Unions are our only bargaining power against this fucked up rape society not supporting them should be punishable by deathif you dont support unions you are literally a golem and the enemy of your fellow man
How will you prevent corruption and the eventual hierarchy that forms with unions?
they're good in theory but they almost always end up being coopted by the state
>>515486737inevitable in any institution idk, at least at the end of the day it still exists to benefit workers
>>515486945Yes but financial incentives would keep those institutions in line. But what's the incentive in labour unions? You may claim that not everyone cares about profits first, but most people aren't self-aware and subconsciously, they care about themselves first.
>>515487360>Yes but financial incentives would keep those institutions in lineobviously not since every institution in our society is extremely corruptunion staff lawyers etc earn a wage its not like its volunteer work
>>515487873Well it won't really matter anymore once AGI is discovered
>>515486737an union union
>>515486558only low skill poorfags without salaries who want to argue about getting an extra dollar an hour join unions, why should i give some company part of my paycheck to larp on my behalf
>>515486558Genocide unionists
>trillion dollar gigacorporations spend billions to fight unions>untold amounts of money and manpower hiring the finest social manipulators to make anti-union campaigns>pressure politicians to import foreigners because they don't unionise ("diverse" stores have lower union activity)>UNIONS ARE LE BADunless you're inheriting millions or being paid to shill, being against unions as a pleb is retarded
>>515488704Heavily depends, if the past century told us something, one career choice can land you on opressed or opressor
>>515486558labor unions are inherently anti-property. a fundamental property right is the ability to exclude others from your property. if you decide to fire and uninvite a former employee for subversive commie behavior like trying to form a labor union, you should be able to exercise that fundamental property right of exclusion and kick them off your land.inflation is the problem, wiping out the prospect of passing down generational wealth for lower class people for generations and destroying the value of workers wages. inflation comes from debt-funding entitlement programs put in place by progressive democrats. but you don't know that because you support gibsmedats and are conditioned to think perpetual inflation is normal like the typical economically illiterate commie faggot that you are
>>515486558The jewish created Labour unions destroyed the White ownerships of our businesses. Now the jews own our business's outright, unions can't do shit, they served their purpose
>>515489238>>515489500americans are so insane lmao
>>515486737>muh hierarchyFag.
>>515489671faggot
>>515489803>>515488704
>>515486737Term limits in leadership roles.
>>515488704/this/
>>515489959doesn't address my points at all. and i didn't advocate importing immigrants. try again you retarded faggot
>>515486558Anyone who supports a union should be imprisoned for life.They push up the cost of production and exclude young workers from joining professions.Anyone who supports Unions is a socialist and a traitor.>>515486866They're not good in theory, they are treason.>>515489671> only bargaining power against this fucked up rape society >"Golem"You're mentally ill, seek help traitor.
>>515488704You're posting on 4chan from an Iphone while in an air conditioned room while eating three meals a day, you are the elite you pretend to fight.But, even if you were working class, unions screw you more than anything else. Being pro-union is retarded.
>>515486558In Finland (Sweden has the same system) unions have achieved absolute power. In the long term, this has lead to 11% unemployement rates. Practically all industry has closed down, even our beloved paper mills are unable to work and the last ones will close before 2030.In Britain, France, and Belgium, public transport strikes frequently bring entire cities to their knees because their right to strike (aka right to never be fired) empowers them to not face any consequences, giving them unlimited and unreasonable power in negotiation.I'm not saying that unions should be banned, but they should never be given absolute protections. If unionized labor is as productive as leftists claim, then they should be able to compete against randoms off the street.
>>515490550They should absolutely be crushed
>>515486558Bargaining is useless. Unions used to threaten the owners directly. That needs to happen more instead of the meme collective bargaining or strikes. Rich literally do not care and will do anything but stop once they are personally threatened.
>>515486737How do you do that in any organisation?
>>515488704My union forced me to join to get the job. they also forced me to pay weekly dues. In return I got a slightly higher pay than minimum wage. The only reason It ended profitable at the end of the week was overtime.
>>515486737Don't let the lumpenproles in.
>>515486558unions are criminal gangs that extort business owners. They force consumers to pay more for products and services with the threat of physical violence.
>>515486558Unions are to protect the useless exclusively.No, I don't want some retard who wanders around talking all day instead of doing anything being protected. I don't care how much you hate having to do your job correctly.Get to it, or get fucking fired.
>>515489238>inflation comes from debt-funding entitlement programs put in place by progressive democrats.literally braindead golem or a paid shill at work, trumpedo sent the debt sky-high>>515490441>They push up the cost of production and exclude young workers from joining professions.LMAOOO
>>515486558here's the real issue that OP is too retarded to comprehend. imagine paying a similar amount of money for things that your great great grandparents did. people used to know that feeling before jewish monetary policy and debt-funding boomergibs and israel wars and coofbux until we're $40T in debt in the US
>>515490441Unions built the American middle class.
>>515490684If you and your coworkers want to form s little group and hand in demands to your boss together, fine. It can and was a productive method to determine wages. Just don't be surprised if you get fired since you might increase labor costs too much.That goes out the window when absolute rights are given to unions.
>>515486558Unions create symmetry when negotiating, e.g. >I want a luch break>no youre firedas opposed to union>we want a luch breaknow the company either fires hapf its workforce or complies>why wouldnt the unions exploit this and bankrupt the companythats like saying>why wouldn't the company create work conditions where every single employee either leaves or diespic rel
>>515491009Americans are braindead
>>515490979>He doesn't understand basic economicsLMAO, look at why your country is shit.>>515491009Back then wages were also a lot less.
>>515491078>since you might increase labor costs too much.How about the owner class take a little less.
>>515491097Anyone who thinks this graph is relevant at all is stupid. You're dumb for posting it in any meaningful way.
>>515491097Strange how this graph also coincides with feminism and nigger rights and basically the domination of progressives in government?
>>515491097Why, doctors unions or party unions get all the jobs, while lone programmer starves
>>515491210>How about the job creator just has less money to create jobs.
>>515490979>literally braindead golem or a paid shill at work, trumpedo sent the debt sky-highevery year mandatory spending (entitlements) is the vast majority of the budget. progressive democrats implemented those programs. kill yourself for being so ignorant of this common knowledge. but yes trump was retarded for failing to veto coofbux and he kept funding entitlements because it's political suicide to cut gibsmedats even though it's the right thing to do
>>515491210They won't though, the same way tarrifs increase the cost of products.
>>515491291Maybe they should learn how to run their business better to make more money.
>>515491097>Americans are braindead doesn't address any of my points, posts an irrelevant image. yeah you should probably kill yourself
>>515491291LOL! it's not like they create jobs with their profits anyway.they use it for stock buybacks and for paying speculators.
>>515486558Americans are niggers for being against unions.
americans will literally fight to have less rights for their jewish masters there is no helping these people
>>515491210Then they shut plants down and build then in China instead. It's just the real world.
>>515492098>Americans are niggers for having fundamental property rights itt faggy eurocucks + abo rimming ausfag btfocommon merishart w
>>515491511Maybe you should learn hard work so you don't need a union
>>515491880>LOL! it's not like they create jobs with their profits anyway.They literally do>they use it for stock buybacksAnd how do you think we create more jobs???
>>515486945yup, "uh it can go bad if we let it because we got lazy" is the stupidest fucking reason to not do something. clearly a right wing retarded with jew cum dribbling down his chin.
>>515492536LolAll hard work gets you is respect from the union
>>515492188You're defending unions, you're literally fighting to have all your human rights stripped from you.
>>515486558I'm against public sector unions.
>>515492098Only degenerates support unions
>>515491269They did that to comp the left into focusing on meaningless issues.
>>515488704stop it, these cattle might hear you and tell their jew overlords.imagine being a fat low skilled low IQ christcuck with a multilated dick and also thinking you should side with your bosses while they extract all the value from your labor and fuck you over in an instant for tree fiddy
>>515492829You are the elite you pretend to be against, any actual working or middle class person would literally gullotine you for being wealthy. You are the scumbag you pretend to hate.
labour unions for trades failed in the US and that's why they've been replaced with cheap labour and earn pennies, they're powerful in aus and thats why our tradies are the highest paid in the world hahaha
>>515486945No it doesn't.Ask Canada Post. Upper management lose money had over fist and award themselves bonuses.Grunt employees' only recourse is strike action which management pushes to make them look bad.And where is their union? Pushing Palestine protests. I even know the chick who is probably behind that, who works for the union. Nice woman but suffers severe leftist brain rot.
>>515487873Nepotism is rife at unions.In the US the bigger unions were always aligned with the Mafia.
>>515492908American CEOs make way more than Aussie CEOs, even if you succeed in Australia and become a CEO you won't make a fraction of what you'd make in America LOL
>>515491097/this/I grew up in a union household. My father was a Teamster who supported himself, my mother (a stay at home mom) and five children. And he still retired a 58 years old, with a full pension.We also had full health insurance with no copay that payed for everything.The facts are that the 50's, 60's and 70's were the golden age of the American middle class, all due to strong private unions.
>>515493144are you a CEO?
>>515492829>muh labor theory of value commie troon detected. the value of workers wages would be far higher without jewish inflation and jewish importation of third world immigrants driving up the supply of labor. ywnbaw
>>515490441nice flag you faggot. here's some wipes to get that heeb seed out of your asshole. the only traitor here is your class traitor ass with your tongue permanently attached to another grown man's boot while you stare at him with hungry eyes. fuck off, go masturbate to Joe Rogan, and cry about how good your life will be once we deport the browns and you "start lifting". absolute fucking brainwashed Israeli clown that believes in a feelings based simulacrum of reality.
>>515493177Wouldn't you rather be a CEO than be in a union? >The facts are that the 50's, 60's and 70's were the golden age of the American middle class, all due to strong private unions.Or maybe it's because we actually went to Church and didn't have LGBTQ+ trannies destroying everything in sight.
>>515490550Mining and dangerous physical labour jobs are all that should be unionized.
>>515486558With propaganda as lame as that it's no wonder you get nowhere
>>515493250No, but im not a Tradie either.
>>515493318You are a traitor, your parents worked to build up companies and wealth for you and now you want that all be destroyed so you can larp as Che Guvara, not realizing he would be first to be sent to the Gulags if an actual communist takeover happened.Complete brainwashed loon.
>>515493366bruh
>>515493463Bruh
>>515492188I'm afraid you may be right friend. It's amazing isn't it.
>>515493543Then why are Americans the only people with rights?
>>515493360>get nowhereunions are strong here tho
>>515486558>>515486737unions should be formed on the fly and should be goal-based temporary gatheringsthey are way too easily manipulated by companies if they stay around for too long
>>515493705Yeah and Australia is a shithole with no freedom or rights.
>>515493327>maybe it's because we actually went to Church and didn't have LGBTQ+ trannies destroying everything in sight.Stop anon, just stop. You're embarrassing yourself.
>>515493854You literally said:>"The facts are that the 50's, 60's and 70's were the golden age of the American middle class, all due to strong private unions."I would be embarrassed to ever again leave my house if people knew I said something that stupid.
>>515493435>your parents worked to build up companies and wealth for youYeah and our parents were unionized
>>515493177>I grew up in a union household. My father was a Teamster who supported himself, my mother (a stay at home mom) and five children. And he still retired a 58 years old, with a full pension. >We also had full health insurance with no copay that payed for everything. >The facts are that the 50's, 60's and 70's were the golden age of the American middle class, all due to strong private unions.non-union workers enjoyed all that stuff too because it was before inflation and immigration ruined the value of money and the supply of labor. i grew up in a non-union household. my dad's non-union job paid well and we had great health insurance and now he has a great retirement from his pension and 401k from his non-union job. see how irrelevant anecdotes are? you should probably kill yourself for thinking otherwise
>>515493991No, they ran the companies that the unions tried to fuck over.
>>515494050You should thank a union worker anon
>>515494050We had higher birthrates back then.Today with low birthrates, you need continous immigration to boost GDP and wages.Want to go back to that? Go back to Church, start having kids.
>>515494308Or maybe thank the CEO/investor who hired you in the first place.
>>515493262He's talking about surplus value you illiterate monkey.By definition salaried workers are paid less than the value their labor provides in order for profit extraction to be possible, the interests of the employer and employee are fundamentally opposed.
>>515494286Quit larping as part of the owner class anon.But let's say you're being honest, then your opinion on working class issues doesn't mean shit
>>515494649>By definition salaried workers are paid less than the value their labor provides in order for profit extraction to be possible, the interests of the employer and employee are fundamentally opposed.By definition they're paid more than the actual value of their labor.A worker without an employer is unemployed... they literally produce ZERO value. It's only when the employer offers a job to the worker that he can begin producing value, but the independent variable here is the employer, not the employee.The more you're paid as a worker, the more incentive the employer has to FIRE YOUR ASS since you cost too much, and once you're fired you will be producing NOTHING
>>515494815>Quit larping as part of the owner class anon.You're the one larping as someone from a union household. Your parents weren't in unions.But even if they were, that just means you're biased and your opinion doesn't mean shit.
>>515494850>worker without an employer is unemployedNonsense. A profit extractor does not contribute to the production process at all.
>>515494364>Today with low birthrates, you need continous immigration to boost GDP and wages. this is a retarded argument. the only reason we must commit to "line always go up" is so our gdp can justify our massive national debt and future spending obligations (boomergibs/entitlements). a healthy society can have its population ebb and flow without causing a massive crisis. but yes the retarded liberals who insisted having children was bad for the environment for years and years are now making the same argument that you're making, that we must grow our population by replacing white people so "line keeps going up"
>>515494913Are you sure you're old enough to be on 4chan? You write as if you are twelve years old.
>>515494050>non-union workers enjoyed all that stuff too because it was before inflation and immigration ruined the value of money and the supply of labor.You have to factor in that if union workers were making good salaries, employers of non-unionized labour would need to raise their salaries to compete for competent workers.
>>515495149Even co-ops have CEOs.
>>515491433fucking retarded jew worshippers can't math. check out defense spending boss hog. billions to defend Israel.
>>515495224>/this/
>>515492902lmao brother what are you even saying. so butthurt when people tell you the truth you spaz out like Charlie Kirk and start talking about how I am what they hate? I live in a zip code with an average income of 30,000. Unlike you retarded virgins I have a life and go outside and talk to everyday people. go suck some more jew cock christcuck. fucking useful idiots the lot of you sky daddy cucks. when you die you will find out I was right.
>>515486558.t lazy low achieving tradie scumif you are a high achieving worker you will *always* get a better deal negotiating on your own vs collectively, which is why white collar workers typically don't have unions. we know what we are worth and how to get it.
>>515495352>fucking retarded jew worshippers can't math. >>check out defense spending boss hog. billions to defend Israel.already been answered itt. mandatory spending (entitlements) is the vast majority of federal spending every year, several times more than defense spending. you should kill yourself for being so ignorant on such common knowledge. obviously no money should go to israel but if you think "billions" is the problem you might be retarded. the problem is hundreds of billions/trillions
>>515495759You need privacy, we agree on that
>>515495277Our do My fellow Pekka but our system is not universal. Other nations have their own ways of running a co-op.
>>515495852tradies earn more than you
>>515493435my parents didn't graduate high school you kike lover.I love my life in opposition to this jew capital system. you worship a circumcised corpse and eat his body. I always said tranny and ID shit would destroy the left and it did. worker solidarity did not. get fucked bro sometimes there are poor people with brains that don't swallow the jew load bible bullshit.
>>515494850goddamn you hate yourself and love the jew so much. it's hilarious. this is why white civilization is going downhill, fat slobs like this low IQ fuck buying the christcuck myth and selling their families and country to kike capitalists.
>>515495852>which is why white collar workers typically don't have unions. we know what we are worth and how to get it.Historically yes but those days are dwindling fast. Just ask your jeet boss or coworker they'll tell you. Or better yet,ask groc or one of the other AI programs out there. They'll tell you the same.
>>515495277CEOs are employees. Massively overpaid employees because of the hellhole of fianncialized zombie capitalism, but still not capitalists. They do the biding and extract profit for the owners, investment firms, holdings companies, shareholders, private equity.
>>515496089>I love my life in opposition to this jew capital system.true jewish liberal capitalism is the problem but jewish commie leftism isn't the answer. white nationalist capitalism is the clear solution. you would care more about property rights if jewish capitalism hadn't made property ownership unattainable for the youngest two or three generations via inflation (jewish monetary policy + debt-funding boomergibs and israel wars) and ((immigration)). and also ((feminism)) drastically increased the supply of labor, reducing wages
>>515496075lol no. not for the same amount of hours. tradies get big bucks when they work 60hr weeks with OT and if they are on site.
>>515497126>/this/
>>515497383it is what it is
>>515495852White collar work is going to get absolutely hammered in the next recession. Tech jobs have become a dumpster fire. The white collar "workers" that will survive are the ones that can rely on nepotism and connections to get jobs. These are people that come from money to begin with.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-Ct2ReT2NMI know really smart guys from Waterloo (the top Leaf engineering university) with several internships that have been unemployed the last few years. One guy went back for a master's degree and is still unemployed.
What happened to this corporate cock sucking memeflaggot>>515494850 lol?His shift at Walmart must have started. Have fun stocking shelves for $7.25 an hour anon.
>>515497383Office wagies work unpaid overtime. I worked 7 in the morning until 1am in the morning the next day last week to meet a fake and gay timeline.
Looking for more information, got some confusion about some history.>Ford didn't want unions, tried to dramatically raise pay to incentivize against their formation>Dodge jews that made money off of Ford's success force them to favor shareholder profits over workers>workers get shafted, form unions>ceos and board executives actively work against unions because they don't want to get fired or sued for not maximizing shareholder profitsJews caused unions by legally crippling their competition, but simultaneously made unions ineffective due to the legal precedent they set? Was this a total jew victory? If so, why can't the majority white country just reverse the decision?
>>515486558Our unions killed our entire ship building sector. Good and bad I guess
>>515496869You hate yourself and that's why you want to larp against your wealthy parents.Champagne socialist.>>515498550I have work soon but i WFH
>>515499440No it's all bad.
>>515498278Historically white collar jobs were for the most part well paying and secure within the organization because the pool of university educated people was small compared to blue collar workers. Now with university degrees being a dime a dozen, the mass importation of foreign replacements and AI it's only going to get worse
>>515500141>Now with university degrees being a dime a dozen, the mass importation of foreign replacements and AI it's only going to get worseThere is an untold amount of studies that show a more educated population is more productive, has a higher GDP, and higher wages.AI will only boost GDP even more as companies become more efficient at producing value.Why is every left wing idea a retrogression to a more primitive society? A.I is bad because it works, people becoming more productive is bad, more workers is bad, etc.
>you must support the jewnions who just promote tranny and faggot shit as well as paradoxically mass immigration and don't give a fuck about the actual workers interests
>>515500513First part is 100% true but mass immigration is needed if you have low birthrates.Nothing worse for workers than a bad economy, an economy needs to have population growth. If it's not done via birthrates, you need immigrants.
>>515497126So what are you disputing? The existence of capital? You're just going to run a business with no resources? And if you say something like state-owned investment banks... that's the exact same as our current system of money-creating central banks which result in the current finance-capitalist system which I'm against.
>>515500141Yes it's a classic case of elite overproduction. They pushed the university meme onto the general population as a pressure release valve while they enacted outsourcing / insourcing / deindustrialization in the 1990s. It was their last hope of maintaining a middle-class standard of living.>>515500398GDP has become a fake measure of indebtedness. The more you indebt a population the more you increase its GDP.>Why is every left wing idea a retrogression to a more primitive societyA more primitive society is coming soon once we run out of oil. Every productive activity we're engaged in is moving civilization more rapidly towards this end.
>>515500936Facts, our system allows people to voluntarily invest their capital in enterprises, rather than have the State forcibly collectivize peoples' resources for their aim.>>515501283Facts. Automation benefits the workers too.
>>515486558No it isn't faggot, eliminating central banks and genociding all jews is.
>>515501283You have a point, and I agree that chubby fuck boomers enable the rot we are experiencing.Now imagine that 90% of union jobs are automated, and about 13 million union members lose their jobs. Too far gone to get an education, too high of expectations to clean toilets. That also doesn't mention the collapse of union trade schools and training facilities that may be non-unionized (think colleges that offer programs too).You now have a labor supply injection, as everyone that is desperate for a job will do anything for cheaper than the next guy. A tent and a loaf of bread will do for the moment. Because of that, while unions are antiquated, the dissolution will make modern society antiquated as a result. What is the solution to the US competing with slave labor overseas,
>>515502057We need a central bank though.
Unions are just a way for workers to use the power of collective bargaining to their benefit.That's all it is. Guess what? You better believe the company is using that power for themselves - any company with an HR department (or even just a recruiter) is using the services of someone whose entire skill set revolves around legal negotiations for your labor.Do YOU have the expertise to do that for yourself? I don't. Maybe salesmen do, but I spend my time developing the skills relevant to my profession instead. Any worker who doesn't support unions is saying "I want the company to have that power but I don't want that power for myself. I want the company to have extra informational advantages and negotiating leverage over me." which is a cuck mindset quite honestly.
>>515503681Companies compete with each other for workers all the time.
>>515503681In fact it's illegal for companies to collectively bargian. It's illegal under anti-competition legislation.
Also I'm not a leftist or a rightist. Left and right emerged during the French revolution after Bourbon dynasty shit up the place. I reject the cult of human progress and with it all marxism, leftism, capitalism, and industrialism.If I could spend the rest of my life as a monastic monk, feudal peasant I'd do it. No GDP, not much usury or debt, no Fiat currencies, no industrialization. These were the peak kino years of Western civilization.https://youtu.be/sX_r9R98DiY?t=3359
>>515503976That quote is bullshit because we had a near perfect system in the 1880s.
>>515502730A central bank is only needed in a civilization that has made money its God.
>>515502496>Too far gone to get an educationThey don't need an education, they need a job. We have too much credentialism these days. No one wants to hire anyone unless they have umpteen years of experience, a masters degree, and half a dozen different certifications. Fuck all that noise.And easy way to fix this is to abolish minimum wage and end mass migration. If people can hire someone for practically nothing, there is no reason not to... And getting your foot in the door is 90% of the battle these days. People who are good at their job will quickly rise through the ranks and make far more money. People that aren't... Welp, sucks to suck. We shouldn't build our entire economy around making sure idiots who's labor is worthless still have something to do.
>>515503903I know it's hard for you ESL shills to comprehend, but if one person (HR representative) is bargaining (negotiating with you with regard to your salary) on behalf of an entire collective (the company), then that's collective bargaining.>it's illegal under anti-competition legislation I wasn't going to address this because it's irrelevant as I pointed out above, but do you really think just because something is illegal that companies don't do it? When was the last time a company got anything more than a slap-on-the-wrist fine for anti-trust violations? They are CONSTANTLY colluding to suppress wages and raise prices. They don't even have to explicitly conspire to do it - if one company raises their prices, the others don't compete with them. They take it as a signal to raise their prices too! This shit happens all the time.You are a memeflag cuck shill and it is plain for everyone to see.
>>515504147>we had a near perfect system in the 1880s.Sweat shops, child labor, collapsing mines, limbs cut off by machinery etc. etc.Ahhh the good old days.
>>515504962>Calls me ESL>Can't even spit out a coherent sentence.>but do you really think just because something is illegal that companies don't do it? When was the last time a company got anything more than a slap-on-the-wrist fine for anti-trust violations? They are CONSTANTLY colluding to suppress wages and raise prices.You realize the reason there's so much crime is because the DOJ is too focused on non-existent corporate "collusion" than in dealing with actual threats to the nation right?>but if one person (HR representative) is bargaining (negotiating with you with regard to your salary) on behalf of an entire collective (the company), then that's collective bargaining.There's tens of thousands of other companies competing for workers.>>515505031Yes yes, a few limbs cut off by machinary is so horrible... lets just go back 600 years before when we had the black death kill a third of the population, so much better!!!
