Why is picrel the only new performance sedan you can get with modern features? It's only competition is the sonata N-line, but if you get the N-line you lose all luxury features, while the K5 can retain them through the GT1 package. Is a 4 door challenger or a Cadillac really my only other choice if I want a new car that can fit my kids in the back but also has a little bit of giddy up?
Fit a piano in that.
>>28865228>performance sedan>2.5L enginelol no
>>28865242Yeah, I know. No other options though. At least it has 290 hp. All other shit on the market is like 150
>anon forgets germany exists
>>28865247BMW and Audi don't count, and Volkswagen are fugly
>>28865248>N is dead if you discount X Y Z examples
>>28865252Toyota Camry TRD is gone, Ford, Dodge, Chevy and Chrysler don't even sell a sedan anymore. Be butthurt that I don't want your shitty German cars all you want. Reality is realitying
>>28865255you're a dumb person and your thread is stupid.
I'd honestly pick a WRX over this.
>>28865255No I agree with your assessment that sedans are generally dead. But disagree with you shilling the K5 of all things as a solution
BMW M340BMW M3BMW 540BMW M550BMW M5BMW 840BMW M850BMW M8Mercedes C43 AMGMercedes C63 AMGMercedes E53 AMGMercedes S500Mercedes S580Mercedes S63 AMGAudi S3Audi RS3Audi S5Audi RS5Audi RS7Audi S8Porsche PanameraPorsche Panamera 4SPorsche Panamera GTSPorsche Panamera TurboPorsche Panamera Turbo S
BMW has an entire lineup of performance sedans. wtf are you talking about?
>>28865282I think he means from a non-luxury brand. BMW will sell you all sorts of things for 80k + but in the sub-50k space - options are limited>>28865242eh as the owner of the NA version of this engine it's pretty fun above 3000 rpm but its weird they don't add a limited slip diff to the GT given that EVERY review complains about the torque steer.
>>28865285bmw has the 330i for 48,800 and that is supplied with a 255hp B48 and the best automatic produced currently in any car in my opinion, the zf8hp. Tune, downpipe and intake tubes put the car at an easy 350whp. With that said, it is clear to me that OP means "performance sedans are dead at the price point I like" and not "performance sedans are dead, period". Options are still there, he just has to pay up.
>>28865285name some non luxury performance sedans from 10 years ago along with their msrp
>>28865255> Ford, Dodge, Chevy and Chrysler don't even sell a sedan anymoreOhhh noooo, no more corporate v6 auto-only slop boxes
>>28865288>50k for base model 4 cyl with zero options>>28865289chevy ss apparently sold for 45k back in 2015, you used to be able to get a v6 on the accord and camry, and then a 2.0 on the accordalso subaru wrx I think is like 38-48k ish.
>>28865295>chevy ss apparently sold for 45k back in 2015
>>28865295>optionsOP wanted a sporty sedan with "giddy up". OP didn't mention a price point but my comment stands. He's poor and being a choosey beggar which is evident by picking a K5 as his benchmark lol. Since the K5 is his first pick, I assume he is working with a 30-35k range. Dude needs a Prius (a nice daily and decently peppy car)
>>28865295
>>28865305it had 415 hp tho in 2015 that's still a good deal you don't even get 415 hp with the 340 you have to go to the m3 for that and that's like 75k starting I think if gm were smart they would bring back pontiac as a lineup of a small and large wagon with NA v6 and v8 engines ONLY intended for the affordable performance market.
>>28865313>they would bring back pontiacPlease no
>>28865313that 415hp was crank, the M340i's 385hp is likely at the wheels. anyway if you want an SS go buy one. There are a dozen on cars.com right now with under 20k miles for less than the original msrp.
>>28865313>bring back the pontiacPontiac was American version of Nissan at best.
>>28865315pontiac was always on the cusp of being special if the interiors had been just a little nicer, the engines just a little newerI think people under 50 CRAVE affordable performance and they are losing money not offering anything to this market. People want things with 6 and 8 cylinders, no turbos (see: Cayman 4.0), not a huge price, and not an SUV. That's a mostly uncovered niche, and what options you have are tiny and impractical at best. If they did what Pontiac sorta did, build comfy, roomy performance CROOZers, they would sell.
>>28865320Just let old badges rest. If it ever comes back it's going to be some infinitely gay cuckovers and EVs, unlike what Pontiac was supposed to be about.
>>28865325there's a big gap in the market if chebby is going to only sell SUVs. >If it ever comes back it's going to be some infinitely gay cuckovers and EVsnaturally aspirated, 6 and 8 cylinder wagonsyou have to compromise a little, but not entirely
>>28865288I could pony up and buy something in the 70-90k range. Just seems stupid to spend that much on a car I'll drive twice a week. Guess I'll have to buy a subaru
>>28865288Forgot to mention, the 330i is way too small in the back seat. My kids aren't getting any smaller and this will need to fit them in 5 years.
>>28865288>just do cope mods, void your warranty and still be slow instead of ponying up a few extra bucks for a b58
>>28865417oh no not voiding the warranty kek fucking wrenchlet
>>28865312It's not really the consumer's fault that thing failed. Nobody bought them because nobody knew they existed. Chevy did literally no marketing for it, I don't recall ever seeing a single commercial/ad/etc. for that car. Hell I only became aware of it's existence a few years after they stopped making it because I saw one on the road and had no idea what it was.
>>28865320The way that US emissions standards are written is such that footprint and vehicle classification determine if you are in the priveliged class or not. The performance sedan has been replaced by the F150, and in Europe it's just reserved for the wealthy. How can the world be just when a Honda Fit becomes unviable with any engine size in the US due to emissions, but a Denali 6.2 for a single mom is no issue whatsoever
>>28865274Those aren't performance sedans. They're luxury cars with big engines
>>28865486brainlet detected
>>28865496The brainlet is the one who wants to pay 80 grand for a vehicle that will depreciate by 50% minimum in 5 years.
>>28865524nope, sorry. your first post was idiotic and this second one just reeks of poor cope. stop replying to me you peasant.
>>28865533>Thinks losing 8 grand/year in depreciation is a good investment for a car that would be driven twice a weekYes, I'm the peasant
>>28865539yes, you are a peasant. bugger off.
>>28865274German trash doesn't count.
>>28865228So, anyway, to not get assraped by depreciation my choices are basicallyUsed BMW (ruined drivetrain from first owner)Used Audi (maybe OK. Haven't looked at them that much)Used VW (fugly)Used ES350 (not really a performance car. Just a luxury vehicle with a v6)Used Toyota crown platinum (probably the best choice desu, but is borderline girl car. Still not really a performance sedan)Used Camry TRD (older, lame)Used G80 (questionable drivetrain)Used Stinger (older feature set on the interior. Drivetrain seems ok at this point)New 4 door charger land yacht (big chungus)New k5 gt (best feature set, questionable Kia drivetrain, shitty capacitive touch interior buttons, barely a performance sedan)I guess I need to look in to Audi's stuff more. I just want something with >300ish hp that can carry 6' tall people in the front and back easily.
>>28865572don't forget you can get a lightly used CT5-V for around $40k.
>>28865578The V6.Yes, still a very nice car, but can't be had in the manual, unless you step down to the CT4-V Blackwing, which has limited backseats.If concessions are allowed by the OP, two doors will include the Challenger and its leading class backseat, as you can see here, fitting a 6' tall, full-sized woman with ease.
>>28865350maybe dont cart them to mc donalds 4 times a week
>>28865242What is enough for you people? Why does everything have to have 600 horsepower to even be a contender for enjoyable?Also bread on hood loser.
>>28865584Manlet>>28865583Ah yeah I forgot about the CT5. I'll take a look at those again>>28865583Too hard to put a car seat for a baby in to unfortunately>>28865586Car fags truly are the worst. 2.5L turbo charged that does 290hp, 310ft lb of torque, has more power than it is even capable of putting down. If they weren't retarded they'd be complaining that it has shitty summer tires or no limited slip diff, but instead they're mad the engine is too efficient
>>28865599>Manletyou'd have to be over 6'2" to not fit in any generic german sedan
>>28865439but that's specific to pickup trucks, suvs/crossovers aren't excluded from corporate fuel averagesit's not JUST cars that are tethered to that numerical calculation
>>28865602>Manlet confirmed
>>28865248>BMW and Audi don't count, and Volkswagen are fuglyRetarded opinion (and I bought an Audi), but these look great in person and would suit someone with a poor understanding of car dynamics such as yourself.
>>28865608No thanks, I already wasted enough time repairing my grandmother's Jetta
>>28865608ruined by the chinkshit lightband desuvw needs to stay classy
>>28865603Many SUV's are classified as light trucks. Crossovers typically have the same drivetrains as their sedan counterparts. Even something like a mazda CX-70 is considered a truck by the EPA, allowing it to have a 3.3 turbo instead of something way more cucked
>>28865630>Even something like a mazda CX-70 is considered a truck by the EPAshow me where it says that
>>28865631The CX-70 has a GVWR of 6014lb, barely classing it as a 'standard SUV' under the category of 'trucks'. You can see how this is intentional
>>28865647ok so its a weight thing nothing to do with form factorthis just seems like a retarded bureaucracy issue but I doubt its really the sole thing preventing car companies from selling sedans as if they otherwise would, sedans have always had lower profit marginsif we had a real government they would fix things like this
>>28865663like this?
>>28865669well, another anon implied it would take an act of congress to fully repeal CAFE so it couldn't come back just by resetting the fines up
>>28865669Yeah lmao don't hold your breath on that actually happening, it's in the administration's (domestic auto-makers) interest to incentivize buyers into large SUV's and trucks. Not to mention, the obsession with increasing oil production which works a lot better when you pump the domestic consumption of such a commodity
>>28865675large suvs and trucks have higher profit margins, but at this point there's room for premium but not ultra-luxury cars/wagons/hatchbacks just as sort of a novelty that's more practical than sports cars, and I think most people have driven a cuckover or truck and gotten how floaty they are and hard to turn and dreams of something that handles like a sports car but can actually fit your stuff and that's where premium wagons could come back. Manufacturers are just ultra-conservative and not willing to try risky/unusual things.
>>28865678You vastly overestimate how much the vehicle purchaser thinks about these things, especially for new cars. Most people don't even realize their brakes and suspension are shot because of the boiling frog analogy
>>28865683my dad is turbo cheap and let the rotors get scored on our suv rather than replace the padsbut hey now I know what it feels like to be riding in a car when the rotors are scored and not clamping correctly I'm not suggesting wagons or hatchbacks would replace suvs, but there's certainly an underserved market for people who want non-high riding practical cars that are not sports cars but offer good performance at a non-luxury pricepoint.
>>28865672BBB was an act of congress.>>28865675it already happened a year ago.
>>28865694I don't know what BBB is. You can't just throw acronyms at me. I assume it's the law establishing corporate fuel economy standards. But yeah so you are agreeing with me that fully dismantling this shit requires Congress to do so, and they are inept.
>>28865694Ah I see now, the fines still technically exist but it's a $0 ticket. The beauty of the american beaurocratic system
>>28865691That segment almost always wants used cars because that segment is more practical than the new car purchasers. This pattern has happened time and time again, just look at the Honda Element market. Mediocre sales new but as they aged they had barely any depreciation because the used market prefers the form factor
>>28865697it's from the image - Big Beautiful Bill.>>28865704yeah it's stupid but it's law now as it was signed by congress.
>>28865706the honda element was underpowered and slightly too small for americaif they had given it a turbo and a bit more room it would have sold better>>28865719the issue with cafe is the actual numbers were unrealistically high and it was always a game of "well these numbers won't go into effect for 10 years"the whole thing just needs to go away its not like manufacturers are going to return to all v8 lineups if you get rid of fuel economy standardsalso, diesel should be taxed less
>>28865586The average vehicle sold in America has over 400hp. It's a little silly buying a "performance" anything with less power than that.
>>28865722The CR-V had the exact same drivetrain and sold way better due to being 'conventional', despite having lazier handling and less interior space
>>28865740If you filter by transaction price, the average vehicle sold for under 50k probably has 200hp and that's a lot of sales still. Performance for a good price is hard to find, and most of those are compromised designs with old platforms, old, cheap interiors, limited space, etc.
>>28865751The average pickup truck sale price is around $50k and those are all at around 400hp or more. You can get them with that 400hp at a much cheaper price point as well.
>>28865753>and those are all at around 400hp or morelolnosuperduty stuff maybe but not F-150 only the 3.5 turbo gets you thatthese numbers come out of your assmost (full size) truggs are sold for more than 50k
>>28865758Don't even respond to him, he has a condition. "profound retardation"
>>28865274Okay now that we've figured out what to avoid, how about listing the GOOD cars?
>>28865786the new audi rs5 weighs under 6000 lbs, isn't that impressive?
>>28865789It's amazing what german engineering can accomplish nowadays, it's almost as light as a suburban!
>>2886575890% of F-150's are the 380hp 3.5 or the 400hp 5.0. The Hemi 5.7 makes 395hp and the GM 6.2 makes 420hp. But you go ahead and spend $60k on a 280hp FWD gookmobile.
>>28865817saucey sauce?also, again I don't think pickups with those engines are selling for less than 50k
>>28865817First of all, you have no idea what average means. Secondly, most f150's are 2.7's, most silverados are 2.7's, and most rams are pentastars. I'm sorry you're so delusional
>>28865570>posts a 90s Mercedes
Lexus IS350
Just get an EV>Tesla Model S>Mercedes CLA>BMW i4>Hyundai Ioniq 6>Polestar 2Plenty of options. Used market is filled with cheap options.
>>28865586My camaro has 450 hp and its starting to feel slow after a couple years of ownership idk what to do
>>28865994manual swap
>>28865228elantra n is a good alternative to the sonata n-line. plus you get a 6 speed manual as an option if youre into that. despite being the same company the hyundais look less gay than the kias, imo.
>>28865274Remove the 4 cylinder cars from your list, i.e. the C43 and C63 Cadillac CT5-VCadillac CT5-V BlackwingCadillac CT4-V Blackwing
>>28866076>want to make my car faster>do this to make your car slower retard
>>28866094He can safely remove everything but the RWD B58 cars. The panamara isn't bad on paper but it's far too ugly even by german standards. The RS3 is a good concept but it's transverse so it's basically pointless
>>28865572If Audi was the conclusion you came to affer your research then I'm sorry there's nothing that can be done to recover your scorched brain cells. The TLX type S doesn't depreciate so badly
>>28866167TLX (actually all Acura sedans) have tiny back seats. It was the second brand I checked. And to be honest, I'm probably going to just wait for the 2027 lineup at this point
>>28866242Oh shit you're right, they split off from the accord platform in the recent gen. I have a 2.0t accord and the rear passenger area is enormous
>>28866276If the new accords didn't look so doodoo or at least had a turbo option they'd be a no brainer for me
>>28866242>TLX (actually all Acura sedans) have tiny back seats.Who cares? Are you an uber driver?
>>28866486you never had kids i take it
>>28865274Those fit into sports/luxury.A performance sedan is a regular ass regular price bracket daily driver with some balls to it.
>>28866507those are your definitions.
>>28865570>out of production for 3 years
>>28865608Arteon was discontinued in 2024.
>>28865994tunehog ass cambig fat supercharger
>>28865608wish we got these in the states>>28865613>chinkshit lightbandeveryone's copying it from teslerthat shit is all american
>>28865583Source on the tall babe in the video?
the front is nice but the windscreen backwards is melted banana slop
>>28865228Wow, it has a sub 6 second 0-60. This thing mogs every jap poorfag sportscar bigly.
>>28865789Nah, I prefer more light and compact cars, like the challenger
>>28866536What's an ass cam?
>>28866618With good tires it can do 5. With a limited slip diff it can do sub 5. Only problem is that you have to clench your asshole every time you drive and pray the engine doesn't grenade itself.
>>28865228>Performance sedans are dead>Why is picrel the only new performance sedan you can get with modern features?Because the category is kind of obsolete now. The C8 Corvette killed it. Anyone that wants performance just gets a Corvette. Anyone that wants practicality gets a truck. Poorfags that can't afford either just buy used or an econobox. It sits in a niche segment that has been dwindling for some time now.
>>28866792>modern features>pushrod
>>28866793If it ain't broke don't fix it. The pushrod V8 is still the quickest and the fastest engine on the planet.
>>28866793it just werks
>>28866796everyone else switched to twin cams>>28866797it lowers the fuel economy and performancethere's a reason you get twin cams in the upgrade enginechevy takes you for a fool and is willing to sell you outdated crap knowing you won't care or know any better
>>28865228>they brought back the galantBASE BASE BASE wow thank you koreanogs
>>28866798>everyone else switched to twin camsOkay and how many twin cams can run 3's or hold a land speed record?
>>28866801r o l l i n gs t a r tlaunch control starts are dumb
>>28866805A 3 second 1/4 mile... No launch control here. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXV3E8Tj_oE
>>28866808yeah i get that you can waste tons of fuel for numbers that's why my first point about pushrods was FUEL ECONOMY
>>28866811Fuel economy? A 20 year old V8 Corvette gets 40mpg highway. Most modern 4 cylinders struggle to get half that in the real world. If emission standards were non-existent no manufacturer would be using twin cam engines or small turbo engines which is ironic.
>>28866814>A 20 year old V8 Corvette gets 40mpg highwayuh huh sure
>>28865572well if you're going used,S60 Polestar, legroom isn't as big as an executive but the seats are deep enough where people sitting in the back won't complain2018 T6 if you don't like hybrids2016 T6 if you can't stand the thought of a 4 cylinder despite respectful performanceGS FLexus holds value and you get your V8Chevy SSolder but you get your V8you get a manual, if you can find oneniche enough to hold valueback legroom is good although headspace is more limited
>>28866815Yes? Oh let me guess. He reset the meter on a 100 mile long downhill, right?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNIZ25eBMco
>>28865994Buy a slow car to DD. Then your Camaro will feel like a rocket ship when you get back in it.
>>28866095>anon getting bored with car>guy suggests to install more fun transmissionNot everything is about being a bench racing faggot Anon.
>>28866746times the opening and closing of your cheeks
>>28865228Why don't you just buy a WRXYeah it's ugly but so is this + you can get it with a proper gearbox and it's not wrong wheel drive
>>28867005Back seat too small.
>>28865320the problem is that poorfags who can only afford one car have a long list of demands that is impossible to meet at almost any price point, and even if you satisfy most of the demands, the povvos will nitpick something and not buy. and they don't buy new anyway. there's no point in trying to cater to them, they don't deserve nice things
>>28867058t. auto companies who only care about profit and are not willing to try anything creative
Model 3 Perf
>>28867065feels like its made out of legos, what a terrible car, if it weren't electric it would be seen as like a mitsubishi mirage, a joke carfinally the hype around teslas is dying and ONLY through the extensive stupidity of the CEO
>>28867039Are you going to be hauling around 3 6 foot 4 men in the back at the same time? It's got enough space for kids and most adults, only the head room is lacking
>>28867069interior is crap too, infotainment is horribly outdatedyou are buying what is effectively a 10 year old compact car with a decent enginek5 is way, way newer, nicer, and more spacious
>>28867072>effectively a 10 year old compact carVB was a brand new model in 2022, k5 is older than that>infotainmentIDK man I just don't give a fuck about infotainment as long as it reliably streams music from my phone
>>28867074Subaru has been using the interior the WRX has since well before 2022. They may call it new, but its the same exact engine and interior as before. >I just don't give a fuck about infotainment its incredibly laggy and slow and hard to useyou've never driven the K5 and don't get how much better it is. I wanna say K5 dates back to about 2020. But just look at the interior. Much newer more modern design.
>>28867080>same exact engine and interior as before. It isn't thoughI don't own a subie, but I have driven my brother in law's wrx a few times and the infotainment seems just fine and I didn't notice any lag. Certainly faster than my old toyota.I also don't know how they are priced in the US (which is where I'm assuming you're from) but in my country even though they cost similarly brand new, WRX are way cheaper used, even the non-riced ones, and they are also much more common.
>>28867088every single review without fail of any subaru complains about the infotainment they ONLY just now fixed it with the 2026 Outback ALL the other ones have a decade old system
>>28867059yeah they should go bankrupt trying to somehow cater to the whims of retards like you who want everything for nothing
>>28867058>>28867116There's always some retard who comes around forgetting that you can just try not to be retarded and look back a few years and see that all my demands would've been met with several reasonably priced cars. I've mentioned them in this thread already. I don't expect much from somebody who thinks it's smart to buy a new car that loses 5 grand per year in depreciation though. >>28867069Not 3 of them, but regularly I'd expect 2.
>>28865823Using all of the 2015+ f150s on copart as a proxy, you're wrong. The 2.7 is outnumbered by the 5.0 while the 3.5 is the most common. 2.7 is basically only in the fleet spec, 3.5 is respectable with a touch better fuel econ in lab tests to help CAFE numbers (plus higher repair bills/shorter lifespan because turbo) so they push buyers that way with allocations or whatever, while the 5.0 is what anyone who knows much and is buying for themselves goes with.
>>28867169What the fuck does copart have to do with dealer sales? Most 2.7's are going to be run into the ground by the initial buyer, while the 3.5's and 5.0's are bought by recreational users which are far more likely to be sold before end of life. I can't find any reputable source on sales breakdowns for the 732,000 f150's sold in 2024, and I doubt you can either. Also, if you're going to make a statement about engines make sure the info is at least from this decade
>>28867188*460,000 f150's, 732,000 is for all f-series
>>28867154>won't buy newand there it is. why do retards expect to be catered to when they refuse to buy when they are? and I have no idea where in this thread (You) mentioned the cars you didn't buy, we don't have IDs here, idiot. but if they're made to appeal to retards like you, it stands to reason that the other retards like you also won't buy new. so no reason for the companies to pander to you, no used cars for you to buy. stupid fucking cheapskate, you get what you deserve: nothing
>>28867357I would buy new if there were cars that met my criteria that are new. Can you read? My initial post is about buying new. I only started considering used after my suspicions were confirmed and the whole sedan market is cucked. A few years ago I could buy exactly what I wanted, new, for under 50 grand. Now I can't do that without making compromises. And I'm not retarded enough to buy a new luxury car that loses 5 grand in value every year on average. Like 20% in the first year lmfao
>>28867376>Can you readcan you? as I said, you'll always find a nitpicky reason to not buy. no cars meet your criteria because whatever your criteria are, they're completely impossible to meet in any one car, let alone a cheapy>A few years ago I could buy exactly what I wantedbut you didn't. you won't make compromises, you won't buy new, but you still want to be catered to like you matter. newsflash, chump: you don't>My initial post which is? I'm not going to play retarded guessing games about who (You) are
>>28867469>Didn't buy when you couldRetarded troll confirmed. Not everybody is in the market 24/7 every yearAlso, I am OP
>>28867478If you buy a K5 GT and show it off pictorially you will mog everyone here and they will seethe endlessly in jealousy from their hard-riding M340xi.
>>28867478having your head up your ass isn't an excuse. you didn't buy then, you won't buy now
>>28867481I'm thinking about it. Just worried about the Kia drivetrain reputation. Also those shitty capacitive touch buttons.
>>28867501I think the main thing to do is to find a permissive dealer or seller who will let you hoon it on the highway or back roads so you can feel like what it is like to have to adjust stuff with touch controls at speed In my kia theres two little knobs but they are so fucking small and have no useful grippy surface its so poorly designed there should be nothing but large chunky grippy knobs in a car but you have to ignore that little bit maybe >Just worried about the Kia drivetrain reputationcomes down to regular maintenance and luckthey've been making engines for a while nowmainly, test drive it, make sure you are ok with the torque steer, why they didn't add a LSD I do not know, every single review criticizes it, they've been selling it a few years now, haven't modified it one bit, oh welland if the FWD format doesn't work for you, maybe a used Genesis G80 could work tell us how it drives, it would be MUCH more interesting if people went and actually drove different cars and came back here and wrote about it, and compared them
>>28867624Yeah I test drove one and it was really fun. Im not the type of guy to gun it on the regular so I'm not too worried about the LSD. I'm planning to test drove an ES350, Toyota Crown Platinum, and a G80 currently.
>>28865572Saab Aero hope this helps
>>28867646>Im not the type of guy to gun it on the regularthen its perfectimho it fixes one of the biggest issues with the naturally aspirated version of the 2.5 - that you have to outright floor it to merge or pass easilyi don't know why kiyundai doesn't sell a light pressure turbo with 230 hp for non N applications. :(
I sat in K5 at a car show and it is surprisingly cramped inside, so the car must be ass
>>28867481>kia>mogging anyoneLol, lmao even. Trolls used to be believable Anon.
>>28867737bring back the k900
>>28865255>Doesn't want German cars>I know, I'll get a KIA!!You ok man?
>>28867768>Beamer faggot can't readMany such cases
>>28865417lmao. fucking brand new cars with warranties. loaded or not, it is a stupid decision. if you were loaded you definitely would not be buying a 330i. if you are not, nice, you gonna lose at least 20k to a car in a few years just because you are afraid of maybe using your fingers a little bit?
>>28865228I've had a giulia for 5 years and it fit 2 rear facing car seats. The only features is missing that I would want is 360 camera and HUD but it's no big deal. Wish they had a 6 cylinder with awd though.
>>28865247gookshills wouldn't get paid if they acknowledged other brands
>>28865228I've said it before, I'll say it again... nobody looks at their korean car and feels proud. They are auraless appliances.>but it's fast>but the warranty is good>but the tech is nice>but it's affordableOk. But it doesn't make you look back when you're walking away. And that is the real sign of a great car. Kia/Hyundai just doesn't have it. I don't care if you bought a gookslop that gets 70MPG, goes 0-60 in 2 seconds, and has an interior so nice it's better than your living room. It doesn't make you look back. It has no aura. You aren't hyped to drive it or own it.This is objectively true, and everyone knows it deep-down.
>>28868708G90s got aura my man.
>>28868657you cannot acknowledge the advantages of Korean brands at all you just think about numbers and prestige.
>>28866847i already drive my car like once every 2 weeks lol. Maybe i should have said, it's acceleration doesnt SURPRISE or excite me like it used to. Because its objectively plenty fast, it just doesn't feel exciting Unironically it's the sound that excites me way more whenever i drive it >>28866852kill yourself>>28866536truth nuclear
>>28865228>Why is picrel the only new performance sedan you can get with modern features?Because middle-class mothers didn't feel safe in them.
OK but what about this?
>>28869586>200k>250 mi range>battery only>5000+ lbsum nothe whole point is to have affordable gas performance cars, and most of the options are ludicrously cheap on the inside and/or outdated
>>28870019All true. But this is one of the most attractive cars on sale right now.
>>28870736eh i don't like the "3d curves everywhere!" lookI would love to see a car with cleaner lines and a slightly more rectangular look but not like truck-level boxy
