>be driving>see a giulia>look inside>the driver and passenger are both menso the stereotypes are true huh?
I'm surprised these are even still on the road. I guess give it 5 more years and they'll be totally rare as they break a lot.
>>29035158>they break a lotNot even remotely true, but all it took was a few biased reviewers to get everyone to take this as fact.
>>29035162Italian car fans are known for underplaying the reliability of Italian cars, too.
>>29035166Anecdotally, I've had my Alfa for almost a decade now, and its been dead reliable the entire time. I service it once a year, and most years all it needs are fluids. It's way cheaper to maintain than other Italian cars too.
>>29035158>>29035150>Alfas picking up steam as youtubers realize they’re a performance bargain>Still on the road because they’re actually reliable>indian shills hired by BMW post low effort trash to /o/lmao. Is this what the “ultimate” driving machine has to do to compete nowdays?
>>29035178>Alfas picking up steamI'm waiting for someone to realize how cheap the 4C is relative to anything remotely similar. Apparently US values are less than half of what they go for in Europe.
>>29035182americans have more options for sports cars. europeans don't, so you guys have to buy either fragile Italian cars or kit cars. we have camaros that out-handle everything under 100k and come in manual. so the auto-only 4c isn't as appealing.
>>29035175Anecdotally, i know of a guy that was rebuilding an alfa in his garage and while he was at work the car started on fire and took the garage and two other cars with it.
>>29035182My friend owned one and didn’t like it. It was a flawed design, that apparently is fixable, but they should’ve fixed the suspension before rushing it out. Also, auto-only is lame for a hard sports car. Why not just get a lotus at that point?
>>29035186There's a reason Alfa Romeo is leaving the american market (again). the american market is the easiest to get into as an automaker. if you fail here, despite being part of a massive conglomerate like FCA(now stellantis) your cars have to REALLY be of poor quality.
>>29035189>they should’ve fixed the suspension before rushing it outIMO everyone who complains about the factory 4C alignment bought the wrong car. Its meant to have a raw, near-competition, feel out of the box. Combined with the manual rack, of course Alfa wanted the steering to be light and alive. But everyone wants to ruin it with a dull setup that prioritizes self-centering over steering feel. Keep both hands on the wheel and drive the car.The suspension options themselves are also self-explanatory. The race suspension is track suspension, of course it's hard on the street.
>>29035201yeah, but my point is why build that kind of car and then stick an automatic in it?
>>29035193There's probably places it's way easier to get into but nobody there can afford a car.
>>29035204because europeans buy sports cars as a status symbol, not for the driving experience, and this car was made for the european market first then shipped over to americans. then you have cars like the Viper that were manual-only for their entire production run. if you want a raw track driving experience, you'd be insane to buy a 4c over any viper.
>>29035204Drive one, it wouldn't work with a manual. The factory boost is 21psi and the DCT keeps you from losing it on shifts. I had an S2000 before my 4C and they're the same type of car with two completely different powerplant implementations. People get caught up in paper debates without realizing what feels good in one car won't feel right in another. The 4C is meant to give the experience of a 70's supercar, not a mid-engine Miata.
>>29035213> it wouldn't work with a manual. The factory boost is 21psiSaying shit like: “you don’t understand, you NEED a DCT in a 230hp 1.8 liter engine because it’s just so powerful!” is just a straight-up lie. Because we’ve been driving 4-cylinder turbos for decades without a problem and they all came with more power and a manual transmission, and that’s just a marketing lie for why they wouldn’t offer it in a manual transmission. This is just cope for:>euro regs mean our engines are shitand>financial beancounting means we won’t offer a manualIt’s really quite a pointless car when there is a better option in virtually every category when you consider the price. People in America are going to cross shop it against a fucking miata, then realize the miata comes with a soft-too, looks better, is half the price.
>>29035226>powerIt's clear you actually don't understand. It's about staying in boost and has nothing to do with the power output of the car. The other reason there isn't a manual is packaging, the car isn't laid out in a way one could work.>financial beancountingAlfa lost money on every 4C, they were all hand built. There are barely 2k of them in the US across all years and trims. It was meant to be a car to herald their return, the Giulia and Stelvio were supposed to be the cars that turned a profit.There's nothing else similar to the 4C. Carbon tub, super lightweight, no power steering; every aspect is driver-focused.>Miata looks betterI wish you put this first before I typed all that out, because now I know you're just taking the piss
>>29035226Yes, such a beauty (picrel)>in order to fix this imaginary boost problem of our own making we had to sacrifice the manual transmission, but trust me, it’s still a driver’s focused hard-core sports car and it’s better this way! Wait, where are you going? Why are you buying an Esprit v8 for half as much?!
>>29035241I'm reminded why I stopped bothering with this board. Not a single US car has those headlights if you take such issue with them (but their purpose was weight reduction, because...it's a driver-focused car).
>>29035241that's not why no one bought themits because its a 2 seater with no trunk. no one fucking bought espirits either lmao
>>29035150>so the stereotypes are true huh?Weak bait thread by the FAG who posted the F22 M240i thread. >>>29032125too easy to spot
>>290352772 series is a baby's toy. Just get the miata and buttplug and call it a day
>>29035193>There's a reason Alfa Romeo is leaving the american market (again). the american market is the easiest to get into as an automaker. if you fail here, despite being part of a massive conglomerate like FCA(now stellantis) your cars have to REALLY be of poor quality.that's not the reason, the reason is that the american market is easy because it is marketable, and it is marketable because few owners do more than cursory "what does X publication say the best car is" googling. alfa romeo did not advertise outside of 3 campaigns - 2 for the giulia (launch and one more), 1 for the tonale (lol that thing really is a piece of shit). had they advertised for more than three seasons out of a whole decade, they would have had a runaway success. instead, the dealer network is collapsing and they haven't meaningfully updated their product line since launch (personally I think the second part is a blessing in disguise, especially once Tavares took over)Look at all the european manufacturers except porsche, look at lexus and honda and ford. They advertise year-round, then give individual dealers money to advertise on their own with. americans typically don't think about what isn't shoved in our faces
>>29035297Americans also care about specs. In europe a 1.8 liter, 238hp “sports” car might be competitive, I dunno, but in America that’s just a Prius (which even has a bigger engine, lol). A “driver’s car” is just the common cope for when your sports car can’t compete).
>>29035307americans do care about specs, if you put them in front of us as comparisons. and the giulia/stelvio outspecced the germans including the macan, being faster, just as if not more efficient, and posting superior lap times when measured. nobody put the specs in front of americans, because advertising is something that only the uncouth would need, and alfa romeo is older than ferrari, and of course people will know alfa romeo is selling cars in the united states (again, after having left in the 90s)again, if nobody knows the specs of the best competitor, the next-best competitor becomes the best competitor.
>>29035297>americans typically don't think about what isn't shoved in our facesTesla has never done any advertisement. people buy them because their cars were exception and word of mouth spread like wild fire. word of mouth of alfa owners reported unsatisfactory ownership experience and everyone else just stayed away.Not everything needs a million ads, and products can still fail with them. if you don't build at least a half decent car, people just won't buy. and americans are usually pretty easily duped into buying european cars even if they aren't reliable.
>>29035316https://adsspot.me/brands/tesla-8d258fdd1406/ads-and-commercials
>>29035316>Tesla has never done any advertisementThere were Tesla ads on this very board at one point.
>>29035328wow, in the two decades tesla has existed as a company, they only made 12 ads, and I never saw a single one of them the entire time I had cable television when these ads supposedly aired.and they STILL kicked the german's ass while alfa romeo failed miserable despite being a much older company.I think european car companies in general could take notes on how to run a car company from tesla.
>>29035341>and they STILL kicked the german's assuhhhhhhhhhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW#Production_and_saleshttps://evseekers.com/tesla-sales-by-year/tesla's peak sales were 1.8m a year, but BMW alone beat that every year since 2014
>>29035358You're comparing 3-4 models Tesla sales to the 10+ models BMW sales. the Model Y was the top 10 best selling car models globally, whereas none of BMWs were.that is a serious ass beating.
>>29035363nevermind the amount of money germans lost trying to beat tesla, and the amount of layoffs they're experiencing. they got clowned on.
>>29035363I'm comparing the market that each brand chooses to address, keeping in mind that Tesla for years had a functional monopoly on nice electric vehicles. BMW doesn't try and break into the pickup market
>>29035382so why doesn't BMW have a top 10 best selling model globally like tesla does? Europeans kept a functional monopoly on diesel shit because Europe is the only region that uses diesels for passenger cars and the european government (right down to the FIA) all coincided regulations that favored diesels and made gasoline less competitive. this meant if you wanted to compete in europe, you had to either spend a ton of money developing an entire engine platform for one market, or partner up with one of the european brands to get diesels like the Japs had to do.Europeans never had real competition until the EV revolution. they weren't used to doing anything but relying on their brand to stifle out competition. when they actually had to try, they lost.
>>29035315it’s still unreal to me that they gave Clarkson a white one instead of one in alfa rosso. They also could’ve easily capitalized on the massive horsepower advantage (#1 spec for americans) and laptime advantage over the m3. It was sabotage, pure and simple. After Sergio died his replacements, who apparently hated him, wanted to sabotage it and focus on their bullshit projects.
>>29035186That sounds like user error.
>>29035251They're also very small, even for a 2 seater sports car. If you're even kinda tall you won't fit.
>>29035150i just don't care for the front. otherwise it looks like the new integra which is a decent bar to meet
