So let me speed run this fagots unhinged 1h mental illness self documentation. >>16902357>no dependence on oil cartels.Ah yes you can not have a ecocultist without the non stop conspiracy theories. Like do you understand how deranged you sound?>EVERYONE WHO DISAGREES WITH ME IS PART OF THE BIG OIL CONSPIRACY!Like can you not bring your mental illness into this disunion?>BIG OIL !>BIG OIL!How about big solar?And how literally anything solar is a scam that eats up government grants and produces useless shit? How about the industry that can do nothing other then grift for government money? Are these scammers not financially motivated to keep on spreading their solar lies?>BIG OIL !>BIG OIL!Yea you people are mentally ill.>PoliticalYes everything is political, I am right wing meaning that I think independently and question things you are left wing meaning you literally are a sheep and repeat whatever CNN or you funny TV man tells you. There is no real "you" you are nothing more then a real life NPC who will do 180 turns on every subject when CNN or MSNBC or funny TV man tell you to do it.Did we get this clear?WTF happened to COVID-19?The word's most deadly virus!Magically vanished now!The virus requiring social distancing or we all die!Except get together to protest racism!And on and on we go. i suspect only 10% of you ecos are actually believing that crap the rest 90% are literally repeating whatever CNN/MSNBC told you to believe today. >BIG OIL !>BIG OIL!Yea sorry you do not believe any of that only CNN/MSNBC told you to day that. There is no light behind your eyes, there is nothing talking to you is more meaningless then talking to a video game NPC.So with this out of the way the guy really ruined his credibility by repeating the same nonsense you did head a million times from CNN/MSNBC.>Solar good>Muh global warnings.1/2
>>16912243Here are some facts>He can not talk about nuclear because .... yea this is another solar cultist>He can not talk about hydro power !!!!!!!! because WOW simply wow. You think these retards would go for the most powerful and effective and working renewable however nope it is literally Schrodingers hydro power who does not exist until it magically starts to exist the moment when ecos want to bitch how hydro is bad because muh fish. He can not talk about hydro.... because he is a solar cultist indoctrinated on the solar scammers talking points.Here is another fact solar is literally useless. Solar can not work on any meaningful way to argue this is absurd. You really think there are is some gigantic magical pocket of energy in sunlight. That no plant has ever utilized like billions of years of evolution and no plant or animal evolved to use this magic energy.The evolved to use photosynthesis and changed it based on the depths of the ocean and even did go chemosynthesis however this magic super energy in sunlight? Nope no plant ever evolved to use it. The energy solar can give is at best equal to the best plant x 4 in 1 year. That is it. This is the fact. If there was this magical extra energy our world would look totally different like animals would evolve photosynthesis or plants would evolve walking or flying. And burning plants for fuel is on a medieval level of energy. fun fact the middle ages are ~100% renewable and do almost not use any fossil fuels! If you get away from fossil fuels you go back to the middle ages not some CGI eco fantasy future. These are the facts now solar shit is always a scam from promising bullshit to distracting from the subject with meaningless talks to literally selling plastic fake solar panels to make the self created eco cult happy. Yea these newly installed le solar panels on things can simply by fucken plastic that is non functional.2/3
>>16912244>b-b-b- my panels le workOK for how long before they break down?>I buy NEW ONES!OK and all the energy from the previous ones you used for things liek heating and lights and never EVER put even 1% of that energy for building a new solar panel...See the problem here?Plants put part of the energy they collect form the sun to create the next generation of plants this is why solar panels are always inferior to simply growing very good plants to cut down and burn (biomass).Also https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlTA3rnpgzUhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mzzz5DdzyWYAnything solar is a scam.
Solar is renewable and oil is not./thread
Seek help
>>16912249>It is le renewableAnd?>It is le renewableHere are some facts>>He can not talk about hydro power !!!!!!!! because WOW simply wow. You think these retards would go for the most powerful and effective and working renewable however nope it is literally Schrodingers hydro power who does not exist until it magically starts to exist the moment when ecos want to bitch how hydro is bad because muh fish.
>>16912243Good to see another mental illness appreciator pointing out some of the mental illness out there.
>>16912282Fun fact that tech connection guy is insane here.He literally rants how electric can not get started.Umm how does he thing oil and gas stations got started? Or nuclear?Why did big bad big oil not keep nuclear down? These people are ridiculous and everything solar is a scam like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H901KdXgHs4https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ff-3MhQ7ri8
>>16912243Wow anon, I’m impressed. You have a succinct and pointed argument and have convinced me that I am wrong. I am going to buy a 2025 Ford F150 (Diesel). Have a good day and god bless Charlie Kirk
>>16912243Renewable zealots make oil barons blush when it comes to harming the cause of nuclear energy. It wouldn't surprise me if they are in fact infiltrated to create controlled opposition.
>>16912243>>16912244>>16912246>>16912264>>16912287All this because someone doesn't suck iff the hydrocarbon lobby.>>16912326Seek mental help.
>>16912354404 - Refutation not found
>>16912326To be fair Hinckley point C is fucking awful. The EPR is so terrible it's like it wad designed to never be built
>>16912246>Plants put part of the energy they collect form the sun to create the next generation of plants this is why solar panels are always inferior to simply growing very good plants to cut down and burn (biomass). huh? burning stone form of biomass means harvesting, processing and burning it to then heat water to steam to turn a turbine that spins a generatorphotovoltaic cells require zero moving parts and at most need some cleaning now and againif you had some real numbers to compare rather than acting like a complete sperg it would be slightly more convincing, but your schizo rambling is not exactly compelling
>>16912246>Plants put part of the energy they collect form the sun to create the next generation of plants this is why solar panels are always inferior to simply growing very good plants to cut down and burn (biomass).so you're biomass dumbass.
>>16912243>I am right wing meaning that I think independently and question things
>>16912425How did the frogs do it?
>>16912354>All this because someone doesn't suck iff the hydrocarbon lobby.As oposed to the solar lobby?>hydrocarbon I repeat the unquestionable fact>>He can not talk about hydro power !!!!!!!! because WOW simply wow. You think these retards would go for the most powerful and effective and working renewable however nope it is literally Schrodingers hydro power who does not exist until it magically starts to exist the moment when ecos want to bitch how hydro is bad because muh fish.You people are mentally ill clowns!
>>16912431>to turn a turbine that spins a generatorYes and?>photovoltaic cells require zero moving partsAnd?The point is that there literally can not be more magic energy then you get from biomass since plants evolved to optimize photosynthesis. Are you denying evolution? Or what?
>>16912243>I am right wing meaning that I think independentlyAnd you don't want your familial clan to become reliably energy-indipendent and subsequently tax-free, eventually completely detaching from a state-run commie dependancy that forces you to interact with the infectious libshit society?Midwits invested into the partecipation into dichotomies simply cannot comprehend the desirability of a technology that give you escape velocity from undesirable systems.
>>16912326>It wouldn't surprise me if they are in fact infiltrated to create controlled opposition.You mean to tell me you don't know literal oil tycoons have been balls deep in environmental shilling since Day 1? Maurice Strong (Rockefeller's protege, founding chairman of Petro-Canada) directed the fucking UNEP in the 70s. Aileen Getty (the grand-daughter of the founder of Getty Oil) is financing JSO today. At no point in the last 60 years was """environmentalism movement""" free from the influence of various oil oligarchs.
>>16912567Plants turn solar energy into biomass at an incredibly bad rate compared to solar panels. A plant operates in the range of 1% where as solar panels do it at 20%. Additionally biomass has to be collected, transported and burned which all cost lot more energy than moving it trough wires. A typical biomass power plant is about 25% efficient dropping the sunlight to electricity efficiency to about 0.25% or 2 orders of magnitude below solar panels. The evolutionary argument is like saying cars can't be faster than horses because horses have evolved to optimize running fast.
>>16912628>The evolutionary argument is like saying cars can't be faster than horses because horses have evolved to optimize running fast.Let's see how fast your gay little electric cuck cart goes on a terrain full of bomb craters. I'll stick to my battle horse, thank you very much. It's properly optimized.
>>16912567Anon, pick up a plant biology book, really riveting stuff. Plants base their carbon biding on RuBisCO, it was the ONLY way that evolved for binding energy into carbon, it evolved ONCE. Because of how enzymes work despite billions of years of refining this protein it catalyzes the reaction both ways, instead of carbon binding, from time to time oxygenation happens, it's an energy sink of over 40+%. But because photosynthesis evolved ONCE it had to compete with other photosynthesizing organisms based on the same system and didn't have to optimize towards gaining all the energy from the sun, just marginally more than other organisms (or using it more effectively) so all the photosynthesis based on the same inherently flawed but functional system.Also plants do a lot of other energy intensive things than just storing energy in biomass, there are other sinks in the system, for example plants exudate a lot of energy rich compounds into the soil to attract commensal bacteria that help them get compounds that they can't get themselves or to compete with pathogens.High-caloric biomass production is not massive evolutionary priority for wild plants.>>16912628This anon is 100% correct, if we want to build something for a specific goal we can often do better than evolution where that goal not addressed directly or diluted among 1000s of other evolutionary pressures.
>>16912683Just to add to that, we can talk about bioengineering plants towards biomass production, finding synthetic alternatives to RuBisCO, or even go full sci-fi and talk about potential futuristic protein pathways that could create direct voltage from very modified photosynthetic organisms. But as it stands, with how research funding was distributed in the past, PVs that are 20 times more efficient than biomass exist today, they empirically work, and are economical to produce and buy.Additional plus is that PVs can do things other sources of energy can't, agrivoltaics, rooftop, remote solar.Solar is here, is solid, long lasting (40y+ lifespan!), and it's a source of energy with minimal downsides. More energy is always practical.That doesn't change the fact that nuclear research was/is underfunded, US totally botched it's lead with nuclear, hydro is underdeveloped too, but those mistakes can be amended while building solar today.
>>16912567>there literally can not be more magic energy then you get from biomass since plants evolved to optimize photosynthesis.even if you were to take the idea of plants being the 'most efficient' at converting solar radiation to useable energy this is fucking retardedwe aren't growing batteries that can be plugged in to the grid, the act of burning and harvesting the released energy has MASSIVE losses to friction and wasted heatnot to mention having to move all that shit aroundif you were to track one of your magical plants from seed to getting chucked into a furnace it would cost an incredible amount of energy just to get it therea solar panel is some sand and metal processed in a precise way, which then produces electricitythere is no magic, just knowledge that might feel like an impossibility because you have no base level idea of whats going onand screaming in to the void about it just makes you look even more retarded than you already are
>>16912243I watched the TC video. where is this guys video? I want more slop to consoom and I guess its good to hear both sides with rebuttal
>>16912571>And you don't want [absurd and impossible scam]Sorry idiot that is an absurd scam>Solar REEEBuild your magic solar city you retards then! Why the fuck did nuclear not need this level of clowning?Why did hydro or oil?>>16912628>the range of 1%>at 20%.>0.25% or 2 >Source some retard made up these numbers.See this is your problem it is all made up>horsesCan your solar powered cars run faster then a horse? See picture.https://youtu.be/R_lVdrHnbYo?t=303Not only is your argument stupid since plants Vs solar panels are the same namely stationary energy absorption you managed to defeat your own argument since a strictly solar powered car is incredibly slow and much slower then a horse.>b-b-b-b-b-BUILD your magic solar powered city you retards! Stop with the endless bullshit and do it.It is over 50 years at this point!The facts are simple there is no magic extra energy in the sun. If you want to go solar energy return to the middle ages wit horses and biomass not your plastic solar meme shit! >evolutionIf there was some magic extra energy in sunlight that plants did never absorb then all of life would be fundamentally different. like incredibly different.To suggest that evolution never taped into this extra energy is absurd (however possible). And you have nothing other then endless bitching.Conspiracy theories>Big oil is behind it all!literal scams.And invalid arguments since your meme plastic can not power anything worth a wile or you beg the government for subsidies or literally adding fossil fuels as some extra(not counted in your propaganda) you can charge your electric shit cars with!
>>16912683Meanwhile in the ocean in reality.https://www.kaneryo.co.jp/media/en/seaweed-info/>No it is ... [denies evolution]look evolution while not perfect will optimize and reward mutations who are beneficial getting more energy from the sun in an advantage for plants and they would have evolved this mutation. >[denies evolution]By your logic eyes should not exist since getting a basic photo detector is good enough.> for example plants exudate a lot of energy rich compounds into the soil to attract commensal bacteria that help them get compounds that they can't get themselves or to compete with pathogens.Translation>My magic plastic meme shit panels do not need to be manufactured in factories or the resources mined or recycled! That needs no energy!See why you do not understand the subject? A plant includes everything to keep on going, biomass has everything to keep on going. Your meme shit panels need to be build after they break and ZERO of the energy they collect during their lifetime is invested in replacing them. >[denies evolution]Chemosynthesis evolved!
>>16912243You know something is bad for you when all the Pedo Island visitors tell you it's the future. Simple as.
>>16912764>>16912764>a nonsequitorAll seaweed use RuBisCO, all photosynthetic Eukaryotes use RuBisCO, it's unrelated to wavelength.>knows nothing about enzyme kinetics>ignores 200x area needed for plants for the same energy output>doesn't understand why plants need shade>can't comprehend the idea of using something for 40 years and then fixing it and using it for another 40 years with 0.1-1.5% material loss for fixing it.It would be easier to talk to you if you pointed where exactly did I say something that's "denying evolution". It seems to me like you have a wrong idea of how species evolve.>Chemosynthesis evolved!All of Chemotrophs use RuBisCO.From all this epic trolling, you indulge in and from my posts you half read please try to understand this fact about evolution:>Survival of the fittest means fittest for the niche, it has to develop from competing for the same niche, not fittest in every measure over all niches.
The core of the seeth remains simpleHow much are you spending a year on gasoline, and would that buy you enough solar panels?Its hard to debate this, and come away unscathed. How do you attack this man, if you disagree with him then?
>>16912811>All of Chemotrophs use RuBisCO.Actually almost all (99.999%+) of Chemotrophs use RuBisCO.Binding CO2 from the air is a very, very difficult thing, it evolved before endosymbiosis, it evolved before oxygen in the atmosphere was even a thing, so the backbone of the enzyme that was iterated on to work with oxygen present first evolved to work without it, and with how small and simmilar those two molecules are CO2 and O2, it's an amazing feat of optimization how it's only 40% of energy that seeps through with oxygenation.I know more about plant biology than unicellular biology, so I just found out about it, there are some alternative pathways of binding CO2 in nature, that evolved in a small handful of Archaeans and Prokaryotes (5 species, 0 of them are oxygenic phototrophs, 3 of them chemotrphs). But it's not hard to see how, what endosymbiosis, nucleus and multicelluliarity provide make it impossible to breach that gap with a single pathway, even when more efficient than RuBisCO. It's impossible even for a very, very efficient phototrophic microbe to compete with plans in their niches.>>16912813I think this guy is just trolling but comes from a sincere frustration of how nuclear and hydro, 2 objectively coolest sources of energy didn't get the funding that solar did, I just like blabbing on about moelcular biology that's why I even interact in this thread.
>>16912243begone corpo shill. Go back to your cubicle, rat.
>>16912811>I do not understand evolution>Somehow getting more energy from the sun is not beneficial to any plantLOL. This is your entire argument.Combining this with the fact that none of the solar ideas produce enough energy and most of the time are literal money grabbing scams by the solar industry we can bury any solar ideas. >>Survival of the fittest means fittest for the niche, it has to develop from competing for the same niche, not fittest in every measure over all niches.LOL.Somehow getting more energy from sunlight is not important for any plant or a benefit. This is the fantastical delusional world of ecologists.>>can't comprehend the idea of using something for 40 years????What is this schizophrenia?> years and then fixing it and using it for another 40????Are you talking about making new solar panels? With what energy? From the perpetual motion machine you keep in your garage or something? >>16912818>>begone corpo shill.>Because the big solar corporations are all good and would never scam us right bros?
>>16912816>didn't get the funding that solar didAt this point only China seem to be interested in doing anything more than rent seeking. Stop lying bitch
>>16912748pls you fagets
>>16912818>begone corpo shill.You mean to tell me you don't know literal oil tycoons have been balls deep in environmental shilling since Day 1? Maurice Strong (Rockefeller's protege, founding chairman of Petro-Canada) directed the fucking UNEP in the 70s. Aileen Getty (the grand-daughter of the founder of Getty Oil) is financing JSO today. At no point in the last 60 years was """environmentalism movement""" free from the influence of various oil oligarchs.
>>16912820>Somehow getting more energy from sunlight is not important for any plant or a benefitYou know how when you have a complex system key elements in that system start to rely on inperfect solutions so those solutions can't be replaced by something optimal? That happened in plants.>Are you talking about making new solar panelsYup, making new solar panels from parts from other solar panels, most things don't have to be made completely new and the thing that gets used up, solar cells can be melted and made into new solar cells with small losses, that's why I said 99%-98% stays before and after "fixing".>With what energyWith any energy, nuclear, biomass, wind, but also just the most obvious thing ever, solar you built, it's has a self sustaining element, try harder. Solar energy can heat kilms, drive assembly machines etc. I don't get your point.>>16912823Don't call me bitch faggot, I just didn't know. You are right, nuclear was funded more heavily than solar in USA and rent seeking killed it. Pic related, big respect for Chinese engineers.
>>16912834>nuclear was funded more heavily than solar in USANo, its about the same. Stop lying. Civilian solar has been leeching of space solar for decades by this point. With no real interest in scaling up and see where that takes the industry. The current state is that we are flooded with Chinese solar, and that is simply because they have a vested interest in not getting cucked by oil blockades if there is a WW3.
>>16912834>Yup, making new solar panels from parts from other solar panels, mostAnd the energy for this is coming from ????The perpetual motion machine in your ass?> solar cells can be melted and madeAnd the energy for this comes from ????Perpetual motion?>solar you builtLiterally impossible. The shit you put on your roof literally ZERO of that energy is going back to make a new solar panel. >can heat kilmsTo bad you used all that energy to turn on your lights and heat your water in your home.> I don't get your point.I know. I do not know how to explain it to you that all the solar energy your meme shit makes none of it is going to be stored to make new solar panels. Therefor creating the problem that your meme shit can not sustain itself or you need to drastically cut down on your use of electricity. Still think plants are stupid for putting this much of the solar energy to ensure the next generation of plants will exist?
>>16912249>>16912354Oil is renewable and will probably be renewable at scale within the next 10-15 years. Look into the work with fatty acid photodecarboxylase and how it can turn medium-long chain fatty acids such as palmitic to C-1 straight chain hydrocarbons. The enzyme can be engineered to work on smaller or larger fatty acids and produce other alkanes, and everything else present in crude oil can also be enzymatically derived from renewable sources. Therefore, oil is renewable and in fact always has been; the factor that makes it practically non-renewable it the timescale at which decomposition of fatty acids occurs. We don't even need to develop technology for it anymore, we just need someone to design a plant large and automated enough to make it practical
>>16912875WEW
>>16912875Wtf did you mean by this?
That's not a 5000 pound gas chamber its a TUNDRA!Thats not a gas chamber it's an explorer!That's not a gas chamber it's a chief grand cherokee.Thats not a gas chamber it's a Tahoe!That's not a 5000 pound gas chamber its a path finder!The gas chambers are NOT disguised as transportation.That is not poison it is freedom distilled in to air.That's not a gas chamber it's an F-150.Those are not gas chambers they are only showers.That is not zyklon B it is only pesticide.You cant spell denial with out denali.You're so fucking racist you cant even see the fucking gas chambers.
>>16912850>And the energy for this is coming from ????The sun, you retard. If you use solar panels to power the equipment necessary to produce more solar panels, their lifetime energy generation capacity is capable of producing more solar panels than you have started with.God, I hate schizos so much.
>>16917180>you retardProjection.>The sunClearly you do not understand anything and are insane.>If you use solar panels Draw a diagram where these solar panels are.They literally can not be on your home since 100% of that energy is used up for bullshit like you turning on the lights.>necessary to produce more solar panels, their lifetime energy generation capacity is capable of producing more solar panelsThis is literally schizophrenia at this point.>God, I hate schizos so much.Projection!
Funny how solar cultists do not understand that their toy tech can never outperform biomass and they are worshiping literally medieval technology.Solar cultists need to deny everything especially>RALITY!This is a hard one. If you even gran the fantastical and nonsensical ramblings they present there is 1 question.Why the fuck did they not build their magic solar city or civilization at this point? Clearly if their off brand perpetual motion rants are valid they can power their homes with solar energy. and eclips all electricity with their magic sun power...Yet this is not true.What you get are literally schizophrenic ramblings about big oil conspiracies and endless grifting of government for free money or grants from the solar mega corporations. At this point it should be obvious to everyone that solar energy is literally a SCAM and the joke levels of energy you can get from this toy of a technology are a joke.>Biology and evolutionIf solar cultists are not engaging in their nonsensical and illogical rants about big oil they will propose the mage up fantasy that there is some magical extra energy in sunlight. This is most often never expressed explicitly and sometimes mentioned because everything solar cultists say is a unhinged stream of illogical insanity.If there was some magical extra energy in sunlight then plants would have utilized it. It is very unusual that this did never happen. This is not impossible since evolution can hit dead ends however utilizing this magic extra energy would have altered how biology and evolution work like absolutely.We are talking plants who walk or animals who use photosynthesis. Plants would have the ability to basically fly because of this extra energy and so would everything else. We are talking animals incorporating actual metal into their bodies and other inanities. Literally the only proof is quoting some professor or eco panel of scientists who say there is a quadrillion wats in 1 photon or some shit.
