So we all know we are supposed to hate DnD and its derivates here but it's the game people are familiar with and therefore the one you can actually find someone to play with you. So my question goes: what edition or game is the best (or least shit if that suits you best) among DnD and its derivates? 3.5e? AD&D? Pathfinder?
>>96683844ADND2e, play with your friends, if a friend isn't interested in learning a system when you offer to run it and offer a premade you shouldn't be playing with them at all in any system, they don't want you to know this but you can just play the game you want to play.
>>96683844I like 3.5e and I was able to convert a couple of people from 5e. I would like to play Pathfinder but I can't find anyone who would teach me/play with me that has experience in it.
>>96683844D&D 4th editionIt was ahead of its time and hamstrung by a terrible marketing campaign and even worse 3rd party license. The game itself is a masterpiece of tactical rpgs, and influenced many of the games that would come later.
I am an avid fan of grid-based tactical combat RPGs. My favorites are D&D 4e, Path/Starfinder 2e, Draw Steel, Tom Abbadon's ICON (2.0 just went out into public playtesting: >>96683335 ), Tailfeathers/Kazzam, Tacticians of Ahm, and level2janitor's Tactiquest.For something less griddy, but still reasonably crunch-focused and D&D-adjacent, I am a great fan of 13th Age 2e. I think its release version is a fantastic balance patch: https://archive.4plebs.org/tg/thread/96334337/#96398798
>>96683844AD&D 1e & 2e are for playing a survival horror rpg with wargame elements.D&D 3e, 3.5, & Pathfinder 1e are for people who's favorite toys growing up were legos and bionicle or if your favorite videogames were modded minecraft and/or elderscrolls. It's basically rules-Kitbashing: the rpg4e is for people addicted to MMOs.5e is for normies and tumblrfags.Personally, I think 3/3.5/PF was the best rules-wise. If you had a problem with any rules, you could bet there was a supplement that gave an alternatibe you liked. 3e was the elder scrolls of ttrpgs, there was a mod for Anything.
>>96684182Yeah, I like 3.5e too. For me it's the way the structure of the system support houserules as much as they support splatbooks.
>>96683844I've at least dipped my toe into all the WotC editions, and my answer ended up being a homebrew monstrosity built upon some of what each had to offer.
>>96684095The only thing it did wrong was have presentation be consistent and a clear divide between the rules of man and monster.I've had countless arguments with people in my homebrew days over how I statted 3e monsters to where I just started answering stupid questions with "Because I fucking said so".
>>96684182>4e is for people addicted to MMOs.Yes I remember the MMO comparisons. A massive elaborate crafting system, massively convoluted build guides, massive amount of expansions with insane power creep, tons of optimization exploits that break the economy, ridiculous shortcuts to power, and gamebreaking bullshit like cure-light-wounds-at-will wands costing less than a handful of potions. The bullshit stat and number inflation in the lategame was also really bad.Oh wait, that's 3e.
>>966838442014 5th edition. play with the power creep books if you want the game to be more interesting, without if you want action economy to really really matter.
>>96683844Contrary to some brain worm that told you so, people do like d&d
I'm a big fan of 13th age. Both the rulebook and the product line are very condensed. It is a game that is greatly improved by collecting the periphrial books and stapling things together ( tension dice from the megadungeon eyes of the stone thief as a universal mechanic, holdings and runes to fill out the destiny dice pool with iconic relationships)13th age fixes several reoccuring problems with DnD. Heavy on class fantasy, heavy on dice, heavy on loot. Lite on rules. No other game mixes this level of strategic/tactical depth with ease and notably SPEED of play. DnD without simulationism, some lite narrative elements to empower players but mostly a very gamist edition.
>I am retarded and bored, here is my idiotic bait post, now please send (You)sFuck off, OP
>>96684373Nice strawman. I love hove you completely avoided the context that WotC built the 4e rules system for an actual MMO that got shitcanned in development. I especially love how you completely avoided the central argument as to why people compare 4e to MMOs: The over-reliance on gamist design in a game series known for trying to be simulations(often to it's own detriment).All of your points fall flat when you get down to actual game table. 4e was Built for an MMO and Plays like an MMO, there's no amount of cope that will hide this.
>>966838443.5 for the modern experienceBX for the classic experience
>>96684780If MMOs played anything like 4e did they would actually be fun.
>>96683844>and therefore the one you can actually find someone to play withWrong. People will play whatever the GM wants to play.If the GM wants to play vampire, star wars or even gurps, that's what the players will play.The only people who think they can only play what is popular are people too lazy to GM.
>>96685059>t. entered the hobby and DnD in early 00s
>>96683844>Strawman this blatant>Dumb faggots replying anyway
>>96685303>No counter-point and can only argue from emotionEvery time. 4e shills never change.
>>96684780>avoided the context that WotC built the 4e rules system for an actual MMO that got shitcanned in developmentIn all the years I've played and talked about 4e from release, I have never heard this. Are you confusing the custom-built tie-in VTT they were working on and which got shitcanned because of the murder suicide and poor documentation for a supposed MMO?Because this is some weird ass new evolution in anti-4e arguments. You people are so desperate to somehow tie 4e to MMOs with an implicit badness that I really don't understand. 4e is quite literally the only edition that has never had an actual game tied to its rules.
>>96683844ADnD for low level power and dungeon crawling.3.5 for the high powered autism and special snowflake feel. 4e for tactical combat and skirmish play. PF2e for middle ground that I mostly use nowadays.
>>96686458>4e is quite literally the only edition that has never had an actual game tied to its rules.Welcome newfag, I reccomend looking up the neverwinter MMO. Not neverwinter nights, it's literally just called "Neverwinter"
>>96683844Basic D&D and AD&D 2e for the simple stuff, D&D 3.5 for the complex stuff.
>>96686628Wait, the anon here >>96684780 said the MMO was shitcanned, yet Neverwinter exists and is supposedly based on 4e. This is still a contradiction of their post.And from everything I'm reading, while Neverwinter MMO is supposedly based on 4e, most people say its basically nothing more than standard MMO stuff with 4e names slapped onto them. Making it basically not 4e.It also doesn't explain why 4e being supposedly built for MMOs (despite all books and articles that talked about 4e up to release never mentioned this) is a bad thing.
>>96686746Neverwinter wasn't the shitcanned mmo, it came later.I'm not even sure the shitcanned mmo even had a name, that idea was killed while 4e was still in dev. The original plan was to release an mmo and the ttrpg at the same time to maximize market.
>>96686949>The original plan was to release an mmo and the ttrpg at the same time to maximize market.There was to be a VTT, not an MMO. Again, where is the evidence for the MMO, we have the evidence for the VTT.
