Is it just me or are novels intellectual slop? I tried Hemmingway, Henry David Thoreau, Faulkner, Tolstoy, dostoevsky, salinger.. Did audiobooks and stopped at least half way through each guy, never finished one of them. They are all slop. Shit for fucking teenagers. Every lesson they try to teach u learn natrually by turning 30. Only writer i ever liked was hunter s thompson and he only has like 4 legit books. He was the only one who really had style, didnt try to preach a high school lesson onto you.I do like philosophy books, those are a whole different ball game. Im a RF electrical engineer so I have years of studying and applying high level math's and physics. After thinking on that level these kiddie books dont really do anything for me. Hemingway is beyond awful btw, complete and utter boring slop. He keeps trying to do that alcoholic shit were he goes into the details and nuances of shit that's not even remotely interesting. "We were at this bar on this street and she was wearing this and the taxi that picked us up was this color and and and and....". Fucking god awful.
Im gonna give this book a try but I dont have high hopes. I could give a shot if the message resonates with me. If the writ9ng style is boring then I wont finish it.
There seems to be a weird little trend on /pol/ and some other sites of a general disdain for fiction.I don't think it's worth arguing about but the virtue signalling like in this thread is a little obnoxious.
>>533362761Oh and dont get me started on basedjack sci-fiIt has all the ingredients to be great, but the writing is for fucking middle schoolers. All asthetics, no substance. This book suck monkey balls. Dune sucks. Phillip k dick sucks. The plots are all kino, but its a shit and boring read.
>>533362597Oh and I forgot to mention that I started reading these assholes thinking they were the pinnacle of intelectualism and had intersing things to say, so I didnt come at it with a negative disposition or assumption. I didnt understand why I ddont enjoy the books for a while either, thought I was brain dead or just needed another author. Nope, they just fucking suck. 19th century writers objectively suck for a 21st centuey man of at least avergae intellegance if nothing else. I bet they were insightful in their time but all this shit has been played out in movies 10000 times, based on their books of course but im not a slopgoy alcoholic who obsesses over the origins of metas
>>533362597I tried to read crime and punishment but it was like 50% details seemingly unrelated to the plot. Orwell at least stayed on the plot line. I’m more of a history fan anyway.
You already posted this
>>533364111Ye like a month ago, are u on here every day lmao? Have u tried reading some novel slop? I preffer that then going on here every day at least
Philosophy books are thinkslop talking about hypotheticals that would never happen>DUDE what if we are STAR DUST>Simply manifest yourself not to be>OK so then marcus arelius said FUCK NIGGERSI get infinitely more out of novels (most of which aren't good but the good ones are), which are just the years of life lessons and experience said writers have from years of living their own life. it's more valuable that philosophy which is a midwit larp most of the time based on bullshit slave theories. A good novel will be written by some expert in the field with a lifetime of experience with a huge number of books already written on said subject.But anyways I've moved on and I'm working on my second language so I'm reading kidslop like La Espada De Fuego, but it's interesting because I don't understand many of the words.
>>533362597>audiobooksYou're a plebian, but you ain't wrong
>>533362866maybe you don't have a mind for literature
>>533362597I've always been envious of that sweater.
>>533364321Im sure the dude who has lolli saved to his phone and cant quate an actual philosophical argument totally knows what hes talking about. Manga isnt novels u midwit.
>>533362597You are so intelligent anonYou need a written version of BBC porn, you are too above of those novel slop retards, you are smart and intelligent you need to read something different, something that is not racist, total BBC porn
What ethnicity are you?
>>533364327I can walk my dog or gym it while I read, its great. But ye my attention span is too fuvked for reading. I need to fix that. Still wont make the novels any better>>533364392Then why do I like hunter s thompson so much? I dont even do drugs anymore and I loved rereading him. Maybe u telling me i dont have the mind for novels when I mentioned these goys is like me saying someone doesnt have the mind for movies cuz they dont like avengers endgame....>>533364519Now that I noticed it, ye me too
Authors are a bunch of pseuds. They can tell great stories and have beautiful prose and whatnot but most of the morals and political themes they try to express are either extremely basic or flat out wrong. Lenin was right when he said "the intellectuals of a country are not its best but its shit". Authors always believe that just because they can write a nice story that they somehow understand fuck all about economics or policy
>>533362597>Is it just me or are novels intellectual slop?You have correctly seen the literary problem.Move on to a more lasting story.https://youtu.be/PZ3hESj__M8
>>533364546I post from my computer and don't read manga because it's slop.If you wouldn't a 13 year old you're not a philosopher, btw.
>>533362597>Every lesson they try to teach uThey're not trying to teach you anything, retard.It's art and should only give you an aesthetic experience. If art is not for you, you could try to watch the sunsets or stg lol.
>>533364603Half (slavic)jew and half normal slavic
>>533364519What up with that? 50 year old virgin core or what
>>533362597you're just retarded
>>533364654Honest question to non Christian(biased) anons, is the Bible actually a good read? Every lesson I heard from it is something u learn by turning 13.
>>533364658Didn't say I wouldn't but anime porn is brainrot for the ireedemgily mentally ill
>>533364653Theres no such thing as economics when banks are controlled by jewish bloodlines
>>533364743Start with Ecclesiastes.Decide whether to proceed from there.
>>533364772I haven't posted any porn though?
>>533362597>Only writer i ever liked was hunter s thompsonYou might just be retarded.
>>533364679That's the thing, their plots have all the potential but their asthetics suck monkey balls. Especially hemmingway. I excepted semi nouir and lost generation class from him but its so bland and dry..
>>533364679He is intelligent because he knows le math!
>>533362597>be 30+ year mixed race mystery meat circumcised amerigolem mudblood unc>engage high school level slop for the first time in your life>don't even read it cus too mixed race and retarded, just listen to the audiobook>don't even finish the audiobook cus too retarded>think you figured out all the "lessons">there never were any lessons unc>complain to fellow thirdes who have also never read a goddamn book in their locrs>topkek
>>533364694no, i just like a good rugged sweater. for rugged men who have lots of sex with women, so they can wear them sometimes and talk about all the sex with women that they have.also, OP is a trolling faggot autistic retard for not liking hemingway.
>>533364644> then why do I like a literal degenerate who wrote everything as a series of assertive, rambling musings about how society has failed in some fashion?Probably because you're too retarded to understand the nuance of any of the literature you claimed to read?> erm ackshully muh RF engineeringIf you're going to claim an engineering field to back your intelligence and then try to parlay that into you being qualified to criticize some of the best authors of the modern era, you must not be that intelligent. If you have any real competence, then your (hollow) critique can be filed away as a fit born of Nobel Laureate syndrome, but I doubt strongly that you do.
>>533364071you are american. catcher in the rye is the highlight of your literature. of course you're not going to get anything from the great british and russian authors
>>533364785Ok memeflag retard
>>533362597>Every lesson they try to teach u learn natrually by turning 30. So if you read them by 20 you'll spare yourself a decade of painful consequences? You're making the books look better and better anon.
>>533362597Decently based post. “Intellectual slop” is a good term for a lot of novels. However, I am concerned that you did not see the value in Thoreau, Tolstoy, and Dostoevsky. You are right to call out Hemingway, Faulkner, and Salinger. The key difference is sloppa novels are designed to make (You), the reader, feel smart for reading them. If you’ve studied literature, you can tell when the author is patronizing you. Posers basically. Good novels just are what they are and don’t care what (You) think. Don’t give up reading. There are good works to be found.
>>533362597I agree with your opinions. It's very trite.
I hate to be a philistine, but I tried a lot of the ‘Great’ novels, and frankly I was left underwhelmed. Maybe I’m too stupid to pick up on all the subtext. Some of the newer stuff is more compelling to me, but the overwhelming majority is complete dung. Dull and predictable at best, crude propaganda for women at worst.You really have to be discerning with this stuff. Personally I’m so discerning, I don’t read anything much beyond pol posts these days.
>>533364644>Then why do I like hunter s thompson so much?Because you're too young for Hemingway.I saw Thompson live once, for an interview and audience questions. He was over 45 minutes late and absolutely shitfaced. He mumbles naturally and with the booze no one could understand what he was saying, including the interviewer. He ended the interview by throwing his half-empty glass of Chivas about thirty feet into the air over his head and walking off without taking questions.
>>533362666>>533364888camp is a great book. in the first 11 pages a hippie gets his head blown off with a shotgun. hemmingway is a dogshit commie with dry prose and excruciatingly dull themes. try orwell (not 1984; keep the aspidistra flying, burmese days, down and out) and confederacy of dunces.
>>533365526>first 11 pages a hippie gets his head blown off with a shotgunYeah I went back and reread that a few times.
>>533362597never read hemingway, but from what i've learned about him he had great experiences in war and love. wasn't it hemingway who said those who are closest to death are the ones living life to the fullest?"The world breaks every one and afterward many are strong at the broken places"i haven't tried to read any of his work yet, although as an aspiring writer I probably should. But on some level i agree with you 19th and early 20th century writing doesn't hit our dopamine receptors like any of the modern brain rot we have these days, so when writers like Bukowski dribble on about some sexual escapade or some shitty apartment it doesn't seem like anything special.
>>533362866You aren't reading what aligns with your values are interests.If you want interesting stuff either try philosophers more aligned with you, or try interesting books like the 40 laws of power.I also enjoy history so I read history books.On the fiction side pick stuff you like, I enjoy Litrpg slop personally, numbers must go up.I don't find I have no mouth good because it's doomer AI glazing torture porn by a Jew.It's really that simple read your interests.Don't read stuff you dislike because someone said it's only for intellectuals.Books are either a tool to learn with or an interesting pass time.I wouldn't be caught dead reading most philosophers because I find dead guys questioning if they exist dumb.I enjoyed reading religious philosophers like Al Ghazzali more because he aligned more with what I like.
>>533364975Im uncircumcised, was born in uROPE. Also did u not read the part about were i thought their writing style was boring. I dont have time to read a book the regular way, im gainfully employed
>>533362597>Im a RF electrical engineer so I have years of studying and applying high level math's and physics.Laughing in BAScEE.
the bible is the only book you need
>>533362597You may actually be autistic if you can't enjoy fiction.
>>533365101>Muh nuance>muh in-between the linesFuck off seething non STEM manual laborer. Mathematics is objectively the pinnacle of intellectual achievement. Im smart than anyone who tried to make a living out of social studies subjects
>>533365174Ye if u read them in middle school then it would be a big advantage but you didnt did u?
>>533362597I enjoyed "All the Kings Men." Classic story of American political corruption. It's a fictionalized story of Huey Long.
>>533365201Thoreau, Tolstoy and dostoevsky weren't bad but nothing plspecial. In the 19th century I bet they were ground breaking but all their tropes have been played out. I bet avengers endgame would have been revolutionary in the 19th century also..
>>533362597>Every lesson they try to teach uImagine reading novels to learn lessons. Philosophy is 99% dogshit.
>>533365975>Mathematics is objectively the pinnacle of intellectual achievementlol
>>533365384He stopped writing anything good by the time he got famouse. U trying to say hemmingway was less of an alkie?
>>533362597>>533362866I remember you from another thread. Sci-fi is gay and fiction is ass for the most part. History is my go to. Check out Empire of the Summer Moon. It's about the Comanche and the formation of the Texas rangers and shit. It doesn't pull any punches with the injuns either.
>>533365975You stink of r*ddit.
>>533365753Hunter s thompson did it WAY betterTHE EDGE. The only people who truly know were it is are the ones who have gone over.Not that its some ground breaking statement but its got style. Unlike hemmingway who has 0 prose as another anon summarized it..
>>533365384by the time of the 80s and 90s thompson was a burned out drug addict alcoholicbut hells angels, fear and loathing, and fear and loathing on the campaign trail are great books.thompson has the ability for his dribbling to be entertaining
>>533365945You'd think The Sun Also Rises would have an audience here, since it's about a guy who had his dick shot off in the war so he can't consumate his love for the object of his desire, perpetually friend-zoned by the bullet of fate, a tragic stunted romance with an idealized female figure who goes on to have an affair with a jew, lots of unspoken anguish and cringe between the lines, oh what might have been, Brett, what might have been, if only my dick had not been shot off in the war.You'd think all the incels here would find something in it.
>>533362597>audiobookslearn2read faggot
>>533362597Novels were never meant to be some erudite club of mega intellectuals. They were stories written for entertainment for regular people before they forgot how to read more than 140 characters. Only now is reading books seen as some “high intellectual” activity to read what is essentially pop culture fiction from previous eras.
>>533365899If this is ur circuculum them lmao dude. Us EE mog u in EM knowledge. Also im a working professional, u are a Starbucks barista
>>533366283"Pretty thought, isnt it"10 hours of my life for that. I want my money back. If that truly is one of his best books then there is no need for me to give him another chance
BTW, since it's semi-relevant there was an interview from the 60s in which Truman Capote complained that literary criticism in the US was nearly monopolized by like 15 Jews in NYC and they alone decided who "made it" and who didn't. He said the South had many wonderful authors but you never heard from them because they weren't part of that NYC crew.
>>533366400You're a hard case, and a confirmed autist. I recommend you keep yourself busy with your soldering iron.
>>533364654Rollin. Where's the part I eat my own cum?
>>533366333Ye, I remeber before the internet i read then the same way I watch Netflix, just a way to pass the time. Zoomer are so vile that they made reading look like a higher calling
>>533366436Some whore told me that shit when I was 20.. "maybe we will run into each other in another life". Same shit
>>533366333>Only now is reading books seen as some “high intellectual” activity to read what is essentially pop culture fiction from previous eras.well said, hemingway for example is history pop culture for the lost generation (an interesting time period if you ask me). i'm sure reading uncle tom's cabin will take you back to pre-civil war america. they are pretty much time pieces in that respect.
>>533362761Its not that. The books are good, but they're as good as any other entertainment medium. There is this expectation when you get super into literature that you'll find some groundbreaking intellectual value from it. Its no different than watching a movie or passively consuming media. Playing an instrument is a better use of your time if you want some intellectual stimulation.The worst offender on /lit/ is Blood Meridian. I can call it nothing else but "unnerving-slop". The book constantly pressures you and it gives the feeling that the author is watching you with a faggy smirk going "eh, are you unnerved yet? Huh, pretty UNNERVING huh?!" As the kids say, its cringe.
In the sense that every war baby read Catcher In The Rye as a teenager. It was one of those "essential" books for that generation.
>>533362597Kurt Vonnegut, Philip K Dick, and Tom Robbin’s are good, imo off the top of my head
>>533362597>I have years of studying and applying high level math's and physicsYour mind works on abstracts, you are both a highly advanced mind and complete retard in terms of social interactions
>>533366623Bascially the plot of this movie. It's for people who live in the past
>>533362597Herman Hesse
My cousin's cousin on his opposite side is from the Tolstoy family. They are a strange bunch that's for sure.
>>533365384What else did you expect or want from him? That’s all sounds about right. If Bukowski showed up sober, wouldn’t you be disappointed?
>>533366752Why is hunter s thompson such an entertaining read for me while these goys make me feel nothing?
>>533362597I like Steinbeck Your just jaded , when these books were written there were no personal phone , internet, movies and tv were tame , most people lived boring work a day lives. Most of the great literary works we read I school I found boring , catcher in the rye , boring , on the road boring. Brave new world and 1984 were interesting.
>>533362597have you tried reading for entertainment? fucking dumbass
>>533362597Literature isn’t for everyone. It doesn’t compare to video games, getting high, /pol/, porn, superhero movies, political podcasts and all the other modern distractions. It’s okay, because literature doesn’t need you. Hemingway, for example, will still be studied a hundred years from now, whether you like him or not. So, ignore literature, focus on things that are on your level of understanding.
>>533366752That's a good observation. Just like the nigger brain can't handle "What if you didn't eat breakfast this morning", the autistic brain cannot handle emotional appeals. I forget the exact test phrases but for diagnosis they are asked something similar to "A person keeps listening to a voicemail from someone who died. What are they holding onto?" and they answer voicemail/message nearly every time.
>>533366943>while these goys make me feel nothing?
>>533367021We invented this site goyim, learn ur place
Until Mark Twain literature and intellectual culture in the US was mostly monopolized by New England and their very effete, pompous writers. Like Shakespeare Twain gave the vernacular a lot of phrases like "whitewashing", "roughing it", and "The Gilded Age."
>>533366943thompson is always hooking you in. dostoevsky is not trying to hook you in. thompson is very jocular, very confrontational. he is engaging with the reader in a way hemmingway is not. you would like celine (journey to the end of the night), or james ellroy (underworld USA trilogy).
>>533367171>you would like celineseconded!
>>533367013Too old for vidya, quit weed(fucking with my sleep), /pol/ got invaded by shitskins dumber than me, just watched pirates of the carbean 5 and now there's nothing left so im watching count of Monte Christo and its not bad and I bet its better than the book and I will throw up if I see another political feed on my YouTube even if I agree with it wholeheartedly. So I started listening to audio books 2 months ago. Its still slop but I feel better about myself, plus its not a strain on the eyes
>>533367171Ill put that on my list, thanks
if i see hemingway spelled with two m's again i'm going to lose my fucking mind
>>533364644>while I readYou're not reading. You're listening. You literally haven't read any of the books you said you've read. That means, you haven't consumed the media the way they are supposed to be consumed and as such you're opinions on them are irrelevant.
>>533367420Any valid argument as to why I should strain my eyes?
>>533362597There some mountain of emerald, that around the earth, the reflection is the correspondence of the sky; that why it blue.
>>533364794https://youtu.be/kQDP8-r22YQ
>>533367502emeralds are green. sapphires are blue.or am i not understanding this
>>533367502U wot m8!?!
>>533367480While you read you think about the media you read, while when you listen you don't do it because the story just moves on. Reading activates different parts of your brain. Listening to someone reading is equivalent to reading a movie script instead of watching the movie. You might know the story but you lose everything else.
>>533367666satan is correct
>>533366465>5>Disrespectful of parents and forefathers Yep.That's sodomy for you.
>>533362597Try generic world classic short stories collection. But go straight to greek writings - Plato, illiad, Epicurus(only one book exists - De Rerum Natura) etc. They’re mostly fables, not nonfiction - why? Hemingghey was a CIA - nothing different from astroturfed podcaster. Most greek writings are lost that goes against Plato cult - why? it’s obvious. Various tyrants in history destroyed it as time passed. Why novel? - because they tend to not get destroyed so often the better if these writers were subtle about it.
>>533367742+) You inshort, if they were a really fucking well-informed wise man at any given time period in history, they would be “publishing” that in fictional form rather than directly expressing yout thoughts - humanity has very poor history retention rate otherwise it wouldn’t be so inconsistent and so much plotholes in it
Mount Qaf where Rukh birds live, the Angel moves mountains, causes earthquakes, four living creatures, the whale moves the earth, the bull above the whale; gathering of two horizons.
>>533362597Read the Saints. The church fathers. Start with Augustine confessions.
>>533367666I dont need much time to think about novels.
>>533367883The translations butchered those stories and I dont have time to learn green. I read the oddesy and its not much deeper than the 90s TV series.. The republic was great but I wonder how much of that was added on through time
>>533362597Mark Lawrence "Prince of Thorns" was the last book I read, well, all three of them, and it was a good style that held me there.I liked "Judas Pig" as well, but if I'm reading a book I don't want it to be a grind and have an inevitable drop halfway through.>I've got mates that sit in coffee shops with three books on the table just to look like a ponce and can't wait for people to ask them about it.Bellends.
>>533368344Kek....Read about some belled that turns to worshiping a kike on a stick.
>>533362597>did audiobooksjfc
>>533368344>read kike slopno thanks
>every lesson you learn by the time you turn 30These books are made not for normal humans. They’re books made for people who are unable to come to these morals by sheer exposure to the world, so they need storybooks in the same way a child does. That’s why so many millennials will relate fucking EVERYTHING to Harry Potter and shit “oh my god class division, just like in Harry Potter” “oh my god corrupt governments, just like in 1984!”They’re literally storybooks made for adults who are not aware of the world around them and need fiction to develop a moral compass. And yes this method can and has been weaponized heavily
>>533365792>40 laws of powerjfc anon, just skip that entirely and read the prince
>>533368793Well said
>>533362761It’s cause they fell for the Epstein psyop (this is an psyop board) of fiction being a waste of time and the only things worth reading are philosophy (only for the sake of glorified self-help, see also the modern self proclaimed “stoics”) and the Bible (to virtue signal about how conservative you are, you don’t actually read it). Everything you do must be work because your life only exists for work, embrace that Protestant work ethic and work yourself to death, art is a distraction. It’s all preparation for 16 hour 7 day workweeks in Peter Thiels cobalt mines.
>>533362597It's pseudointellectual slop rather. Good for kids, yep.I do enjoy Wodehouse, his prose is absolutely unmatched. Not exactly deep but witty and entertaining it is. You may try his Wooster and Jeeves series first.
>>533368793This is what Scott's Blackrunner metaphor was for "Replicants">Deckard:- "You gave them memories."A buffer for their underdeveloped emotional state.Books, t.v serise, movies, all these works of fiction are for those with zero internal monologue of independent thought. They can't process the world around them and only follow crowds.Sports games to t.v shows reveal the world to them with no concept of the fact that this isn't how it's done.When ylu tell them something they'll say..."Where did you hear that?""Who told you that?""Stop watching whatever it is."They can't conceive of observation and developing an independent thought from it.
>>533362597>intellectual sloplmao, shut up twitter retardyou don't even know how to spell hemingway
>>533370442Hemmy's so fucking deep man..... You couldn't come up with anything like picrel on your own....
>>533362597I'd start with a translation of Candide by Volitare. Shakespeare, Sir Thomas Mallory, Anderson, or Tolkien if that's not working for you. I'm only posting because you're responding to the thread, but I'm probably off.>>533362761Agreed.>>533364111I didn't see it last time, faggot.
>>533364685I regret giving you any attention and knowledge. OP was a faggot as always.
>>533364685Cyril Kornbluth was a genius you should understand then. If you can read Russian then Kir Bulychev will give you worlds of joy (mind you that he's written about the most anti-totalitarian book ever as well - The Naked People. He isn't being translated to English though)
>>533370906I know, no one likes slavs
>>533372434You can't go wrong with good old Mikhail Bulgakov either.
>>533362761I only respect one author and his name is Thomas J GloverAnon, /pol/, do yourself a favor and pick up some Thomas J Glover in your life. Don't thank me.
>>533362597Those are all shit except a few Dostoevsky books.
>>533372434It's possible that the western problems and settings just don't resonate with us. Although Joseph Conrad ended up being as English as you can get and he did know how to write. Nah.. the "famous authors" are just pseuds being carried by the most professional American marketing.
>>533362597You missed the point. All classics are from an era when the books were the best tools for mass communication thus the best medium for teaching people good values via good stories. Their message became mundane precisely because of their success in the previous decades. In an environment where teenagers grow up by listening to the genderqueer stories about polyamorous relationships, the importance of those classics is more than ever.
>>533368793You are a stupid human being. Those examples are given not because you can't find anything in your life to apply to that situation, it's to allow other people to conceptualize it via widely known story. It's really rich for you to claim any intellectual superiority when you can't comprehend a simple fact as that.
You're reading novels to be in the company of interesting people. It's like having a conversation with another mind, but in your head, through space and time. If you're not interested in what they have to say, that's not necessarily on them. Would you have to tell them anything that would excite a brilliant mind like yourself?
harassment architecture by mike ma (pbuh) is one big >in minecraft shitpost that’s worth a read if you’ve spent years here. i’m currently reading the serpent and the rainbow which is a nonfiction study of the zoological/botanical/theological aspects of haitian and west african zombies aka voudon as told by a archaeologist/botanist it’s fascinating
