An important detail that's often overlooked about this fable is that, eventually, the fox moves on. It doesn't linger around or try in vain to jump up again and again to waste its energy. Sure, it makes a degrading remark to soothe its own ego, but that doesn't change the fact that by the time the fox has caught its next meal, the grapes are long forgotten.
well, its insisting to the reader theres really nothing really wrong with the grapesmaybe we could have a little closer inspection?
Not really, every time he looks at some grapes he will remember his incompetence. But it's a mindset thing, the seething is all self made. A more positive mindset like asking for help or finding something to use as support to jump higher gets him the grapes.
>>84306338what if the grapes are poisonous?
>>84306338>t. wishcasting rotten grapecel
>>84306338>A more positive mindset like asking for help or finding something to use as support to jump higher gets him the grapes.Or you could always just resort to grape.
In reality the grapes once developed enough drop onto the ground and the fox who waited laps them up content.
Moving on is the right choice. But it's about how it moves on, which is by deceiving itself to soothe its wounded pride rather than just accept its limitations. It's a common thing people do that hinders their development in the long run.
>>84306338The fox is not incompetent. Believing (or wanting to believe) you can have anything you want is exactly the kind of delusion the fable is calling out.
>>84307340>Moving on is the right choice.i think the right choice objectively was this>>84306495>In reality the grapes once developed enough drop onto the ground and the fox who waited laps them up content.the fox says he doesn't want the grapes but what i want to know is did the hunger ever go away.
>>84306338Other grapes may be easier to reach. Alternatively, the grapes could be poisonous berries.
>>84307374The problem is not believing, the problem is thinking if you can't get it nobody should.
>>84307340What difference is there in accepting limitations and just soothing ones pride? If you just accept you are a failure, nothing improves, but if you convince yourself you could accomplish something if you want, you build confidence. The fox is literally doing the exact thing that is taught to be successful in life, to be able to see yourself accomplishing something you have yet to do.
>>84307419The fox can find something else to eat within its reach rather than sit around starving. Just like you can go find a girl for you rather than wait for stacy to settle.
>>84306253That detail doesn't matter to the people wielding the fable as a weapon. Their intent is to humiliate, they don't want the metaphorical fox to do well or find any other set of grapes
>>84307442The fox wants to believe it's capable of getting the grapes, it's just not worth the trouble. This is a rewriting of the reality that it wanted the grapes but couldn't reach them. It's about protecting your own ego at any cost.
>>84307467its implying that the grapes are perfect therefore the fox is wrong to criticize perfectionits kind of a sly way to liken all criticisms against yourself as invalid by likening yourself to these perfect infallible grapes
>>84307446Lmao the fox's mentality doesn't lead to positive achievement, you just lie to conceal your butthurt and hope no one calls you out.
>>84307490What alternative is there for the fox? To be depressed and mope over being a failure who can never get the grapes? He made the right decision. Alternatively, in the efforts to get them, he could have come to the realization of how pointless the effort is in comparison to the reward.
>>84307525the grapes are objectively worse if the fox can spend less energy on better food. objectively they are the worse choice with that extra information added to it and the fox is right it would be really stupid to continue pursuing them.
Kinda get the vibe you guys aren't talking about grapes.
>>84307537>What alternative is there for the fox?>>84307447
>>84307537>he could have come to the realization of how pointless the effort is in comparison to the reward.which makes the grapes a stupid choice. the fox is right it is stupid.
>>84307525And what does he achieve alternatively? Either way he isn't getting the grapes. Why should he be a sad bitch about it? Plus the fact that "lieing to yourself" (fake it till you make it), is a foundation of many of those who do focus on a growth path or chasing personal achievements.
>>84306338>be fox>eat grapes>brain screams HEY REMEMBER THAT TIME YOU COULDNT GET THE GRAPES FROM THE TREEsome foxes can tune it out, some foxes can't
>>84307559>And what does he achieve alternatively?It eats something and is no longer hungry.
>>84306253Based on that picture, he could easily reach them, he just doesn't give that much of a fuck to be bothered.
>>84307576So is the assumption that after leaving the fox curls up and dies because he couldn't eat the grapes?
>>84307419Why did he wait for the grapes then? Only wait for what you actually want. Also grapes will wall hard and turn into raisins so the fox is retarded for choosing grapes
>>84307545You don't need to lie to come to the conclusion you should just move on.
>>84307442I think that's fine. The fox can do what it pleases and will do just that.
>>84307467Smart calling op out on their narc post
Sup it's your bro WolfchadDon't listen to those other grape eaters, they were definitely sour
>>84307490Interesting so op changed the fable to fit their own narrative.
>>84307590If you're a doomer incel, sure.
>>84307545Sure they are objectively worse. But to that fox they mean everything. So the world can burn and the fox gets the grapes. >>84307546Kek now you are catching on. See if you can see this in the other threads made by op
>>84307600But he's not lieing, its his oppion. Those grapes could indeed be sour.
>>84307490>The fox wants to believe it's capable Nothing wrong with this.
>>84307638They weren't sour when it was trying to reach them.
Better to tell yourself they're sour and move on than spend months doing naught but lamenting the lack of sweet grape juice running down your chin.
>>84307649It knows it isn't though.
>>84307667That's not the fable. The fable the fox is lazy and doesn't try. It is entirely capable.
>>84307638i also don't see how its a lie thats theres better stuff to eat. the grapes might be fine but the decision to try to eat them definitely isnt. i get hes not supposed to say something bad about the grapes and we need to worship these grapes but the decision to try to eat them can indeed warrant bad mouthing - its just a dumb idea.
>>84307684It does try though, stop lying. It's about cognitive dissonance, which is clearly rife on this board.
Needs the follow up where the fox comes back a month later after eating his feelings and talking to Gemini to ask the grapes if they've changed their mind and the whole vine just disappears.
>>84307667Why would he tell himself that then? Part of him must believe he would be capable if he actually decided to put in real effort.
Instead of looking for another meal, the fox should jump until it dies of starvation or exhaustion, whichever of the two gets it first. It should lay awake at night obsessing over the grapes it couldn't get. It should make grapes live in its head rent-free, make it their entire purpose to stretch their paws out to a grapevine that's always out of reach.Or it could just move on, maybe hunt rabbits like it usually does. I wonder what the fox will do.
>>84307694if you tried to get something and realized how stressful and difficult it would be to get it its definitely possible for that thing to lose a lot of value in your eyes. thats not cognitive dissonance its operant conditioning - you keep getting zapped everytime you try to touch then yeah maybe this zappy thing you now associate with a pain response isn't that fucking great in all actuality
>>84306253>>84306338>>84307340The grapes are poisoned (incapable of devotional monogamy) and it's gynocentric to try to pretend otherwise. People who actually experience the poison are conveniently ignored.Gynocentrism is built on hazy, enigmatic lies and magical thinking. These lies come from the same part of the mind that is reserved for mythologies/spirituality/reverence. But modern culture is anti-myth and therefore lazy gynocentric ethos comes in to fill in the void.Men who embrace this culture (people who still latch onto the sour grapes analogy) are lazy and nihilistic automatons. They see it as a chance to finally become dull and hypnotized at the expense of their entire gender (and the world). Gynoslave cattle's whole shtick is to ignore the exploding nuclear elephant in the room.
>>84307699It believed it was, realized it wasn't, and then out of shame and resentment told itself it never wanted the grapes.
Maybe if the fox wasn't such a vinogynist the grapes would come to him.
>>84307732>shame and resentmentno thats projection which could be likewise responded back with "one must imagine sisyphus happy" another projectionwhy are you so intent to paint the fox as the bad guy
>>84307750Foxes aren't allowed to have feelings.
>>84307603Of course he can, but that mindset is just free poison. The fox wins nothing thinking like that instead of either trying further or accepting for now the delicious grapes are out of his reach.
>>84307750It's not projection and the fox is not a "bad guy". The fable is pointing out how people will often rather live in contradiction of themselves for the sake of their ego rather than humbly accept the truth and live appropriately.
>>84307775>the delicious grapesthats an assumption you're making. no one has any idea what they taste like and they very well could be sour. you could counter this allegory with the very simple a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush since indeed nobody knows if the grapes are even good at this point yet. again i think you're bashing the fox purposely. maybe the fox was wise to eat something else than waste his time on food he doesn't even know tastes good or bad yet.... thats actually just dumb
>>84307778if your rules are these grapes are literally perfect and without flaw then yes you shouldn't be allowed to ever say something bad with those rulesthe problem is in a more realistic world (like the one we actually have to live in) things are imperfect, do deserve citicism, and yes we do need to make trade offs
>>84307806But what if the bird in hand has a questionable aroma and a chick that's not yours, while you're sure you could catch that prize-winning bird in the bush if you could just construct some form of net?
Are you all saying the grapes are tits?
>>84307826exactly if you add more information ie this bird smells extremely bad and is disgusting (like wow im going to vomit actually) then that would justify making a net for that less smelly, lets be honest, not as ugly (4 out of 10 would be generous here) uh bird
It's about humility. The fox wants something that is outright bad. In a moment of clarity it recognizes that bad things are bad. Grapes are for wine, a grape still on the vine is not good. The acids, tannins, and sugars are not right, it's not stemmed, crushed, fermented, or settled. It's not wine.I sometimes envy how many seem so happy, and it looks so easy. Use words to hurt someone when they aren't around. Use words to hurt someone when they are around. Utilize power, and prestige to hurt those beneath and erode or poison those above. All of these things are clearly important for obtaining true happiness. Especially when combined with wanting and obtaining material goods, or engaging with popular stories like movies, shows, and internet celebrities.You can accurately say the grapes are sour. You can consume the grapes and pretend you enjoy the sour taste. You can remind those without that they are ambrosia and not the least bit sour. But if you don't possess the ability to truly believe they aren't sour it's essentially just acting, and the reward for acting is every bit as sour as consuming the grapes.The root desire can be identified. The purpose of pretending to want the grapes, and pretending to enjoy the grapes, is that of kinship and belonging. This is of course impossible to acquire because it does not exist. So a cargo cult is built around it. You don the emporer's new clothes. But every single aspect of it is hollow. The lesson is that there is no lesson. A deafmute appreciating song and music with others who also appreciate song and music. If you can't actually perceive the song and music you desire the joy that comes from it. It all feels alien and difficult to describe, because the essence can not even enter your periphery. Faking it for the sake of harmony is possible, the average person is exactly that, average. In general, very stupid, easily deceived, no understanding or appreciation for anything. No theory of mind either.
>>84307806he knows the grapes are good and he's not wise because he has nothing in hand. When the fox asserts the grapes are sour just because he's not good enough to reach them he's being dumb
>>84306253Ego defence mechanisms to a certain extent in healthy behaviour. I hate redditors and pseuds for demonizing anything related to the ego the presence and size of or the mechanisms relating to it as evil and 'narcissistic'.
>>84307864One could argue that one should never stop grinding 'till one bags their dream bird and that it's more a fault of the birds that more of them don't meet your standards.
You're all acting like all grapes are as high set as the grapes the fox initially set his eyes upon. Who's to say there aren't grapes just as fresh and juicy on a different vine in a slightly poorer vineyard?
>>84306253The sweeter grapes at the top make you gay because one would be willing to turn into a gay cuck like Will Smith to get them. Is it worth souring your life, selling your "soul" and losing the spokes on your butthole to get some sweet fucking grapes of dubious value? For me personally, no.
>>84307930>Who's to say there aren't grapes just as fresh and juicy on a different vine in a slightly poorer vineyard?its just really hard to imagine
The fox wouldn't have this problem if he just took finasteride.
>>84306253Classic allegory, but to be autistic: a fox is a carnivore, it is built to eat critters and is good at it. It requires meat and protein to live, which is not found in grapes. The fox sees it, and projects "something good will happen when I eat that." Maybe he is just bored and curious.In reality even if the grape was good he may not know the difference, he is not built for grapes. And if he finds another vines with lower grapes, it might actually be sour. So the whole grape project was in vain, it was indeed a waste of time from the start. The fox should focus on what he is good at, instead of chasing false dreams. Doing so, will cause avoidable and unnecessary stress and suffering for the fox.
>>84307864Right? Op will just add Whatever Information to make their argument right, twisting or adding details.
>>84307930It's not really relevant, the grapes he wants are those. There's no need to add more elements to the story everything that you need is already there
GRAPES OWE ME SUSTENANCE
>>84307865So the fox waits until it falls on the ground. Then eats the grape. The fox is smart because it knew what it wanted and had the patience and commitment to wait for it to mature enough
>>84308072Some foxes are built to defy expectations and will simply not settle for anything less than the finest and juiciest of grapes. Those who would decry the fox's valiant efforts as pointless do not respect the hustle.
>>84306253the part people always forget about this fable is that grapes are toxic as fuck and would poison the shit out of it. the fox yearns for something that will hurt it, and despite it's lamentation is better off having failed.
History forgets the fox that does not strive.
>>84307877You are assuming the fox can't get the grapes. The fox can, he's being lazy. >>84307988They are picked sooner in the poorer vineyards and gave accompanying issues to just the actual grape itself. Plus the trauma from the vineyard. >>84308072Okay so the grapes are now tree rabbits. The fox loves rabbits. >>84308079Oh but if the other elements are not added then op can't be right so that will never work you fool
>>84308100Some foxes prefer a lesser grape specifically because of who ..I mean..what that grape is despite other much better grapes being within reach.
>>84308116>The fox can, he's being lazy.Facts. Only the lazy fox must settle for wolfchad's sloppy grapes.
>>84308102starving is far worse
>>84308102Well but what did the fox say
>>84308131Actually not wolf Chad. He's a possum and says he's wolf Chad. We know this.
>>84308132It's thinking like that that gives rise to supreme gentlefoxes.
Kek the idea that op thinks he is wolf chad really shows what a retard he is
It also doubles as a metaphor for USAID.
>>84307447The fox causes every potential food he touches to wither just like i dry up pussi in my vicinity nyugguh
>>84308395You do know that foxes live in a den of bitches and also fuck way more often
>>84308404#Notallfoxes
>>84306338The fox should start a forest fire just to spite the grapes
>>84308407Yeah all foxes. >>84308415Agreed. Burning it down seems just
>>84306253the fox is a pus. I'm no quitter ill keep trying
>>84308578No, the fox will eat the grape
>>84306347Have you ever heard of poison grapes?
Stupid fox. Just have chicken tendies like me.
>>84309232No the fox only needs his 1 grape
But fockses can jump rly high like a cat that looks like a dog thoThis focks has teh downs
>>84309253Look at it's face. The fox does not have downs
>>84306253Other anons already pointed out, but the point is how the fox did that."the grapes are sour anyways" is just a lie the fox tells to itself in order to justify being unable to obtain them, it would be healthier if the fox went for "I can't get the grapes, let me eat something else", which is more self-accepting, and also a smart choice because it's not like the fox needs to specifically eat grapes. Maybe if you find them on the ground eventually you just eat them next time.
The fox would rather be dead.
