>>1511637
On behalf of all Germans I’d like to say good riddance

>>1511637
Sorry for the wall of text, but here are my thoughts as a foreigner just in case: it seems that americans see us as slaves, not allies.

Over the last year you have, among other things:
>started a trade war with us
>threatened to annex our territories (Greenland)
>lobbied Brussels against producing our own weapons on behalf of your defense companies (as you don't actually want us to be autonomous)
>sanctioned EU officials for enforcing EU laws within the EU
>started a war without consulting with us, then used the threat Russia poses to the eastern countries as blackmail to get us to join it
>fucked our economies

Look, I get it, you need to blame us for your issues, both domestic (it's convenient for the US Republican Party to justify its persietent resistance to social reform by pretending the entire military budget of the US goes to "defending Europe", while ignoring the gargantuan spending that funds INDOPACOM and CENTCOM), or the latest narrative, which is that it's our fault that the Strait of Hormuz is closed.

Just understand one thing: we may be weak and in decline, but we are not yet slaves you order around. This blackmail is useless and reeks of desperation: we are not getting our warships blown out of the sea because you (and Israel) aggressively fucked up and no longer control the situation.

Ask yourselves: if opening up that waterway were so easy, why hasn't your huge, powerful navy done it already?

Last, but not least: we assisted you when you were attacked by al-Qaeda and occupied Afghanistan for two decades. This time NATO is under ZERO obligation to assist the United States, given that it ATTACKED a country that falls OUTSIDE the scope of the alliance. Just like it did not assist France in Algeria, just like it did not assist Britain in the Falklands.
And if we're being honest, since the end of the Soviet Union the main purpose of your bases in Europe has been to enable you to bomb the Middle East to play petrodollar diplomacy.

>>1511637
So we've taken out the troops that were supposed to secure US interests in Germany, including most notably our some of our closest nuclear weapon storage to Russia and China, in favor of "not protecting Germany" even though they were there for our benefit instead of theirs.

Good fucking job Trump. You're really punishing them by taking out the troops we insisted on putting there.

>>1511646
>>1511653
Russian/Republican shills spotted

>>1511646
And on behalf of Americans that have been stationed to Germany, scheisse Deutchland. Nothing would make me happier than to close down every base we have in Europe and pull out of NATO. Then we can watch you put up with Russia testing your airspace when you can't even keep 1/3rd of your Luftwaffe in the sky. It won't be our problem anymore and we won't have to put up with anymore of your protests outside our base gates.

>>1511653
>And if we're being honest, since the end of the Soviet Union the main purpose of your bases in Europe has been to enable you to bomb the Middle East to play petrodollar diplomacy.
You know what, anon? I actually agree with you (and I am pissed with Trump). Which is another reason why I want these bases shut down - so we can pull out of the Middle East forever and go back to an isolationist stance. Let some other country try to keep stability in the world while Israel and Iran throw nukes at each other, Russia takes back eastern Europe, and China gobbles up Taiwan. I'm tired of people like me being sent overseas, to countries full of people who hate us, so we can fight in endless wars trying to develop third-world nations like Afghanistan. All the money and lives we pissed away there trying to make it a democracy - and for what? So people like you can bitch about "your assistance" standing around doing nothing in the northern part of the country? I can't believe this shit when I looked this up just now, 59 deaths only in that entire 20 year war? Compared to over 2,400 US deaths?

Nah, fuck that. It's long past time we pulled out of NATO completely and have our military focus solely on protecting our borders.

Der vill be a 4th Reich!
I vas wrongt und slavs are ><90% Aryan, especially ze Rus Norse Vikings dat created Russia.
Zis, alonk vit da ashkeNAZIs in Israel who is mostly Rus, vill be led by Germany to create this new world order.
American Mongols will be the Slav's slaves

>>1511669
You’ll have to keep voting Trump in if you want to leave NATO, which means you’ll have to support Israel. If you put Democrats in charge they’ll never leave NATO, but they won’t support Israel either.
I think you’re alright, this isn’t aimed at you I want to say is that it seems to me that most Americans don’t understand things on a fundamental basic level, like Europe and what that is and what NATO is and who’s in it and where those countries are and how NATO can work and what it was for and why all these people went to America from Europe in the first place, all these pertinent things which Americans mostly don’t have proper knowledge of.
For example, Trump wants war with Iran and the best way to supply this war with Iran from the air is through Europe and you already have all these bases ready to go and some of the countries that let you refuel and stuff aren’t even asking any questions they’re just letting you go through no problem right, that’s what’s been the case since Bush started the War on Terror. Ok so then why the fuck would Trump, knowing he is going to have to make war on Iran, go to such great lengths to piss off every single ally he has in Europe and NATO with all the tariff bullshit and talking shit about how bad everything supposedly is in Europe and threatening to take Greenland and annex Canada and all this stuff like allowing the Israelis to just shoot and rape and bomb tents and him blockading the strait when the Iranians were opening it and everything which is only making it harder for him to prosecute the war in Iran because now you’ve got not only the people of Europe but also all the governments.
I’m wondering if Russia tomorrow marches into Estonia and NATO goes all in against Russia, will Trump say he’s not helping. It’s just weird, he’s gimping his own military actions seemingly for no reason and there must be a reason and Russia going Baltic makes more sense than Trump invading Greenland

>>1511669
There was a world order before World War II that allowed America to be isolationist.
Europe used to be the seat of global power. Nobody forced the US to dismantle European colonial empires to take Britain and France's place as the global hegemon. Nobody forced it to kick its former European allies out of Suez and the Levant to control the Middle East. Nobody forced it to share that power with the Soviet Union. Nobody forced it to contain soviet influence from South America to East Asia, once the Soviet Union became its main opponent.

Everything you do is done for your own gain, and every solution to a problem spaws a new one. Disarming Germany and Japan created the issue of not having them fall to the Soviet Union and China once their disarmamant was complete. Delocalizing to China to cripple the USSR made China an industrial power. Assisting the afghan mujahideen created the Emirate of Afghanistan. Removing Saddam created the "Shia corridor" to Lebanon. Killing the Ayatollah seems to have caused Iran to take control of the Strait of Hormuz.

The ride never ends because history never does, decide whether you want to stay on board or sit it out, but remember that no one forced you to ascend to superpower status to reap the benefits that came with it. Out.

>>1511691
>but they won’t support Israel either.
God, I wish.

>>1511699
What benefits that came with it? The last 25 years of the war on terror haven't made us any safer or as free as we once were. Nothing we've done has made the average US citizen better, which is why I want us out of this game for good. And yes for the poster above you, I'm going to keep voting for people like Trump until we finally get a politician (however unlikely) that keeps his word and pulls us out of NATO.

>>1511701
you're literally not american

>>1511701
lmao how is the war on terror NATO's fault? We literally started it and dragged them in. The only time NATO has been called to defend an ally was when we called them.

>>1511704
You're not hearing me anon. I want us out of NATO so our politicians can't send us off to forever wars in the Middle East, for no benefit to the American public, so we can spend billions of dollars each year dying for Israel. Like the other anon said earlier, and he is correct, we use those bases in Europe to hop troops to and from the desert. Getting rid of those bases makes it so that it's not cost-effective to send soldiers there for another 20 years.

>>1511707
NATO literally isn't helping us and we're still doing it. All leaving NATO is going to to is make the bill bigger.

>>1511707
Nothing about fighting a war across an ocean and a continent for the benefit of Israel alone is ever going to be cost effective.
You need to figure out what was the benefit for America of staying in Afghanistan for 20yrs, and toppling Saddam and Gaddafi and Assad, and the civil wars in Yemen and Sudan.
I do not think you have more freedom now than you did in the late 90’s. You have more billionaires and wealth gap and shittier public services and more poverty in a real sense and the highest rate of incarceration in the world

>>1511714
>NATO literally isn't helping us and we're still doing it.
By sending troops through NATO bases. How the fuck do you think we get them downrange?

>Nothing about fighting a war across an ocean and a continent for the benefit of Israel alone is ever going to be cost effective.
Getting rid of the main hubs they use to rotate troops in and out is going to make that option LESS cost effective, which makes our government less likely to do it. The only reason we're able to force project into these places are because of the bases we keep overseas.

>>1511701
>What benefits
The US dollar became and still the global reserve currency, America gained leverage over major oil exporters in the Persian Gulf and the power to meaningfully sanction countries, other entities and individuals as a result of said dominance of the dollar. It also gained influence over semiconductor chokepoints. Etc.
>Nothing we've done has made the average US citizen better
They do so indirectly. For instance, the dollar being the global reserve currency makes imports cheaper and lowers borrowing costs.
The point is that you're not doing these things for free.

>>1511725
>Getting rid of the main hubs they use to rotate troops in and out is going to make that option LESS cost effective, which makes our government less likely to do it.
lmao if they cared about the price of their stunts they wouldn't have started this war.

>>1511725
My point is that they don’t care about the cost. Just look at how much this current war with Iran has cost and they don’t give a shit.