HOLY FUCK
>>2057863
>MD-11Death Cruiser returning for one last crash
>>2057863Better video
>>2057862As someone who has extensively fixated and researched on DC-10/MD-11's shifty history and accidents, this ones hitting hard.Will this accelerate the retirement of these older MD-11s? They were just slated to be kept in service into the 2030s due to shortages.
>a shelter in place order has been issued for a five mile radius around the airportis that normal?
>>2057863>>2057864>>2057871pls post with sound on /wsg/ I can't hear the screams
>24 years old>MD-11s stopped being made in 2000was this the last one off the line or something?
>>2057868First thing I thought of when I heard it was an MD 11. Why the fuck do they still allow anyone to fly those things?
Here's my best effort at the impact area, extrapolated from the videos and pics I found online
>>2057877Presumably to make it easier for emergency crews to get around.
>>2057885OR it could've been carrying tonnes of hazmat!!
>>2057886It was carrying a full load of jet fuel, which is a pretty big hazmat concern on it's own. Also looks like it plowed into a GFL Environmental waste facility, which is pretty nasty as well.
>>2057884Who would ever want to build any sort of building that close to the end of a runway?
>Another case of a good flight crew and unknown number of people on the ground being killed by the DC-10 family.This has gone on for far too long.
>>2057888cheap land
Pratt or GE motors? I hear the UPS Pratts were on the way out
>>2057888it's mostly junkyards and dive bars for junkyard workers
Anyone know if Stooges got hit in the debris field? I always loved going to see the titties out there, really good burgers for a wet t-shirt bar.
>>2057884Thank you anon. I was looking for this and even the local news outlets are just reposting stories from their national parent network, so there's virtually no identifying information available.
>>2057896still at risk of burning down if the fire spreads
Americans are incompetent.More news at 11.
>>2057868More Death II
>>2057900Someday your country will have airplanes too, don't worry little guy.
>>2057903>ONLY countries with mayor plane crashes the last 2 years>USA>IndiaThe absolute fucking state.
>>2057862SDF is a major UPS hub in the US. Guessing they have to divert all the flights currently on their way there. How bad is this going to fuck up the supply chain?
>>2057905jeet boeing coder's fault.
>>2057905That isn't even remotely true
>>2057902WE GAAN
Stitched version/video timeline of the crash.
Suboptimal flight condition
why didnt he pull up?is he stupid?
>>2057915engine probably fell offsimilar to AA Flight 191https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Airlines_Flight_191
>>2057894GE
>>2057871Tell them it was me
Boeing?
>>2057863Why the fuck can people not keep the camera pointed on screen correctly for fuck sakes
>>2057916Looks like it.
>>2057929>show plane>whoops, my hand slipped!>show big boomthe video is fake and gay
why didn't they take their engine with them?
Is crazy watching america down spiral live.How the mighty have fallen.
>>2057864>mutt ''''''''aviation'''''''they've taken to napalming themselves now in penance for Vietnam
>>2057913what's the point of a trijet if you can't take off on 2 engines?
>>2057939Thrust asymmetry is a bitch, if it was tail eng it wouldn't be a problem. Then again, it would take less than 5 min for the fire to reach cargo or melt the wing. Wouldn't make much of a difference in this case.
>>2057944I think a lot more went wrong than just thrust asymmetry m8
>>2057932We don't have cameras tracking every takeoff and landing, at all international airports. FAA niggas are fucking usless
>>2057939There's a good chance that whatever caused engine yeeting to also mangle wing surface and reduced wing lift. Once it started dipping that low to the ground with fully loaded plane they couldn't recover.
>>2057945yes?>Then again, it would take less than 5 min for the fire to reach cargo or melt the wing
>>2057944>Then again, it would take less than 5 min for the fire to reach cargo or melt the wing. Wouldn't make much of a difference in this case.it would mean not crashing on takeoff which is what anon is thinking about so yes it makes a difference
>>2057929You can see before he zooms in that it's from inside an airport vehicle, probably a fuel truck or something, you can tell the guy is driving with one hand (and turning) and filming with the other, he probably just saw something looked weird and decided to film it while trying not to crash. I tried to find the exact vehicle from the playback but it only shows aircraft
>>2057939Looks like #1 came off and #2 at the minimum was compressor stalling, mightve only been flying on a single motor, number 3
>>2057939That fucker was filled to bursting with fuel and cargo. Likely close to MTOW. #1 was violently ripped off, debris very likely being ingested into #2. Thrust asymmetry, likely lift asymmetry, past V1, only one engine putting out full power. They were doomed the moment that engine let go.The stars aligned to smite that plane in particular.
>>2057880Planes have long service lifes, like 3, 4 decades of service. Usually old passenger planes get sold to very poor passenger airlines in third world countries (who can't afford newer ones) or cargo companies (who pay for a convertion).Dunno how the economics work out as these older planes have higher fuel consumption, but it must make sense as they keep using it.
>>2057979>Dunno how the economics work out as these older planes have higher fuel consumptioncargo companies don't care that much
>>2057979first world airline with new planes goes bankrupt and the lender can get the plane back, the pensioners can get fucked but who cares about old people, what are they going to do, wave some protest signs? there's an easy solution to that (picrel)third world flag carrier goes bankrupt and they pay the pensioners first because old people are kind of respected in those kinds of cultures unlike in the west where they're considered unpleasant trash not to be talked about in polite company, so the pensioners get paid and the lender is left holding the bag, no one is going to underwrite that arrangement
>>2057981oops forgot my picrel, say hello to my little fren
>>2057981nigga what the fuck are you on about
Are there any pictures of the crash scene taken today? I presume they've gotten the fire knocked down and only hotspots remain. I'd like to see it without smoke or flame.I feel terrible for the crew and those on the ground.
>>2057933DEI plane, it identified as a twinjetthere was only one thing left for it to do when it realised it still didn't pass
>>2057905most fatal crash in the last 10yrs+ was in korea
So I know after V1 you're supposedly all-in, but is that only for one engine? What if 2/3 engines fail? What if you can tell the engine actually fell off? There must be conditions where you know you're fucked if you continue and trying to abort overrunning the runway is the least worst option?
>>2057921Based
>>2057913>The low ri-der drives a little slower>*playful brass music intensifies*
>>2057992if you have enough runway you reject takeoff, but in this case they didn't; so you gotta punch it and hope for the bestI was reading that if they rejected the takeoff, they'd skirt off the runway and probably crash directly into the UPS warehouse instead, which they probably decided to try and avoid the company warehouse
>>2057879>>>/wsg/6020993
>>2057992Realistically no. Every second past V1 is eating hundreds of feet AND adding hundreds of feet needed to stop. If the engine blew right at V1 and they aborted they might possibly have been able to grind to a halt in the grass, but id give them a 90%+ chance of going into the warehouse, especially given startle factor
Now that planes keep crashing all over the place is it time to return to a more civilised method of aerial transportation?
>>2058002Looks to me like they've got space there for an EMAS but maybe too expensive since it's kentucky
>>2057880Cargo airlines love MD-11 because it has very high maximum take-off weight and can handle lots of very heavy air cargos.
>>2057992>What if 2/3 engines fail? What if you can tell the engine actually fell off? There must be conditions where you know you're fucked if you continue and trying to abort overrunning the runway is the least worst option?100% fatal. The mistake you are making here is you know these things now, but they didn't know at the time. You lose an engine at or after V1, that is treated as an inflight emergency. For a normal emergency (lol), taking it into the air is safer because you can still climb even at MTOW. It is 100% for sure you don't have the runway to stop. They were clearly trying to rotate. They had no idea the engine was gone, same as AA191. All they are going to have time to see is adverse engine indications. There is only one flight where the decision to abort and accept a runway overrun was the correct decision: https://avherald.com/h?article=4a5ecf6a. That incident was a Sully-esque combination of everything going right. For UPS2976, those guys know there isn't enough room to accept an overrun; it's an airport they are at all the time. They should know it very well.
>>2057977>Likely close to MTOWI hope this won't delay the delivery of my concrete piano and anvils
Are you okay?
The plane was at a maintenance hangar in San Antonio, Texas for 6 weeks starting in Sep 3, 2025.
>>2058015ruh rohsome poor amt is sweating bullets right now
The engine that detached is from one of the wings not the center.
>>2058012Buster wolf!
>>2057868and it was an engine detachment too
>>2057901>More Death II>Revenge of Death Contraption 10
>>2058022These just aren't funny here but they'd do well on reddit
>>2057979>>2057980MD11 fits in the same sized sort parking as B767s and A300s, which speeds up the loading/unloading for UPS, as opposed to dragging cargo out to remote parking on the south side of SDF. Plus for domestic operations, UPS has the MD11s sitting all day, as opposed to pax airlines that are flying more often, thus total fuel used per day is artificially lower because the planes fly less.>>2057992No way to plan for every outcome, >>2058009 is 99% correct (Ameristar isn't the only "justified" abort past V1) and the inherent risk of flying is that you can hit a flock of geese and be forced into a water landing, or have batteries catch fire and burn your jet down like UPS6, some things are just the risk of doing business. I'd expand and say the only reason to abort past V1 is the aircraft is "unflyable" which is very rare but historically has happened. Plenty of hand wringing is always to be had after any mishap over what "justified" and "unflyable" really mean. But it's all about pilot judgement when you're rolling fast, the aircraft isn't flying right and the pavement is getting shorter.https://flightsafety.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/asw_mar10_p57-64.pdf
>>2058017>>2058015a lot of the MD-11s are maintenance there>.t native who sees them at KSAT
>>2057970Looking at slowed down footage of it going down the runway, it seems this might very well be the case from the small bursts coming from the right. They were basically doomed.
https://x.com/Breaking911/status/1986254239921021042video shot from Grade Lane at approx 38.148084, -85.736455 note the blue awning outside and the road markings match. By this point the MD already scraped the roof of the UPS supply chain building, but it appears all the gear are still intact. Using street view it looks like it was the oil storage at GFL Environmental that was what finally did it in. The jet was flying straight and level until the left wing clipped the tanks at GFL, and then immediately rolled hard left.
>>2058049>scraped the roofI'm still trying to wrap my head around how they pulled that off. Did the tail strike the roof and they just barely cleared the warehouse before hitting the ground?
It will be interesting to know if the engine fuck up damaged the flight control systems. If it's the case, they were almost doom, AA 191 all over again.If I was the maintenance technicians who worked on that engine, I would not sleep well.
>>2058050>I'm still trying to wrap my head around how they pulled that off.The will to live is a hell of a drug. See JAL123.
>remote maintenance from India
engine is completely gone
>>2058064At this point, the only relation this has to AA191 is the engine and pylon separation. The dashcam video >>2058079 shows left wing slats and flaps intact and ease of control in maintaining wings level. Whether #2 was compressor stalled but running, or completely fodded out will be up to the NTSB to sort out, but the jet would've probably survived and climbed out normally if #2 was producing takeoff thrust.
what were their last words?
>>2058097>I should have bidded for the A300 Jokes aside, RIP
>>2058097>It's over
>>2058097>Why did you flip the "detach engine switch"!?>...I didn't
>>2058097would /n/ have the presence of mind to yell "we gaan" during a 100% fatal crash?
>>2058114I just make “We gaan” the last item on my ‘Before Takeoff Final’ checklist
>>2058107ah fuck was this a south korean flight where something like this happened?
>>2058126It was the recent Air India crash
>>2058107jej
>>2058009>>2058036Another interesting post-V1 abort: https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/324000In this case, the plane actually became airborne but landed back in the runway and overran.
>>2058081One thing I've heard is that the engine detaching should have been less dramatic than a simple engine failure, as the aircraft was relieved of the weight and drag of a dead engine. This again underlines how the aircraft should have made it safely to altitude, especially if it reached v2.
>>2058148>the engine detaching should have been less dramatic than a simple engine failure, as the aircraft was relieved of the weight and drag of a dead enginNot if it smashes into the wing on the way out
>>2058148>should have been less dramatic Except with an engine failure you can shut off fuel and hydraulic lines, and the weight of the engine keeps the longitudinal center of gravity where it’s at. Instead you have an uncontrollable structural fire and loss of on-side hydraulics and a big shift in CG affecting the handling. This is all assuming the uncontained #1 engine failure didn’t cause the #2 engine to fail, which is looking more probable.
>>2058148>One thing I've heard is that the engine detaching should have been less dramatic than a simple engine failureplease stop hearing thingshow does that even make sense to you?
>muricanot even once
oof
It IS American 191 all over again
>>2058287it's not, stop sucking off slopbait tiktokers
>>2058286>be warehouse wagie/truck driver>suddenly covered in burning Jet-A>die in complete panic and confusion with no possible way to have prepared or to save yourselfHaving worked warehouses near airports it strikes a little closer to home
>>2058312I guess the saving grace is that warehouses and light industry are usually pretty empty. When this crash first happened and they were showing the chopper footage, I thought it had crashed into a commercial area full of shopping centers. That would have been much worse
>>2058312just keep an eye on ADSB
>>2058312The wing hit a bunch of oil storage tanks before the fuselage smeared itself across a half mile of junkyards, that's why the initial fireball looked like one of those novelty pyrotechnic displays they do at drag races and stuff
>>2058104>A300 Impressionnant/impressive
>>2058377What happened to all the packages on that plane? UPS better have updated the tracking at least to indicate it's either on the debris field or incinerated and lost.
>>2058377>UPS 1354>Controlled flight into terrain due to pilot error and pilot fatigue - Airbus not to blame>UPS 2976>Boeing/McDonnell Douglas dogshit designed and maintained airplane crashes once moreAre you pretending to be retarded or you’re genuinely a retard?
US NTSB has issued its preliminary report for the ongoing investigation of the Nov. 4 crash of UPS flight 2976, a Boeing MD-11F in Louisville, Kentucky.The taxi and takeoff roll were uneventful until the airplane rotated for takeoff. Airport surveillance video of the airplane showed the left (No. 1) engine and pylon separating from the wing shortly after airplane rotation, with a fire igniting on the left engine while it traversed above the fuselage and subsequently impacted the ground. A fire ignited near the area of the left pylon attachment to the wing, which continued until ground impact.The airplane initially climbed but did not get higher than about 30 ft above ground level (agl) according to radio altitude data from the FDR. (Based on FAA-provided ADS-B data, the last data point showed 481 ft mean sea level [msl] and 100 ft agl.) The airplane cleared the blast fence beyond the end of runway 17R, but the left main landing gear impacted the roof of a UPS Supply Chain Solutions warehouse at the southern edge of the airport. The airplane then impacted a storage yard and two additional buildings, including a petroleum recycling facility, and was mostly consumed by fire.After initial cleaning of the fracture surfaces, examination of the left pylon aft mount lug fractures found evidence of fatigue cracks in addition to areas of overstress failure. On the aft lug, on both the inboard and outboard fracture surfaces, a fatigue crack was observed where the aft lug bore met the aft lug forward face.The NTSB's investigation of UPS flight 2976 is ongoing.
>>2057992>>2059276I hope anyone who floated the idea of rejecting the takeoff feels bad
>>2059283To be fair, if you're guaranteed to crash, surely some crashes are preferable to other crashes, who is to say that overrunning the runway wouldn't have been more survivable?
Grounding expanded to DC-10 and MD-10https://avweb.com/aviation-news/dc-10-md-10-grounded-emergency-ad-md-11/
>>2059276I cursed maintenance to hell as our bow rode the stall.One engine danced like a moth in the firelight.White horses rode high as the devil passed byTaking souls to Hades by twilight.
>>2059287>who is to say that overrunning the runway wouldn't have been more survivable?the warehouse they missed
>>2058288See>>2059276It is actually
>>2059276If I'm reading the report correctly, the fatigue cracks were not visible from the outside inspections it had recently undergone and a thorough tear-down inspection where it would have been detectable wasn't due for another ~8K cycles. So presumably that's what they're doing right now with the grounded fleets. I would guess that they're going to shorten those inspection intervals.
>>2059333>and a thorough tear-down inspection where it would have been detectable wasn't due for another ~8K cycles. This is the “oh shit” for me. Clearly there is a design defect with the type, and AAL191 was exacerbated by the poor maintenance procedure. I can’t wait to see how many are just barely hanging on when they do a 100% inspection. What’s wild to me is both this and AAL191 were the #1 engine. I am curious if the engine turbo machinery is putting a weird torque on the mount becuase of the amount of mass that is spinning and the moment would be the same on the #3 engine (both spin clockwise) but act on the other side, there is no issue.
about time all mcdonnell shitlas aircraft are retired permanently
>>2059320See my nuts, AA191 was done in by the left wings slats/flaps retracting, UPS2976 was done in by the #2 engine compressor stalling, if not failing entirely. Notice how the NTSB notably says nothing about the #2 motor, because they're duking it out internally on how to deal with the problem. Neither root cause is the pylon, stop watching tikslop.
>>2059363Standard engine startup procedure for all jets I'm aware of is to crank engine #1 from the APU, then bleed air to engine #2, #3, etc. to start them. I wonder if there's some defect with the starter.
>>2059601Not quite, unless there's a specific aircraft/operator I haven't heard of, if the APU is fully functional, you'll start all motors off the APU bleed. The APUs are always turning 100% RPM for the generator frequency and max bleed pressure, where most engines have to increase above idle power to provide enough crossbleed to start another motor. Compounding this is that jet engines at idle always burn more fuel than the APU, jetblast risks of standing up a thrust lever on the ground, and the difficulty and risk of a crossbleed start while taxiing with an engine stuck at partial thrust, as opposed to just running the bleed from the APU.idk how a potential starter defect would be relevant, but UPS MD11 procedure is to always reach max motoring speed before introducing fuel. I'd guess max motoring for them is something like Boeings, which is less than 1% N2 rise in 5 seconds.
>>2057916>engine probably fell offIs that typical?
>>2059743Well there were a lot of these planes flying around the world all the time and very seldom does anything like this happen.
