ClassesSpellsSkills?Alignment? Magic ItemsEconomyCastles and Holdings HirelingsDungeoneeringOverland TravelDowntime ActionsTracking TimeWhat am I missing? So, the question is - what game does each subsystem best? Alot of Fantasy Heartbreakers have come to market recently and I've been reading some classics like Hackmaster. Part of me wants to staple everything together DTD style.
>>96825358>D&DYou already failed
>>96825616FPBP/thread
>>96825358A good place to start is to ask what you'd consider the best for each. Some people like pointcrawls, others like hexes or abstractions. How involved do you want domain play to be?There is no single best way to do any of these things, except sea travel. There is a correct way to do sea travel.
>>96825673The Birthright sailing subsystem is the correct way. I forgot to add it because of how correct it is.
>>96825616>>96825624t. dumb nogames.
>>96825358>ClassesI think AD&D for "class fantasy" given the unique XP sources and Domain play options, while in terms of ground coverable by the structure 3.5 ACFs, variants, and substitution levels plus multiclassing following through into prestige classes is vastly easier to fill out design space.>SpellsThe TSR days had a lot more shit in the way of treating them as silver bullets to use as you wish. On the other hand, 3.X did many funny things, like a spell that lets you do a large chunk of basic +numbers item crafting as a Permanent buff fueled by a demon you can let drive the recipient crazy.>Alignment?B/X because the Good/Evil axis is cursed by midwits on both sides of the screen. And sale.>Magic ItemsI give this one to 3.X for hard exclusivity and it being vaguely reasonable to make them, even if XP costs bottleneck the macro-economics of it HARD.>EconomyFor being able to engage with things at all 3.X wins basically by default, for actually making a lick of sense probably one of the Domain play focused books from the TSR days.>Castles and HoldingsProbably AD&D via Birthright.>HirelingsNot sure which TSR edition, but definitely one of them as 3e reduced them to rarely-useful side-pieces and later WotC editions barely bothered with a footnote>DungeoneeringAs with many things, somewhere in the clusterfuck of AD&D permutations, probably stock as it was still the "main" focus.>Overland TravelDepends strongly on what feel you want for it.>Downtime ActionsWhile jank in many ways, 3.X as usual covers ground in ways far easier to wrap one's head around.>Tracking TimeAgain, somewhere in the AD&D clusterfuck, exact branch depending on what kind of time-pressure you want.
>>96825725I'm sorry for your situation, OP. You'll get invited to a 5e game some day. Probably. If you work on fixing your unbearable faggotry maybe.
>>96825785>classesthis probobly depends on your class in question, but generally newer games do this better>spellsyeah, maybe 3.5 >alignmentI like the 13th age version>magic items3.5 >economy i dont really have an answer to this question. Is it Hackmaster? 3.5 is very fleshed out but its likely mostly untested . Torchbearer? >castleswhy birthright over hackmaster?>hirelingshonestly this is better in like warcraft 3 or talisman or something completely out of the genre. >Dungeoneering prolly adnd or hackmaster >Overland Travel I suppose i was mostly referin to hex crawl and endurance caravaning/seafaring. Wilderness exploration , traveling a known area is usually much safer. >Downtime ActionsICON by tom abbadon is best in class here >tracking timeyou dont think anyone has iterated on a better system here?
WoundsI need a system that tracks wounds with a ton of detail. I honestly don't care if the level of detail makes it unplayable.
also bonus points to WHFRP for having the best mass combat for a TTRPG by playing WHFB
>>96826449Sounds like projection, nogames tard.
If anyone is nogames in this thread they can always join my gamei have 52 available classes and the party is cleric, wizard variant rogue, warlord/commander/marshal type guy and a barbarian. two humans, a minotaur, a duck and a naga.
>>96825358As far as I'm concerned 5e basically nailed classes. The Class/Subclass system is probably one of 5e's best points. You have a core class with actual features (unlike PF2e where the classes have basically no actual features, all their features are locked to Class Feats), then you can get more features or modify existing features through a Subclass. It's simple, elegant, and is better than having classes that are just "X Class but Y" like 3.PF1e did.
>>96827750did u start with 5e? Older editions weren't afraid to print more classes. 5e gave up really after Mystic. Artificer and Warlock are much simplier than their earlier versions- both of these classes could benefit a great deal from dedicated spells. There are room for more base classes too, like Jester , Summoner and Witch being low hanging fruit
>>96826469...Oh, I was under the impression that "games" was confined to D&D editions from the thread title being "in D&D". I have very little understanding of existing heartbreakers.
>>96828473I still find your feedback relevent. Can you tell me more about some of the birthright subsystems? Can you compare and contrast the castle building rules between that and hackmaster?
maybe torchbearer is the best game at tracking time.
>>96825358The best place to start is to ask if a game could be improved by removing a subsystem, or just making it part of the core system. The answer is usually yes. You are done creating when there is nothing left to remove.
>>96827750Yikes.
>>96825358Retroclones & NSR do all of this better than modern D&D and it's reskins. They're way easier to hack and staple together too. Best bet is to read games and find out what you like from each. That's why there is a million retroclones.
>>96827739>a duckOne of our games had a Mycelium that died in the first round of the first combat. He rolled another character but the spores were still hanging around on the party's clothes. Unfortunately the campaign never finished so we never had the chance to play out what could have happened to the spores but I liked the idea.
>>96830557We had a mushrooman myconoid alchemist in our party when we were raiding the kobold/tiamat themed megadungeon. He was a guest character for two or three weeks but he is fondly remembered- i kind of DMPC'd him to justify getting the party more healing potions. What class was your mushroom person?>>96830438some of these subsystems need to be closer to the core of the system. Designing a full scale economy is very difficult.
>>96830967We were playing race as class. OSE>Mycelians are humanoid mushrooms, with tall stems, wide, flat caps, and beady eyes amid their gills. They have no mouths, but communicate telepathically. They dwell in lightless caverns deep underground.We sacked off the telepathy because the players voice was so good and was based on Brian Badonde. https://youtu.be/VJenbaL8SM0Is your duck a literal duck?
>>96830967Good job adding nothing meaningful to my post, which stands on its own and requires no assistance.
>>96831699a classic runequest style duck. He has cleric levels. Longest running character in this game.
>>96832932>RQI'm quite unfamiliar with it but it sounds cool. Which RQ is least crunchy? I've looked at it before and I understand the pitch but I could never wrap my head around the setting and how i'd run it.
>>968277505e's classes are ideal from a player perspective- classes work correctly, power goes up correctly, subclasses provide the real meat of the lore, and fit in nicely with the base class. But from a designer's perspective they are less ideal. To create a class from scratch in 5e is much harder than in 3.X or older. To create a subclass is well within the purview of even a novice homebrewer, but if the fantasy in question isn't captured well enough by the base class, it creates its own issues. I think 5e's class system is great, but it's such a hard wall to climb to add basic shit like ninja or samurai, and the system tries to gaslight you into thinking those are subclasses. It's still totally doable, it's just more effort.
>>96833406lol
>>9683298913th age glorantha is the least crunchy>>96833406im glad ur happy with ur mcchicken dude. I think a class system that is resistant to adding new classes is hard to do well and I don't think 5e does it well. Even boomer dnd had a better class list than 5.1. My game has 52 classes ( I'd say 5 of them should be cut ) and players build their own subclass which leads to a much large variety of characters than something like 3.pf or 5e where you pick your subclass and most of the rest of your character is pretty autobuild
