>mass produces spell scrollsretards will say "NOO U CAN'T DO THAT CUZ U JUST CAN'T OK!!!"how will wizard survive this economic change
>>97145673You can't do that.FBPB/Thread
>>97145690>You can't do th-ACK!!!what was that?SPBP/Thread
>>97145673>mass produces spell scrollsHow?
>>97145698
>>97145673Let's go further:>a wizard repurposes a loom to make punch card scrolls (spells are basically "machine" language anyways>a native American shaman invents the integrated magic circuit (magic chip)>another wizard invents the C (Chtulu) magic programming language>A Fenno-Swede Druid and a fat Tauren invents the Gnu-Linux open sourced magic operating system...
>>97145673What game?
>>97145881The Thaumaturgical Revolution and its consequences have been a disaster for every race.
>>97145881
>>97145673Part of the magic comes from the deliberate act of writing by hand. It isn't just the motions and sigils, it is also a conscious mind tapping into the magic itself that generates the power needed for the spell.A natural tool built from natural materials with no mind to "dip" into the magical current shrouding the world will never be able to use magic.Sure, you can use mass produced scrolls as instructional pieces to better teach fledglings the signs and motions, but the scrolls themselves, being magically-inert, can't be used directly for spells.The supernatural processes of a spell can't be executed with machinery. It won't work without a subconscious that's connected to the "magic stream", and such a subconscious can't even be preserved through magic.
>>97145673>how will wizard survive this economic changeSabotage production lines, kill those who know how to remake them. Generic fantasy medieval stasis doesn't happen because common people stopped coming up with new ideas that would make their life easier, but because wizards systematically dispose of uppity muggles that would threaten their monopoly on phenomenal cosmic power.
>>97145673>how will wizard survive this economic changeWho do you think is mass producing the scrolls? The wizards are just gearing up for their next Competitive Ranked Peasant Abuse Day. Some lucky town is about to be picked as the site of a week long party involving hundreds of amoral wizards, thousands of scrolls and far too many spells that range from Mass Testicular Torsion and Contagious Cucking to Summon Baby Blender and Flay Soul.
>>97145673A few well placed delayed blast fireballs going off during peak production hours should do the trick
>>97147275Ah, a fan of the Harpers.
>>97145673>how will wizards surviveWizards would have to do it. You can't make magic scrolls unless you can cast the spell and it costs that casting for the day as well as expensive components and time.There's no way to make spell scrolls anywhere close to the speed that you're implying like a printing press.
>>97147200>The supernatural processes of a spell can't be executed with machinery.That's why you use slaves.
>>97147792>arcane practitioners as slaves
>>97145673>how will wizard survive this economic changeIf picrel is to be believed, they don't. Instead everyone dies after at minimum 6 seasons due to an Atlantean-tier fuckup.Personally I agree. Wizards are dangerous enough as is, one shudders to imagine them being able to apply any sort of method, scientific or otherwise, to their madness.
>>97145673>how will they surviveThe same way artists did when replaced by AI. Artists provided custom erotic porn to gender experimental homos with beastiality fetishes. Similarly, there will always be demand for a spell market patroned by transsexual deviants seeking animal compulsion and alter self spells for their bugbear romance and Chad rape fantasies.
>>97145673You can't cast spells from scrolls unless you have that spell on your spell list.Not that a no-games retard like you would actually give a shit about the rules. Retards like you may as well be doing freeform RP for how disconntected from reality the rules of your game are.This is what happens when normies aren't gatekept.
>>97145673What system?
all this 'AI will replace jobs' is so funny because it really is just another printing press, isn't it? even if it's 'simply remixing existing art' (duh? great!)but yeah this thinking is a flaw with magic-as-technology type settings. magic is exceptional. you have elemental-powered airships, that opens up all sorts of (reasonable) 'then what about doing _____?' questions.
>>97147890>the same way artists did when replaced by AIThe AI just sucks so bad that any product using it immediately tanks?So what, the mass produced spell scrolls are all pieces of shit?
>>97147973"AI will replace you" is kind of hilarious since it's failed in every field it's been placed into. Each AI worker needs 5 men checking its output just to make sure it's not putting them into unrecoverable legal hot water, let alone the dozen more men needed to fix all its mistakes.
>>97147977>Several projects using AI art that are doing okayBut wizards would be fine in a generic market for ease of life and infrastructure spells, they're still needed for all the addicts these living comforts generate. >>97147966It's a common homebrew rule, desu Satandubs. Functional and transferable scrolls themselves don't make much sense under world rules with class locked spell lists.
>>97145673Do you have enough wizards on hand to pour their XP into the scrolls to make them actually work?
>>97148133No, the vast majority of AI work is going belly up.Any that are not are so rare as to be a rounding error.
>>97148140Good AI generated content is much like a good makeup - you'll never see it because to be a good one it has to, by definition, be indistinguishable from a real thing and feel perfectly natural.
>>97147970... what other fantasy rpgs use scrolls besides dnd? There must be some.
>>97147977>AI scroll of firbirball creates a frog on fire with a beach ball. >the frog immediately screams and dies>ball pops >fire goes out
>>97148133>It's a common homebrew ruleIt's not a common "homebrew," it's a common mistake.You and your faggot friends didn't realize how scrolls were supposed to work because you're stupid and never actually read the rules. So you're whining and bitching about the rules based on your own retarded misunderstanding.>"Oh no, I'm playing the game wrong and it makes the lore so imbalanced! ;_;">"But I won't stop ignoring the rules though!"You create your own problems through your own stupidity, and then try and act like it was the developers fault.Consider being less of a fucking retard, how about that.
>>97148179Okay, so there's none other than the one off accidental piece.
>>97145673The magicians guild is sending their golems over to smash up your shop for ruining the artificially inflated market price of magic items.
>>97145673But you need XP and gold in order to produce spell scrolls. The bottleneck to mass production is a lack of wizards willing to give up XP and transcribe each scroll by hand to put the magic in.How does 'mass production' help in any way? You still have those inherent problems.
>>97145673Okay. Good luck making a profit.
>>97148133No, they make perfect sense. By purchasing scrolls, you can exceed your normal limit of spell slots, and spells cast from items don't cost you any XP.
>>97148217I understand well enough. But it is a common homebrew rule adding some variety to the game, do leave your echo chamber more. User-locked scrolls make sense, as the language they are composed in can be a character's unique magical language. Class locked spells imply a shared language or deity enabling functional communication of unlearned spells, which isn't present in many campaigns. And neophytes can still cast spells above their level, to be immediately forgotten. It doesn't make much sense from a gameplay perspective either, while a fair check on the availability of magic, scroll loot becomes a character specific item. But don't let any of that stop you from the norules, nogames, theaterkid screed bait you have prepared to loop.
Look at what happened with Qurans and the printing press in the Ottoman Empire
>>97147983Almost as hilarious as you delusional "AI will never improve lol look 6 fingees" faggots. The elites are too committed now, there are only two outcomes: we keep pouring money and resources and effort in until LLMs become truly useful, or they drive our whole economy into the ground and fuck off to Mars. Given that the Romantics lost, Luddites lost, Arts & Crafts lost, and ecowarriors lost I don't see any reason why Muh Soul-fags have a better chance of winning.
>>97148495Plenty of technologies have been outlawed and eradicated before. It'll happen again. I'll see to it personally.
>>97148495>It's the next big thing, I SWEARJust like dirigibles, eh?I'm sorry your technology is too expensive and shitty to see results. You keep wishing it's going to be like the industrial revolution, but you forget that factories were MORE productive, not less.
>>97148383What if it wasn't to make a profit but to fund domestic terrorism by arming local ruffians against the king?
>>97148632I'm not going to give you content for your youtube channel. Fuck off.
>>97148632Sounds more like freedom fighters, not terrorists.
>>97148229We don't know how many there is but there's undeniable sampling bias towards showing the failures.
>>97148800Given the extreme failure rates of companies trying to use AI, I feel pretty confident in saying successful uses are extraordinarily rare.
>>97148800Actually, I have the unique ability to instantly and infallibly detect all AI-generated work, regardless of medium.
>>97148804Succesful adaptation of new technology isn't going all-in as if it was a sure-proof tip for next horse race, but selective adoption in segments where it actually makes sense.Companies trying to use AI fail because they are treating it like hot new get-rich-quick-scheme often at the cost of abandoning or recklessly reworking their established business.Gold rush didn't leave most prospectors worse off because there wouldn't be gold, but because too many rushed there too quickly without realistic expectations or a sound plan. Nihil novi sub sole.
Of course, the difference here is that gold can actually be used for things. AI has no use cases. At all. Ever. For any reason. Do not reply.
>>97148858Alright - here's a list [3,5,5,11,18].Which of those numbers were rolled on physical die and which were generated by Copilot?
>>97148863There's no gold, is the problem. The only successful business models with AI are scam based, since you can fool more grandmas faster that way.
>>97148881all of them because you dont actually play games, nor have physical game pieces.
>>97148915Yeah, our civilization divorced mesuring of wealth from physical assets decades ago. Now it's entries in a database backed by nothing that can be used as a value because everyone plays along with the idea that they have a value. And movement between those entries can be incentivized by playing into people's beliefs and personal preference which builds whole another database. Now there's all these piles of data that can be converted to another data and become perceived as value and it would be mighty convenient to have automated workers that can move all this stuff around... which is exactly what we're getting to. Silt of data from which AI filters the pieces with perceived value. Which you can then trade for physical gold, if you so desire.
How the fuck a printing press discussion becomes a discussion about AI? You area bunch of Ai-obsessed luddites.
The Luddites were right, of course.
>>97149056>invention for mass-producing stuff with less human input necessaryvs >invention for mass-producing stuff with less human input necessaryreally makes you think
>>97145673Wouldn't wizards become even more powerful? If anything it is the martials overlords who get the short end of the stick.
>>97145673>how will the guy who can create any item he can imagine for free deal with economic change?gee it's a mystery
Why has WotC literally never published a setting with a Industrial Revolution powered by magic?When it's literally the most obvious thing?
>>97148419>Doesn't know the rules>Doesn't use the rules>Refuses to learn the rules>Calls me a theater kidREAD the fucking book.READ it.Stop making shit up based on """vibes""" and actually read what the books says.Once you've done that, THEN you can start bitching and whining about the rules. But as of right now, you're ignorant and you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.Sorry you have no idea what the rules are because you haven't read them, but you could choose to read them at any point.Until then, your retarded mistakes are nobody's problem except your own.
>>97147671man, fuck the Harpers.
>>97147792>Enslaving and forcing people to lock powerful magic into runes CORRECTLY thet they know you will use later in life critical situations.Yeah, that sounds like a good way to stockpile a ton of 'cursed' scrolls. You should read up on how german slaves sabotaged the machinery they were forced to make in ww2.
You fools. This is the perfect opportunity to make your Big Bad Sorcerer Hitler.
>>97149176
>>97149043>We're totally going to get to something convenient! Two more weeks!Tech bro nonsense.
>>97149043This has always been the case. Money is in reality an abstraction of trust and social debt. Barter economies have never existed. The actual form has always been "I do something for you with the expectation you will repay me some day". The earliest types of currency were things that had practical value, like food or livestock or furs. These commodity monies didn’t require much trust. A toolmaker is willing to accept a bag of barley as payment, because even if he has more than he needs, he can be pretty sure that someone else will want it. Because, you know, you can eat it!But commodity money isn’t very convenient. Try schlepping forty bags of barley across town just to pay your rent. And if your landlord doesn’t spend it right away, it could mold or get eaten by rats. And if he wants to buy a tool from you, he has to carry the sacks all the way back to your house.At some point, someone realized that life would be so much easier if instead of actually carrying sacks of barley back and forth, we could just agree to pretend to carry sacks of barley back and forth. We’d just need some way to keep track of it all.This 5,000 year old Sumerian clay tablet is one of the oldest examples of writing ever found. It says: “29,086 measures of barley, 37 months.” Writing wasn’t invented for royal decrees or epic poems... it was invented to keep track of imaginary sacks of barley--in other words, credits and debits.
>>97148636I don't have a YouTube channel I have a real job >>97148675Depends on your point of view I guess. If they are casting fireball across the street, Fist Full of Dollars style, endangering everyone, sounds like terrorism
>>97150799Yes you do.
>>97145721Do the Harry Potter thing and have animated pens floating around writing on parchment?
>>97148185Wfrp
>>97147489Yeah but that's also how whole species of beasts, mutants, and other magical creatures come from. Wizards fuck with some lucky town and at least a few dozen of them are turned into 6 legged spider donkeys. Centuries later heroes regularly encounter the Tarrantumules on the local mountains but no one really knows where they came from.
>>97147970Hello????????
>>97151467True, but this same process is how we get things like Gremlins too by way of >>97147275 The wizards find the uppity muggles that are building complicated machines that might alter the medieval way of life and transform them into small misshapen goblinoids. Now we have little Gremlins that constantly build weird and dangerous machines everywhere out in the mountains that adventurers need to sometimes clear out.
Wouldn't Prestidigitation be able to effortlessly print faster and better than a printing press?
>>97151478Thirsty Sword Lesbians
>>97149228Ehud, you still owe me 3 goats you fucker.
>>97149104>zoomers can't into Eberon lol
>>97151300Damn I didn't know that. Must be a Truman show like situation
>>97151478Hi :)
>>97151478What?
>>97151559No. It wouldn't.
>>97145673>retards will say "NOO U CAN'T DO THAT CUZ U JUST CAN'T OK!!!" My rules offer a pretty precise framework for crafting magical artifacts and paraphernalia. You do have a rule book, don't you?
OP is a stupid sack of shit nogames retard. This is a copypasta thread started by a troll or a bot.But to counter the stupidity for any of the retarded anons who post here, here's the rules of scroll production for various editions and systems.>AD&D 2eYou need a quill, ink, and writing medium.The quill must be from a magical creature and unused, this is per scroll.The writing medium must be of the highest quality; paper is best, parchment works, and papyrus sucks.Exotic, expensive, and complex, each ink set must be made specifically for each spell.Wizards need their spell book while priests need a special altar.One day per spell level for the scroll, thusly a 6th level spell takes 6 days of writing.DM rolls for scroll creation success.Per these rules, impossible to automate or so cost prohibitive as to be impossible.>3.5>>97148383>4eDont have any, not possible.>5eScribing a scroll takes an amount of time and money based on the level of the spell, as shown in the Spell Scroll Costs table. For each day of inscription, you must work for 8 hours. If a scroll requires multiple days, those days needn't be consecutive.To scribe a scroll, you must have proficiency in the Arcana skill or with Calligrapher's Supplies and have the spell prepared on each day of the inscription. You must also have at hand any Material components required by the spell; if the spell consumes its Material components, they are consumed only when you complete the scroll. The scroll's spell uses your spell save DC and spell attack bonus.A 5th level spell scroll takes 25 days and costs 1,500 GP.
>>97153424Continued...>Pathfinder 1eTo create a scroll, a character needs a supply of choice writing materials, the cost of which is subsumed in the cost for scribing the scroll: 12.5 gp × the level of the spell × the level of the caster.All writing implements and materials used to scribe a scroll must be fresh and unused. A character must pay the full cost for scribing each spell scroll no matter how many times she previously has scribed the same spell.The creator must have prepared the spell to be scribed (or must know the spell, in the case of a sorcerer or bard) and must provide any material component or focus the spell requires. A material component is consumed when she begins writing, but a focus is not. (A focus used in scribing a scroll can be reused.) The act of writing triggers the prepared spell, making it unavailable for casting until the character has rested and regained spells.Scribing a scroll requires 1 day per 1,000 gp of the base price. Although an individual scroll might contain more than one spell, each spell must be scribed as a separate effort, meaning that no more than 1 spell can be scribed in a day.>PF2e.The process to Craft a scroll is much like that to Craft any other magic item. When you begin the crafting process, choose a spell to put into the scroll. You have to either Cast that Spell during the crafting process, or someone else must do so in your presence. Casting that Spell doesn't produce its normal effects; instead, the magic is trapped inside the scroll. The casting must come from a spellcaster expending a spell slot. You can't Craft a scroll from a spell produced from another magic item, for example. The caster has to provide any cost of the spell. You need to learn only a single 1st-level formula to Craft scrolls.Like other consumables, scrolls can be crafted in batches of four. All scrolls of one batch must contain the same spell at the same level, and you must provide one casting for each scroll crafted.
lmao this faggot nerd plays make believe games
>>97151457How does making scrolls in warhammer fantasy rpg work? >roll d100 to make scroll >01-75, explode into grim flame and die, no scroll>76-95, explode into dark flame and die, scroll is completed, roll on bad time magic table for scroll results >96-00, minor magical conflagration, roll damage, scroll completed, roll on bad time magic table for scroll results
>>97147792>Letting slaves handle fireball, teleportation, cosmic spray. etc. scrolls that they could easily turn against you or sabotage Are you retarded?
>>97151467>>97151549Why can't we just make them short stacked Goblinos?!
>>97153424>AD&D 2ekino, immersive, milleu, questworthy>3e>5ehandwavy videogame soulless slop
>>97148800Anon you can just look at the AI companies behind them, none have figured out how to turn it into profit yet.
>>97148881A physical die is a form of analog AI.
>>97153557bro's never heard of mindrape
>>971537463e has more rules and less handwaving.
>>97145673The paper or vellum and ink are one expense, spell components are another and far more variable in cost, then you still need a qualified wizard on hand to cast the spell to be caught on scroll; think of it as a tape recorder; you still need somebody to cast the spell in the first place; the scroll is just a "frozen" spell.Then you should probably employ some apprentices as "Spell Checkers"; considering the scrolls will be printed, I'm not so concerned about the words being wrong, but a printer misalignment could spoil a whole batch.And since you're manufacturing a product on a large scale, you will quickly find yourself running up against local bylaws regarding the proliferation of magical artefacts, as well as lawsuits from dissatisfied customers.>Faulty scroll of Bigby's grasping hand goes on a mass groping spreeThat's a lawsuit>Gnome child brings a scroll of fireball to school and incinerates his classThat's a scandal>Fire breaks out on the storage level, and a barrel of demon's blood ink catches fire; the whole shift is exposed to evil vaporsThat's a bucket full of workman's comp. New methods beget new problems.
>>97147977You actually believe this?
>>97155030It'd be crazy for anyone to believe otherwise given the absolutely terrible track history AIs have nowadays.
>>97155047>>97155030I miss when AIs were significantly more functional like 20 years ago.Every single measuring stick for automation ability has gone -down- besides ability to shitpost. It feels like we're going back in time to a much shittier tech tree.
>>97155030imagine coping this hard KEK
>>97155047You use AI every day
>>97145881>a fat Tauren invents the Gnu>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wildebeest>>97148383Technically possible in Pathfinder 1 as there's at least 2 traits that make crafting 5% cheaper. A large factory of Hedge Magicians could in theory turn a profit. At which point you can establish logistics chains and let economy of scale go brrrrrrrrr.>>97149176Just remember to hit him with Cloudkill while he's low level, not Stinking Cloud.>>97151559Depends on edition, of course. The main problems are "crude details" and "slow transformation" and "limited duration" for most effects>>97154630I remember old guys complaining that there were too many rules taking away DM's authority when 3e was brand new, but also saying it was like a videogame. 4e's release was an "aha! I told you WOTC was doing this shit!" moment for them.
>>97155521That's probably why every single computer system works significantly worse than before the modern AI, huh?
>>97145673>how will wizard survive this economic changeGetting a head of the curve, opening their own shop and hiring all the 5th level and below mages allowing you the corner the magic scroll market in your area and effectively put your thumb on the local business and political scene.
>>97145673Traditional games?
>>97156113What about them?
>>97155052>I miss when AIs were significantly more functional like 20 years ago.>Every single measuring stick for automation ability has gone -down- besides ability to shitpost.We Things like license plate detection, facial recognition, intrusion detection (both physical and digital) have became much better. Hell, drone flight corrections and last-mile autoseeking cheap enough to be mass produced would be unimaginable just 10 years ago.Sure, productivity of average office worker might have gone down being overwhelmed with too many tools and their updates, but as long as that worker keeps seeing targeted ads his spending should not decline and economy keeps rolling.
>>97156810The only AI functions that work are things that are using old technology. ALL the new shit is useless trash.
Once again this is an example of missing the big opportunity of what a magical industrial revolution would look like by virtue of saying "this technology can make magic easier as-is, with no novel alterations".You're basically saying Wizards should ride trains or drive cars. Boring.
>>97151439Writing a spell down makes the paper into a magic item? I feel like the printer should at least know the spell and expend the energies that are required to cast it. Otherwise it's just the words that are magic, and that anyone repeating what a wizard says is also now a wizard
>>97157526Wizards don't get to ride trains. Instead companies with royal charters hire peasants to work for 18 hours a day to cast the same cantrip over, and over again, until their hands bleed. Bourgeoise dress in fine silk and cotton coming from overseas colonies where wizards mind-rape brown elves to work on the fields. Meanwhile 7 sea company is planning to genocide the entire population of an island in the middle of nowhere to make room for a new wave of colonists and slaves.
>>97147792>GRAND RITUAL OF DRAWING THE INNER CIRCLE OF NINE LANTERNS>made in China
>>97153532I don't even remember. None of my players even wanted to and the rules are complicated and difficult to succeed in.
>>97151726Oh, I'm not a tranny, I can't help you with that one.
>>97145673>how will wizard survive this economic changeChange? Let's make some logistic connections.I'm using GURPS, since fuck you and your statement that printing scrolls is EASY.First of all, scrolls may need magic to be magical. Can end here, but let's assume they are not.Medieval Fantasy is about TL3. Printing Press is TL4. Could stop here too, but let's say we borrow machines from some other, more advanced culture.Then we need to make people learn how to operate the press. Since it's TL higher than most of folks, we need specialists. They cost money, loads of it.We also will need paper (expensive), ink (cheap), the original scrolls (medium to one of a kind), stamps of original scrolls (expensive), and some other expenses like distribution and taxes.Without even calculating the total cost, it's fuckton. Even if you try to get someone to pay for all of it, mages would probably burn your ass in a fireball, before you could make any scrolls.
>>97145673what makes you think it wouldn't be a lazy wizard who comes up with that stuff?
>>97157664That's great you made such a well-thought-out post blowing OP out of the water, but not only will you not get a proper response, you may not even get a response at all.
>>97156768What traditional game?
>>97155564What does that have to do with the price of cheese?Anon said>The AI just sucks so bad that any product using it immediately tanks?I am ITT with underage ESLs
>>97145721brrrr
>>97148383Simply sell them for more than the material cost plus the time to make it
In the end you realize that magic, like power, is quite relative. Relative to accessibility, so too.The true wizards at the end of the day are those of mastery and vision. Geniuses. They make new worlds. New Paradigms. Such as whoever decided to mass produce scrolls.Eventually everyone gets access to the magic, and the magic becomes something else.
