Missing Links Edition>>IF YOU ARE ASKING A QUESTION, PLEASE SPECIFY WHICH GAME YOU'RE PLAYING<<Previous Thread: >>96366675/pfg/ (pathfinder 1e) link repository: https://pastebin.com/RSt0rF0T/p2g/ (pathfinder 2e) link repository: https://pastebin.com/1zySxwm3/sfg/ (starfinder) link repository: https://pastebin.com/5yp9s2U3>>CHECK THE SHARE THREAD FOR MISSING MATERIALS<<TQ: What 3PP content do you regularly use? Which one is your favourite?Should there be better links in the OP next time?Should someone bother making new and better pastebins?
Apparently the new mythspeaker book has a new goddess all about getting along with monsters. She's still unholy tho so lol lmao.
>>96464977New? Isn't that just Lamashtu?
>>96465013Unless Lamashtu is doing an insanely thorough rebrand, nah, new in Titansbane, and seemingly unrelated. I don't have the book myself yet to peep full context though, just a skeeter giddy about the "new monsterfucker deity" who's clearly not taking in or supplying the full context of this bitch.
>>96465013>>96465267>newnewfags read more for fuck's sake.
Found out they're making a card game before The Dragon's Demand video game comes out this year, has anyone played it?
>>96465508>from the final book of tyrant's graspno wonder I didn't remember her, I erased that fucking AP from my mind
>>96465571Okay, apology accepted.
>>96465602Yea, unironically, that's just outright my mistake for not going back to check through the old list first. At the very least this answers the question of if she's actually supposed to be chill, or if the unholy is a sign of sinister intent. Seems like she's chill but has enough followers baying for blood they're dragging her vibe down.
Whats with the autistic rage against fun meme builds?
>>96465692Depends on the edition and your table entirely, I imagine powergamers online just hate the idea of not being optimal but you really can fuck yourself hard depending on the scenario (just look at the innocent merman questioning how to get around on land last thread)
>>96465713The appeal of ttrpgs for me is making a dumb character concept, but playing them straight in universe. Like a wizard who only knows chain lightning and uses it for every solution, or a barbarian master combat carpenter who specialized in making boats for some reason.
>>96465770Your examples are more extreme than what most people would consider fun meme builds and go into actively trolling everyone else at the table territory.
Do premade character sheets for a5 binder exist?
>>96465682Would.
>>96465770Dude that's pretty fr*cken random.
Yep, I play a ruffian. Gang up, opportune backstab, vicious+bloody debilitations, preparation, high athletics and using a gladius+free hand. It's not much, but it's dishonest work.
>>96465682cute Greek wife
Whats a good archetype for an angelic sorcerer?
1E"This serves as ammo to make any club's normal attack range 30ft". Does this sentence also increase the threat range of the weapon or just the attacks I make on my turn?
>>96469400As far as I know snap shot is the only thing that will let you threaten with ranged weapons
2eSo I'm playing a Thaumaturge with Bard dedication and picked up Versatile Performance and Intimidating Prowess. I wanted to make sure that Intimidating Prowess's bonus to Demoralize should stack with Versatile Performance's ability to use Performance for Demoralize. I don't see why it shouldn't but Foundry doesn't automatically bring up the bonus so I want make sure if paizo made some clarification that I'm not aware of or if it's just a foundry issue.
>>96465984Exaggerated examples are not to be taken literally, but I realize you may have aspergers and are unable to denser them as such.
>>96469894Likely a foundry issue, it doesn't like you substituting stats for other actions. Using my kineticist impluse attack to grapple is a pain. If your GM is fine with the interaction, you'll just have to add it manually.
>>96465682What book?
>>96469989Yea they are fine with it. Just been bugging me and was curious if I was wrong. Thanks Anon.
>>96469072Blessed One is a good fit. If you don't need additional focus points and don't care for Lay on Hands it's not worth it though.
>>96468179I question the choice to pick up both Vicious and Bloody Debilitation but otherwise yeah that's bog-standard rogue. Bloody Debilitation's really good but I dunno if it's level-12-class-feat-good when you already have Vicious, which is kickass enough on its own. I guess it depends on what else you'd be looking to get instead.
There any decent third party material for SF1e? Thinking specifically in terms of feats and equipment. Mindboggling that Sonic weapons have ten times the support of any other damage type.
>>96465571>tyrant's graspThat was the you have to kill yourselves to beat the final boss one, right?
>>96471239I think that twist would work fine in a shorter AP like we have now but calling back to>Well, you were technically already dead at the start of the adventure so the whole thing is borrowed time5 books and probably like a year+ of real time play later is fucked up.
>>96471266I learned a long time ago never to pick up the AP until it was done for reasons like this, dead book 1 connections and NPCs that went nowhere or extremely late final boss reveals.
>>96469994filename
>starfinder 2 came out at some point.Is it as bad and dumb as the first one?>wm00w
>>96472183It's not finished coming out yet but yeah it's kinda dumb you should read the books for yourself, just know that it fully claims to be a PF2e compatible system and everything that entails but you need only go to the last few threads to see much more detailed write ups in terms of player power or lack thereof alongside modified player class fantasy and goals in game. I wrote all of that shit and didn't see GM core came out yesterday lol
Teaching a group of newbies how to play 1E this weekend. It's the only way to keep this edition alive
Pathfinder 2E (though it's more of a philosophical question) I'm gonna play a female minotaur in my table's next game, how attractive can I get away with the character art before my table starts to have suspicions about me?
>>96472359How attractive does it need to be? Do you care about any possible suspicions?
>>96472359Probably want to shoot for something between the paizo art, the Satyxis from the Iron Kingdoms, and a GW era femBroo
>>96472359If it's not with a group of trusted friends, going to be any level beyond "butt-ugly Martian". You're in /tg/, you should know by now that insecure nerds that think being a "gooner" is the worst faux pas you can make infest this hobby and is not a zoomer-only phenomena.Either go all-in with your furry fetish and don't give a shit or only pick Male Human Fighter.Semi-Related: I'm reminded of the time Legends of Runeterra/the League card game introduced a femme fatalle minotaur and the fandom threw a shitfit over a skinny, sexy cowgirl over "UNGH MUSCLE MOMMY!!", and this lasted until the next set where there was exactly that.
>>96472183>badNo, in that it looks like it actually works for shit via just being a bolt-on for PF2E, adding a lot of stuff I've seen people want (new ranged weapons and casters that aren't utter dogshit, magitech)>dumbYes because it's kind of undercooked (Solarian and Emvoy look kind of ass) and between default fluff and how it tweaks system expectations just enough, seems to make the average pf2e fan shit bricks, despite the compatibility. The idea of a toolbox used and adjusted as you see fit instead of everything being purely RAW is foreign to some fuckers
After skimming frankly I wanted more in-depth and explicit starship combat and maint I want to play FTL with my friends during combat encounters not just restrict players to TOTM combat on a big pretty galaxy map. It won't be hard to adapt this system but I would've hoped for a few more pages and statblocks. I'm sure we'll get more later, check again in 2 years if you're lazy.
>>96472952>The idea of a toolbox used and adjusted as you see fit instead of everything being purely RAW is foreign to some fuckersIf I'm paying a premium for this toolbox and have to fix up every part of it then why wouldn't I think it's shit?Why wouldn't I just play something that works?
>>96472980>FTL with my friendsIt's frankly astounding how no one has ripped off Battlestations for an RPG yet. Battlestations itself sits in that weird space between boardgame and rpg typically filled by dungeon crawlers and extremely involved Necromunda campaigns.
>>96472982Because that shit is 98% of the way functional and all you have to do is pick one of two gear upgrade methods, adjust some traits for compatibility with your chosen upgrade system, and change the fluff to match the kind of campaign you want, not reinvent everything from scratch. Shit isn't rocket science homie.
>>96473047no reason why we can't have a big book of ship stats and flip-tiles to construct our abomination on the table to combat other microdungeons as it were. I need someone younger than 40 at Paizo who has played a video game at least once to break through on the rules staff, and while I know 256 pages is the new standard I could do with 14 less on "how to adapt pf2e to sf2e and back" in the GM core.
>>96473113I think Paizo is pathologically incapable of giving players what they want. It's why Armory was full of shitty niche and gimmick weapons instead of filling in the holes of Core's weapon/armor table. Its why the City and Alien Planet flip tiles look like dungeon corridors rather than something you could build into a real environment. Its why there's no starship flip tiles.
>>96473113Much like the Bastion mechanic in nu-D&D, that kind of longterm, player-structure is very hard to get right if you don't bake it in to the core of the game. It either unbalances the economy, combat, or play experience. Furthermore, it goes against the d20 fantasy idea of (You) mattering. Even if you do the FTL deal and have dedicated battlestations (which may not be available if you don't have your ship built to account for everyone's skills) for each player, they aren't as expressive, customizable, or important to the average character's story or build. Roles and stations have to be flexible enough that anyone can fulfill them but also impactful enough that you don't feel it is a waste of credits. You would be SOL if your pilot is unavailable for the week, for example. So they CAN'T be extensions of such... Think of how unengaged the Kingdom Manager parts of Kingmaker can get. It isn't (You) growing, even as a better ruler given the separate skills it uses over their own stuff. It is the kingdom and that is really hard to conceptualize for the average player (on top of its own shitty rules).It is a major reason why I can wait on Tactical Starship rules. Not only it turns the game into a miniature wargame (and more likely less fun than a real one), it is so hard to make it feel like a natural extension of characters in either 1e or 2e's rulesets. And that applies to the flip-mat idea too.
>>96471239>>96471266The biggest issue I have with that twist is that it's very difficult to justify someone who's replaced their character halfway through the campaign or maybe come in late to be lumped in with the rest of the party, stuff like that generally assumes that the same exact party comp that was in Book 1 is the same as Book 6 but I myself play with players who flat out refused to let any character get resurrected unless it's like a mid-combat quick revive or if there's just absolutely no other way to justify the party being able to bring someone new in.
>>96474548Yeah it'll get better - this just feels like an expansion of how Chases already work. If anything I'll just be running complex dungeons with hazards for extended breaches onto a battlemap of a starship of some sort for when I want the on-the-ground to matter more. As it stands only Piloting and a few other skills matter for the majority of the defined starship roles and actions. It's fine as is but that's all, mostly just a new way to read a stat block and not really a new system.
>>96474600Yeah, they already said that the rules in the GM Core is simply for Narrative Combat purposes. More if you want a rules-lite combat to fit 1-on-1 engagements. Full rules will come next year with the Tech Core.
>>96471749damn good reason I'm very interested to see if them doing quarterly single big books instead of split 3 book multi-part APs is going to help anything or not
>>96475435It can't be worse, right?
>>96475482Hopefully they'll at least be narratively consistent and have things structured more organically rather than trying to force X level by the end of the book.Loot will probably still suck for the Starfinder books though.
>>96475482[laughs in monkey's paw]
paizo didn't think about the 2e Operative's "guns" confusing the shit out of people when they could've called their special class of weapons "Operative Arms" or something else
Paizo can't stop shitting the bed. They could be dominating rn
>>96480394I think they did that for future proofing reasons, that there is a clear "gun" notation over something truly specific for Operatives. Given it is kind of the Fighter of Starfinder, they just kept it simple. It's one of the few nomenclature decision I can defend. Compare to something like "Inventor" not only not inventing things, but also shares it with a feat.
>1eOur GM finally went and banned all spellcasters. Magic items are still on the table though. Are there any particular builds for getting the most out of them?
>>96480742Relic Master Fighter with Shikigami Style
My playgroup made the decision to seitch from SF to PF2e so I went looking for books.>Check Books A Million>Only has Monster Core>Check my closest LGS>Only has some random AP>Check another LGS>Literally has nothingDoes nobody play this game or what? Why is this shit impossible to find?
>>96480884>Shikigami StyleWhat is this for?
>>96480590>Given it is kind of the Fighter of StarfinderYou mean Rogue. Soldier is the Fighter.
>>96481027Prequisite for Shikigami Manipulation
>>96481049Kind of interesting. Wonder if the GM will let me do this.
>>96481059You can try to also fit in Equipment Trick (wondrous items) -feat for extra boost.
>>96480590I don't think it was a good choice to use a term that is...>...a common term used by many people in discussions in real life and regularly interchangeable with the term firearm>...already getting thrown around in the system with rifles and ranged meta
>>96481577The point is that every ranged weapon in the core book ARE guns for the purpose of Operative's abilities, despite the wide range of weapon classes they fit in. It keeps it generic, future-proofed, and easily memorable for people, and can easily slot in the pre-existing firearms as long as they explain that stuff like cryo-cannons aren't really FIREarms. It also not something prone to getting mixed up thanks to the genericness of the term. "Ranged weapon with analog/tech trait? Yeah, gun".The only awkwardness would probably involve combination firearms, seeing as non-Strikers lack a clarification that the whole combo will be a "gun" for the purposes of scaling. Or the two crossbows being a gun but you have to be really smoothbrained to get upset about that. Ultimately, I doubt that Operative is going to hog the term in any real effective way.
>>96480998Despite what hopium addicts in this thread would have you believe, no this game is basically stagnating and is still niche despite technically being DnD's biggest competitor. It's the Firefox of Tabletop.
>>96481892>Game is sold out in multiple bookstoresTHE GAME IS DOOMED>Game has excess stock in multiple placesTHE GAME IS DOOMED>Game has multiple popular Humble Bundles, including one running right nowTHE GAME IS DOOMED
>>96480394This is the same company that will have a feat named Tactical Combat and a feat named Combat Tactics and have them do wildly different things.
>>96482549Didn't say it was doomed. But I can tell the game being successful is very, very, very, very, very, VERY important to you and your self-esteem so for your sake, we can go ahead and call it a smashing success and household name. I'm not particularly invested in the performance of a brand like yourself so I'm willing to let you have this one.
>>96484529If you don't like it, why are you here?5e's woke bull shit and ai art use, open game license changes, and other dumb shit hasbro has done, has caused a mass exodus.Paizo can't print copies fast enough to keep up with demand, the beginner box and core books are selling out as fast as they can deliver them.
>>96484627Just because I don't fellate the brand doesn't mean I hate it. You're being a little ridiculous.
>>96482549I really wish they'd bring back the Fantasy Grounds humble bundles. You'd think they'd want to get one last spate of sales from the Starfinder one.
Can someone explain for retard what the differences between 2e and remastered editions are?
>>96484944Remastered is 2.5e but they don't want to just admit it for whatever reason, which is especially funny since D&D did the same thing with 5.5e.
>>96484944Since Wizards nearly fucked over the whole space with the OGL fiasco couple years back, Paizo felt it best to reprint all the core books with new errata and a new license: the ORC. Player Core 1, 2, Monster Core, and GM Core are all the new remastered books you need to run the game. Major differences include massive reworks of the Alchemist, Oracle, Witch, Champion, and Wizard classes; the loss of OGL terms and systems like alignment and spell schools; the addition of core mechanics like Sanctification, Shield Runes, and reworked Crafting, and better organization of player and GM options.It is similar to the 5e2024 refresh/5.5e edition, but it has far more attachment compared to that and isn't really as "negotiable" as that is. You aren't going to see people play the Legacy Edition of 2e (or try to say Legacy Content/stuff that haven't been touched up yet should be banned at the table), and most of the fans are eager to see new Remastered books to see how they update the lore, classes, and errata. For example, Guns & Gears and Treasure Vaults have Remaster books, with Dark Archive coming in February. Any book with a green Second Edition label at the top (plus Rage of Elements) is remastered or using remastered rules/assumptions.
https://2e.aonsrd.com/rules/1231-downtime>Life in a post-scarcity civilization like the Pact WorldsSomehow, I heavily doubt that the Pact Worlds are post-scarcity, even by the Starfinder 2e GM Core's own definition:https://2e.aonsrd.com/rules/1084-technology>Post-Scarcity: At this level of technological progress, there's no longer a need for mortal species to compete for resources. All needs and basic desires are met, resulting in an opportunity for social and artistic progress unhampered by the inequalities of the past. Oftentimes, this level of technology betrays a darker truth, as the society is propped up by those who could only dream of the false utopia. Other times, the civilization's military or explorative tech is no more advanced than a tech renaissance or even late industrial civilization, as some watershed moment in the civilization's history pushed them to focus their efforts on energy, food, technology, and resource allocation. Such a utopia might be accepting and curious of outsiders, or it might fear that the inclusion of outside technology might damage their hard-won harmony.
>>96474548Doing battle stations is a mistake. Like you can do it, but it's not very fun and would be very limited. What you need to do is build the system in such a way that fighters/mecha stay relevant throughout the game. This way your party gets a main carrier ship, probably some retrofitted cargo hauler for a start, and 3-5 mecha/fighters that they would deploy in combat. This way each player gets their own ride to pimp out AND everyone gets something to do in combat since they actually take to the field. Main ship could be piloted by an NPC during combat if needed depending on player preferences.The easiest way to facilitate such approach is Skill/BAB based defenses where ship speed/maneuverability determines how much of them you can use or penalizes them. Like armor maximum Dex bonus. There is little reason to keep best pilots on the heavy ships since they don't really benefit from it much. Fighters/Mecha on the other hand go from defenses being in the 13-15 range to something like 40+ over the course of the game. This makes small ships the most cost effective to deploy if you have the ace pilots to fill in the seats.
>>96464318Pubes status on your current PC, /pgg/?
One of our campaigns is ending soon and someone is building up a new campaign. I realized that I was in the perfect position to just make a character sheet for it just like I've been doing for my project so that's what I did. GM is having us do ABP with magic items so it's going to be fun just taking as many classes as I can to see if a "whoops all Color Spray" build will be able to last or not lol
Boy, I can't wait to utilise my favourite 4chins Paizo general thread to find books for my favourite tabletop roleplaying game!>rebrand web server down, probably permanently>trove domain expiredwill it ever stop hurting?
>>96485481Honestly they need to add repair lasers and let starfighters/mechs go into a "badly damaged" state rather than just being immediately destroyed.If you could divert shields to reinforce another ship, and have small ships do a "close range sensor sweep" to give a flanking bonus, that would be a vast improvement on the system.
Whats the best way to find online games? I'm a bit tired of Society.
>>96491237Run your own.
>>96485372Given that Akiton, Apostae, and the Diaspora are Pact Worlds they are most definitely not Post-Scarcity.The one good thing about SF2e is that this this SFS season might just give us a full gazetteer on Akiton instead of just dribbling and drabbling eight different planets.
>>96491237r/lfg
>>96491004You don't even really need to do that if you make it so fighters are hard enough to hit with main weapons on capital ships. Do something similar to Heroes of Battle from 3.5 where army formations needed to basically shoot over a whole area of the field to force Reflex saves to deal damage on a character since trying to single them out would have ended without doing damage at all. This way while capitals still can swat fighters from the sky they also would need to divert absolutely unacceptable levels of firepower to do it when they have other capitals and sub capitals to deal with. Basically bigger cannons get size penalties to shoot at smaller targets. Batteries of smaller cannons need to cover a whole area to deal damage of one (or a few) gun in them to the fighter.Big cannons are good vs armor/hardness/damage reduction, whatever.Small cannons are bad against armor and stuff.If you need to divert 50+ percent of your weapons to kill one fighter during a proper fight, assuming you even can get firing angles from all the weapons needed, you probably can't afford it since you need to hammer other capitals/sub-capitals.
>>96491646Eh, capital level battles shouldn't really be a focus for Starfinder unless you're dealing with mass warfare systems. The problem is that the game should support the "Millenium Falcon+X-wing" player fantasy and it doesn't.Granted, it still supports it better than Edge of the Empire, which fucked it up so bad it was astounding.
>>96491809Just thinking, another thing to do would be to make weapons have a max damage die against smaller ships (So many d4s and d6s are preferred) and a damage reduction per die for larger ships (So rolling d10s and d12s is preferred).Give coilguns something like an Automatic weapon trait for the DC is set to 10+X per damage die + gunnery, and the target makes a piloting check and takes 1d4 for every five below the target DC.
>>96491835Yeah.-Heavy weapon penalty to attack for size, a lot of damage. -Small weapon no penalty, small damage.-Battery or high rate of fire weapon deals damage plus more damage for each 5 points it's beats the AC or the target fails the save. -AoE attacks loaded into big weapons do lower damage only once but can force a save on all the targets in area.Combined with way higher "dodge" of fighters that should work pretty straightforward.
>>96491237I've used mainly reddit or the PF2E discord to find games and I've been fortunate enough to find a lot of success with those.It took me about two weeks to find games using those. I was fortunate enough that one ended up being a long-running game I'm still in and the other is a westmarch with a solid group of players and dms.
>>96490431Optimally you'd be looking/asking here >>96474626
>>96464318>There isn't even a dedicated PF2 threadIs the game that bad? I was thinking of giving it a try.
>>96492037It's better to cover all of Paizo's games because they're still worth talking about and this way, it is possible to talk about them.I think PF2E is very fun, personally.
>>96491983shit u rite
2eHow useful is having an imprecise scent in play? Trying to pick out an ancestry feat for a lvl 13 Nagaji and was curious if Serpent's Tongue would be good.
>>96492700Honestly, depends on how much roleplay the GM allows or enforces around it. In combat it is not particulary useful.
>>96472359New modern woke pf2e audience, ladies and gentlemen. this is why people migrate to dnd5.5
>>96492700>lvl 13 Nagajianother one, gentlemen
>>96492987>herp derp derp
>>96492087>I think PF2E is very fun, personally.I'm sorry to hear that.
>>96492037>Is the game that bad?It's pretty damn bad, but there's not really any correlation between the thread being shared with pf/sf1e and sf2e and pf/sf2e being awful.>I was thinking of giving it a try.It's worth trying at least. Definite improvement over playing something like D&D 5e. Also all the rules are free on archives of nethys, which is officially endorsed by paizo, and the foundry VTT integration is really good.
>>96492037It's good, lots of good online tools. Absolutely the best VTT TTRPG right now thanks to foundry
>>96492784Makes unnoticed enemies undetected or hidden if they're not stealth'ing aroundVery important for encounters
>>96480998A lot of LGS use the same toy distributor and you'd typically find Paizo stuff at comic book stores for years but that comic distributor went out of business recentlyhttps://paizo.com/community/blog/v5748dyo71kxl
>>96491941Any advice on what or what not to look out for?
congradulations, Commander is Warlord and Warlord is Commander. Peace has been achieved. My journey is over. It's perfect.
Do we have a release window for the Tech Stuff and NIGGAship rules? I want a complete science fantasy experience before getting a game off the ground, though the fact the the actual science part of the science fantasy game is delayed to a splat book and makes me thing this shit doesn't work
>>96495388Not really, likely next Gen Con. Maybe earlier if the Necromancer/Runesmith book is that quarter's release.
>>96496171I highly doubt that the tech core stuff is gonna take another year
>>96496314I can believe it is a Spring book since there's not much there at the moment, but I'm not holding my breath. Good to remember how the PF2e Advanced Player Guide was a year after the CRB
>>96492037The other games can't keep a thread alive and they would come here anyway to shit on 2e so might as well make it one thread.
>>96493110why is it bad
>>964920372e fans try to make themselves feel better by saying their game generates more discussion than one from over 15 years ago, but yeah you hit the nail on the head and there's a reason they need the 15 year old game to help generate enough discussion to not slide off of /tg/.
>>96497260i stopped browsing this thread because every time ichecked it was 2e
>>96493426Sorry anon, didn't notice this until today.Good GM's are typically fairly comprehensive in their posts. It goes without saying that the more detail the better. Who they're looking for, what the setting is, background. Whatever. It's usually a waste of time to try your luck on someone who could only muster maybe two paragraphs at best.Unless the pitch was very solid I ignored most posts that didn't have a google form. If they rely solely on comments or direct messages the GM is probably going off of a first come first serve basis and it's a big waste of time. Also if there's a form, there's usually even more detail on how things are going to be in it.That's kind of it for me honestly. Since this isn't 5E there's thankfully a lot less trash to sift through because people tend to (but not always) care more about the game and how it's run.It will take time and you still have to be kind of lucky, but I hope you get into a game that's fun for you eventually.
>>96496516While being a system intended to solve the ivory tower design of PF1e, it only makes it worse. About half of the classes are just worse versions of another class, spellcasting as a whole is COMPLETELY fucked on this front (over 90% of spells are completely useless, often in deceptive ways that would trick a newer player into taking them). Skill feats are intended to separate flavour feats from combat power ones but not only fails at that (due to the existence of things like kip up and titan wrestler) but also the rest of them end up being feat taxes for shit that you should just be able to do, like intimidate someone with a menacing glare.There's such a deep obsession with "balance" (which actually just means that certain classes aren't allowed to have fun, because the restraints and limitations of said balance are entirely built around letting two specific classes have fun and making everyone else suffer) that several classes are completely stripped of identity and personality, having to slowly buy back a tiny fraction of the core features they would have had in earlier editions at the cost of their actual effectiveness. Ironically for a system that has kneecapped itself over a balance obsession, it's incredibly imbalanced, and it's much harder to fix that skewed balance than it is to make a curated list of player options in something like 3.5/pf1e.In summary, it fails at almost every single one of its stated design goals. It was an attempt to make a hybrid of D&D 4e and PF1e but somehow manages to inherit only the flaws of each.It's not so bad that I would refuse to play it if one of my friends wanted to run it for the group, but it's a real mess.
>>96498994>spellcasting as a whole is COMPLETELY fuckedOk, buddy.>over 90% of spells are completely uselessOk, buddy.>it's incredibly imbalancedOk, buddy.>because the restraints and limitations of said balance are entirely built around letting two specific classes have funOk, buddy.>In summary, it fails at almost every single one of its stated design goals.Ok, buddy.>It was an attempt to make a hybrid of D&D 4e and PF1e but somehow manages to inherit only the flaws of each.Ok, buddy.
Spell Trickster should have its feats have requirements for traits (and areas) instead of affecting specific spells.Actually just scrap the whole archetype and give a bunch of these to choose as extra feats for casters.
>>96499247Ok, buddy.
>>96497282You stopped posting pf1e what else did you expect? You even took the 3.x and PACG out of the OP you flagrant fuck, go troll somewhere else and stop bitching for once in your miserable life.
>>96499287The problem with ST is that each feat are designed around specific spells. Something like Barrier Shield and Drenching Mist makes no sense to apply on a general level.Also it being an archetype is an easy approach for it to be "extra feats for casters", over reprinting the same feats again and again on caster class feats.
>>96499909You don't reprint the same feats for each class, you put them in a not-spellshape feats category and tell in the class pages how many and when each class gets them.
>>96499928So this is one of those compounding design issues. It is kind of lame you have to sacrifice an archetype for more metamagic, especially coming from 1e where you just need to spend a feat for such. But making a designated "Spellshape Feat" system for casters would not only mean we have to find a way for non-casters to approach, expand the number of General or Skill Feats for others to reach (and make them as impactful as stuff like Toughness), or not have them be feats and function on a different wavelength -- which starts hitting power budget issues.Really doesn't help Spell Mods are NOT Spellshapes, so you they can be combined with such.Basically, they are sort of fine where they are. The only real thing I would just change is remove or reduce the Dedication lock if we want to say ST shouldn't be a "real" archetype.
if a devil offered me a pact to turn my pf2e wizard into a pf1e wizard i would backstab my party in an instant for it
Playing PF1e for the first time this year, been having a blast with a heavens shaman that's focused on summoning this huge frog deity which is just a Giant frog with a spiritual guardian template slapped on it, supported by some homebrewed support relevant to my PC (channel energy) and now with a mythic level, an Agile Template via mighty summons.However, For my first feat, I just picked whatever seemed like a safe option. I inquired the DM about it, and he's letting me retrain it into whatever else I qualify for at level 7. Pic related.In combat, I mostly summon the Frog and debuff enemies, alongside bringing some buffs and divine-caster-themed solutions from a distance.With that in mind, what feats should I consider instead of combat casting? I keep scrolling through the humongous feat list and honestly I get a bit overwhelmed.
>>96502884Most casters that focus on summoning usually get Augment Summoning to give their summon a +4 enhancement bonus to their Str and Con, helps them hit harder and tank a little better. Combat Casting is usually more useful for casters that want to cast while in the fray of combat, which it sounds like you're not really doing as someone who summons.
>>96503090sure, but that needs spell focus.. I could give up Spirit Talker for it though. Maybe give up on Spiritual Guardian, do you think its worth it?Pic related: The Phrog
>>96491983Are we allowed to ask for books here? If yes, I need Titanbane. lmao
https://www.polygon.com/starfinder-afterlight-crpg-companions/
>>96506007...Kole is just ripped out of a gay fatfur visual novel you download from itch.io. That's not even subtle.
>>96499287>ST feats and spellshapes combined into one category and accessed with witch lesson type tiered feats for casters>Spellshapes have a frequency instead of action cost, can be ignored by paying a focus point per use>Multiple spellshapes per spell restricted by subclass feature and/or feat
>>96506007>https://youtu.be/2-bd786JrZw>starfinder 2E gamewoah baby? Well here's hoping there's enough starfinder fans to get something off the ground
My Starfinder setting is inspired by the Old Republic and it has implied sex in it
>>96508432Boring. You should implement the full FATAL system into it.
>>96508626This you?
>>96464318>hit party with a PL+2 and PL+1 miniboss encounter>rogue instantly writes the fight off as a TPK >we're even running PWL so this shit wasn't half as nasty as it could have beenGranted, it did almost turn pretty bad. Two PCs got brought to 1 HP but not Dying since they had 5 temp HP from a buff earlier in the day, once from the Large Ancestry wizard trying to bum rush a sniper without adequate cover and the other from a very, very gnarly crit to the Investigator. Goes to show the utility of seemingly marginal bonuses, I guess. At least I finally got to put the party on notice a little. Too many of the previous fights have been stomps in the boring way.
Is pf2 being so streamlined compared to pf1 a good a bad thing?
>>96510968Bad because being more streamlined than PF1 is an incredibly low bar and the ability to go "b-b-but PF1!" whenever criticisms with how poorly laid out 2e can be get brought up gets annoying. It's sort of like the deflection "it's better than DnD 5e!" whenever Pathfinder in general gets criticized.
I don't like clerics in pf2.
>>96511052>"b-b-but PF1!"My GM does this all the time unfortunately because he has a hate boner for pf1 casters.
>>96511063In what way? I assume you mean in that you're kind of forced to be a heal bot support role because you can't specialize them any other way like you could in pf1?
Money grubbing paizo is almost as bad as WotC atp
>>96507871>>965060072e plus going for Guardians of the Galaxy vibes is honestly killing it for me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-FPqPIiHegas much as I hate him and every other pf2 "content" creator, a few of his house rules are okay
>>96512049Starfinder ALWAYS had GotG vibes though
>>96512354No, originally it had Alan Dean Foster/Anne McCaffrey vibes, then they hired a bunch of zoomer women freelancers who wrote stuff like Skitter Drive and since that's a free adventure it became people's first exposure to the setting.Zoomer refusal to interact with any literature written before Harry Potter is one of the most annoying things in the world.
>>96512290Funny how he only mentioned nerfs to casters. No Phantasmal Doorknob, nothing about how fucked up Fighter or Champion Dedication are, or how STR is by far the best stat in the game. Tailwind is only an issue because of how accessible it is to martials, casters need it to keep up movement speed wise.
>>96512975>Implying Skittermanders weren't core to the marketing from year 1
>>96512975Not only are those two writers not even included in the big list of inspirations that Paizo themselves out In the back of the 1e book both the MCU GotG and the classic GotG were put as inspirations for the setting
>>96513547Isn't Fighter dedication notoriously awful/pointless?
>>96513547Rules lawyer is notoriously retarded about casters, down to making up some bullshit story about how he ran a campaign for both an all-caster and all-martial party and the casters did better.>>96516112I assume he meant "Fighter Class or Champion Dedication" not "Fighter Dedication or Champion Dedication".
>>96513547>STR is by far the best stat in the gameHow so? Wis always seemed to be the overloaded one to me. For any character not using melee weapons, Str is almost always the first to go, whereas every single character is pumping Con, Wis, (usually) Dex, and one other stat.
>>96516235If you're a caster you don't matter, therefore it boils down to STR vs DEX. Bulwark let's you ignore DEX while getting more AC, STR increases damage and let's you robust (Athletics) enemies.That's about the gist of it.
>>96516262I don't think that really makes Str the best stat in the game. It's the best stat for the best class, sure, but Dex/Con/Wis are universally useful. Take Thief rogue for instance, easily the 2nd best class - Str is useless to you.
>>96516297What makes thief better than ruffian? You don't need dex to damage when you're getting str to damage and ruffian has better feats like the one to add clumsy to your debilitations.
>>96516339I guess the value of that depends on your overall team comp. Best thief rogue I saw was paired with a spear fighter, so clumsy was already covered on that end, which then further increased the value of thief's +2d6 precision damage debilitation.
What's a good ability score distribution for a Maestro bard (level 1), catfolk?I kind of want to pick up Enigma in level 2, but I'm not sure how badly can I afford to dump str / wis /con.The party already has a barbarian, a rogue, an investigator, a cleric and (I think?) a commander.
>>96518097(Playing Pathfinder 2e)
>>96518097Classic spread is 4 cha, 3 dex, 1wis/con. This is assuming you're taking alternate ability boosts instead of dealing with the wisdom flaw but if you really want, you can go +2 con and 0 wis. Maxes your AC in a kilted breastplate (You don't meet the strength requirement but it has the flexible trait so you're not -1 on your acrobatics when it comes to escaping grapples/swallows), doesn't fuck your other defenses.Going with literally anything else is a rough sell on a charisma caster unless you can pick up medium armor proficiency at level 1 which opens up some strength plays for being a grappler.
I know kineticist's aura is clearly visible, but can you see a champion's aura?
>>96518528Only if it's doing something.Like wind.
>>96518528As far as I can tell, no. You can just feel it if you follow the same deity. It'd be really hard to justify any champions of proscribed gods if anyone could gaze upon them and see their aura of malevolence/righteousness.
How difficult is it to learn to DM pathfinder 1e if my only experience is OSE and 5e 2014 in the past?
>>96518713Easy if your players are also new to the system and you're figuring it out together, agonising if any one of them knows a lot and is anything but generously gracious and willing to just make a CRB character and vibe.
is it true that when you one-hand a lance on horseback, you still get 1.5x STR on damage?
>>96519188When the fuck do you use a lance two-handed while mounted?
>>96519220i agree with the logic, i just always thought it was unfortunate consequence of the rules until recently. but maybe i am just dumb.
>>96519188Yes. In Pf1e the lance never ceases to be a 2 handed weapon, you just get to wield it in one hand. You still apply 1.5 STR mod, and you add Power Attack as if it was a two hander.
>>96518097Other than what the other anon said. Really can't suggest dumping con, but you can probably get away with 0 at level 1 as long as you raise it afterward every chance you can
>>96518713General flow is close to 5e minus short rest spam, what you'll need to learn is the conditions and threaten/limitations like when to apply flat footed, when to force defensive casting, etc. How familiar are your players with the game?Have you played the pathfinder video games? They aren't perfect for learning as they wont cover a number of things but its not a bad start
>>96521038>>96518141thanksugh the flavor for Enigma/bardic lore is so nice, but it seems to be kind of trash, especially with some actual INT classes in the party
>>96521249Enigma definitely gotten powercrept, never been an optimal subclass pick even at launch, and lack support, but you actually have some unique powers to not only compensate for the deficit in INT/WIS, but also support the crew's other Recall Knowledge checks. Loremaster's Etude is an underrated spell, Assured Knowledge is a Take 10 for the check, and Hypercognition is a fairly early Occult spell that synergize with Bardic Lore.Thaumaturge with Diverse Lore likely wins out on doing such, and you can pick up Loremaster Archetype for much of the mechanics without needing to split your Bard feats, but I wouldn't discount Enigma Bard too much.
>>96521292Party already has an investigator so why bother?
>>96521298Definitely some overlap but if they aren't using Empiricism, they don't actually Recall Knowledge that often. And even if they do, Loremaster's Etude grants Fortune on THEIR RK checks as much as yours.
Booklet-anon here https://scribe.pf2.tools/v/M89l6VvfDid I miss anything with Alchemist? Should I give Toxicologist a Strike with Rapid Application?>>96368454I tinkered with it a bit (mainly changed the status bonuses and penalties to circumstance) but don't know what else to do. To keep legendary casting in addition to gaining master striking it would have to sacrifice spellslots for wavecasting and even touch the defensive proficiencies, I feel.
>>96471266That sounds pretty cool to me
>>96474548It sounds like you're just excusing professional game designers for being awful at their job and not giving a shit about it being fun or even usable
>>96522348Trust me, the last thing I want to do is give Paizo an excuse to be lazy. I'm bitter enough over Vampire Archetype to continually question when I can see the "We have let go several freelancers" post on the website. It just that, as someone that has experimented with ship and mech battle rules and was comfortably happy with the Skirmish rules in Battlecry, I can reasonably argue that being patient and giving them as much space as possible for the concept to work is asking the professionals to do their best. Again, if you lived through Starfinder1e's launch and remember that starship rules, you understand why waiting is the best call.Of course, if they fuck it up again, I do expect heads to roll like the French Revolution is in vogue.
>>96523198They had all the time in the world to figure out a better kingdom system for the new edition of Kingmaker. Yet random fans still do a better job than them.
>>96523283Ehhh, little incorrect thanks to the nature of Kickstarter campaigns. That one was more hideous mismanagement (so the average Kickstarter campaign...) with Legendary Games (LG not releasing content on time and polished?? say it ain't so!) combined with having only one dude handle all 6 books + the subsystem rules. And that is still the AP team and freelancers compared to Paizo's core devs, who are even worse at writing content than Paizo standard (though they been getting a lot better over the years and the new AP model should help them immensely).You aren't wrong to be skeptical or use that as prior evidence of Paizo's longstanding incompetence. But there are some compounding factors that wouldn't apply (read: can't be used as an excuse this time) for the Tech Core book.
I like how there are two separate Japans in the Tian Xia campaign setting
>>96524172Reminder that there's actually 3 different Japans in Japan*, with Hokkaido and its Ainu and the Ryukyu islands and its people being distinctly different from mainland Yamato.*4, if you count Tokyo vs the rest of the main island
>>96499287This but scrap the entire spellcasting system and make a new one with mechanics like Spell Trickster in mind
>>96513547>STR is by far the best stat in the gameReddit won't admit it's better than DEX and it's infuriating
>>96524172There's also like four different Chinas. China's just too big and too old to fit all the tropes into one not!China country I guess.
>>96524379Hold on, there´s imperialist dynastyc china, religious china and wuxia china, which one is the fourth? Ah, old on. I forgot the communist china neighboring the religious one, my bad.
>>96524223If I only had the time...
>>96524296I would accept the argument if Bulwark didn't exist. There aren't enough things in the game to punish a shitty reflex save once you take damage effects out of the equation. But they'll defend anything to the death, so you can't help but laugh. My favorite poster is a guy who insists Druid is the best class in the game and feels the need to share it nearly all the time.
>page 9grimeven a 4e general would be more alive than this
>>96528187To be fair, 4e threads usually get propped up by the grogs seething about the very fact that the game exists.
If you could change one thing from 2e rules, what would it be?>lust provoking image to distract from the question
>>96528337Proficiency is now +1 instead of +2
So I had to miss my last session of Kingmaker 2e last night. They were doing Valerie's quest and triggered multiple encounters against the hag. So the party ended up tpking along with Valerie and Tristian. It sucks but I'm honestly not surprised. Party recently lost a Swashbuckler and a Thaumaturge and their players came back with a Wizard and a Sniper Gunslinger. With the rest of the group being a Resentment Witch and a Dragon Summoner who rides his eidolon into melee with a crossbow. I'm playing a Monk and also the medicine guy. So we went from a frontline heavy team to a team with just me and the summoner. Go figure when I'm not around, they get overrun since Valerie was stuck fighting the hag solo. Honestly, the biggest lose from my was Tristain since he was my bro. I hope we continue playing since some of my pc's plot was going to come up soon. But at the same time, I could see the rest of the party losing interest in the campaign.
>>96525089I dunno, I feel like people overrate Bulwark due to GMs who are too cowardly to just kick their shin and knock them over, but I'm also a vehement hater of how saving throws work and how mandatory Dex/Con/Wis tend to feel so it's not like I'm not incredibly biased.
Is Fleet on Monk a meme?Should I just retrain it to Toughness?
>>96529528Both are great. If I had to pick I'd pick Toughness. You are a tank, after all. You'll eventually have a high enough movement speed that you can get basically anywhere you want in a fight with one action anyway, unless you're planning on moving half-speed to take advantage of Mobility from a rogue multiclass or something similar. I'd make room for both feats if I could, though.
>>96529528You get both, but since you already are fast as fuck, you can get Toughness first and not feel bad about it.>>96529336If a GM is sticking to the bestiary, they only get to use the abilities the monsters have. Soldiers and human enemies could be tripping, sure. But most monsters are more inclined to grab or swallow you. I think off the top of my head, only wolves have some bonus to it? There just isn't that much in the game that punishes a low Reflex save outside of damage. Hell, even most Athletics actions target Fortitude, so it's a PC issue too.I feel the same way about ability scores. Unless they go for armor, casters MUST choose Dex as their second highest score or they get fucked. The other two are too important to ignore for every class.
>>96530073>If a GM is sticking to the bestiary, they only get to use the abilities the monsters have.Really? I assumed that basic shit like athletics actions were just assumed as part of listing an athletics modifier, that seems pretty fuckin' silly.
>>96530158Yeah.I think it's meant they don't get to use map cheats like Grab or Improved Grab.You can do all kinds of stupid things with the basic actions like having guard dogs attempt demoralize checks by barking with a -5 to the check, since guard dogs aren't scary and don't know common.
>>96530158They can, but the issue is that it doesn't make sense for most monsters. Like, why would an ooze trip you? Is it even smart enough to recognize that as a strategy before it just tries to engulf you? There aren't that many creatures where their go to strategy is to trip foes first. Disarm targets Reflex and has the same issue.
Harm font. Is it a joke outside of an undead party? I know there's shit like channel smite and cast down. I still don't think the value compares to just blasting out a 2 action heal and negating a decent turn from a boss.On an unrelated note, how do people feel about guardian stances. Hampering is good and way better if you play a large race, paragon's guard is obviously good value but I think it's kind of diminished in worth on guardian where you can already get shielding taunt and bake an action you would be taking a lot anyway into raising a shield and the two feats don't work together in any way. I don't like right where you want them because the main reason to shove is if you're already fucking with hampering stance and a reach weapon, forcing enemies to eat a reactive strike if they want to close to 5ft of you.
>>96530700Harm font generally isn't as good but you can do funny things like spam the one action version three times. I would say cast down does elevate it highly. It's a shame Paizo didn't make it so things like Fortunate Relief apply to harm spells on undead or something.As for guardian, hampering is less important at high level in my opinion. Monsters have more ways around difficult terrain or a lot of movement and if you dedicate yourself to shielding taunt, well that has a flourish so you're locked out of Guardian's other extremely good flourish actions. I'd opt for paragon's guard.
>>96530700>Is it a joke outside of an undead party? "Joke" is maybe a bit much. Harm isn't a bad spell, but when Heal is right there the choice is obvious. >Guardian StancesHampering Stance is powerful. Its follow-up feats not so much. Removing your opponent's ability to Step away from you really fucks anyone who wants to use Manipulate actions. Not so Fast! is a powerful option to have, but if you're taking Hampering Stance that means you're 100% taking Reactive Strike, and do you really need to double up here? Meanwhile Lock Down has Flourish, which means it competes with all of Guardian's action compression feats, and I don't know when you'd actually want to use it. Like, Hampering Stance does a pretty good job of making movement difficult. How often are you going to want to use Lock Down to make it even harder, when you could be using Taunting Strike or Shielding Taunt to buy yourself an extra action instead? The stance itself is worth taking, but I'd leave it at that.>Paragon's GuardI think you're spot-on here. Guardian can buy an extra action to Raise a Shield with with any of their level-1 action compression abilities. They can also Raise a Shield as part of a Stride with Shielded Attrition at level 4, which doesn't even have Flourish. Guardians have a lot of ways to make raising a shield free, and so whether you want Paragon's Guard or not really depends on whether you have a Flourish attack you really want to use. If you do, Paragon's Guard saves you from needing to use Taunting Strike or Shielding Taunt every turn, which frees up your Flourish action for whatever else you want it for. Otherwise, I'd skip.>Covering StanceIt's not nothing, especially if you're getting Gang Up or something so you can flank while adjacent to allies. Still, if you're considering Covering Stance, that means you're in melee. And if you're in melee, you could take Hampering Stance instead.>Right Where you Want ThemMeme feat. It's fun, that's it.
>>96521898Made some changes and added the research field changes to make the class more flexible.Might look at the feats next, need to unfuck the Battle Harbinger more as well.
Hi Anons. After playing through the starter adventure, I really want to get into Pf2e proper, the build system looks cool as hell compared to 5e. But unfortunately I'm nogames for the time being due to work. Any campaign/one-shot podcasts you can recommend?
>>96528337Add 1/2 level to proficiency instead of full level.
Is there any ancestry/heritage stuff similar to 5e's Aasimar transformations?So far all I've found is some basic shapeshifting among the yaoguai, kitsune and hungerseed, but that doesn't really hit the same.Don't want to have to start every battle with a 2 round casting of inner radiance torrent just to get the same effect.
>>96472243>>96472952Do they still have ship combat and is it more or less boring now?(Also do they still give all their ships side view art despite the mechanics having facing and thus would be better with top view art?)
>>96533941Pathfinder's Aasimar are the Nephilim versatile heritage, use their feats for angel themeing. I think they gain wings at level 9? Could maybe mix with some ancestry like a strix and flavor it. If you want it to influence your combat, you're probably looking for an archetype.
>>96534049Starfinder 2e's starships are mostly Victory Point challenges for the time being.https://2e.aonsrd.com/rules/1179-cinematic-starship-sceneshttps://2e.aonsrd.com/starship-sceneshttps://2e.aonsrd.com/starship-scenes/1-asteroid-ambushhttps://2e.aonsrd.com/starship-scenes/2-scanning-a-dying-sunhttps://2e.aonsrd.com/starship-scenes/3-songbird-sortie
>Barrow's Edge, https://2e.aonprd.com/Ikons.aspx?ID=2>Transcendence — Drink of my Foes (Healing, Transcendence, Vitality)>Requirements: Your last action was a successful Strike with the barrow’s edge>Effect: Your blade glows as it absorbs your foe’s vitality. You regain Hit Points equal to half the damage dealt.Why in the fuck does this have the fucking Vitality trait?!
>>96534468>Your blade glows as it absorbs your foe’s vitality>your foe’s vitality>foe’s vitality>vitalityTruly a mystery
>>96534468>>96534651It DOES mean you can't use this power to heal if you are Undead/have Void Healing. But it can't hurt you can and it isn't like this is that good a power anyway.
>>96534468>>96534651Why doesn't it have the void trait if you deal damage to an undead creature
>>96534468because they really, really don't want you playing an undead outside of Paizo Designated Undead-Friendly Scenarios.same goes for anything unholy i guess
>>96528337>lust provoking imagesex with elves>questionremove the entire writing team, does that count as just one thing? whoever we get in to replace them needs to not have a retarded adversarial mindset where they need to cockblock every attempt for the players to feel powerful or enjoy themselves
So what's the actual opinion on Starfinder 2e not influenced by politics and e celebs
>>96534692It's a fine enough start, but lacking the full Tech rules does make it difficult to get invested in the same way you would PF2e vanilla. Solarian and Envoy are also kind of lacking in purpose, but not necessarily bad classes in the way Pre-master Oracle or Inventor are. The others are actually pretty strong.
>>96534692My unfiltered dogshit opinion is that SF2e is a Fine(tm) content expansion pack for PF2e, but woefully incomplete as "it's own thing", especially since it basically requires you port PF2e shit forward and retool it to fit to make up for the fact they are explicitly avoiding making basic shit like "fighter/rogue in space". The playerbase overcomplicates the compatibility by insisting on shit like "make them time travelers" or "be strict shitheads about the upgrade stuff" when all you need to do is add or remove a couple traits and maybe keep tabs on access to things like flight. A Fighter in Starfinder is just what a SF1e melee Blitz Soldier used to be. A ton of the basic ranged weapons (like the rotating pistol) from SF2e are perfectly reasonable in PF2e, mechanically and fluff-wise.It needs like, 2~ years worth of content and erratas to unfuck some of the weird parts of it, like Solarian and Envoy being kind of bad, or Operative being strong but bizarrely designed.
>>96530073The game was poorly conceived
In PF1e, are there any ways to gain more swift actions or reactions? I'm playing a stupid class combination with a bunch of houserules, and I need more swift actions, or the ability to mill move actions into swifts or reactions. I'm talking about something like Combat Tenacity ( https://metzo.miraheze.org/wiki/Combat_Tenacity ).Psionics are fine, but I believe I've looked through all of the psionic feats and didn't see an applicable one. Akasha is fine too. Maybe there are spells, powers, maneuvers, items or weapon enchantments, I'm open to anything at this point.
>>96528337Change the action system from 3 actions + 1 reaction to 4 actions that can be freely converted to reactions, anyone can store any number of actions for the rest of the round to use as reactionsAs a knock on effect all martials should start with a unique reaction as a class feature at level 1, whether that's an existing thing (stand still, opportune backstab, riposte) or a new one
>>96536256Ok dungeon coach
>>96536367what does that mean
>>96536412NTA, Dungeon Coach is the author of DC20, which has exacly what that anon said: 4 actions that can be held to do reactions.
>>96536436oh thati remember reading the playtest for that a while ago it seemed like a bunch of "good ideas" on paper that really didn't mesh well together at all and ended up being a schizophrenic mess that just didn't functionthink it was mostly based on 5e though so thats to be expected
>>96536011Swift actions not really excluding some quite endgame stuff like Time Stop and possibly some weird interactions between badly written abilities. Reactions do not exist in 1e, but if you mean Immediate Actions then also the same as Swifts. If you mean attacks of opportunity then go whammy with high dex and Combat Reflexes.
>PF1>Strix>with high Str>wielding a bunch of cheap and expendable lassos and nets>fight by grabbing someone and then just flying up as high as I can>even if they free themselves, they just fall>once I'm high enough I can drop as a free action>they cant even reach me to fight back while I fly up if I hang the lasso down with enough slack while I fly upIs there any reason why this wouldn't work?
>>96537939Featherfall.
>>96538025... shit.
Would you pay $135 a week to play pf2e
>>96538052Making people waste their spell slots on not going splat is still useful.
>>96539082No.I don't think I'd even run a game for 4 times that, since most people in this hobby now seem to be theatre kids that never worked out how to be photogenic, and are totally insufferable.
>>96539082I honestly don't know if I'd play 2e if I was the one getting paid $135 a week
>>96539100>>96539103I say this because:I looked for a session on shitcord since I don't have any friends that play Pathfinder. Expressed some interest in one. Got an interview by the guy, seemed great, then he said something about pricing. Sure, no worries, if he wants $20 for his effort and time managing retards and cooking up stuff for us I'm happy to pay. We get in and it's only me and another guy, the others didn't come (presumably scared off because of needing payment to play), fine, the guy gets to the pricing and...it's $90 USD, he asks you okay with this? I say uh...no because that's $135 in my local currency per week...that's unaffordable to me, sorry. The other guy just straight up said I thought this was going to be free and bailed. I sat down with him and said this shit needs to be $30 USD at MOST and you need to have everyone on board, say it upfront, and have everyone introduce each other and like each other before committing to a paid game.I haven't even played PF2E goddamn, I'm just going back to Dawnsbury Days, I guess.
>>96539082Brother I play this shit because I'm broke as fuck, have too much free time, and made friends with people who are into it, only reason I'm paying someone anything is to buy a book or foundry module for someone who wanted to run
>>96539082>$540 a monthWhat the fuck?I'll be honest with you man, I don't understand people who charge or pay for tabletop. This shit is a fun thing to do with my friends/acquaintances. It's not a job. Fuck making it a job.
>>96539149It would actually be $2160 because 4 players
>>96534780Yeah, one of the dumbest things about SF2e is that Soldier is so damn laser focused on area attacks and Operative is so damn focused on being a sniper.
>>96534739I was surprised reading the Solarian entry and realizing that without Feats its pretty much a just a fighter that gets a free longsword, laser pistol, and weird opportunity attack. Bizarre coming from 1e where as weak as it was, it at least started with special burst effects at level 1 without using class feats.
>>96539155The GM would be getting $1440 a month which is... fine if he's got two or more groups going. But I'd never be spending $400-$500 myself a month on fucking tabletop. Especially not just for access to a campaign. That's absurd.
>>96539112I feel I've seen discord 5e games at like 5 bucks, 90 is insane.Did it include printing your mini and painting it for you or some other extra or was it just 90 bucks a week to listen to him talk?
>>96539224Yeah, it was mini and paint too but I said that should be a one off payment, and optional. He had a whole list of $5 payments that added up to $90, I could've screenshotted it and put it here as lulz but that would've been assholeish because he was legitimately nice and well-meaning but that was just way too much for me to justifiably spend.
So a GM I just finished another game with is thinking about running Starfinder 2e. I know fuck-all about Pathfinder and other 3.x variants, since I'm mostly osr, with a touch of weird indie stuff.He said we're using the galaxy guide and the playtest versions of two classes that aren't out yet, but nothing from standard Pathfinder. Where can I get a basic rundown of how the system actually works that's not buried in 466 pages of cruft?What are the big trap options to avoid? >inb4 Hurr durr playing Starfinder is a trap option
>>96539295Sounds like your playing Starfinder 2e which is more akin to Dnd 4e then 3.5
>>96540246Starfinder 2e yeah. All I know 4e from are /tg/ memes, desu. Please help?
>>96540273You're a couple months too early for the rpgbot breakdown so aside from reading the player core yourself the best reviews you can get are probably the guys ITT who left very detailed info throughout the last year but I would say that would require some archive digging for specifics.
>>96540273I haven't played Starfinder 2e yet but since it runs on the same framework, most people seem to think that martial classes are the superior option while Spellcasters are gimped. Personally I don't have a problem with the way spellcasters are played but just something to keep in mind
>>96539149A lot of GMs are just stupid amd greedy. And I've noticed that a very high percentage of the ones who think they deserve to get paid are basically just meat chatbots who are completely incapable of managing anything beyond 100% by the script playthroughs of published modules.
>>96540350Gimped how?
>>96540369NTA but Wizards aren't gods that can solve every situation with a hyperspecific spell anymore or annihilate an entire battlefield with a single spell anymore and actually require coordination with the rest of the team which has made spellcasters very upset
>>96540393NTA either but combine the three action economy with few free/1 action spells with saves that scale worse than what a few other classes can do, wizards can feel like they are doing far less than say a fighter can in specific matchups.
>>96540369As >>96540445 said, the system runs on a 3 action economy, the way martials are set up they have plenty of abilities and ways to go around combat while spellcasters have less options as most spells cost 2 actions and have nerfed damage and scaling as the remaster.
>>96540465And it was worse premaster.
>>96540445Pretty much.Wizards/casters et al are there to solve magic problems like walking on lava, removing curses, taking to the dead.In matters of meat points the martials take precedence.
>>96540393casters suck ass in 2e stop coping
>>96540545>NOOOO YOUR SUPPOSE TO LET ME BE A GOD!!! I DON'T WANT TO USE TEAMWORK I WANT TO BE THE MAIN CHARACTER WITH OP ABILITIES!!!
>>96540585choke on paizos chode somewhere else fag, casters are useless and fighters dont need teamwork in 2e to be successful
>>96540482trick magic item handles all three>>96540585>teamworkok lets go over your options>aidwill generally require you to be in reach of either the ally you're aiding or the enemy you're aiding against. martials are better>flankingexclusive to martials>status bonusesdon't rely on spell dc/bonus so a martial with casting archetype is going to be either just as effective at this, or just slightly worse (meaningless difference) while still actually being useful characters>healingthis is the one point that casters win at and is less useful when you have 4 contributing party members speeding up fights and therefore minimising damage taken
What am I supposed to do with melee only monsters against ranged targets? I want to rush them, but theres a fucking champion in the way blocking the entire hallway.
>>96540642Nothing, the players have a good party and strategy. Play the monsters how they would naturally act and get slaughtered.Unless the monsters are intelligent, then have them disengage.
>>96540642You are the master of your own destiny, you can just make a wider hallway or use different enemies in it.
>>96540656Unfortunately this is an AP so I am stuck with the small rooms and corridors.
>>96540618healing also doesnt matter because you can heal up between fights trivially
>>96540618i forgot one other thing>status penaltiesin small amounts martials are drastically better (critspec, runes, demoralize) and in large amounts the enemy will either be too weak to be worth spending spell slots debuffing, or will succeed a save at worse putting them on par with a martial landing a crit
I'm looking at the Eldritch Knight, what's a good class combination that keeps it as simple as it can be?I'm looking to use a reach weapon, or even going full weeb and using a scythe.
>>96541133Forgot to mention that I'm playing 1e.
Question about 2eIm interested in potentially running the game, but I feel like the game is very tied to Golarion as its setting. Is it difficult to homebrew into other settings? How much upfront work should I expect to do?
>>96541235>Is it difficult to homebrew into other settings? How much upfront work should I expect to do?You'll need to provide all the relevant info for any deities players should have access to, as well as curate a list of available player options. Sticking to Common stuff only will do most of the work for you on the latter front, but for deities there is a bit of work to do. You'll need to establish:>Divine Font (Harm and/or Heal)>Sanctification (Can/Must be Holy/Unholy)>Favoured Skill>Favoured Weapon>Domains (Choose 4, if there are any more you want to add they should be listed as Alternate domains)>Additional Cleric SpellsSpells are the part with the most caveats. There should be three in total - one 1st rank, one 2nd or 3rd rank, and one of 4th rank or higher - and these spells should all be spells normally unavailable to the Divine spell list. If Magic is one of the deity's domains, there should instead be nine different spells, one for each spell rank.
>>96541133If you want to play a melee spellguy just play a magusif you want to play Eldritch knight PrC specifically its pure fighter and pure wizard into EK. You already lose spellcasting progression, so tacking any other arcane class is just really painful and sets you further behind1 level figher, 5 levels wizard straight into EKScythe is pretty bad, you want to get max crit range to proc spell critical on EK more often and Scythe has a terrible crit range in exchange for its huge multiplier. You should be using a Scimitar
>>96541370>You should be using a ScimitarFauchard has the same crit range + reach if that's a priority, at the cost of being an exotic proficiency. Thought I'd bring that up since he mentioned using a reach weapon
>>96541133If you mean the prestige class, my best recommendation is the drop it in favor of the Magus, EK was a port from 3.5 and almost everything that it does Magus does better aside from like, one or two minor things that aren't worth the rest of the hoops you have to jump through to get it working.That said, if you're still dead set, the classic combination of Fighter with one of the 9th level Int-based casters is probably your best bet, or another option instead of Fighter is Bloodrager since it still gives you what you want martially while also giving you some abilities that might fit the route you're going.
>>96541370>>96541436>>96541439Thanks for the input, we already have a Magus and the party is on the larger side. I'll look into Bloodrager as I've seen that come up more than a couple times in different discussions online.I was initially considering a reach Cleric, but I don't want to cause the DM a headache with managing summons since we also have a druid.
>>96540465I will bring up a pretty important note: the freedom of action economy is a bit of an illusion. Many martial classes either have a pretty major action tax to upkeep their abilities (Hunt Prey, Exploit Vulnerability, Devise A Strategem if you are playing Investigator wrong, Taunt), and even the more free-flowing classes like Monk, Swashbuckler, or Champion tend to expect you to learn how to build a rotation.Most 2 action spells are built around the expectation of doing that rotation/upkeep/expected power all at once. Even single-target spells like Hydraulic Push tend to be built around the expectation of a martial landing two strikes and a maneuver all at once. Spending all your points up front DOES kinda suck, but it isn't like you would have many things to do anyway.>>96540642Tumble Through is an option. But it is something you just gotta get used to playing Abomination Vaults.>>96541235It takes some effort to build around; such as with Deities, class lore like Exemplar, several archetypes built around Golarion organizations like the Hellknights, and some spells. But that's not much more than running a 5e game out of Forgotten Realms. It's not difficult, just do your due diligence as a GM.
>>96541704Yeah but you can just ban stupid lost omens stuff and roll out with player core options and whatever else is setting agnostic like rage of elements.More GMs should just range ban the goofy shit.Like guns and gears isn't appropriate for most fantasy games.
>>96541682man youre all over the placeWhat does the party have right now?what about a warpriest or paladin?
>>96541745I say simply renaming or just handwaving some stuff is fine. I don't like banning the LO stuff as they already get very little play from my experience. Stuff like Pathfinder Agent, Riventhun Invoker, or Wylderheart are pretty underrated for what they are.>Like guns and gears isn't appropriate for most fantasy games.If you are homebrewing a setting, you can make it appropriate. Honestly I would argue most fantasy settings nowadays are built around Age of Enlightenment/Renaissance aesthetics and tech levels, where gunpowder was known, just not easily distributed.
>>96541746It's an 7 person party, and I'm the 7th.It's a Druid, Paladin, Brawler, Magus, Prodigy, and a Swashbuckler.For the most part a lot of things are covered.
>>96541982>7 player partywhat the fuck is going on over there
How underpowered would I be if I wanted to play a cleric in Starfinder
>>96541704>class lore like ExemplarI will forever seethe that exemplar seemingly just doesn't have a sidebar going "hey this is trivial to refluff to not have demigod fluff, make it like, a mystical weaponmaster or some shit", so now every time I mention the class to a group I have to reiterate that I'm not trying to godmode the game because it's not even that meaningfully powerful compared to barbarian, champion, or fighter
>>96542280Hobgoblin genocide
>>96541982new suggestiondont play a 7 person campaign unless you want to blow your brains out every time combat starts
>>96540585Most mature 2e fan response to criticism.
>>96464318>~~~Pirated Material~~~everything under this in the pastebin is several years out of date for 1e. where the hell do I find the old APs to download?
>>96543632There's a thread on /tg/ for sharing PDFs, you might have better luck there. That pastebin is ancient and nobody's bothered to make a new one, pretty much nothing in it is up to date.
Have you ever actually seen someone have their tiefling reflect their demonic heritage?
>>96543651cheers, just finished up my third playthrough of WotR (after two Kingmaker runs) and left fiending for more so I'm now resorting to reading the APs and comics.
>>96540273What does this picture mean?
>>965446411e: Kind of ugly, but the true classic2e: Clean, traditional, typical, but maybe not so memorable (can you actually name that actor)?3.x: OP Anime4e: Not a real example of the thing being compared.
I was meaning to finish this one last week, but I got lost in the sauce and second guessed myself into fiddling with it for another week. Still, I'm about as satisfied as I can be with it.As always, if you want to see the others you can find them here: https://x.com/DrumerThead/status/1967452716659364009
>>96540369Casters if not run as support are very difficult to play in the early to mid game and can be a downright miserable experiences if not run in a specific campaign structure. They eventually start popping off at level 7-9 but that's a long time feeling like your a detriment to the party. There are multiple reasons and fixes for this and i cant be bothered to list them.Martials on the other hand feel like the MCs of the campaign from level 1.
>>96544707>can you actually name that actor?Are you ragebaiting or do you not know that's Christopher Lee?
>>96546455I don't expect much from people with 4e derangement syndrome
>>96545931Even as a support player casters feel miserable. I would much rather play a Commander or Investigator than any caster, and players who aren't fond of playing support but get "forced" into it by necessity would probably land on a share rage barbarian or boon ranger, so they actually have a game plan outside of their supporting. The only people I have seen actually enjoy playing a caster were literal healsluts.
>>96546924yeah its insane pretending like even for 2/3 casters there wasnt a massive gutting going into 2e
>>96546892>JAll of the "derangement" is actually from the people who think 4E was good and get mad at all criticism
>>96547321Say the line 3.5jak
>>96547394>WotC made it's biggest competitor in the D20 space by alienating the 3.X communityI don't even know what "line" you mean, buddy.
>>96546924I agree somewhat. If you just want to be a heal or number slut then you will have a great time 1-20 playing a Bard or Cleric. The game does get better as a whole for all casters after level 7.
>>96547498The problem with support is its just way too effective to be interesting. You just pick the options that optimise numbers. Bard is the perfect example of this. Why use any other composition spell when Courageous Anthem and Dirge of Doom just math hardest and you can just spam them endlessly at a ludicrous range. I honestly wish player and enemy movement was a far more common thing spells and abilities could do at lower levels or using your allies as your vector of attack like using your action economy to attack via the fighter.
>>96547703>or using your allies as your vector of attack like using your action economy to attack via the fighter.sorry that's the exclusive right of Commander, who uses intelligence and clever tactics, not some stinky thing like magic
>>96545281Nice job on Biboo! Really like what you did with her. Was surprised there was no reference to Shiroi like with Fuwamoco.
>>96549974Near as I can tell by the nature of the lore that's been established, Biboo seems to be the oldest one out of all of Advent, and not by a small amount either. As such, I had probably the least amount of material to work with to justify the "Shiori is secretly acting as a subversive manipulating agent" angle I'm doing for most of them, instead being left with just the classic "she's been picked up along the way because she was useful and didn't necessarily need to be tricked" sort of thing. Kind of like Luffy and Zoro in One Piece, Biboo just follows Shiori's lead because she's been convinced Shiori is the right person to BE the leader of the group.
>>96550008That makes a lot of sense. Thanks for sharing Anon.
2eWhats the stat of combination weapon these days? Its been a while since i heard that guns and gears was getting a remaster so what changed in general? Did they fix gunslinger?
>>96553234Combo weapons are "fine, I guess..."-tier. They still are unwieldy to maintain but their damage is more comparable to normal weapons, least for the two-handed ones. The one-handed ones are still pretty meh. Gunslinger got some interesting buffs. Singular Expertise now became Slinger's Precision, granting them a slightly scaling precision damage die on all non-repeating guns, and a flat +2/+3 for crossbows.. And now they treat both ends of a combination weapon as a firearm for the purposes of proficiency. This makes Triggerbrand and Drifter much easier to pilot (at the expense of aesthetics...). It doesn't necessarily make them more powerful than they already are (good feats and features, but still stuck on a mid-tier weapon class, so standard Gunslinger affair), but it makes them far more open, customizable, and just less a headache to play wiht.
>>96553253oh shit, really? so stuff like gunsword isnt mega gimped cause of how MAD they were dice wise? i assume you prolly need a little strength for damage but otherwise that seens awesome,
>>96553284The way it is worded, I don't think you get the bonus damage on the melee portion of the weapon, but I kind of expect that to get errata'd one more time because of the obvious omission (and that Drifter don't need to take a melee weapon). It's such a slight bump I don't think anyone would get at your throat if you just tack on a +1/+2 to the melee side.
>>96553317*Melee combination weaponwas late as hell making that post.
>>96539295Biggest issue with 2e is that "Soldier" isn't fighter and "Operative" isn't rogue. Instead they hyper specialized Soldier into ranged AoE and Operative is pretty much locked into Sniper with the class feature to play like a 1e Operative notably weak.As far as trap options go, Solarian could technically be considered one but is so obvious about it that it amounts to a pile of carrots under a box in a Bugs Bunny cartoon.If you want to be powerful and effective, best options are Operative for combat or Mystic for spellcasting.
>>96554794So if I make an Astrazoan Sniper Operative, I'm probably alright?
>>96553317>>96554284I'll have a look at the rules myself but that sounds reasonable. It'd keep the gunsword somewhat in line with a trigger brand if you get similar damage cause of the dice size versus the stat damage i guess. It'd be an easy homebrew to fix too, shouldnt be that insane. Hopefully i can get my old group back together since i think the DM is done with his masters.
>>96555971Honestly, I'm not quite sure what that anon is talking about, least for Operative (there is a decent melee Soldier option, it is pretty cool). Sniper Operative is actually one of the more rougher picks, between the bad sniper rifles printed and only getting a free reload at level 9. You probably want to choose Ghost for the stealth sniper one, even if it focused on Deception, and just work around the Unwieldy/Volley traits. It's better to have an option than just play neutral on just okay items.
we TPK'd in triumph of the tuskseason of ghosts some time soon
Is Starfinder 2e out or is it still in playtest? Ive got a group that wants to do outlaw star/Cobra shit and it came up during game ideas.
>>96558034It's out, archive of nethys has a SF2e site up and running even. It's just uh, really fuckin' barebones (only PC and GM Core, Tech guide is a ways off) and basically requires combining with (and adjusting) PF2e content to fill it out, since they're cross compatible.
>>96558056Oh, sick. So we could basically just play PF2e and retrofit it with some starfinder shit. Cool.
>>96558076the GM core has some guidelines on how to combine stuff, though it also felt weirdly obsessed with with having mixed content exist due being displaced via time travel or shit instead of just... Adjusting them to be integrated properly as relevant? There isn't an actual basic bitch "Space Fight Man" or "Space Rogue" in SF2e because they "didn't want to just Print another version of Fighter/Rogue when PF2e already has them", and any changes you'd need to do would be things like adding free light armor to some casters and making flight more accessible.Just use your brain and shit mixes fine, you might need to add or remove traits to some gear (analog and an upgrade slot to a lot of weapons/armor, for example) so they work with the SF2e upgrade methods, but that shit ain't hard.
>>96558152Yeah i was a bit confused when i looked at operative and soldier and both classes make pretty explicit mention that you're gonna be using guns. Which is kinda weird considering there ARE melee weapons in the game. I assume they want the PF2E boys using a fuckin lightsaber or somethin.
>>96558175They also explicitly went out of their way to have one class per ability mod in playtest, but they kind of fucked that up and make it all fall apart when they changed Witchwarper to allow it to be able to pick between Int or Cha for its KAS, though. So now I just stare and wonder why the fuck the dogass Solarian can't pick Dex, or why Striker Operative can no longer pick Strength when it could in playtest. Soldier being Con based is interesting mechanically, but I also still find it fucking stupid, and a bit ridiculous how much Con-to-whatever they build into it.
>>96558227Solarian not having DEX is pretty bullshit, but STR Striker Operative is kind of pointless. You still expected to use a gun and the only one-handed area fire pistol so you can add your KAS is the Starfall Pistol. You don't even have a free-hand so it isn't like you can grapple people or whatever. I highly doubt it would have any real purpose, beyond just the novelty.I mean, the Key Ability Score system is the worst part of 2e so I would normally like more stat stuff. But if CON Soldiers is too stupid for you, I doubt STR Operative would have been much.
>>96558367Most of what I find stupid about soldier is Paizo's bizarre relationship with stat swaps more than anything. They're obnoxiously timid and conservative about it, and it makes the times they DO have a class with them just bother me.Striker having the option for Str wouldn't have been particularly relevant, but it does just add another small contribution to SF2e feeling like it NEEDS PF2e content to fill in gaps. Which isn't even a big deal, but it does mean online conversations about both just feel like a headache.
>>96556334Hm. Looking at it, I'm probably buying the same weapons and taking a lot of the same stuff either way. I'd basically be dropping the unwieldy and volley immunity, Experienced Smuggler, and Keep Them in Your Sights to get Face In The Crowd at level 1 instead of 2, free up a skill feat (which I could use to take smuggler again if I want it), Aim as a free action, and Ghost Tap. That does sound good, thanks!
>>96558497What I find stupid about Soldier is that its entirely specialized around area attacks rather than being a sci-fi Fighter like 1e Soldier. Meanwhile the Solarian which you'd expect to have niche special abilities just has "Free longsword and laser pistol" and relies entirely on Class Feats no stronger than any other classes' for its "powers".
>>96556334I was talking more about sniper/sharpshooter playstyle (Sit in one spot aiming and firing with a rifle) than Sniper class feature. Most Operatives are probably going to be using longarms rather than sniper rifles overall. The closest to the default 1e playstyle of "take a full action to move and attack using small arms" is the Skirmisher with Mobile Aim as their starting feat.
>>96559291Both of those things factor in to me finding Soldier kinda stupid? I think a martial AoE specialist, pseudo-defender(?) class is interesting, but not ideal for a CRB baseline. The decision to make SF2e 99% compatible with PF2e led to the decision to make Soldier no longer be Space Fighter, which they have openly stated was to avoid printing player options that are too redundant with existing ones... But that just means that for normal people coming in, or autists who hate their peas and potatoes mixing, SF2e just flat out has unfillable gaps in its core class roster. Maybe they'll fill them, but waiting another few years for it is lame.Solarian is just so fucking sad bro. Just looking at it, in both editions of Starfinder, makes me sad. Cool ass flavor attached to a nothing class. They couldn't have had the guy who worked on Exemplar take a look at this shit or something, spice it up a little? They replaced a whole fuckin' subclass with "worse reactive strike"? For real?
>>96559617>>96559291Whats the issue with the class exactly? Is it basically the fuckin 2e Magus problem again or some shit.
>>96559696Soldier is pretty much fine power wise, afaik. Most of the griping is pretty much aimed at how it is no longer the general purpose "build your martial" when SF2e just kinda doesn't have that on its own.The Solarian problem is that it just kind of doesn't really. Do. Anything? It just doesn't do anything that special. It isn't worthless or even obnoxious to play, it's just incredibly mundane for what it sells. The most "special thing" it has baseline is "can return to the 1h d8 reach flail meta" and "has a kind of shitty backup pistol that takes no hands to fire". It has maybe one passably good feat most levels, has to pay to have any of its big exciting aoes (and will only reasonably have one of them), and gets legendary in its weapon... At level 19. It otherwise has normal martial proficiency.Meanwhile, Operative has features that straight up don't work, and is still stronger somehow.
>https://youtu.be/fn49lmHxmqg>https://www.backerkit.com/c/projects/paizo-inc/pathfinder-quest>www.myminifactory.com/frontier/pathfinder-quest-4534Pathfinder Quest FULLY FUNDED in less than 24h. Though the board game interests me less (its just simplified PF2e on rails campaign in a box game like VTM Chapters or Gloomhaven or the D&D adventure box sets for 4e), the straight to STL minis on the other hand seem nice. How are you guys feeling on 60 USD for a book and some figgies you have to print? I have sincere doubts Paizo will be able to spin this into an ongoing line however considering the cost and weight I dunno how you could even approach most adventures that aren't single modules.
>>96559617> I think a martial AoE specialist, pseudo-defender(?) class is interesting, but not ideal for a CRB baselineThinking on this argument more and more, I think it is actually somewhat reductive. Or at least not recognizing what the other martial classes have opened up for those wanting more customization, or SF's meta entirely.The idea of the "Space Fighter" would probably be either a Heavy Weapons Guy or a Han Solo-esque smuggler for most people. The traditional melee battler wouldn't be a baseline option in a world of guns and explosions and the literal vacuum of space separating you and the guy you wanna slash. It would be more niche, even in a more fantastical setting. Even if you want a more "generic shooter mcshootface" dude like Roland from Borderlands or the non-Master Chief Spartans from Halo, Operative covers a lot of those bases thanks to how targeted firearms function and their proficiency scaling. Attacks just also function different in 2e compared to 1e anyway, so something has to give, even just with making the basic shooter idea.Now putting all the melee slashing on Solarian's back at the expense of cool shit is...a decision. But I've said before, it just needed more page space if you want to go crazy. If any class should have been swapped out with something like Technomancer or even Vanguard for more room to breathe, it probably should have been them.
>>96561964Somebody at Paizo is in love with the Solarian fluffwise but has no clue how to do them mechanically. The 2e version is so boring and missing things mechanically they'd have been better served adding Vanguard as a melee core class. Instead of giving them solar weapons give them a built in energy shield and an entropic strike that adds a special Critical Specialization to whatever melee weapon they use.
>>96561964Sure, logically a melee guy wouldn't be ideal in a ranged meta, but this is fuckin' starfinder. People are looking at Guardians of the Galaxy for inspiration, and John Sword is still going to be strong as hell and only need minor adjusting. It doesn't really matter to me that the SF2e Core doesn't do it, because I just port PF2e classes, my thesis in a roundabout way is mostly that it's just really goddamn awkward for new people (and dickheads who refuse to just COMBINE AND INTEGRATE SYSTEMS, who I thankfully don't have to play with).Hell, Operative is a nonstandard weirdo. It feels like they justified overloading it by just making it just lack basic QoL in bizarre ways>caps at expert in non-firearm weapons if you aren't a striker>can't even get full proficiency in advanced firearms natively until level 19>has a level 3 save feature that basically doesn't work, and gets fully replaced with no compensation later
