Cockatrices EditionPrevious thread:>>96597218>Legacies:https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/>HH 3.0 - Complete gofile - All Books:https://gofile.io/d/cnJk0N>New Edition, to a great wailing and gnashing of teeth:https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/setting/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloads:https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/>Thread FAQ (very old, remembers Age of Terra)https://pastebin.com/iUqNrrA8https://pastebin.com/8riDmnhS>30k TACTICA & TIPShttps://pastebin.com/Tm2P4QLphttps://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/Age_of_Darkness-Warhammer_30k/2.0_Tactics/General_Tactics『Adeptus Titanicus and Legions Imperialis』>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloadshttps://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/legions-imperialis/>List of Titan Legions with Badges and Colourshttps://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17Jccq0V--SwJifLVLwbisYnQeqLlS2pMSiPbGXp1Brs/htmlview>More listshttps://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/List_of_Titan_Legions>What size magnets do I need?5x1mm>Tacticshttps://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/Adeptus_Titanicus/Tactics>Thread Question:Does your preferred legion have a piece of artwork you're fond of?
>>96611010>TQi'm AL so we don't get muchand what we do get is redditor "DUDE ARMOUR SHIFTING EFFECT" nonsense fanart that has no existence in lore
>>96611010Alpha Legion - this particular one. Has that old school soul to it, and the hazard striped bolters have some nice irony to them.
>>96611010>TQI liked how his weird Chogorian pistols got referenced in the HH books. Wish he had a bow too.
>>96611010>TQPic related
>>96611124what's the fanciest pistol in the HH? My vote goes to The Lantern
>>96611038they should all be wearing Meta glasses
Poetry
>>96611062I like that the Legion cover art seems to be a slightly grittier update of the same rough scheme, with the striped bolter and the same helm. Makes me wonder if I should have a go at the hazard bolters to indicate the units equipped with Banestrike or whether they'd clash a bit with a lighter cyan metallic rather than that deeper one.
>>96611139Probably this bad boy
>>96611124doesn't he have an archaeotech pistol for shooting?
>>96611010>TQYet another AL one, I just find it cool.
>>96611010eaters have lots of pieces oozing with sovl but i think this is my favorite with how far it stretches the VISION of a marine
>>96611268I wish we had more WIDE helmets like that. Really dehumanizes the marines
look at this handsome prick, fuckthe visions on the whole are amazing
https://litter.catbox.moe/s1052g8c9zaprzd9.pdfhttps://litter.catbox.moe/nsm1j6y0slqb3mud.pdfvisions for you to behold if so wanted
>>96611306>>96611306it's crazy that the athaneaen shoulderpad design goes back to this, wonder what the inspiration was originally.
>>96611139
>>96611378*pants grab*
real real real real classic
dated at the outset of the scouring
art
>>96611424Wouldnt the irony be that that Sanguinius would know the answer to that better then his brothers considering HE saw the visions of himself dying.
>>96611440but wasn't he determined to avoid that fate?
>>96611440Yes Anon, that's why it is poignant.
sovl
peak cataphractii
>>96611481There's a tone about a couple paragraphs of flavor that thirty thousand words just can't match.
How are you planning to run your new satties? Axes seem like the best option, though the WB guys should probably stick to fists
>>96611527Indeed. I don't need that slop Abnett shat out to cap off the excessive novels, I just have this from 1987. Before Horus was even the Emperor's favored son.
>>96611528Four with axe, two with hammer. Just because I think it's cool honestly.Still not sure if I wanna give them plasma blasters to match the praetor, or particle shredders because they're more convenient to get.
Does anyone have a PDF of the liber strategia for legions imperialis? I can't find one to save my soul.
lavish stuff
sons of magnus, roll for your tutelary
>>966115282x hammer w/ blaster, 3x axe w/ shredder, 1x fists(clawbs) w/ shredderpraetor-sama will have a hammer and axe i'm thinking as it's just nucking futsfour six man line saturnine squads beneath
>>96611558There is only one option
>>96611538>saying "you are deluded" to your son until your arm falls off so hard that it imprints onto the geneseed of his own sons, and even 10,000 years later Abaddon has no arms
>>96611558i hope i get an armoured bro
>>96611558we is kangz
>>96611558nay
>>96611558The book with legs is hilarious
>>96611558ScareBro, I summon thee to my side!
>>96611619>TS will never escape their shitty upgrade-set kit for their special terminatorsIf I cannot die I wish to kill
>>96611453It's okay it's not poignant, I checked.
>>96611640you spooky motherfucker, if you're not running NL already you have to repaint everything to be NL nowyou have three hours
>>96611649all I have is militia so that's going to be difficult
>>96611640HOW
>>96611643You are so boring
>>96611705let's hit those showers!
>>96611669I don't make the rules
Rolled 1 (1d10)>>96611558I need wizardbro so bad
>>96611558Where my pumpkin bro at. I better not get the catgirl
>>96611306I dunno if I want these guys or never wanna see them again.
>>96611558Are knight armies in LI big gay like they are in 40k?
>>96612080No.
>>96612094Sweet. I want an army of teeny tiny knights.
>>96612102Do it
>>96611010>TQAll the Autek Mor General Images/Shitposts
I just got telegram since apparently it’s the only place to get STLs anymore. Anyone know a channel link for heresy stuff? Specifically Auxilia
>TQI like'em big. I like'em chunky.
>>966115587, check em.
>>96611010>>Thread Question:I don't think any other peice of art goes as hard.
Who are your Inductii? Tell me their fluff
>>96611526More like Cata-fat-rii.
>>96611062I'm painting my mk2 tacs like this, my mk6 tacs like pic related, and my 3rd tac squad will be green
>>96612622AL inductii that became actually schizo about every order they'd receive, their shoddy hypno conditioning meant they think even the most basic orders are either convoluted plans to screw their careers or veiled instructions to do something completely different to what the orders otherwise actually indicate. Because of their inability to take anything at face value their increasingly exasperated commanders have to try and predict how these retards will interpret orders and thus try to give them wrong orders to lead them to do what's actually necessary.
>>96612622>Night Lord InductiiAfter the destruction of Nostramo and with little recruiting worlds, the 13th company of the Night lords were destined to stealing human colonists from mass prison raids on planets. Even though they were criminals in arms from their origins, there was no love for the press-ganged prisoners like many other legions had for theirs. These rapidly trained inductii were at best, given broken armour or were simply left unarmoured and were used as fodder against light targets or as a clean up crew for after planetary raids. None of the Inductii from the 13th company of the Night lords survived past M32.
>>96611148you should do it because it's an awesome idea and i'm totally shamelessly gonna steal your idea
>>96611558roll>>96611640based
>>96611558God please not the kitty cat I don't want to get raped like a night lord
>>96612846>skelebro I'll gladly take that
>>96611268There’s so many CHONK WE in Visions, it’s honestly hilarious. Like why the fuck are they wide now? The nails didn’t promote muscle growth. I’m the anon who counted Visions art recently and I almost made a separate category for chonk Marines, wish I did.>>96611368>>96611372Ah My glorious Blood Boys, first one inspires greatly>TQPicrel related. Love this art, even though it’s overt redness makes it hard to make out, made my Chaplains silver because of it.
Why are warhammer artists so bad at human anatomy?
>>96613091because spacemarines are tranhumans
>>96613098Ye but this marine can't fit a helmet on since his head is so big. Usually artists give marines heads (often with helmets on) that are far too small. Helmets are big and bulky but somehow marines heads are smaller when wearing helmets than when they're bare-headed.>>96612741
It's said that the Emperor's Children turned their attention to the civilian populace during the Siege. Does this imply rape, or just torture and murder?
>>96611526>>96612637I mean if they're EC you should be calling them Catamites.
>>96611619>>96611642I thought the TSons special Termie boys were in Cataphractii? Does this mean I can snag some pieces from that 40K kit, even if they are manlets, to sex up my Tartaros?
>>96613163>special Termie boys were in CataphractiiUnfortunetlay sekhmet are still cata locked this edition, but the 40k kit is pretty much the same size as the plastic tarties and is pretty great.So if you want to spice up your basic termies go for it.
I think I'm being priced out of this hobby.
>>96613240i need to remember euro's use , as . in money because i was about to freak the fuck out.either way consider forge world east.
>>96613250Black Legion Market is the way to go for us Eurobros. God I love how weak the dollar is.
For me, it's the Death Guard.
>>96613302Love BLM
>>96613240>The year is 2025>Poorfags still think they have any right to play HH
>>96612622Literally volksmarines. My Fist are a mechanized assault cradle specialized in armored warfare, they arrive late to the fortification of Terra (just few weeks before the actual battle began) and after they ask for fresh equipment and manpower to cover the losses from their previous campaigns, they meet with "young" marines that were only trained for defensive warfare and barely a few Rhino chasis. So, my Praetor only option was to spread his few surviving veterans among their new inductii, salvage the turrets and heavy weapons from their damaged vehicles to be used as pillboxes holding his last armored units as reserves. My idea is to model my 3.0 inductii after a Battle of Berlin volksturm force, barebones 20 men squads supported by the new turret, maybe some buried Rhino/Predator as tarantulas proxies and very few "elite" forces
>>96613302How good is their quality control, what are their shipping times and how much do you have to pay for customs fees?
>>96613565I've bought from them three times>Qualitygood, their resin stuff is better than their plastic stuff and out of the 4 things I've purchases I was most annoyed with the eliminator squad which had two identical models out of the three>Shipping timesas I'm from Australia generally about 40000 years but yuropoors get their shit quicker>custom feesSeem'd okay, though I guess everyone has an opinion of what delivery fee's are.Pic related is the traitor champion which you wouldn't even know it was a 3rd party model
Im completely clueless about the new edition still and the Inductii rules dropped now https://assets.warhammer-community.com/eng_sept25_thehorusheresy_legacies_inductii-ip0av2vvfq-sitewwodhz.pdf>DA Inductii cost 90p, all have volkite chargers and two get to have special equipment from the legion >10 more inductii cost 90p >20 man squad for 180p are volkite charger units like this worth it, if i can give them some plasma burners or repeaters?
>>96613575>>96613582So are they Ukrainian or what? Seems a bit more expensive than Chinamen recasts based on skimming other recast sites.
>AL Inductii are the same + combis every 5Truly, Hydra Dominatus
>AL inductii cannot be shot in the first game turn unless its volley fire/reaction>this is GREAT if you're going first, you can rhino rush onto points and don't have to worry about them being shot off it>they also now get access to 2 combi-weapons in the squadthis is pretty good, i'm happy with thisbut the best bit? AL just got 18 new units as they can steal 17 of them
>>96611558rolling for catgirl
>>96613603>equipped with deadly weaponry from the darkest vaults of the First LegionThat's one way to describe volkite chargers I guess.
>>96613605They're Ukrainian so they will be more expensive then chink shit (as chink shit is famously dirt cheap) + you're funding Ukrainians with TZD
>>96613630>AL copy everything>even other Legions' recruits
>>96613647Right, shipping times should be reasonable then if they're next door.
>>96613605BLM are a bit expensive but reliable and you don't have to wait so long like for the chinaman.
>>96611417Ummm, ackshulee according to nufluff MK5 was only used by four dudes during a really wild night out on Proxima 7 and the moniker of "Heresy armour" was completely ironic. Everyone in that image should be in MK6. In fact everyone in all images of 30K should be exclusively beakies, and if you disagree or think that's dumb you're a fakegrog.
>>96613667The sweltering sizzling summer heat ... Are the rumours true??
>>96613603Chargers are alright but "special equipment from the legion" isn't a thing. It means 2 marines can pick between nuncio voxes and augury scanners, that's it.
>>96613137It implies all of the above, but more recent publications have emphasized the mass use of humans, physically and spiritually, to produce chaos-drugs.
> IH get phosphex bombs everywhere That's cool man you can keep your Line(2) and mental stats>>96613645Sounds like the DA vaults are a bit shit desu
>>96613603> Iron Warriors Intelligence 5> Lower than WE> Same as Inducted LevyIW confirmed for recruiting retards
>>96613778Yeah the IH ones are cool, they get the keys of hel stuff where they count as always having a medic too. WE also have some cool stuff.
>>96613603Wait, does this mean that butcher surgeons can join red butchers? And have them become loat to the nails while taking the "loyalist" legion trait for an insane number of attacks?
>TS inductii get a good power (6+ breaching if cast, no perils if failed)>also get 1 volkite caliver per 4 mendamn this shit good
Did I miss somethinf or WE can't take chainaxes but SoH and SW can?>>96613828It'a weird how some of the inductii get "1 per 4" wargear onstead of per 5 or 10. I guess it's ao you get 3 when bumping the squad up to rhino size?
>>966138335 in a 20 man unit
>>96613778>> IH get phosphex bombs everywhereAnd I love them for it.
>>96613833The World Eaters legion rules let them swap chainswords for chainaxes at no cost, so they don't need the option on the actual unit sheet.I assume the butcher-surgeons are meant to be Traitor-Locked, but if they're not that's totally wild. Red Butcher sweep.
>>96613603>EC for 15pts get 2 attacks with charnbal sabre, van 2 and roll additional die for status checksholy shit
>UM inductii remain the GOATs of rhino rushes>Tactical statuses mean you can take an inductii squad with flamer, rotor cannon, and combi-grav on the sgt in a rhino with havoc launcher to have a <200 point squad inflict every status in the gameOur spiritual liege shall never let us down
>>96613603So if AL steals the TS Inductii they dont get to use the psychic power right? Because no one would have the TS trait at that point?
>>96613948>he thinks the UM trait is better than CANT BE SHOT TURN 1 for rhino rushes
>>96613968No that’s just expected Alpha Legion BS because they’re some designer’s pet army
>>96613907But the "loyalist" trait isn't loyalist locked, is it?
>>96613951They're still Psykers, they can use their powersThe whole point of TS' trait is to give the Psyker trait to generic units; if TS units didn't also include the Psyker trait outside of getting it via the TS trait, there would never be a point to RoTing any of their units
>>96613951>>96614006The power saya the target unit has to be TS, so it doesn't work on AL
>>96614020Target: The Target Unit must be the Unit that the Focus is part of, and must only include Models with theThousand Sons Trait.Pretty gay, makes them useless steal
I'm liking WB inductii, easy access to malefic is nice and vanguard 2 means I've got some chaff to run alongside my gal vorback and not worry about the wrong thing killing objective holders.
>>96613968the squad can't be shot, doesn't say anything about the transport they're inside
>>96614034the rhino is there to get them from A to B, once thats done the rhino is only useful as a LoS/charge blocker and status effect machine (you DID give it a havoc launcher didnt you?)
Hi, I'm Josh. I'm a Warhammer TV gaming presenter, and today we are going to learn to play 'Warhammer: The Horus Heresy - Age of Darkness'.
>>96613603>sergeant options goneYep, sure is 3rd edition.
>>96613807I think it's impossible to get a prime advantage slot for an apothecary outside of the WE hereticus detachment, so no I don't think you can do that combo.
>>96613968>Can't be shot>Can still be charged>No special weapons to dissuade said charges
>>96613565>QCGood. No miscasts in my order, but plenty of cleanup.>shipping timesTook me about a week or two to get my things.>customs Since I'm a euro, none.I mainly use them to get hold of discontinued FW stuff and exclusives.
>>96614120scratch that it is possible to take one if you take an apothecarion detachment they do have 1 prime slot
>>96613791Pertie was a big fan of project 100.000
>>96614215Oops, forgot the link.>https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_100,000
>>96614191Thanks, I'll order some vorax and chaos dwarfs from them then.
Afternoon lads. I have a question for you, and it's about aesthetics and readability. Without looking them up, can you name what armour mark that is, and which Legion the respective helmets belong to?
>>96614100>retard can't read and doesn't realize inductii don't have sergeantsyup, sounds like a third edition hater
>>96613603>>96613948>>96614123I mean, from a modelling perspective, SW Inductii sound kino as fuck. Just 10+ dudes with combat shields and chainaxes, just chilling in the moment.>Rushes 11">Can still charge.>Is still Space Wolf so get's a 5" setup move.>Total threat range is 16+2D6 (pick highest)>Can be shoved into a Rhino or LR or whatever as well.>Can now threaten anything within 28" with a charge.Honestly, if you fail a charge with these wolf-fuckers then you DESERVE to be Stunned & Pinned.
>>96614279Armour is mk5 with some modifications that make me think white scars.Top mid helmets could be EC or maybe DG even, top right are SOH for sure.Bottom left are WS helmets, bottom mid IW, bottom right Dark Angels or IF templars.
>>96613630>>96613968The issue is line 1, you'll be behind on scoring and you must move react them off to avoid melee vanguard. Opponents Tacs will just walk on on, steal it, and you're immediately behind on points. If you start them on foot they have protection going second, but they're basically just fodder to protect your scoring. If they're your primary scoring you'll lose in the movement phase.
>>96613948My SAL inductii can still be built the same way as before, so that's good. +1 additional combat res if you score any kills seems alright as well.
Man for the word bearers inductii it fucking sucks that We're again cucked by the shitty scoring system and missions, their rule would be cool if it wasnt really easy to vanguard cuck with reactions and if there weren't like 2 objectives they can even trigger vanguard on each turn so even if they don't get cucked it's hard to actually make it work
>>96614439Melee vanguard is such a non rule. Nobody is going to flood objectives where they can't just toe in the circle and then bounce. That leaves shooting vanguard, which also means you aren't putting line on the objective and are behind on points already by not scoring it.
>>96614316Sergeants being gone in general is not the win you think it is, anon.
>>96613603Wait, where the fuck is the sergeant for each unit? Mine carries a combi-grenade launcher and a power axe.
>>96614480>>96614496I can't tell if you guys even read the document or are just trolling, but yes, none of the inductii squads have sergeants now, they get 1/4 weapon options instead of 1/5 ones instead
Isn't it crazy how tactical/despoilers squads have Line (2)?I was just looking at other armies and they are almost alone in that.I have no idea how a militia player could compete at all. An infantrymen squad only costs 10 points less than a tactical squad and they are THE SAME POINTS COST as the new inductii.
>>96614504>none of the inductii squads have sergeants nowCope and seethe, another W for the Boys in Blue
>>96614504Isn't that a legitimate question though? They had sergeants, now they don't. Why?
>>96614439Have faith Word Bearer
>>96614514>in6>literal tard wrangler
>>96614513>I have no idea how a militia player could compete at allThey compete by taking 5 artillery batteries that shit out suppressive (2) in a 7" template for 85 points a pop
>>96614525>Still smarter than an IW inductiiUnmatched>>96614520>had sergeants, now they don't. Why?Because they used to be an upgrade for tactical marines instead of their own units and now that they're their own thing it's a good way to differentiate them from the tacticals they're supposed to be a sidegrade to
>>96614504Not trolling, I am genuinely confused by this. Outside of artificer armor inductii sergeants had the same options as normal tactical/despoiler ones. Many people probably have modeled theirs accordingly – I certainly have. Makes no sense.
>>96614279Left-to-right, top-to-bottom:- Mk V- EC- SoH- UM- IW?- SWAll of them have an uncanny valley look though, you can tell they're pretty third party. Almost fourth party.
>>96614527Yeah but in this edition you can just take tacticals in an allied detachment instead of bothering with your infantrymen for example and STILL have your artillery. it's a 10 point difference between the units and with the inductii it's 0 points difference and they are able to do WAY more.
>>96614520Since challenges are now herohammer, sergeants don't get to be in challenges. Without that, sergeants are just an extra attack, Ld, or wargear, so they can remove them for easy nerfs.
>>96614316>And That Was A Good Thing.
>>96614513Mechanicum has comptrollers which are arguably more annoying. Also get 2 bonus VP, but instead on squishy marines that die when you sneeze on them it's tanky as fuck magos that are impossible to kill, who are hiding in an ever expanding blob of tech thralls that give zero fucks about status effects or morale.
>>96614571Or are attached to a toughness 8 2+/5++ thanatar that they can repair to full wounds every turn unless you absolutely nuke it.
>>96614031>EasyScoring with vanguard is not easy. And they lose a third of their squad when they get it
>>96614221falvorful
>>966143232d6 drop lower is 4.5 on average, bit less so round that down to 4. Means they have a 20 inch threat on average (just like me hyuk hyuk), pretty impressive
>>96614583Comptroller doesn't do anything on thanatars, they have support unit
>>96614571Are tech-thralls worth it at 10 points a pop? I haven't read up much on their rules or their magic
>>96614514Ahem...
>>96614535>Keeps posting the ONLY cool UMMalum is a badass but he can't carry his entire legion on his shoulders. And I don't think he was around back in 30k
>>96614279Armor looks like MkV but I would cover the samurai tassets with bits and use them as Reavers.Top helmets are EC and SoHBottom are UM / AL (looks good on both), middle either IW or SoH, check the Visions of Heresy, I'm sure I've seen an illustration with that helmet. Bottom right could be for SW and IF.
>>96614633short answer is no, complex answer is they can be worth it only if you have a lacrymaerta magos attached and just use them as ablative wounds for the magos to win challenges or combat res by punching the shit out of 3 guys a turn.
>>96613603Once again inductii are more interesting than tactical squads, for some reason.
>Iron Warriors Inductii have CL 8>as high CL as terminator squads>Iron Warriors Inductii have IN 5>lower IN than literally any other legion infantryThey are quite literally based retards.
>>96614687>for some reasonBecause tacticals are intentionally the plainest most basic vanilla unit in the game, and inductii are tacticals with a special rule? Why does this surprise you?
>>96614687Because calling inductii just new recruits is disingenous, because what they actually are is the representation of their legion turning into their post heresy selves (or for death guard, what their post legion selves may have looked like if they didn't get nurgled)
>>96614695I meant equipment-wise actually.
>>96614549Are you a GW cock sucker?
>>96614063zesty
>>96614750No, I like the proper heresy aesthetic. Those models don't hit it. Neither do GW these days, but if you're going third party, at least find the good ones.
>>96614766What is proper heresy aesthetic to you? Post some models?
>tacs with phosphex grenades>medic reaction with no medicLuv me beep-boops
>>96614781WTF that should be the death guard inductii
the loss of +1 attack for melee weapon/pistol is actually starting to piss me off.
>>96614781dumb
>>96614781Keys of Hel sheit
>>96614792well there is plenty of 3.0 stuff to be pissed off with, what a mess
>>96614781They get implacable advance too. Imagine a wall of stiff robo-zombies, hidden beneath fully enclosed armor, with obvious woudns that would kill any man, not even flincghing as they get fist sized holes shot into their torso while they repeat robotic pre-programmed battlecries in robotic monotone
>>96614316yeah third ed sucks
>>96614792I think bringing back 1+ attack for CC weapon/pistol is fine. I don’t think getting 1+ attack on the charge makes sense to me. So I’m willing to meet halfway.
>>96614846If you say this while playing second you should be beaten with a stick and have the entire lgs laugh at you
>>96614781
>>96614769More or less anything from the start of heresy up to just before AoD.Also most of the vehicles we've had since.
>>96614605I'm aware, which is why I mentioned running along other vanguard units like gal vorback, so you've got multiple units to secure the kill.
>>96614887>hmm, my scoring units will now never score properly>I know, I should just include more units that will never score properly!
>>96614864Second is superior with some tweaks. Were you beaten as a child?
>>96614881So classic resin FW and manlet 30k plastics? I will agree that is peak heresy despite being manlets.
>>96612467Bump?
>>96614921There are no good auxilia STLs
>>96614902Scoring is based off getting the final blow on a unit controlling an objective, so hedging your bets isn't a bad idea.
>>96614935Vanguard will never trigger, so all you're doing is hedging your bets on losing
>>96614935>>96614887This doesn't help against opponents move reacting off the point, you're doubling down on never scoring
>>96614947they should just change vanguard to also scoring if a unit move reacts off a point. Easy fix.
>>96614920Yes.Some 3rd party creators capture the aesthetic well, but it varies in terms of how consistently and how well, and they usually end up canned by GW as well.
>>96614944>Vanguard will never triggerI think you're just in a very negative mind space.>>96614947It's not ideal, but at least you're removing a unit via pressure and making your opponent use up their resources because they're worried about your basic infantry.
>>96614906It’s not. It’s “bones” are about as high quality as a child’s with leukemia. Oh boy I sure do love the absolute sink or swim mentality of second where you have to either limit/ban units or do mass rebalances of entire libers to make them not insta loose
>>96614982NTA, but the bones of 3.0 are broken glass bro.
>>96614956All they need to do is make scoring happen at the start of turn, so if you want to get your points for holding that objective your opponent actually gets a chance to interact with it.
>everyone focusing in IW inductii having CL8 or INT5>ignoring the fact that you can have a 20 man unit all with shotguns
>>96614971Not the main advantage of the inductii. They’re basically just cheaper despoilers with vanguard that get a good buff when they’re doing well. You’re not going to see their fnp every game but when you do it’s gonna feel great
>>96614998No it’s not lol especially if we’re considering at launch 2.0 as a “good” edition. No army is completely fucked outside of sos custodes like some of the legions in 2.0. I still catch myself feeling good for thousand sons or solar aux players who no longer are being tortured by a slanneshi demon every time they play a game of 2.0. Even dark angels who are one of the worse factions in the game right now aren’t completely fucked like their contemporaries in 2.0. 3.0 needs a faq, 2.0 needs to be old yellered
>>96615026You're right, I just thought having them run alongside gal vorback or other vanguard units would be a good place for them.
>>96614971if anything you should pair up your vanguard units with line units following closely, so you can have your own line guys step on the point after the opponent move reacts theirs off
>>96614998I honestly think the best possible game for HH is comprised of elements from 1.0, 2.0, and 3.0. Some of these elements pulled more from other editions than others. These goes doubly so for legion and setting flavor. I’ve considered combining elements of each legion rule set from every edition to have each legion have a good set of rules, rites, and wargear that are fun to play and fluffy.
>>96615047>I never actually play, I just regurgitate what reddit tells me.Ah, you should have led with that.
>>96615053That's what 60 tacticals are for
>>96615047The fact that scoring is so heavily built in to units kills mission variety (There's a reason they've been so bad at actually getting missions out - only 3 in the base rules, and they're just the same mission with different numbers of objectives). Deep strike fucked, challenges fucked, army comp fucked.You're wrong - a competent F.A.Q. can fix 2.0, and we've seen people house-rule it often enough. I can't think of a core system in 3.0 that doesn't need gutted.
>>96613603I thought SW Inductii were all hand flamers. Or am I thinking of another unit?
>>96615047Fair on TS, but the rest of your post is, at best, of dubious nature. Though I suppose you are right insofar that ALL factions now feel like utter garbage to play, so at least there is more parity.
>>96614571The main thing that Mech lacks relative to Legions is the ability to dump Line 2 onto points round 1 for a relatively low cost. They have no Rhino-equivalent transport and you can't make a Magos fast enough to keep up with a jump pack squad, so your only option is some awkward daisy-chain thing with a Magos in a squad of Thallax. Magi are just incredibly good, though, and Myrmidons are some of the only ranged Vanguard units with enough dakka to actually kill off units.
>>96613603The Thirst – A Leadership Check must immediately be made for each enemy Unit that is not part of the Combatwhich has any Models within 8" of one or more Models from this Unit. If this Leadership Check is failed, then allModels in that Unit gain the Routed Status. This aftermath option is resolved after all other aftermath options fromthe given Combat have been completed.This is pretty insane, although they're also pretty weak so it's hard to trigger.
>>96615067Exemplary Battles. Jorlund Hunters, I think.
>>96614192It feels weird that you can use this without taking the Hereticus army rule in the first place, but yeah, I think that works. 2 base + 1 charging + 1 lost to the nails + 1 dual axes gets you 5 power axe attacks per Red Butcher and another 5 D3 chainfist swings with the sarge, that's pretty monstrous.
>>96615066If you think 2.0 deep strike is fine you deserve to be stuck with 2.0
>They bring back the World Eater Apothecary rules>Its only for the worse hereticus rules > The apothecaries can only join InductiI hate GW so much, its unreal...Why is every rule they bring back so souless...
>>96615095It could use fixing, but 3.0s is much, much worse.
>>96615060>Only running 60 tacsIt's like you don't want to win
ME OWN FOOKIN' SON IS PLAYIN' 3.0
>>96615095I’m not that guy but feel free to correct me here. 1.0 didn’t allow assault out of deep strike but the game had more turns and allowed multiple units to deepstrike a turn. Does the problem get one step closer to being fixed for 3.0 if they just upped the turn count, allowing deepstriking units to get a hold of enemies in CC, and allow mass units to deepstrike if rolls are passed?
>>96615095It was fine, the amount of people I saw that actually tried to abuse deep strike were 0 the entire edition because people understood that it was unfun to play that way. Did you have a playgroup so retarded that you couldn't self regulate and now need GW to completely knee cap a mechanic because you were so bad at playing games with each other?
>>96615101Nah, it's where deep strike should be and where it's been trying to get to for years in 40k, it's only the 2nd edition retard babbies who think it's okay to be able to deploy anywhere and get a free guranteed charge is okay because it only works if your opponent doesn't take the 10 point upgrade for a free shooting phase.
>>96615101>>96615119>>96615128Charging out of deep strike always was and always will be stupid. 1st edition still has the best deep strike rules. 2nd led to stupid unfun play patterns and 3rd edition actually punishes you for using it.
>>96615066Even with the couple of mild annoyances in Mechanicum it's nice to have actual unit variety again. No set of fixes I ever saw for 2.0 let me do anything more interesting than spam slightly nerfed Myrmidons rather than full power Myrmidons, whereas now I have at least some incentive to try every unit in the book except perhaps Vorax. I will happily shuffle detachments around for a minute or two per listbuild in exchange for this much army variety.Deep Strike could use a little help, but I've been pleasantly surprised by the new challenges. It's not the deepest puzzle in the game and Finishing Blow is more juiced than I'd like, but I've had cause to use all the core gambits besides the +1WS only-one-attack one, which does seem completely pointless, and gotten some great moments out of stuff like the Night Lords swapping a chump into a challenge or the Myrmidons blasting their opponent in the face with a darkfire cannon.
>>96615128Are you implying he has a game group, let alone ever actually played even a single game?
>>96615130Well, that's not what I said, but you're either too stupid or too disingenuous to actually discuss it, so I'm gonna stop wasting my time.
>>96615107>tfw you don't have a son anymore
>>96615146I don't get why people are fine with a full melta squad dropping in and firing at full BS, but god forbid a chainsword unit get into combat before turn 3.
>Joining a saturnine praetor to a deathshroud squad I know it's retarded but I don't care, my glorious kings will make their way across the battlefield at a snails pace and thank me for it
>>96615168That's not even that retarded, I'm so retarded I'm joining my saturnine praetor my indomitus terminators!
>>96615160I TAUGHT 'IM BETTER THAN THATME OWN FOOKIN' BOY
>>96613603Huh neat, TS Inductii get to take a volkite caliver per 4 models. Quick, aspirant! Channel the spell "Beginner's Luck"
>>96615146I agree and will move my ruleset back to that.
>Inductii cap at 20I mean shouldn't they be 30 or 40 per squad considering their background of being glorified levy units?
>>96615168>I know it's retarded but I don't careBased.
>>96615194Please no, deploying and manoeuvring around 20 man squads is cumbersome enough already. There's barely enough room to deploy two squads of 20 alongside support units when you have to space out a little for blasts.
>>96615194aside from the fact that 40 man squads would be a pain to move, nothing stops you form taking more squads. It's not like troops slots are in short supply
>>96615194They're still meant to be tactical/despoiler marine replacements, technically. Even if they do their own thing, they still need to adhere at least marginally to the overall outline.
>>96615194>Take a 40 man squad>They get shot with a single status gun >They fail because they have worse mental stats>a single flamer just disabled 40 marinesI don't think that'd be a good idea
>>96615069>utter garbage to playI guess if you think that bending your opponent over the table and raping them so badly they literally cannot win is fun then yeah
>>96615168Heres my 2k list fellas, what do you think? Saturnine praetor with DeathshroudChampion and siegebreaker in rhino with a tac squadSecond tac squadPhosphex Arquitor, 4 phosphex rapiersLeviathan Sicaran ArcusI know I'm kind of fucked against AV14 but sometimes that's how it goes
forty fucking militiamen stamped out of the tail end of the last kilogram of resin i've been working withabsolutely radgonna need twenty more to properly fill out the overseer's complement and finish the backline allowing the bulk tacticals to ADVOOOOOOONCE
>>96615167Is there any danger to the integrity of the game if deepstrikes would be allowed turn 1?
>>96615257Did you ever finish the chonkynators? And did you print anything new after seeing the journal?
>>96615194The tactical equivalents start at 90pts and all of them pay 9pts per body. Weaker mental stats, no primes, and no sergeant equivalent on most of them is a fine enough portrayal, they're still Space Marines. At least, I like this more than 2.0 only really disabling AA sarges and attached characters entirely, seeing that Support Squad made sure hardly anyone used them.
>>96615279I think lore-wise, the legions were coping and treating them just like they would their regular marines, with minor differences. Aside form special cases, the legions at least pretended like they were equal to regular tacticals
>>96615233At least we're both getting some action then, as opposed to blandly staring at each other over a game with as much flavor as wet cardboard.
>>96613603Aren't chargers a bit shit this edition? The DA one could've been a little less dry if they could buy a caliver or culverin for every few odd guys, but still sounds like fun.
>>96615167Because in 1st edition drop podding meltas was less impactful because the most armored vehicles were melta resistant due to Armored Ceramite, duh. Its almost like they had a better grip on the rules back then.
>>96615302Really depends on the legion, but in most cases regular marines looked down pretty hard on inductii. On the extreme ends Guilliman and Dorn both had pretty high expectations of them and Salamanders were very careful with them (as far as the heresy goes, anyway), while IW, WE and IH both had than as little more than broken fodder to do a single job.
>>96615340>because no one took any vehicle without Armored ceramite or artillery FTFY
>>96615273all thirty one of my saturnines are out and proonted, did basically another full squad of tacticals and plenty of neat stuff alongsidewound up stumbling upon some very nicely done combine overwatch soldier .stls and couldn't resist. they're one of the bases for my conception of my eater's flavor outright and make a chef's kiss of a foil to themi think i could have stood to scale them down a little more but they're by all appearances roundly augmented troops anyhow and their size is already impinging on the surface area to dote up pretty heavilylascarbines, i'm thinking. with an appended meltaman.appropriately grisly fellows for eater-helpers <3
>>96615345I think it was a "give your baby brother an unplugged controller so they think they're playing" sort of situation. They can't outright call them Inductiggers and order them to die (unless they're IW) but they do"accidentally" forget to give them extra bolter mags, smaller rations, they get assigned to frontline cannon fodder duty every time, etc>IHThose guys are a special case since they aren't fresh newfags, they're dead veterans brought back as robo-zombies
but yeah the journal only prompted an additional two saturnines to fill out a command group to sixone of them gets twin fists as an excuse to use these gorgeous fucking clawbsseckso!
giving a shot at an FDM marine right now on his SLA supports for shits and giggles with the tail end of the spoolif it's remotely workable he might end up somewhere but if not he'll be terrain ;3i have spare resin helmets and other smol bits in case they're the sticking pointsfun stuff
Having a 2k AL vs DG game soon, any advice for either of us? Will be our first real game of 3.0.Is a unit of 10 seekers overkill at this point level?
>>966137918 Cool is more than enough to seduce and fuck your mom with our implacably advancing pump actions.
>>96615620Score points.
>>96615638anon... shotguns are assault already...
>>96613551>Year is 2030>British government bans 3D printers after GW releases a movie about incels making working Boltguns and shooting up places.
>>96615667GW would absolutely bribe for this
>>96614766Literally every one of those designs is a direct lift from Visions of Heresy.
>>96615345I wish RG inductii were first gen Raptors. Low cool, but I5, A2 and move 8. Capped at 10 and 2 specials. Then for every unit after the first you roll d6+x and on a 5+ they're muratated and lose rifles but become A5 T5.
>>96615441>they aren't fresh newfagsIIRC Siege of Cthonia got into a it a bit more than the blurb in the new pdf does. They are fresh, but they're not made to last. Many of them were dying from radiation poisoning almost as soon as they got inducted.
>>96615013Yeah I don't understand that. I guess it makes them double dip with Pinning shrapnel bolters (3ppm jesus) and Stunning shotguns. I'm not sure I'd give them either.Pity the loss of Fury of the Legion for all inducti except DG LMAO, but IW Inductii Tacs getting Implacable Advance is niceFully Expendable army let's go!
>>96614750are you printing off cocks to suck at home right now?
>>96615713Are these cocks in the room with you right now?
>>96614513Militia don't stop scoring when you shoot them with the big guns
>>96615697I can't remember where but there's a stpry about the keys of hel and it's just random battle brothers that die and get rezzed, losing more and more of their personality. I don't think they mention their level of experience but they also don't mention them being fresh recrutis, so presumably they just take every marines that die. Hell, if they have a set rate at which they can produce these reanimen, then they'd likely want to raise the veterans first since those would be a better baseline (until they eventually degrade into mindless automatons, but hey at least they've got one or two more "lives" in them than fresh recruits). Hilariously this whole process is extremely similar to how Stormcast Eternals work
>>96615667Probably not even a joke. Someone dragged Blair out of his crypt to peddle a >Voters support universal government-mandated digital ID cards(by a wafer thin margin, if we ask incredibly partial and leading questions designed specifically to generate that outcome)report from a thunk tonk.
>>96613968> RHINO RUSHES forward> Lmao can't be shoot!!!!!!!> Just gets assaulted and slaughtered off the obj anywayLmao ALcuck
>>96615667Wouldn't happen. It wouldn't happen because GW is a company manufacturing goods in the UK, which the government would never support.
>>96615667what are you referencing?
>>96615897memetastic short series called adolescence wherein a huwhyte kid is portrayed in his murder of a young girl, with the premise derived from something actually carried out by a somali in the uk
>>96615945but does he 3D print a gun to do it? and did it lead to any kind of legislation? I doubt it since americans can buy handguns next to diapers in supermarkets.
>>96615983I'm gonna go with WB, their inductii do nothing half the time, and kill themselves the other half
>>96615620Ignore AV14Put Line units on objectivesThe winner will probably be clear by the start of turn 3
Which legion has the best Inductii heraldry?
>>96616069eaters of course
>>96616075Yeah, hard to argue with that one. There's some contenders but that is certianly striking. I can't help but feel that they fucked up with the perspective though. These are Mk6 helmets, pointed towards the camera. But the mouth is drawn as if it was on a flat helmet. What does that thing look like from the side?
What exactly is the timeline for WE color schemes? Pre-heresy and early into the heresy they had the classic white and blue scheme, but at some point they switched to red instead of blue, didn't they? But byt 40k, they're fully red. There used to be some lore saying that the red armor was actually just white turned red from all the dried blood but that's so retarded I'm not even gonna entertain it. So when did they switch from blue to red to fully red? And why? Was it the same for every unit?
>>96616105From my understanding>GC to Shadow Crusade: white/blue/brass>Shadow Crusade to Sol Invasion: white/red/brass>Sol Invasion onward: red/brassThere are always exceptions both in the Heresy and after it (there's a canon Khorne Berserker warband that still rocks the white and blue on 40k)
>>96615953I don't think hes making that specific of a reference.
>>96615945Wait it was actually a Somali?
>>96616069Several of these are wrong. Just somebody at GW nonsensically using images of vets for inductii, and contradicting their own fluff elsewhere.
>>96615945Wait that dude was Rwandan, and the show was written and scripted BEFORE he stabbed and murdered those kids
>>96616105What >>96616166 said. Also the change to red was heavily correlated to WE units being closer to the Conqueror fleet.
>>96615098And Red Butchers. they can join them as well.
>2x20 Asphyx TS Inductii>2x10 Tacs in RhinosI'm doing it. It's probably going to hurt me on scoring but I don't care.
>>96616105as best i understand it:>What exactly is the timeline for WE color schemes?they would have gone into the heresy in pretty much full white and blue with of course plenty of variance here and there as texture might arise individual by individual, company by company, and squad by squad potentially.in and from there is the process of becoming increasingly and indeed coated in red. just by virtue of what they're up to the practice is started by painting one's self with the blood of the fallen or otherwise letting it just cake. this can take the form of singular sections of armour around a suit being shifted from blue to red or whatever, or an individual maybe going for an entirely red coat on his plate. both have been given rendition in visions and all the books and such. suits amidst the heresy seem also to be given properly applied or, factory-red paintjobs in some instances. all throughout their corundum(?) optical lenses and instruments of all sorts are tinged green generally speaking at least, eyes and suchthey tend to go for very utilitarian-looking patterns of metallic sections, blemished silvers and frequently seem to like brassy metallic trim all over otherwise
>>96616069why is death guard night lordsmy favorite is night lords
>>96616281death guard is george formby
>>96616166>>96616105NTA but WE are depicted in white and blue at the start of the siege and full red and brass by the end. It's only art but if you wanted a timeline its probably white and blue up to the first battle for Lion's Gate Spaceport on Terra, then white and red up to Warhawk and Kharn's defeat (second battle for Lion's Gate spaceport just after Saturnine) and finally turning full red and brass in time for the battle for the eternity gate, possibly inspired by Angron being around a lot and the khornate influence reaching its peak/
>>96616210There are WD articles about the schemes, which ones are "wrong"?
>>96616304i like these hypotheses
>>96615098Where does it say they need to be using those rules? Pretty sure the "normal" trait can take it too. And theh can join Red Butchers too to stack buffs and become what'a likely the killies unit in the game. How does Medic! Interact with EW anyways?
>>96616317here's the art
>>96615718I don't think so I'm not printing any
>>96616247Remember rhinos can fit 12 dudes
>>96616210>be me>post-human chimera of human and artificial genetics>wearing ultra-advanced powered, armoured warplate>carrying rocket-boosted .50 cal pistol and monomolecular tooth-edged chainblade as standard armaments>don't sleep, shid and fart in suit and it recycles it into nutrients>supplement nutrients with anything I can, like dead enemies>until month before last I was an eight year old boy>now I'm a seven-foot tall roidrage in my birthday suit>only vaguely remember past life before all the surgeries and hypnotic indoctrination>distinct sense of unease about being forced to fight for space dad's approval but rolling with it>hear a voice from about two feet lower than my ears>"eeerhm akshually your HERALDRY is WRONG and you shouldn't be MIXING ARMOUR MARKS you HEATHEN">dinner time
>>96616304So they went through three color schemes in 5 ish months? And they said EC were fashion-obsessed...
>>96616334Are those flaming arrows? What the fuck were they shooting sangy with?
>>96616364Highest functioning WE inductii
Really wish the FW books weren't so rare and expensive to find as second hand. Legion red books were pretty cheap, but the Army, Mechanicum and rulebook cost a pretty penny.
>>96616417MTO black books any day now haha...
>>96616314This was discussed here when these WD articles were published. They just chose "interesting" paint schemes over accuracy for the purpose of the articles. For example, the RG crow skull is a veteran icon, and they showed RG inductii with plain armour in previous books, which is way more fitting. The crunch vs fluff is also all over the place, since not all Inducttii were basic troops, there were also inductii officers, and some legions mixed them among old units instead of creating new ones. The BA "inductii" is from an indepent company closer to a Blackshield, and not part of the BA under Sanguinius in Terra or the dudes still at Baal.And so on.
>>96616372Those are bolter shells hitting the stairs and exploding next to spears.
>>96616478RG didn't even have inductii in the true sense until induction rules came out. They got shoehorned in. They had first and second gen Marines+ with advanced gene tech the Emperor personally handed to Corax. The first gen were inexperienced, rash, but stupid fast and strong. They gave veterans a run due to sheer stats in hand to hand but were often overzealous and prone to charging in like idiots. Second batch were the mutated ones AL fucked up that Corax was a bitch about.
>>96615638>>96615662Though, since IW Inductii are cheaper while losing Fury of the Legion, would it make sense to just throw shrapnel bolters on them instead, or is it just a retarded way to make them more expensive than the Tacticals again?
>>96616339True, but I don't have anything I want to stick with them. I'm running a jetbike libby, sorcerer, and termi warmonger. Or do you mean 12 tacticals? Interesting but I have exactly 20 MKII.
>>96616473>9 books at £100+ a pop...
>basic tacs have IN 7>basic inductii have IN 6>IW inductii have IN 5Is this another Forgebreaker situation? Perturabo makes his legionaries more retarded in order to surprise any enemies who expect his legionaries to only be normal levels of retarded?
>>96616628They're not trained to operate Microsoft office.
>>96616628Probably more like IW inductii aren't taught anything, because most will die within 30 minutes of their first deployment anyway.
>>96616628Their original fluff is that they were just barely more than servitors with astartes bodies. They were lobotomized and didn't really have much more than targeting protocols and pathfinding routines in their head. I guess Perty figured that was more efficient than actually indoctrinating and training these kids to be capable legionaries.
>>96616561They're called Raptors and I'm mad they're not in the game. Give them pseudo Gal Vorbak rules without malefic
>>96616628>Welcome to the Iron Tenth son! Here's your bolter, here's your helmet (optional). See that guy with angel wings? Go kill him!
>>96616748;_;
>>96616756Perturabo servitorizing inductii and using them as props for pretending he's actually Ferrus and in charge of a different legion than his own is pretty amusing.
>>96616561You confuse the 30k mutant Raptors with the actual RG inductii fresh out of Kiavahr that joined the Legin just before the Battle of Yarant (like the one in the image)In the fluff, most inductii were just noobs without special pros or cons except their inexperience. The basic 1W tactical/despoiler profiles are probably the best way to represent them. Only schizos like WE/WB/IH fucked with their geneseed to make them faster or whatever
>>96616786He probably uses them as the OpFor in his little wargames, since them being his enemies but even more retarded than his own sons is the only way that he'll ever win for real.
>>96616765Of course they had to sneak in a "Nevermore" in there
>>96616786whoops. Chalk it up to dishonest recruitment strategies
>>96616811You just know Perturabo held live-fire exercises for every stage of training
>>96616816Thought it has always been pretty obvious which poet GW drew inspiration from for Corax, just like Johnson was named after that one gay poet.
>>96616805yeah it is a gimmick and makes no narrative sense, realistcally inductii would just be cheaper tactical marines with worse leadership
There doesn't seem to be anything stopping 1kSons Inductii from loading up the whole squad with Asphyx Bolters for Rending 6+, and the power they can cast 72% of the time gives them Breaching 6+, so every single Inductii blob now has a lesser version of the Corvidae autocannon cheese. 250pts gets you 20 marines with Asphyx + Nuncio-Vox, and they'll kill a Contemptor in one round of fire or deal 12W to MEQ/5W to Cataphractii if Aetheric Guidance goes off. Two squads firing will easily kill a Saturnine Dread.
>>96615047What they did to 3.0 SoS is unforgivable
>>96616963Delay the codex and give us a PDF to cope?
>>96616805>Only schizos like WE/WB/IH fucked with their geneseed to make them faster or whateverThere's a neat little point about the IF foregoing the implantation of certain organs in order to speed up the rate of induction during their mass conscription effort on Terra. Having more bodies in the garrison was viewed as more important than for all the defending legionaries to have Betcher's glands.I think that goes nicely to explain why inductii programs were not commonplace before the HH. In just seven years the IF would cause irreparable damage to their gene-seed, which had been stable for centuries by that point.
>>96616939TS are OP, what else is new?
>>96615667Blacks are already at work with knives, no need for boltguns n sheit
>>96616939Thanks for pointing that out I'd forgotten about asphyx bolters
>>96617029Kinda fucked up how the inductii program still had consequences for the legions' geneseed 10k years down the line.
>>96616219No that was another blavk guy
>>96615953First he stole a bike and then he stole a 3d printer.
>>96616331>Where does it say they need to be using those rules? Lost to the Nails is only a Hereticus rule, if you dont have that tactica, you dont have the Nails Bite, nor can be Lost to the Nails.> And theh can join Red Butchers too Good luck ever getting a charge off with a Cata unit. My Red Butchers are abysmally bad because having no set up is cancer.
>>96615667>"You wouldn't download a car">Ha ha 3D printer goes brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
>>96617029What does the betchers glands do again?
>>96617073Let marines spit acid. The corrosive sort, not the trippy stuff.
>>96617073Add acid to a marine's saliva that allows them to spit poison into opponents' eyes and chew through plasteel giving enough time.
3.0 Inductii power rankings>SBA. The ability to spook 25% of the opponents army is pretty crazy, pair them with a big blender character.DG. Access to multiple flamers and rotor cannons, tank shooting casualties, fury of the legion, these guys are insane.Sallies. As the only inductii mob that can spam up to 6 thunder hammers and 2 disintegrator blasters, these guys are a real threat even to TEQ.>AIH. Phospex and augmenticsDA. Volkite is scary in 3.0, the ability to potentially delete an enemy 1W MEQ squad of the same size is worth the downgrade to Line 1UM. The flexibility of the equipment spread + anti-routing rules are great.>BWE. Vanguard 3 is good but heedless is a major downside. Still, there are worse troops choices.IW. But only if you bring enough shotguns and shrapnel bolters to status opposing units.SW. The rush+charge is a very good trait.NL. This guys are kinda ass BUT breaching precision + art of murder can wreak havoc if used smartly.TS. Breaching asphyx bolters.RG. An odd but not useless unit.AL. Combi-weapons and treacherous lure are good, but limited.>C.WS. A really odd unit, they almost seem like an anti-Vanguard unit. Useful applications for tarpitting.IF. Pinning is good, but needing to stand around is not.SoH. Average melee selection but the ability to gain Impact (S) or get stunned is not good.WB. Potentially a big problem if they don't die or kill themselves.>D.EC. They got style, they got grace, but where's the meat?
>>96617107I think DA should be A+, not quite S tier but its better then you think.Stick a moritat in there with them, and they get firestorm now. They dont fire at full BS, but they can charge, fire volley fire, and then chose not the finish the chargePlus Moritat rad greandes makes it gross.
>>96617107>DA inductii still goodDammit, still have to build that 20 man vokite charger squad now, and already have too many shit to build and paint with how many units are viable and fun now.
>>96617107>World EatersThey are complete trash, your never getting Vanguard off and Heedless makes them completely useless when the opponent steps off. Your just bringing worse despoilers.
>>96617090>>96617094Cool thanks anons
>>96617061I'm pretty sure you have lost to the nails anyways. It's a rule in the same rulebook. Same deal as some legion units having inferno pistols despite only WB having the rules for them, it's in the book so you just pull it form elsewhere. So "loyalist" WE can get lost to the nails as well
>>96617107You're not buying THs for fucking inductii
>>96617107So AL are the real winners again, since they are all legion specific units, and therefore also AL units.
>>96617221That's why no one will remember you
>Why do Salamander inductii get so many toys?>These Inductii were often granted wargear taken from slain warriors of the Legion, accepting both the honour this bestowed, and the expectation it brought. Awesome
>>96617247Meanwhile>"My primarch, the inductii lobotomies are complete.">"Good, now bolt helmets into their skulls so I don't have to see their drooling retard faces."
>>96617247
>>96617217>So "loyalist" WE can get lost to the nails as wellYou mean "worse despoilers" can get lost to the nails. Your only joining Red Butcher who dont need a primaris apothecary, or our shitty inducti that suck. If apothecaries could join any unit, it would be so much nicer.
>>96617320Red Butchers with 5A each on the charge are pretty great for their cost, admittedly. Probably worth the Apothecarion Detachment to have around.
>>96617107TS are A or S tier, rending breaching bolters en masse is crazy, even at 6+. Smattering some calivers is actually pretty nice.. They exist to mulch other scoring and cant take out a termi or two if needed.RG are C tier, its their old rule but now that stun and suppress exist they are still gimped by 2/3 of statuses. One nemesis per 10 is token pinning I guess. Should have had infiltrate.>>96617244Except TS, of which you need to be TS to use arcana.
>>96617414They're EW 1 too, so in combination with the Medic! reaction from the apoth they can shrug off D2 shooting.
>>96615373This looks like shit, you might as well be using plastic army men. This isn’t even kitbash, it’s just shitting half-life into heresy. Grow up
>>96617414>>96617320>>96617217>>96617061What I dont understand, is can my Apothecary join non Mad units with the mad keyword, it says a unit with the rule can only be joined by other mad units, but apothecaries arent joined, they join units.
>>96617463oh fuck it's Moritats all over again
>>96617463If they could, this would be a fantastic buff, its a shame only one Apothecary can easily get the prime buff.
>>96617320>>96617414>dont need a primaris apothecarythey do if it gives them extra attacks and makes them even tougher to kill. These guys get to primarch levels of damage mitigation while being unholy rape machines. I wouldn't be surprised if they can output enough AP2 to brute force their way through most elite termie deathstars on the charge>>96617442How do the rules interact? Does this mean they can turn dmg 3 hits into dmg, and dmg 2 into 0?
>>96617320>worse despoilers>same weapon access>cheaper>T5 after charging>literally 12% less likely to take a W from MEQ on the charge>can be given an upgrade that allows you to simply become [10.10.10.10] forever at the cost of ... +1A forever and 3" King Set-up>Hereticus has a special detachment made for this>can now put same upgrade on Red Butchers>it costs... 30 pointsmy man if you think you'd have a better time with 3 additional Despoilers go for it
>>96617500>These guys get to primarch levels of damage mitigation while being unholy rape machinesAnd then you fail your charge because your a Cataphractii unit. Cata units suck these days.
>>96617513>WS 4Good luck wiping literally anything when your hitting on 5s or get shot to piss on the way in. Despoilers are the worst unit in the game right now, investing anything into them is so stupid when Rampagers do the same role with WS 5.
>>96617517They can only charge 1d6+1 instead of 1d6+3, whatever shall we do? If only there was some sort of carrier to take them into combat. Perhaps one that would help them raid the enemy's land. It would need enough room to take 5 bulky models and a character though, I don't think there's such a thing in the rulebook. If only.
>>96617500>How do the rules interact?EW 1 reduces incoming damage by, to a minimum of 1. Recovery saves reduce unsaved damage taken by 1, to a minimum of 0. Far as I know there's nothing saying these don't stack. It wouldn't entirely negate 3 dmg hits, but each butcher dying to a 3 dmg hit has a 50/50 chance of surviving on 1 wound.
>>96617500If I'm doing my maths right, a large number of Red Butchers with the axes vs an identical number of "standard" elite terminators with thunder hammers trade exactly evenly if the RBs benefit from both the loyalist +1A and Lost To The Nails.The hammers hit harder, but EW negates the damage advantage and the axes have more attacks while swinging first, so if you have sufficiently large squads then enough of the generic 3A WS5 hammer cataphractii will die before they can swing to even out the damage. In smaller squads it's going to be more swingy, but a combination of the RB being considerably cheaper and the sarge having the D3 chainfists probably evens it out.
>>96617608that's disgustingly resilient, imagine those fuckers facetanking three lascannon array shots before dropping, or completely ignoring regular lascannon shots (with the heavy boost too!). Even meltas go down to dmg 1, and that's when they get past the 4+ invul. Actually, how many fucking melta shots does it take to kill one of these guys?
>>96617647*two, for some reason I was thinking they were 3W each
>NL inductii basically have 2e charnabal weapons base for 100 pts>you can stick them in a rhino with a havoc launcher for stun checks to boos them to WS5honestly probably better than chainsword despoilersnow to find some funny little knives for them
>>96617647Models only are allowed one recovery save, and it is rolled before you remove casualties. So even if all red butchers suffer an unsaved wound from melta weapons, if you roll enough 4 ups they'll all keep standing on one wound. The medic reaction is a bit weird in how it works.
>just finished a 5man rotor squad and a 5man flamer squad.>Have exactly 40 tac marines ready to go>The new inductii rules drop>I have a game on Sunday Grandfather blesses me once more
>>96617695Reiver knives are the perfect size.
>>96617695Model them barehanded but with their dicks out
>>96617699Wait, you roll Recovery after allocating all the wounds and rolling all the saves? The box explaining Recovery Tests in the legacies doc says it happens "when you allocate a wound", which would presumably happen in such a way that you roll a save, roll recovery, assign damage for that save, then roll the next save, but the Medic! reaction itself says Step 11, which would in fact leave you with a bunch of wounded guys in an incredibly janky way.
>>96617742apothecaries are a contender for fuckiest rules in the game, medic more or less works on 2trust me bro". Play the rule however you want, because it's unlikely your opponent will actually know how it really works
>>96617742Yeah it needs an FAQ or errata clarification if you ask me, it's kinda confusing how it works now.
Is there anyone uploaded forges of saturn yet? I want to read the new fluff.
>>96617749>>96617742>>96617752To this day one of the worst things GW did in 3.0 is, for no fucking reason, because no one asked for it, and no one even complained about it, they randomly changed how Apothecaries work. Honestly im about half tempted to say "Fuck it" and house rule it so that Apothocaries cost 20 points more so 50 base, and they give the unit a 5++ FNP, and only a primus medice can go into a terminator unit and he gives a 5++ But can spend a reaction to do a 3++
>>96617798What do you want to know about it?
>>96617798Ill save you the time. >Behold this super ultra rare and exotic form of terminator amor, bigger, stronger, and more intimidating then the last, requiers massive amounts of resources, time, and energy to be able to assemble its esoteric forms>Oh by the way legions literally have almost a hundred of these suits just laying around and despite you know being in the middle of the biggest supply line cluster fuck due to the civil war, we were able to build a bunch of these suits.>Dont ask questions just consoom.
>>96617801it was obviously intended to be a nerf, but why they didn't jsut worsen the fnp save or increase their cost is beyond me. Sure fnp gets better now that ID is gone but there's better ways than this poorly worded mess
>>96617814Thing was FNP 5++ was not even that OP like it was a nice extra buff but FFS Apothocaries were already in the elite slot, which was a section of the FOC that was already fought over by a lot of other units, so it was not like Apoths were all over the place you kinda almost had to build for them.Like just increase them to 50 or 60 points, give them a 5++ FNP and make a special rule in the FNP from apothecaries that say "If the strength of an attack is double the targeted models toughness, they can not take a FNP save from this special rule." Boom problem fucking solved.
>>96614513>An infantrymen squad only costs 10 points less than a tactical squadWhat the hell are you on about?An Infantry squad is 20 models base
I buy all my recasts from aliexpress
>>96617801I’m not justifying the over complication of 3.0. But the medic reaction is simple in the vein of roll your armour save, roll for FNP/Shrouded, then roll for 4+ medic reaction. Or is the debate about what comes first Eternal Warrior or Medic! 4+?
>>96617843Sime does not always mean good. The change to Apothocaries made them such dog shit there is no reason to take them now. Out of all the games i have played i have only ever seen an apothecary fielded ONCE, and it was me. If it was a free reaction? maybe sure.
So it begins...
>>96617859I found apothecaries to be quite useful still. The narthenicum helps prevent status effects, and it gives melee units like despoilers a reaction they can use.
>>96618008Im not saying they dont have a use, but they are realyl really not worth it anymore. They were nerfed for no real reason.
>>96618014Apothecaries are only 30 points. Give them a power sword, put then in a despoiler squad and they'll earn their points back killing tactical marines. The narthenicum and medic reaction are basically a free bonus.
>>96617969Are you going to sculpt the massive cloak out of GS?
>>96617859>>96618008I really don't like how they've implemented reactions because they are wildly imbalanced.Some reactions are absurdly more useful than others.Some units are frequently going to be able to/want to react, while others (often attacking melee units) have little to no reason to use them.And i get the feeling GW is just trying to double down on reactions by making MORE things reactions, which only makes them worse.This is on top of the general shittiness of reactions being a meta concept - in the literal sense of being player tokens, not something inherent to individual units.It takes away from the wargaming aspect when (you) the player, decides if 1 unit can activate their neurons and react to something, which then means other units brains shut off because you ran out of tokens for the turn.Reactions would be better if it simply existed as a type of action, but there was not a set number of reactions you can preform per turn. Instead it just remains 1 reaction per unit per turn, and they are all balanced around this fact.
>>96618043Nah that'd be shit. Now you gotta make decisions on which units use which reactions, and can try bait out reactions so you can punish other units. Adds a layer of tactical decisions to the game. If all units could always use their reaction there wouldn't be any reason not to do reactions with all units all the time.
>>96617859>>96617843This is lame and I don't like it. Standard FnP mechanics please and thank you.
>>96618043>I really don't like how they've implemented reactions because they are wildly imbalanced.Personally i think the reaction system in general is a bad system. It turns the game into a series of gottems that is not fun. I dont like them in 2.0, i dont like them now, i dont like them in any system espeically if its tied to an economy because then it just becomes a game of "Who has the best economy." If they wanna do a reaction system, they need to remove the economy behind it, and standardize it all, for example, if you are shot, you as a unit can chose to either return fire, which is just shooting back at Snapshots, or going to ground so you get a cover save. If you do either you cant do any sort of reactions in the following phases. In teh charge chase you can over watch or brace.The reaction system is just a bad system that causes more unbalance then it fixed it also HIGHLY incentivizes max squads to abuse them even more.
>>96618081Thats what im saying, just go back to a 5++ for the group. Since ID is gone just say that if the weapon str is double the toughness of the model making this save, you don't get a FNP save.
>>96617969That's badass. Grab a Pteruges bit from wherever or sculpt your own and that is gonna be one nice looking dude. I also want to make a one-off Mk1 for my Luna Wolves and then one other clad in grey to be used for Ghost Legion AL/Blackshield/Dusk Raiders.
>>96618032They aren't 30pts, its the cost of the hero or prime slot to unlock the detachment as well.
>>96618043>Reactions would be better if it simply existed as a type of action, but there was not a set number of reactions you can preform per turn.we had Overwatch as an any-unit ability from mid RT (after it was ported in from Space Hulk, which specifically uses Action Points and allows you to spend them to set conditional Actions to take place in the other player's turn) until 7E/7.5E/HH1it wasn't better and the cost of using it dropped massively over that time (originally you had to place a token and forego that unit's shooting/movement if you wanted them to Overwatch in the following player turn, but even that went hand-in-hand with broken shit like Pop-Up Attacks on skimmers)Reactions are fine, what you're asking for isn't really a non-finite set of Reactions per turn (which would be unwieldy, with all the movement, shooting, charges etc taking place) but free Overwatch, because you're a fucking Tau playerwould you like some target painters too you absolute blueberry, why don't you roll on down to the juicing floor immediately and collect your NCC-1701 warsuit while you're at it
Lorgar and Erebus have gotten their respective derangements discussed to death, but what in the goddamn was this guy's problem?
>>96618109I'm swimming in detachments anyway after taking utility commanders
>>96618125That Lorgar bussy got bro acting zesty
>>96618125He was too right about everything to liva as a well-adjusted member of society.
>>96618125You'll get it when you get older.
>>96618125The introduction of the astartes severely reduced the little boy population that he could rape.
can anons check out these necron rules for 3rd ed heresy? I think getting some comments on it would be good to send back to the creatoreven I think theres a few issues with it, such as>c'tan being way too strong for the cost and LoW slot>monolith being LoW slot>the gauss rule (called entropic) deleting tanks and dreadnoughtsbut theres a nice unit selection of old and new stuff
>>96618244>FORGETS TO FUCKING LINK IThttps://files.catbox.moe/j1lukp.pdf
>>96618075>If all units could always use their reaction there wouldn't be any reason not to do reactions with all units all the timeYes, thats exactly my point.Previously we had things in 1e/40k7e and further back that were 'reactions' in all but name, but they were balanced around the assumption that all units could use them.i.e. infantry going to ground to self pin for better cover saves, 6+ to hit overwatch etc.Current reactions are a fucking nightmarish mess of really shitty reactions, really strong reactions, and certain unit types that can easily abuse reactions or will rarely ever use them at all.
>>96618125Old man basically is what the boomers are going through. They are shitting themselves because they realize their time has passed and their relevancy is no more. Does literally everything he can to stay relevant.
>>96618085Yeah, thats exactly what I mean.Every unit can react once per turn (as they do currently) but no fucking player based economy of choosing which units can activate their brains.>>96618113>but free Overwatch, because you're a fucking Tau playerI play world eaters with massed despoilers, but ok anon.You also ignored half of what I said of 'reactions would need to be BALANCED around the fact that all units could do one, per turn. So yes, certain stuff like 'free fucking shooting phase' would need to be tuned down or have actual downsides.
>>96617805I was curious about the War of Bitter Iron, and the Kolarne-Distal Incident.
>>96618267NTA, but if you're doing that I think you might as well just go to full alternating activations in movement/shooting/charging, which accomplishes the same goal of making the opponent's turn vaguely interactive without requiring a lot of faffing around trying to balance extra action economy.
>>96618267but you're also calling for them to be unlimitedyou're not supposed to put actual nails in your brain, anon
>>96618315NTA but! i mena at that point yeah but the thing is, reactions are GW basically trying everything in their power to NOT do alternating activation. Its basically a shittier worse version of alternating activations. GW either needs to go full on with AA, or get rid of reactions because right now its the worst of both worlds.
>>96618268>the Kolarne-Distal Incident.A joint research station of the TS and WS was located in space near the Maelstrom by the HH's outbreak. Part of their job had been to assist in Vulkan's Saturnine program. When the HH broke out they were isolated and got no news at first.Eventually a ship of the WS arrived and announced that all the TS had to die on orders from the Emperor. The WS garrison under the presiding stormseer did not agree with this. Fighting broke out and all the attacking WS were killed. They may have been members of Hibou Khan's brotherhood, which was attempting its coup in the Prospero system around this time, at least according to the aforementioned stormseer's writings.After the battle the WS and TS mutually agreed to empty the research station of anything valuable, Saturnine technology and other psyarkana, and departed to separately rendezvous with their respective legion in order to find out where they stood.Instances of both cohorts' materiel being used in battle were documented during the war, so it is likely they each had a successful reunion with their parent legion.
>>96618244Get out
>>96618332its heresy rules for necrons dummy
>>96618034Was not planning on it, but I'll have to see once things start coming together if he'll need one.>>96618102Various cingulum militare bits I do have and him having one is in the cards, once we get to that phase.
>>96618321unlimited in the sense that there is no limit to the number of units per turn that can react, anon.So yes, 6 different units should be able to go to ground in the same turn, or whatever. Not that a single unit should be able to react move off a point, return fire, and overwatch in the same turn.
>>96618374You don't seem to understand the joke it's not a joke.
>>96618648>>96618648>>96618648
>>96618329Thank you anon
>>96617810That’s not what it says lmao. Salamanders who were the main ones producing them had 100 at their peak that mostly died at istvann. With how the books written there are maybe 1000 max for the totality of the heresy throughout all legions lmao. Enough for the odd company to have a squad or two but they are certainly the least common armor in the heresy even with every legion having the plans to produce them
