Text (PDF): https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/download/pdf/Manifesto.pdf Audiobook: https://librivox.org/the-communist-manifesto-by-karl-marx-and-friendrich-engelsalso shoutout david graeber:https://files.libcom.org/files/__Debt__The_First_5_000_Years.pdf
>>516300743Not a fan of famines and gulags and political repressions and extrajudicial killing though
>>516300743I read capital and it was retarded
Zoomers cant read
>>516300743>just read some jewish grifter retard who had no understanding of economics or class structureNo.
>>516301009and of reading as well i assume? seems you dont know what the book is about actually
>>516301135desu if you thought das capital sucks , the manifesto isnt that much smarter , probably dont need to read it if u already know what its about (not commie stereotypes lol)
>>516301144rip
>>516301409Name one time that a country modelled on that book didn’t partake in the things I listed
I've read the communist party manifesto and it was absolutely retarded.The LTV has been aptly abandoned for 200 years for a reason, it's increasingly palpable how supply & demands affect the markets.
>>516301148yay newspaper cartoonist's opinion on an ideologies is my favorite way to know about it too! *sips choky milk like a retard*
>>516301585The mistake you're making is to believe that only fans has any value
>>516301148https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOFS0B5gDSc&t=120s
>>516300743I read books on engineering, not fictional bullshit and schizophrenic theories about why we need a dictatorship with a "people's" prefix attached to it to get rid of the previous ruling council.
>>516301540learn a new thing retard you should read the book (it aint that big fr) , and make your own opinion im not your mom , even if after you read it you keep insinuating gulags are encouraged by it idgaf , why would i spend time correcting your misconceptions on something you hallucinated and didnt even read bro
>>516301981>shitty societies founded by Marxist’s aren’t real bro you are hallucinating K
>>516301694>objective valueImagine being this retarded. You should study to be a knocker-up. Or a lamplighter.
>>516301912thats awesome! since you read books on engineering im sure you already understand how retarded it would be if i tried to argue against an engineering concept i never red about! and that i should instead educate myself on what other belive before debating their take. great! this reply should be useless then
>>516302110oh no u misunderstood me , its not the nations that are hallucinations its the notions that you have of communism without reading the book . like its there black on white .. why not read it
>>516300743Mein kampf? It’s just 1 book!
>>516301148
>>516300743Yes, I read the Turner Diaries cover to cover thricely now. Now fuck off.
>>516302183im not giving up my fat ass salary so you can have a pittance. Sorry anon
>>516301585Yeah marx underestimated the beast sooooo much its crazy.hey as long as you've read it man!
>>516302277Because there’s no point, all the people who read and abide by it go on to either be retards (you) or monsters (every Marxist leader ever)
>>516302285yeah! a good read especially if anyone ever wants to speak on the matter of nazism
>>516302401>the Turner Diariesnot the book i mentionned there bud not even same century lol
>>516302502Explain Christianity.
>>516302405dammit
>>516302660
>>516300743just gave it a short read, I mean I knew the basics what is in there but haven't actually read it - and now I still think its retardedit sounds like its written by someone that sees there are rich people and there are workers but he doesn't identify with the worker class, he just sees them as cogs that will produce output for a OCD style managed state
>>516300743lollmao evenThis is a board for Stormfront rejects, literal neonazi hooligans, whose idea of entertainment and intellectual edification is to screech "nigger" and "kike" at each other all day. Only 1 in 30 /pol/ users has a triple digit IQ. And you expect them to read and understand a book that has more text than pictures. Are you retarded or something? These men are what we call "the executive arm of the street". Disposable cannon fodder. You give them a crate of assault rifles, a target and a short webm cartoon that makes them angry and then explains to them why the target made them angry. You don't give them books, dumbass. What are they supposed to do with books?
>>516302587euh a religion , prophet and deliverer of the message is jesus christ , no idolatry , sacrifice yourself for god and society, dont make covenant as hard for gentiles, etc..i mean its christianity doubt i can explain in one message why?
>>516300743I have faggot, and in the end that homeless cocksucker admits he just wants everybody to die, including the pros. Get fucked
>>516302898oh no u misunderstood me , its not the spiritual that are hallucinations its the notions that you have of Christianity without reading the book.>like its there black on white .. why not read it
>>516303024I read the bible many times man what are u on about :v also the other montheistic scriptures >like its there black on white .. why not read itlike i said i did , jesus ? goated , he could have fucked the romans up , but chose to be based
>>516300743kill yourself
>>516303121sir yessir
>>516303024also i used to be the most argumentative cringydebateloving shitty atheist until i actualy red the fucking religious books i was insulting all day, (and realised its not the scriptures fault that the theists defneding them all this time were just low iq) and this is why im making this thread dingus
>>516302851well i mean you should actually read it then no ? lolafterwards you can think marx was autistic , non friendlt , or bourgeois himself thats your perogative
>>516302409Your religion of envy leads to millions dead, millions starving and a worse life for everyone you claim to try to be helping.You have no qualms about any of those consequences and imposing them on people that want nothing to do with it, because you're an arrogant retard, and should your wishes ever come to fruition, you'd be the one thrown in the gulags first, since thankfully commies are the best commie killers around.
>>516300743tldrcan tiktok instead?
>>516303487(religion? whatevs i know wat ur saying)hey i can only hope you are wrong in general. but if people want nothing to do with it it shouldnt be forced on them im sure we agree on that
>>516303530tss no can do gotta suffer
>>516300743>Just read the goddamn fucking book , its just one book and then at least ull knowlol, no, stupid
>>516301009>famines and gulagstell caesar to stop fucking with nature, and you wont have to suffer famines and gulags
>>516303915
>>516303464he's just like me, fr fr.makes me hate him even more, desu, senpai, on bog.
>>516303647>but if people want nothing to do with it it shouldnt be forced on them im sure we agree on thatIf you want to fuck off and start a voluntary commune in an uninhabited small plot of land I'd have no problem with that, I just don't want any whiff of your religion being imposed on an inhabited nation anywhere.
>>516300743Why would i read a book by someone who never worked?
>>516300743Is this translation decent?
>>516303996sorry fellow tard fren, but i wont eat the commie slop, i will not live in the commie slop, i will not submit to commie prods.i will parasite off the capitalisti will neet off the goy slavesthey want their shiny garbage, so i'll neet until they're in their graves.
>>516304160Because he put labour into the book, it’s not effective, efficient or valuable labour but you have to purchase it anyway
>>516304131I wouldnt want that eithermarx wouldnt want that eitherlenin wouldnt want that eitherstalin definetly would be okay with it lol
>>516304160its free , also to learn stuff for when you need to talk with someone about the topicText (PDF): https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/download/pdf/Manifesto.pdfAudiobook: https://librivox.org/the-communist-manifesto-by-karl-marx-and-friendrich-engels
>>516300743>"It's... not ok to make your dumbness other people's issue">advocates communismbruh
>>516304168honestly not sure ; i think it is ; apologize if it is not
>>516304497heh just read the book man
>>516304380Pretty much everything Stalin did was mentioned as acceptable in Lenin’s letters tho, forced collectivisation, gulag slaves, extrajudicial killing, show trials, terror as a policy, all a okay according to Lenin
>>516304562I have read the book and was thoroughly unimpressed. You are operating under the wildly false assumption that your opponents:>simply haven't read your foundational text>upon reading said text, would necessarily agree with itAs many others have pointed out, the labor theory of value has been affirmatively empirically disproven. Historical materialism is, at best, propganda or a false religion.
>>516304562Hey bro, I read it and I also studied it a lot.I don't agree with a single point in the book, ama. Or should I start asking you questions?
>>516300743
>>516304562>just drink the poison man>how do you know it will make you shit your pants and die? you've never had anyDude, this ideology killed hundreds of millions. I don't need to read it to know it's retarded.Rhetoric can sound incredibly logical and at the same time appeal to our greatest desires and fears. But that's just our ape brains. The true test is the empirical test. The real world.And when that book was applied to the real world, the biggest genocides in history took place.
>>516301009
>>516304380>marx wouldnt want that eitherThe book you just linked says otherwise. It says Marx literally wants to steal my things, as they exist now, and make it the state's property.I shouldn't be surprised you lied, since all commies are snakes.
>>516304711oh mm a looot of people didnt read it ,im assuming now that you specifically did, which is great! and if we were to ever meet that would be great! cause we could directly actually talk about it and your quarels with it etc.. but yeah this thread is mainly here to encourage people to read it first , the same way i should understand at least the basics of free markets and their advantages before i insult them.If you care to share why the labor theory of value is empirically disproven feel free to do so man
>>516302392That's hilarious! saved
>>516300743Read it as a kid. Totally retarded. Tankies are the dumbest people on Earth.
>>516300743i read it as a teen and found it to be low iq trash
>>516304993seems you havent read the book , and insist on speaking on something you havent read , you should read it and then speak about it.
>>516305024That was a chill and respectful response. Good for you man. I can't stick around for more conversation, but I wish you the best. People who are willing to have a conversation are rare in this world anymore, and it gives me just a little bit more hope for the future.
>>516305024>If you care to share why the labor theory of value is empirically disproven feel free to do so manIt's wrong because the whole theory is built around the concept of surplus value, while completely disregarding the "deficit value" concept.I'll give you an example. Suppose that a "capitalist" has inherited a piece of land that he now sells for 100k and wishes to try his luck and test his skill in business. He uses that 100k to organize capital as well as labor. He begins the manufacturing process and .... he fails. It's a complete disaster, due to his lack of experience or any other hundred reasons why a business could fail (majority of businesses do fail).So now, the "capitalist" is no longer a capitalist, he has nothing. While the worker is in fact a salaried man. Worker was paid for his work without the value produced. He STOLE the money from the capitalist for his work was not verified on the market.This is equally ridiculous as the whole marxist theory of economics, but it would make perfect sense in that theoretical framework. Of course, this example could easily be explained with normal (capitalist) economics, where market is just a sum of the competition forces along with luck and social reality.
>Thinks I'm going to waste my time digesting kike propaganda specially designed for the goyim.>It's okay to be dumb but not make your dumbness other people's issues.OP is a special kind of dumb
>>516305021>It says Marx literally wants to steal my thingsthe word 'steal' is nowhere in the text , you must not know what 'literally' means ...okay so the paragraph u posted, hes talking about how we take the private branches/means of production (not your private property like your underwear or car , we dont need those they are usuless to us as a society) and own them communely , so you for example who is afraid of people "stealing your things" like you said (feels like talking to a cartoon 5 year old) don't have to fear anything from this paragraph , but also you get to communly decide in what your society produces yay!
>>516305228you have a good one man
>>516300743is never okay to be a jew
>>516305524He literally says “private property must therefore be abolished”Did you even read it bro fr fr it’s not long
>>516303464>well i mean you should actually read it then no ? lolare you also retarded? can you read? I just wrote i read it>only works if he wants to (and probably only what he wants to, write stuff down is his work)I dont think he sees himself like a worker in a factory that can't just decide yeah no I make these pieces in a couple of days...that's why its not working
>>516305524A community is not wiser than the market of unconscious forces, as has been demonstrated countless times."Theft" is never explicitly mentioned, but always implied. What do you think "redistribution of resources" means? Redistribution = theftIt's as I were to invent a world swiftheading (to swiftly behead someone) without saying that we should execute someone. "See, we're not talking about killing anyone, just about swiftheading them".
>>516305464hmm >So now, the "capitalist" is no longer a capitalist, he has nothing.after the capitalist failed , he became a worker , not nothing ; if the rules of society are fair for workers , if a businessman fails they still live a respectful dignified life.>While the worker is in fact a salaried man. if the business failed the worker also lost his job, and will find a new job , he is also affected altho he made no decisions and would not have share in the spoils in case of success>He STOLE the money from the capitalist for his workwhat?
>>516305524have you even read it? > (not your private property like your underwear or car , we dont need those they are usuless to us as a society)>carit even says >Centralisation of the means of communication and transport in the hands of theState.
>>516305697yes and it must be replaced by " the common utilization of all instruments of production andthe distribution of all products according to common agreement " that dosnt sound good to you?you dont like the common utilization of instruments of production? (so that people can produce without needing to beg the overlord inheritooor to produce for them)or you dont like the distribution of all products according to common agreement ??you prefer it when its distributed without agreement? whoever gets it (no matter how he gets it) keeps it, like savages ?
>>516305794Maybe you should go and actually study that theory and not just spend your time on Reddit.The example I gave you is very precise and your response to it completely shows the flaws of the whole theory. If you knew anything about it, you would know understand what you just did.1) Capitalist cannot become a worker, for capital is always multiplying itself. In marxists theory, it's impossible for a capitalist to fail. All capital engagement is profitable, because workers ALWAYS produce value, not matter how good they work.Which is nonsense, thus the example I gave.2) But how can the worker receive a salary if his work was not confirmed on the market? He cannot receive salary if he did not produce any value? How is this possible? It shouldn't me in marxist theory.Which is nonsense, thus the example I gave.3) The worker exploited the capitalist for the worker tricked the capitalist into paying him what he was not worth, because the market did not value the work of the worker.
>>516306063Are you above 100IQ and older than 12?Do you believe everything you read and assume that things are true and will work just as you've read and imagined them? Are you aware that people lie?Are you even aware what "political-economy" means? POLITICAL. POLITICAL. THINK ABOUT THAT? What does POLITICAL MEAN?Political means the control of the masses, thus political economy is based around creating a thinking framework about how economy works that can be used to MOTIVATE THE IGNORANT MASSES.
>>516305915euh yes i did , so the screenshot is talking about the means of production , and how they should be available to all (aka DEcentralised)"Centralisation of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the"is another part,
>>516306063Oh so now it does say it’s taking private property from people, but that’s actually a good thing? You argue like you wear a tiny hatWhat about the common agreement part? I don’t agree that you should get what I produce so that you can write slam poetry in seattle while moderating r/itwillworkthistime, does that mean I go to gulag? Or would my disagreement be accepted?
instead of reading that shity book that over elaborates over points into something that can be described in a few paragraphs i decided to look up criticisms of the book insteadthe critics seem heck'n valid, sorry pal
>>516306269>so the screenshot is talking about the means of production , and how they should be available to all (aka DEcentralised)kek are you that stupid you can read a document about centralization and think somehow a magical dream decentralized structure comes out of it? one that no one talks about except in their mental gymnastics?>"Centralisation of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the"next sentence we are at centralization again - and you just skip the whole part of having your own means of transportation
>>516306328>You argue like you wear a tiny hatfirst time i ever heard this and its great lolwhat he is talking about in that paragraph is private property in the means of production so privately owning a factory , privately owning a filming studio privately owning a thing that allows us humans/society to produce things in an industry (so not your son's bike or your socks)>What about the common agreement part?common.agreement if we dont agree , and then i kill you thats obviously not a common agreement lol >I don’t agree that you should get what I produce so that you can write slam poetry in seattle..obviously i wouldnt agree to this either , i do personally think that its normal for a select few members of society to do art, dont you?
>>516300743reading is boring. iracing my bmw gt4 against others is a bit more fun.
>>516306730No it says clear that since private property cannot be separated from competition and individual management of industry so it must be abolishedRead it againAlso can a bike or socks be produced and sold for value? Then it’s a “good” that will fall under the communal ownership of goods right? You are dialectically tying yourself into a pretzel mate, it’s right there in plain writing but you think it says something completely different
>>516301409The communist manifesto literally tells people to commit violence.
>>516301148socialism sounds great but what if you only have one cow?
>>516307114>my bmw gt4No it’s all of ours comrade, let me have a spin
>>>516300743I now denounce Yehovah. Selah. > I now cannibalize Yehovah. Amen.
>>516301981>why would i spend time correcting you?because you want the person to learn what you want him to? what a stupid wuestion.
>>516300743I read that already and it's just utopian opium ramblingstry these, they have interesting comparisons to be drawn with the real state and you can tell whether someone is familiar with both the reality and the document by the way they respond to eachen.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manifesto_of_the_Fascist_Intellectualssjsu.edu/faculty/wooda/2B-HUM/Readings/The-Doctrine-of-Fascism.pdf
>>516307191come round blud and you can have a drive
itt: bots
>>516300743Why should I read it when I can read history to see what communists actually did when they got into power
>>516300743no
>>516307145I think we are misunderstanding each other here , and i fear I dont have a clear sentence to give.I believe the screenshotted paragraph talks about the means of production . a bike/sock can be produced ofc , what we want to collectivise is what produces them , and not the objects themselves. I personally do not want your things and im trying to communicate that no communist wants your things just the means of productions so we can decide together (not sharholders) of what to produce(do u know the distinction between private and personal property ?)
>>516300743why?seriously, no serious communist revolutionary in this age gives a shit about whatever marx wrote aboutthey stopped caring when ww1 proved him wrong about capitalismitalian fascism has more in common with orthodox marxism than either do to the progressive current of today
>>516307684>I personally do not want your things and im trying to communicate that no communist wants your thingsExept every time in history when communism was implemented they did want peoples things and murdered them to get them
>>516307290you are right 100% to be honest, but its very hard to argue/debate (not teach) with people from 0 without them not having the basics of the subject ,
>>516307832bruhread the book , ask more communists , get out of your own head
>>516307863its true but you’re going to have to work hard to see the change you want. personally i just want whatever allows me to sit indoors gaming for 10 hours a day while i take breaks to walk the dog,feed the cat, and water my sarrcenia.
>it's okay to be dumb, goy
>>516308033godspeed man sounds lovely
>>516301148>buy a bull
>>516308011Checked, communists always lie and theory that Marx puts out is not only retarded but delusional, so we can only look at what communists actually did when they took power and thats almost without exeption mass murders and mass theft of private property, mass incarceration and so on
>>516308094Its more than okay is what nixon said
>>516308145checked? cool
>>516307684Oh thank you so much for letting me keep socks mate, what about my house, my land, my tractor, the grain I produce? Sounds like you do want my stuff
>>516308033kek you can only do that in current society and not in one that everyone has their share of the means of production. because that means you actually have to do stuff
>>516308237Newfag
>>516308175whats wrong with having an abundance in highly educated people? also is that the roger freeman of British descent? he went to oxford uni so was probably some masonic cunt.
>>516307863>>516308011>>516308101>>516308175So you came here to talk about the book, and will just ignore my posts?
>>516308274>you have to do stuffmeh, ill run away and find a bunker somewhere, rig up an extension cable and game to my hearts content. i doubt there will be people looking for random folks.
>>516308455That’s why they make internal passports and the checka/kgb and also make it a crime for anyone who knows and doesn’t report you
>>516308257you're welcome, it would be retarded to give you a product made from the means of production we have and then ask you to share it as if we couldnt make more now that we have the means of prod. only a retard would even think we would take ur socks right? a retard that never read the book and that should read the book so he stops being so embarassing right?house ? personal property tractor / grain ? not personal property yes sorryif your neighbor dosnt have grain, the tractor and other farming tools ofc should be used to provide for him , or for you and your kids if you were in his shoes , and he was hoarding the means of prod.If you monopolise grains or anything of the sort maybe like 'Monsanto' currently you do deserve death sorry to say. because we live in a society and need to act like it.
>>516308455too bad that's a crime, I think you need some reeducation
>>516308411i came here to get people to read the book if they have the time and they want to.saw your replies didnt want to answer further , you should paste them into chatgpt or smthng maybe
>>516308559i have literally no friends left so there will be nobody to miss me. ive thought about every conceivable angle except for burying the extension cord. well, i have now. kek>>516308928catch me if you can, commie… lol
>>516308922Why should I make grain if you are going to take it and make me eat two minute noodles? It’s not like you worked to earn enough to buy the land, the equipment, fertiliser, water, you want a cut of the product you can front some capital
>>516309276>why would i produce grainso you can eat?
>>516309354So I’ll make enough just for me and mine and you can starve
>>516309075But wait, that doesn't make sense. You are are speaking with other people here and replying to their questions.And second, what's the point of reading the book and asking others to read it if you yourself don't understand it or can't read it? If YOU read the book, then I assume you're aware of what's in it and based on your flags and postings you agree with it. So it should be a simple to thing to answer my posts.Unless, you're just doing this for propaganda.
>>516309276so yeah mm one very important thing is thatmarx built a system he didnt just shoot a single idea;If you buy the land, the equipment, fertiliser, water and do everything yourself of course society has no right to your labor bro .but why let you struggle on your won like an animal which then give you an exuse to keep everything for yourself like a savage?why not cooperate in a society , together from each according to his ability to each according to his needs. so that production is easy + cooperative and the rewards are shared .do you long for misery?
>>516300743Why don't you tell us your favorite quotes from this book you've totally read?
>>516309593Are you really this pathetic?
>>516309685beebee booboo we live in society
>>516309464so the main reason is that i have nothing to say that will advance the convo with u bud, or that would be useful to you.our 2 starting points are too far away and i dont have the mind to meet you where u are
>>516301488>(not commie stereotypes lol)lolMarx himself was the proto-commie stereotype.
>>516309593>If you buy the land, the equipment, fertiliser, water and do everything yourself of course society has no right to your labor bro .I asked the peasants in Tambov (and about 360 other places) in 1920 and they said that’s bullshit and you are stealing their grain at gunpoint so they are rebelling> why not cooperate in a societyWhy cooperate with people who are trying to rob me of my labour?> so that production is easy + cooperative and the rewards are shared .Why should the reward be shared if the input of capital (which is the result of labour) is not shared?
>>516309866lol first time i see this thanks for sharing
>>516309593>>516310101All your arguments are boiling down too:>come on bro just give me your stuff bro, you can keep your socksWhich makes sense since Marx spent his whole life begging Engels to pay for everything
>>516310186okay , mm im pretty sure that not what i said ; but thats what you heard and thats okay.read the book then, obviously better and more eloquent arguments there;
>>516310441Even if I read it you would tell me that it actually means something different like with excerpt earlier in the threadBut thank you for proving that people who agree with the book are retarded
Thessalonians 2:15 They have killed OUR Lord Jesus Christ and their prophets. They work against God and are the enemies of all MANKIND
>>516310878unless im inside your head 24/7 i cant do that and ull be able to have your own opinion like a big boi yay
>>516300743OP's pic is a grave insult to the DNC.
>>516300743marx talks about bourgeoisie like hitler talks about jews. are the bourgeoisie jews?
>>516309856Intellectual coward.
>>516300743>hegelian dialectic reframed as class struggleyou're peddling outdated and retarded philosophical drivel
>>516300743are the proletariat gentiles?
>>516309593Sorry, but I'd rather work for myself and only produce enough food for myself and my family then produce an abundance of food that I then have to give to the leeches.
>>516300743The 20th century just called, and they want their political struggle back.
>>516300743Engels had nothing to do with the CM. Marx hired him to be his cover goy so everyone wouldn't immediately call it jew slop, which it is. t. also read Das Kapital If you want to know what socialism was before kikes subverted it, read Eugen Dühring's The Jewish Question as a Racial, Moral, and Cultural Question; 1981.
>>516313536>1981 1881*