Small LGS goer.
Happy to report that two (2) people showed up for Spiderman Prerelease.

>>96578923
>TQ
draft
im thinking of getting back into modern but i honestly dont know what i want to play was thinking either burn or d&t but i think theyre both kinda shit at the moment

Did 2 prereleases today. Pulled no soul stones (it's over)

It's a shockingly vanilla, OK limited experience. Gameplay wise it felt like a core set. It plays fine, but not exciting at all.

Extremely confusing since everyone had 3 spidermens on their board at any time. "I kill your spiderman" or "I pulled the mythic spiderman" ok what? OK???

First pre release had 11 people. Second had 13. Aetherdrift at this store had 30+.

>>96578923
since when is ponder red

>>96578923
Who fucking plays this game anymore? First prerelease in almost a decade and it was so fucking gay. Why is every card a novel? Why does every creature have to do 5 different things? This just solidified why I completely gave up on magic. This was your last chance with me wotc and you fucking blew it.

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>TQ
Legacy and Premodern
>Current decks
Legacy: WR(G) initiative, Moon stompy, The Spy, BW(RG) DnT, 4c Yorion Zenith
>In progress
Legacy: Bomberman, Belcher, TES, Infect
Premodern: Monoblue Skies, Miracle Grow
Kitchen table: Pic related

Is it weird that my lgs had boxes already? I thought it didnt release till next week

>>96578923
>TQ
I'm trying as hard as possible to quit commander
Been playing it almost exclusively since 2013.
I'm playing a necrotic ooze modern deck atm, I'd play a premodern oath deck but I can't seem to get games in.
Standard looks fucked. I hate what mh3 did to modern/legacy. I guess I could try pioneer. I always liked delver, I could do pauper i suppose.
Damn I shoulda played more modern before mh.

I will never play sealed again. Fuck this format, draft or nothing.

>>96578990
Where do you play premodern?

>>96579039
Prerelease is the street date now

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It would have been super kino if Mr. Negative had a white border in paper while every other card had a normal black border

>>96579152
When/why did that change?

>>96579169
>When
A few sets ago
>Why
Greed, prerelease is also the day cards become legal in constructed formats

>>96579165
WotC doesn't do cool things.

>>96579078
>I hate what mh3 did to modern/legacy.
I want to see if I can get my legacy playgroup to assemble golden era legacy decks but I'm not sure what the cutoff should be. There's some argument for making it later, but Theros block - i.e pre-M15 frame - seems the easiest.

>>96579114
LGS with mostly the same crowd as legacy, where else?

>>96579165
>7 mana
How are you supposed to play this card?

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>>96578923
>TQ
Pioneer, baby!

>>96578923
>TQ
modern: eldrazi combo, intruder alarm combo, high noon/teferi control

also our local club does drafts every week

>>96579343
By either using wubrg, or the very least 4-color, to web-sling him onto the field; or try to make plenty of treasure tokens to get him out since villain= wants money (treasure)

>>96579165
Tall ask
Also, it would mark the card

When do we actually find out the next 12 months of sets after Avatar? Is it next weekend?
If we are legit in for a year of TMNT and Marvel slop I'm fucking done.
They could have chosen far better IPs that marvel or nickelodeon for a fantasy card game

>>96579497
"first look at 2025" was publishing late oct 2024 so maybe late oct again

>>96579497
Magic Con Atlanta is next weekend, it looks like they have a reveal panel scheduled there

>>96579497
Such as?

>>96579412
You can play with old sets like 4th edition with white borders and they aren't marked cards.

>>96579412
Not necessarily if it's only the front that's white

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are the sisters excited?

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>>96579497
idk the spiderman set is just pretty lazy to begin with instead of henchman/thugs/goons or mabye a bunch obscure villians we got like 15 different versions of spiderman, construction workers, smear and pidgeons.

and of course half of the cards are legendary to please the commander fags.

What's that site that lets you pick any mtg card art and get a playmat of it? I thought it was ultra pro but I don't see it there.

>>96579686
https://bad-dragon.com/

>>96579704
upvoted

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>>96578923
Let's be fair.
That's an awesome looking card.

>>96579704
I got the Amon playmat from there.

>>96579716
I mean, it is a comic panel; so there's bound to be good art in some places

>>96579526
Literally anything remotely fantasy. Super hero slop has gotta be the actual worst possible thing. Its worse than spongebob or fortnite

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Honestly you want to see a a UB set any real money?
Just wait until they delve into the gacha game space and see what real whales can actually spend.
If they make a Genshin/HSR/FGO set it will likely outsell FF based purely on whales.

Anime sets will happen at some point and the gacha space spenders spend a ton of money

>>96579782
HoloLIVE UB is the only ting I could imagine making money at this point.

>>96579788
I would actually laugh so hard if they did do Hololive. It would make some people so mad but at the same time all the collector product would get swallowed.
I cant see it happening though with them just releasing their own card game

>>96579809
Anything like this is a case of Hasbro needing the IP more than the IP needs Hasbro, which is yet another reason UB garbage is so ridiculous.

Imagine any other game doing a collab with mtg
lol
lmao

>>96579850
>Imagine any other game doing a collab with mtg
>lol
>lmao
Fortnite Battle Pass (tm)
I just shit out my ass\

>>96579850
They're going to add Jace Ajani Lilliana and Vraska skins to fortnite during the crossover

So what happened to grand prixs

>>96579870
Killed in the name of reducing company costs.

>only 1 soul stone in spiderman
So are we getting 5 more Marvel slop sets then? There cannot be a worse timeline than this

>>96579870
Murdered to go all in on commander and secret lairs. Wotc doesn't give a toss about 60 card formats anymore since commander players and UB make them so much money.
Commander players will buy just about any slop shat out by Wotc

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>>96578923
out of 2 player boosters. got this one.

>>96579878
That’s a shame I don’t really hate commander but I do hate the players.

>>96579911
Nice pants fag

>>96579911
guy at my lgs got the foil thanos one almost makes me wish i actually went to prerelease

>>96579870
they had to be axed otherwise the investors would starve

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>>96579782
just wait a few years sis

>>96579950
>I don’t really hate commander but I do hate the players.
i feel this i think the format can be fun but holy shit the people who play it are so annoying

>>96579967
How did they make investors starve

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>>96579976
They didn't give Tarkir a 50% markup because they thought nobody would be interested in gay dragon sex.

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It's over

>>96580094
B-
BUT UB THOUGH
UB IS A MONEY MAKER THOUGH
UB... UB NEVER FAILS THOUGH!!!
WE SWITCHED TO UB BECAUSE REGULAR SETS FAIL AND UB NEVER FAILS!!!!!!
LINE... THE LINE GO UP THOUGH!!!

>>96580094
This was the sentiment I got from the game stores in my country as well. Like sure, the set will sell to people who don't play magic, but at some point they have fucked their enfranchised players out of the hobby and it's just gonna be collectors and commanderfags who won't attend events

>>96580108
>who won't attend events
Surely this won't be a problem.
Surely we can sustain a game entirely on scalpers selling to speculators....
right?

When they manage to fuck up prerelease attendance, it should be a huge red flag that things are completely fucked

>be mtg player
>goes to prerelease event
>people are playing some marvel card game instead
>leave
It makes sense

>>96580119
Collector boxes \were preselling for 1000 dollars
LINE GO UP, CHUD.

>>96580094
It's Saturday night here and my LGS usually posts photos taken instore during events. They posted this
>Amazing turn out for our first night of the new Magic The Gathering set; Edge of Eternities Prerelease with max number of players for our 7pm flight. Still a chance to get in on the fun and boldly go into cosmos with this new set at our remaining prerelease events:
On EoE's Friday night prerelease, and in the photos all the seats are occupied. I was there last night for Cube and half of the seats were occupied, and they haven't posted any photos of any of the 4 events they've run so far even though I saw one of the staff members taking some. I also heard that non-WPN stores had supply issues, so they're the only store with enough kits for all their events and they were expecting refugees from other stores.

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Most recent biggest paper events:
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=73725&f=PREM
30 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=73458&f=PREM
92 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=72661&f=PREM
32 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=71876&f=PREM
45 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=71875&f=PREM
40 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=71540&f=PREM
81 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=71249&f=PREM
107 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=71247&f=PREM
60 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=71452&f=PREM
50 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=69859&f=PREM
177 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=68956&f=PREM
66 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=68886&f=PREM
84 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=68297&f=PREM
279 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=68163&f=PREM
92 players
>https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=67416&f=PREM
52 players

Embrace tradition.
Come back to Premodern, /tg/.
Come back home.

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Here's your next Secret Lair

Praying to God himself that the Spiderman set is a flop. The pre-release failing gives me hope.

>check out prerelease for spiderman because a friend offered to pay for me
>less than half the number of people we had for the EOE prerelease
>less than a third of the people for the FF prerelease
Oof. This is fucking dire for them.

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so what kind of cards do you want to see banned in your format of choise ?

for me it has always been toughtseize in modern, people pretend the card is fair just because they fetched a shockland into a toughseize against a burn deck once in 10 years.

>>96580094
Can’t wait for WotC to interpret this pathetic prerelease performance as “most players prefer to play at home” instead of accepting that this set is a flop

>>96580326
lmao, I can see it already.
>While we saw a dip in INSTORE attendance in some areas, the general trend was that Spiderman was really well received by the players and prerelease at home was the number one way for players to engage with the set

It's so fucking over this prerelease was D E A D

>>96579497
NYCC maybe

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>>96580311
>so what kind of cards do you want to see banned in your format of choise ?

I've enjoyed Pioneer since it started. I've hated many of the bans but whatever. The cards they HAVEN'T banned are much worse than interesting decks like Inverter and Amalia being beheaded.

My ABSOLUTELY FUCKING ESSENTIAL bans would be

>Cutter
>Fable
>Annex
>Cruise
>Den of the Bugbear
>Ramunap Ruins
>(I think hitting the extra reach in the mana base solves a lot of mono-red reaching for lethal in games it has no right to, better than banning its fragile core pieces.)
>Cauldron Familiar

Maybe some others. The format is so badly curated that it's basically just become an insufferable vomit pit at this point. Hardly anything redeemable about it anymore.

Also, I'm happy to see my endless meming of Fleeting Spirit finally made its way into Greasefang. I've been saying that card is cracked for years, get fucked haters.

>>96580326
>>96580380
You're aiming too high.
>State of design 2025
>Lessons:
>Through the Omenpaths created confusion
>Lots of players were asking about where OM1 was available in paper play, not realizing that it was the Arena version of SPM. This unnecessary confusion caused lots of players to not understand that they should be looking for SPM, not OM1, on the shelves. Going forward we renegotiated all out license deals so we won't need to make more Through the Omenpaths sets, avoiding this mistake.

>>96580412
its basically guaranteed that the full marvel set next year will also have an omenpaths variant.

I have been playing magic for nearly 20 years at this point, and I have literally never seen a lower attended prerelease.
I saw Un-sets and sets released mid pandemic with higher attendance for fuckssake.

>>96580418
>I have been playing magic for nearly 20 years at this point, and I have literally never seen a lower attended prerelease.
The set immediately after the Splinter Twin banning (can't remember the one) had nobody (zero people) attend at my shop. The store was basically a Modern-focused shop and like 60% of people played Twin.

But yeah, it's bad. Spiderman is deader than dead on arrival.

>>96580416
There's already internal discussion occurring at WotC about how OM1 is a disaster because of the only thing they'll acknowledge: proxies.
It's not enough that people are saying they like OM1 more than SPM because it fits the fantasy aesthetic more.
Commander players are proxying OM1 cards en masse for use in paper instead of buying Spider-Man, and WotC sees this as opening the door for players proxying other cards, which they see as disastrous since after killing 60-card there's no real way for them to enforce no proxies in gameplay (and if they tried to focus on sanctioned commander tournaments it would be a shitshow, see every cEDH tournament).
They really, really don't want people proxying cards so they're trying to find a way to kill Through the Omenpaths sets as quickly as possible. As much as they didn't like OM1 being a bandaid for messing up the SPM licensing, it's now completely blowing up in their face.

>>96580431
Huh? How is this related to SPM? Why would Commander players proxy this one differently?

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>>96580426
i like some of the cards gameplay wise but all in all the set is underwhelming also, final fantasy and even avatar can kinda fit the magic setting, spiderman is just a bridge to far for me

>>96580431
I will be proxying 5 cents commons onwards out of principle.

>>96580447
>i like some of the cards gameplay wise but all in all the set is underwhelming also, final fantasy and even avatar can kinda fit the magic setting, spiderman is just a bridge to far for me
UB was always destined to be a failure for this exact reason.

Truly sensible people saw it as a bridge too far as soon as it was introduced. Then people who hated it but were still in love with the game went silently and coped.
>"At least it won't be in Standard!"
And now it's in Standard.
>"At least it's fantasy IPs only!"
And now it's Spiderman. And step by step, as WotC runs out of other peoples' ideas to act as crutches for their own incompetence and lack of creativity, they will have to reach farther. And farther. And then more people hate it. And more people hate it. And more people that stayed silent see fucking Spiderman and can't stay silent anymore.

The bridge too far? They keep building it longer with every set.

The earlier commander players start proxying cards instead of throwing money at wotc, the faster the game will heal. There is zero incentive to use real cards in commander as it's not sanctioned play requiring real cards other than there being a sunk cost fallacy for players that have wasted their money on commanderslop

>>96580628
Commander has this thing called "Bling" and Commander players use it as a social ranking system.

The more money you spent on your deck, the better you are at Commander. It's the ultimate Pay2win game except you don't win because you intentionally design your decks to suck ass.

>>96578983
>Why does every creature have to do 5 different things?
This is modern magic now. MH sets were the final nail in the coffin.

>>96578983
>Why is every card a novel? Why does every creature have to do 5 different things? This just solidified why I completely gave up on magic. This was your last chance with me wotc and you fucking blew it.
Please understand. In order to push boundaries, you have to do things that everybody hates. We tried adding more text to cards and everybody hated it, so that meant we were pushing boundaries which is always a good thing. So then we added more text to cards.

We're a small indie game dev studio. We can not cater to everyone. Except when we're catering to everyone by banning Skeletons and Spiders from the game because they're scawy. Then we can. But not when it comes to designing cards that don't suck. Us producing cards with shit designs is non-negotiable.

Please understand.

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>>96579078
>I hate what mh3 did to modern/legacy
Luckily it impacted legacy only fregarding creatures but yeah it sill changed quite a bit. Modern is in a complete mess now. It's crazy to me how it shifted from being the best format (2011-2015 era) to the worst one real quick.
Pioneer is good but there are very few people playing it, both online and paper. Pauper is probably the best format right now since it has a great variety of decks, altough the delver deck is not like the usual tempo legacy stuff but it's much more straightforward.

>>96579716
That's because Moebius drew it.

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https://www.newyorkcomiccon.com/en-us/things-to-do/panels/panel-information.html?gtID=908894&panel-name=Nickelodeon-x-Magic-The-Gathering
>et your exclusive first look at the next powerful team-up between Magic: The Gathering and Nickelodeon. It's going to be [redacted]!
TMNT

>>96579343
Reanimator, duh. Literally wins the game on the spot in the right deck.

>>96579850
Like final fantasy? That's a game series.
I mean shit, the ff tcg is even still ongoing
Wait so is assassins creed
What are you smoking?

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>>96580311
Yup, surely toughtseize is the problem in modern right now.

>>96580698
My biggest concern for pioneer is pioneer horizons. I know the moment I get into the format it will be announced

>>96580718
I really hope they won't do it, the power level is fine at the moment. Having a slightly less powerful modern but without the fetch lands sounds like a dumb idea. Expecially since pioneer is already in a weird spot beetween standard and modern.

>>96579171
If boxes release and cards become legal, then it's just a release and no longer a pre-release. Why do WotC do these things?

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>>96580311
>>96580411
I’m ALMOST completely agree with you anon but in my opinion pic related, Rage and Emberheart are cards that MUST go away. For every format health, this design mistakes must die.

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He told me UB is whole loved and asked for the majority of this game player base
I come here and i’m reading how this new UB product based on a beloved and succesful property from marvel is a failure.
Who should i believe?

>>96580779
>I’m ALMOST completely agree with you anon but in my opinion pic related, Rage and Emberheart are cards that MUST go away. For every format health, this design mistakes must die.
Agreed on Nemesis, easily the worst designed card of all time.

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>>96580718
I don’t think is happening anytime soon.
The problems with Pioneer are actually very high to justify such inversion.
I mean they plunge the fucking support from the format, the last official arena tournament was a top 8 full of RDW decks, the problems with Midrange decks specially Rakdos are still there and the ban list hast been updated since the, in my opinion mistaken, bans of Amalia and Sorin.

The format is a mess they shall at least put some effort before trying to charge an extra fee to customers.

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>>96580700
>another horrible comic/tv show that fits 0 within the Magic universe will soon polluted the game and give us another pack of the worst cards ever printed in history like city sewer or pizza…
why do this? why after this garbage of spiderman?

I'm having a hard time with this game desu can't seem to find a way to enjoy it. Any recomendations?
I dislike standard and the rotating for mat
Only eternal format i enjoy is legacy but nobody plays and the budget options are non existent.

Tried draft and it honestly bored me.
I enjoy deck building more but I suck at it.

>>96580828
Off to the commander slums with ye

>>96580840
I honestly hate that format. The people there are control freaks. I want the freedom to play what I want.

>>96580850
Damn you misses out on the hay-day of commander then
There was a time
There was a time

>>96580828
Casual modern on mtgo has been scratching the itch for me
Id love to try premodern

All this time I thought Bloomburrow was set within Eldraine

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here's a silly thought experiment, can you guys think of a card that would specifically make this better? I'm thinking of a 2 mana enchantment that says "if your opponent would exile a card from their deck, they exile twice that many cards instead" + "whenever your opponent attacks a planeswalker you control, they exile a creature they control", sorry if the text templating isn't correct but you get what I'm going for here, ashiok does double duty while being harder to kill

>>96580980
Hey that woulda been kinda cool

>>96581027
>can you guys think of a card that would specifically make this better?
Enchantment: whenever Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver activates a loyalty ability you win the game.

>>96581067
This but it's on a Leyline that searches any Ashiok card when it ETBs.

Fantasy Card game sells less and have less attendance when the setting of the game is modern era closer to reality.

What a chocker.

>>96581027
Whenever a creature you control but don't own attacks, it gains menace and "if this creature does combat damage to a player, exile the top three cards of that player's library" until end of turn

>>96580687
>>96580690
Sounds like a good way to exclude new players. I can't imagine being someone picking up magic for the first time with this set. I get that power creep is a thing but jesus, don't you think giving every creature an enter the battlefield effect, activated ability, triggered ability and alternate mana cost is a bit excessive? What the fuck even is conniving? Can you imagine being a mtg judge in this era? Just shoot me. The sweaty whales have won. Enjoy my game, you fat bastards.

>>96578983
>Why does every creature have to do 5 different things?
Commander. Next question.

>>96581027
1 mana artifact that lets you activate the loyalty ability of planeswalkers twice if a card from anywhere was exiled this turn

>>96581027
The fair planeswalkers are the ones that don't defend themselves as they enter. You want to remove that fairness. I don't think that such tech should exist, if you cannot defend the planeswalker regularly you should lose it.

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>>96579850
Smite did one and the game is now dead.

>>96580119
There's literally no reason this wouldn't work if the set was actually fun to play. You think there's no crossover of marvel and mtg fans? Those venn diagrams basically overlap. The thing that is so offputting is making every card do too much shit. How do you even play a game where you have to read every card and still don't understand what they do? At the prerelease, I didn't even know what most of my cards did but I only had 50 minutes to figure it out. This is complete newbie poison and it's no wonder mtg is going down the shitter.

>>96581165
Smite 2 technically still exists, but Hi-Rez continues to shit the bed.

>>96581169
In my experience mtg is only a great game about 65% of the time
The other 35% of the time I keep playing because of a mix of sunk cost and the non-game related elements such as art.
WOTC should never fuck with that 35%, but stuff like rotating modern (eliminating some sunk cost) and UB does.

>>96579911
>he spent money on this slop

>>96581144
Why would EDH players like wordy text boxes? Wouldn't that be even worse since you only have one ofs? I've literally never played commander or understand why people do or why the players are hated. I only hate wotc for pandering to EDH every single set. You can only have one commander so why not just print some bears? It used to be they would print bad cards to make the other cards look good. That doesn't seem to be happening anymore.

>they lined up multiple other marvel sets
Oooooooohnnonononnonono
Let us pray final fantasy was a flash in the pan and that avatar also flops

>>96581196
>65%
I don't know, man. Even when I played more regularly 8 years ago it was already a fucking struggle. Magic players are the sweatiest of neckbeards and make me lose my enjoyment. Had one fag, during fucking draft of all formats, write his 7 with a tiny loop so that he could say it was a 9. Saved him one extra turn from lethal. Who fucking does shit like that?

>>96580698
Delver is overplayed. Plus it's pretty much just mono-blue snakes with delver dropped in.

>>96580311
>NOOOOOOOO YOU CAN'T PAY 2 LIFE TO MAKE ME DISCARD MY COMBO PIECE!!!
A thoughseize ban is one of the most retarded ideas you could ever come up with.

>>96581216
Because it's a 4 player party game. When your turn comes to play a card, it better do something.

>>96581216
Part of the design of the format is to make the games last longer and be inconsistent
Its really easy to powercreep that without effected other formats too much viw complexity bloat
Or at least that was the theory.
Theres more to it but nobody wants to hear me rant about it

>>96581307
I want to hear your rant about it.

>>96581261
What is the allure of that? I really don't get why it became the preeminent game mode other then wotc pushing it to sells cards because it's a singleton format. Everything about it seems like it would be the opposite of fun.

>>96581228
>avatar also flops
It's not out of the question. Maybe the fandom isn't important and it all boils down to premium pricing.

>>96580108
It's already like that lol, reason why wotc started selling to amazon and supermarkets.

>>96578983
>Who fucking plays this game anymore?
My mom and my little sister. That Bloomburrow set roped them in.

>>96581216
Commander players rarely know what any of the cards they’re playing against actually do and they’re afraid to ask to read so the downsides of wordiness don’t exist

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>The only think that doesn’t work in Spider-Man is that the set is not fun, Marvel and MtG are perfectly fine together.
>Ignore pic related and the other twenty disgraceful design of cards, the ten thousand variations of Spider-Man, the atrocious art and the poor not even engaging history inside a whole fantasy game.
How you people are here and not in the Olympics with that skill for the mental gymnastics?

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>>96581394
Honestly? I don’t think Avatar flops as hard as SPM, is very Magic adjacent

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If Strixhaven 2.0 has Slaads i might like it.

>>96581374
Because most people are NPCs, they cannot handle or understand loss, in commander you can't lose, because when you "lose" you just shift blame onto the other 2 players rationalizing that they either didn't do enough or ganged up on you.

>>96581473
why they are not going with the rival schools idea? i would love dimir/rakdos/selesnya in harry potter

>>96581450
After all the shit they've done, you really care about setting and aesthetics that much? Who fucking cares, as long as it's fun. This set just isn't fun.

>>96580709
>dies to Shock
Lol retard

>>96581480
Because they have so many allied-pair planes that making one of their few enemy-pair planes into that would be boring.

>>96581450
I think superhero stuff CAN work in Magic, I think they just focused a bit too much on mundane New York and also people are just tired of Marvel. If we get a Cosmic set I can see it being more well-received.

>>96581493
It's pretty bullshit that power creep has affected so many creatures yet we still won't have our lightning bolts back. Shows just how much they shit on control players.

>>96581473
>calling this creatures "salads" is frowned upon
Slaadi face microaggression

>>96581505
No it cannot, fuck off retard.

>>96581560
Bro, come on. You believe all sorts of crazy shit in magic but people having super powers is a bridge too far? If your problem was crossovers then you should've complained at the very first one. Since they keep making them, seems you guys weren't complaining enough.
In my case, it worked for this one set. I hadn't played a prerelease since ixalan. I only went to try to rip a gwen stacy for my daughter (got a gwenom, hope to sell it). That only works one time, though. I learned my lesson. I never should've given wotc another chance.

>>96581613
>Since they keep making them, seems you guys weren't complaining enough.
nta but this makes no sense, we could have 1 billion people complaining, if 1 billion and 1 are buying it then it wouldn't matter
complaints don't matter, money does

>>96581560
You could probably pull off some sort of masked vigilante thing on Fiora or New Capenna

>>96581631
That's what I was trying to say. The money is there so apparently the community doesn't disagree with crossovers, and obviously there's crazier shit in mtg than spiderman, so what's the issue? The set just wasn't any fun. Too many triggers and activated abilities. What is wrong with making spiderman a 3/2 with flash and reach?

>>96581648
>The money is there so apparently the community doesn't disagree with crossovers
but this is exactly the problem with crossovers, the people buying it aren't part of the community, they're coming from outside and are outspending people who don't want nothing to do with UB

>>96581648
How many times do we have to explain how this works? There is no community, nobody normal is buying this shit in any large capacity, all the money is being poured in by speculators moving billions.

>>96581560
Why not? What about superheroics stuff specifically makes it a bridge too far from fantastical settings? Is it the fact that DC and Marvel and most other superhero things take place on Earth? Would it be acceptable if it were in a recognisably different, albeit fairly modern-ish setting?

>>96581648
Final Fantasy brought in a ton of people, they stayed for a few sets but couldn’t care less about Spiderman so they didnt go. These should be the people who care the least about crossovers tainting magic but this shows that they have no real attachment to the game itself

>>96581648
>and obviously there's crazier shit in mtg than spiderman, so what's the issue?
For me, it's the mundanity. Seeing "Hot Dog Cart" on a card is inherently repulsive. There's no mystique, there's no intrigue, it's just a real world thing forcibly slapped onto a card.

>>96581663
The majority of 'new' people buying UB are lapsed Magic fans apparently. And people who are wholly new stick around and getting into it because of UB stick around at a greater rate than people who just try it randomly or because a friend plays it.

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>>96581687
>it's just a real world thing forcibly slapped onto a card.

>>96581680
Because superheros are garbage for retards, that's why.
they already tried with the jacetice league and failed hard, but you know this, don't you? marketer.

>>96581701
Oh, so you have no argument, it's just "CAPESHIT CAPESHIT SLOP SLOP SLOP".

>>96581705
You don't know what an argument is, kill yourself mongrel.

>>96581663
>>96581670
I don't see wotc dissuading the whales with all these collectors boxes and shit either. They actively hate the kitchen table player.
>>96581687
Good point. The citizen tokens were equally repulsive.
>>96581689
This is me. They lost me a long time ago when they started pandering to whales instead of fixing their cardstock. Came back only to pull a certain card for my daughter. Won't be doing it again.

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>>96581697
You think "of Urza" means nothing, boy? Yes, an otherworldly name stapled onto the card is all it fucking takes. Just the tiniest bit of effort.

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>>96581736
Through the Omenpaths is LITERALLY a demonstration of how easy it is. So easy that they could do it at any time.

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>>96581736
So, by your logic, this is fine? Peter Parker is not a real person. He is explicitly a fantastical character.

>>96581255
>Card singlehandedly, with no skill involved, oppresses an entire macro archetype unless it's a 1-card wincon or based on lands
Yes anon most games would consider that bad design.

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>>96580790
>easily the worst designed card of all time

>>96581745
Yes, that's actually fine. Peter Parker's Camera is one of the cards I take least issue with.

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>>96581777
You mean the 3 mana planeswalker, right?

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>>96581778
Fair enough. I don't personally have an issue with Hot Dog Cart per se, because it's... Kind of an inherently campy thing to put in from New York (the Bagel is similar), but this thing makes me a bit more upset and I can't quite articulate why. I think it's because this could just be normal-ass New York if Spidey wasn't just sort of also there.

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>>96580790
>easily the worst designed card of all time.
Allow us to introduce ourselves.

>>96581803
Yeah, anyone who doesn't hold Oko as chief of WRONG CHOICES is incorrect.
A planeswalker who meaningfully advances their gameplan on uptick is genuine insanity. It's like someone just fucking typoed his -1 and they decided to print it.

>>96581809
Companion was literally built off a framework that was already proven not to work (Baku and Genn), yet WotC did it anyway because Mark's ego is too big to accept that his pet concept was a bad idea. 50% of them are banned in at-least one format which is more than Dredge and Initiative.

>>96581843
I understand the comparison but Baku/Genn were unfixable because their effects were inherently unchangeable and the numbers on the cards themselves didn't matter. Companion had a lot more areas to fudge to make it acceptable, they just... Didn't.

>>96581843
Doesn't matter. Oko was still more insane. Oko is the most backwards card in all existence.

>>96581255
It's the equivalent of banning lightning bolt

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>>96581773
>only 4 allowed in the deck
v.
>2 card combo has 8 cards, 4 of each in the deck
>omitting potential reduncies
I don't see how it oppresses an entire archetype just because it can be used to delay your combo a few turns. And then there's the fact that it hurts you against aggro and combo is still 35% of the meta. In legacy where thoughtseize is also legal, combo is 51% of the meta. It is in no way oppressing any archetype. You just need to stop being lazy.

Looking at any format, I'm more worried about what they meta has become in response to what they've printed in MH1-3 and all the other sets in the last 5 years. Not a useful lorwyn block card that can't win you the game unless your opponent concedes in response or you're extremely lucky with your timing after it.

>>96581843
5/7 artifact lands that come in untapped are banned in at least one format, I guess that's actually a worse concept.

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Are there any cards with 1 art that you wish had an alternate art?
I love this card but this art sucks so bad. Some kavu look cool and some look stupid and this is one of the stupid ones.

>>96581866
This is your brain on black mana
>No! I NEED this mechanic that's banned in literally every other card game for being a braindead win button! You don't understand!
Grief isn't getting unbanned.

>>96581945
nobody said anything about grief
plenty of other card games have hand hate

WHERE ARE THE ATLA SPOILERS
I NEED A CONSTANT CHURN OF SLOP OR I'LL DIE

>>96581954
Yes anyway let me play my Ghetsis, Forceful Sentry, Bucky, and Mindrender Illucia. Because obviously when they tried to copy Thoughtseize it turned out to improve the game. Oh wait...

>>96580094
Our store was busier for EoE by far but there were a lot of people just buying stuff. Cheaper prices than FF surprised me

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>>96581964

>>96581971
I don't play those games anon. Tell me, which of those are actually thoughtseize tier and which are grief tier?

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>>96581945
>banned in literally every other card game
go play one of those card games then because discard isnt going anywhere

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>>96581870
I still cringe whenever i see black aragorn....

>>96582027
>Other card games do it!
>Doesn't know anything about 4 largest competitors

>>96582063
WE

>>96581945
>banned in literally every other card game for being a braindead win button
It's not a braindead win button in MTG. I don't know why you come on here to make yourself look stupid.
>>96581971
>Ghetsis
Trainer cards have no cost and you can play any number during your turn. The only restriction is for supporter and stadium cards. Of course, the only balancing mechanic is energy which only applies to pokemon. Trainer cards do not compete for resources. Whereas in MTG, playing a thoughseize often means you can't play a doom blade or a creature.
> Forceful Sentry
Unlike MTG, Yugioh does not have any balancing mechanics like mana cost. Which is why something that is innocuous like opt or sleight of hand is not gamebreaking in MTG. Whereas Pot of Greed ends up breaking the game because you can just draw 2 cards for as many pot of greeds you have in hand and just win if you draw your combo. There is no restriction to the number of non-monsters in Yugioh you can play any turn so you can use all of your pot of greeds on your first turn. Like Pokemon, there is no resource management here. You can still play one monster, put down traps, and play any of the spell cards you want on your turn without having to manage resources.
>Bucky
Don't even know what game this is from. Probably lacks the balancing features of MTG.
>Mindrender Illucia
I've never even touched Hearthstone. But likely there is something about the ruleset that lets it completely break the game. Whereas in MTG, it doesn't break the game.
>Grief
The reason grief was banned was because there was a combo with undying evil/malice or some of those other one cost black cards. Turn one, swamp> grief + exile card you don't care about > undying in response to sac > grief comes back with a +1/+1 counter. You get to remove two cards from your opponents hand and get a 4/3 on turn 1.

MTG is not the game for you it seems.

>>96582026
jej

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>>96581945
>banned in literally every other card game
I know it's heretical to mention Hearthstone around here but it still has had hand removal even in recent years, albeit as endgame strategies rather than early game control.

>>96581866
dude it is not only good against combo it is good against almost everything, turn 1 you get to see the opponents hand and discard their best card, I know black players pretend to know how the enemy deck is played even before the first land hits the board, lategame it is like a peemtive counterspell, but turn one it is like you played a 1 mana timewalk and get to know your opponents hand.

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>>96582087
8 mana......

>>96582079
>>96581971
>Mindrender Illucia
Hello, Hearthcuck here to explain Mindrender Illucia real quick. She originally read "Swap hands and decks with your opponent until your next turn".
GIven that A) Hearthstone has no mechanic that prevents your opponent from doing this to you and B) The class this card was available in had a viable aggro deck; meant your opponent typically dropped this card late with nothing in their hand and not only got to play your cards, which may also just be discarding your combo pieces, but also gave you nothing to play on your turn in response except whatever shitty low impact card you draw out of their deck.

It was essentially a 3 mana time walk that ripped cards out of your hand.

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>>96582063
I want this nigga restricted in DC so fucking bad... there are so many other Jeskai decks we could be playing but no, we have to keep playing goodstuff piles because of him.

>>96582079
Ghetsis was a supporter card anon. At least try.

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Little known fact: Companions core idea was lifted straight out of Hearthstone as a neat way to encourage diverse deck building.

>>96582068
It's a sarcastic question, none of those cards are the equivalent of thoughtseize except for forceful sentry, which is from a game where cards are the only resource. Ghetsis and Illucia are not 1 for 1s. Bucky I actually don't know, unless you mean Marvel Snap in which case that's not a hand hate card so idk what the fuck you mean.

>>96582135
These cards were also banned in hearthstone in a very rare move, because they were actually borderline impossible to balance around in a way where even/odd decks would be approximately the same power level as unrestricted decks.

>>96582144
>I was merely pretending to be retarded!
It's okay anon. That was obvious the moment you said Thoughtseize is good design.

>>96582099
>like you played a 1 mana timewalk
It's nowhere close to that. It's nowhere close to a 2 or 3 mana cost timewalk.
>get to know your opponents hand
Until they start drawing cards and playing out the cards you knew they had. It still costs one black mana and would come at the cost of either being able to cast 2/2 on turn one or a removal later.
>peemtive counterspell
Of course IESLB would want a thoughtseize ban.
> lategame
Late game they should have access to one of the cards that can give you hexproof like veil of summer or surge of salvation, a counterspell, or you should have enough mana to have already played the good targets for thoughtseize or to have already won the game.
>>96582127
>supporter card
Is a type of trainer card btw. At least try.

>>96582063
That's just Idris Elba

>>96582219
look at >>96581777
WotC thinks every black man looks like Idris Elba

>>96579165
What is this card? What does that mean?

>>96582245
dude read the frigging card
>you exchange life with an opponent
>if your life total is less than before, you draw cards equal to the difference

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>thinking about picking back up my burn deck
>checking card prices
>see this art of swiftspear
wtf did they do to my girl

>>96582245
It means it's designed for commander.

Idk if I'd call Thoughtseize "great design" but the card isn't egregious. Like it's probably overly efficient for what it does but pinpoint discard gets exponentially worse each turn.

My bad opinion is Force of Negation is a much better design than Force of Will. 0: Counter target spell is an insanely strong effect that would see play even if combo was nerfed down to turn 5.

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>>96582263
Only switspear version where the flavourtext has to mention that the creature is female, because it sure is hard to tell from the artwork......

>>96579165
The card looks kinda cool but also kinda stupid if you colour invert it.

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>>96582359

>>96582339
>FoW is good design, Mind Twist is not
Woah...

>>96582366
Looks way better than expected, honestly

>>96582382
Well I honestly figure the artist just did Mister Negative himself as a separate layer in black and white (with the exception of his powers glowing) and then inverted it. He does look sort of like he wasn't painted in on that background.

>>96582368
Twist is a better design than Hymn at least, given it has less chance of creating non-games. Thinking about it now I think Twist is a better design than FoW, yeah it's a brutal effect at 4 mana but 4 mana spells should win the game anyway.

>>96582382
>>96582366
no way thed did not just invert the colors in photoshop for this....

>>96582392
Yeah that's definitely what they did, I think it works fine.

>>96582402
Anon, that's the character's gimmick. He looks like a photo negative.

>>96582263
I know it may be controversial but I actually prefer that art over the original one.

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>>96582402
I mean for Negative himself, probably? It's the easiest way to get his unique aesthetic to happen and I'm pretty sure they often do that in the comics for him.

>>96582395
>4 mana spells should win the game
Ah yes because JtMS was overtuned we should now make every 4 mana spell a bomb that instantly wins.

>>96582339
>Force of Negation is a much better design than Force of Will
Is this supposed to be a joke?

>>96582395
>4 mana spells should win the game anyway
Tell me who declared this

>>96582435
You're making this easy. JTMS is stronger at cmc4 than Twist is because JTMS is relevant on a non-empty board. Max power Mind Twist requires
>sorcery speed mana
>opponent to have cards in hand
>you not go be dead on-board
Twist doesn't do shit if your opponent is ahead on-board AND it doesn't actually pressure your opponent on its own. JTMS can bounce creatures on top of being an insane draw engine, and if you manage to clear your opponent's board he becomes a win condition.

>>96582395
This is peak black mana induced brainrot.

>>96582469
>4 mana win button is fine because it's a sorcery in the color with Dark Ritual

>>96582461
There was an article on the mothership back in like 2010 that said exactly that, if I remember right it was considering resource investment and relative speed of aggro.

>>96582476
In this context, Dark Ritual is the mistake that ought to never have been printed.

>>96582476
Swamp Swamp Dark Rit into Twist isn't even good. You're unironically better off just casting Hymn on curve.

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>>96582482
The most powerful win condition in the game right now is 4 mana + an additional 3. What the fuck are you smoking that Mind Twist is fine?

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>>96582499
>The most powerful win condition in the game right now
>can't kill a man through Teferi's Protection

>>96582499
Twist does not end the game on its own. It depletes you opponent's resources and best case scenario puts them in topdeck mode, but you still need to actually win. Belcher is played in a way that actually ends the game on resolution. Turboing out lock pieces like Trinisphere is a better plan than fast Twist. Shit you could just be casting Sheoldred for 4.

>>96582526
This is the Magic thread, not EDH. I guess that's why you think 4 mana should = instant win and discard is bad.

>>96582530
EDH-coded post.

>>96582532
You made a wrong statement, get wrecked nigger.

Ah yes. MTG in 2030
>I summon Gandalf from the command zone and tap him to crew my M1 Abrams. In response, I tap Rainbow Dash to crew the Vax-Scene drive thru by Moderna. Each player creatures a dunkin donut token.
>What do you mean Standard? MTG was always a single card format!

>>96582451
Dead serious. FoW is a truly insane card, it functions as your choice of 0 mana removal, 0 mana disruption, or 0 mana protection. It's at its best in either control decks with undercosted threats as it slows down your opponent's clock and protects your win condition, or fast combo decks as a way to bypass the first answer.
FoN is worse protection as it's not free
on your own turn and doesn't function as creature removal.

>>96582544
Twist wouldn't bring back draw-go control, I don't know what to tell you.

>>96582570
Rainbow Dash is silver-bordered.

>>96580891
I rather they actually made eternal formats good. Hell modern should not even exist they should just ban RL cards from legacy.

>>96580699
>moebius
>amano
I'm happy at least someone on the Magic team has good taste.

>>96582574
Adding on to this, in any format where FoW is legal paying mana for spells becomes a liability, in a matchup between 2 "fair" decks FoW's best outcome is "0 mana Time Stop." Playing a high curve is a fool's errand because you're opponent can just curve out and answer your threat/answer/combo piece without slowing down.
FoN doesn't stop you from jamming some dumb undercosted beatstick and asking for a response that costs real mana.

>>96578931
So did you get first place or last place?

>>96582698
DQ for doing the spider-pig

>>96582574
If you're talking from a design standpoint that's one thing. But if we're arguing power level there's now FoN is better than FoW.

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>>96582668
To be fair I only liked the Amano artworks from the FF sets. Pic related is a great example.

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>>96582718
I've been talking about a design standpoint the whole time.

>>96582451
>>Force of Negation is a much better design than Force of Will
>Is this supposed to be a joke?
Literally the comment I was replying to.

I work at an lgs and we still have a fuckton of prerelease kits and have sold less than 5 packs of Spider-Man. I predicted it but the owners bought like it was final fantasy

>>96582781
It's almost like people who want to play a game based on the fantasy genre don't want capeshit.

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>>96582725
I kinda hate it.

>>96580108
Who cares? It's Universe Beyond no real Magic is going to buy it.

>>96581859
>Oko was still more insane.
Lurrus was litteraly banned in vintage before the errata, the card was litteraly more powerful than the power 9.

>>96582952
Power is besides the point. Companions were a confused concept, unknown, unprecedented. Errors are expected. Oko was a planeswalker, made after many years of planeswalkers. They had the experience to know what he would do. He should not have happened.

>>96579165
With Lich

>>96581803
>>96581809
>>96581843

Lurrus is the only card (with argument for Sharahazad) ever banned in Type1/Vintage for power level reasons.

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>>96581945
You clearly never had your entire hand discarded to a Mind Twist on turn 1, only to turn around and win the game.

It shows.

>>96582988
To be fair restricting it doesn't really alter the usefulness of it in Vintage due to how Companion works.

>>96581803
Incredible that these cards were released in 3 consecutive sets

Compared to this cards... How fucked up were actual cards like Rage, Cutter, Vivi or This Town?

>>96583120
Those cards are just power-level mistakes. MAYBE Vivi could be argued as a design mistake (should have some cost on the ability, or a restriction on how many counters it can get per turn, I dunno) but honestly isn't too much on that.

>>96583003
Enormous cope from nigger card player.

>>96583127
This. Cutter is on a different league from the Lurrus, Oko and Breach level.

Nemesis on the other hand? Completely shuting down one of the main counters of Red decks? On a haste creature? That is also unblockable? That's a lot of Nos in my book.

>>96582988
literally nothing wrong with sharahazad

>>96582963
>Companions were a confused concept, unknown, unprecedented
But that's wrong, companions were just a constructed version of a commander.

>>96583241
They are not. They are a Magic interpretation of Hearthstone's Start of Game legendary cards. They don't even control your color identity, how could they equate to a commander? You'd think they would've just used the command zone (which exists in all formats) if that were their intention, but no, Companions come in from "out of game".

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>>96583153
>lies about helping white
>instead pushes the fuck out of blue and red for the next 6 years
Name a more biased game designer (besides Nosewater)

>>96583322
>legendary creature that is always available to you in a zone your opponent can't interact with and restrict your deckbuilding
>how are they similar to commander?
Anon please

>>96583334
this guy fiddle's with kids and it shows.
no different than rosewater. jfc

>>96581327
edh works best as a bottomfeeder format sucking up cheap and underused cards from other formats
I started playing mtg with edh in 2013
I travel a lot for work and visit a lot of lgs across America each year I have a good idea of the nature of the meta. Zur was always a thing. Grixis storm was always a thing. There was an emphasis on interesting board states and combo was hated but present.
There was an ecosystem, draft, trade with modern/standard/legacy players, buy singles, arms race your friends but keep a bunch of shit decks sleeved.
cEDH, mostly unseen.
Precon decks before partners were unplayably bad but sometimes had some good or even broken cards in them.
3 things happened around the same time, introduction of 4 color decks/the partner mechanic, the proliferation of the cEDH subreddit and a little later FIRE design.
4c piles are notorious in highlander formats and edh is no exception. The cEDH decks became more mainstream and people were looking to play more effective decks. FIRE design also creates significant card compression, you see more cards per game get more resources. The popularity of the format brought in more players and the players were more competitive and that's a problem. Multiplayer magic has a single archetype that makes sense and its combo. There are maybe a handful of decks that can break that mold but even those decks either play a lockout or loop turns or a combo as compliment.
So now wotc has carte blanche to make as busted of midrange and aggro cards as they want and obviously printing these cards into other formats and not just into edh precons/masters sets are having knock on effects. Doing harm to the formats that should be acting as the top of the food chain.
Having a culture of anti-combo sentiment was only ever going to go so far, this was all inevitable and anyone who played knew that. Wotc investing heavily in a fundamentally broken format was not inevitable however and that's where they messed up.

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i was told this was the place to ask, given how good you all are at the game.
make picrel playable.
>pick format
>give us the gist of the interaction/combo
>the outcome has to be in your favour

this is your time to shine, /mtg/.

>>96583520
>Leyline of the Void
>Hive Mind
>Knowledge Pool
>One With Nothing

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>>96583497

>>96583497
cum and turd player here and every word this anon says is true. god I wish people would be more willing to play with only cards not designed for the format

>>96583520
>Swamp
>One With Nothing
>Discard 4 Grave Troll 2 Imp

>>96582963
You could argue a planeswalker with removal on +loyalty was also an "unknown".

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>>96583497
ye I always figured that commander was supposed to be like the garbage bin format where you and your buddies make some fun theme decks from cards you found in a bargain bin or were left over on draft night.

I can see upgrading those being pretty fun what I do not get is people playing every tutor and manarock possible to shit out their wincon turn 3

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You can print a card. A card that must save your favorite format. Must not be on pair of Oko and other bullshit but besides that could be whatever shit you want and with whatever mechanic you want.


What you, savior, print in this dark times of slop?

>>96580259
Flop X (As this card enters, you may drop it onto the battlefield from a height of at least 12 inches. Nonland permanents with a mana value of X or lower are destroyed if they are touching this card when it lands. If you do not, draw a card.)

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>>96583871
pic related but for every set printed in the last 10 or so years

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They had to cancel the saturday prerelease because three people showed up...sad. We usually get solid 20 or so. Don't know what I'll do with the rest of my night.

>>96583871
{1}{W}{W}
Sorcery
Fallow soil
Each player chooses a basic land and sacrifices the rest.
Shuffle all lands in graveyards into their owner's library.

>>96583991
I cant wait to pick play boxes up for 70 bucks and draft with my friends at home

>>96583871
The Pest Apocalypse
{1}{B}
Instant
Exile every creature with value 2 or less. You lose life equal to the total mana value of the creatures exiled this way.

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>>96583991
you can always ponder about future possibilities

>>96584065
i don’t want to see 2026 schedule bros…

>>96583871
Gay Bolas {W}{U}{B}{R}{G}
Legendary Creature - Elder Dragon
This spell costs {W}{U}{R}{G} less to cast if you control a Ugin planeswalker.
When this creature enters, each opponent must read aloud an entire chapter of the Magic story (your choice) where Ugin has sex with Nicol Bolas. Each opponent who does not finish reading the whole chapter with complete correctness within 15 minutes loses the game.
7/7

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>>96583871
I just like aggro bro....

>>96583871
The Tall Poppy
WW
Enchantment
When The Tall Poppy enters, exile all rare and mythic rare permanents from the battlefield. Whenever a rare or mythic rare permanent enters, exile it. Whenever a player casts a rare or mythic rare spell, counter it.

>>96583871
Leyline Antibullshit
{2}{W}{W}
Enchantment
If Leyline Antibullshit is in your opening hand, you may begin the game with it on the battlefield.
If an spell would be casted from another place than your opponent hand or duplicated, you counter that spell.

>>96583991
Recession is here. At this point only market manipulation, streamers and it/crypto nerds keep the card economy alive.

I would say slight price correction is coming in 13-15 days.

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>>96584159

Give me a list of cards I should make high quality copies of.
Local comicon is coming and I wanna scatter a few rares around the place.

>>96584207
Rhystic Study and Smothering Tithe. Ruin more commander games until WotC is forced to start updating banlists.

>>96584292
constantly pestering your opponents to pay 1 is the gayest shit. Hate those cards.

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>>96583871

>>96584311
>Companion creature type
>Legendary as a subtype
Come on man.

The second companion wave will come sooner rather than later.

Be prepared.

>>96584376
it's been half a decade, I dont think it's happening

>>96584046
>exile removal becomes the norm
More like how to ruin a format

Hello guys, I am new to this awesome card game and I am a magic girl or mgtgirl lol.

This game is older than me wtf how crazy is that. Anyways could any of you give me a quick rundown on magic history? Like that would be great because the story is confusing.