>you can’t buy a car directly from the manufacturer because… reasons.Insane that this scam is still fully operational.
>>532270923Those prices are reserved for employees.
>>532270923it's not going to make cars any cheaper. how do you think warranty service repairs are funded?
>>532271042>thinks dealers raise the price just enough to cover the warranty and not a penny moreRetard
>i'm going to have to go talk to my manager>he's gonna kill me for doing this>i'm not makin any money on this deal!
>>532270968One piece at the time would surely be an even better price.
>>532272648I went to buy a car recently. My 2004 was on its last leg and got a 2024 to hopefully last until 2046 or longer.Started at 46k, got it to 40.5k and told them I want it under 40k total. They pulled those 3 exact lines on me. Simply isnt my problem you value the vehicle above what it is worth and I started to leave. Magically they had found they could get it to 39.4k. I despise dealing with dealership faggots. Now they are calling me weekly asking for me to leave a google review.
>>532271153i have no idea what your mentally retarded ass is trying to say.manufacturers pay for warranty repairs (parts and labor at book value) but they don't pay for the overhead on the building and equipment necessary to service the vehicles. that cost is paid by the dealership, who in turn funds this cost via markup on manufacturer MSRP. if you want warranty services you still need to pay for that building and equipment... in addition to the cost of the parts and labor.
>>532271042Warranty gets charged back to the manufacturer you fucking moron.
>>532273797hello mentally deficient nigger retard. see this post. >>532273765
>>532273765>i have no idea what your mentally retarded ass is trying to say.That would be because you have the reading comprehension of a small child. Lurk for 2 years before posting again.
>>532270923You also can't buy foreign made cars for cheap either. Sorry goy, please keep buying our $40k+ shitboxes filled with electronics that cost $5k to repair. What you want a car that just drives from point A to B and has air conditioning? Don't be silly goy, that's illegalImagine if they actually made good cars again, everything is fucking carslop nowadays
>>532273765>thinks dealers raise the price just enough to cover the overhead on the building and equipment and not a penny more
>>532273765Dealers make the majority of their money from repairs and very little from car sales minus the financing
>>532274575the sales wagies are commission only and they make $200-400 on a new car, some of which goes to the sales wagie and some which goes to the support staff (finance manager, receptionist, etc.)direct to consumer sales won't yield materially cheaper cars.
>>532270923matilda was a great movieit was really good at showing how cartoonish the world can seem through the eyes of a child
>>532274790>the sales wagies are commission only and they make $200-400 on a new car, some of which goes to the sales wagie and some which goes to the support staff (finance manager, receptionist, etc.)You’re forgetting the owners of the dealership, who will be taking home the largest portion of revenue. Where do you suppose their money comes from? >direct to consumer sales won't yield materially cheaper cars.Just simply wrong.
>>532273765The manufacturer includes all of that in the MSRP, which is a suggested retail price, which is the amount the manufacturer thinks the customer should pay. Never pay more than the MSRP, as the manufacturer's and dealership's profits and any servicing/warranty are already included in that.
>>532275048>Based on data from the National Automobile Dealers Association (NADA), the average gross profit margin on a new car sale for a dealership is around 3.9%. This means that for a $30,000 car, the dealership's gross profit would be approximately $1,170. However, it's important to note that this is just the gross profit. It doesn't consider dealerships' various expenses, such as overhead costs, employee salaries, and advertising expenses.https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shopping-guides/how-much-does-a-new-car-dealer-make-on-a-deal>>532275091you are wrong and you have no idea what you're talking about.
>>532275214>>Based on data from the National Automobile Dealers Association (NADA), the average gross profit margin on a new car sale for a dealership is around 3.9%. This means that for a $30,000 car, the dealership's gross profit would be approximately $1,170. Nice. So if I bought directly from the manufacturer, I could save $1,170. Thanks for confirming this for me.
>>532275397that's immaterial, poorfag-kun. your niggerbrain is also forgetting (again) that it wouldn't decease the price by $1.1k because the manufacturer would mark up the price by some amount to account for its ownership and operation of the dealership's service department, which is necessary for the warranty.
>>532275214Explain what the words "suggested retail price" mean.
>>532273765>>532273912They pay the overhead as part of running the business, dipshit. Not all work is warranty. Kill yourself.
>>532275520So you’ve gone from saying direct to consumer sales won't yield materially cheaper cars, to saying the amount saved is immaterial. If you’re going to argue, at least argue in good faith.
>>532275650who pays the overhead?>not all work is warrantyhow is this relevant to the discussion? manufacturers need a network of vetted and qualified service shops across the country to provide warranty work. as it stands, this overhead (utilities, water, sewer, lease if it's a leased facility, commercial loan if it's an owned facility, OE specific tools and diagnostic equipment, shop consumables, etc.) is paid by the dealership and NOT paid by the manufacturer.
>>532275710do you have a learning disability? $1.1k saved on $30k (not including taxes) is immaterial. however, the amount saved would be less than $1.1k because it doesn't include service facilities overhead. what does a SMALLER SAVINGS represent?
>>532270923you can buy a tesla directly from the manufacturer
>>532274894>seemYeah no. Just put yourself back into the shoes of a child and you'll see people are still cartoonish in nature. Whether they are comical or villainous though depends on you. Still, awesome movie. I think it was probably the first kids movie I watched with a female protagonist that I could relate to and actually followed.
>>532273991>my 05 Toyota has a head light out. >Buy a new bulb for $10.>replace it in the parking lotVs>my 2022 Toyota has a head light out>have to buy a whole new head lamp for $500>have to remove the entire front fucking clip that takes 4 hours>have to replace all the plastic fasteners>the clip fell off the work bench and is now crackedJesus fucking christ. All so I can blind oncoming traffic with HID projectors. My 2018 GMC 1500 had a bad brake light and they wanted $1000 to fix that. Lmao.
>>532275797The customer, dipshit. When you pay for repairs, you're paying for the shop costs. When warranty pays for repairs, they're paying shop costs. You're clearly fucking retarded. None of this requires you to buy a car from the fucking dealer.
>>532275924>$1.1k saved on $30k (not including taxes) is immaterial.Such a good cattle slave goy you are, willing to throw away money for absolutely no reason whatsoever, so that Mr. shekelstein who owns the dealership can upgrade his yacht next year. I can only imagine you are a car salesman trying desperately to justify your position in society, that would at least be understandable. If not, this is just pathetic.
>>532275797>Nooo we can't just contract out to qualified third parties>We have to bulldoze a forest and turn it into a parking lot for cars people can't afford nor want!Have you considered you're a massive faggot and should kill yourself?
>>532273571If they can elicit a "sympathetic" response from somebody, they know they've got a "nice guy," AKA fucking retard, and they can rob the cocksucker blind.Don't be fooled though, they still robbed your ass, but they have a very slight grudging respect for the fact that they robbed you less than usual. Business is not the place for nice guys. Go be nice to the little old lady next door, that has nothing to do with a major purchase, unless you're plain stupid.
>>532271153I know a few guys who own large car dealerships in my city. Like top tier car dealerships not some shady used car lot. The guys I know are actually strong Christians and not really doing anything shady at all but they are all doling very well for themselves. Dealers definitely make a good profit
>>532276143>When warranty pays for repairs, they're paying shop costs.WRONG, stupid nigger. the warranty pays for labor and parts. warranty does not pay for the shop's SG&A costs.
>>532270923Who made that a law?
>>532273571>He bought a post-covid vehicle for $40k and expects it to last 20 years
>>532276174>Nooo we can't just contract out to qualified third partiesthe manufacturer now has to invest time and money into training and vetting 'qualified third parties.' they will also undoubtedly waste money on those third parties fucking up, which yields repeat repairs and money lost on warranty parts and warranty labor.there's a reason why manufacturers of sophisticated equipment refuse to allow third party retards to perform WARRANTY REPAIR (and in fact void warranties for third party service.)
>>532270923I strongly dislike this type of protectionism as well.It is similar to communism in preventing the system from optimising in favour of busy-work.I do think those long standing businesses should survive, but they do (even in states without this rule afaik).Instead of preventing anti-competitive behaviour, the government is creating it.This makes sense, since the largest interest groups don't benefot from competition, and their interests are heavily reflected in the government.This is similar to taxi drivers getting uber banned in germany. Taxis still rxist in the US, clearly it's fine.
The scam is bigger than you think. You do not own "your" car. The state does. A certificate of title is not title. Why can cops take it without due process? It is tye state's property. It is a scsm.http://notfooledbygovernment.com/free-america/who-owns-your-car/
I mean this is the same with almost everything, not being able to purchase from manufacturer. Why are only talking about cars?
>>532276663So essentially your entire argument for why consumers should not be allowed to buy directly from the manufacturer is because of the warranty. So why not just make the warranty void for anyone who buys directly from the manufacturer? Oh I know, because literally everyone would just buy from the manufacturer to save money and the dealers who have lobbied congress to make it illegal to do so would all go out of business.
>>532276921>soverign citizen shitNo thanks.
>>532276051New vehicles are an anathema and I hope everyone involved in their enshittification dies horribly from cancer.
>>532277181>should not be allowed to buy directly from the manufactureri didn't say this. i just said it won't save a material amount of money on purchases.cars are expensive for a number of reasons. trucks are expensive because manufacturers mark them up (not dealers), which is supported by excess credit availability (retards taking out 8 year loans.) entry level/economy cars are actually cheaper if you compare nominal dollars vs nominal earnings across time, but they feel more expensive because basic elements of cost of living (rents, food, housing, etc.) are taking up a larger share of your income.
>>532275397they make money selling loans. if you want the best price on a car get the longest financing they offer and then pay it off immediately. just make sure they dont kike you with any early payoff penalties
>>532275214The whole dealership itself is a markup. You mentioned gross profit not selling price vs the cost the paid to the manufacturer. Every salesman is pure markup, every cent they get is paid by increased costs for the buyer. Yes the shop brings in money too but looking at just the profit isn't the whole picture.
>>532277598>You mentioned gross profit not selling price vs the cost the paid to the manufacturer. that is literally the definition of gross profit (revenue less COGS, not to include elements of OPEX.)
>>532270923>directly from the manufacturerYou'll still have the same prices. Why? Unless you're going to take a trip to Mexico to buy from Ford or to Germany to buy from BMW, you will most likely go to a type of dealer. A dealer needs its own distributor or wholesaler. These both have costs associated with both transportation and maintenance which must be met. Moreover all these businesses will have costs. "Directly buying from the manufacturer" in this case is having the manufacturer own and maintain the wholesalers/distributors and the dealers. It will make little difference in the price as the manufacturer simple assumes the costs and still must be profitable. If some dealers are defunct and dealers are owned by the manufacturer, then that becomes a problem for the manufacturer. Whereas with a decentralized distribution of vehicles it is only a problem for a specific dealer if that dealer is not profitable. If not going to a dealer and "ordering a vehicle" this is another complication as now you have to assume the manufacturer takes up the business of logistics to satisfy millions of orders instead of the current practice where the dealer satisfies maybe thousands of orders with an economy of scale leading to lower costs per unit.
>>532270923I just order from the factory and pay MSRP when it gets to the dealer.
>>532273765You are a retard keyboardmaxxing won't help you
>>532278063you're a financially illiterate retard.
>>532276400>Christian>practicing usuryok see you in hell, from heaven
>>532277919No you don’t. You order from a dealer who then orders it from the factory.
>>532273571I ended up dealing directly with the sales director because he got tired of his sales rep walking into his office every 2 seconds.He was a cool guy and a ruthless salesman. That was fun.
>>532276276Only explanation is they're jewish
>>532270923Just go to auctions dumbass. You can buy last year's floor models that have 1 mile on their odometer at like $7000 off the expected sticker price on average.
>>532278269At the end it’s essentially the same. Sit down and say exactly what you want and it shows up. Like 500 dollars for tax, title, tag.
>>532278514Many auctions (at least in the US) are dealer-only and do not allow private individuals to participate. Yet another scam.
>be american>want to buy cheap Chinese car>YOU CAN'T DO THAT, YOU MUST BUY 3x MORE EXPENSIVE AMERICAN MADE CARland of the free
>>532270923>buy a car at the dealership and get ripped off>buy a car from the manufacturer and pay the price of two cars just to get it delivered to your home...and get ripped offok zoomer, you've had enough internet for one day.
>>532270923>car insurance is mandatory to drive>health insurance is a necessity>mortgages have been unaffordable for 4 years>brown people miraculously find a way to fund all 3america is jewed to the core
>>532277598>Every salesman is pure markup, every cent they get is paid by increased costs for the buyer. Are you saying that the salesman and dealership should do it for free? That car dealers must work as slaves to the buyer? That they should not try to make a living for themselves or their families? That they should not be able to charge for the value of keeping and maintaining stock, maintaining a nice place for you to go look at cars, and for helping you to find one you want to buy? This is the communist retardation that whatever the labor costs associated with producing a good is identical to the value of a good while ignoring the value that distributors and dealers provide by moving things around for you without you even thinking about it. A gigantic decentralized distribution that exists just to bring goods to customers provides a lot of value to you the customer even if you don't even think about it. Complaining about mark up or treating it as a problem which is fundamentally just charging more than you bought something for is retarded in general.
>>532270923Not just cars. Remember Trump flipping out about people buying straight from China saying it was an unfair advantage over American retail? So only retailers should be able to buy from China at $20 to sell at $100 because of what added service rather than letting everyone buy from China at $20?
>>532270923Tesla was on track to eliminate this nation wide, but their CEO is so retarded that he can't take a win without fucking it up somehow.
I bought from a dealership for the very first time a year ago. I was inexperienced and rushed it and realized afterward I was ripped off. I estimate I was ripped off about $8000. So I devised a large slingshot that I can put into the back seat of a rental car aiming out the window and I can fire while driving. It shoots out a dozen 1 inch ball bearings about 50 yards. The dealership is conveniently located right next to an elevates freeway on ramp. So every 3 or 4 months I get a rental car, give it a temporary license plate, and drive up that ramp and fire off a dozen ball bearings into the lot at early hours of the morning.Since I know they can repair these dents and windshields cheaply I estimate only about $1000 damage per salvo, and I've already hit them 4 times so I plan to do it another 4 times to cause damage equal to what they stole from me, plus cost of the rental cars.
>>532279174No you idiot the threads general gist is we should just be able to buy any car we want direct from the manufacturer instead of dealing with artificial external structures that are only kept alive and are emplaced by government oversight and laws. Let me buy a hilux direct from Toyota in this supposedly "free market economy". Get rid of state franchise laws that require dealerships and the chicken tax, those are the actual communist artificial economies and they're in place right now.
>>532279174Holy strawman
Don't be retarted and buy new. Buy used, and shop around. And don't be simple minded enough to believe there's any mechanical benefit in buying German. Kia put a 7 year 100,000 mile transferable warranty on their cars. Honda dont break, Toyota dont break. Getting good, reliable, tidy motor is simple if youre not guided by what you think others think of your car.
>>532279631Based rental car slingshot anon. Godspeed
>>532279174Cars would not be so shitty if people bought direct from the manufacturer because they would be able to return them a "warranty issue" arises. Dealerships pay about half of MSRP then deal with the enshitification of automobiles and essentially being the body that stands in the way of consumer rights. I dont want to take my car to the dealship when something goes catastrophically wrong and they need to fix something. I want a new fucking car which pressures manufacturers to stop pumping out cheap shitboxes that we are paying 3x the value of. I dont need a salesman to blow smoke up my ass for 2 hours then pay him 5% for the privilege of having my time wasted. On top of that they straight up MAKE you take financing and wont let you pay cash which is fucking theft.
>>532279631Giant child. If i thought for one minute your revenge larp was true I would still think you were a pathetic cunt. However, as I know its a larp I can comfortable call you a cunt for being a pathetic seether, thrashing out imaginary revenge on thise whi wronged you. Get help.
>>532280630>On top of that they straight up MAKE you take financing and wont let you pay cash which is fucking theft.Lmao, no. Is that what your dad told your mum when she asked where all the money was going?
>>532280962I dont really care what your opinion of something you spent exactly 0 time learning about is, vinegar brain.
>>532270923Yes, you can... It's one of the great memes of industry 4.0 where you track "your" car as it goes through the factory. Both Volvo & Porsche has this
>>532279643>No you idiot the threads general gist is we should just be able to buy any car we want direct from the manufacturer instead of dealing with artificial external structures that are only kept alive and are emplaced by government oversight and lawsNo. They exist because motor vehicle companies decided its more efficient for them to have decentralized distributors. >Let me buy a hilux direct from Toyota in this supposedly "free market economy".A free market does not just apply to you but to manufacturers. They have the freedom in a free market to decide who they sell to. It's like you don't even understand what you're talking about. >>532279676Not a straw man at all. Literally communist rhetoric and lack of any understanding of economics on your part.
>>532282609The anon was suggesting that salesman are unnecessary and the process could be streamlined, and then you accused him of suggesting the salesman should work for free as a slave. That is by definition a strawman, you retard.
>>532280630Not at all. Cars are terrible now because people in the 50's instead of maintaining their vehicles, they let them rust and bought new ones after three years instead. And then there's the reality of the demographic decline leading to a decline in the quality of people in jobs. Cars will continue to get worse as long as people continue to buy new vehicles. >they would be able to return them a "warranty issue" arises. Moreover dealers are required to service warranties. Even if there was an issue with a vehicle, a company can still determine terms by which it will accept returns even if you were to purchase from them directly. Likewise since anyone owning a business can determine terms by which they will sell a product to you, they can have their own return policy by which they can inform you with paperwork or on a receipt before purchase. It is their right as a business.>Dealerships pay about half of MSRP then deal with the enshitification of automobiles and essentially being the body that stands in the way of consumer rights. Explain to me how you choosing to a buy a shitty car is the dealer's fault. Moreover any vendor can determine terms by which they will sell you something as is THEIR RIGHT. Why are you trying to expect rights to be this one way thing at someone else's expense? Literally communist retardation. Nothing at your expense and everything at everyone else's expense as is so common with communist thought. Everyone else must be made a slave to you. You can somehow have rights as a consumer and yet neither the dealer no manufacturer can have rights to conduct business as they choose or to determine terms by which they will do business from you?
>>532276462Thats wrong, can you post a source to your obvious horseshit. If it cost the shop money to do warranty work they wouldn't do it.
>>532270923half the "economy" is based on protecting boomers from their own decisions and actions. thats why there are so many middleman service industries, its all to handle boomer complaints.
>>532273267https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTP9__vi3d4
>>532270923why? what exactly can you buy from a manufacturer directly?
>>532282881>The anon was suggesting that salesman are unnecessary and the process could be streamlinedExcept you can't streamline anything. The reason things function the way they do independent of government intervention (yes, the entire system here is not the result of government intervention) is because this is much more efficient for the company. They choose to do business this way because it is much more efficient and much more manageable for a manufacturer to deal with independent distributor/wholesalers and then have independent dealerships deal with the distributors/wholesalers than it is for the manufacturer to do everything themselves. You remove a middleman or two and in exchange the manufacture must GREATLY COMPLICATE his business. >then you accused him of suggesting the salesman should work for free as a slaveThis is what the "salesman is markup" rhetoric is at as fundamental level and this is what he's saying whether or not you or him want to admit. It is coming from the same place the communist does. They must have all the rights to everything they want at your expense due to some idealistic retardation while no one else can have anything. Someone must be a slave to you because you don't want to allow them to function in a way that they would normally choose to operate because it is better for them. No no. That's Bourgeois (le bad). They have to be made slaves to the self-appointed proletariat. You might be too retarded to recognize this. But this is always what's fundamentally at play:>waaaaaaaaaaa i don't like thing>waaaaaaaaaaa i don't understand thing>waaaaaaaaaaa think bad>waaaaaaaaaaa only i matter>waaaaaaaaaaa people should do what i want and nothing else>waaaaaaaaaaa they can't be allowed to get away with looking out for themselves they have to be slaves to me and my sentimentsGrow up little communist baby. The world doesn't revolve around you.
>>532270923Wait, what, you can't? Oh right, you are all normies on here lmao. Carry on plebs.
>>532284463>yes, the entire system here is not the result of government interventionStopped reading here. This shows you know nothing about the industry or the laws that pertain to it. You cannot legally buy a car from the manufacturer in the United States because dealers lobbied congress decades ago. It amazes me how many of you retards talk directly out of your ass.
>>532284463>be american>cuck
>>532273991It's not just +5k to a repair bill, the electronics they make it so you total your $50k car if you hit or are hit by anyone at speeds in excess of 8 mph.
>>532283499go call up your local dealership and ask if corporate pays for the lease on their building.
>>532270923Back in the 1950s a bunch of laws were enacted to protect dealerships from manufacturers, especially after the 1954 GM-Ford price war. Unfortunately they didn't realize that dealerships could also abuse their power if given the chance.
>>532270923I don't need some sleazy fuck to give me debt and thousands in markup. I know I want a car and what it is and I would gladly pay cash and have it delivered if my old one can be picked up. Carvana is the closest thing to the experience I want but often their markup is higher than anyones.>>532272648This, every time. Why should a whole ecosystem of jobs exist on the markup? Half the reason Tesla is so popular is because they don’t do this.
