BIX NOOD MUH FUGGA YO WATUP BOUT IT?

>>532162049
That someone being present(besides a few exceptions) would be subject to the country they are in.

>>532162049
It depends on the subject matter jurisdiction

Birthright citizenship means that if you are born here, you're a citizen.
As simple as that.
but what about ambassadors?
In practice, the children of ambassadors born in the US get fast tracked to US citizenship. That is the current reality.

>>532162049
So if I steal a wallet in Japan, I'm Japanese?

>>532162049
She is a nigger, of course she will steal your wallet.

>>532162230
No, if you steal a wallet in japan and then shit out an anchor baby soon after, that baby is Japanese.

It makes sense if you dont think about it.

>>532162049
It means that everyone present in the US (legally or not) is subject to the jurisdiction of its laws.

>>532162049
So they talked about full allegiance and partial alligiance. Both count as jurisdiction. The partial allegiance would be that of a traveler. If you went to Japan, you could break their laws, and still be subject to their laws. Unless you were outside their jurisdiction i.e. diplomat, sofa agreement, legal immunity

Here's an example:
South Korea, itself has forces in Kyrgyzstan and has negotiated a SOFA that confers total immunity to its service members from prosecution by Kyrgyz authorities for any crime whatsoever, something far in excess of the privileges many South Koreans object to in their nation's SOFA with the United States.[15]

>>532162307
Japan doesn't have your retarded laws, so no. She is saying that as a foreigner in Japan she us subject to Japanese jurisdiction

>>532162308
That's not what Jurisdiction means though in the 14th amendment
and we know this because the guy who wrote the words
>and subject to the jurisdiction thereof
and SCOTUS later in Wong Kim Ark both stated that "jurisdiction" and "allegiance" and also "domicile" were all requirements to be
>subject to the jurisdiction thereof
Temporary Visa holders by the very definition of the world "Temporary" do NOT hold full ALLEGIANCE to the UNITED STATES and neither do Illegal Migrants.

>>532162307
Japanese laws are very different, but the US Constitution is very clear: If you are born here, you're a citizen.

>>532162049
Why does she have to compare being born with stealing, is it just nigger brains? She is the reason DEI should be destroyed.

>>532162049
Yet if you rape and murder as an illegal nigger in americana you get wellfare for life!!!

>>532162560
Incorrect
It states
>If you were born here AND subject to the jurisdiction thereof

>>532162486
Birthright citizenship can't apply to temporary visa holders and illegal immigrants anyway, so what does that matter?

>>532162049
No way that nigga actually said that.

>>532162659
Since that is everyone except for people given diplomatic immunity it amounts to the same thing

>>532162049
I bet she makes good pancakes.

>>532162675
As the law is being enforced now if a poojeet comes here on a H1B and brings his 8 month pregnant wife with him that wife when she shits out a brown subhuman has just gained a path to citizenship because her poop baby is considered a "birthright citizen"

That's what this entire SCOTUS case is about and to prevent.

>>532162049
I don't believe you because even a nigger on the supreme court cannot be that fucking stupid; I refuse to believe it without a sauce

>>532162710
>since that is for everyone
>except for ambassadors
>except for Native Americans until 1928
>Except for soldiers of a foreign invading army
>Except for Illegal Migrants
>Except for Temporary Visa Holders

>>532162486
Wong Kim Ark was domiciled in San Francisco. Then he left. Went back to China. His parents were temporary traders, loyal to the Emperor of China. They also left, never to return. Wong Kim Ark returned, unassimilated, speaking Chinese, dressing Chinese, etc. His only connection to America was his place of birth. This singular fact gave him birthright citizenship.

>>532162049
So she's saying if she steals somebody's wallet in Japan, she has "allegiance" to that country? Does she not know what allegiance means? Surely this was taken out of context...

>>532162762
But I don't think anyone's arguing that because the and/or his wife have a visa then that means they were born here and therefore are citizens. That wouldn't make any sense.

>>532162049
Dems are so stupid, putting this nigger clown on the scotus.

>>532162710
no
"subject to the jursidiction" would mean wherever the fuck they came from, not where they ended up in the US
t. paralegal

>>532162865
Wong Kim Arks parents were LEGAL PERMANENT RESIDENTS of the San Francisco Area and lived there for multiple decades and had a successful business and started a family there.

They were LEGAL, PERMANENT RESIDENTS, who were DOMICILED in San Francisco when they gave birth to Wong Kim Ark.

That's the difference and you know it.

>>532162871
She's under Japanese jurisdiction. If she steals or is stolen from, she has reprieve from their courts.

>>532163026
Ok then that makes sense. So if somebody is born here then they should be subject to our laws. And you can't pick and choose which laws they have to be subject to all of them.

>>532162864
Foreign invaders and diplomats aren't subject to US law. Indians were also not considered subject to US law when on their reservations which changed in 1924

Illegal migrants and visa holders ARE subject to US law. Sorry. One more reason I'm glad we don't have a written constitution, it's so hard to fix this kind of fuckup

>>532162049
The only way a nigger is capable of abstracting an idea is to frame it in the context of stealing

>>532162049
>What did she mean by this?
niggas display loyalty through theft...a nigger that wont steal from you cannot be trusted.

>>532162138
smacks lips

>>532162049
It's a shame that retarded niggers like this and the people defending birthright citizenship will ultimately win out because trump is too retarded to do things properly. Forcing executive orders through again like last term was never going to meaningfully change things, and without the people around him to do proper PR/optics this time around he's going to get fucked worse in the midterms and make himself a lame duck all over again. Imagine if he had a different personality, could be genuinely deceptive, knew to play the bipartisan act and shove things through unnoticed. Like obama funneling africans into white suburbs while nobody fought it. Of course, any conservative that could act like that would focus all of their efforts on abortion instead, because that's how things go. Christcucks were this countries foundation as well as the decay.

>>532163025
They would have been excluded from immigration then. They said they were temporary traders, holding allegiance to the emperor of China. They left, never to return. You now make them model citizens to fit your narrative. Wong Kim Ark never assimilated in his life. You're changing the past, look at his pictures. 100% Chinaman. That is why he was rejected at the port.

>>532162959
No. A foreigner who commits a crime in the US is charged under US law, not the law of their home country

>>532162959
No it doesn't. Johnny Somali found out he was subject to the worst korean jurisdiction.

>>532162049
>What did she mean by this?
No one knows.

>>532162049
Of course she wants to know what'll happen if she steals a wallet.

She thinks if you're in a country illegally you are allowed to break the law? Is she serious? This is the thinking of a retarded high school student.

Wong Kim Ark is a wacky name.

>>532163289
>Indians were also not considered subject to US law when on their reservations
WRONG

The Ruling Elk v. Wilkins stood all the way until the 1920s which stated that even if a Native American were to give birth OUTSIDE of the reservation on "US Soil" the baby was STILL not considered a US Citizen by Birthright under the 14th amendment due to the fact that the baby's PARENTS held ALLEGIANCE to their native tribes and not to the US.

>>532162896
they're arguing the kid is

>>532162192
GROUNZ!
>>532162049
This bitch is painfully dumb

>>532162049
I love that Joe Biden thought this was a great idea.
Niggers hhahahahahahahaZ!

>>532163390
if they comit a crime in another country and move country they are still wanted in the first country by the first countries police

>>532163512
That's the exact opposite of what she said. If you are in a country illegally you are subject ot the laws of THAT country, not your own country

>>532162049
BANG BANG SKEET SKEET MY NIGGA

>>532163575
Elk was born ON a reservation

>>532163289
Foreign invaders vs Illegal migrant
what, exactly, is the distinction between the two in your mind?

So stealing a wallet is the same as having a baby? Just trying to follow her logic.

>>532162710
hol up, u sayin if we yasuke n shit, we can steal wallets in japan?

>>532163584
I got that but what's the point of arguing that the parents aren't when nobody ever claimed they were?

>>532162710
OK genius answer this; if everyone born here is a citizen as you claim, why in gods green earth do they even include another sentence? Why not just leave it at that? Why even include the line 'subject to the jurisdiction' why even write it if it just means everyone? What was the point?

>>532162049
My wallet got stolen in Japan

They brought in Chinese men to build and work, but kept out Chinese women, so these men wouldn't marry and have kids. They knew if Chinese couples had kids, those kids would be American citizens through birthright citizenship.

The person who wrote in the law himself was clear that it shouldn't mean foreigners coming in to have babies here, and should be focused on people who were already here to begin with. The parents must become naturalized legal citizens for their kids to as well, this was always the intent.

Subject to jurisdiction mean subject to the laws of the land.
The Trump lawyer argued that "jurisdiction" in the 14th Amendment means allegience.
She was challenging the lawyer to explain how a visitor to Japan, subject to its jurisdiction, requires that the law breaker have allegiance to Japan.
It's not that difficult. Unless you're a rightoid, but in that case, you're not human, so

>>532163808
To exclude those not subject to the jurisdiction

>>532163808
>if everyone born here is a citizen as you claim
I don't think they claimed that.

Birthright citizenship is utterly American but also retarded.

>muh ius solis

Kek

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>>532162307
>It makes sense if you dont think about it.
The thing you did there has been seen

>>532163869
Maybe he should have wrote what he meant.

>>532163841
Or it's because they didn't want chinks to permanently move here and have to have families, they wanted them to work and then go back when they're done.

>>532162049
She is there to represent the stupidity of the people. To be held up as the example. To be the voice of the arguments made by the
" our democracy " leftists.

In writing, the children of diplomats are excluded, in practice they are not. They are very much "favored".

>>532162049
Shieeeeeet it do be like dat doe

That’s what lack of BWC does to a Black woman

>>532162049
Biden's handlers chose her simply to troll us.

>>532164027
They couldn't be considered "natural born citizens" though, right?

>>532163972
He did and it's very clear, there's two facets of criminal justice who look at the constitution as a literal document and another half (guess who) who take it as a "living document intended to be interpreted and pilpul-ed with modern era knowledge and meaning"

>>532163597
AJEKSHUN!

>>532162049
>If
when

>>532162211
The Constitution was misinterpreted, when that false conclusion was drawn.

>>532162049
if you fuck an underage kid in africa you are subject to american laws thoughever

honetly this ruling is retarded, we literally prosecute people for crimes done overseas

>>532162049
She's saying if she steals a wallet in Japan, she becomes Japanese.
Magic soil, magic wallets. Basically, citizenship = wherever the fuck you are.

>>532162049
Don't care, the allegiance topic is a red herring.

>>532162049
She's talking about her lived experiences. Listen and learn.

>>532163710
One is subject to US law and the other isn't, it's not complicated. Soldiers are treated differently in law than civilians, its not precisely "illegal" for them to invade you

>>532162865
Why do you lie like this

>>532162560
If it were clear like you seem to think it is, then the case would never have gotten as far as it has, to be hashed out in the Supreme Court.

>>532163972
He definitely should've. Huge oversight.
Oh well. All it did is give away the country.

>>532163289
>Foreign invaders aren't subject to US law.
what the fuck are you talking about? Under U.S. law,
individuals deemed "alien enemies"—nationals of a foreign nation involved in a declared war or "invasion" of the U.S.—are subject to specific federal authority, such as the Alien Enemies Act of 1798.

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People didn't notice how Biden stacked the courts with Blacks and women. Only 15% of his judges were white men and I'm pretty sure most of those "white men" were Jews

>>532164336
That's the most pilpul sentence I have read in weeks

>>532164167
>The person who wrote in the law himself was clear that it shouldn't mean foreigners coming in to have babies here
>He did and it's very clear
The text:
>All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States
Doesn't say one word about the parents, does it?
So how is it "very clear" about "foreigners coming in to have babies" when they are exact zero words in the text pertaining to them?

>>532163808
To exclude the various classes of people who are not subject to US law while on US territory, i.e diplomats

>>532163888
She's a dei nigger retard. Just because you can be charged with a crime, that doesn't automatically make you "subject to jurisdiction". If that were true, every illegal make immigrant between 18 and 25 with be in violation of not registering with the selective service. Start charging them for that and watch the lefties go nuts.

>>532162049
It's called being subject to the nation's criminal code. It's not allegiance.
She's a retarded subhuman nigger. This creature was put into the Supreme Court by the political establishment. Think about that.

>>532164002
The Chinese were excluded from immigration. They didn't want them to "set roots". Wong Kim Ark's parents said they were temporary traders. Yes, they wanted them all to go back. In the SC decision, those judges acknowledged that Wong Kim Ark was a FOREIGNER and an ALIEN, his only difference from those Chinese workers was he was BORN IN THE USA, that's it. Now conservatives are even lying about what really happened. That this Chinaman was an "American" was a very reluctant decision.

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>>532162049
This argument would likely sway any justice that was on the fence to vote against birthright citizenship.
If you are agreeing with this nigger, you know you are wrong

>>532164499
>Just because you can be charged with a crime, that doesn't automatically make you "subject to jurisdiction".
That's the exact point she was making, you subhuman retard. The funny this is your brain will never fully develop to the point where you will ever comprehend it.

>>532162049
If you committed a crime in a foreign country, you will serve the sentence for your crime in that country and only after that you get deported. Otherwise people would just travel to your country, commit crimes, get deported and travel to another country, UK for example, commit crimes there, deported, travel to Canada to commit crimes there and so on.

>>532162192
Jekshun

>>532162230
>>532162307
No, if you steal a wallet in Japan and get arrested, and the ching chong founding document says that anybody who can be arrested for stealing wallets in japan is japenese, you're japanese

>>532164336
>Soldiers are treated differently in law than civilians, its not precisely "illegal" for them to invade you
Foreign nationals and agents of the foreign governments that are in the US to engage in espionage, intellectual property (IP) theft, or unauthorized surveillance face severe criminal and civil penalties under U.S. federal law. Punishments range from significant prison terms and multimillion-dollar fines to life imprisonment or the death penalty in extreme cases.
.

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>>532162049
Most americans normally go for a food analogy lmao

>ayo so it be like dis nigga
>if i steel a wallat n sheeit in juh pan
>da popo finna chase after me
>dat just how it be

>>532164536
The political establishment despises us.

>>532163808
It was to exclude native american reservations which were treated as independent political entities and were not subject to the jurisdiction of the US. This wording explicitly prevented native Americans born on reservations from claiming birthright citizenship. (Later on the indian citizenship act would provide native Americans with us citizenship whether they were born on or outside of a reservations)

>>532162049
It's a disgrace that this dumb ape got pushed to the front of the line for the highest court in the country.

>>532164358
It was blowout, weaker than the initial presentation. Trump's council was nerfed, weak arguments made, like they threw the case. Admitted Mr. Cowen was a despicable racist.

>>532164499
> every illegal make immigrant between 18 and 25 with be in violation of not registering with the selective service.
Trump needs to start doing this. Instead, illegals are entitled to free gibs that male US Citizens are excluded from if they fail to register.

>>532164536
She’s probably the least qualified individual to ever serve on the USSC. Even Kalgan called her out yesterday on her dopey dissent in the Colorado troon grooming case.

>>532164608
You stupid fucking shit skinned retard. If they were subject to jurisdiction z then they would be required to register with the selective service. They aren't required to do that. If I go to the Congo and rape your mom, does that give me all of the rights of a citizen? Jurisdiction means much more than being bound by some of a country's laws you fucking dimwit.

>>532164747
She is so fucking dumb. Her verbose opinions are a sure sign of her low IQ.

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>>532162049
She's a retarded sheboon

>>532164690
Uh… no. We pretty much do whatever our jobs require which generally isn’t evil spy shit. I fixed test equipment. My friend played bass for the jazz band and mostly baby sat high ranking officers homes while they and their families were away on vacation.

We are generally subject to the laws of the host country. Crimes committed off base can result in being turned over to the host country for trial and punishment. There was a case where a highschool student murdered another student on base. By agreement he was turned over to the Japanese authorities for processing, however he was later returned to base and deported back to the US where he was immediately detained and arrested for murder.

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>>532163390
A foreigner who commits crime outside the US is also charged under US law.
Trump can use this to claim jurisdiction over Greenland next.

>>532164969
160 years of legal precedent agrees with me.
Trump's supreme court agrees with me.
You got a D in geometry and dropped out of HS.
Your life is worth nothing to me. You were put on this earth for me to hunt for sport. Not to have a debate with. Stay in your lane, subhuman.

>>532162049
>IF I STEE A WA'ET IN MUFFUGIN JAPAN I AM SUBJEK TO JAPNEES LAWS. IN A SENSE IT BE ALLEEJINS.
I read this in a nigger accent. Anyways, this is what happens when you give monkeys rights.

>>532162049
Who is happy to have lived long enough to see an 85 IQ Supreme court justice?

>>532162049
>when you say something so bafflingly fucking stupid that you push 5% of the remaining leftists to the center

>>532162049
Ketanji is utterly incompetent. At least the other negro is actually moderately intelligent.

>>532162049
"I am nigger, stealer of wallets."

>>532163249
You don't have to be born here to be subject to our laws, just not have legal immunity. Trump is bringing in soldiers from Qatar. What happens when they start raping, robbing, and killing people? Will they have legal immunity?

>>532162049
>Nigress so stupid that other justices routinely have to write in their opinions that everything she said should be disregarded because it doesn't conform to the most basic legal procedure and language
America is not a serious country

>>532164887
Illegals are not entitled to free gibs unless they are of a certain status designated by the government nor can immigrants join our military unless they are American citizens. Birthright citizenship carries the same responsibility to register for the draft at 18, same as any other citizen of the US. So basically all American citizens between 18-25 are subject to the draft.

>>532162049
But I'm not in Japan.

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>>532162049
>bix nood
Did she have breakfast this morning?

>>532165272
What legal precedence dumbass? Wong Kim Ark's parents were LEGAL permanent residents? There haven't been any cases that challenged citizenship for the children of people in the country illegally.
Did you even go to school? If you had at least a well thought out rebuttal I could respect it. But, you don't seem to understand even the most basic things. Pulling shit out of your ass isn't a valid argument to your point.

>>532165494
No. They will be subject to our laws, same as we are overseas in other host nations. They don’t get diplomatic immunity unless their visit is classified as a diplomatic mission.

>>532165272
it makes sense to me. citizens of other countries are still subjects to their laws while in the united states and so therefore are not entirely within the jurisdiction of the united states.

>>532162049
>>but I did steal a wallet for breakfast last thursday

>>532165660
A low IQ take is thinking that white people were created by a sinister mad scientist to destroy black men.
Black women were created by a sinister mad scientist to destroy black men.

I like how they call it a right for people who have no rights here.

>>532165699
What does the 14th amendment say about parents?

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>>532162049
wtf is that a real question? She really is fucking dumb, that doesn't make any sense about birthright citizenship.
Not to mention pic-related lol, I hope somebody pointed this out to her because a better analogy would obviously be
>If I go to Japan and have a baby there, that baby is NOT a Japanese citizen

>>532165972
Different laws. She's talking about jurisdiction. Japan is Jus Sanguinis.

>>532165761
yes but you are still subject to your home countries laws while overseas.
the argument is that someone who is a citizen of a foreign state is not wholly within the jurisdiction of the united states and so this law should only apply to stateless residents.

>>532165972
>that one classic Japanese story about a foreign woman showing up in a raft
>they sealed her inside and pushed it back out to sea

>>532165699
Weren’t there two fairly recent cases (1950 and 1980) that basically reaffirmed the Constitutional Right (14th Amendment) of birthright citizenship to anyone born in the United States?

>>532163390
They can also be deported back to their home country or face fines and punishment in their home country for crimes committed in the US. They could be fleeing from justice in their home country or be prosecuted at any time for any myriad of reasons by their home country. So they're subject to the jurisdiction of a country other than the USA.

>>532166000
"I'S ON MAH BREAK"

>>532165966
If the parents are citizens of another country, the child is also a citizen of that country. Therefore the child can't be wholly subject to the jurisdiction of the United States. You can wish upon a star all that you want, but you can't change this simple fact.

>>532165481
>"I am nigger, stealer of wallets."
and by doing so in your country I swear allegiance to it

>>532163808
Because we literally have the writings of the Framers of the 14th amendment saying that it isn't meant to apply to foreign immigrants lmao

The entire conversation is the
>liberals pretend to not understand shit, rendering discussion impossible
But the second is, if you can just import a new voterbase I have no reason not to immediately form paramilitaries with my ex-mil buddies and immediately begin hunting liberals for sport.

The constant inability by leftists, doing the bidding of jews while ironically coming here and screaming "M-MIGA", is that their world of rules only exists in a world where they arre following the rules- but they constantly desire an anarchotyranny where only everyone but them are subject to the rules. So necessarily they are cancer and must be removed fromsociety.

>>532165761
You see you have it completely backwards.
The WORLD is subject to the jurisdiction of OUR LAWS.
See >>532165229
American Laws do NOT have borders.

>>532162230
SHIIED we wuz of the jurisdiction thereof n shied. Gibz me dat citizunship fo dem reparayshuns

>>532166335
They can't be deported unless america allows it though

because they are in the jurisdiction of america

>>532162211
"Birthright citizenship" means that if you are LEGALLY born here, you are a citizen.
LEGALLY.
Here on a Visa? Green card? Etc etc?
Guess what, retard. You're not legally here. You're visiting.
That subtle difference between privilege and right.

>>532162049
>ayo hol up *CHIRP*
>wut if lawz wuz bout stealin walluts n SHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEIIT

>>532162230
it means Japanese cops can arrest you, so you're under Japan's jurisdiction

>>532166833
it says anyone born under the jurisdiction of the USA is a citizen

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>>532165005

>>532165587
Kek

>>532166480
I can't control whether or not foreign governments consider me to be a citizen, though.
If one of them, let's say Japan, decides to grant me Japanese citizenship for whatever reason, does that mean that my American citizenship is automatically revoked?

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>>532162049
Remember, people think it's the highest human virtue for this nigger to be ruling over your sons and daughters.

>>532166807
they can still be charged with a crime and convicted in absentia thoughever. their assets in their home country may be seized, their certifications or degrees legally voided etc.

its pretty simple brother

>>532167023
So Maduro is a US Citizen?

>>532167023
>, and
What does ", and" mean, Mexican't?

nigger utterances

>>532167209
They can only be charged for stuff they did in their home countries though

>>532167265
he wasn't born there retard

>>532162049
>Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof,
She isn't completely wrong. It says AND subject to. The parents are not subject to the jurisdiction of the US in that they citizens of another country and owe their allegiance to that state. Some of this shit os straight put of the feudal law... which goes back to when Constantine let on the christcucks. Serfs were part of the land and property. When a child was born to serfs they were born into serfdom. It's the same as if you own a cow. When the cow has a calf it is your property. If a Canadian cow walks across the US border and drops a calf it does not become the property of the US. It is the property of the Canadian rancher.

>>532162049
it means that you but a 70iq nigger into your highest court

The 14th amendment excluded native Americans.
The 14th amendment is very poorly written and that was obviously not their intent. Fucking idiots didn't understand the implications of what they wrote.

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>>532167369
That's where you're wrong kiddo

>>532166480
Everybody in the US is subject to the jurisdiction of the US.
It's simple algebra.
>citizenship = born + jurisdiction
If
>jurisdiction = citizenship
then
>citizenship = born + citizenship
which is circular reasoning. And it's nonsense. Jurisdiction has nothing to do with citizenship. Jurisdiction applies to the government, not the people. If you're in the US, no matter who you are, no matter why you're here, then the US authorities have jurisdiction over you. The only exceptions are diplomats and their families, and the jurisdiction clause was simply meant to exclude them because it would create a class of citizens who were not subject to the laws.

>>532167089
Okay, really great debate strategy. Let's play the what if game. In order to gain citizenship, immigrants have to swear allegiance to the US. That's why you've been hearing that word today. It means loyalty FYI. A baby that is a citizen of another country is unable to do that.
If you obtained citizenship of another country by swearing allegiance to it, then you could be guilty of treason or sedition.

>>532167871
>jurisdiction
>the government acknowledges your claim of citizenship
>this is known as "naturalization"
>it is somehow unclear that a child born to noncitizens is not a citizen
You're retarded on purpose.

>>532168097
Show me the dictionary definition.

>>532165966
Only that they need to be in the United States at time of birth. Nothing about the parent’s citizenship - or lack thereof— status. The “subject to” was referencing native Americans who were often born on reservations and subject to local laws regarding citizenship as part of the Indian Nation.
“All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.”

>>532167513
>The 14th amendment
is a mess.

Section 1: Defines citizenship, prevents states from restricting privileges/immunities, guarantees due process, and ensures equal protection.
Section 2: Addresses representation in Congress.
Section 3: Disqualifies individuals who engaged in insurrection against the U.S. from holding office.
Section 4: Prohibits the payment of Confederate war debts.

>>532167871
So then we should start charging all of the 18-25 year old male illegals for being in violation of the selective service act?

>>532168189
You're going to whine because I chose a dictionary that hasn't been subverted, aren't you?

>>532167927
Let's say that Japan (which again is just a stand-in) didn't require any sworn oaths from me. Again, I can't control their standards as to who is a citizen and who isn't.
But then you see the problem, right? Suddenly I'm not (wholly) subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, even if I was previously. It seems that you're arguing that I am now no longer an American citizen in this case.

>>532168248
again retard
it only applies to newborns

>>532167089
this is the most ridiculous strawman i have ever seen
citizenship doesn't just go away after the fact magically unless you get exiled or something

if you for example were an orphan of unknown illegal immigrants that were later discovered to have been mexican and thus eligible for mexican citizenship you would still retain your american citizenship

>>532168196
It's literally about diplomats. The argued about it in 1860s and the clause was added. Native Americans were considered their own nation. We had treaties and trade deals with them. They weren't considered under the jurisdiction of the US, and in some cases, still not. That's why they're allowed to have casinos and have their own police and sell cigarettes without taxes.

>>532168248
Just because some laws apply to the US citizens doesn't mean that all laws only apply to US citizens.

>>532168540
>I refuse to read
Imagine thinking that everyone else will ignore the words you choose to omit.
Go the fuck back to Tel Aviv.

>>532168491
But you are. You might have certain duties to Japan, but if your allegiance is with the US, your duties to the US will take precedence.>>532168540
WTF are talking about you smelly wetback?

>>532168979
that's not what subject to a jurisdiction means lmao

>>532162486
>That's not what Jurisdiction means though in the 14th amendment
>and we know this because the guy who wrote the wo—
the draft of the first amendment protects you from everything and everyone unlike its LEGAL form which only protects you from the government. you cannot use "but they write this!" as an argument without conceding that your constitution is trash and needs a reform

>>532168876
>Just because some laws apply to the US citizens doesn't mean that all laws only apply to US citizens.

Your comment makes absolutely no sense.

>>532168870
Well you and the anon who loves to use the word RETROACTIVE (maybe you've seen him) probably disagree on that point.
I'd say your position is fair in sort of a moral sense but assuming that the government wants me deported, can you think of any legal reason that I'd retain my presumptive citizenship?

>>532166162
Yes and no. If I am in Amsterdam, marijuana is legal, however as a military member, I am still subject to the UCMJ (military law) rather than local law which permits consumption of marijuana. However, if I were to commit a crime off base, I could be turned over by the base to the host country for prosecution and punishment according to their laws. Such a case happened in Japan where a drunk airman beat a cabdriver, stole his cab fare, and made his way back to base hoping to be penalized as harshly by the military. He was arrested and turned over to the Japanese police, was tried, and interred in a Japanese prison for 5 years. Later discharged from the military dishonorably.

>>532162560
>>532162659
Are you a subject of another nation?

>>532168979
How do you define allegiance? Maybe the government says that I actually have no allegiance to America. After all it's not like I took an oath because I was just born here, but then you say that's not enough for me to have allegiance with the US, right?

What will happen is you go to court, pay a large fine, possible jail time, then you are deported (kicked out of the country).

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>>532169206
idk man, seems to make perfect sense, maybe you're just fucking stupid?

>>532165272
Geometry??

>>532162307
Do they arrest the babby then?

>>532162192
No... that's just if the court can hear the case..
You're thinking of personal jurisdiction.

What a weirdo oral opening

Are americans attempt to make citizenship something like criminal cases where is it now the the duty of the government to prove you are not a citizens hence therefore if they failed you are a "citizen" even though that is clearly not how it supposed to work?

>>532169331
Yes, and crucially this is a consequence of *Treaties*
That means a Treaties terms, enforced by a Consulate, govern the jurisdiction of aliens (and their children) in the United States
Children born to parents under a visa, are under the jurisdiction of the foreign country's consulate and treaties thereof, not the United States
Overstaying a visa would also be under the jurisdiction of the consulate
Illegal entry into the country, would render those people stateless, and their children stateless, they are not under any jurisdiction, which only makes sense because they are completely off the radar of any state, basically piracy

>>532168491
>I'm not (wholly) subject to the jurisdiction of the United States
what does that even mean? If you're a US citizen and move to another country, obtain a citizenship there, and live there for decades, you are still a US citizen in the eyes of the US government. You still have to file US federal income tax returns every year AND pay taxes to the US on ALL your foreign earnings. U.S. law considers the U.S. citizenship permanent once lawfully acquired, unless you formally and voluntarily renounce it at a U.S. consulate. Besides the non-refundable $450 fee, you may still face potential tax liabilities, such as an exit tax.

>>532169281
i'm not a lawyer nigger, i'm not familiar with every way a person can be stripped of citizenship but i imagine its not something easily done.

also birthright citizenship would probably still exist even if the law were interpreted differently anyway, you don't need it to be in the constitution to be law.

>>532166480
That’s not what the 14th Amendment says, however. England allows dual citizenship (as does America) to anyone born outside their native country (dependent on the status of the parents citizenship). I believe dual citizens of England are required to choose a single citizenship by 21.

>>532169509
Here we go again with your retardation. You're a smooth brain that will never understand anything. I'm quite tired of trying to educate you, when you prove it's impossible.

>>532169927
The 14th doesn't actually address it, which is why we have the current case before the supreme Court.

>>532162049
Who cares. America is dead. JewMerica won’t survive the century. Let the whole world become citizens. They can play in the rubble that is this third world nation.

>>532169935
I think you're just upset that you can't think of any good answers to my questions.

>>532162246
She could have chosen any number of offenses for the example, of course she goes right to stealing.

>>532162049
>Japan
what an odd choice of example.

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>>532162138
>BIX NOOD

>>532169331
if anyone, not just some military guy, were to go to europe and fuck a 14 year old(legal by whatever european law) on video and post about it on their social media they would probably find themselves charged with a crime.

that's just how it is, just because it's not something often done doesn't mean it never is or can't be
people have even been charged and convicted of the same crime twice, once in the country in question and once again in america

>>532166654
Good luck with that. American laws apply to all American citizens no matter where they are but they do not supersede the host country’s laws. Just because you can enjoy a dildo here does not mean sex toys are allowed in Saudi Arabia- even on American bases. You are subject to Saudi law should you choose to bring a sex toy there. Immunity from a host nation’s law only applies to those on diplomatic missions. Likewise, should you violate Saudi law, you would not necessarily be subject to the same law here if the Saudis agree to hand you over for prosecution and punishment.

>>532170306
No, it's just frustrating that when I answer one question in a way you can't refute, you ask an even dumber question. Typical leftist thinking. Just keep asking retarded questions and pretend your right. It was fun for a while, but it's grown old and I'm done interacting with you.

>>532170234
Things that the US achieved since the 14th amendment went in effect:
>most powerful country in history
>most successful country in history
>richest country in history
>biggest middle class of any country in history
>only country in history where poor people were in the minority
Things that the US achieved since the conservative revolution of the 80s:
>the loss of all of those things

>>532162049
She was just telling a story about her recent vacation to Japan

>>532170462
US nationals and companies can be prosecuted under the Foreign Corrupt Practices Act (FCPA)
for bribing foreign officials to secure business, facing up to 5 years in prison and substantial fines per violation. The Foreign Corrupt Practices Act Unit - Department of Justice (DOJ) and FBI actively investigate these acts.

>>532170462
That’s because it’s illegal both in the US as well as Europe. Now let’s say it was Thailand, and you are wise enough not to post or discuss what happened there. Why Thailand is pedo capital of the world.

>>532170548
I don't think you're done yet either. You could've actually replied to me twice now but are going for insults instead. This I think is because you are too tired to think, but still willing to insult because it's easy.

>>532170610
>since the conservative
very (((conservative))) yeah. lmao, silly murricans

>>532162049
Allegiance only in the sense of voluntary submission instead of certain death through eternal combat with every policeman in the nation.

>>532162824
https://video.twimg.com/amplify_video/2039378086979149824/vid/avc1/1536x888/I4nq0J1PSl0RWOs2.mp4

>>532170462
Generally the US may take “time served” if you were convicted and served in another country during the sentencing phase. Depends on the crime, its impact on international relations. You’re still going to walk away with a conviction for sure.

>>532168491
you obviously don't even understand how citizenship is granted and you also seem to think this constitutional amendment is the only law governing citizenship

Conservatives are on the losing side here. And they shouldn't expect public opinion to back them up, since rightly or wrongly, most people support birthright citizenship.

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>>532170959
Incorrect (You) are on the losing side as precedent supports the Trump Administrations argument

https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/112/94/

THIS EXCHANGE RIGHT HERE AT 1:32:17: https://youtu.be/DY9O5bxgDPE?t=5537

>>532167871
Diplomats and the families of diplomats are also subject to the jurisdiction of the Constitution of the United States in the most pedantic sense that demonstrates how retarded extending birthright citizenship to illegals is. Because a diplomat from a foreign government can be ejected at will by the President of the United States this is tacit jurisdiction by the United States over anyone within its borders. Just because we have agreed to observe a treaty extending 'diplomatic immunity' does not actually supersede the founding principal of the Constitution as the Supreme law of the land.

>>532170711
people have been charged for fucking a prostitute even bro

it just depends on how much the government wants to fuck with you, ANY crime under US law committed overseas may be prosecuted

>>532171090
idk it's a pretty easy to understand argument both ways, personally i think birthright citizenship is retarded and should be revoked in either case with an emergency amendment of the constitution

fact is chinks coming here for a baby vacation shouldn't get access to american gibs

>>532171090
Elks parents were Native American and were part of a recognized “Nation” within the US territories so presumably allied with that nation and its citizens. Illegal immigrant are not necessarily subject to any particular alliance however the child is born here and is subject to American law by citizen status- not by their own choice.

>>532171267
Diplomats are here but hold allegiance to their home country , usually with the intention of returning home with their families. Some kids of diplomats are allowed to hold dual citizenship though.

Immigrants come here to make this their home, kids are awarded birthright citizenship.

>>532171628
Being subject to american law is not enough as I just explained in Elk v. Wilkins. You must be "completely" subject to the jurisdiction of the United States and owing it "direct and immediate allegiance".

Someone who has entered the united states illegally, someone who is not domiciled within the united states, someone who still owes at least partial "allegiance" to whatever nation state they originated from.

you retards are stuck with this nigger for 40 more years LMAO

>>532162049
Imagine an intelligent person agreeing with this nigger ape

>>532162049

She's not stupid because she's black, she's stupid because she's a woman.

>>532163289
Fuck off, shitbrown

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>>532162192
THIS NIGGA FUQQS

I'm just waiting for that moment when enough of the right admits that they don't actually care about the Constitution and would rather have a king in charge since all theoretical responses to losing the birthright citizenship case rely on a dysfunctional Congress doing something about it.

>>532162211
Ambassadors kids usually don’t get American citizenship. They keep their own citizenship. They are a drop in the ocean compared to birth tourists though.

If you’re illegal and changing your name anytime you want, are you really subjected to jurisdiction

It seems trying to stay off the books isn’t exactly trying to stay as they make clear is a goal or not, for citizenship, it seems like the opposite in criminal cases for the illegals who hit me, interchanging their names easily with fake id or willingness of government agents

The 13th and 14th amendments are clear. Trump has no case.

>>532164195
so the 2nd amendment is not up to interpretation but the 14th amendment is?

>>532166833
Unfortunately the constitution doesn’t say that. I agree that it should, but it doesn’t.

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>>532164436
Miggers are coping and lying through their teeth. The constitution is pretty unambiguous here. It’s retarded, just like the 19th amendment, but there’s no pilpul you can spin up to get the conclusion miggers want. They’ll call you a libtard for being honest, because they’re in a cult.

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>>532162049
Not bleached hard enough

It's pretty much over once the ruling goes in favor of birthright citizenship. There's no plausible solution for the right.
>get Congress to pass an amendment!
You need two-thirds of the House and Senate to agree on it, or two-thirds of the state legislatures (both of which are practically impossible). Then you need three-fourths of the states to ratify it, which also is pretty much impossible.

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>>532162049
>What did she mean by this?

BY FORCEFULLY ENTERING THE COUNTRY FOR THE PURPOSE OF DEFRAUDING CITIZENSHIP ET. AL., THEY BECOME SUBJECT TO OUR LAWS MUTTATIS MUTTANDIS, 14TH MAKES THEM OUR SLAVES TO FREE & CONFER WITH POLITICAL FRANCHISE.

In other words, the outcome of this case will determine whether or not there is martial law prior and/or during Midterms or not.

>>532162049
She means that being in a country makes you a citizen of it.
She's dumb and wrong.

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>>532162049

>>532162192
Are you the state of Wisconsin?

>>532162319
>So they talked about full allegiance and partial alligiance. Both count as jurisdiction. The partial allegiance would be that of a traveler.
And an illegal entry alien is exactly the same as an invader and has no allegiance

Shiiiieeeet das a good point yo I ain’t neva thought about dat shit dat way yo

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Bitch is 55 year old btw.
Imagine a white roastie at 55.

>>532162211
Everyone who is here legally has submitted to our immigration laws and is thus subject to our jurisdiction.
Their children are therefore automatically citizens.
Those who broke the law to come here have not submitted themselves to our laws and are not subject to our jurisdiction

>>532162560
>If you are born here, you're a citizen.
The constitution does not say that. It says born here and subject to the jurisdiction. (Meaning not subject to another sovereign.) Without consent there is no jurisdiction, only conquest.

>>532175125
>our
faggot

>>532163808
To exclude ambassadors and diplomats, that's all. It's unfortunate, but that's what the Constitution says.

>>532162049
This case is so clear cut and easy only retarded miggers who can't read Pre-K level English think so otherwise. The line reads "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" not "whose parents are legal citizens/residents of the United States"
CASE
L
O
S
E
D

>>532162049
Some nigger pulls a gun....shoots her in the head....screams "I pledge allegiance to the United States.....!".

>>532162049
Japan doesn't have birth right citizenship.

>>532175125

IF IT'S BROWN I FLUSH IT DOWN NIGGA

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>>532175110
>it's not whether she can make a measured, justified decision on some of the most important laws brought before the supreme court

>it's more important that she looks like a NIGGER

eat shit punic

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>>532175125
>Those who broke the law to come here have not submitted themselves to our laws and are not subject to our jurisdiction
You're dumb as fuck migger, Getting caught for a crime and being subject to a nation's jurisdiction are two completely different things.

>>532162049
It makes sense now why Jews are here in America. We have have everything and they steal it from us. They are in an allegiance with us.

>>532162049
>"If I steal a wallet in Japan, I am subject to Japanese laws….. in a sense, it's allegiance."
no bitch I'm pretty sure your ass is getting deported

>>532162464
It’s a retarded hypothetical question, if I got arrested in Japan as a foreigner, I would be arrested, punished and deported, forever banned from entering. Very different from some gook or goblina who are here on a visa or illegal popping kids out.

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>>532176371
>>532176388
>arrested
Arrested by Japan, not China, not Mongolia, but Japan, since you are in Japanese jurisdiction you fucking dumbass ESL niggers

>>532176653
Cool what part of this implies allegiance?

>>532175955
> Cheap Evil Oil 90 banan coins
Geg. Who is Shiva supposed to be? Netanyahu?

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>>532176837
>Cool what part of this implies allegiance?
Subjecting yourself to Japanese laws in the first place you stupid nigger. There's a term for not doing this, it is called extraterritoriality, which 99.9999999999% of you fucking retards aren't able to do, get that through your neanderthal skulls.

She didn't mean anything because she's a braindead sheboon and was only put on the supreme court because briben declared he was going to put a braindead sheboon on the bench. It was even a campaign promise. Remember when she couldn't/wouldn't say what a woman is? This retarded bitch needs to be disbarred and Trump should put in the most hard line America first judge to ever bang the gavel.

>>532177131
>Subjecting yourself to Japanese laws
How in the fuck is breaking Japanese law subjecting yourself to it? Holy shit dude what are you smoking?

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>>532177031
Mark Carney, the prime minister of Canada

>>532162710
Holy fuck, I'm a Leaf and even I'm not this stupid.

>>532174382
>so the 2nd amendment is not up to interpretation but the 14th amendment is?
Yes. Now eat shit, retard, and then kill yourself.
Remember when you faggots claimed the constitution was a "living document" when you tried to uproot the 2nd amendment? Why is it suddenly NOT a living document when it comes to protecting a bunch of fraudulent foreigners taking advantage of a retarded interpretation of a very late amendment to the constitution?