Religion isn't based on intelligence, it's based on faithSome of the smartest fags ever to have lived were religiousHating religion is just reddit tier retardation
>>519843064>pronlem
Lets me guess, they included muslims and hindus in the study?
>>519843064Both are not incompatible. I'd say religion can bring in the idea that science cannot and will not be able to explain everything. But it's dangerous to rely on it without any critical thinking.Also faith helps at times, life has never being entirely encompassed by any means we know of.
>>519843323Faith is based on lack of intelligence
>>519843064The 'pronlen' with atheism is you have to be 'Neurodivergent' to fall for it. In other words, a spaz or a sped. Yeah sure those 'gifted' atheist spergs get high scores in school, once school is over and they are forced to enter the real world, they're fucked. Up a creek without a paddle and certainly without a prayer. That's why atheists have the highest suicide rates among any other demographic
>>519843323In what other circumstance is it blind faith seen as good?
>>519843064You abandon your mind to god.For all the questions "Why? What?..." etc. you throw "God" as answer and move on.
>>519844280Some of the greatest scientific breakthroughs in the world were made by the faithful, you devolved vermin.
>>519844432Risk & Reward. People who risk more tend to thrive more. People averse to risk tend to rot more. Faith is innate to any species and is instrumental for adaptation. To adapt is to survive, and to throw oneself into adaptation it requires a degree of faith. Atheists don’t adapt, they barely take risks, they have no faith. Not just in God, but typically of life in general and especially of themselves.
>>519844556they were just pretending to believe to fit in. can you blame them? religious zealots are not exactly known for their tolerance of different opinions.
>>519844614That's not blind faith, retard. Taking risks has nothing to do with gullibility. The fact that you are aware of the risk means you're not acting blindly.
>>519844725It’s still blind faith, because to claim the contrary that you are not blind makes you ironically blind. You are not a psychic, you’re not a fortune teller, you cannot predict the future 100%, and you cannot account for every variable or their consequences out of every decision you ever make, especially when other agents of free will are concerned. The atheist fools themselves that they are not blind, and this makes them blinder than most. You can be aware of risk, but at the end of the day you still have to jump and take it. And that requires allowing those unforeseen variables to play out. And atheists almost never want to do that, that’s why a majority of them lead soulless lives.
Yaaaawn
>>519843323>Some of the smartest fags ever to have lived were religiousThey don't, smart people lie about their views all the time.
>>519844868How do you know the billions of atheists personally?
>>519843064Do not fall for glownigger divide & conquer tactics.Christianity is the definition of "right wing" political ideology:- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left%E2%80%93right_political_spectrum#Origins_in_the_French_RevolutionChristianity has always been a racist religion:>"Oh, race of Franks, race from across the mountains, race chosen and beloved [...]">"the kingdom of the Persians, an accursed race, a race utterly alienated from God [...]"- https://www2.cbn.com/article/church/pope-urban-iis-speech-calling-first-crusadeThe racist and anti-semitic Confederates have always been Christian.The National Socialists used the Celtic cross and gave out iron cross medals for bravery. The white term for "swastika" is hakenkreuz, meaning hooked cross.- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HakenkreuzbannerHere's a growing list of Christian political commentators who are racist and anti-semitic:- https://rentry.org/Deus_VultFeel free to reply to this post with others.Educate boomers irl. If you don't preach to them, the anti-Christian kikes will:- https://news.antiwar.com/2025/10/06/israel-to-spend-up-to-4-1-million-in-propaganda-campaign-targeting-american-christians/israeli nationalism ("zionism") is a heresy:- https://youtu.be/GKlT-hhZXoM&t=658s- https://youtu.be/odNoExd8a5U- https://youtu.be/rp92-3aBL-AThe "holocaust" (burnt offering) is a lie made up by kikes, both soviet and freemason:- https://rumble.com/c/ScriptureandTraditionFrJM/videosBoycott israeli products:- https://bdsmovement.netCommon glownigger talking points:>"jesus is a kike"The word "kike" comes from "kikel", which means circle. The kikes hate the cross so much, they would sign documents with a circle, hence the nickname.- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plus_and_minus_signs#Alternative_plus_sign>"off topic"Reminder the pope is the monarch of a country. In fact in many white nations there is no separation between church and state.
>>519844701You are delusional, believing all faithful must be zealots. You are not capable of comprehending the mind of a religious scientist. It is above you.
>>519843064How is this a surprise? Most religious places in the world are countries with an average IQ of like 70
>>519847391>You are delusional, believing all faithful must be zealotsNo one said that retard. Even a small portion of zealots are enough to keep others in line
>>519848065>Even a small portion of zealots are enough to keep others in lineSomething the atheist understands very well, after all, they practice zealotry too, but they replace the components of it with their own ideals. They even have their own 10 commandments really.>Thy shall do what thy want>Thy shall not tolerate intolerance>Thy shall not discriminate>Thy shall not misgender your neighbourSo on and so on. They even have their own version of 'Original sin' too, they just call it 'Privilege'.
>>519848487kek, I need not elaborate. Lefty atheism in particular is just slavish faith in institutions with God stripped out. All the language, behaviors, and many of the little rituals remain, just secularized.
People with low IQ have PROFOUNDLY STRONG common sense because their brain can’t process complex and fancy ways of thinking. People with high IQs are smart enough to understand complex ideas but see thru the athiest psyop and recognize it as the most midwit position possible. Atheism is literally an entire mindset revolving around DESPERATELY needing people to think you are smart because you ARE smarter than the average but nothing too much above it, creating the world inferiority complex and need to pretend to be smart. Whereas the genius, loves looking stupid and thinks it’s funny when a midwit thinks they’re smarter than them for holding the mindset given to them by MSNBC.
>>519849042>Hehe, atheists are such midwits, I'm so smart.>Believes in virgins giving birth and talking snakes.??
>>519849526>believes in vapid materialism and that nothing exists for a purpose>sneering arrogancemidwit confirmed
>>519850194>no argument against believing in virgin birth>Y...YOU'RE ARROGANTdimwit confirmed
>>519850194Also, I don't believe that nothing exists for a purpose. I know christkikes exist to help kikes rule over the goyim.
Atheists have only partially functional brains.
>>519850327I could show you DNA evidence recovered from the weirdness surrounding the Eucharist, and you'd call it a fraud, no matter the evidence. You have neither eyes to see, nor ears to hear, on matters of theology. You are spiritually and morally inert.
>>519843064Whenever you see the word 'intelligent' just mentally substitute with the word 'midwit'. This will match the actual data in the study.
>>519850649You don't even comprehend what "jew" means, you reprobate fool. There were no "jews" in a recognizable sense before the seething Pharisees, whose name literally means "set apart", wrote their filthy Talmud. Before, there were Hebrews.
>>519843064>professing themselves as wise, they became foolsMany such cases
>>519850756>Here goy look at the (((DNA evidence))) if you don't believe it you're a fraud!!!Hilarious. Mary was a whore who cheated on his husband and lied, and billions of idiots eat it up.
>>519850849>Our kike on a pike wasn't a jew!!!!Christkike cope. Many such cases.
>>519850887>>519850959seething kikes detected, I'm not even Catholic
>>519843713Or Mexicants.>>519844174The genuinely faithful are to let the Holy Spirit guide them, it's more complex than the atheist conception.>>519843323Atheists are peak midwit. I think they reject religion, usually wholesale, because they have difficulty grasping abstract concepts. They get their degrees by being good memorizers and playing the social game of flattery and promotions well.
>>519850959Le sigh
>>519851083>SEETHING KIKESOne person retard. I denounce the talmud and everything derived from it, including your jewish goyslop religion. Can you say the same?
>>519850709>by shutting down the threat processing center of the brainSo theists are cowards. Either they're too afraid of reality to see clearly or they're too afraid of an imaginary demon to see clearly.
>>519843064That's what she said.>[4:5] Do not entrust the incapable ˹among your dependants˺ with your wealth which Allah has made a means of support for you—but feed and clothe them from it, and speak to them kindly.
>>519851371>So theists are cowards. Either they're too afraid of reality to see clearly or they're too afraid of an imaginary demon to see clearly.Lmao. Are you reading your own words? You respond to a post that shows literal brain damage can cause atheism, and you count this as a W? I’m not surprised, though. Atheists are reductionists. They consider reducing themselves down to nothing as virtuous.
>>519843064Atheism requires courage because you are admitting that there is nothing else after this life. It also requires lack of ego because you are accepting that you are nothign but a talking primate living on a rock. Religious people do not possess this courage or humility. >>519843323The disguised boast of the religious coward slave. "Some smart people have been religious therefore I smart because I am religious". Typical behaviour because religious belief is rooted in self importance and intellectual cowardice. Some of the the smartest people in the past may have been religious because in the past religion was rammed down people's throats from an early age but even then you are misrepresenting human history because most intelligent people have shunned religion for centuries.>>519851705>Atheists are reductionists. They consider reducing themselves down to nothing as virtuous.Another fine example of what I am talking about. The self importance and cowardice of the Religious peasant slave.
>>519851297Upper case T kike. Then you go lie to God and say>oy vey God I dont denouce the "T"almud, oy vey, I denounced "the talmud" oy vey im not lying oy vey!fucking kike rat
>>519851297I have already called the Talmud filth, you do not even comprehend that Christianity is pre-Talmud, because you are a pagan imbecile, likely not even an atheist.
>>519851939I denounce the Talmud.There you go shitskin kike lover. What now?
There is no god. When you die there will be nothingness forever.
>>519843064>Hey reddit, lack of religiouscity correlates with an IQ of 110! Who's gonna tell him
>>519843064What's the p-value, sample sizes, and methods of population selection? Without a property analysis, OP is just a faggot making baseless claims of grandeur off wording
>>519843323the main reason why people like religion now is because the left went batshit
>>519851981Ok fair, I confused Torah with Talmud. Not like it makes you christfags any less of kike loving cunts.
The midwit meme is starting to feel like "two more weeks" applied to intelligence. "Just two more standard deviations above the mean and surely they'll all start agreeing with me."
>>519851111>I think they reject religion, usually wholesale, because they have difficulty grasping abstract conceptsI don't reject religion. I just don't see why I need to believe in your personal feelings about God
>>519850709>God is a figment of the imagination Lmao
>>519843064The problem with atheism is that retards conflate "smug and illiterate" with "methodological and well researched". No, a pithy one liner isnt a philosophical position, it's a t shirt slogan. At least fedora atheists read and tried.
>>519843064You unlock it by turning the banana key in youe anus
>>519843064Faith and belief are different from religion. Religion is just a framework some use to express and understand their belief. You can have faith and beliefs and not subscribe to a religion, but you can't the other way around without being a liar. Some religions are benign while others are not.Atheists are people that have faith there's no higher level or power. Usually become it's trendy where they're from, or they just want to be selfish assholes without converting to Judaism.
>>519851787You contradict yourself by saying most intelligent people were religious then saying the opposite. Atheism has led only to decline in community and the nuclear family. You basically worship yourself. You simply replace God with the state. Without God there are no inalienable human rights as its decided by the state. The rise of atheism is directly correlated with the moral decline and fall of the West.
Abrahamism is fucking retarded. Theres no reason whatsoever to believe that nonsense
>>519844533Hatefilled incorrect assumption.
>>519853467Sure. It's socially and existentially productive. Now what?
>>519853513Its literally not
> I don’t worship anything without evidence that’s why I believe in logicMore like smart enough to be retarded
>>519853399>Atheists are people that have faith there's no higher level or power.Incorrect. I lack belief until evidence sufficient enough convinces me. No "faith" needed.
>>519853578>Believe>LogicYou don't believe logic, logic is just a description of mechanisms in reality and concepts
>>519853541Oh, Mr. Retard Hyperbolic Shitpants, what a well researched and structured argument. Truly i cower before your atheistic might, thank goodness God has my back; I'd be in a morally vacant void of relativism and beset with ennui otherwise.
>>519853399>Usually become it's trendy where they're fromThis is the thing. Being intelligent or educated doesn't make you privy to some secret knowledge inaccessible to the plebs. In a setting, such as in university, where. The messaging is that religion is for idiots and that to be intelligent you have to be an atheist then there's a good chance that's what you're going to so
>>519843323Nothing more midwit than being a devout atheist.
>>519850194>there has to be a divine purpose in lifeSubwit confirmed.
>>519853693>I'd be in a morally vacant void of relativism and beset with ennui otherwise.I never understood why people need to leap to supernatural to understood morality. It's observable with or without it
>>519853693Ok chat gpt bot, nice cope
>>519851939>if you don't respect jewish books you're jewishMemeflags rape kids.
>>519853716>being a devout atheist.Retard tier understanding. Atheism is just a lack of belief in God or gods.
>>519844533Thats nonsense. Science wouldn't exist if that were true. Belief in God encouraged people to seek out answers to understand His creation. It inspired curiosity and scientific advancement much more than being a nihilistic fuck that believes in nothing
>>519853579Not surprised you don't realize we basically said the same thing. Also not surprised because atheists love to be an argumentative asshole who gets dopamine hits when they always try to be right. Kind of why they're generally insufferable selfish assholes and the least genuine people because their motives, even in helping others, is self based.
>>519844280All knowledge is ultimately faith.
>>519843064>83 STUDIES>EIGHTY-THREEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!baffled with bullshit
>>519843064>"meta-analysis"Wow they asked a bunch of smart people at an atheist convention if they were atheist then went to a mental asylum and asked them if they "believe".
>>519853787Because it's socially productive. It's a quick, thorough, and logical position that can be explained with the categorical imperative to even the dullest dolt to get them to be productive instead of self maximizing. Personally, I'm a structural utilitarian in a post modern framework, but that's a lengthy can of worms.>>519853805Bruh, how often does chat gpt call you a retard and insult you sarcastically while proving a point?
>>519853951>we basically said the same thing.No we didn't. Nor can you explain how >Also not surprised because atheists love to be an argumentative asshole who gets dopamine hits when they always try to be right. Kind of why they're generally insufferable selfish assholes and the least genuine people because their motives, even in helping others, is self based.This is a projection. A tantrum you're giving because you can't stand criticism for your ignorance
>>519854040Retards who worship a jewish foreskin genie need help trying to appear as though theyre capable of engaging the topic
>>519854042
>>519843064I was atheist 35 years ago when I was 15. I grew out of it pretty quickly because it's retarded lmao.
>>519853951>their motives, even in helping others, is self based.If christkikes didn't think they were getting good goy points for being charitable none of them would do it. Everything you do is to ensure you personally go to jew heaven because you're afraid of shaytan.
>>519854089>I believe in jewish fairy talesLel
>>519854040None of this actually answers my question
>>519852034All you have is baseless ad hominem. Muhammad is a gay pedophile though. Jews and followers of judaism hate Christ. He was fighting against the pharisees who were the precursors to modern day judaism
>>519854129Believing it's that simple. Oh to be a child again lmao.
>>519854136>None of this actually answers my questionWhat's supernatural about the bible?
>>519854084Seems I broke you, adorable. Not only are you too stupid to understand I'm fundamentally a nihilist, you're too stupid to understand the structure of supporting arguments against your position.>>519854136Seems you are also too stupid to understand the argument. Let me break it down like you're five:>big sky man offer infinity smile points>but only if you dont stab grub>if you stab grug you lose infinity smile points and go to sad frown land>want sad frown land? Be big mean.>want smile happy land? Do good stuff that make many smile, but cost you some smile
>>519854270Why would i believe fairy tales? There are no compelling reasons to convert to jewish fairy tales
>>519854247>this other jewish fairytale guy is a gay pedoKek
>>519854330Is this a serious question? It can't be.
>>519854381>Still no proof of his sky rabbiLel
>>519854401>Is this a serious question? It can't be.Name something supernatural about a book.
>>519854381>Demonstrate his beliefs are retarded.Thanks, I already knew that. Still doesn't answer the question. Rather it demonstrates group think.So the actual answer is tribalism amd survival in said tribe
>>519854381The religious are overrepresented among the prison population so clearly you're not understanding that the jewish social credit system you like doesn't work.
>>519843064>t. the men can get pregnant crowd
>>519854442This isn't a serious question. Got it
>>519854523>Women can get pregnant without sex crowd
>>519854104Doing good deeds doesn't get you into Heaven. Only belief in Christ does. We can't earn our way to Heaven. Everybody does things in self interest. You get good goy points from society and the benefit of people liking you more. Nobody is truly selfless
>>519854523Amen sister
>>519854572
>>519854572>Nobody is truly selflessThanks for agreeing.
>>519854572>Doing good deeds doesn't get you into Heaven. Only belief in Christ does. We can't earn our way to HeavenThe DEI of religions
>>519853463>Without God there are no inalienable human rightsRights such as?
>>519854572Take you meds. None of those things exist.
>>519854417Are you actually this stupid? That has nothing to do with my central premise: that it's socially and existentially productive to have a formal ontology.>>519854497That's not what I believe. Would you like to reread and try again?>>519854502But it does. The prison population feels enough guilt to put themselves in a redemptive framework to justify their socially malicious aspects. Without it as a control group, there would be no justification for rehabilitation at all othrr than subjective relativism, particularly among idiots.
The atheist model for creation and existence is a meaningless explosion which allowed sulfuric acid to breed with rocks to create amino acids which decided to evolve in to bacteria which evolved in to fish which evolved into T-Rex which evolved into chickens and apes and BOOM you are here.Even Grok couldn't calculate the astronomical number of zeros in the probability of that happening. (Don't make me reply and explain).So no, actually, atheists aren't smart, they are just in open rebellion against God.
>>519854400Seems like your the gay one as you take completely innocent phrases and think its about butt sex. Thats really creepy. You know thats about converting people. You argue like a jew and play ignorant of what it actually means. The Bible condemns homosexuality also
>>519854684>Worshipping jews and their foreskin genie is productive Its not
>>519854693God doesnt exist moron. Take your meds and go to the dentist
>>519843064Fake stats, anti-Christian propaganda. In every field of science, PhD level people find that the Bible is true, Christianity is correct. I studied economics, and we all know that Christian society based economies are the most stable, most prosperous.
>>519853463>Without God there are no inalienable human rightsNot really. As it takes man to define God, then man to define these inalienable rights, then man to enforce and defend said rights
>>519854684>That's not what I believeThat's what you just demonstrated
>>519843064
>>519854716Yes retard, I understood your chiding. If you'd like to discuss things in a productive and articulate capacity, try harder, or I'll just insult you and smug post; a level of communication beyond what you're doing.
>>519854744>Fake statsIt isn't nor can you prove it is
>>519843064F off./pol/ is a Christian board.
>>519854741>God doesnt exist moronI've heard Him, I've seen Him. I was visited by Him in a vision on 19th October after denying the devil's temptation. I know He exists.
>>519854613Not an argument
>>519854684>The prison population feels enough guilt to put themselves in a redemptive frameworkThey didn't put themselves there, the state did, and over 2/3 of felons are arrested again within 3 years.
>>519854822Meds. Christ never existed.
>>519854769Yes. I know many arguments across a wide variety of philosophical traditions, and you didnt ask me what I believe. I told you one argument to raise the level of discourse and was met by screeching retards talking about jews and foreskin.
>>519854822>/pol/ is a Christian board.Yet you clowns cry about the constant anti Christian postings lol
>>519854824Yeah because you forgot to take your meds
>>519854785No im just going to dismiss your retarded claims that have zero evidence to support them
>>519854824Cool, why should anyone believe you?
>>519854769Explain to me the meaning of the bible?Oh, you can't accurately recite every part of scripture? I guess that means you don't know what you're talking about.
>>519843064as an atheist i have to respect christianity for being predominantly european. at best, its a takeover of semetic religion almost like having legitimacy over jews with their religion. I do not want to be christian because i just dont believe any of that stuff is necessary to live a happy fulfilling life. you can be conservative and racist as an atheist through understanding of history and humanities
>>519854709>incoherent effeminate seething You're a childless eunuch just like your savior, who actually was jewish.
>>519854785I've seen you on /pol/ a few times now and you never engage with any point anyone makes. You merely dodge questions and name-call. A soulless intellectual coward
>>519854835Dont need an argument to dismiss your imaginary friend
>>519854617Yes? Thats just how humans work. Thats not a win for you. Doesn't mean people can't act in others interests. Just means it's not completely selfless
>>519854883>and you didnt ask me what I believe.I don't need too >I told you one argumentWhich was an argument for tribalism
>>519854666The vast majority of humanity believes in the supernatural. You are the mentally abnormal one who needs meds
>>519854926>Oh, you can't accurately recite every part of scripture?>has the internet in the palm of handWeird you can't answer your own moronic questions
>>519854640Heaven isn't a skill based job. Stupid comparison
>>519855012The vast majority of humanity is retarded due to unregulated breeding
>>519855074>Heaven isn't a skill based jobIt should be.
>>519849042Facts, all of it, anon.Also consider that much of what they call "science" is just another religion. Big bang is absolutely a religion.
>>519843064>ATHEISM IS FOR SMART PEPO
>>519855001What exactly are you saying about your personal beliefs and actions? It seems you're focusing on the actions and beliefs of othwrs without giving any real interpersonal examples of yourself.
>>519854862Correlation isnt causation, and that is not an argument, but an observation. Structural and systemic issues are the more likely explaination, but in general the retard who believes in cosmic punishment may do something good outside of their direct gratification, hypothetically. One who doesnt will not.>>519854918It's okay fagboy, need some lotion for your rectum?>>519854937Other than I immediately used kant and mill in the structure of my argument with a pragmatic realist framework (machiavelli, discourses not the prince, but a bit of both and a dash of lao tzu), and it was ignored by people who couldnt diagnose it screaming about foreskin.
>>519855168Why would i need anything beyond showing you have no arguments?
>>519855155Lurk more
>>519854945>people can't act in others interestsChristkikes don't, that's the point stupid.Ephesians 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them>>519855168>dismisses reality for a hypothetical
Hey @grokWhat is the probability that 2 identically-mutated (infinitesimally rare) sea-dwelling creatures existed at the same time (over 3 billion years) in the same place (millions of square kilometers of ocean) near a land mass (millions of kilometers) and both decided to jump out of the ocean (almost infinitely improbably) and start breathing with lungs (infinitely improbable), when no observable mutation in a living creature has ever been observed to cause a genetic benefit (never observed in all of recorded history) and have its offspring drop its sea-dwelling characteristics and be born only suited to breathe air (never observed in all of recorded history) and digest land-based nutrients AND find a suitable mate to breed with (impossible)?Error: there are more 0s in this probability than there are grains of sand on Earth.
>>519847391>You are delusional Ironic.The fact that you're getting so angry show a lack of intelligence btw
>>519843323I'll let you in on a secret, these studies poll Japan, Korea and China as being high IQ, and then considers Shinto, Confucianism, Buddhism and the like as non-religious but merely "ritualistic" practices.
>>519855001Yes. Specifically state based protectionism. And you would if you were smart, but cant have it all.
>>519855064You"re retarded and don't bring any real knowledge to the table.Here's thw internet for you.https://youtube.com/watch?v=C0r4RTJTr4E&
>>519855260>YesI already know lol>Specifically state based protectionism. And you would if you were smartThis statement doesn't make sense bud, can you elaborate?>>519855281>You"re retarded and don't bring any real knowledge to the table.Sounds like a personal problem
>>519854643The rights in the constitution are based off belief in God. It uses that as the authority. Also anything in the Bible. Things like self defense, inherent value of life, equal treatment under God, free will etc
>>519855217Conditonal antecedents are a logical position. Reality isnt a statistic out of context.>>519855201Anon, I habe a very clean ontological argument sourced with real philosophy. You havent engaged it at all because you lack the capacity and formal education.
>>519853846That would be agnosticism, you fucking retard. You are the midwit in question mate. Atheism is the positive belief that something does not exist. The idea being if God actually showed himself from behind the clouds, agnostics would say oh look, it's god, and atheists would say "you are not god, god does not exist".
>>519855355The U.S. Constitution does not base rights on belief in God, nor does it reference "God-given" rights in its text>>519855381>That would be agnosticism, you fucking retardAgnostic is a branch in both atheism and theism, you fucking retard
>>519843064dunning krugger aah thread but who cares? Expose all King James Freemasons, anyways.
>>519855381>Atheism is the positive belief that something does not exist.That's still a lack belief. It's amazing how dumb you people are
Atheists are good zutt sluts
>>519855368>Conditonal antecedents are a logical positionSure, which is why it's logical to say that if someone is religious then they're not any less likely to commit acts of evil and the data backs this up.
>>519855350It will take longer to explain the conditions of modern statehood than it's worth. But the summary for someone who doesnt understand what those words mean is that you cant care about everyone in the world at once, but if you care about people aligned with your position, you will be able to help them through favourable structure.
>>519855504>but if you care about people aligned with your position, you will be able to help them through favourable structure.Wow, like modern day society? Kek
>>519854936This has nothing to do with trans shit. Its about abstinence. Its not encouraging anyone to become one. It just says its ok if you already are. For the vast majority this is not how they will live. This is about a small portion of people. Besides these you are supposed to be fruitful and multiply, but you already know that. You are arguing in bad faith like a jew
>>519855350>Sounds like a personal problem
>>519855368Nebulous claims that your jew cult is "productive" arent an argument
>>519855603>confirms itKek
>>519854943I accept your concession since you have no argument
>>519855502Can I see this data? Is your "prison" example the only data? Either way, that wasnt my argument. My argument was people who do evil may sometimes do good by having a framework that incentivizes it, and if they dont have that framework, they wont.>>519855606Again, not my jew cult fagboy.>>519855555What an insanely dumb reply.
>>519855664>What an insanely dumb replyNotice how you don't say I'm wrong though. Just an ad hom
>>519844868Your argument is extremely flawed because you're twisting it to fit the conclusion you want it to come to. People who take risks understand they are taking a risk, anyone who just blindly thinks they will succeed at anything they try simply because they have faith will crash and burn hard even if they start off with a lucky break or two. You then make some unfounded platitudes that are backed at best by your own life experience but probably not even that. Your argument is so retarded that it actually makes the opposite point than the one you're trying to torture it into which is quite a feat
>>519855658Exactly, you have nothing. Typical christ nigger
>>519855355>Things like self defense, inherent value of life, equal treatment under God, free will etcNone of these "rights" exist though regardless of belief. As just one example the state regularly extorts money from you through taxation, if at any point you decided not to pay then the police would kidnap and inprison you. If you attempted to reject such treatment you would be killed. There is no right to self defense or inherent value of life in such a system
>>519855664>My argument was people who do evil may sometimes do good by having a framework that incentivizes it, and if they dont have that framework, they wont.Which anything can be that "framework" such as simply not wanting to go to jail and/or not wanting to hurt others etc.
>>519855217I'm saying we can't be completely selfless. That includes everyone. Including you
>>519843064Not hard to see, gotta be real dumb to believe in skydaddy and all the clearly written by losers loreNo depth at all in any of it, has no wisdom you dont gain by 25 if you arent a recluse, has nothing to say of substance and hides behind a veil of complexity, its just a mystery box like a shitty jj abrams movie, you do 90% of the work adding meaning its not thereFor retards.
>>519855664>Its not my cult>Im just promoting it
>>519855224the response to this thinking is>w-well, there's still a non-zero chance, and if there's an infinite number of attempts then the probability reaches 1. we are able to live in this miraculous incalculably improbable world because it's the only one we could gain consciousness in... hah!which on its face, looks like a good response.but imagine looking at a crime scene, there's a guy with a knife jammed into his forehead.there's a neighbor named bob no one can find anymore to interrogate and he's the only one who had access to the room.the mayor tells you you ABSOLUTELY CANNOT ATTRIBUTE THE MURDER TO BOB NO MATTER WHAT, so you instead concoct this scenario,>a freak accident where the victim slipped ona banana peel, catapulted upward into a ceilinf fan that somehow dislodged a perfectly aimed knife from a hidden wall mount (despite no banana peels, no fan, and no wall mount existing the room) all because the mayor insists Bob's innocence in non-negotiable, so you force-fit an "infinite cosmic coincidences" explanation to avoid the glaringly obvious culpritthis silliness perfectly mirrors the anthropic retort.it dodges the fine-tuning problem's OBVIOUS implication of design and therefore a designer by invoking multiverse lottery wins, no matter how contrived, just to keep the sacred cow of naturalism untouched.
>>519855689Anon, like I said, it would take a massive amount of text to teach you the concepts. In short, we live in a globalized interconnected trade system that incetivizes the mobility of capital over protectionism. Any more depth requires more investment on your behalf.
>>519855099If it was it would be empty. We can't live up to Gods perfect standard so Christ acts as an intermediary. Nobody is perfect except Christ.
>>519855834>Anon, like I said, it would take a massive amount of text to teach you the conceptsYou really don't have a concept beyond what you said. I>goes into explaining the most obvious shitWhat are you even arguing bro?
>>519843323this. hating those who seek comfort and guidance in religion is cancer. reddit is cancer. Atheists/agnostics who are loud about it don't understand the /human condition/. THEY are the ones to be pitied, not the dude who takes his family to church on Sunday.>t. agnostic
>>519855878Nah
>>519855118Sad pathetic mockery isn't a replacement for an argument. This is /r/atheism tier
>>519854928Bro, its not as trash because its hellenized.Its basicaly kikery lite mixed with roman and greek mystery schools like mitra worship, where all the weird symbolic canibalism rituals come from, transubstatiation etcNone of that exists in original christianity, none. Its all retcons with european paganism, which made it a but less trash, but still trash.A less stinky turd is still a turd, dont go trying to say its great
>>519855760Sure, but it is a tool we have now, and the foundation of our justice system at a fundamental level. Without it we couldnt have our current structures. Research the categorical imperative as a position and the level of refutation to go beyond it pretty much solicits compliance for most the midwits, and metaphysical rewards at a base level do it for everyone else. Hard to be more efficient.
>>519855590>making christ troons write paragraphs in defense of dicklessnessKek
>>519855878>We can't live up to Gods perfect standard so Christ acts as an intermediary. Nobody is perfect except Christ.I'm not asking for perfection. And Jesus still puts you to the test. Simply asking for salvation doesn't actually grant it as you need to be sincere in your repentance. How does one demonstrate sincerity? By producing good fruit. How does one do that? Not by words alone as the bible has shown
>>519853846>Atheism is just a lack of belief in God or gods.Negative. Atheism makes a knowledge claim that there is no God. In their own thinking, the atheist makes a clam at least as fantastic as the believer. It is the agnostic who merely lacks belief.You need to do better with words. Words mean things.
>>519855990>and metaphysical rewards at a base level do it for everyone elseAnything can be considered metaphysical. Like planning a trip or setting a goal.
>>519855437>pic>gnostic atheism>agnostic atheism>gnostic theism>agnostic theismthis isn't a real philosophical taxonomy of belief, it's carl sagan's dumb tactic to be able to couch atheism behind agnosticism so that you can weasel out of having to give an argument for your ideology.no one categorizes systems with "gnostic/agnostic" prefixes except when dodging the burden of proof. try applying it elsewhere:>gnostic flat-earthism>agnostic flat-earthism>gnostic unicornism>agnostic unicornismsuddenly it's obvious, the split is a rhetorical shield instead of something epistemological.so "agnostic atheism" just means >i don't believe in God but won't defend why the universe looks designed, life bootsrapped from chemistry, or morality grounds without a lawgiverit's atheism in a lab coat, pretending humility while smuggling in naturalism as default.the real taxonomy is:>theist: affirms God>atheist: denies God>agnostic: witholdsthe rest is word games to avoid arguing the hard parts.
>>519855948Sometimes its not worth arguing.Do you spend hours debating the veracity of santa claus and rudolph or do you just laugh and refuse to engage in it because its not worth the time?Same deal.Be buttblasted all you want, no one is forced to get into a retarded argument about a topic thats obviously bullshit, grow up
>>519855922I've been very clear. Seems like a skill issue from someone who doesnt understand what words mean. Modern day society isnt state based protectionism, and if you knew that "incredibly obvious" stuff, you wouldnt have said it.
>>519855437Declaration of Independence states people are endowed by our Creator with certain unalienable rights so the meaning is clear
>>519843323Religion can be based on intelligence; If you're smart enough to notice that the elites worship Satan, that the world is flat, that most religions are designed to lead people away from Christ and God, that is intelligence.
>>519855922>What are you even arguing bro?We're making fun of you.
>>519856071>>Atheism is just a lack of belief in God or gods.>NegativeAffirmative >Atheism makes a knowledge claim that there is no God. Gnostic atheism, which is still a lack of belief >You need to do better with words. Words mean thingsYou need to fully do better and learn words have context
>>519856122Yup, but infinite rewards and bliss after your death for compliance as a metaphysical reward versus infinite shittiness is fairly compelling to retards.
>>519856137>this isn't a real philosophical taxonomy of beliefYes it is. It demonstrates weak vs hard lack of belief.Gnostic and agnostic are branches in both theism and atheism and is clearly very observable
>>519856122in philosophy, metaphysical refers to concepts that go beyond the physical>nature of existence>time, space, causality>consciousness, identity, free will>abstract entities (numbers, moral truths)it's not just "non-material"saying "planning a trip or setting a goal is metaphysical" stretches the term beyond its intended use.those are psychological or practical activities, not metaphysical ones.they involve intention and foresight but not necessarily metaphysical inquiry.you're conflating abstract or mental with metaphysical which muddies the meaning.
>>519856205>Gnostic atheismYou really are a plebbit tier euphoric.
>>519856150>Seems like a skill issue from someone who doesnt understand what words meanYou've yet to bakc this. You've actually been agreeing with me lol>>519856162See>>519854745>Not really. As it takes man to define God, then man to define these inalienable rights, then man to enforce and defend said rights
>>519853513>white people can't be productive without [jew mind virus]TM
>>519856332>can't argue, only ad homTry again kiddo
>>519855756The state doesn't follow its own laws. If it wasn't dysfunctional it would. It is important to believe in them though to fight for them. States never follow their own laws, but believing we have these rights is still important so we can fight against it
>>519856294Thanks anon. I just assumed his premise broadly, and reduced it to spinoza style language ontology in intersubjective relationships because I couldnt be assed to explain it.
>Try again kiddo
>>519855658>CONCESSION!!!
>>519856291>weak vs hard lack of beliefthat's just rebranding the same dodge. >"weak" (agnostic atheist) = "i lack belief but won't justify it." >"Hard" (gnostic atheist) = "i claim knowledge God doesn't exist, now prove me wrong."both shift the burden: theism makes a positive claim (God exists), so it carries proof. atheism, to be intellectually honest, must either:>deny the claim (gnostic: "God doesn't exist"—prove it), or >Withhold entirely (true agnostic: no position).splitting atheism into "gnostic/agnostic" lets you pretend "lack of belief" is a neutral default, exempt from argument. but apply consistently:>gnostic a-unicornism: "Unicorns definitively don't exist." (burden on you.)>agnostic a-unicornism: "I just lack belief in unicorns." (why? Evidence demands it.)no one accepts "agnostic a-unicornist" as dodging proof, unicorns are ruled out by biology/zoology. same for God: if fine-tuning, cosmology, biology scream design, "lacking belief" is just willful blindness.your "observable branches" are ad-hoc, post-Sagan wordplay to shield naturalism. real philosophers (plantinga, swinburne) debate theism vs atheism on evidence, not hiding behind "weak" shells.justify your "lack" or admit it's faith in materialism.
>>519856294>metaphysical refers to concepts that go beyond the physicalLike planning a trip or setting goals. Ideas are metaphysical, until made physical >you're conflatingIt's this faggot again. No dummy, you are stuck on your 1 dimension of metaphysical
>>519856394No. Modern society isnt state based protectionism, that's antithetical to globalism, tribalism is only broadly state based protectionism, and you dont know what any of those words mean.
>>519856518>not an argument.
>>519856550>that's just rebranding the same dodge.Nope. It demonstrates the militant atheist and theist over those who believe or have lack of belief but still remain uncertain
>>519856332Hard versus soft [a]theism is a useful distinction though. I for example am a gnostic theist and find faith repugnant>>519856451>The state doesn't follow its own laws. If it wasn't dysfunctional it would. It is important to believe in them though to fight for them. States never follow their own laws, but believing we have these rights is still important so we can fight against itGod is irrelevant to such rights then, and your original claim is that belief in God is necessary for human rights to exist >>519853463>Without God there are no inalienable human rightsGod is very real but rights are not. Rights require human definition and enforcement as >>519856394 points out
>>519856579>Modern society isnt state based protectionismHere in the US it is
>>519855658All conecession posters are r/the_Donald trannies.
>>519856654>I for example am a gnostic theist and find faith repugnant
>>519855780Imo it's more like you're looking at a crime scene, and it's one of those locked-door mysteries that's really mysterious, but then there's a guy on the investigative team who just keeps insisting that a ghost did it because ghosts can walk through walls and stab people without leaving fingerprints, and given the locked door and lack of fingerprints, a ghost is *obviously* the best explanation and why would you even bother with considering alternatives?
>>519843064>>519843323>>519844280>>519844556But the statement IS true. The truth hurts feelings and thus the kneejerk reactions of the untermesch in here.
>>519856550>unicorns are ruled out by biology/zoology.>same for GodGod in the way you understand him, yes.
>>519843064My dog can do it. Dumbass.
>>519843064You don't need to do all that jargon. Everyone knows that you take it up the ass.
>>519856556>Like planning a trip or setting goals. Ideas are metaphysical, until made physicalno.ideas are mental (epiphenomena of brain states), not metaphysical. metaphysics probes ontology, what exists beyond physics (platonic forms, modal realism, substance dualism). your "ideas become physical" is crude idealism or panpsychism, that's a metaphysical claim you're smuggling without defending.planning a trip is applied psychology: neural firing predicting outcomes. no transcendence required. calling it "metaphysical" inflates everyday cognition to dodge rigor.>It's this faggot again. No dummy, you are stuck on your 1 dimensionad hominem + projection: you're the one flattening metaphysics to "anything non-physical = spooky ideas." real taxonomy (per aristotle, kant):physics: material changemetaphysics: being qua being, first causes, immaterial substancesyour "dimension" is solipsistic word salad. defend why intentions ontologically exceed physics, or admit you're redefining terms.bonus humiliation: if goals are metaphysical, is my grocery list a treatise on teleology? checkmate, retard.
>>519856603>I yell "concession accepted" and declare myself the winner, argue with me!!!
>>519843064critical thinkers know religion is bullshit.I remember studying religion in a serious attempt at being religious. god damn it's hard to maintain that delusion, my critical thinking would always seep in and remind me this shit is dumb as hell.the people who believe in religion on this site probably believe in prison christianity - aka CHRISTIAN IDENTITY.the people who believe in christian identity has a big gaping flaw so serious no one can take them serious (they have thousands of flaws but this one is nasty)they don't think evolution is real. if they did their fairytale about white and jewish origins wouldn't work.that's LITERALLY flat earth levels of retardation.
>>519856679No. Not at all. And the fact you think it is speaks to your low level of geopolitical awareness or comprehension. There is a shift towards aspects of protectionism in the recent administration, but the current context makes traditional protectionism next to impossible due to stratified global resources in different states.
>>519856793>>Like planning a trip or setting goals. Ideas are metaphysical, until made physical>no.Yup. >paragraphs of sophistry
>>519856831>you can't judge me I have the power of science on my side!!!
>>519856731Concession accepted
>>519857080
>>519855722You are the one with no argument
>>519856691I guess you would know redditor. I couldn't say as I don't go on reddit
>>519857137>16 pbtid>all reaction images and one-linersIt's amusing how christians now won't even attempt to defend their garbage religion anymore
>>519856856>t-that's just sophistry!coward.>>519856837>the people who believe in religion on this site probably believe in prison christianity - aka CHRISTIAN IDENTITY.i'm a vanilla baptist>>519856755your analogy casts design as the "ghost" (supernatural woowoo) while multiverse is the sober detective.in reality though, fine-tuning is the locked room with>constants dialed in 1-in-10^120 precision (penrose)>no fingerprints? exactly, no natural mechanism produces that calibration"ghost" (designer) walks thorugh because>it explains the lock (intentional settings)>predicts the scene (habitable universe)>falsifiable (change constants = no life)alternatives?>infinite unobservable rooms>no evidence (cosmic inflation is a speculative add-on)>solves by fiat ("somewhere, knife hits forehead by chance")occam's razor slices your throat, one designer > infinite untestable universes.design leaves math.your analogy confesses naturalism is poverty-forced to invoke more magic (eternal inflation) to dodge the obvious.
>>519856047Yeah thats true. Im not saying you don't do good works. Im just saying you can't earn it without Christ
>>519855943Yeah
>>519856145Yet you care enough to keep replying.
>>519857493Christ never existed
>>519856755And then when you tell the guy to stop speaking nonsense because there's no good reproducible evidence of ghosts, he gives you a sly look and says "Well what about this crime scene?"
>>519857465>>t-that's just sophistryIt is watch.>>519856294>beyond its intended use.Who determines that? You gate keep it to your 1 dimensional opinions about God
>>519856654I didn't say God is necessary for them to exist. Just for inalienable ones to exist.
>>519843323Faith is being dumb enough to think "Even though I have no proof for this, and nothing in my own first person conscious experience leads be to believe this, I will ASSUME IT'S TRUE just because some other cunt in a robe who seems to be in a position of authority told me it's true.THAT, my friends, is pure retardation and why "having faith" is so easy for people who don't have the critical thinking skills to even determine objective truth. Everything is magical to their tiny brains so why should the magic sky man be any different.
>>519856854>No. Not at all.100% it's why some states grant abortion and some don't
>>519856178>Religion can be based on intelligence>that the world is flat, that most religions are designed to lead people away from Christ and God, that is intelligence.Lmao
>>519844280If you state "god doesn't exists" that is faith too, because you have no proof that can back that statement to begin with. Atheists are such retarded animals that they fail to see that their core beliefs and moral system is basically a religion on itself.
>>519857493>earn itExactly
>>519854745My point is the authority of God makes them inalienable not that humans don't play any role.
>>519843064yes
>>519856178>that the world is flatYeah, this is a well poisoning kike.
>>519857844>authority of God makes them inalienableNo it doesn't. It's men who do
>>519857738>I didn't say God is necessary for them to exist. Just for inalienable ones to existThere's no such things as inalienable rights. Nowhere do they exist in nature. Rights only exist due to extreme human effort in temporary bubbles with applied conditions
>>519856518>>519856603>Redditjak! >Yeah a funny face will surely prove me right! Yaawn how lazy
>>519857844>inalienableWe also make amendments, so that really debunks the supposed "inalienable" part
>>519857411>I don't go on redditOnly because they shoah'd your home kek. Go back to /pedo troon general/>>519857465>i'm a vanilla baptistAren't you the pedophile who said you wished you were jewish the other day?
>>519857798State means a soveriegn political entity, the technical name for country, not a participant group in the corpus you pedantic moron.
>>519858063>State means a soveriegn political entity,Not here in the US. What you're talking about is communism lol
>>519851787>Some smart people have been religious therefore I smart because I am religiousHe didn't say that, retarded kike. His statement was about how intelligence and religion don't correlate in any way, and you can't argue with that fact, because it's true. To absolutely deny the existence of God is just as irrational as to confidently believe in him. Atheists are such retarded animals, i learned to hate you as much as i hate pajeets, since every day you flood this board with low quality bullshit like this thread.
>>519857961This anon gets it
>>519843064>smart enougharrogant enough
>>519858176You’re going to die and there will be nothingness forever. There is no god. Cope you spic.
>>519853846>Atheism is just a lack of belief in God or gods.That's agnosticism, retarded faggot.
>>519857721philosophers since aristotle.metaphysics = ~after (meta) physics (physics)the study of being, first principles, immaterial substances, not "muh ideas"you can check the stanford encyclopedia or the internet encyclopedia for philosophy if you'd like. https://iep.utm.edu/category/m-and-e/metaphysics/metaphysics is ontology, cosmology, causation beyond empirical.>gate keep it to... God???i wasn't bringing up anything theological in the context of correcting your misuse of the term.
>>519858258Again,>>519857721>>beyond its intended use.>Who determines that?Still waiting for an answer here.
>>519858055no, pedophilia is against my religion.it's atheism in practice though.
>>519858252Agnosticism is a position of "i dont know"
>>519856644Just take the lose, you retarded animal.
>>519858252>That's agnosticism,Catch up kiddo>>519855437
>>519858252>theist doesn't understand pic related for the 10 millionth time
>>519858332>who determines [the intended use of the term?]philosophers since aristotle do.metaphysics = ~after (meta) physics (physics)the study of being, first principles, immaterial substances, not "muh ideas"you can check the stanford encyclopedia or the internet encyclopedia for philosophy if you'd like.https://iep.utm.edu/category/m-and-e/metaphysics/metaphysics is ontology, cosmology, causation beyond empirical.the subjectivity of language is a zero sum cop-out.if "metaphysical" means anything you feel, dialogue dies, and fleep florp magoogagagurk.
>>519858415see >>519856137
>>519843323Being retarded is a prerequisite for worshipping a jew
>>519858515Metaphysics deals with the nature of reality beyond the physical, so ideas and goals—being abstract concepts—can be seen as metaphysical in the sense that they’re intangible and exist as mental constructs. They’re products of consciousness, not bound by physical laws until you act on them.Once you manifest an idea or goal—say, by building a house or achieving a career milestone—it transitions from the abstract to the physical, taking on concrete form. But even then, the original idea retains a metaphysical quality, as it’s still a mental blueprint that can inspire further action or reinterpretation. The line isn’t absolute; it’s more a shift from purely mental to partially or fully physical.Consider Plato’s theory of Forms: ideas like "house" exist as perfect, eternal concepts in a metaphysical realm, while physical houses are imperfect manifestations. Your idea or goal could be seen as a personal "Form"—real in your mind, metaphysical in nature, until you ground it in reality. Even post-manifestation, the idea can still exist metaphysically, as it’s never fully reducible to its physical outcome
>>519858549See>>519856291
>>519858063Hey leaf coward, you ran away from our debate in /pol/&/bant/ the other day. Here's your last posthttps://thebarchive.com/bant/thread/23507443/#23507676Your response to the problem of evil is quote->Divinity is doing something productive when all logic dictates otherwise>Divinity is doing... somethingYou ran away from my response, which is again->Divinity is doing what exactly? An all-powerful being is all-capable at all times, which logically makes everything a LARP at best. A net painful LARP for God's creation>Yes, this is true [that suffering is a catalyst for change]. Suffering produces change, and thus far in this world everything is only getting worse. Again, making creation a morally evil action on God's partIs running away your typical response to losing arguments?
>>519858351>pedophilia is against my religionNo it's not, there are zero verses condemning it and god endorses it in the OT. You also posted a jew, which just bolsters my argument since you aspire to be jewish.
>>519858351>no, pedophilia is against my religion.That's a lie
>>519844432>blindNot a religoid but religious faith isn't blind faith anymore than believing newton's law of motion is blind faith. Not all the pieces of the puzzle are in place in either context, religion or science, so all we can do is observe and report. Get your head out of your ass.Also, one does not disprove the other and are more complimentary to each other if you're not a sub human 80iq brainlet that parrots what some fag wrote either way.
>>519858593>metaphysics deal with...no, you deal in equivocation.your claim:>ideals/goals = metaphysics (intangible mental constructs)reality:>mental states = psychological/epistemological (brain processes). metaphysics = ontology of being itself (substances, universals, causation independent of mines)plato's forms are eternal mind-independent archetypes, not "muh career milestones."you're bastardizing idealism. forms are objective realities grounding particulars, your "personal forms" is a fanfic.>line isn't absolute... shift from mental to physicalhand wavy dualism without commitment. if ideas "retain metaphysical quality" post-manifestation>is my built house partly immaterial?>does the blueprint ontologically exceeed wood/nails?that's property dualism or emergentism, metaphysical positions you'd need to defend.but you're not, you're inflating "abstract" to "metaphysical" for rhetorical cover.stanford/IEP confirm, no seciton on "trip planning" under metahpysics.it's under philosophy of mind/cognition.if goals are metaphysical, then every intention probes ultimate reality, and a grocery list disproves materialism.
>>519843064Funny thing about atheists - many of them are eager to do missionary work and try to spread their faith among unbelievers. The opening post here is a typical example.If we are only biological meat puppets without immortal soul and afterlife, then what the fuck do you care what other people believe in?
>>519858648see my response to that here >>519856550
>>519843064I want to put women with large breasts into barns.,
>>519858898>metaphysics = ontology of being itselfExplain why ideas and goals lack these.>more sophistry
>>519858932>If we are only biological meat puppets without immortal soul and afterlife, then what the fuck do you care what other people believe in?Believing a lie generally causes problems. False paths lead to painful ends. I mean lets pretend that atheism is correct, it means that Jesus, his apostles and countless Christians got tortured to death and wasted their lives in service to falsehood. An atheist missionary would then be saving people from experiencing such a horrendous fate
>>519858549carl sagan didn't invent the term 'gnosticism' nigger, just because the average retard doesn't clarify if they are a 'gnostic atheist' or 'agnostic atheist' doesn't mean all atheists are gnostic in their beliefalso, using "flat-eartherism" LOL, people are more specific when it comes to theology, that's just the way it is
>>519858898>if goals are metaphysical, then every intention probes ultimate reality, and a grocery list disproves materialism.Every intention, including a grocery list, probes ultimate reality by engaging consciousness, which is where the metaphysical rubber meets the road. It doesn’t outright disprove materialism, but it raises a pesky question: can matter alone account for the "why" behind your need for eggs and butter?
>>519858396>>519858409>>519858415Is this some kind of organized reddit raid all over again? Anyways, by your picture, faggot, you have to be in one of the 4 groups defined in your graph, you are either agnostic (theist, atheist) or gnostic (theist or atheist).Even under your insane mental gymnastics, the statement:>"Atheism is just a lack of belief in God or gods."as shown in your graph, is not a group you can belong to, you retarded animal, but a vector. Proving my former point that atheism without conviction is just agnosticism. That graph serves no purpose whatsoever, besides introducing nuance to the simple concept that agnosticism is just a neutral position.
>>519859139Yeah your imaginary jew and the fairy tales that precede it are false
>>519858238>You’re going to die and there will be nothingness forever. There is no god. Cope you spic.Well, your religion is retarded.
>>519859199They dont even look too shiney but are still stupid.
>>519859220>I can only reason based on this memeGrim
>>519859282Seethe
>>519843064>"Religious"70IQ Goat Herder Muslims+70IQ Demon Worshipping Pagan Pajeets+110 Euro Christians vs Athiest AcademicsYour study is flawed. You're literally the embodiment of the midwit bell curve meme I can't find. Someone post it for them.
>>519844280>Faith is based on lack of intelligenceyou have faith you won't die by tomorrow or you would be writing dumb shit on the Internet today.
>>519859041ideas and goals lack metaphysical status in the ontological sense because they are mind-dependent particulars.epiphenomena of neutral activity, not fundamental being qua being.change the brain (injury/drugs) ideas vanish, unlike numbers, substances, or causal principles which persist independently.ontology probes what exists necessarily (aristotle's substances, platonic forms) your "goal" is contingent, subjective, ephemeral, not a first principle or immaterial universe.category errors.>epistemology (how we know ideas)>philosophy of mind (nature of intentions)>metaphysics (if minds/souls exist beyond matter (dualism) but ideas themselves aren't the inquiry)plato's forms are mind-independent eternals rather than personal blueprints.your goals = mental events, reducible (in principle) to physics/chemistry.either provide evidence they're ontologically basic, or concede you're conflating "abstract" (non-concrete) with "metaphysical" (bneyond physical in behind"
>>519859220>you have to be in one of the 4 groups defined in your graphno. get it now?
>>519859199>carl sagan didn't invent the term 'gnosticism' niggeri didn't say he did, read harder.
>>519859342Its not faith, retard, its based on reason and pattern recognition, unlike your jewish fairy tale
>>519859321There is nothing to reason about, faggot, your picture is misleading and serves no purpose. Your picture doesn't prove me wrong in anyway, and by the way you are pretending it does, makes me believe i'm arguing with a retarded nigger.
>>519859220>as shown in your graph, is not a group you can belong toThis idiot doesn't understand that if I say I believe with 100% certainty that there is no God, that's still a lack of belief. A lack of belief back by gnostic certainty
>>519859234I'm not a Christian moron, God is real but Jesus was a liar or schizo if he even existed in the first place. He literally promised to return before his followers died multiple times in the Bible
>>519859511Im sorry you were defeated by a simple image
>>519859547God isn’t real. You’re mentally ill.
>>519859547>God is realProof?
>>519859291That statement could by a byproduct of immersion.
>>519843064it's almost as if religion has been the opium for the masses all along
>>519859347Even if ideas and goals lack ontological heft in a strict sense, they still do something in the world. They shape behavior, drive actions, and influence reality, like how a grocery list leads to buying milk. This suggests a kind of functional reality, even if it’s not ontologically independent. In dualist or idealist frameworks, ideas might still carry metaphysical weight as products of a non-physical mind or consciousness, which could itself have ontological status. For example, Descartes would argue that the mind, as a thinking thing, gives ideas a kind of derived metaphysical reality.
>>519859406>being this literalfiltered
>>519859547What else could the son of man mean then?
>>519859606>God isn’t real. You’re mentally ill.Mental illness is a possibility, however to deny what my senses have beheld would be illogical. In the past I sought God and by his grace I found him. All beings are likely capable of this, after all he is the center of everythingIf it makes you feel better I suspect he's more of an amoral Azathoth type entity than anything moral or anthropocentric
>>519859347>plato's forms are mind-independent eternals rather than personal blueprints.A grocery list, as a product of your mind, doesn’t directly tap into the Forms, but it reflects your participation in rational thought, which Plato sees as the soul’s connection to the eternal realm. The act of intending (writing the list, planning to buy milk) could be seen as your soul dimly grasping at eternal truths, like the Form of Purpose or Action. This doesn’t disprove materialism outright, but it aligns with Plato’s view that the mind’s ability to form intentions points to a non-material soul interacting with a higher reality.
>>519859683It's a similar statement made by many physicists. Physics turns into Vedanta after a certain point.
>>519859738>even if... functional reality"functional" =/= metaphysical.influence via causation is physical (neutrons --> muscles --> milk) no ontology required, pure mechanism.>dualist/idealist frameworks... descartesinvoking them concedes my point, ideas derive status from mind/soul (metaphysical entity), not inherently.your original claim:>ideas are metaphysicalnow you're saying:>"derived" in some viewsmaterialism: (your implicit default): ideas = brain fizz. zero metaphysicsdualism: mind = res cogitans, ideas = modes/contents. still epistemologica/mental, not "being qua being."grocery list "shapes reality?" so does gravity. physics, not metaphysics.evidence ideas are ontologically basic (independent substances/universals?) *crickets*conflation confirmed, "abstract/intangible/influential" =/= metaphysical.take your L.
>>519859347>your "goal" is contingent, subjective, ephemeral, not a first principle or immaterial universe.My goal maybe, but not goals in general. And if one can imagine a goal, then that opens them up to the ability or ontological framework to more immaterial metaphysics
>>519860212>"functional" =/= metaphysicalIt's sets the ground work for ontology
>>519860212>your original claim:>>ideas are metaphysicalAnd I'm right
smarter than a christcuck but otherwise still in the npc bracket.
>>519860212>evidence ideas are ontologically basicA grocery list fits both if these
>>519859870>reflects participation... soul's connectionplatonic fanfic.plato's soul recollects pre-existent forms (anamnesis in meno/phaedo)not "dimly grasping" via grocery lists.your "form of purpose/action" is completely invented.plato lists goodness, beauty and justice, not "milk-buying"intention as "higher reality interaction" begs dualism that you must prove.under materialism, intention = neural prediction algorithms. no soul, no forms.>doesn't disprove materialism.your "metaphysical" claim collapses without idealism/dualism.evidence for soul/forms under materialism? zero.grocery list = epistemology (decision theory) or mind (cognitive science), not ontology.cite plato where errands = metaphysical inquiry or admit stretching "intangible influence" to "beyond physical being" is equivocation.
>>519859399Atheism is a vector in your graph, you retarded nigger. As shown in your graph, you can't be a "true" atheist, gnostic, theist or agnostic. You, as a datapoint have to necessarily be in one of the quadrants since the logic of gnostic atheist and agnostic atheist are exclusive. Holyshit dude, how retarded can you be? Go back to whatever shithole you came from.And if you anyways group those 2 groups into 1 convenient supergroup labeled as "atheist" then the distinction serves no purpose or whatsoever because at the end of the day you will be left with 3 functional groups anyways. Atheism, Agnostic (neutral), and Theist. Gnostic cannot be functionally turned into a 4th position given that gnostic theist and gnostic atheist are totally opposite positions, you can't just say i'm "gnostic" without clarifying if you are atheist or theist because those 2 positions don't overlap in any way. Your retarded meme graph just doesn't work.>>519859523>if I say I believe with 100% certainty that there is no GodThen you don't understand how percentages works, faggot. When you say i'm a 100% sure that A is B, there is not uncertainty on that statement or whatsoever.
>>519860212>"functional" =/= metaphysical>>519860362the grocery list’s functional role (getting you to buy groceries) stays in the physical/practical domain, not metaphysical. But the intention behind it, rooted in consciousness, raises questions about whether consciousness itself is more than material, probing ultimate reality in a way that challenges materialism’s completeness. In Platonic terms, this might connect dimly to the soul’s rational capacity, but without Forms, we’re left with consciousness as the wildcard. The list itself isn’t metaphysical, but the mind’s ability to produce it might be.
>>519860550>your "metaphysical" claim collapses without idealism/dualism.It has both >>519860642
WHEN WE DIE THERE WILL BE NOTHING FOR ETERNITY. COPE.
>>519860630>you can't just say i'm "gnostic" without clarifying if you are atheist or theist because those 2 positions don't overlap in any wayAbsolutely one can say this. To say "I'm gnostic" simply means "I know [the truth]"
>>519853180>I don't reject religion. I just don't see why I need to believe in your personal feelings about God98% of /pol/ would consider you to be a dumb atheist for saying this.
>>519860034>Many physicists have made similar statements*My bad.
>>519860630>When you say i'm a 100% sure that A is B, there is not uncertainty on that statement or whatsoever.Correct, but when I say I lack belief until evidence convinces me then that still invokes lack of belief (atheism) and without certainty (agnostic), therefore agnostic atheist Have a nice day my dull friend
>>519860767It's literally impossible for something to become nothing. You yourself were born from the "nothing" you claim awaits us
>>519860803>98% of /pol/ would consider you to be a dumb atheist for saying this.And they are welcome to their personal feelings and opinions.
>>519860859Yeah but it’s still nothing you moron.
>>519844556cant be very smart if they worship a jew who hates them
>>519860911Nothing doesn't exist
>>519860642>functional role... physical/practicalconcession noted: list itself not metaphysical>intention... consciousness... challenges materialismshift #3.now "mind/consciousness" = metaphysical probe.original claims: ideas/goals areyou're retreating to philosophy of mind (hard problem) while pretending victory.>conscioussness question = metaphysical inquiry>consiousness itself is debated (dualism vs emergentism) but ideas = contents/products, not the substance.platonic "rational capacity" requires soul/forms proof.materialism says consciousness = integrated information or global workspace, no wildcard needed.evidence intention ontologically exceeds physics? *crickets*either argue consciousness is non-physical and abandon materialism, or admit equivocation chain>ideas --> intention --> consciousness --> metaphysical
>>519861028Then why is it a word?
>>519860550>intention as "higher reality interaction" begs dualism that you must prove.I can’t definitively prove dualism, nobody has, empirically. The best case is that intention, like the grocery list’s purpose, highlights phenomena (consciousness, aboutness) that materialism doesn’t fully explain. This doesn’t mean dualism is true, it could be panpsychism, emergentism, or something else, but it keeps the door open to non-materialist viewsThe grocery list doesn’t disprove materialism or prove dualism, but its intentionality (why you wrote “milk”) pokes at materialism’s limits. It doesn’t require a “higher reality” in a dualist sense, just a recognition that consciousness, where intentions live, might involve more than physical stuff. I shouldn’t have leaned on “higher reality” without clarifying; it’s more accurate to say intention probes the nature of consciousness, which may or may not be material. Dualism is one possible inference, but not a necessary one.
>>519859547>>519859870The existence of theism without reference to a specific religion is one of the reasons why atheism, in order to be a useful term, really shouldn't be conflated with a claim to certainty about the nonexistence of God in general imo. Because without a specific religion, what do you even mean by God? For some "theists" it might be as simple as a label for a first cause, so anyone who doesn't think causality goes back forever would be a theist in their view. But if the first cause isn't necessarily omnipotent or omniscient or even exactly intelligent or discernably being-like at all, should you really call it a God? Or if simulation theory is true, should whoever designed the simulation be called God, even if in their world they're still subject to their own laws of physics?So I feel like there's a clear opposition between people who believe in some interpretation of the Abrahamic God or the God of classical theism and people who don't believe in that, but around the boundaries the details get so fuzzy that the theist/atheist opposition just devolves into disagreement about what should be counted as what and isn't so useful.
>>519861132It's a semantic spook, a word for a thing that doesn't real
>>519861124>concession notedYou left out>>519860642>But the intention behind it, rooted in consciousness, raises questions about whether consciousness itself is more than material, probing ultimate reality in a way that challenges materialism’s completeness. In Platonic terms, this might connect dimly to the soul’s rational capacity, but without Forms, we’re left with consciousness as the wildcard. The list itself isn’t metaphysical, but the mind’s ability to produce it might be.Take the L kiddo
>>519861124>>ideas --> intention --> consciousness --> metaphysicalWhich ideas and goals can encompass.Like your idea of heaven and your goal to get there
>>519861162Thread is about to die. Your post is reasonable. People should first define words before beginning debates I suppose
>>519843323>Hating religion is just reddit tier retardationfedoras dont hate religion they just dont believe in it
>>519860772>>519860835>"I know [the truth]"Its a binary election then, faggot. Since the truth is a binary election on this case. As opposite as to say "i'm agnostic" which means you are in a sparce uncertain position where either A or B can be possible. Do you see the difference now? do you see why the 4 groups distinction doesn't work? >therefore agnostic atheistThen you could just say you are agnostic, fulfilling the same purpose, retarded nigger, since agnosticism as is is not a binary election but a sparce position.
>>519859399This is hilarious. The reddit faggot doesn't understand his own matrix. Anyway, the term "Gnostic" has a specific historical meaning that this matrix of faggotry totally abuses/obfuscates. Maybe that's the point.
WHEN YOU DIE THERE WILL BE NOTHING. COPE.
>>519861414>Its a binary election thenWith hard and soft qualifiers. Gnostic or agnostic atheism is still a lack of belief and gnostic or agnostic theism is still belief Still binary
>>519861414I know vs I don't knowSeems pretty simple to me
>>519861474>Anyway, the term "Gnostic" has a specific historical meaning that this matrix of faggotry totally abuses/obfuscatesDemonstrate the supposed obfuscation
>>519857610IDs exist, you might wanna check who replied to that post before proving yourself the fool
>>519843064Really? Then why are there far more atheists today that "wake up" and become religious than cult adherents that go atheist? It isn't because on average people become more stupid with time. It's because they acquire wisdom with time, and it takes wisdom to have anything other than an edgy, nihilistic, and empty opinion of this shitty world.
WHEN YOU DIE THERE WILL BE NOTHING. COPE!
>71 posts by this atheist evangelistthat's real religious fervor
>>519861513>Still binaryIts not, faggot. That is just like saying that quantum mechanics are binary. thats just as stupid as saying that a superposed quantum state is binary. That's what agnosticism represents, uncertainty, it just becomes a binary certainty when there is information to collapse the uncertainty into a certain position.
>>519861360Any discussion that devolves into words and their meaning isnt worth continuing. Its classic deflection, who gives a shit what atheism means specifically, god wont start being real based on the definition exercise.
>>519861725>Its not, faggotI've already explained it is
THERE WILL BE NOTHING. THERE IS NO GOD.
>>519861718>gets dunked on>replies with a cowardice ad homSo long pseud
>>519861751>I've already explained it isYeah, i think I'm done with you retarded cunt. You are the dumbest gorilla nigger in the hood.
