In the ocean, a wave is a disturbance of HEIGHT in sound, a wave is a disturbance of PRESSURE what is EM radiation in reality? What quantity is actually being disturbed/oscillating?
Red pill: whatever’s being measuredIt never fucking mattered
>>16801209Disturbances require a medium. EM waves do not. The analogy fails.
>>16801209A wave is anything that can be described by a wave equation. A medium is not required.
>>16801209Day 1 shit bro
>>16801215>>16801223I understand there's no medium, but if that's true what IS the wave? And how can you know that EM waves are transverse as opposed to longitudinal?
>>16801236We only consider advanced topics at this porn site of higher education
>>16801243it's just unfortunate that a more quality schizo post may have died for this low effort "aha" moment threat. Niggas need to do a quick google before posting I think
>>16801209Waves are not fundamental, they are just models. In the case of EM, Maxwell’s equations were altered in a way that they solve the wave equation. These alterations were not derived logically or experimentally. We wanted waves, so we changed the equations to get waves in the end. It’s a sad state of affairs
>>16801246To see this look at Weber’s electrodynamics. Describes the same phenomena without waves. So are waves and fields fundamental? Most likely not
>>16801246>>16801249go on....which equations? all 4 of them?
em radiation is actually god gasas you are reading this post it is god gas going into your eyes
>>16801237> what IS the wave? The oscillation of the electric and magnetic field magnitudes.> how can you know that EM waves are transverse as opposed to longitudinal?Faraday's Laws and the Poynting vector.
>>16801215Are fields not a medium? I thought the whole point of field theory is that waves are perturbations in fields
Classical logic demands the pertubations "exist" as a physically real event, just like it demands thoughts must have thinkers (cogito ergo sum) but modern logic allows for the existence of paradoxical imaginary things like complex numbers because they're super useful. So we can "imagine" thoughts that don't have thinkers, or pertubations that don't require a medium. Waves and fields are like complex numbers. They're based on something "imaginary" that nevertheless very accurately models and predicts physically real things, despite requiring you to accept the contradiction that implies.
>>16801209>The sun emits light soherically>Light reflects spherically>Somehow no interference Wait a second....
>>16801372this. I'm confuse
>>16801223Retards like you got an A in class despite not actually knowing the course. WHAT IS THE WAVE EQUATION RETARD?>>16801209> What quantity is actually being disturbed/oscillating?The answer to your question: Probability. The probability of finding a photon/electron when projected into x, y, z, time, OR alternatively the momentum of said photon. So I supposed you can say that the wave equation describeds the movement (oversimplifying from a classical physic pov) of the photon).
>>16801209Electromagnetic waves aren't mechanical waves, they don't propagate through a medium.>>16801372A field is just and useful abstraction. They aren't a medium. Waves don't propagate through them.
>>16801372Maxwells equation show that EM waves are self propagating. No medium necessary
>>16801267https://www.researchgate.net/publication/392083357_The_Derivation_of_Maxwell's_Displacement_Current
>>16801640because they’re not physical waves, they’re abstract descriptions
>>16801465bottom part of this post answers it ^^
>>16801397every time that i see imaginary numbers filter people due to their nomenclature, i chortle a little
>>16801215Waves need a medium also don't they?
>>16801972It doesn't matter because ultimately any kind of wave is an abstract model that describes a physical phenomenon. Take for example sound waves, the waves themselves are not real, they're a statistical quantity that describe how regions go from low to high pressure or vice versa. Ultimately reality happens at or close to the atomic scale.
>>16801972Why is the EM field not a medium?
>>16801986NTA but there are numerous reasons for that:1) Fields are not fundamental. They're just mathematical models that help in describing stuff. I say they are not fundamental because there are other frameworks that describe electromagnetic interactions and they do it without fields, but rather using forces in a mechanical kind of way. This tells us, or at least gives us an indication, that fields aren't really needed.2) One can't directly measure fields, you need a test charge. In the absence of charges, it is said the field is still there but you can't measure it at all. Seems very bogus.3) The whole idea of EM fields rests on a quantity that was added to the Maxwell equations and this quantity can't be arrived at experimentally or logically. It was added retrospectively to arrive at EM fields as self-propagating waves. Physicists put the cart ahead of the horse here.Not an expert by any means, this is all IMO.
>>16802002>1) Fields are not fundamental.Neither are water surfaces. Yet there you're fine with waves.>2) One can't directly measure fields, you need a test charge.Do you have any argument besides "I don't like it"?>3) The whole idea of EM fields rests on a quantity that was added to the Maxwell equationsYou could at least read the wikipedia article.>Not an expert by any means, this is all IMO.Then why do you assume the million of physicists and engineers that worked with EM fields are wrong instead of assuming that you're an idiot?
>>16802024>Neither are water surfaces. Yet there you're fine with waves.I don't understand what you're saying. Want to elaborate?>Do you have any argument besides "I don't like it"?Where did you get that from? My point is that if something cannot be measured directly, then we shouldn't believe it's real. Is this not logical? How did you go from that to "I don't like it"?>You could at least read the wikipedia article.Which part do you want me to read exactly?>Then why do you assume the million of physicists and engineers that worked with EM fields are wrong instead of assuming that you're an idiot?I'm not claiming EM theory is wrong, it's just wrong to think the entities built from vector analysis (fields, waves, etc.) are real. They're bookkeeping devices, nothing more.
>>16802024>You could at least read the wikipedia article.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell%27s_equationshttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Displacement_currentOk, I read it. What about it? Where does it say how the displacement is measured?>>Then why do you assume the million of physicists and engineers that worked with EM fields are wrong instead of assuming that you're an idiot?No one wants to face the fact that they've been fed slop all these years. Unless you can show us how the displacement current may be directly measured, I'm going to assume it was tacked on because someone really wanted muh esoteric waves. The funny thing is that recent attempts to measure the displacement current have shown that the theory is incompatible with lab results. Go awn, tell us more anon. Are the fields and displacement currents in the room with us right now?>The test results do not coincide with theoretical values of the classical electromagnetic theoryhttps://www.researchgate.net/publication/287082437_A_direct_experimental_inspection_of_displacement_currents
>>16802002>Not an expert by any meanswe know
>>16802160>we know>what is ad hominem
>>16801237>And how can you know that EM waves are transverse as opposed to longitudinal?If you accept the fact that photons can be modeled as EM waves (based on your use of that term here) then EM waves represent self-propagating oscillations of electric and magnetic field values that satisfy the three-dimensional EM wave equation. This explains phenomena like optical interference (i.e. interferometry) and polarization. The velocity of the propagation, in general, is dependent on the medium (its permittivity and permeability), but this velocity is equal to the speed of light in a vacuum when there is no medium. EM waves, as they are conventionally modeled, do not require a medium, but they can be in one.This makes the EM wave somewhat different than the other types of waves you are describing, which are instead tied to the spatial boundaries of a particular medium, or the pressure gradients in a medium, as they change (thus causing wave propagation) over time. EM waves by contrast can travel or propagate through a vacuum. These waves, if you choose to model them as waves, can then continue to travel through diverse media, such as the earth's atmosphere. EM waves represent an important force carrier in the standard model. Interestingly enough, this manifests as other types of mechanical forces, which are all exerted ultimately by electromagnetic forces. For example, the normal force preventing you from falling through the floor – electrons in other solid surfaces are repelling the electrons in your body as they come into closer proximity, causing a macroscopic force to emerge since the negative charges repel each other more strongly as the distance between them decreases. Hopefully that hand-waving explanation provides some basic context.
>>16802267How does that address the question lol. You just copy pasta wiki
>>16802287You don't know the three-dimensional wave equation?
>>16802289How does that address the question of a longitudinal component?
>>16802267Why do you reify mathematics?
>>16802103EM fields are not fundamentalelectromagnetic scalar and vector potentials are fundamentalthey are quantized, non-local and, notably, their effects are gauge invariantyou can choose a gauge and calculate a field from potentials, but not the other way around
>>16802378Any EM books that focus on this?
>>16802381https://www.kuenzigbooks.com/pages/books/22525/y-aharonov-d-bohm-yakir-david/significance-of-electromagnetic-potentials-in-the-quantum-theory
>>16802381Peshkin&Tonomura alsohttps://www.amazon.com/Aharonov-Bohm-Effect-Murray-Peshkin/dp/3662137267
HERE'S A SIMPLE QUESTION...Everything tends to react as a density.Think of your sky as an ocean of electrons that are suspended in Voronoi space (3D grid of individual repelling magnetic points).https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voronoi_diagramNow imagine individual photons suspended in empty space, filling it and acting as a medium of transmission of wavefronts.
