>be Imperium>ships never arrive on time>constantly losing planets>barely understand how tech works>made it to M40 only because everyone else in the setting is smaller>still think IOM can beat Galactic Empirewhy 40k fans still think they can beat Star Wars
>>96837875You missed the general.
>>96838010my bad bro
>>96837875Because everyone in Star Wars is fucking incompetent on a level that's worse than 40K - they don't even have the excuse of being a backwards, superstitious theocracy that makes a virtue of ignorance.The Empire of Star Wars lost to fucking ewoks and a scruffy nerf herder. The New Republic was even worse at managing its territories than the Imperium of Mankind, and almost got BTFO by the First Order if not for Rey Sue. The Old Republic didn't even have a standing army by the time Palpatine executed babby's first dictatorship and were getting their shit pushed in by the . . . periphery planets who just spammed droids. Even if you dip into the decanonised Star Wars EU, 40K novels have just as much if not greater tardery to bring to bear. At the end of the day, anon . . . the Force is Female.
>>96837875>>ships never arrive on timeIncorrect>>made it to M40 only because everyone else in the setting is smallerWildly incorrect
the reality of any sci-fi vs sci-fi what-if is that the one with better ftl travel (if any) wins automatically in any large scale conflict. Star wars FTL is borderline videogame fast travel convenient which gives them such a stupidly large advantage over pretty much any other sci-fi shit because Starwars is a space fantasy soap opera that sees travel time as so incredibly boring and inconvenient to the kinds of stories it wants to tell that it skips it entirely. There's some sci-fi settings with straight up direct teleportation that's even more convenient than Starwars hyperspace who'd win just by teleporting out of every fight and popping above the empire's planets to blow them up before instantly leaving, but that's getting into like Dragonball Z levels of retarded power ceiling.Plenty of Warhammer characters could probably beat other sci-fi characters in a fist fight or space wizard duel but that's irrelevant when travel time operates on a scale of weeks to months to even YEARS just moving between planets, while in Starwars you can get from the fucking galactic core's capital city of Coruscant to the bumfuck edge of the galaxy like Mustafar in a matter of hours, which is literally what Palestine did when fetching Anakin's burnt body after he lost. Imagine if you could get from the eye of terror to Holy Terra in like four hours in 40k.
>>96838920I mean, both Hyperspace travel and Warp travel have their downsides.Hyperspace travel needs established hyperspace routes, or it gets really dangerous. The Imperium doesnt know any hyperspace routes in the 40k space. Likewise, if the Astronomicon doesnt shine in the star wars galaxy, the imperium is borderline fucked.So any versus conflict would first have to establish rules how each metaphysic system fuctions and overlaps
As much as >>96838920 point about FTL is valid within the same setting (best FTL win) it's just meaningless to compare distinct setting.All those "who would win" thread, only have one interesting outcome: finding the right set of circumstance or enemies to have an interesting match to talk about. Having a victor isn't even relevant.Me, I say the Lunar War setting beat Starwars and W40K. As they appear somewhere the laws of physics collapse for them and they all die.
>>96838920You're both heavily exaggerating how effective star wars FTL is and how much impact modes of transport have on war in general. Sure being able to pick your battles is a great advantage but it doesn't help if the only options you have to pick from are shit.
>>96839445how are they shit? Ravaging the imperiums back line, cutting their supply, their production and their agri worlds will mess with their ability to bring and keep fighting power at the front lines. The imperium cant station a sector fleet at every single one of their backline planets
>>96839445anon if you're spending six months traveling and the other guy is spending six hours traveling, that means for six months you don't even HAVE an armylogistics is the only thing that actually wins wars and if the entire imperium's fleet is two months into warp travel when 90% of the imperium's planets are destroyed that's gg. some of the Aztecs managed to kill a couple Spaniards during the conquistador era, but the Aztecs didn't have a single fucking ship capable of sailing to Spain and actually hurting the Spanish.
>it's another episode of desperate SWfags pretending that their ships do not need previously mapped stable hyperspace lanes or otherwise they're just as slow or worse than 40k ships>they only cling to that because 40k mogs SW in all other areas military-wise
>>96839459>how are they shit? Ravaging the imperiums back line, cutting their supply, their production and their agri worlds will mess with their ability to bring and keep fighting power at the front lines. The imperium cant station a sector fleet at every single one of their backline planetsAnd what are they going to do if IoM push the offensive? How is them being able to attack an agricultural world going to help them if the IoM hit coruscant with a virus bomb? Also while there aren't sector fleets for every planet, planets of strategic value have system defense fleets that lack FTL capabilites but are roughly equivalent to IoM destroyers and frigates.
>>96839560>it's another episode of desperate SWfags pretending that their ships do not need previously mapped stable hyperspace lanes or otherwise they're just as slow or worse than 40k shipsAs if 40k ships don't need stable warp lanes mapped out by the Navigator guilds, right? lmao>they only cling to that because 40k mogs SW in all other areas military-wiseStandard issue blasters are plasma guns. 40k warships use human crews to load their macrocannons which can take several minutes. 40k warships can't be mass produced anymore because they're barely understood tech to their own tech experts, who also take years to produce a single ship because they only know how to do so via rituals and superstition.
>>96839628>push the offensive>while supply of material and food collapses>what is the Empire going to do?????? What do you think Guardsmen eat and shoot and drive? Faith and Autism?
>>96839505>anon if you're spending six months traveling and the other guy is spending six hours traveling, that means for six months you don't even HAVE an armylogistics is the only thing that actually wins wars and if the entire imperium's fleet is two months into warp travel when 90% of the imperium's planets are destroyed that's gg.Yeah I guess if they just make dumbass choices like a strawman than it's pretty easy.>some of the Aztecs managed to kill a couple Spaniards during the conquistador era, but the Aztecs didn't have a single fucking ship capable of sailing to Spain and actually hurting the Spanish.So you're saying that if the aztecs had ships 10x as fast as the spainish but nothing else, they would have conquered spain because "spain would just put their entire military on a boat and then aztecs would rank undefended spain?"
>>96839647Good job reading only the first sentence of the post anon. I know reading is difficult for you but just that one sentence shows you really put in the effort!
>>96839691>why dont they just drive by and oneshot virusbomb Coruscantfor the same reason this doesnt happen with eldar craftworlds, the major Tau home septs, the prime ork planets and every other of extreme value. Beside the fact the EU empire kept fighting for decades after Coruscant fell to the New Republic
>>96839646>Navigator guildslol>Standard issue blasters are plasma gunshahahah>40k warships can't be mass produced anymore stap, lmao
>>96839647what prevents Terra, Mars, Luna and Titan being one-shot by Starkiller Base halfway across the galaxy?
>>96839732meant for >>96839706>>96839628
>>96839646>As if 40k ships don't need stable warp lanes mapped out by the Navigator guilds, right? lmaoThey don't NEED it, it just makes it easier. It's like comparing an all terrain vehicle vs a train. Sure a train is going to you to anywhere that's connected by rail faster, and the ATV is going to mostly be using roads since roads are better to drive on then dirt. But what is the train going to do if getting from A to B requires you to take an out of the way route but there's a dirt path directly to it?>Standard issue blasters are plasma guns.Incorrect, you mas well claim a tank shell and 9mm and .50 BMG is the same because they're both bullets.40k warships use human crews to load their macrocannons which can take several minutes. And starwars ships have weapons that have an effective range that's shorter than what warhammer considers boarding distance.>40k warships can't be mass produced anymore because they're barely understood tech to their own tech experts,Incorrect, they just aren't able to improve on the designs they currently have, there's several forge worlds that pump out warships.>who also take years to produce a single ship because they only know how to do so via rituals and superstition.Again, incorrect, they have the exact blueprints on how to make them. It takes a year to make an average warship because the smallest warships are bigger than your typical star destroyer.
>>96839706Craftworlds have powerful fleets and foresight. The Imperium steers clear of craftworlds because they are too dangerous to antagonize unless they are weakened or small craftworlds.During the Damocles Crusade, the Imperials considered Exterminatus'ing Dal'yth Prime but there was much protest against it in the Crusade Council because the T'au were honorable foes and didn't deserve to be nuked from orbit.However, 200 years later, the Imperium Exterminatus'ed the major sept of Muglath Bay and other Tau held worlds using an arcane DAoT weapon.
>>968397321.there's no mapped hyperspace lanes in 40k2.the Sequels are retarded and do not countAlso, killing the 40k planets does not help the SW empire, because once the 40k fleets exit the warp, is game over for anything in SW short of a Death Star. They'll be only delaying their death
>>96837875>why 40k fans still think they can beat Star WarsEwoks are OP as fuck in Star Wars, they're barely a Tau client race at best in 40gay.
>>96839732Void shields.
>>96838920Who cares about their space travel? Pointless logistics stuff like that has nothing to do with winning a war. That's about strength and determination above all else.
>>96839765There actually are mapped hyperspace lanes in 40k, the Tau and Eldar use them.Humanity in 40k is just retarded and tainted by Chaos.
>>96839732if Cadia could stop a Blackstone Fortress from firing it's giga planet destroyer warp cannon I'm sure they could stop a beam from a knockoff death starthey'd deep strike terminators into Starkiller base and destroy it and none of the shitty stormtroopers could stop them
>>96839856False equivalence.Cadia survived the WARP BEAM of the BSF because it was protected by a boosted gellar field augmented by Necron technology.Cadia has no protection against a standard energy laser blast.
>>96839856Blackstone fortress needed to get really close and Cadia had help from Trazyn. Starkiller based fires half a galaxy away without the Imperium even knowing. Night and day difference.
>>96839898>Cadia has no protection against a standard energy laser blast.>void shields? What's that?
>>96839930Cadia didn't have planet-sized void shields. Don't think such a thing exists.The Black Legion was running orbital fire on Cadia nonstop. They could have used ordinary extermintus on Cadia but Abaddon wanted Cadia obliterated. It was the only way the Pylons that shutdown the Pylons
>>96839853>There actually are mapped hyperspace lanes in 40kno they don't, you coping SWfag.In fact, allowing hyperspace in 40k is just a concession so SW aren't stranded for the purposes of the comparison.Additionally, the similarities between hyperspace/the force and 40k's inmaterium make possible that they're just the same thing. So good luck for SW ships trying to travel it in the 40k galaxy, lol
>>96839898>Cadia has no protection against a standard energy laser blast.You're average white shield is a better marksman than SW elite stormtroopers. They could probably teleport a squad of recruits up there and take it over with 20 men.
>>96837875because said galatic empire lost to a small band of quircky retards despite having far fewer threats to worry about and more reliable tech and infrastructure
>the Imperium will surely win in a figh.... ACK!
>>96837875Which version of SW? If its Disney then it immediately devolves into a MegaCorp death wrestle on who can write the more bad shit than the other.If its the EU then things can get interesting holistically. The Galactic Empire is a civilisation that is c25,000 years old (counting it as part of the Galactic Republic) that has exceeded the previous Republic in territorial control, population size (Being larger than the archaic WEG pop stat for the Republic) and Industrial might after eating both the Republic MIC and the CIS MIC with a bajillion colonising expansions from WEG era lore, and kept churning on until the death of the Emperor. It controls the vast majority of the SW Galaxy and more importantly it entirely controls the important sections of the Galaxy in terms of Industry and encomics. All nonewithstanding the typical author not into scale (ie KT). The previous Republic managed to scale from a very disarmed MIC into being able to outproduce and outfight the CIS within a three year time frame in the first Galactic Scale total war in 1,000 years. Despite this the main deciding factor in a tard match between the Imperium and the Empire is how they travel in space where 40k absolutely shits the bed thanks to warp travel being both Glacialy slow and fucking dangerous. Hyperspace on the other hand is both quick, easy and ubiquitous but requires previous scoting routes which kept being updated. Hyperspace itself is a reflection of normal realspace and so the hyperroutes are actually routes of realspace that have little to no dangerous objects such as stars or black holes that project mass shadows into hyperspace that would destroy a ship enroute. Hypothetically while it would take a while to Map out the milky way its definitely possible and thanks to hyperspace the GE can operate on a comparatively lightspeed tempo to the IoM with its warp travel.
>>96840096And unlike the IoM with its endless deathmatches across the Galaxy where it can't bring its full might to entirely crush a threat, an previous weaker iteration of the GE did scale up to fight a Galactic Total War within 3 years. Thanks to Hyperspace even without muh 3 years example, the GE would be capable of defeating the IoM via defeat in detail via doomstacking naval formations to Base Delta Zero unprotected and important worlds/locations. Or drag out the super duper wonderwaffles to do the same such as the Tarkin or any of the World devestators (which are operational 6 years post Endor but could be available earlier)Hilariously if the Necron Celestial Orrery is workable on the SW galaxy then its game over for the GE (depending if using it on them wouldnt horrendously impact the Milky Way by a galaxy scale blowback for the Necrons to act, or maybe they dont care and instead GTFOing to the SW Galaxy and hide out in the unknown regions while attempting to return to flesh).However SW writers being SW writers and 40k writers being 40k writers it would be entirely shit on both sides. Anyway these SciFi tard debates are a reminder of a much more civilised time before the major Franchises all collectively shit the bed concurrently that made previous fantard moments appear quaint and the Internet was better. Before the Dark Times.
Reminder that if you go >weapon X will totally oneshot the other side or>defense mechanism Y wont ever be penetrated by anythingyou are full of shit and retarded and also engaging in bad faith arguments
>>96837875Those are the only sci-fi 40kids know about
>>96840051delusional, even 40k stormtroopers > SW whatevertroopers, nevermind fucking Astartes
>>96839960>Cadia didn't have planet-sized void shields. Don't think such a thing exists.They do, it did, at one point they got taken down because th before wouldn't have been able to do anything otherwise
>>96840096>>96840116>delusional SW fanboyism the GE, which at their peak couldn't even control it's own space for a decade before being defeated by guerrilla warfare, had to rely on the Senate to keep the peace. The moment they fucked up that, they began losing system after system.Nevermind all the far regions that they never controlled.Or that their mainstay ship, the ISD, it's barely a escort frigate by 40k standards.>Hypothetically while it would take a while to Map out the milky way its definitely possible and thanks to hyperspace the GE can operate on a comparatively lightspeed tempo to the IoM with its warp travel.More delusion. It took the Republic more than a decade to map just the Outer Rim and not fully and in peacetime.SW ships would be exposed to all kind of dangers, and Imperium ships would be the least of their worries, lol>muh Base Delta Zero you sound like one of these STvsSW fags that posted in stardestroyer.net like Curtis Saxton. Just handwaving all issues because you say so.Just coping because capital ships in 40k can fire macrocannon shells the size of corellian corvettes, have plenty of realspace speed, energy weapons, shields, armour, size, teleporters, boarding torpedoes and troops that wipe the floor with anything in SW. Unless you're The Culture or The Xeelee, you better stay in your (hyperspace) lane, SW fanboy.
>>96837875It's always IoM VS SW and never the other more powerful factions from 40k Imagine of the Dark Eldar were in SW, some webway gate opened to the deep levels of Coruscant? Could anything in star wars stop the dark eldar raids that steal away whole planets populations?Could they defeat a single tyranid hive fleet? What about 10? or 20 of them? IoM deals with hundreds of different hive fleets and splinter fleets at a time.What if a tomb world awakens? Could mandalorians beat an awakening tomb world?
>>96837875Same answer as you got the last three hundred pointless threads you made about this.>IOM vastly outrange and outgun 100% of non-wunderwaffen SW vessels. So incredibly badly, it's not even funny.>As in, most SW vessels have gun ranges less than what is considered point blank distances for IOM vessels. And their main guns don't shoot at C, or even fractions of C.>While SW vessels have hyperdrives, these aren't 'get everywhere in ten minutes' drives. They require safe, litter free 'lanes' to travel in safely, or they have to move at a crawl as to not collide with bits of debris.>While Imperial worlds have unreliable inter-group logistics, the actual logistics flow is quite robust, as each system is typically self-sufficient.>SW vessels can outpace IOM fleets to strike at worlds. But said Imperial worlds of any strategic relevance have capital ship grade weaponry on hand, either with monitor ships, or defense lasers/silo's/batteries.So yeah. OP is once again gay, and is once again making me lose that little bit more love for Star Wars and the community.
>>96837875Sure, the Death Star might be individually superior to an Imperial battleship, yet both are mobile space stations capable of blowing up planets and the Imperium has a thousand battleships while the Galactic Empire has one-and-a-half Death Stars. Multiply that for every ship class and even if the IoM can't shit out a fleet of 25,000 in a decade like the Empire can, it will use its existing fleet to knock out the GE's industry before it would be able to bring its economy to its advantage.
>>96839397Arguably any large concentration of the force should probably function similarly to the Astronomicon at a reduced scale. Coruscant could arguably be enough of a force nexus that it actually matches the Astronomicon.
>>96839998It's a given in any crossover context that technology or magic or whatever doesn't suddenly just stop working because the settings are different.You could equally point out there's no warp in star wars so all the psykers would instantly be "cured" and chaos would be unable to act. But there's no point in discussing that and no way to find common ground, so just assume everything just keeps on trucking.I mean can they even breath each others air? Would they be wiped out by exposure to the others diseases? Do blasters and lasguns both work? Not worth discussing unless you enjoy that sort of thing.
Something to remember is that WH40k the Imperium controls more or less the entire galaxy, while the GE controlled at best half the galaxy before the rebellionSWhttps://gizmodo.com/app/uploads/2025/06/star_wars_galaxy_map_4000x4000_24949c08.jpegWH40khttps://i.imgur.com/vGeNNHH.jpeg
>>96837875>yet another "my dad can beat up your dad" thread
>This kills the imperium.
>>96839670The entire Empire's fleet can teleport across the map and hit planets with small and weak defender fleets. They can blow up and glass planets, so they can presumably beat the shitty backwater Imperium mini-fleets, and then loot any super weapons they supposedly have. They can then teleport across the map home, hand off the ships to their top scientists (gathered from across the galaxy inside a week), who will be copying them in no time. Then they just teleport across the map again and blow up Holy Terra. Meanwhile, the Imperium fleets have managed to hit the absolute closest system, and are now sluggishly grinding on towards the next system.
>>96841706>it will use its existing fleet to knock out the GE's industry before it would be able to bring its economy to its advantage.Warp travel is absolutely not fast and reliable enough to do that, c'mon.The Death Star was a project produced in absolute secrecy, only known to actual members of government because of spies and leaks. If the actual industrial power of the Republic/Empire was marshaled without need for secrecy - as would be the case if they encountered these Imperium loser psychos - they could churn them out like hotcakes.
>>9683787540kfags are infested with Chaosfags who would insist that chaos beats everything easily in any vs match. There used to be a regular bait thread about a Dalek appearing in 40k that was guaranteed to get the Chaosfags frothing with rage at the notion that the Dalek would just immediately time jump to before the Big Bang, delete the Warp, and proceed from there.
>>96839960Planet-scale voids are rare but do exist. Cadia and Terra both have them (Terra also has layered void shields around the Palace).
Reminder that the Empire doesnt have hyper autist and utterly dysfunctional administration and bonkers religious dogma. Once the Empire realizes its weakness in area A, B and C coming the first few engagements, they can start to reverse engineer and actively innovate to either adapt, steal or overcome shit like ceramite astartes armor, void shields or makro cannon. They can start to entirely change their ship design and set their massive shipyards like Kuat, Fondor, Yaga Minor, Bilbringi, Corellia and Byss to work on overdrive.The Imperium meanwhile cant do that because technological progress is haram and hyper heresy and will see you get burned on a stake. Or some Magos will hoard any new desgins in a vaul, where it will rot forgotten for the next 5.000 years.The Empire can out-adapt the Imperium way faster and way easier.
>>96842239SW Empire was basically destroyed by 20+ yo farmer boy and bunch of ragtag rebels
>>96840355>the GE, which at their peak couldn't even control it's own space for a decade before being defeated by guerrilla warfareThe Imperium doesn’t avoid getting harassed by guerrilla forces because they’re better at handling them.They avoid it because they literally can’t do it. Their fleets take years to cross the galaxy.The only reason planets don’t rise up like the Rebellion is because nobody can escape, nobody can get help, and by the time anyone responds, the entire situation has already died of old age.That’s not an advantage.That’s just a logistical disaster pretending to be stability.
>>96839560>they only cling to that because 40k mogs SW in all other areas military-wiseJust so I can stan up for the underdog the empire probably has a more reliable R&D department than the imperium and given their avaiable resources and manpower they could probably develop technology and tactics to counter whatever massive the ovee the tops things the imperium throws at them repeatedly which could give the galatic empire a better fighting chance agains't a far stronger opponentSee: Damocles (though it's hard to compare because the T'au had way less resources than what the empire has and arguably a more competent military)
>>96837875Because VS debaters like yourself are all retarded.
>>96842239>>96843007the SW galaxy is just as technologically stale as the 40k Milky Way. Starship battles from the Old Republic are indistinguishable from the Clone Wars and from the Rebellion era. It's obvious besides a few superweapons. And SW ships are not made to last, they're become space trash after a few decades unlike 40k ships still functional after millenia of use.>They can start to entirely change their ship design and set their massive shipyards like Kuat, Fondor, Yaga Minor, Bilbringi, Corellia and Byss to work on overdrive.Bullshit, they didn't do it for any of their wars, or even when the Vong invaded. Most of these shipyards are only good for civilian stuff. >>96842972>Their fleets take years to cross the galaxy.Retarded memelore.It usually takes a few days, weeks or months to travel most distances in 40k. But in reality it depends of how well is know the warp route and how bad are the storms, with little correlation to realspace distances. Warp travel taking years or arriving before leaving are exceptions, not the norm. And it's usually due to local warp conditions.Reaching some star systems may indeed take years while others just next door just take weeks.But the Imperium still has an interstellar economy, and very stable trading and resource gathering routes (like they do with the Black Ships to get psykers)Btw your pic makes me laught. Marines destroy baseline human meatbags unless they're lucky enought to get a shot with a heavy/special weapon, or they're swarmed up by hordes of zealots (neither of which are SW things)
Is the only reason OP keeps powerscaling IoM and The Empire because they both are "Empires"? Or is he just a Star Wars fag that is desperate to prove his toys are stronger than your toys? Can't be just "proving 40K isn't the top SF setting" cuz there are many way easier choices than Star Wars for that.
>>96843007The issue I think with comparing galaxies, is the naval culture is very very different.In star wars, naval combat is a very very close-in thing. You've got carriers, sure, but 90% of things is just to get people close up to each other to, at best, strafe.This is because while superweapons do exist, 95% of military development and warfighting is spearheaded by force users, who often prefer engaging in close quarters. And, in fairness, you could say the universe itself (by way of The Force), supports this perspective.Meanwhile, while that's also true in 40k, naval combat there is spearheaded by people with no such fixations.So you get bigger guns. Bigger armour. And despite preconceptions, greater sub-light speed and maneuverability. (Though in fairness, this is because ships in Star Wars can generally just use ftl to get right on top of where they want to go, before taxi-ing down).Instead of Galley style naval combat, with some hints of carrier war, you get Battle lines, firing control systems, and military sciences closer to those of ww2 in all fact.>t.naval autist
>>96843586Desperate Star Wars fag.We've had this exact thread before, several times. It always ends the same way.I also know OP then rageposts the same things on reddit. Typically a screencap of his own OP post, with the title "Is this true???"
>>96843589>In star wars, naval combat is a very very close-in thing. You've got carriers, sure, but 90% of things is just to get people close up to each other to, at best, strafe.If you know enough to comment, do you think for within the same solar system only (talking tactical not strategic here) either UNSC (Halo) or ESF (Universal Century Gundam) would have a good old slugging match? All three fight in close range with carriers, UC even has dogfighters though the UNSC... doesn't I don't think. I think they are all roughly the same power level and approach so it could be a good spectacle.
>>96842874The 20 year old farmer boy is the son of the chosen one and will become one of the most powerful jedi in existance. The rebel alliance is a well organized army of professional insurgency cells, led by skilled military leaders and supported by powerful galactic nations like the Mon Calamari. Highly insincere post.
>>96842239>the Empire doesnt have hyper autist and utterly dysfunctional administration and bonkers religious dogmaI don't know what bullshit they put into star wars post-TFA because I just ignored it, but that's so far from the truth its funny. The galactic empire is the epitome of bonkers religious dogma. Their emperor is practically worshipped as a god. Being part of his cult is so restricted and exclusive that there's only one guy other than him, which doesn't stop dozens of wannabe sith apprentices from trying.
>>96843683The Imperium form WH40k has a shitload of genetically altered chosen ones, related in a some way to the most powerful human in the existence, some of them even have magic powers, you know?
>>96842239BTW, weren't TIE fighters designed as expendable flying space coffins on the purpose?Being a TIE fighter pilot is as grim fate as being Imperial Guardsman.
>>96837875What an abysmal thread.While we're at it, can any 40k anon explain how would any Imperium vessel fare against the humble buzz droid swarm?Obviously after the void shields get overwhelmed.
>>96843762Yeah, its cost cutting and doctrine. If your doctrine is focussed on capital ships and starfighters are an afterthought, it makes sense to cut corners by removing shields. After all, you need to produce a gorillion TIEs, for every bumfuck frontier world and every small outer rim garrison
>>96843802>mildly hazardous automaton-lifeIt's one more tall tale for the officers table while the bilge slummers hunt them down with crowbars for the fighting-pits on deck 83. A few escape and become a symbiotic part of the ship ecosystem, catching rats or scraping algae from the walls in exchange for black market recharging sessions in the ventral servitor stables.
>>96843802>The best SW fans can do is a swarm of missile launched droids not even specifically designed to hard-kill enemy capital ship combatants, but disable near-unarmoured fighter craft.Ignoring the point defenses, and the computational difficulties of hitting an escort frigate (given their operating speeds, there's a good chance they could genuinely be outrun), we've got the secondary, tertiary, and quaternary point defenses to look at, to engage near-hull, and on-hull targets.Going past that, you've got the meters thick armour that the buzz droid needs to cut through. In some vessels, there will be specialized compartments behind these, designed to vent explosively to dislodge boarders, or simply confine them to make dealing with them, by turrets or ratings, easier.Other ships utilize field bracing, generating power fields over the hull and structural supports to further reinforce the ship, as well as function similarly to a power weapon, when used offensively to ram or batter.Now, we assume the buzz droid makes it past all these defenses, and isn't atomized by the power field the ship may or may not also generate overtop itself, the fact is, it's got to hold onto the hull as the Imperium vessel maneuvers, and remain in roughly the same spot, while it uses its small circular saw to slowly dig a hole through meters of solid adamantium. Not cut, but literally dig, as it's limbs clearly don't reach deep enough to pen the outer hull.Honestly, their best use would probably, genuinely, be to overwhelm the void shields.
>40k is getting overglazed yet again Yawn
Star Wars top duelists vs 40K top duelists is a more interesting discussion since at least duelists have specific feats you can compare, like Starkiller vs Sanguinius or whatever else you wanna argue about.
>>9684401740kiddies literally can't help themselves. They don't read their own lore, they're famous for it. They think 40k is just a powerlevel wank fantasy
>>96837875>One suicide pilot destroys Vader's flagship>>96844017Cope SWfaggot. You retards are the one unironically believing in the "Imperium doesn't know how to make ships anymore!" and the "it takes years to make a single trip in warp travel" memes.
>>96843762Kinda.The Navy demanded a fast fighter that can be fielded cheaply in huge numbers for their newly reorginized fleet after the Clone Wars.Seinar decided to make that happen by stripping anything from the design that wasnt connected to either guns or the ion engines.Removing the shields and life support simply made the graph go up.
>It can take years or even decades for 40k ships to reach their destinations with warp technology!Motherfuckers, the entire Horus Heresy only took seven to ten years. If each warp jump took fucking decades, how did the loyalists and traitors wage a galaxy-spanning war in that amount of time? Not to mention all the other battles or conflicts that lasted much shorter than that.
>>96840035>>96837875The Galactic Empire will wi- WHOAH WHOA WHOAH WATCH OUTIT'S A BUNCH OF WOODEN LOGS!!!!!!
>>96839646>star wars blasters are plasma gunsLeia and many other characters survived a direct hit from a blaster. The guy who made a last stand at the end of Rogue One tanked multiple blaster hits before going down. >40k ships can't be mass produced anymore Yup, you don't know what the fuck you are talking about. Forge Worlds and even industrialized worlds can make warp ships. Even fucking cavemen can make a 5km long imperial warship that mogs Star Destroyers>Perhaps its greatest strength is theLunar's ease of construction, since it can be manufactured even in orbit ofHive WorldsandIndustrial Worldswith little-to-no shipbuilding expertise, a fact which is most ably illustrated by the manufacture of theLord Daros, aLunar-class vessel that was actually constructed by the barbaric denizens of an ImperialFeral Worldwith no industrial base of any kind.https://warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Lunar-class_CruiserSeriously, why do you even try talking shit about 40k when you don't even know the basic lore besides stupid memes?
>>96839742>>96844247>r*ddit spacinggo back and take your gay game with you shitskins
>bro, 40k is so strong bro>they cant even penetrate a single space marine armor>they just cant, ok?>no, they cant board then a corvet>it has like a gazillion point defence guns, 49 layers deep>what, 40k factions board ships all the time? Yeah, we will ignore that>dude, imperium planets are so badass, like not even 20 super star destroyers could penetrate the void shields>what, other 40k factions do planetary bombardment all the time? I´ll ignore that>dude, haha, only the single lowest and weakest Star Wars source is valid, everything else is headcanon>btw, take this one quote of some literally who black library book>it says space marines can piss at the speed of light>did i mention the average space marine librarian is like Palpatine, Vitiate and Abeloth tier with his powers?>its so over bro, the imperium could just do a drive by virus bomb and destroy every planet>what? Why they never no that in 40k? Shut up star wars fag!>no, the hyper autistic imperial administratum and admech is actually hyper effective and efficient, all the lore about the decaying state of the imperium is wrongthe absolute state
>>96839560>SWfags pretending that their ships do not need previously mapped stable hyperspace lanes or otherwise they're just as slow or worse than 40k shipsWhere is that retcon coming from? Cause it doesn't match anything published.SW ship just hyperspeed to any star system they care to go to, or slam into superfortress, the IoM better not forget their Void shield.
>>96844464>>96844039Lmao it's you SWfaggots who keep on making disingenuous crap that are hinged on memelore like this fucking idiot >>96839646
>>96844471Yes. All of that is true. Reminder that Star Wars turbolasers have less range than IRL ballistic missiles. Now fuck off with your faggot setting
[nodiffs every mortal in your setting]Psh, nothing personnel. >but what about these gods!Not what was claimed.
>>96844554I suddenly remember someone else posted about the range of SW ship guns compares to 40k engagements from another SW wank thread. 40k boarding actions begin at tens of thousands of kilometers.
>>96837875>fleet of final order planet buster ships jump to terra>1 (one) gets through and blows up terra in a few seconds, a feat no other warhammer ship can achieve>all of this with a better industrial base and logistical supply chainThe only people who think the Imperium wins are people who haven’t played an actual wargame. Warhammerfags just smash their action figures together
>>96844554>shorter range than IRL missiles>Even Iran, North Korea and Pakistan mog Star WarsOh no SW babies!!!!!
>>96844617>Emperor summons a warpstorm to destroy the fleetProblem solved. Oh wait, the planet buster ships all got destroyed before they evenleft their base BECAUSE THEY ARE SO RETARDED THEY DON'T KNOW THE WAY UP
>>96844635It would take the imperium centuries to find and locate a base, Star Wars time scale is absurd compared to warhammer>Empire scout ships encounter Imperial rogue traders>Learn of the greatest threat they have ever known>Empire gets to work making more planet busters>Imperium takes a century to even acknowledge the report of another human empire>Fleet of World Engines show up and log the Imperium
A single Harry Potter-universe wizard casting Avadkra Kedavra can kill the Emperor of Mankind, all Primarchs, Palpatine, Luke, or even Goku in one hit.I rest my case
>>96844652Goku dodges it
>>96844646>Emperor summons a warpstorm to blow up the World Engines>The Lion uses his forest powers to teleport to Coruscant, the Death Star, Palpatine's bedroom and kils him>among many other possibilitiesYawnnnn. Problem solved. And that's just the Imperium. Let's not even get into how Chaos or the Necrons no diff Star Wars. Heck, even a single genestealer cult can take over the galactic empire.
>>96844646>>96844617Shut up SW bitch boy. It's already been established that Ayatollah Khameini mogs you
>>96844682Lion mogged by Darth VaderEmperor mogged by Emperor
>>96844662
>>96844723Goku dodges it
>>96844735Logos erasing dodging sorry.
>>96844696Reminder imperial guard use literal ww2 tier tanks
>>96844739Goku thens kills him with 1 (one) punch, since he can’t dodge
>>96843850>tech menial squad 7λ56 prepares their stubbers and power wrenches for a mid-combat emergency spacewalk to the portside egine secundus to cleanse the infestation before it spreads to the other irreplaceable subsystems.Fun scenario, but that doesnt sound like a mild hazard at all.>>96843979>not even specifically designed to hard-kill enemy capital ship combatants, but disable near-unarmoured fighter craftThey work on ships of the line and fighters all the same, the bigger the target the more droids it simply takes to disable it efficiently. And if the droid finds any data circuit it can fuck with it and try to highjack it.>Ignoring the point defensesThe target profile is tiny. The actual missile itself is no more than 5 meters long. You would need some insane precission or serious saturation to screen them all, and thats before it deploys the droids.>meters thick armour that the buzz droid needs to cut throughIndeed its probably not capable of going through the thick armour plating of 40k, as it only has 2 relatively small plasma cutters. Any exposed systems are fair game however. And it will just take some time before the droids can indetify any viable entry points into the bowels of the ship, like torpedoe tubes or airlocks.>got to hold onto the hull as the Imperium vessel maneuvers, and remain in roughly the same spotIt has a magnetic clamp to latch to the hull and thrusters to reach the target if it gets disloged or the missile overshoots.>computational difficulties of hitting an escort frigate (given their operating speeds, there's a good chance they could genuinely be outrun)Thats hilarious.How fast are those things? How do you even compare two sci-fi settings sublight speeds?>and isn't atomized by the power field the ship may or may not also generateInteresting.The buzz droids ball carapace is made to bypass ray shields, but most of those wont disintegrate you.
>>96844752Logos erased punching too sorry.This is the no-u robot, you can only beat it by creating faster than it can no u or no u its no u (neither apply to Goku).I think Aquarion sucks btw.
>>96844760>applies epic magic to goku>goku powers up until he counters it anywayWatch DBZ bud, hacks only work if you got the power level to back it up
>>96844777Logos can erase powerlevels. It can erase ki. It can erase the concept of Saiyans and delete the entire species altogether. It's a reality warper, not a magic user. The only way to beat it is with equal or greater reality warping.
>>96844777Goku gets pwned by a single normie with a laser beam WHILE IN SUPER SAIYAN GOD FORM. DBZbabs need to watch their own show.
>>96844743>another memelore being presented as factWhoa WW2 tier tanks had ceramite & adamantium armor, plus laser, plasma, and fusion weapons?Anyway the Nazi German V2 outranges the Turbolaser and the Soviet T-34 doesn't instantly die to a fucking wooden log hitting it so even WW2 humans mog Star Wars
>>96842060Shhh dont try to resist it. Just let the critical mass of pure nerd rage autism do its thing.
>>96844784Nope, goku powers up>>96844796His ki field was down, planet busting laser btw>>96844799Those are light scout vehicles, equivalent to an armored car, not a tank
Let's settle this once and for allIn both of their primes, can Naruto beat Luffy?
>>96844831Luffy can blow up a mountain but then has to recharge, and is completely unable to rest quickly without someone providing him food. Naruto mogs
>>96844831Is there a character that could even possibly EVEN TOUCH Madara Uchiha? Let alone defeat him. And I'm not talking about Edo Tensei Uchiha Madara. I'm not talking about Gedou Rinne Tensei Uchiha Madara either. Hell, I'm not even talking about Juubi Jinchuuriki Gedou Rinne Tensei Uchiha Madara with the Eternal Mangekyou Sharingan and Rinnegan doujutsus (with the rikodou abilities and being capable of both Amateratsu and Tsukuyomi genjutsu), equipped with his Gunbai, a perfect Susano'o, control of the juubi and Gedou Mazou, with Hashirama Senju's DNA implanted in him so he has mokuton kekkei genkai and can perform yin yang release ninjutsu while being an expert in kenjutsu and taijutsu.
>>96844840Akshuaulllyyyyyy Luffy Gear 5 mogs Naruto. It is even implied that Luffy is a literal sun god and the rubber fruit is actually an ancient zoan fruit and this isn't even his final form
>Emperor of MankindAVADKRA KEDAVRA>Palpatine>AVADRA KEDAVRA>Naruto>AVADRA KEDEVRA>Luffy>AVADRA KEDAVRA>A Dalek>AVADRA KEDAVRASHUT UP FAGGOTS!KNEEL BEFORE THE ONE TRUE KING OF POWERSCALING
>>96837875Okay but is it all of the star wars universe vs all of the wh40k universe? Or is it just the IOM vs the startwars universe?Because I dont see how SW could beat chaos especially is SW fans entire argument rests on FTL travel superiority when chaos can literally materialize out of nowhere and corrupt things from the inside out just from sentient beings being aware that chaos exists.
>>96837875Star Wars weapons count as plasma weapons in 40K.MEQs basically are fucked.
>>96844247
>>96844890Star Wars has a benevolent warp entity, The Force, which helps them resist
>>96844890Um sorry but only we SWfags can set the parameters
>>96844916>the Force>benevolent
>>96844928Yup, it spawns agents of good whenever subversive (((sith))) become a problem
Fuck this scifi shitHow about Warhammer Fantasy/AOS vs LOTR or GOT?
>>96844933i don't know the force sounds more like the immaterium where its neither good or bad it just depends on how people use it. Also isnt the force midi-chlorians in the blood stream or something?
>>96844943Fantasy rapes both at the same time
>>96844948Midichlorians are just a genetic marker that shows someone’s connection to the force, not the force itselfForce is blatantly good, Jedi live in balance with it which leads to 1000 years of peace. Things go bad when Sith work to use it to corrupt, they are a cancer. When things don’t solve themselves the force spawns hyper powerful users to take them down.
>>96844943>any sharpshooter from any faction blows off Daenery/Gandalf's head>GOT dragons get shot down by empire/skaven guns or get mogged by elf dragons>White walker wights are shown what TRUE undead armies areReally nigga. I absolutely would love to hear the arguments of GOT and LOTR fags on how they can somehow survive against WHF/AOS.
>Implying Captain Picard wouldn't negotiate peace between all factions using the powers of logic and reason. Also there is apparently a star trek board game. Multiple in fact.
>>96844943Regular-ass swordsmen in warhammer fantasy can solo Greater Daemons so I'd say it's no contest against most fantasy settings until you get into slop like xianxia.
>>96844959So you are saying the force can be... corrupted. Would that mean that chaos could corrupt it too?
>>96844977Picard would negotiate peace with the empire, the imperium would be designated as “Star fleet actually tries” and wipes it out trivially
>>96844980This. Empire Halberdiers can bench press even space marines>Fantasy daemons are weaker than 40k daemons!!Nope. They're the same across settings.
>>96844985Nope, just had a rogue psyker problem. Chaos intentionally tries to corrupt, force is very easy going but generally breaks down people into horrific ghouls for being evil. I could see sith falling to chaos, spawning jobbers demons that die to Ewoks (since warhammer fantasy demons die to literally goblins with sticks) and the force spawning equal counter measures to restore balance
>>96844994It makes sense. Warhammer Fantasy humans are primal breeding stock, when men were men. 40K has an entire army spawned from degenerative Turkish genes, applied to random nu-human thugs. The average space marine is about as strong as a modern day UFC fighter
>>96837875Because the Imperium was destroyed by a bunch of water farmers with ancient ritual weapons.
>>96844959>The Force is blatantly good, Jedi live in balance with it which leads to 1000 years of slavery being legal and accepted as a general institution.Based Southern Force.
>>96837875Star wars loses because it's gay. That's it.
>>96838858>nerf herderwow I didn't know racism was allwoed on /tg/
>>96844994Daemons are also stronger on the Warhammer Fantasy planet than most 40k planets due to how suffused with magic the world is, even despite the Vortex.
>>96844089Raith Sienar was truly the da Vinci of his time.
>>96846704this doesn't say demons are stronger though
>>96847940more magic = more powerful daemons, that's basic warhammer knowledge
>>96844163The writers were stupid.
>>96837875>Star Wars is stronger.>40k is stronger.The real answer is Star Trek would wreck both universes in an afternoon, and they don't even need to bring in the Q to do that.
>>96844723Didn't read all of it but is Logos stronger than Demonbane?
>>96837875yeah but how does the covenant fair
>>96837875this image pisses me off so much because the executor-class is a damn mobile command platform, not a battleship. it would snap like a twig against a warship half its size even from the same universe, if it weren't for high-capacity shielding and a complement of fighters and other warships.the galactic empire is pretty technologically regressive too, if you compare the prequel era. they're stretched thin economically because they have to police the whole galaxy, that's why TIE fighters and stormtrooper armor are dogshit.i personally am a bigger star wars fan than a 40K fan, but the empire's ONLY advantages are being less fanatical, understanding their own tech better, and having a reliable non-fucked FTL system.
>>96844972>implying that the four would able to hold themselves against an Abrahamic-tier creator deity>implying that Malekith wouldn't be wooped by the likes Feanor>Implying that might of Numenor wouldn't bring the old world to its knees>Implying that the valar couldn't tear off the roof of the skaven empire, like they did with Utumno
>>96848828Stuck in a decaying franchise that last had a good mainline entry in 2007 (nearly 20 years ago). Get swarmed by either power because they dont even control all of the Orion arm never mind a true Galactic power.
>>96844972The setting where they literally all lost and got punished by being reborn in homo world for gays?
>>96844890I think it's just iom vs empire
>>96849012Which faction would vibe best with the Shrie while they watch everyone else kill eachother?
>>96849292Most of the Warhammer factions have no chill, even the halflings of the Moot are far more gluttonous and greedy than the worst hobbits, but Gotrek and Felix would probably like it.
How would the imperium fare against the Guardians. I dont think they could take them. Not even Custodes had a chance. Guardians go against cosmic gods and win.
>>96848684^thisPeople forget how strong the tech is in the star trek universe. Namely that they can fabricate anything out of energy alone using the replicator.
>>96848809I googled it for powerscaling purposes and the consensus is that the matchup is about 6-4 for Logos.
>>96842104>thunder hawk with a librarian inside flies next to funny looking ship and fries the crew's mindsAnd that's how the Mechanicus got a new toy.
>>96844612>effective range 25 km>tfw the guns near the rear of a SSD barely hit anything past the front of the ship
>>96849504You automatically lose if your game is dead and gay.
>>96850352>Implying an unnamed librarian would win against plot armoured men like Kyp Durran, Han Solo and Lando Calrissian
God I missed these kinds of threads. I hate them too, and every poster in them, because of course all your opinions are wrong compared to mine, but its still soothing to the soul somehow. Fuck all of you retards, im glad /tg/ hasnt forgotten everything of its heritage, and keep on trucking.
>>96843610NTA but if it's against the UNSC I think the Federation would rip them a new one more often than not, if they can deploy MS, before UNSC ships rip their carriers apart from range, which while there are no solid numbers for weapons ranges in Gundam as far as I am aware would have trouble fighting at further range. MS are just very unfair as they both actively jam radar, supposedly maneuver very finely in space and carry ship-grade weaponry, given we take something like the Jegan or GM 3 as an average. Issue is that the Federation more or less just has Mobile Suits and all other aspects of their military are subordinate to deploying or supporting said Mobile Suits, so in any situation where say an enemy ship can as I mentioned earlier target their ships which are primarily just MS carriers first they are fucked. This being said, I think mega particle and beam weapons generally outclass the MACs the UNSC fleet has in terms of armor penetration and destructive power. Also I'm pretty sure the UNSC has a much larger overall material pool than the Federation, which it's implied isn't even fully utilizing all its resources to hyper-mobilize as Gundam is kind of more realistic and most armies there aren't the hypermilitarized total war machines we see in Halo (and 40k, and Star Wars). Point I wanted to make is that the Feds win any space battle where they can deploy MS in against the UNSC.
>>96850710Pointless arguing about meaningless sci-fi hypotheticals is what separates the real posters from the tourists. I could write dissertation length papers on which sci-fi and/or fantasy faction could beat which other faction and I have strong opinions on all of them.
>>96852749I think dispersing Minovsky particles from the ships themselves would FUCK UP UNSC really badly. 0083's novelization says they engage at 5,000 whatevers (unspecified unit) but given that we know Minovsky particles tend to deaden an area pretty effectively, so much so that a warship emitting them is fucking up radar, visible light, and infrared so much that ships need to be visually identified at ranges of 100km and UC in general is a very "low acceleration" regime where it took White Base almost five days to go from Side 7 (roughly the same distance from the Earth as the Moon), though they did stop at Luna 2 for a bit, can probably assume no faster than 1970s transfer times with chemical rockets.And so while slow, they are basically undetectable on thermal, gamma, visible light, and radar until you're right on top of them. This is made even worse by squadrons of MS also emitting enough Minovsky to make themselves only detectable through visible light at around 20km. Particle beams are only coherent (even the mega particle ones) seemingly for like 5km or so? But UNSC's (and anyone else's) missiles are dogshit once M-particles are out at combat levels. The railguns are good but swatting MS with them might be rough? I don't know enough about Halo's AA capabilities but UC does invest heavily in AA and MS are still ship-killers. But UNSC ships are way more heavily armored since they don't have to move much at all in realspace.I think the Battle of Loum would be basically how it went for UC forces (even early UC, let alone Unicorn-era or later) vs UNSC or The Empire. Fucking up detection in space until you're in knife-fighting range (for space) is a hell of a convenient feature.
>>96855274I will add in the favour of UNSC however that given foreknowledge of what Minovsky effects are, with their much superior computational power they could maybe take advantage of some system to find where the stars are distorted and figure out approximately where a UC navy was coming from... given enough distance and knowing what to look for. Probably not accurately enough to hit them with a dead shot from a MAC cannon at 1000km though, being off by milliradians means missing by a moon's diameter after all. Maybe, it might be possible, in this scenario for them to use their missiles like loitering munitions? The visuals cut both ways, looking out through the EM-spectrum haze sucks for the UC ships as well, they would need to let it disperse to see. This almost kinda sounds a bit like submarine warfare actually. Could be kino, both have equivalently strong effectors after all. Sensors and computational power plus foreknowledge of the enemy's basics would make it a very even fight, especially if the missiles could be used like loitering munitions and hopefully end up on the path of an approaching UC fleet, turning on and using laser targeting. Though laser targeting does suck still, and radio is REALLY strongly affected by Minovsky so the missiles actually being able to detect incoming ships and zoom at them for a kill is dubious. It's like trying to find a shark in the ocean but you can only see through a straw.The Empire has dogshit 1970s computers and sensors just like UC though so they don't get this edge.
>>96848889>understanding their own tech better, and having a reliable non-fucked FTL systemthat literally is everything they need,
>>96848889>>96857714I was gonna say, this is like listing a bunch of negatives and then saying "and all they have is an invincibility cape and a kill anything gun!"
So what is THE most powerful sci fi setting of all time, /tg/?
>>96857886The Cthulhu Mythos
>>96850438so 40k looses by default?
