>>96662213
Never used the allies chart for anything in any edition of Warhammer ever. Ain't gonna tell me who my friends are.

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>>96662213
Allies chart was lame and gay, all hail 3.0

>>96662213
with the strict Loyalist/Traitor division of units, the Allies Matrix was pretty dead weight

Levels of Allegiance made a certain amount of sense but at some point you have to ask why eg Lorgar would continually be questin with a bunch of daemon obsessed Thousand Sons he doesn't get along with at all

>>96662213
Came from another time.
A decent idea, but it was never expanded on the way it needed to be.

>>96662213
another narrative play victim of the 40k mentality behind 3.0. No one who wants narrative should touch 3.0 with a barge pole.

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>>96662620
grogs gunna grog, go home macca you are fat and gay.

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>Be me, playing 2nd game of 3.0. Big midfield objective mission
>Opponent went first, put a tactical squad on it before I charged him with my own tactical squad. He is 5VP ahead because of this
>No worries, I'm not retarded and know how Vanguard. So I have a unit of power maul terminators ready and charge the existing melee on the second turn.
>Just need to kill 7 enemy tacticals with my own 7 tacticals and 10 power maul attacks and I score 8VP. Making them run works too so this a sure fire, big brain strategy.
>Initiative Step 4
>mfw my 7 tacticals give it their 300%, hit with everything, wound with everything and the opponent fails all of his saves, loosing all models
>mfw the opponent does the EXACT SAME FUCKING THING
>Terminators are left there wondering what the fuck just happened
>Can't trigger Vanguard since they didn't actually get to attack
>Can't score pity VP because they are not actually in range of the objective themselves
So how are your dice treating you this edition /hhg/?

>>96662213
The allies chart as it existed in heresy was dogshit because it wasn't there for lore (otherwise word bearers wouldn't have had such shitty ally options) and it wasn't there for balance (otherwise custodes wouldn't be sworn brother with every loyalist faction). It was just a shifty leftover of a system that was there to stop you from allying Eldar to Chaos Daemons and trying to apply it to a conflict where there's infinite justifications for why two forces would be best buddies or bitter enemies despite the allegiance of their larger organizations.

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>eying up Tortuga Bay stuff
>don't live in the Americas or Europe
>options are either paying extra to consolidate it to the US, or paying half in trusting a slav postal service

Fuck

>>96662267

This.
I don't care about which Primarchs were friends or who was campaigning together decades ago. Its my doods, I should be able to decide who their friends were.
If my shitty backwater garrison has spent the last 50yrs training the local PDF, I should be able to trust them on an objective regardless of my wider Legion reputation.

>>96662886
>>96662886
>before I charged him with my own tactical squad. He is 5VP ahead because of this
First mistake. Tacticals should never be in melee. So long as you can put one more toe on it, either by placement or shooting his off with other units, that should be your goal. You would have tied and potentially got first strike if you lined up on them. You would have had vanguard scored too.

Never ever charge with your Line units for any reason ever. They are there to score, not get locked in CC and disable their scoring.

>>96662620
but with "bring whatever" you are open to whatever narrative argument you want? The only thing stopping you from playing narrative stuff is yourself in this. This is a horrible argument.

>>96662213
>tq
Good
It never made any fucking sense
It's retarded that you couldn't make armies that feature in the lore with traitor loyalists or loyalist traitors just because the original legions didn't get along

>>96662213
>tq
Yeah it was retarded. Cool to see on a legion wide level but it made little to no sense for individual forces. Word bearers would absolutely work with traitor ultramarines despite calth. Loyal iron warriors would work with fists etc

>>96663132
Yeah it's going to be down to individual commanders not the whole legion of 100k marines

>>96662213
>Thread Question
I liked the matrix in the sense it gave you insight into the legion relationships, but it makes more sense now that it's gone. I have a bit of nostalgia for it, if only because the game launched with it.

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>>96662298
Coincidentally, AoS it's just a better game than HH.
And if you don't play both games you are missing out

>>96663475
I dunno, 4th edition sucked so much of the fun of the rules out of the game
I'm really tired of GW dumbing everything down to try to reach an increasingly retarded market

>>96663536
What would you have them do? They are faced with a populace of unprecedented retardation. They can either try to sell more models to an increasingly aging population of grogs who are dying from fast food induced heart failure, or they can try to market towards younger people who have never read a book in their lives and only know how to play roblox. To make a better game you need a target audience that is capable of playing a better game.

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Militia baneblade built. I am probably just a simpleton, but plastic kits needn't be more complex than this in the sense of parts. This kit has less than half the parts a Spartan has.

>>96663536
My gripes with AoS 4.0 are oddly similar to HH 3.0 despite the rulesets being so different. I actually really like the core rules of both systems, but the army rules and listbuilding are depressingly lacking.

>>96663619
Agree. It also makes it easy to be able to convert for swapping guns etc

>>96663475
It's certainly a better designed game and does the best job of any current GW game of having a magic system and of having factions be distinct and unique, however the current edition has cancer list building and bad scoring rules (hence they keep rewriting them every GHB), there's also a bit of a deficiency in list building variety. I'd call it equivalent to HH 3.0, but obviously the general design of the game is much different.

>>96663826
For me Core rules of 3.0 i give like a 7/10.
They got some really good ideas but some really really shitty ones, poor designs and just badly written rules in some cases.

But the army rules? Holy fuck, like 4/10

>>96663619
There does seem to be a trend of shit having more plastic parts than they actually should. Outside of a certain case of missing undercarriages.

>>96663930
>good ideas
With poor execution. Making mental stats matter is cool, but the various statuses are kinda fucked up. Especially in application.

Mission scoring is so fucked up top to bottom I'm not sure how to fix it. Progressive is the right way to go, but it skews too much with line bonuses. Maybe scoring the objective is the start of the turn but line is at the end. A way to have a bonus "I have boots on the point" for your turn but the bigger chunk of points is for staying on it and actually risking vanguard. It means everyone has a chance to get some points but reward s ore complex tactical plays.

A lot of weapons are just bad for no reason. All the combi specials minus volkite and maybe flamers are awful. Melta is in a bad spot. Maximal plasma should be D2 minimum across the board.

>>96664304
>10th edition slop: the post

>>96664335
>10th invented scoring at the start of the turn
>10th also has scoring st the end of the turn now somehow?
>10th invented statuses
Are you the one who thought the battle mat that's older than some GW games was AI slop?

People love to shit on 10th but not everything it does is awful. The main issues are extreme lethality, unrestricted listbuilding and the character system. But there's things it does right as well. The CP system feels more interesting than reactions and gambits

>>96664348
Man is just so buck broken that he sees 10th edition everywhere.

>>96662969
>First mistake. Tacticals should never be in melee.
I don't think he was wrong to do this. After a Vanguard unit does its thing if it is the only think on the objective you get.... 1 point for holding it no matter what. If you are confident you will crush you opponent off an objective you should be trying to get your Line units on there.
If you go in With a tac squad as well as your blender unit you can get all the points of the objective +Line 2. That is a massive swing.

>>96663587
They could have used their unprecedented covid windfall to do a share buyback, take the company private again, and never deal with shareholders demanding endless unsustainable growth again, freeing them from the necessity to cater to normies and retards, but their management are the same empty-souled Line Go Up business majors that run everything these days so they just piled more cash on the moneyfire.

>>96664368
Probably because subhumans keep coming here and into 30K groups and saying shit like this fucktard >>96664366.

>>96662969
>So long as you can put one more toe on it
Why tf would the opponent let you do that if they got into the objective first?

>>96663619
Yeah the plastic contemptor went full retard like with the arms, just look at the old gingerbread calth contemptor arms, much simpler and better design.

>>96664366
neither CP nor reactions or gambits are interesting. CP is just a stat to encourage you to take core units, which is a problem GW made for themselves, that is at least partially responsible for the L shaped hellscapes of the modern competitive scene. Gambits require no tactical thought whatsoever, its just a gimmick you pick to extend the length of challenges with no statistical difference in outcome from stats alone. Reactions are probably the worst of the three, again to solve a problem GW made for themselves, requiring no tactical play whatsoever to artificially shorten games and make turns more lethal. When will retards like you learn that its the same fucking braindead corp hires making every GW game, there's a reason they all suck, require constant errata and editions and serve only to keep the treadmill running?

>>96664586
Stratagems are worse than reactions because many of them are reactions and also there are an enormous number of them.

>>96664413
You don't need to risk it with a charge. You can just take the extra VP right then and there by simply standing on the point. Charging with those tacs lost points for no gains because you can't score in melee. It snowballed with bad rolling. The bad rolling didn't need to happen in the first place. It's like people who think punting the objective in deploy servo skulls at an angle think it sets them up for better plays. It never does.

>>96664586
>>96664614
Just drop the gambits and reactions, scrap them. Retard additions.

>>96664507
How are they going to stop you? Do you propose they are going to always have perfectly screen the control area? Always sacrifice their line to vanguard to deny your line?

>>96664366
>People love to shit on 10th but not everything it does is awful.
Go read a 3.5E chaos, Gray knights, or guard codex and the 4th ed rules of 40k then weep for the game and your own ignorance.

>>96664643
I was just thinking about when the enemy has the point and you can only get a Line on there with a charge. If you don't have to charge to get the Line on the Objective then yeah why would you endanger your scoring troops?

>>96664679
>GK before 5e
You are ones of those nostalgia faggots that dickride 4e.
People who lived through it derided it for it's lack of options and stale play.

>>96664798
I sincerely hope you aren't implying that Matt Ward happening was good for GK.

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I ain't no fortunate son (local playgroup plays 3.0)

>>96664644
I thought reactions were a nice addition but even I understand it definitely can gum things up. Honestly what I remember gameplay wise around 40k 4th was a wonderful ruleset. Reactions definitely change the way the game is played and scoring in 3.0 doesn’t help that.

>>96664679
Sure old editions did a lot of things right but also a lot of things wrong. Remember when the only decent use case scenario for terminators or veterans was just suicide dropping them with meltaguns to kill one vehicle and die?

>>96664798
>lack of options
Lmao fake antigrog grog. The 3.5 e chaos book has more options for each individual chaos god than any of the dedicated chaos God legion armies/books in 10th edition for the same god.

Fellow LIgmas and ATchads.
Any tips for making a gaming board? Im making a cityscape board, and making it semi modular, using thin hardboard as the basis of the tiles, in 6"x6", 6"x12", and 12"x12" tiles. Got a proof of concept image after a couple hours work.

Thinking of adding in a bit of height difference with raised city areas comprising a couple of buildings to provide avenues for smaller units while blocking larger units.

Anyone done anything similar and any tips before i get too deep to unfuck myself?

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>>96665108
Im going to fucking kill myself

>>96665119
Looks fine. Just use cardboard, plasticard, cork sheets, straws and little tubes, and the thin metal grating sheets you can get at hobby stores or online. Get a tub of texture paste for mud, grass, and making craters.

Also, you're looking for shapes that look cool and appropriate so don't shy away from trash and small toys from thrift stores to use in scratchbuilt structures.

>>96665119
>>96665108
Build your buildings out of small LEGOs. When a powerful shot misses its target, roll to see if it hits a nearby building and knock a chunk out of it. If it falls over, that's just the shifting nature of a battleground where such powerful weapons are brought to bear.
If a building would fall on a unit, it gets to make a save as if against a ranged attack but if it fails it's crushed by the debris.

>>96665409
Im already making damaged and destroyed variants of all but 3 of the buildings that will be on the board.
Maybe when i finish the board ill get around to making a destroyed version of the 3 largest buildings but ill need to make all new bases for em since theyre glued down to the tiles themselves

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What's the verdict anons? Would this be too powerful? Will post the DG version when I'm done with it.
As I mentioned last thread please post ideas for legion specific destroyers.

>>96665495

Don't Death Guard already have quite effective legion-specific destroyers? They don't get Firestorm, but they can stack an ungodly number of Poison 2+ flamers for a very affordable price and top it off with a phosphex bomb for the Panic. 276pts for 11 alchem flamers, a nuncio-vox and a phosphex bomb in a Termite is silly value even without Volley boosts, that's enough armour saves to remove almost any unit including TEQ.

I like the idea of dual revolver squads, but it feels odd to give AL another squishy elite unit that excels at popping expensive MEQ when they already have so many.

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>>96665495
>>96665699
Heres the weapon I'm thinking of giving the death guard squad. The idea would be that the squad would count as T3 and WS3 defensively in melee, going for a high risk high reward type build.

I really like the idea of dual wielding railgun revolvers but I'm fine with changing what they're good at targetting. Would having them be specialized against light vehicle or TEQ be a better niche for them? Right now they're basically flying effrit, trading the debuff for more damage.
I appreciate the feedback anon <3

>>96662886
All vanguard units should have at least one spear to get a hit in early in the sequence.

>>96665768
And so why does this emit radiation that poisons the marines and a regular phosphex bomb doesn't

>>96665897
The way I'm picturing it, the Phosphex bomb by virtue of being larger can have a safer containment method, whereas as the much smaller canisters used in the grenade launcher need to give up some shielding to both contain the Phosphex and still be light enough to be shot

>>96664798
Not as much lack of options, as there were a lot, it is just that the GK/Demon hunters books was not ment (unlike the 5th ed one) to be played mono. GW designed it with narrative games and allying Inquisition/GK/radicals in to all imperial armies. Power wise, especialy when compared to power builds of the era it was weak. I mean GW "forgot" to give power armoured GK the option to take rhinos/razorbacks. But there were people who "water warriored" GK back then, few and very specific people. And it was way before coaches, pros etc So I ain't saying that if we were to play it today the 4th ed codex would somehow get good. Models were great though. I still have a butt loads of metal terminators.

>>96664822
Not the anon, but you tell me what is better. A codex with no real build to be played. Or a codex with Draigo wing, the Mix lists razorbacks and 6 rifleman, the (most people claimed the best of all GK codex builds) Coteaz list spaming henchman razorbacks and rifleman and the off meta purfire list. You tell me what is better. For enjoyment of playing, number of options/builds to play, unit verity in lists, and even faction fantasy.

I mean what is better then the Ward codex? The uppy downy , spam NDKs and pray for not clock to play the game stuff that exists now ? the GK-worse faction ever in 8th ed. The 9th ed suck till second book comes out "upps covid happened, and now you never get to play it" or the 7th ed "GK list is Draigo, 6 centurions, WS storm seer with eye, inquisitor with null rod etc"?

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>>96665495
no, just play the game thats literally just come out. Post models and matches before this sonic fanfic.

>>96665768

Anti-TEQ would be nice, if possibly a bit hard to finagle. I might drop the power daggers, or at least make them a 5ppm upgrade.

Effrit are basically all about their debuff and amazing Infiltrate, the fact they also have semi-reasonable guns and meltabombs is decidedly secondary to their mere presence letting you slap half an army with statuses.

>>96666176
NTA, but go fuck yourself. The new edition blows anyway, people should play it how they want. Get off your knees bitchmade pussyboy.

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>>96666219
New edition is great and shits on 2.0. Go fantazise about playing 40k 3rd ed or whatever current nostalgia bait you grogs are jerking it to currently, you are not missed.

>>96665495
I'd say drop shred and overload (Unless thats how 3.0 banestrike works, I haven't checked lol). Make it 1 shot but extend the range to 18". Turns them into an annoying skirmisher unit.

>>96666261
Clown opinion. Glad my group isn't full of fags like you.

>>96666261
anon I could pop into 40kg right now and get the same opinion about 10th ed, you are only kidding yourself.

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>>96666287
so happy mine has shed peeps like yours bro, all the bitter sad men have left, its just good vibes and great fully painted, well themed hobby now. Enjoy!

>>96666287
Keep playing 2.0 then faggot, make your own 2.0 circlejerk thread, the rest of the world will progress without you

>>96666318
>>96666387

Dumbfuck slop eaters think this is progress. Get the fuck out of here. Go play 10th where you submutants belong.

What the fuck is this fight even about? Is it just a mutated "new=40k and old=good" fight? No one will remember nor care about the shade you throw on hhg in 10 years. Talk about games or models.

>>96666478
had the same shit with old world, it got flooded with 40k tourists who ate that shit up despite all the blatant awful rules like linehammer, the level 4 and dragon spam and it inevitably got errata'd out by GW 8 months later. They think they are being clever defending obviously broken rulesets then get pissed when their waac abomination lists get deleted overnight.

>>96666533
I have predators, despoilers, assault marines, an autocannon sicaran, and WS4 terminators in my army I can assure you there is nothing WAAC going on with this shit

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>>96666507
Post modles, post hobby, post games and post art, this is the only answer.

>>96666544
the point is that if you can't call out shit for what it is you will only end up looking very foolish when all is said and done, if you truly don't see the problems you should be listening to people who do because chances are they know every pothole coming down the road.

>>96666566
>listen into people who know the problems
>look inside
>"plasma should be AP3 Breaching 4+ D2"
Yeah I think we've heard enough of your wisdom

Has anyone in the current discussion played one (1) game of HH3

>>96666604
I have
I had fun

>>96666591
I get it dude, you have to be really committed to eating shit.

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>>96666604
Played like 8 games so far, so much better than 2.0 but challanges are a bit of a slowdown/learning cruve so I avoid them currently. Local community is hyped and we just had a 30 people narrative event that went gangbusters. T3 being a solid choice and reaction changes have really opened it up as well as nerfing bullshit like dreads and auto take lascannon teams shooting 3 times in a turn.

>>96662213
>GET, 666

I have acquired a Contemptor
However, I do not onow how I want to equip him
Kinda thinking double Fists of some sort with mounted meltas

>>96666767
Doing one fist and gravis autocannon or gravis melta for mine, idk +1 attack doesn't seem worth giving up a gun arm

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>>96665108
>>96665119
Most of your buildings should have a small perimeter because you don't want to force titans to take an entire turn to just walk around them. Since terrain is destructable you want the buildings to be removable also. Having some wider shorter buildings is also good so as to keep titans from simply walking over them bit also not be totally helpless behind them.

Why is AT always in a city, you can make a board with hills and canyons and shit, have some big alien redwoods that can hide knights and warhounds

>>96666713
I played 5 games, which is less and definitly not enough to know everything about the edition. But the fact that my army is unable to score, does hamper my enjoyment of the new edititon. But I hope that GW is going to either errata it or what is probably more probable, there is going to be a book with rules that somehow let my dudes score and contest.

Challanges seem to be tedious and a ton of stuff I do not get or understand. I can imagine that someone good at grasping all the options probably can have much fun with them, but I just want to roll my attacks and kill stuff, and not go over 10+ steps and wonder what special stance I should take, only to find out that either it didn't matter, because my opponent would out stack my guy anywhere or my paragon spear just bounces off their terminator armour.

>>96666798
I made a shitton of wire trees to use for AT but trashed after covid killed the local scene (not literally).
Buildings are just way easier though especially with all the 3d support and work much better for the game.

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3rd ed mech
i'm fairly certain this is how you're supposed to make a list? at least with an archimandrite guy

>archimandrite archmagos
>take apex detachment
>fill apex detachment with techpriests and servitors, all of these take the same subfaction of what you want ypur army to specialize in (e.g for this, lets say thallax so reductor)
>logistical benefit the prime retinue slot for a unit of myrmidons for the archmagos to go in (archimandrite so doesnt care, can still benefit from scoring+comptroller as they're infantry)
>take your magos', their subfaction what you want to specialize in second (e.g for this case, robots so cybernetica)
>take detachments of thallax, yoir techpriests can buff them
>take detachments of robots, your magos' can buff them

right?

>>96666838
oh no wait you cant logistical benefit the apex detachment

swap it out for a logistical benefit on the core detachment from the command slot

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>>96666812
>paragon spear
Custodes and sisters are 100% getting a proper release, there is alot left wanting for them currenlty. I hightly recommend just chucking in small allied line unit detachement in the meantime or you will be just chasing vanguard.

I think my biggest want from 3.0 is more missions with more scoring options currently.

>>96666790
yeah the image was just proof of concept with the largest buildings, i have a spattering of other, shorter, and some short and wide buildings. also planning some verticality in the road layout itself, with a couple raised plaza sections for titans to take cover behind.

>>96666812
>Challanges seem to be tedious and a ton of stuff I do not get or understand.
They are tedious and honestly just a waste of fucking time, because 9/10 times you almost always pick the same gambits
>Near garuntee to go first?
Pick finishing strike
>Not sure if you are gonna go first?
Pick seize
Defender
>Are you sure you can live a turn?
Pick test foe
>Sure your gonna die?
Pick Guard

The major issue with Challenges is that they ahve all these fucking rules when in reality it boils down to who swings first 99% of the time.

The game would just be better if the challenge system was reserved for Primarchs and named characters and other wise challenge just did not exist. Or if they do exist. you just swing at the same time no matter what wepaons you are using, and damage is applied at the same time.

>>96666927
Challenges are already limited to command and champion models. Most games I've played only had one or two challenges happen, it's already uncommon enough that people don't memorise the gambits.

>>96667045
Which leads to the point of. "Why the fuck is this in the game at this point?"
I have never had a challenge happen when i go "OH BOY CANT WAIT FOR THIS!" it just slows shit down. i would rather have it so challenges just dont exist outside of Primarchs the reason for this is because of the existence of challenges everyone kits their character to just be challenge winners.

It why like in 2.0 everyone just took fucking hammers becusae thats what killed characters in a single hit. it was lame. just let me dump my attacks into the units. I hate that characters dont feel like they can cut down chaff because all that happens is you just get challenge locked.

>>96666927
>just a waste of fucking time
Too true. I know I am a little jaded with how complex d6 systems can really get but damn are challenges a failed effort.

>>96667162
Its just one of those, i get what thye were trying, because challenges were annoying as shit to deal with and caused issues in 2.0 but the answer was not "lol ok lets just make them more cumbersome"
Just fuck it dont have it, or if you really wanna have 2 characters fight do it this way.

>Weapon IMs dont matter
>You roll off d6 + your base Init
>winner gets to swing a single attack at you, loser swings a single attack after
>If you have paired weapons like lightening claws, you get 2 attack instead of 1
Repeat this process until one guy wins.
There you go, problem fucking solved.

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How are breachers in HH3? finally worth it?

>>96667199
Oh fuck yeah, people sleep on breachers but the best way to use them it to treat them like land mind.
Breacher squad with 2 las cutters in a Rhino.
Hide your rhino the best you can, wait for something to get into your threat range which is like 24" then you just ambush said vehicle. Run up with them, dump your breachers out, move them up to said vehicle pop your 2 las cutter shots for 2 damage at S8.
Then get into melee and enjoy your 2 S12 4 damage hits.

You can also do this with a 10 man vet breacher squad, and get 4 las cutters. But i would possibly look at doing that with a drill instead just depends.

but yes breachers are good

>>96667199
They can charge out of a rhino and fuck up a land raider or spartan with lascutters.

>>96667215
>>96667219
>breachers in a rhino
>charging vehicles
I guess it must be effecive, but it's unfluffy and gamey as fuck

>>96667290
That's just, like, your opinion man.

But footslogging breachers throwing out Pinning with graviton guns are pretty alright as well.

>>96667290
Think of it like hoplites splitting off form the testudo formation to charge an elephant

>>96666927

Honestly I've been enjoying challenges, although I play Mechanicum, so it's not just the same mirror matches and Cybertheurgy/Malagra/Myrmidax collectively let me play an interesting little game of tailoring my statline to the opponent rather than just mashing Finishing Blow at every opportunity. It's not the deepest system ever but I've had some decent fights with everything from Myrmidon Lords to Siggy. Primarchs are the most boring Challengers honestly because at most there's one other character on the field for whom the challenge rules stand the slightest chance of being meaningful, whereas my Secutor Lord has at least some kind of chance against the thunder hammer praetor.

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>>96667337
Close assault breachers are the chad choice. I used lascutters since 1.0 and nothing is more hilarious than chopping up peoples tough units with shield walls.

>>96667199
Just like me and the boys playing Ready or Not

Going to be running my immortals with 7 volkites, a combi flamer, grav gun, and lascutter in a termite. Might use a siege breaker to lead the unit.

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Ok, so what about rotor/assault cannons? Are they good too?

>>96667413
I've been thinking of running a vet squad with rotor cannons, shotguns, combi flamers, and a grav pistol to be shitlords with all 4 statuses lmao, a few disintigrators or combi meltas for punch

>>96667413
They're alright. Rotor cannons have suppression 1 so will stop units from shooting well. Assault cannons have 1 fewer shots when moving and firing, but they do have a "safety off" fire mode with 5 shots.

>>96667413
Is this why Americans build their walls out of cardboard?

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>>96667450
ooooh that is hilariously mean

Anons I've played 20 3000pt games so far and 14 of them have been basically decided on turn 1, 2 of them were decided on turn 1 but then a weird status/dice oddity occurred so it went up in the air, and 4 of them were the legendary mission from the first book so barely count (but fwiw attacker scores 10 points turn 1 every time)

I think we just talked out round 4 for the majority of them because everything is so fucking dead by then you can be like "okay this unit that's still on the objective 100% scores because you have 2 assault marines 40" away, and your 2 assault marines I guess can rush onto that objective to gain 1 more point, so I guess it ends 50 me to your 10"

is this edition, dare I say it, not good?

>>96667991
Your expereince is pretty much the same as mine, turn 4 we basically just talk out or at which point its a case of "Ok your clearly ahead, is it even possible for me to win. "

I would wager you also found that the person that goes first has a higher chance of winning since they can get on objectves. Most games i found are decided by turn 2, and turn 3 is the only come back chance.

>is this edition, dare I say it, not good?
Its not, and most of its issues stem from the retardation of the libers.
Core rules are very eh.
IMO you would have a much easier time fixing 2.0 then fixing 3.0.
If you ported over 3.0 blast rules, and vehicles rules into 2.0, then 2.0 would be monumentally better, along with a few house rules.
Between 1.0, 2.0, and now 3.0. i can say with out a doubt 2.0 was a much more enjoyable game for me.

>>96668069
However i am cursed to be around people who want to play the latest and greatest edition and between the choice of rolling dice and being meh about the experience and not rolling dice at all. Ill take the former.

But if given the choice i would much rather convince people to play a house ruled 2.0. But no one wants to depsite everyone being upset about 3.0 to some capacity.
I swear to god i dont understand peoples apprehension to house rules and common sense balance.

>>96667991
I've played 7 and my opponents conceded bottom of 2 every time. They just don't get on objectives and I try to help but it seems like no one wants to try to score.

Castra ferrums should be a pair for 1 detachment slot that operate independent like how tarantulas do. Come on they suck ass at T6 W5 at least they would have a niche if they weren't taking just as much detachment space as a saturnine

>>96668572
Frankly I think they should have an aura, I'd say an aura like in 40k that allows rerolls of 1 to hit and/or to Wound. But this edition seems vehemently against any rerolls.
At the very least it should allow friendly Infantry to use its Ld or Cl value when within 6", to give it a niche as a close support platform with emphasis on support.

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Finished my terminator squad at long last. They were an absolute pain in the ass but I'm pleased with how they turned out. Shoulder joints are magnetized and I've got two sets of alternate weapons for them: twin lightning claws and twin power axes (just need to finish painting the gunmetal / silver, and hit them with some blood).

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>>96668739
Oh Anon these are fucking delightful, well done

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>>96668572
yup the triple nerf to dreads was a bit heavy handed, and we can see already in the new Tactica release more dread friendly detachments. I fully expect some more over the next year.

>>96668739
Interesting, got any pics of the conversion process?

>>96667991
How is this different from the game being decided turn 1 or 2 because either 90% of your units got evaporated by artillery in 1.0 or sniped by lascannons and nemesis bolters and pounded into dust by dreadnoughts in 2.0

>>96668572
The War Engine detachment should at least confer two walkers, and the Mortificator's talon could afford to also be a bit less rigid too. Castraferrums are otherwise consigned to being rifleman dreads in their current state, yeah, but some others are kind of awkward too. Saturnine could really use a rule to split shooting between its guns.

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>>96668784
Thanks
>>96668811
No unfortunately I didn't think to take any process pics, but I can sort of describe it:

I drilled and embedded a vertical pin (paperclip) into the waist of each set of legs and a corresponding vertical hole in the bottom of each torso. Then I played with adding various amounts of greenstuff as a spacer between the two halves. I settled on between 0.5mm and 1mm (depending on the pose) vertical height increase, and also tilting the torsos slightly. I added some visual bulk to the waistlines by adding various sizes of guitar wire (stuck into the greenstuff and drilled into the plastic at the model's back). At the back of the model I also had to sculpt some overlapping armor plates (some I did with cardstock, others I did layers of greenstuff).

Overall they're just barely taller than nuscale marines (the top of a beakie helmet is level with the peak of the brass circlet thingy these guys are wearing wrapped around their eyebrows).

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i underlay both blue and red sections of my eaters' plate with a nice and thin and opulent purple so as to build up to some really passionate tones of either end hue but for a moment in process they look a little like hello kitty marines

>>96668739
gorgeous!

It seems Melta armed Sky Hunters are the preferred options, but is there a place for the other weapons? Plasma particularly?

>>96666478
Hear hear

>>96669307
Plasma is ass but if you think it looks cool go for it

>>96667413
Pictured, poor downtrodden militia gc veteran adds a new extension to his approved dwelling

>>96669307
Tbh plasma is overhated, it’s just the basic ss and hss variants that suck. Plasma bombards are silly, and if you plan on letting the new siege terminators get into melee, plasma blasters are the primary option for most legions

>>96669435
Not responding to you directly anon just at the plasmacels

>>96668739
Really nice job. You could post pics from the rwst of the army :) How you magnetised the arms? Have you bought some additional upper armour plates so you can have on all arms? Pics please :D

>>96669307
Heavy bolters and volkite culverins are okay, but mostly into MEQ or light infantry. Plasma cannons are solid too now, with how accurate blast weapons are this edition. Even if you miss they still hit most of the time.

>>96669435
Agreed, especially the blast plasma weapons are either solid or downright scary. The heavy plasma bombard being barrage 1 is frankly ridiculous, even without LOS it is gonna hit most of the time. And with damage 2 and no reason not to overcharge even terminators get melted by it.

>>96668739
Dunno what it is, but something seems very off about these. They give me some serious uncanny valley vibes.

>>96669466
bro adjusted the abdomen to be taller
pretty minor and falls within the boundary of one's tastes but it alters the overall shape a good deal on what are otherwise really hunkered down and stocky models

>>96668739
>soon I will control the Maelstrom Zone

that's some nice lookers you got there

>>96668572
they're in a better place than Contemptors for close assault purposes, particularly if you're using them to defend a position alongside another unit because they don't explode

functionally they're no worse off than a contemptor in melee - the basic gravis bolt/gravis fist for 120 vs 155 has all the same shooting and only a little worse melee and is a much better choice for bullying Line off Objectives, since it even has better Cool thanks to Heavy , and access to flamestorm cannon

>>96666847
you can Logistical Benefit the Apex, but only on the Retinue (who would otherwise only get some mostly-redundant benefits to Advanced Characteristics)

>>96666838
HH2 still has me thinking that you're supposed to pick 1 Techno-arcana for the army (which would mean no Thallax in an Archimandrite force outside Primary/Allied or Logistical Benefit) but I doubt that's really the case

>>96668572

I would 100% support Heavy Support Detachments having 2 WE slots, and then introducing a special rule that the heaviest units are 1-per-detachment. So the Saturnine Dreadnought gets that, so your HS detachment is 0-2 dreads of which one can be a Saturnine. I'd also like to see the Kratos and Spartan get this rule.

Then Mortificators getting a Prime WE slot in their detachment along with a new Dread-exclusive Prime advantage, 'Venerable' that gives +1WS/BS.

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Tortuga clutching as usual.

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>>96669449
>Rest of the army
Right now I've only got 2 other squads painted (~90% finished), so quite a way to go.

>How are they magnetized
It took a lot of dry fitting and test posing to get everything aligned. The shoulder plates are attached to the body and the arms just pop in right underneath. I painted the soft armor joint magnetic connection point black and gave it a few coats of varnish.

>>96669466
I like the way they look next to the nu-scale marines. Here's a pic of the tallest one next to a Mk6 sergeant.

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>>96669702
yep, the cata and tartaros kits are showing their age and are too smal compared to newer PA kits. GW needs to release their upscaled Cata.
Meanwhile there's alwasys 3d printing or Tortuga bodies like the Justy in pic related

>>96669745
valrak said upscaled cata and plastic justaerin are coming

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>>96668572
Castaferrum dreadnoughts are still real solid in my experience. Still regularly field 3 or 4 of them as DA no less and the resilience and firepower you get for their point cost is great.
Dual gravis plasma cannon is real nasty against any kind of infantry, and even the dual gravis lascannon castaferrum have proven to be quite efficient at getting rid of terminators and light to medium vehicles.
And even if something shoots them they can return fire with all weapons, so there's no reason not to deploy them somewhere with good LOS and get the heavy benefit on their weapons right away. Killing seems to be an inconvenient amount of effort too, as most opponents so far prefer to try and hide from my castaferrums rather than attempt to destroy them.
Gonna try out their performance in melee once I've painted some of the dreadnought CCW for them Got too much things I want to get painted, so many units and options that are all viable and looking fun in 3.0

>>96669702
>Hydra Dominatus, brother

>>96669702
>The shoulder plates are attached to the body and the arms just pop in right underneath.
Nice idea. Probably stealing it. Keep us posted here with your painjobs, it's always nice to see some well painted armies.

Does anyone have the reference sheet from the Saturnine box on file?

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>>96669794

>>96669516
iirc you cant logistical benefit the apex in that scenario because the apex is a reductor detachment and myrmidons are myrmidax, cant mix subfactions in detachments (except the base one)

3rd making every unit have a subfaction is fine as detachments are quite easy to get, the issue is having a character with something other than cybernetica, myrmidax or lacerymeta as you either have to join a unit and suffer stat/obj penalties, or take a unit of servitors which are retinue and hard to get a slot UNLESS you have the archimandrite apex detachment

>>96669814
nta but agreed
cataphractii with shoulders lower than the torso looks fucking ugly

and anyone who builds some without the inner shoulderpad should be deported

>>96668958
You're right, it's not the edition that's bad. It's the game itself, and always has been.

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>>96669814
>tfw i didn't lookup pictures before assembling and i have to reglue with some guys already at the basecoat stage
i-i'm workin' on it

>>96669516
Notably, contemptors are wounded on 4s by hammers and 3s by power fists, castaferrums are 3s and 2s. Going from T7 to T6 makes a big difference. Other common scenarios is plasma wounding them on 3s, and meltas on 2s.

>>96670437
yes

Also my dreadnoughts being a walking bomb in assault is a feature not a bug

>>96669745
I hope to fuck not I just bought some today

>>96670437
Vulkan not black enough

>>96669745
>>96669753
>tfw mulling over Cataphractii models and scale
>already have 10x plastic ones from the AoD box too

At the very least I hope whatever upscale GW's comes with more melee options and a much better Praetor or Consul sculpt to go with it. Other than the upcoming Indomitus Assault Termies, sourcing certain wargear options like hammers is a pain if it's just official stuff. Is Tortuga pretty good with quality control?

>>96666838

I'm not sure you can give the Apex detachment any Arcana besides Archimandrite, although admittedly it's extremely vague and probably needs to be in an FAQ. The basics of "take Magi, give arcana, take detachments of that arcana for them to go with" is correct, though.

I personally like cybertheurgist tech-priests to go with Myrmidons, since they don't care about Comptroller and just want someone to throw Guide on them and maybe fire a gravgun for status procs. A Guided Secutor Lord is easily as good as most Space Marine HQs in a challenge, although not quite up there with champions, praetors and div/bio Librarians.

10 wound thanatars exploding like an atom bomb is extremely funny.

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>>96669745
>>96670976
>>96671025

From Liber Hereticus

>>96671204
They will be stupidly oversized, like the Saturnine termies or the new plastic praetora from AoD box

Does anyone have a scan of the new LI rulebook ?

>>96671281
which look fucking awful

>>96668572
All dreads should get WS5 or BS5 if they have double melee or double ranged weapons.

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>>96662213
>Posts female space marine
>Turns out to be active in sissy, chastity, and other porn addict subs
How do they manage to exist beyond the point of parody?

>>96671281
Saturnine are not infantry
The praetors are just primaris models and suffer from the retardation of HQ=Bigger that jumped from Orks to marine designers for whatever reason
There's no reason to believe new terminators would be that big
Plenty of reason to believe they'll be monopose models with no options tho

>>96671381
Was it deleted? My google-fu is failing me.

>>96671204
Why is GW retarded? When you wear an EOD suit you don't magically grow two extra vertebrae

>>96671484
Wrong

>>96671484
You do however get some RDJ lifts

>>96671381
What Legion tho?

>>96671484
Because it looks cooler

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>>96671484
???

>>96671204
Now post the one that corrects the blatant page curve.

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Current cataphractii are actually fine. It's the special characters that are oversized for some reason. That's true of even power armor.

>>96671609
>for some reason.
Its not really "for some reason" its because GW is trying to do the same thing to HH they did in 40k and AoS, thye want their heros to be big and stand out, but dont realize that it looks gay as a result.

Current cata are fine. Nu marine scale is what ever, old marines still look fine on the table as well.

>>96671381
These people are factory defects

>>96671558
Anon that page is about as straight as you are.

>>96671529
Emperor's Children are the only ones that would have an inclination to do so.

>>96671609
Why does that first bolter marine look so damn good? It's like he's perpetually in shadow and it's fucking me up.

>>96671422
It was

>>96671733
>anon learns that lighting is half of the reason peoples models look good in photos.

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1 The Word Eaters
2 The World Bearers
3 The Iron Irons
4 The Hand Warriors
5 The Space Legion
6 The Alpha Wolves
7 The Raven Deaths
8 The Guard Guards
9 The Emperor's Horus
0 The Sons of Children
00 The Ultramar Nights
11 The Lordines
other dubs The Sons of Sons
trips The Dark Sons
quads The Thousand Children

ROLL

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Reminds me of when I was comparing my old plastics with the new hh3 mk2s

>>96671772
Rollan

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>>96671204
>>96671561
>>96671558
My shit attempt to line it all up. They look to be about a forehead taller.

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>>96671772
>Sons of Children

>>96671861
Why are you meassuring the top of the helmet when the helmets are very different in size?
Line up the eyes

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>>96671901

Rolled 6, 6 = 12 (2d6)

>>96671772
Rolling for Alpha Wolves

>>96671772
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH

>>96666261
You would slurp up any slop GW puts out you faggot corporate shill. You're embarrassing.

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>>96672073
Anon I don't think you're replying to a real human being

>>96671772
Rolling for world bearers, cause that's what my beerhammer partner starts calling my army around turn 3

>>96672155
Primary red, secondary blue, or primary white, secondary red?

>>96672221
Lets go primary red, secondary blue

>>96672155
Okay Atlas.

>>96672221
>>96672228
Primary Red, Secondary also red

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CAN WE GET MUCH HIGHER?

>>96671772
I solemnly swear I will paint at least one model as whatever it is I roll.

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Okay what do iron irons look like?

>>96672542
Dip the marine directly into the pot of iron warrior

>>96672558
And then splatter them with leadbelcher from above?

>>96668958
It's different because you could avoid both of those IRL extremely uncommon scenarios by simply refusing to play with reeking faggots. 1.0 and 2.0's issues were around taking too much of a good thing in army lists, 3.0 issues are integral to the core functions of the ruleset.

In fact, ironically, the fact that 3.0 has made faction balance better(by constraining options and leeching out flavour) makes the problems with its core rules even more pronounced and self-evident, because basically *every* game will play out in the same boring, predictable, unsatisfying way.

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>>96672542
you just posted it mang
nice and black iron pockmarked with straight up corrosion sort of blemishes

>>96672542
>erm AKSHUALLY are we to believe that BARE IRON can be BLACK and also SHINY and also RED and also

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TRIED TO GO TO CHURCH
CHURCH AIN'T WORK
STILL WANNA KILL
NIGGAS
TRIED TO GO TO WORK
BUT WORK AIN'T WORK
WORK AIN'T WORK FOR THE FEEL, NIGGA

REALLY MADE ME FEEL LIKE A FIELD NIGGA
MAKE ME FEEL WORSE, REALLY TRYNA' CHILL
BUT INSIDE I FEEL LIKE A STEEL
MILL
NIGGA

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are you excited for the scouring? looks like it'll start this year

>>96672839
I don't read warhammer books, I'm interested if they make game or model content based on it though.

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>>96672839
not nearly as compelling a context in my eyes
only picks back up when the mortally wounded beast regains its footing a little and lumbers on as such with the diaspora of chapters in full effect

>>96672839
eh it has been filled out quite a bit already by Abaddon's books and issues like Dorn and Guilliman falling out are well known. The characters have all been established as well so they can't do anything new with it, and arguably they killed off nearly all the interesting heresy characters. I guess they could follow the future chapter masters, hearing from Autek Mor would be great. Game wise I think if they do anything it should be a range of mark VII, some of the old marine plastics and do one time supplements to play every historic event from the scouring to the first tyrannic war.

>>96672839
I care about my 2nd foundniggas:
>Red Talons
>Brazen Claws
>Soul Drinkers
>Fists Exemplar
>Blood Drinkers
>Novamarines

>>96672839
No, I like the themes of 30k but dislike the bl books. So changing the themes and keeping the writers isn't great from my pov.

>>96673071
for me it's the flesh tearers, finding out amit's fate for real (although we can be pretty sure already) would be nice

funny how every Knight's Errant was killed off so the GK have no founders now, gonna be fun watching BL slopwriters wrangle they way around it.

>>96673116
I thought the lore was it was founded by the one Tsons knight errant.
Janis or something like that.

>>96673126
Revuel Arvida was hinted as being a founding member but they killed him, they killed Loken, they killed Rubio and they killed Garro so there is no one significant to become Janus.

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>>96673071
supeisumarine chapters in general are seriously kino on the back of all the individual cultures they give rise to
scythes of the emperor are one of the most blessed imo of the lot for having been nearly eliminated and insodoing justifying their existence in full
the fucking honor of nearly having your chapter die out in defense of the imperium, yo
basedmarines

>>96673163
the 1ksons who had his mutation rewriten, and who had part of magnus shard in him. That is what Malcador made in to Janus.

>>96673116
>>96673163
what are you talking about? Revuel Arvida did become Janus in The Last Son of Prospero and wasn't present at the Siege

>>96672611
Okay but I gotta do some kind of accent colors or this will just be iron hands

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>>96673217
keep their trim very subtle if not nonexistent. IH are characterized by lustrous and luscious silvers very often on said geometries
to lean further away from iron hands, have the plate very matte. cast iron sort of dealie. the hands loved to have their stuff polished to a mirror finish and even possess iridescent notes. their coloration was spartan and simple but kept rigorously spotless where and when possible
you'll have to heavily leverage the corrosion otherwise to really push it i think
gravitate about picrel for their legion icon and a basis for the plate, lmao
he's not going to be very reminiscent of an Xth dude when splotched all over with rust i assure you
think death guard sort of neglect but pushed up another angle. you may want to scar the plate with a scalpel and such prior to painting for actual 3d surface texture besides

>>96670437
RIP Pianoman

>>96672839
I'm only interested in seeing how they describe Iron Cage

>>96673367
oops all cataclysmic psychedelic transhuman warfare

>>96673353
F for Rich.

>>96673367
>IF walk straight into Perty's trap
>Perty has prepared to assail the IF by all means available to him and in every manner he could conceive of
>the IF endure the trap so well that Perty's dudes literally run out of ammo
>have to abandon their defensive positions to finish the job in melee like cavemen
>what should have been a total blowout becomes a brawl where both legions are on track to being wiped out
>Perty gets a wakeup call from this idiocy when he's alerted to the Ultramarines arriving in the system
>instead of scoring a mutual kill he's now on track to die like a retard in his own trap while the pissboys get to walk away victorious
>packs his shit up and runs away with his legion of retards
That's where the fluff is currently at in 40k. Some of that shit would have to be revised in order to make Perty look like less of an embarrassment.

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Legions for this feel?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkLvpt9Z3fA

>>96673641
>lost control of my life
Thousand Sons

>>96673641
Imperial Fists.

>>96673641
Blackshields

>>96673641
>>96673695
Loyalist Blackshields or Shattered Legions, really. Although the former fits better.

>>96673641
Salamanders' Disciples of the Flames.

>>96663619
You used the same Krieg 3d parts I've been eyeing up for a while now. How are they? Worth the money to get?

>>96673641
really, no one gonna suggest NL?

>>96673652
>>96673660
>>96673695
>>96673717
>>96673891
i was afraid the answer was Luna Wolves. i don't really want to paint white right now

>>96673907
you just slather that shit on w/ powder puff drybrush straight onto a black primer m8 it's dead easy and has a great finish

>>96673891
Night Lords aren't even the best legion for this feel.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GViI8Cq-9gg

>>96673946
i didn't mean to imply that it was difficult

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>>96673959
fair enough
i love white on marines so there's not much a factor of getting bored of it in my case at least for now
murrhaps you've burned yourself out on it and i respec that

>>96673984
i'd probably do a light blue blue basecoat plus a watered blue shade for a grim "dark" feel.
i doubt it's any scarier that yellow. did a test marine upto the shade for IF, and it wasn't that bad.

>>96673641
Iron Hands

Spent my day perusing bits sites to get stuff to tart up some White Scars. Grand Cathay's release was very helpful for me.

>>96673783
forgot to tag you too >>96673907

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has anyone put the FW MK3 helmets on nu-MK3?

i've seen the old plastic helmets on them but not the FW ones

>>96673116
it's more fun that you can run a full KE army in HH3 and nobody's doing it, even though the Knights-Errant Trait isn't Loyalist locked, only the special characters are

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>>96674269
It's the same helmet. Yeah, there's slight details that got changed, like the eyes, but other than that, it's the same helmet. Just take any image of a nu-MK3 with old MK3 helmets, and just sink in the eyes a little more and make them much lighter gray. There, that's what it'd look like.

god why does the daemon list suck ass?

the only real good unit is the daemon brutes, look at the behemoth, they made that shit 250pts but WS/BS3, and its weapons are.....a flamer without panic and a AP4 D2 melee weapon with no special rules

>>96674508
oh no sorry its AP5, what a pile of shit

>>96670766
true but you can still get 10 castra for the points of 8 connies :)

>>96674508

The daemon prince and greater daemon equivalents aren't too bad, since they score really well and have no overhead cost to take 'em, but they are very pricy for units that need to dodge the enemy heavies. I still think a single Sovereign isn't a terrible allied pick, I might do up some kind of huge stompy archmagos covered in runes to ally to my darkmech.

>>96674532
How do you plan on getting 10 WE slots

I mean contemptor talons still exist so it's technically doable for them

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Why is he like this?

>>96674532
8 contemptors have more attacks than 10 castraferrums at higher initiative and higher strength

>>96674662
>WS4
>Melee unit

>>96674494
they are far from the same. the 'hat' and brim on neuemk.3 plastics entirely alters the character of the piece of plate
very similar? sure, but there are others who'd disagree unto death even on that

>>96674693
I'm not the one who brought up the idea of them being used for melee. I would much rather be using my boxnaughts with my autocannons or my lascannon + missile loadout

>>96669516

>>96673543
>Some of that shit would have to be revised in order to make Perty look like less of an embarrassment.
Lol. Lmao, even. The retcons go one way, and it's always to the favour of team piss.

>>96674650
>rejecting woman desperate for his shmeat
Mega based.

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>>96674725
Yeah, but the conversation was between these two helmets, not the new helmet? Why would anyone want to find images of the new MkIII with the new MkIII helmets when that's the default?

>>96672839
It'd be pretty boring as a continuation of HH
If they introduce more xenos and religious fanatics that'd be cool tho

>>96674508
With how much the HH team talked about god aligned unit rules being planned for future tactica journals in that interview, I bet the Daemon rules we got are just token placeholder rules to keep us pacified until GW can nickel and dime us with functional daemon rules spread over numerous journal paid DLC.

>>96674918
>I bet the Daemon rules we got are just token placeholder rules to keep us pacified until GW can nickel and dime us with functional daemon rules spread over numerous journal paid DLC.
wernt people saying the same thing about daemons in 2.0?

>>96674918
Wasn't there rumors of generic demon kits coming out for ToW?
Maybe they are waiting for that

>>96674929
Not that I know. Certainly no one important from GW did.

Reminder that 2.0 was abandoned by the rules an design teams before the edition's launch.

>>96674954
I dont buy that it was abandoned before the launch i think it wa abandoned about a year after the launch.
Personally i think the way it went down was like this.
>GW decided there is enough of a market to make a new edition of HH.
>Realize that it has the attention of a lot of the old guy that left 40k becuase 40k is not the game they liked anymore and GW wanted them back.
>Launch 2.0
>2.0 does a LOT better then they originally planed.
>Original plan was to leave it as a specialist game, sort of like Necromunda or TOW.
>Realize about a year in, Holy shit there are actually a good amount of people who are into this.
>Decide to push the 3 year cycle bullshit
>Rules need to be rushed out in half the time to get HH on the 3 year cycle, which is why the rules are such dog shit, and poorly writen and in some cases just out right wrong in the rule book.

>>96674979
There literally was verbal confirmation from one of the HH team. In one of the interviews leading up to the 3.0 launch (one of the livestream iirc) they literally said that they initially planned to put Saturnine terminators in the 2.0 launch box, but because the model development wasn't far enough, so the decision was made to save them for the 3.0 launch that they were working on.

>>96675016
I mean anon anyone can make shit up after the fact, my dad works at nintendo and he told me the originally were gonna make a new pokemon game for the switch but they said fuck it and are going to make it for the switch to.

This is from teh same company that also got shit on because if the rules did not leak, massive amounts of peoples armies would be unplayable, so they had to speed run a PDF that has more fucking entries then the actual rules book does.
And even then they are still fucked up, Moritat does not have bitter duty, literally nothing can join a unit of destroyers now.
Some units dont even have the right key words on their models lacking a SGT in the unit.
I dont think anyone can honestly take anything GW says especially after the fact as truthful.

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>>96674979
i regard your wider hypothesis as almost certainly accurate
there is no basis for foisting it away from many oldhammer properties besides GW getting the impression that because uptake is so large, it should be brought in line with the flagship games so as to enable easier crosspollination of players between the now three systems
this besides the fact that 3.0's books are laughably scuffed and incomplete and obviously rushed to shit and summarily shat out

>>96675072
Again i have no proof of it, but just given what i have seen, its the conclusion i draw, the rules seem to have been super rushed out, because GW wanted to tap it into the 3 year cycle.

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tie me to a missile and fire it at nottingham i am ready

>>96674979
wasn't HH listed as one of GW's mainline properties right before 2.0 launched

I remember that being one of the big data points in favor of there being a 2.0 at all

>>96674568
>Allied Detachment Logistical Benefit Centurion
>non benefit Centurion
>AD Castra
>HS Detachment Castra 4x
>repeat

they can all have the same Faction so you don't even have to choose, it's a 20 model AD

or for a Primary

>Praetor
>3x centurion
>logistical
>7x AD Castra
>Officer Cadre
>up to 5 more Castra

it's not hard

>>96675134
I dont recall if they said it prior to launch or how soon before launch they did say that if they did.
I could possibly see them saying they wanted it to be a mainline game but perhaps a lot of people figured that did not mean the 3 year shit cycle.

My long standing theory from the very first announcement of 2.0 has long been the same.
HH is going to become to 40k waht TOW is to AoS.
HH will eventually move into the scouring era, and become a soft 40k reboot like how TOW is a soft WHF reboot.
GW is going to try and double tap the market and get all the new players into 40k and AoS but keep the old guard strung along via TOW and HH
Thats just like my opinion man, but i do personally think 3.0 was not in the stars for this early of a launch, i think HH did a lot better then GW thought it would and decided to get greedy with it.

>>96675158

The corpororate mind virus infects everything. It must be purged. Short term thinking destroying long term gains.

>>96675197
Its the burn and churn that infected 40k that bruned out a LOT of people in 10th and late 9th.

>WB blockading a forge world so they can loot all the good shit before leaving
>IH enter system and decide if anyone's gonna loot shit it'll be them
>IH fleet would definitely win but their battleships are too slow to make it before the fighting starts
>WB are just trying to do some damage while their planned evacuation is still ongoing
>IH throw a proverbial wrench in this plan
>the cruiser UNALLOYED HATE races straight through the blockade to start shitting drop pods into the atmosphere
>shortly destroyed by WB fire, the cruiser is purposefully angled to soak up the firing solutions that might otherwise target the pods
I just love how they're spiteful to the extreme. It's like they'd intentionally step on a landmine if they thought the shrapnel would hit a traitor legionary.

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>>96675267
>It's like they'd intentionally step on a landmine if they thought the shrapnel would hit a traitor legionary.
great framing of it and yes the Xth was immediately reduced/elevated to such a state upon it sinking in that there was nothing left to lose

>>96675204
It's amazing to me how they fuck up every edition and never truly learn anything. Early Index 8th was fun as a game and 9th had good flavor rules once the codices were out but then they went to 10th and forgot absolutely everything they had learned for this meta-edition cycle AND pushed people into old editions or cool stuff like Prohammer. Now they're doing the same to Heresy.

What a mix of death, incompetence, and corporate shmuckery. But hey at least most of the plastic heresy model converts have been nice.

>>96674508
>why does this hard to kill giant blocking unit cost 250 points
>when all I can do is choose to drop it into the enemy backline turn 2 in return for a WP check on a hidden psyker in my backline
>and its basic abilities only fuck up reactions and charges by making mortals shid and fard
>also makes daemons shid and fart and lose wounds
>why does this monstrous thing that can easily make gal vorbak just kill themselves by looking at it cost 250 points
>what is this 250 point wound sponge that can form the horrific core of a deep striking monster squad even doing in the game that I regularly play and understand the rules of
>why can't this thing that I can bring to a 1k game be better than it already is at just fucking with the other guy's plans shouldn't it have ap2 D10 plasma with armourbane

seeking more industrialized murder horrorcore muzak conformant with transhuman homunculi combat

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=waQqK6N6tTU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giOg-7ckxUE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2APgwe4Ua3o

>>96675440
The entire Ultrakill OST, half the SIGNALIS ost

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>First time fielding a saturnine praetor
>Ends up in a challenge with enemy praetor
>Loses focus roll off (because of course)
>Shrugs off the enemy praetor's attacks
>Flattens enemy praetor in return with his saturnine hammer
That was actually pretty cool.

>>96675472
coinflip invulns are busted but they're best that way

>>96675339

Herald of Unreality can only drop units in base to base contact with the Harbinger, you can't warp something into the enemy backline without having your own HQ in there first.

The spooky rule gives you a very minor benefit while being charged or enemies reacting to your movements, neither of which they really need to do because it's a 250pt brick that doesn't do anything since it has no melee capability and two normal flamers at the absolute best. A proper Thanatar can take the lascannon option, have two real guns and a real melee weapon and beat the Behemoth out in durability, firepower, flexibility, everything except Fear for 5pts less, even before including army synergies.
I think the Ruinstorm list is better than it's said to be, but the Behemoth really is a total dud.

>>96675339
its a soul grinder, look at its weapons and tell me if the stats reflect what it has

>>96675339
Wait, there are people who unironically defend the daemon behemoth, wtf? That thing is the worst unit in the game (so far!)

>>96662213
>What do you think about the absence of the allies matrix in 3.0?
Its an issue, that opens up a lot of ally bullshit that you can do.
I like allies but its way to open, it allows you to pull some horse shit combos.

>>96669753
Whoo cares, fuck GW and their awful run company shitting on fans constantly. I am tortugabay terminator now.

>>96671609
No, they need a 1-1,5mm torso increase.

>>96675581
>can only drop units in base to base contact with the Harbinger,

it's Infantry, you just join it in Reserves

since you all have Encroaching Ruin for free DS you're one big blob o doom

I'll be honest, I was thinking the Heirarch and Sovereign had Command, not Champion, but you can still load up on Harbingers as an assault group and used the big lad for wound sponging and preventing Reactions, since the Harbingers limit status wounds to 1 per status

>>96675593
if it was a soul grinder that would explain why everybody seems to hate it and it remains in the game to spite them

>>96671695
I prefer the old marines but the arms are way too long, which is easily fixed by adding 1-2mm height to the legs.

>>96671819
Souless vs SOVL
>>96674494
It's not, the nu-head is much smaller as are the nu-beakie heads.

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enter

>>96676084
>those desgines
Leave.

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>>96676087
no i insist, you must enter

>>96672839
They already said it was later this year when they announced it

>>96676084
too fat

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>>96676084
I think the arms need to be longer/bigger, doesn't feel like they could reach much at the moment. Are these supposed to be Cataphractii?

>>96676095
i'm almost certain they're an alternative rendition of the overall tartaros archetype but i've not asked the guy

>>96676100
Interesting, though I feel like they're too similar to his satties, only worse

>>96676112
little bit of a swing and a miss to me even though i'm madly in love with his saturnines and mk.v marines (the latter only after abdominal proportion adjustment but holy fuck are they mean)
concordant with his overall language though which i can't fault
gw's tartarussies are hard to beat. absolutely sick models.

>>96676135
agreed on all points, I think it doesn't work here because Tartaros is specifically the "agile" pattern and these guys don't look very agile. It works for the chonker Saturnines and I imagine his Cata pattern will be great, bit this one is iffy

>>96675145
okay

A contemptor can do it with 3 mortifactors or whatever the fuck they're called, compare that to the points of 5 centurions lmao

>>96676100
>>96676112
>>96676135
>>96676198
I don't get it. Someone posts a perfectly reasonable Tortuga marine and it's five threads in a row of
>LUL ZOMG TROONSCALURZ
faggotry reposting the same five shitty conversions from instagram, but this ponce excretes these shitty blobmen "saturnine" etc and suddenly everyone's cool with 12 metre tall marines with the proportions of a shitty anime villain?

Either this is extremely dedicated astroturfed shilling for this guy's T O L marines, or the antiTortugafags really was just the resident Rooskies chimping out.

>>96676598
models that aren't plastic or metal are not "reasonable".

>>96676598
No, it's because it's Friday night in America and there's no longer any Brits here to counter eastern European retardation on that side of the world.

>>96672839
I'm only interested in the miniatures, so if that means new mk7s and boxnaughts I'll be good

>>96676068
>nu-head
The ones nobody was talking about? Again, these were the helmets we were talking about: >>96674869

>>96676659
You can tell when anons in those regions wake up by the average quality of posts plummeting.

>>96677079
anon, we in eastern europe never sleep. Post 24/7.

>>96677113
I especially prefer to post during burger hours to have them take all the blame for my retardation and autism.

>>96676063

I guess you can do that over two separate turns, neat trick. It's a shame you can't give the Harbie wings, because if I understand the reserve rules correctly you'd then be able to join a True Believers master of descent, drop your spawning squad round 1 and then deploy a bunch of demons off them round 2, which is fast enough to actually be viable.

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>>96673543
>Perty's dudes literally run out of ammo
I'm wheezing

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>>96674766
>team piss
Yes, it's called that for a reason

>>96673543
The only retard in this situation is Dorn and that's impressive when the opponent is perturabo
Possibly the most retarded piece of lore ever written before they made up primaris marines

>>96677363
It was just the usual primarch/astartes retardation.
Otherwise Ferrus should have exterminatus Isstvan V with cyclonic torpedoes and called it day.

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>>96677164
Balkans+Eastern Europe=always messing anglsaxon days.

>>96677373
And destroy the evidence of the traitors for them? Sounds sus to me.

did anyone get the fellblade? hows the build?

>>96677715
>did anyone on /hhg/ in year of our lord twenty twenty-five buy current gw kit
oh I am laffin

>>96677766
Anon most of the actual model posters here have been using the mk2 and saturnine