How do we fix Steampunk?
Start by clearly stating what's there to fix.
By actually creating something besides 4chan threads.
>>97196423Try to have something to say, don't rely on retarded aesthetic for arthoes to carry you.This also applies to making a thread on 4chan.org
>>97196423Why would you do that? The tensions between technology, magic and nature that your pic brought in have already become fantasy staples. Its in goddman everything, has been for decades. The rest is just when goths discovered brown suits could hide their growing guts and if you added in more colours there were more girls you could photograph.
>>97196526>Its in goddman everythingmention 10 rpgs with this theme
alternate history Ancient Greece, where Hero of Alexandria's steam engines took off millennia early (but electricity, medicine, etc did not).so then you have the Greek gods and shir, not just London with blimps.
>>97196423Arcanum is technically a fantasy-steampunk crossover. Not pure steampunk. Your problem is fixed just by picking something without magic or classical fantasy races.
>>97196423Give it its own identity beyond "fantasy Victorian industrial era with cogs glued on".>>97196570Steampunk is automatically fantasy because the "technology" ranges from plausible anachronism to outright impossibility.
>open ended question>OP will not reply to any posts in itMod thread.
>>97196606Technically true, but I was talking about artistic genres. Not level of being grounded in reality.>Steampunksci-fi, steam technology, industrial revolution, victorian, colonization, humanism, orientalism, etc.>FantasyTolkien-esque, mythical races, medievalism, magic, knights and kings, spiritualism, etc.
>>97196531Here, mix of obscure and things even your grandma knows about. >Eberon (Basic bitch forgotten realms too)>Spire>Blades in the Dark>Mage the Nouning, only going to count once even though its a bunch of games >Magic the Gathering >Dungeon World >Engines & Empires>Dragonmech>World of Warcraft >Fucking Starwars Its in god damn everything. Hippy garbage man vs nature dualism is deeply ingrained in western culture.
>>97196737I clog the way you line up the cats.
>>97196563This is what I did with my setting because I fucking love Automatons as a concept
Did people not like the Dwemer
>>97196423Steampunk is an aesthetic, not a genre. There is nothing to fix.
>>97196737>colonization, orientalismthese two being considered offensive to depict nowadays is precisely why steampunk is dead
>>97196765You monster.
>>97196737>Not level of being grounded in reality.Fantasy directly pertains to the level of grounding, in terms of its application to games at least."Artistic "genres"" mindlessly parroted by limpdicks and leatherheads don't matter, because they're always worthless pigeonholes whose "definitions" change depending on who you ask, and they're pretty much always cited to profess some higher knowledge, importance, or culture the person doesn't actually possess.
>>97196805How could you call me a monster in the face of such an overwhelmingly positive response?
>>97196423You can't. It was made without any foundations, so it isn't substantial enough to fix.
>>97196804Could you even imagine the controversy if Arcanum II came out and the UK had a massive colonial empire? Even if it was just solely in the background, redditors and journos would be scrawling out entire screeds trying to get the game taken down. Throw a little Burroughs in there with a massive untamed jungle continent and the backlash would somehow be even worse. Even Southoryos from Game of Bones and Pandyssia from Dishonored had people complaining despite literally having absolutely nothing to do with the story in question or featuring any characters whatsoever. Two huge parts of the Victorian world are just gone.
>>97196750>All his examples are just lies.Huh. I would have thought you'd have at least one real example.
>arrow>hide thread
>>97196423OP, what's wrong with steampunk?
>>97196434Start by clearly stating what "steampunk" is. People get weirdly contentious about that.
I have a strange aversion to the term Steampunk, because of the pip-pip-cherio cogfop thing. When I do it, I incorporate a lot of gothic fantasy horror stuff.wait,>https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GaslampFantasy>Dishonored and BloodborneOh, I've been doing gaslamp fantasy the whole time.
>>97196423Replace it with dieselpunk
I'm gonna sound like I'm being facetious, but I'm serious here: What are the prominent steampunk works? Cyberpunk has its Blade Runner, its Sprawl trilogy, The Matrix, shit you can point to as what defines it or cements what it is, at least in the popular eye. What is there for steampunk? I've seen the aesthetic stamped onto other settings, like for themed temporary events in vidya and shit, but what are the big works? Who is the original Victorian fop airship captain or whatever? What is it that the art hoes and convention types are actually referencing?
Make a single good setting or game with it. Just one.
>>97197860>>97198341Not really weird, there aren't really any defining works. Hell, even tvtropes (not exactly the best critical site, but it generally is useful to get an idea over the consensus for what people would tag as whatever) starts with Verne. Which is like, I dunno, defining peplum by starting with the Aeneid or something.
Put the "Punk" part from Steampunk to the forefront.
By acknowledging that Mass Polit(r)ic(k)s are a fundamental component of an industrial society, that must be handled seriously, lest your setting comes out as either weightless pulpy cogfop on one end or ridiculously hamfisted morality play on the other.The fantasy element should also be subdued, but incorporated well enough to seem like an organic part of the setting. Personally I like leaning into gothic horror themes, since that meshes well with the general vibe of steampunk-y stories.Oh and also explaining why steam power is both so dominant and can facilitate machines more impressive than those of our own 19th century can help the entire setting look less ridiculous. A good method is to replace coal with some other sort of unobtainium mechanism that can more efficiently power steam engines.
>>97198341The Difference Engine is the one book I can think of.
>>97196423idk I remember enjoying Fable 3 very much back in the day so I guess do that.
>>97196423This should be a question in a general, not its own thread.
>>97196423Kill all theatre kids.
ban the use of red, green, and bronze
>>97197652I accept your concession.
>>97196423By pretending it doesn't exist until we feel nostalgia for it.
>>97196423OP, what's wrong with Steampunk?
With the sole exception of cyberpunk, every single -punk setting is just an aesthetic rather than a real setting.Like take the cyber out of cyberpunk and you would still have dystopian hellholes with corpos crushing average people.But you take the steam out of steam punk? And you have no setting.
>>97198980Interesting, where's this map from?
>>97200324An old setting from one of those "/tg/ makes a setting" threads I ended up adopting for myself. Never really ended up properly organising it, since I moved on to other projects since.
>>97198341>MatrixI don't really think that Matrix is cyberpunk. Not even the first one, although that one at least explores some of the themes that are explored in cyberpunk. I mean the story is about a literal chosen one messiah with super powers and that is the least cyberpunk thing that there is. The animated short stories do qualify though.
>>971964231. stop with the clock top2. base it off Austria Hungary instead of Britain
>>97199450They're not kids, they're adults.
>>97196423Traditional games?
>>97196434FpbpThere's nothing wrong with Steampunk; if you don't like it, don't use it for your games.
>>97196750>Starwars>Steampunkyou are retarded.
>>97196423/tg/ has shit taste.
>>97201125He isn't calling Star Wars steampunk, he said in >>97196526>The tensions between technology, magic and nature that your pic brought in have already become fantasy staples. Its in goddman everything, has been for decades....and then >>97196531 asked for 10 RPGs with that theme, and in >>97196750 he delivered.Learn some reading comprehension.
>>97196423As opposed to the originator of all the "punk" suffix genres, cyberpunk, steampunk doesn't really have strongly associated themes or settings or tropes. It's kind of a disembodied aesthetic floating in the void. This is far from the only option, but if it were up to me I'd make works focused on the actual "punk" bit, namely, about the march of technology and the conflict between normal people and nature with the eponymous steam engine-driven advances in the industrial revolution, echoing similar themes of technology versus society in cyberpunk. If you want to add a dash of fantasy, go for it. Treemen trying to drive back John Henry-style forest-tilling machine, a young inventor trying to stay ahead from big barons who want to steal his new tech, a gold rush cum arms race for some precious new material or resource. Shove in all the cogs and steam mechs you want, just make it mean something.I'm sure there's already plenty of works like this, but ime most of "steampunk" is just a millenialoid aesthetic, so there you go.
>>97196750>Dragonmechgetting ready to run this. It's a pity that goodman games won't do anything with the IP beyond throwing a reference in some DCC module, it has potential for a really interesting setting
>>97198980I agree except for coal, that should be key. As for games, you could draw on Victorian literature for ideas like murder mysteries, adventures into the dark corners where ignorance reigns (like in the first section of Dracula) and political intrigue. There cant really be any dungeons unless you do a major setup like Dr. Wizzelbaum's amazing AutoFactorium, which has stopped sending update telegrams 2 weeks ago. Or Count Otto von Henyadi-Krackenstrup had invited a prestigious natural philosopher to his castle only to imprsion him and its up to the pc's to rescue him. Its mostly window dressing but it would allow a DM to write campaigns that fall in line with Westerns and thrillers
>>97196423Get rid of Victorian aesthetic and embrace the Bella Epoque aesthetic insteadaka what arcane did with Piltover or Howl's Moving Castle anime
>>97203859>I agree except for coalI think it depends on how far you want to push it. I took it into a direction similar to the old Dystopian Wars lore if anyone remembers that with my setting. So the internal combustion engine exists, but is a rather niche invention because it's discovery was predated by the discovery of Kiep crystals, a bullshit fantasy substance which can be induced into a strong exothermic reaction when submerged into a strong base & using some catalysts. The reaction can be used to build ultra efficient steam engines which can power huge airships, submarines, city-sized contraptions, trains, road vehicles, etc. The trade off being of course that it produces incredibly toxic sludge as residue and no one's quite figured out how to deal with yet, slowly poisoning everything.The group I DM'd for were all stemlords so I came up with this whole system to explain away all of the implausible flying devices and such.>you could draw on Victorian literature for ideas like murder mysteries, adventures into the dark corners where ignorance reigns (like in the first section of Dracula)Yes definitely! The fantasy part of the setting is inspired by stuff like Dracula, Frankenstein, The King in Yellow, The House on the Borderland, An Inhabitant of Carcosa, The Great God Pan, things like that.>>97204405TRVTNVKE
>>97198765>punksteamAnon, you're an idiot.
>>97199033I wish that book was good. The first story showed a lot of promise, but the rest was an absolute snore. And it's a shame, because I like Gibson's work.
>>97196804I've never seen fantasy or steampunk explore the idea that magic/technology became an equalizer to the point that colonialism never happened. Hard to capture Haitians and make them slaves when they've got a zombie army to back them up, hard to conquer the Aztecs when all those human sacrifices actually gave them superpowers. You could easily create a steampunk world where different cultures became luddites, embraced technology totally, or embraced both. After all, what's the point of alternate history if the history isn't alternate?
>>97196423By replacing it with superior Gaslamp Fantasy. Specifically, the "fantasy world reaches Victorian Era tech level via industrialized magic" variety, not the lame "Victorian Europe, but with faeries and magic" like Castle Falkenstein did.
>>97198980>Personally I like leaning into gothic horror themes, since that meshes well with the general vibe of steampunk-y stories.Hell, Gothic Horror and Steampunk came from roughly the same era of Victorian culture. There's a reason GURPS did a "GURPS Screampunk" splat all about the overlap/interweaving of Gothic Horror with Steampunk.
>>97202349and?"The tensions between technology, magic and nature" does not apply to Star Wars.Nigger
>>97204405Based
>>97206694You fuckwit the rural farmboy uses a hookey religion and feelings to defeat the techno fascist super weapon in the first one ever.
>>97196423You don't. The problem with steam punk is that it's neither steam nor punk>Its gears>and the manFix that and you fix the basic issues.If you want victorian Sci fi play that, If you want achronistic punks because you can't comprehend that punk was only ever a psyop to begin with, play that. If you want steam punk play that but you won't because there's no damn hook. THere's a handful of settings where this is less of a problem (girl genius comes to mind) but there the hook is the foglio's love of lingerie and ropeplay. You could do some interesting things in that 1890's to 1920's period but again if you want alt universe or sci fi from that period just do that. Cyberpunk works because it's a dystopia that is so oppressive that punk is actually not the most retarded take at something. All the other punks suffer from not having that built in. You want to play Steampunk? Congrats you are fighting against the Dutch West Indies Company except they have 'heat beams' of condesnced heat? that are basically more painful lasers and semi mechanized infantry. You are some degenerate brown person who lost. You could make that work, but most people don't want to. For some reason it's just called History if the Dystopia is in the past.
>>97196563>alternate history Ancient Greece, where Hero of Alexandria's steam engines took off millennia early (but electricity, medicine, etc did not).>so then you have the Greek gods and shir, not just London with blimps.And that's going to be classified as "Bronze Punk" instead of steam punk.
>>97196423You may as well ask "erm gaiz, how do we make Pride Parades less gay???" The fagginess of steampunk IS the intent.
>>97196423>How do we fix Steampunk?At least in TTGRPGs a lot of games add straight up magic to the setting, unless properly integrated into the setting feels like a tacked on gimmick added as an afterthought. I get why it's there, but I'd rather powers be a product of new science that pushes ethical and social norms. Something like Jack Griffith's iocane powder from the "invisible man" or at least make it a psychic power and not straight up magic.
>>97206830>The fagginess of steampunk IS the intent.If huge tits squeezing into a tight victorian corset is faggotry than what is straightness?
>>97206888Occultism was a big part of the industrialization age.
>>97196423Is this some content bait for some TTS Youtube TTRPG shit? what the fuck are you fixing??
>>97206924>Occultism was a big part of the industrialization age.Same can be said for early skeptics like Harry Houdini using their knowledge of stage magic to debunk spiritual seances and the like. The tension between industrial modernity and the old ways is one of the major themes, so you need to consider both sides, there where also things believed to be scientific that seem like magic to us, such as Mesmerism and the concept of "animal magnetism"
>>97207033>The tension between industrial modernity and the old ways is one of the major themesModern(17th century +) Occultism had nothing to do with the "traditional ways". You would be very hard pressed to call alchemy "traditional".
>>97207145>Modern(17th century +) Occultism had nothing to do with the "traditional waysOccultism often claims to derive it's believes from some ancient forgotten tradition, such as Helena Blavadski's "Secret Teachings of the Ages" weather these claims are true or not is besides the point, an occultist's approach to knowledge runs contrary to the dominant empiricist scientific positivist paradigm.>You would be very hard pressed to call alchemy "traditional".Unless it's modern day Jung bro "symbolic" alchemy, I very much can.
>>97207178>Secret Teachings of the AgesThat is *Secret Teachings of All Ages
>>97206709>the rural farmboy uses a hookey religion and feelings to defeat the techno fascist super weaponthe tyrant who also has the same magical powers.
>>97207185>>97207178Secret Doctrine, tards.
>>97207178>Occultism often claims to derive it's believes from some ancient forgotten traditionIf it's forgotten then it ain't tradition.>an occultist's approach to knowledge runs contrary to the dominant empiricist scientific positivist paradigm.Does it though? The line gets blurry when you consider Frankenstein or your own examples of mesmerism and the like.
>>97196423you don't?you just make it more than a cogflop aestheticlots of "steampunk" settings are pretty popular or have a positive cult following>console gameschrono trigger incorporates time travel and advanced tech, final fantasy 6 has some lovecraftian becoming god type stuff, final fantasy is general has tons of stuff like this with the airships and low tech firearms alongside engines and swordsthere's also dishonoured, arcanum as op posted, usually asian settings incorporate stuff more if I think about it, lots of anime also has a steampunk style like nausicaayou can also sprinkle technology and have it go through advances like Edge Chronicles
>>97207230>Does it though? The line gets blurry when you consider Frankenstein or your own examples of mesmerism and the like.Those aren't really mystical or occult so much as they are fringe science, the monster of Frankenstein being partially inspired by real life experiments involving electricity for example. >If it's forgotten then it ain't tradition.And that's why you get "mediums" to contact ancient spirits of Tibetan Sages and Atlantis priest kings so they can pass "the secret teaching" to you.
>>97207260>Those aren't really mystical or occult so much as they are fringe scienceThe way I see it the main difference between becoming invisible with the power of fringe science or by accessing the secrets of Xibablba is the age of the source of the knowledge. One is cutting edge and the other ancient. Both are pushing beyond the the accepted boundaries of science and tradition. Is that distinction important enough warrant a thematic struggle between the two or make them incompatible in the same setting as the original poster implied?
>>97207308>The way I see it the main difference between becoming invisible with the power of fringe science or by accessing the secrets of Xibablba is the age of the source of the knowledge.That makes sense. But there's also the relationship that these beliefs have with truth, one believes that you can measure and understand the whole universe, the other wants to directly experience the truth through mystical means.>Is that distinction important enough warrant a thematic struggle between the two or make them incompatible in the same setting as the original poster implied?Sure, it's a dispute over the fundamental nature of reality itself, as well as two distinct ways of seeing the world, that can be an interesting conflict, and I think it's important to steampunk in particular.
>>97207374Again. I don't see that much of a difference. Both the ways you present of understanding the world(direct experience and the the scientific method, which btw are not at odds with each other) are explored in Lovecrafts works. Gaining too much, or forbidden knowledge through science or occultism lead to same results ( at least as far as Lovecraft is concerned). The existence of truth as monistic, eternal and attainable is rooted in mysticism (Parmenides poem On Nature) and has been the foundation of science from its very beginning. After all they seem to fill the same void in humanity as both occultism and the belief that science would solve every problem were popular at the same time. In WWII and even in the cold war all the major powers were really into both occultism and scientific research.
>>97196423Steampunk as the setting's primary culture:>cringe, overplayed, cogfopSteampunk as a secondary, specialized culture:>useful and aesthetically distinct while not becoming inescapableSteampunk in the ruins of a long-perished culture:>certified gigakino
>>97207457I would agree with you if we where talking about renaissance or early modern periods since the line between mysticism and alchemy where often blurred but the Victorian era on which most steam punk is based specifically, is the period where Darwinism and scientific naturalism first emerged as major forces in society and people where begging to question religious institutions and the validity of mystical experiences. But also a period where "new thought" and Theosophy where pushing back against materialism (among other groups) the conflict between these forces is one of the interesting dynamics that can be explored in steam punk, which is kind of supposed to be "industrial revolution on steroids."
>>97196860Arcanum was able to find enough to make a pretty good game. Maybe people are just not looking hard enough.
>>97196423>How do we fix Steampunk?The aesthetics of it can be amazing.The execution of it is the hard part.I don't know how to execute a Steampunk setting properly.
>>97207207Do you think tension and narrative themes can only have one point?
>>97208930>Just how fucking STUPID are fantasists today?Anon that was a quarter of a century ago.
>>97208928What a stupid question.You failed to prove your point and lost your argument.
>>97208930>reddit spacing
>>97208930>Wizardry has ALWAYS been associated with machinery and architecture and geometry and sciencegod forbid fantasy tropes might be explored in a way different from how our ancestors didthere was a time when machinery and science were envisioned as the domain of gods, not wizards. yet here we are, using what amounts to sorcery powered with the fire stolen from heaven to discuss inane shitcalm ye tits, anon
>>97197615And now->>97208930We have a redditor having a meltdown over the game's own magic system. Apart of what makes Arcanum unique is now making redditors have an aneurism. I was completely right about why we can't have an Arcanum II.>>97210623>TropesI honestly think that's why genre literature, hell all literature, is starting to rapidly decline. Many, many people no longer enjoy a story for being just that, a story. No, now we have people sit down with checklists where they painstakingly attempt to record any and all details about the work in question. In short, fiction is now work. It's no longer escapism, and that's why we get shit like the Star Wars sequels.
>>97211225>Many, many people no longer enjoy a story for being just that, a story. No, now we have people sit down with checklists where they painstakingly attempt to record any and all details about the work in question.I think I've fallen into this kind of trap.Did you break out of it and how did you do it?
>>97209061Fine. We won't call you Anon anymore. Your new name is Asshat.
>>97211238ntayrt Read things you like. Make shit you want. Don't worry about it too much.
>>97196423All that neat tech and such? Your players don't have access to it. It's for the obscenely wealthy/aristocratic types. At best you got cobbled together shit that might explode if you look at it weird. That is the PUNK half of steampunk that everyone fucking forgets about.
Thisbthread have discussed many things.I will add one more: politics.Steampunk is about victorian period with high class people. You cannot have that without some interesting pllitics involved. And many modern wroters suck at politics.Besides Game of Thtones i do not remember a recent book that did politics well.Hence we cannot have steampunk, cuase we are too dumb to write politics
>>97210623>calm ye tits, anonHe doesn't want calm tits! He wants to SEETHE!He wants all of reality to conform to his preconceptions, no exceptions. He's a moron.
>>97211238>Did you break out of it and how did you do it?1. think of something fun2. come up with a short story about how fun that thing is. it doesn't have to be a prize winning novel; hell, if you can't come up with something, go on and rip off the plot of some series or movie you think is fun3.profit>>97212079>I will add one more: politicsI think this is the big problem with the steampunk genre in particular, people fin the aesthetics cool and interesting but can't bother with the actual background of the steam age and its consequences, and the reason they can't bother with that is because that requires reading something beyond YA romantasy and that's boring shit for fat boomers
>>97206047I can't believe you don't like peamstunk
>>97206888>>97206914>supposed to be some kind of inventor or adventurer>dressed sluttier than a Victorian whoreThis is really the only nonnegotiable characteristic of steampunk.
>>97207207To be fair, the tyrant is defined as a traitor to the hokey religion by the fact that he's using his magical powers in service of technofascism.
>>97209061>Don't call me "Anon" again you ignorant twat.Anon...
>>97196423>How do we fix Steampunk?Play it straight. The genre's pool of published works is about 85% "subversions" with "plucky foid/groid protagonists fighting against The Oppressive System" which is why it dissolved into Tumblr Soup so quickly. You actually need at least one of the major colonial powers to be the unironic good guys totally justified in bringing Progress and Science and Basic Hygiene to the fuzzy-wuzzies. In an American setting this is incredibly easy to do by keeping the injuns the howling savages they were IRL and adding some neat alt-tech. In a British setting this is also incredibly easy to do by channeling your modern 21st century rage at the Pajeet Menace back at their ancestors and have Queen Victoria chastising her administrators for not suppressing them more effectively, or by looking at the fall of Rhodesia and South Africa to understand what those colonists were up against.
>>97200644wtf it was?pre WWI Europe meets Chinese Warlords cross-over?
>>97211225>Aneurysm: Of Steamworks And Magick Obscura
>>97206086Ah but you can't do that either, because unless you turned them into societies of super-geniuses living in steampunk Wakandas and all the white cultures were backwards shitholes(afterall, without all the wealth and knowledge and people and heckin genius we STOLE from the poor wholesome chungus natives, we'd be NOTHING) the same people who'd shit on you for depicting colonialism would also throw a hissy about you depicting primitive people as, well, primitive. And even if you did the Native Wakanda vs Dimwit Luddite YTs, you better have at least 70% nignogs(and a token Amerindian) on your company's staff because otherwise you'll be "appropriating the culture of the oppressed" or whatever.My point is there's no way to win, not until we go back to simply rejecting the premise that depiction and endorsement are synonymous, and also the premise that people of one culture aren't "allowed" to depict, draw from, or make comment upon another.
We had a perfect Steampunk universe once, with slight elements of Aetherpunk and "Tech vs. Wilds" concepts, but PP ruined it.
>>97213878Yeah, this guy's pretty much got it.
>>97210623>there was a time when machinery and science were envisioned as the domain of gods, not wizardsGods and wizards are indistinguishable retard. Magic and religion are indistinguishable. Magic (including esoteric knowledge) was a gift of the gods. Odin was a god. Thoth was a god. The most powerful wizards are typically part-god, sponsored by the gods, or full gods themselves.
>>97213323>This is really the only nonnegotiable characteristic of steampunk.First Steampunk was faggy, now it's too str8, I guess there's no pleasing some people.....
You know, people like talking about "fixing" steam punk as a setting, how many people in this thread actually play steam punk games like pic related? And if you do, what are your favorites and why?
>>97217248don't play many RPGs anymore so I'm more into it in video and table top gamesalthough warmachine aka iron kingdoms had some really neato rpg books about the setting
>>97215738>Gods and wizards are indistinguishable retardgo pray to Harry Potter, plebbit>Magic and religion are indistinguishableagreed> Magic (including esoteric knowledge) was a gift of the gods. Odin was a god. Thoth was a god. The most powerful wizards are typically part-god, sponsored by the gods, or full gods themselvesIrrelevant for the topic at hand, but thanks for your participation
Personally, I like these steam punk miniatures.
>>97219135
>>97219152This is from The Man Who Would Be King, can AI do nothing but rip off?
>>97219174The other one is from Sherlock Holmes (only he's a legless creature immured in a robotic diving suit for some reason), they're clearly meant to be part of a reference-heavy game.
>>97219152
>>97219233
>>97196521> It's important to say, don't show.Shit advice. Having “something to say” is meaningless. Everything you do already communicates something about you and your society, and what you reveal unintentionally is more valuable than whatever shallow message you choose to broadcast.
>>97202362>just make it mean something.Meaning comes from the reader's interpretation, not from your worthless intentions. Everything can mean something. Your parroted cliche does absolutely nothing to improve any setting, genre, or product.
>>97207230>If it's forgotten then it ain't tradition.What are you on about? Do you also believe that if culture is forgotten then it isn't a culture? What about language, or art?
>>97219174If referencing and drawing inspiration counts as ripping things off, then yes, an AI can only rip things off, but by that logic, the same should be said of human beings. Art is built atop art.
>>97221835Tradition is by definition a living thing. It is cultural continuation, the passing down of cultural elements from one generation to the next. If such continuation doesn't exists anymore then we are not talking about tradition. We are talking about history.
>>97217321>go pray to Harry Potter, plebbitI pray to Odin. The true god-wizard.
>>97196423>>97196434Whereas cyberpunk was an aesthetic but also a social commentary on unrestrained hedonism/corporate greed and the consequences thereof, steampunk is just an aesthetic, which is why it's so hollow and why it mostly appeals to cosplayers. There's no substance so it's nebulous and vague, which makes it easier to get into but less poignant.>tl;dr it's shallow
>>97221874>steampunk is just an aestheticSteam punk deals with themes of rapid industrialization, colonialism, Victorian class structures, the impact of anachronistic advanced technologies, such as the "difference engine" would have on the world at large. Steam punk isn't just cyberpunk with brass googles it's a genre of alternative history, a fact people sadly forget.
>>97221866lol. lmao, even>saar im from pure Aryan stock, saar, I worship the white gods of the north saaar>>97221835>What are you on about? Do you also believe that if culture is forgotten then it isn't a culture? What about language, or art?mtf how can we know something, and clasify it as culture, it we have forgotten it?>>97221874This is the precise point; steampunk is mostly an aesthetic without any commentary on the social and political environment that should go along with itthat's what the OP was looking for, I think>>97222026>themes of rapid industrialization, colonialism, Victorian class structures, the impact of anachronistic advanced technologies> a fact people sadly forgetthis anon gets it
>>97211935One of the interesting things about Arcanum is that it goes the opposite way with it, magic is for the elite only but technology is something everyone can use.
>>97208930No good post had ever this image attached.It's always some no-game nonsense on how magic "should" be.
>>97219174>AI can't make quality pictures>AI can't make interesting pictures>AI can't make creative picturesDoes the anti-ai crowd do nothing but complain?
>>97225502Go back to your slop thread.
>>97225502There wouldn't be anything to complain about if this shit wasn't spammed and pushed every-fucking-where.
>>97196423You really just need to tone down the fashion a little. That's what usually tips it over the edge into being lame.
>>97198341Anything by Jules Verne. Of course, the issue there is that he lived when Steam tech was the newest thing, so at the time his works were just speculative fiction. It's only after steam faded that his works became the basis for a new psudogenre
>>97198980>A good method is to replace coal with some other sort of unobtainium mechanism that can more efficiently power steam engines.Most modern power plants (Nuclear, Coal, Natural Gas, etc.) are in actuality giant steam engines turning electric motors in order to generate electricity. The steam age has not really ended it was just hidden from sight. If you want steam punk to actually work you need to come up with a reason that pumping a high pressure aerosol of liquid vapor through pipes is a better energy transfer method than transmitting electricity through metal wires.
>>97198341You know what, I don't how steampunk fashion/subculture started either. It seems to me it must have started in the US but that's as far as I can go; there must be a reason beyond some music bands adopting the steam era adventurer aesthetics back in the 2000s, but I just don't know what it was>>97230255In Dragonmech it all boils down into "steam powered shit was invented by dwarves and they're so good at it everything just works out", the book just tells you not to overthink it and just enjoy the rideit also implies that the same dwarves that invented steam powered mechs also know about electricity generation and nuclear powered engines, but won't tell anybody about it because it's just too dangerous to let people like humans or goblins get their hands on that kind of knowledge it's also implied that there was an ancient dwarven empire that nuked themselves into the stone age and that's the main reason they keep that kind of tech under wrapsi'm personally fine with that; i just want to run a high fantasy adventure with mechs and sheit
>>97213529That not playing it straight. That is being retarded and not understanding punk is sticking to the man. Making it into /pol/ retardation is not fixing anything
>>97230511Based punk anon.
>>97230511Punk is and has always been corporate-sponsored "safe" rebellion to keep the youth sedated and buying your products, idiot. Cyberpunk is the only one to get it right by making the punks PART of the system. They think they're rebellious and living free, but they're just useful pawns to the corps. Deniable assets, free agents, and some of the biggest spenders (and testers) of a whole host of weapons, software, and cyberware. Why pay for some test subject to use your sweet new cyberspine in a controlled (and thus unrealistic) environment when you can just "accidentally" leak it to some cyberpunk who will put it through its paces for you?>>97234620Based useful idiot, I bet you think the big corps on your allies when they slap a rainbow on their profile pic once a year (but not in the middle east, of course)
>>97235561The idiot here is you. If you used your brain (if you have one) you would see that going durr durr corporate-sponsored "safe" rebellion derp does not change that making it into /pol/ retardation is missing the point of punk. In Cyberpunk the corps are bad guys who are doing shady shit. To play punk straight you need to understand the idea of behind punk
>>97235671>n-no u!Punktards truly are retarded, holy shit.>/pol/ retardationI never once commented on the other poster's blathering, I'm just pointing out the (you) are retarded. Quit with the whataboutisms like the pussy faggot that you are.It's also very funny for you to clutch pearls over /pol/ when punk has its roots in neonazism.>In Cyberpunk the corps are bad guys who are doing shady shit.EVERYONE is doing shady shit in cyberpunk, retard.The corps.The governments.The gangs.Other punks.They've all got skeletons in their closet because they're all complicit contributors to The System™ that put them there. Not just that, but there is just as much Cyberpunk media out there about being an enforcer of The System™ as there is about being an unwitting pawn of it, i.e. a punk. Hell, all the best cyberpunk TRPGs have classes specifically associated with playing a member of a corp. CP2020/RED has the Corpo/Exec as well as the Cop/Lawman, and Tokyo NOVA has no less than three different classes to represent being either a corporate goon of varying heights on the corporate ladder (as well as police/yakuza goon) to straight up being a fatcat descended from the corporate elite spacehabs. You quite literally have no idea what you're talking about.>To play punk straightPunk is never straight, retard.
>>97235671Go play trenchcrusade faggot
>>97230511Steampunk was literally born as a bunch of nerds asking what if the (early) steam age had better computers. Take your gay plebbity lace code and shove it up your ass.>>97230255Materials shortages. If platinum, neodymium, and all the other fancy elements that catalytic converters and permanent magnet electric motors rely on to function are in short supply, STEEM TOOB is the fallback option.
>>97235915Yes, you are retarded and if you are not commenting on that other retard (or even reading it) then was no point replying to me. >>97235981No u
>>97235990>t. retard with stuff up the ass.
>>97236030I was addressing (you)r statement, not his. Good job remaining retarded tho.
>>97236183My statement was in reply to someone else, you retarded faggot. It is stupid to get upset about a post without at least reading the other posts in the reply chain so you understand what is going on.
>>97235561>I bet you think the big corps on your allieswhat's up with nu-4chan users making wild assumptions like these lmafolike the other anon said punk is sticking it to the man. a game where you already won like the big guy would be very boring to play
>>97206781maybe, but make the focus of the game steam-powered machinery while everything else hasn't caught up. you may not having the printing press or industrialised farming, but rudimentary trains ALONE mean you're getting (scribed) messages from A to B. shifting coal around. i suppose you could just decide that people still work glass to make goggles in order to make the machines. and they keep those goggles on top hats.
>>97238084Makes sense, the "what if Rome industrialized" alt history is pretty underutilized as a whole.
>>971964231.) Start with gassing anyone who has ever dressed up like pic related and burning all literature associated with steam punk.2.) Make the practice and even a mention of steam punk illegal and punishable by death.3.) Wait until steam punk is forgotten completely 4.) The world is now a better place
>>97239397
>>97198341>but what are the big works?Wild Wild West
>>97222787>he hates the wizard stereotype Fuck off cunt
>>97196423>How do we fix Steampunk?Make it all into steampunk ASMR, then toss drama, despair, clash between the established and newer technology like liquid fossil fuels, make it like in your picture interfere with magic.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3JSuwubl78
>>97236773I concur, the funnest part of Cyberpunk isn't the faggy retard with a mohawk spray painting a cyber dick on the side of a building and thinking it's sticking it to the man.It's the idea of society now being neo-feudalism, where corporations wage wars of espionage and sabotage against one another, and have coteries at their disposal from cyber ninjas to hackers that are regarded as "cyber mages" and you being one of those agents.
Bump
>>97222026This guy gets it. As an aside,>Victorian class structuresThe industrialization led to the birth of the modern middle class and the rise of "new money" in the face of pre-established "old money". People who otherwise used to have no business getting rich were now getting rich, and nothing throws society into a tizzy like threatening old rich people.
Incredibly funny to see the grug tier rambling ITT like steampunk doesn't have the most straightforward path to the punk part if you would bother to take Fuentes' and the Heritage Foundation's cocks out of your cocks for even a single minute and look at the history of the 19th century beyond your psychosexual race war fantasies.>>97230255>Most modern power plants (Nuclear, Coal, Natural Gas, etc.) are in actuality giant steam engines turning electric motors in order to generate electricity.Yeah that's what I meant. You want to keep the whole steam engine aesthetic, but replace the heat source with something that can more realistically power those typical steampunk mech and airship contraption instead of coal. IDK maybe it's just my autism but I find it kinda silly when you have some humongous coal powered machine that would obviously need a whole coal collier pullled up to it at all times for fuel.
>>97221874I point out that the main reason for this is because the social commentary would offend liberals. That's why they don't want to go too deeply into it, it's an era where people hated foreigners, used racial slurs, hated homos and women had no rights. If Call of Cthulu's 1920s setting made them clutch their pearls, 'authentic' steampunk would give them a fucking heart attack.
>>97248032It's not about "straightforward paths" monganon, it's about the fact that Steampunk in practice is inspired by Jules Verne and the like so it is in fact about rich people having zany adventures with nutty inventions, not revolt and social upheaval. The name is just a name, it's autistic to get hung up on it as if it's supposed to define the genre via some fuckass truenaming sorcery.
>>97222026This. Peoples just don’t know it because in the woke era no one is making a game that involves colonialism and features a predominantly white society.In fact, I’m struggling to find a better example than the pic in OPs post.
>>97248704Who the fuck cares about whitoid shit anymore? Your 5% now lmfao.
>>97248704And to its credit, colonialism is a fair avenue of narrative within steampunk.>New (potentially unspoiled) land discovered>Not directly underneath the ruling authority's thumb, so lots more freedom and autonomy in this region (this is why the Wild West works)>Multiple new competing interests racing to put their stakes down and claim the land, offering multiple avenues for competition>All while dealing with locals and the exotic local culturesIt's a gold rush for new land and resources, all while meeting interesting new people from all directions, and that's reason enough for adventure.
>>97248721The main things that involve making colonialism unsavory to the modern public has to do with questions of racism and inequality. Essentially, as long as you're not racist and are catering to the needs of the locals, you might get away with being called the "good guys" in a colonialism story.
>>97248721They did this in Pillars of Eternity 2 and no one liked it.
>>97196423buy returning it back to its roots as said by this anon >>97221874 these days it just an aesthetic & nothing more now I'm not talking about some bullshit like "Capitalism big bad" you hear the retards spew but this form of Capitalism, Corpitism is bad here is the why, have it heavily focus more on the Steampower Machines & what it does to the natural world & how it corrupts & erodes Magic.
>>97248715I guess we could make a game about African civilization, except…..
>>97248730Eh, maybe, but I doubt it.As long as the locals are implied to be inferior is someway (technological, culturally, etc) it will be seen as racist.And since the locals have to be inferior for colonizing to work, you will always have this issue.
>>97196423>How do we fix Steampunk?Add more cogs
>>97204405Looking at this image makes me angry beyond words, it shows what could have been and what the west has lost
>>97208930You would have a point if the game didn't explicitly describe why magick and tech are incompatible. Magick changes the laws of physics locally which can have disastrous effects on machines that require a very specific coefficient of friction, tensile strength, ideal gas law, mass, etc to function
>>97248704>Peoples just don’t know it because in the woke era no one is making a game that involves colonialism and features a predominantly white society.Greedfall exist you dumb nignog.
>>97217248Played it a few times as a kid back when it was released, but could never keep a campaign going for some reason.
>>97219174You're probably trolling you dumb twat. This is from the game Rise of Moloch back in 2017.
>>97235915I have tried. You can't reach retards that have had their brains rotted with too much Marxist critical theory. From their view, people's morality is indirectly proportional to their wealth, i.e. the poor are innocently good, the wealthy are irredeemably evil. If you look at the characters from Cyberpunk's root, Decker, Case, Cowboy, Molly and Sarah, none of them are punks. They're all sellouts. Sarah is like the worst as she keeps trying to join the side that has been trying to kill her.
>>97198980A magical element that naturally release heat as it decays. Bonus, the element also releases an exotic energy that sickens and warps living creatures, so the overreliance on it by the major military powers is a source of both suffering for the common folk, and also monsters.
>>97206924This, almost everything about ghosts in the contemporary culture was devised by grifters around the turn of the century. Ghostbusters included. Look up the spiritualists, ectoplasm is literally vaginal mucus.
>>97213878Yeah, this is an older problem than we typically remember, and the whole reason for fantasy races in not only Arcanum, but Ye Olde Donjons & Dragonnes, as well. Orcs are red injuns. The various other goblinoids are the various flavors of chink/gook/jap. Gnolls are urban niggers, while drow are the threat of educated Negroes and especially feminist Negresses. And, of course, all the many monsters representative of the Gygaxian phobia of women. Dragons themselves represent corporations, and the core races are just various sorts of working class whites. Hardworking artisans, comfortloving tricksters, sylvan aesthetes, etc.
>>97235915This nigga gets it. He's a little bit autistic, but he gets it. Punk isn't straight. Punk means gay.And the greatest piece of cyberpunk fiction, with all due respect to Grandmaster Gibson, is Robocop.
>>97249590wakanda has fallen
>>97249590I mean to be fair cyberpunk is also about fictitious societies that can't really exist.
>>97252694That's delusional. We actually live in a cyberpunk society right now. It just lacks the aesthetic.
>>97252005>Played it a few times as a kid back when it was released, but could never keep a campaign going for some reason.How was it? Why didn't people stick around for the long campaign?
>>97252716Ah yes, I forgot that I can buy cybereyes, reflex enhancers or a robot arm from a sketchy surgeon in the back alleys of Spokane, Washington as long as I'm fine with the Apple design language.
>>97253465Cyberpunk isn't synonymous to cybernetic enhancements you filthy casual.
>>97253579>using God as an actual argument on a tabletop games board>and calling another idiot while doing soSAAAAR
>>97255361>using moronic arguments>calling another anon a moronkek
>>97253465Did you miss the part were he said it "lacks the aesthetic"?Also, Spokane's back alleys aren't nearly sketchy enough for cyberpunk.
>>97253465It's actually really easy to buy secondhand, jailbroken electronics. There's also literally an ongoing legal between people who bought cybernetic eye implants from a company that went under and the company that bought up their patents and discontinued service on said eye implants. We're in a cyberpunk dystopia, it's just a gay globohomo slop dystopia instead of a cool neon corpofeudal dystopia
>>97250337>the primitive culture being colonized is white>the colonizers are “Not! Muslims”I stand corrected anon.
>>97196423>How do we fix Steampunk?Make it *vernian* rather than steampunk:>Focus is on exciting adventures around the world (and beyond)>Technology is dropped in a "monster of the week" fashion and mostly make sense, at least within the context of late 19th- early 20th century science
>>97258584Ask yourself this. Would God see (You) as a retard the same way we do? Someone who can shitpost casually isn’t really shitposting on their end. It’s just what they do.Don’t respond back to me.>>97258172Didn't know about this until I read you. I concur in that we live in the shittiest cyberpunk dystopia possible
>>97258738>Would God see (You) as a retard the same way we do? Is an ant a retard?
>>97257225NAYRT but Anon, the joke is that Shadowrun is set in Seattle/Washington State by default.
>>97259948>states are giant, monocultured monocities with exact equal distribution of wealth and crime
>>97253579>>97253623>magic is just exotic technology>everything magic does can be described by in-universe sciencefantasy settings that take this approach are universally shiteven if it makes logical sense, I reject it on this basis alone
>>97262926It only makes logical sense according to our own world.Anons like the one you responded to fail to understand that a fantasy world can have aspects that are beyond its own natural aspects, because they will always apply real world logic, even to something that can have impossibilities occur such as fantasy.It's a waste of time trying to talk to them about fantasy.
>>97264908It wouldn't necessarily have to have the logic OF OUR WORLD.Because fantasy is the faculty or activity of imagining things, especially things that are impossible or improbable.It can have things that are:>natural to it and natural to us>unnatural to it and natural to us>natural to it and unnatural to us>unnatural to it and unnatural to usI'm not going to waste my time explaining it yet again.
>>97266432>It wouldn't necessarily have to have the logic OF OUR WORLD.Irrelevant. Logic is logic. I don’t care how alien it is. The beauty of magic and the supernatural is that it’s relative, not literal. How else do you think fiction works? One fiction’s concepts/contents are not going to be another fiction’s concepts/contents. What is magic in one setting is not going to be magic in another. Even the ability to manipulate the four classical elements is not necessarily going to be regarded as magical. It might be TOO natural. Far too casual. It’s just something people do. Magic, like power, is relative. This is why there’s such an overlap with superpowers and concepts of “knowledge is power”. If everyone is super, no one is super, and it is the same with magic—unless society is continuing to use the word as a reference point for wonder and wisdom, or mystery and mastery, etc. Because even in a true Atlantean-esque era like our own, people aren’t going to be convinced of the sheer wonder and amazement they were born to. They’re too used to it. They’re far too exposed. It’s far too natural, casual. But even magic in the past was seen as this natural field. It’s ironic.
>>97266602>Magic, like power, is relative. This is why there’s such an overlap with superpowers and concepts of “knowledge is power”. If everyone is super, no one is super, and it is the same with magicI wish people would understand just how magical (and accursed) the internet is
>>97266677Nothing in our world can BE magical, because everything in our world IS natural or a product of nature.Magic's state of being in a world must be beyond or removed from its nature, in order for it to BE magic.State of being isn't about whether or not little Timmy thinks red doesn't exist just because he's color blind, or that we call it red because that's what we see, it's about the energy itself being radiated that registers as red to those who aren't handicapped. Regardless of whether or not you can see it, the energy is still there.
>>97266602>Because even in a true Atlantean-esque era like our ownniggga wtf
>>97271258Didn't you JUST point out that>even in a true Atlantean-esque era like our own, people aren’t going to be convinced of the sheer wonder and amazement they were born to? How are you getting mad that Anon isn't convinced of it?
>>97271250And within a fantastical reality, it can have things that are natural to itself and unnatural to itself, because fantasy is the faculty or activity of imagining things, especially things that are impossible or improbable.It isn't possible for things to be unnatural or supernatural IN OUR WORLD, but in A FANTASY WORLD, where there CAN BE IMPOSSIBLE THINGS, it is possible for things to be unnatural or supernatural.It doesn't matter what the history of our world says.It doesn't matter what religion of our world says.It's fucking fantasy. You don't need to apply real world logic to it.
>>97271258>>97271900>Because even in a true Atlantean-esque era like our ownpulling made up terms out of your ass is not an argument, anon> You drop a shiny and chrome enough candy bar wrapper into the past and suddenly it’s a sacred objectlol, if you say so. Whatever bloats your goats>>97271801>It's fucking fantasy. You don't need to apply real world logic to it.your """arguments""" are self-defeating, anon
>>97274222Do you REALLY think modern science and all of its mathematical diagrams and symbols and other infrastructural configurations *wouldn’t* look more radically esoteric or alien or “magical” to persons in antiquity, compared to anything else they could have artistically or imaginatively cooked up themselves? Lol. A cellphone would be more arcane than anything else around to them.
>>97274288stay on topic, pleasefirst, define Atlantean>>97274288>Do you REALLY think modern science and all of its mathematical diagrams and symbols and other infrastructural configurations *wouldn’t* look more radically esoteric or alien or “magical” to persons in antiquityprobably? But that's only due to lack of knowledge, not because science is in itself "magical". Technology works because there's a logic to it, as in procedures reliant on subjacent physical laws interacting through material means, discovered and develop through theorisation, experimentation and confirmation of any discovery by repeated experiments in controlled environments. The ancients had that too, but not as much accumulated scientific knowledge as our modern civilizationIn the end it doesn't matter if it *looks* more or less magical or whatever. A fantasy setting needs an internal logic as to why magic works or doesn't work, otherwise it's just pointless, bad storytelling or plain, boring shit
>>97274435STOP BUMPING THESE SLOP THREADS. You know what goes in all fields.
>>97196434Notice how OP didn't respond to this question. This thread is just pointless slop by the jannie to keep this board shitty. https://crestresearch.ac.uk/resources/mining-the-chans/"One way to achieve this would be to regularly post content that looks genuine (using the right language, imagery, etc.) yet is meaningless – this would dilute the message of these boards and make their threads uninteresting, thereby reducing their attractiveness and sense of community."That is what is being done here.
>>97197759The Industrial Era aesthetics with trains is shit. The only good aesthetics from the 19th century was in The Order 1886 game.
>>97274700And? Fuck academia and fuck the rich.
>>97239580No, you cretin, I don't hate it.I simply noticed that every post on /tg/ with that image attached is worthless trash, just like (you) are.
>>97274598read my post again. Slowly. Especially the last bit.>>97274615I appreciate the value of science and nature precisely because it isn't magic. Magic irl is shit like horoscopes, the power of crystals, faith healing and The Secret; magic in fantasy is fun stuff that reminds me off LotR, Arthurian legend and mythology in general and allows nerds like us to play pretend in a meaningful way.>nature or science to be a magical field (like the ancients did) then you don’t exactly love or appreciate nature or science, do you? Just saying.bullshit argument. go build your strawmen on somebody else's posts
>>97196423You dont, i unironically hate steampunk. I utterly despise it, any redeeming qualities about it have been buried by redditors in tophats that unironically listen to electro swing.
>>97275504Fuck you too bootlicker.
>>97276576>science can only be appreciated if it's as unexplainable and opaque, and therefore amazing, as the natural world was through the lense of ancient cultures without the same amount of actual scientific knowledgekek. If you say so, anon>>97276591>The idea that magic is le unnaturalit IS unnatural. If you really can't distinguish magic from actual science then, I'm sorry to say mate, the retard here is you.> It’s a way of being unsatisfied with present naturehow so?>“I don’t like it, it scares me and goes against what I believe in, therefore unnatural, therefore witchcraft”. Or, it is just another way of a saying “no it’s better!” while coming across as a pretentious ass, a la “no it’s a miracle!”, as though the word for miracle didn’t come from Latin’s word for wonder, as though magic hasn’t been associated with mystery since forever, even before Latinmeds, now>>97276591>The knowledge of nature offered by the wizards is seen as incredibly esoteric, magical, like the black powder employed by Gandalf for fireworks, or Saruman for explosive weapons of war. Tolkien absolutely saw machinery and warfare as wicked and indistinguishable from sorcery.Yes. But that is called "metaphor", not "science as actual magic".Tolkien also absolutely saw the distinction between magic and actual science. The machines and industry of Saruman and Mordor are based off the industrial development he saw in England itself and how destructive it was towards the natural word, all in the name of greed and powermongering
>>97197860>Start by clearly stating what "steampunk" isIt's just a world where the main form of energy is steam power, and you add in fantastical tech to go with it. Who is arguing that?
>>97196423Opus Anima is by far the best and most original Steampunk game, I've come across.But you can't play it since it's dead, out of print and in german.I like Dark Earth as well.But you can't play it since it's dead, out of print and in french.
>>97249590Egypt counts man. Ethiopia also had some shit before they got kicked in the dick by their neighbours and never recovered properly. Now a lot of other Africans don't like them exactly because of their history, but that is besides the point.
>>97277048Egypt is a North African civilization and have more in common with Levantines and Berbers than with blacks.Ethiopia is a good point though.
>>97250167Dirt main roads that stink of horse shit and people throwing their shit out in the streets out their windows?
>>97208930>>97208930>I just cannot play it.Anon, be careful to avoid voicing an opinion so loudly on a game you've never played. Had you played it you'd have reached Tulla which has some of the vibes you're describing. Otherwise it represents thinking around the industrial age, not the medieval age.
>>97239397Yeah, no one wears stuff like that in Arcaum
>>97274435>define Atlanteannta, but plato described it as being advanced naval power compared to his ancient greek world. I don't think he expected it to be more advanced than aircraft carriers and submarines.
I’ve always said: “Atlantis wasn’t then, it’s now.”
>>97279516>Their "magic" is Art, delivered from MANY OF ITS HUMAN LIMITATIONS>And its object is Art not Power, sub-creation not domination and tyrannous re-forming of creationWhich are traits shown in the technological machinery used by Saruman and Sauron, though I guess in the end their stuff does have a mystical basis since they're basically angels with an intimate knowledge of the inner workings of the universe, like the Watchers from the book of Enoch and such>>97277637>No. He has said machinery is kin to magic.Only in its results, not in its means.I can agree that the results magic provide can be seen as just science with way less steps and effort, but thinking that science and magic are the same as in >>97274288 is just an idiotic and way too simplistic way to look at the matteraaaand that's it for me, this thread was derailed way too long ago and the OPs topic was resolved like 100 posts ago. New year resolutions and that stuff>>97280281>’ve always said: “Atlantis wasn’t then, it’s now.”ok
>>97280508>though I guess in the end their stuff does have a mystical basisThey don’t. They’re just machines.
>>97280508>>97280508I think the point is that the elves are magical the same way the 21st century is magical.
>>97280508>but thinking that science and magic are the same as in is just an idiotic and way too simplistic way to look at the matterAre you saying Tolkien is an idiot? Listen, this isn’t an oversimplification, it’s you making it more complicated than necessary. Nature is nature is nature. What’s not to fucking understand?
Seems like half the thread got nuked
>>97196423There is nothing to fix. But every player and game master must know the setting.
>>97196423>How do we fix Steampunk?Doesn't seem like there is anything to be fixed besides creating good fantasy media where steampunk aesthetics exist in said media.I wish I knew how to properly be the change to give steampunk a better recognition from the public.
>>97294475Just run games in a steampunk setting of your choice/design.
>>97196423Step one: make cyberpunk settingStep 2: replace electricity with steam enginesStep 2.5 (optional): Replace computers and hacking with the occult and magic/weird scienceStep 3: profit
>>97286661A certain poster here is too logical and rational for some to handle, and so they prayed to janny, who prayed to modsy.
>>97299338>they prayed to janny, who prayed to modsyCan this skill be learned?
>>97250167Homeless child soldier veterans being runover by the carriages of the uncaring idle wealthy?>The Jews took this from you!Good.
>>97198341Arcanum, thief, abney park and Katos tits.
>>97206709Man you are one dumb illiterate fuck. Stop polluting the thread
How does /tg/ feel about non-Victorian Steampunk? My first experience to the genre was an old videogame that was in a more Dune-adjacent setting.
>>97198341Princess Principal
>>97222026The Difference Engine is the only example you "but steampunk is about social commentary maaaan" guys can point to. While a good book, it certainly wasn't influential within its alleged genre.
>>97196423>people generally like when fantasy settings are more mysterious and generally unexplained.What is the steampunk equivalent of using that much restraint?
>>97303403That's a boy on an errand, you myopic ambulance-chasing kike.He's got a fresh crew cut and a clean uniform.>Carrying a package wrapped in a cloth makes you homelessNGMI
>>97303353Not from a Jedi...
