a conformist would say :)
>>130973691That's a dope set! and yeah can't go wrong with Chailly's Mahler.
>>130973702You gotta standout and put your own individual twist on things somehow, especially with Bach, whose music lends itself well to arrangements.>>130973470I liked it! So far my experiences with the violinist Joshua Bell has been positive.
>>130973716I admit I conform to kindness, civility, and the propagation of intellectual mingling!
>>130973767Refreshing tbqh
I conform to nothing except the minimal that is required of me to convey my thoughts to you utter imbeciles. Listening to Lord Scriabin and revelling in my individualistic sophistication.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kzk0XDWSYk
>>130973864I fuckin knew it lolHaving a strong interest in Chopinchungus is always a bright red flag. I mean, I just can't take anyone seriously who'd name the mystical mustachioed manchild as a favorite.
>>130973327the way you talk is detrimental to the quality of conversation regardless of the content of your opinions
>>130973957Imagine falling for a ragebait thar obvious
now playing, time to start exploring Milhaudstart of Darius Milhaud: Symphony No. 1, Op. 210https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtsQQOo8leE&list=OLAK5uy_mayDZPBoFdWH1rkScBSP7WmKMX8P4oopc&index=2start of Darius Milhaud: Symphony No. 4, Op. 281https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aX2-cbv7gAE&list=OLAK5uy_mayDZPBoFdWH1rkScBSP7WmKMX8P4oopc&index=5I don't think I've ever seen such a high opus number for a first symphony. 210 lol, sheesh.one community reviewer writes,>With thirteen symphonies to his credit, Darius Milhaud (1892-1974) can probably be considered the leading French symphonist of the twentieth century. In describing his influences, Milhaud stated "My musical culture is determined exclusively by Latin-Mediterranean civilization, which is already explained by the fact that I come from a very old Jewish family of the Provence. Mediterranean music, especially Italian music, has always said a great deal to me; German music as good as nothing." I think this is pretty accurate, as Milhaud's music is as far away from Bruckner and Wagner as you can get.>Milhaud's music is primarily lighthearted and is filled with lots of skipping rhythms and colorful orchestration. The music often shifts in texture and in mood, often quite unexpectedly, as if Milhaud lost interest in what he was doing and wanted to try a new idea. Milhaud utilizes a highly contrapuntal style, not completely different from the contrapuntal style utilized by Villa-Lobos in his symphonies, with violins swirling about, often at the tip top of their range, while the brass or woodwinds are doing something else altogether. Milhaud's music is generally tonal, but with so much occurring at the same time, dissonances abound. This style is not universally appealing, as it demands a great deal from the listener. Depending on my mood, I may describe this music as sunny and interesting, or (if I am not in the mood) rambling and distracting.
Classical Era Anons, what you think of the symphonies of Carl Friedrich Abel?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPz3zAlwPGE
>>130974014It's not obvious considering there are people on this board who are like caricatures of pretentious nitwits - the Scriautist being one of them.
>>130973532i think they're a good contrast to one another Feinberg is a more traditionalist romantic approach whereas Fischer is that middle ground between the romanticist approach and the incoming modern approach of the early 20th century
Wagnerhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3AEOOZSLaYo&list=OLAK5uy_lmv_Tj1aaxDvqnaY28XWivFI2UHfl41VY&index=1
>>130973532There's nothing to debate about. Feinberg's a master, Fischer is a kiddo.
>>130974437Nah Fischer is based, he is the only pianist that Furtwangler felt comfortable with as an accompanist, and he still has the best Schubert Impromptus on disc, and some of the best MozartHe was just a little studio shy sometimes.
>>130973532I don't listen to anything even remotely Romantic-adjacent, so no performers born before 1940.
>>130974667>Furthackler
>>130974703>i only listen to trashWeird admission but okay
>>130973532Fischer, no question But I'll take Hewitt or Richter over both.
>>130974802sorry but not all of us can be underaged white bisexuals
>>130974667>Furtwangler>Rach's favorite conductors to work with were Nikisch, Mahler, Mengelberg, and Fiedler. However, he was not very fond of Furtwangler. Not paying attention to Furtwängler, who was rehearsing a symphony, Rachmaninoff sat down at the piano, looked at his watch, and thunderously struck a few chords. Perplexed, Furtwängler stopped. He looked at Rachmaninoff, who showed his watch and said, ‘My rehearsal time was ten-thirty.’ With no further exchange the rehearsal of the concerto commenced. After five minutes or so, Rachmaninoff walked to the conductor’s stand and began to conduct. The orchestra had two conductors – Furtwängler, bewildered, and Rachmaninoff, swearing in Russian.
>>130974803Horrible, terrible, disgusting taste. Classical ain't for you, try pop music instead. Marilyn Manson has a new album it might interest youhttps://www.youtube.com/channel/UCbirjI1K3MGu0-Y1gTBNR5w
>>130974882No one is impressed by your taste in ancient recordings, anon. Please go be a pretentious dipshit somewhere else.
>>130974895I heard Kanye has a new album or whatever, you should go check it out. Leave classical music to men.
no new? ;o
fien guess i'll make theNEW>>130975394>>130975394>>130975394NEW
the vagner meme
