I will never truly understand Tau Hate.Sure there are some leftover feelings over their balance and old lore, but modern day Tau hate is so stupid to me.>But theyre le Good Guys! Hows that GrimdarkBecause its interesting and fun to see a Star Trek Federation type force be in 40k, Have all the Ideals youd expect from typical Sci Fi, and have them twisted to be somewhat dark. Not only is the Federation sorta Twisted, but their ideals get Backbroken by this Grimdark World. its seeing a force try and be good, and failing, and also be torn apart in the universe where no good deed goes unpunished. All other empires had their golden era at some point but Tau will never have the pleasure of getting that far.
It’s because theyre indian.
>>97732046They are incredibly lame and any problems they'd in universe get handwaved. They aren't good guys, they are either idealistic retards or poorly written expansionists who GW has to retcon when fans get pissed at them ignoring the setting. I wouldn't hate them as much if they weren't just bad mechs (Space Marines are effectively a Zaku II). I'd enjoy it more if you actually had a mishmash of xenos drugged up by the Tau to comply with the farting space jeets that lead them.
>>97732046They're not the Star Trek Federation, that's the thing. They were originally played up as the dark version of the Federation, but all of their "group of many races working together" elements were squeezed out in favor of more Gundam mech suits. Now all they have is one unit of Kroot that no one uses.
I don't like the Tau. When they're all roboted up, they highlight how bad GW is at mechanical design.Without helmets, they look like bargain-bin Oddworld designs.That's right. I said it.Abe-ass looking motherfuckers.
>>97732046They're a fascist faction that's constantly portrayed as the good guys.
>>97732046every time someone bitches about tau i just add another railgun to my army list
>>97732046>But theyre le Good Guys!
>>97732046It's because they're fascists and most people tend to frown upon fascism.
>>97732387I feel like the issue is that Tau fags unironically want them to be that. The issue they ignore it's a science fantasy setting and the Imperium has good reasons for the cruelty beyond it being cool as fuck. The Tau never really have to struggle with shit because they soley exist to be a foil to the Imperium in like one way.
>>97732436As a Tau fan myself I like the Tau because they're a bunch of fascist despots that fulfill that itch for an authoritarian but elite force. Compare that to say, the Imperium, who are also authoritarian, but have a much more communist flavor to their authoritarianism, going for quantity over quality and generally relying on human waves rather than the tight, well-coordinated strike forces of a Tau Cadre.
>>97732264That's every faction.
>>97732046>Because its interesting and fun to see a Star Trek Federation type force be in 40kno it isnt
>>97732447Genuine retard
>>97732523>t. no actual counterpoint
>>97732436Similar to the other guy, I like Tau, but it's got nothing to do with the idea that they're good guys. I like them because I like how they contrast with and act as a foil to the Imperium. Tau occupy the space in the setting that's typically reserved for humans: young, newly-spacefaring, secular, logical, lucky, and naive when it comes to galactic politics (or, in the case of 40k, the utter lack thereof). Humans by contrast are ancient, superstitious, psi-sensitive techno-barbarians who conquered the galaxy while the Tau were in the Stone Age (literally), and who sail through space waging their permanent wars with technology from their (multiple) dark ages that they don't understand and can barely maintain.The twist, as the other Anon alluded to, is that Tau's logical, scientific approach to the galaxy is utterly unsuited to the actual setting of 40k, which--as it turns out--is actually is batshit insane. Humanity's religious maximalism isn't ignorant; it's a survival mechanism, and an effective one, used to protect against a foe that the Tau utterly misunderstand. Seeing Tau and humanity interact--especially when that intersects with Chaos--is a lot of fun, and I think it adds a lot to the setting.Anyway, to return to my point, no part of their appeal has anything to do with being good guys, which they absolutely are not. Maybe "nice guys" would be a better description, but ultimately the Tau are still a brutal military dictatorship bent on galactic conquest, even if their conquest involves turning the other sentient races of the galaxy into vassal species rather than just straight-up genociding them like the Imperium would. I guess you could call that comparatively good? In any case, it's not what's appealing about them.
I love them because they are a scifi parody of the Bush era NATO (stated by the writers) go read the taros IA book.
>>97732635You've piqued my interest but where do I get this? I'd buy a digital edition if I could find one, although I'm not against pirating.
>>97732480I don't mean authoritarian, I mean actually fascist. They have a caste system and their government is guided by fasces.
are we allowed to be honest here?It's because the Tau are Communists. Any one that argues otherwise is probably a communist.Thats the issue, it attracts lots of communist fans to 40k. They can't differentiate fantasy from reality and gunk up the 40k fandom with poltard shit and have successfully taken over most of the discussion because of reddit reframing the entire setting as pro-tau and anti-imperium.Just obnoxiously stupid people.Tau on their own as presented in the fluff are cool and a little bit interesting as a North Korea/Chinese style communist regime with 1984 parallels.
>>97732046if your interpretation of the tau is>they are the good guysyou may be retarded
>>97732447>decentralized feudal mess>authoritarianThreat of violence, religion, and a multitude of archaic and ancient treaties are all that keeps the Imperium (barely) together. They don’t even have a monopoly on violence, just the biggest stick. They’re the Holy Roman Empire.
>>97732622the Tau aren't nice guys or good. They are objectively the most authoritarian, totalitarian regime in the galaxy.They give other species no choice but to join them. They also have plenty of evidence they are extremely xenophobic "racist" towards other species. To actually make their ideology work they have to resort to several forms of mind control to force it to work.
>>97732682Fascists don't have caste systems.
>>97732682Tau's caste system is based on Taoism (get it Tauism) and its actually a classless system because a caste is not a class
>>97732675Super easy to pirate just look for it on google. Imperial armour 3 first edition the taros war. Literally the 40k war on iraq.
>>97732046The Tau aren't even really a Star Trek Federation type force. They're still an aggressively expansionist imperialist state (there's a reason why they're called the Tau Empire and not the Tau Republic or Confederation) that is only "nice" in comparison to other 40k factions because they first send diplomats to ask you nicely to join them and only conquer your planet with military force if you refuse. In Star Trek and most other settings they'd be the bad guys. But this is 40k so not being genocidal makes them seem "too nice" by comparison to everyone else.
>>97732987you are almost correct, except the part about genocidal.Tau are 100% genocidal, it used to b explicitly mentioned in their codexes but suspiciously was dropped to an implicit mention.They have also been shown to have genocidal tendencies in the books.Basically the thing is about the "join or die" philosophy of theirs is they really mean it. If you do not join them they will genocide you. Ironically the way the Tau treat other species can be interpreted as a form of mass slavery. They force species to join them and then put them to work.
>>97732046The problem came from three things.Tau fans pushing they were the "Good guys" of the setting and basically missing the point that they're just a different brand of "evil" like everyone else.They became the Marxist group, and the woke commie fags wouldn't shut up about them.They also made somewhat a faction for the weebs as many of their armor and mechs are mecha/gundam inspired. (Especially the group that broke off from the Empire.)
>>97732046Because it offends people who treat the Imperium as the good guys when the Imperium is designed to be a monstrous machine, keep together through barbarity, cruelty, and superstition to keep working a machinery working they don't understand. The Tau are an efficient. If the Tau are the good guys, then all that cruelty, all that barbarity, was never necessary in the first place.
>>97733184found the tautist pinko
>>97732965Yeah I actually did find it between those replies, sorry for jumping the gun there.
The Imperium is a medieval, backwards and declining kingdom: a Holy Roman Empire that it is neither holy nor Roman, desperately clutching to lost glory, built over the corpse of a civilization they will never match. The Tau represent modernity: They incorporate elements from NATO to the Warsaw Pact, China, and India. They are an ascending empire that represents the glory and horror of the modern world.
>>97732046The T'au are terrifying to the Imperium not because they are "stronger," but because they prove that logic, science, and diplomacy still work in a universe the Imperium insists can only be survived through fanatical hatred.
>>97733208this post misses the point>>97733205same faghello plebbit
One thing I think it is a bit unexplored is how large the Tau Empire really is. While the T’au Empire is often described as a "tiny" fish in a pond full of sharks (the Imperium), "tiny" in galactic terms still means hundreds of star systems and trillions of citizens. While we often hear about the septs, the empire is actually made of hundreds of worlds. Their civilization is one that dwarfs our own. Their society would be more complex than ours.You should be able to find everything from capitalist, to technocratic, communists, to fascists worlds.
>>97733251While all follow the Greater Good, you could have stuff like this world is more Water-caste minded. This world is dominated by merchants. This world is more Earth-minded. This world is more militaristic. This world is more authoritarian. This one is more loose. This world is more xenophobic. This world is more open.All follow the Greater Good.This is already a thing in the lore. But it is rarely, if ever explored.
>>97733251not really its uniform because the Ethereals enforce the Tau'va. Only breal away Tau societies are the Far sight Enclaves. Also for a while the 4th sphere expedition radically diverged from the Tau'va but was put back into line when they reconnected with the Tau Empire (quietly put in body bags)Tau really do not like difference in ideology.
>>97733263The Imperium doesn't tolerate diversity either. If you don't worship BIG E, you get exterminated.
>>97733268that is false. The Imperium is very diverse and doesn't care about a worlds culture or religion just as long as they swear fealty to the Emperor provide tribute and don't place their gods above the Emperor. Preferably worship their God as an aspect of the Emperor.Otherwise you are completely free. They don't care.The Ethereals HAVE to maintain a unified system or their empire will collapse
Usually, 40k writers use the T’au as a foil to the Imperium’s darkness. Making the T’au too complex or morally gray (in a human way) sometimes risks making them feel "too much like us," which takes away from their "alien" optimistic tragedy.
>>97733275The Imperium has to maintain worship in BIG E or the Imperium collapses. Without BIG E, and the hundreds of thousands of psykers scarified each years to keep the Astronomicon running, there's no Imperium.
>>97733268The Imperium does not give a flying shit what you do so long as you praise the big E, pay your taxes, and don't fuck around with proscribed shit (psykers, advanced tech, xenos, chaos etc). The only thought that the Imperium would have upon seeing a gay communist utopia that follows those three commandments would be "hmm, I bet that we can tax them more".
>>97733292>Imperium upon seeing a communist world>meh>Imperium upon seeing a communist world with a traitor Governor declaring its independence from the Imperium. >++++EXTERMINATUS++++
>>97732046because of reddit communists
>>97732716The Tau are fascist, not communist, it’s the Imperium that’s communist.
>>97733366no. Back to plebbit
>>97733369Nope, the only people who can’t tell the difference are retards who think communism and fascism are the same thing.
>>97733380Only retards from r/40klore deny the space communists are space communists
>>97733366Neither fall under fascism or communist under the strict definition. Where's the worker's movement? Where's the appeal to a frustrated middle class? Where is the The cult of action for action's sake? Where is contempt for the weak? Where is eat the rich? Neither fall under either ideology under strict definition.
>>97733385Oh, I’m not denying that the Imperium are commies, far from it.
In reality, the Imperium is a Theocratic Feudal Hegemony, and the T’au are a Technocratic Caste-based Oligarchy.
>>97732046
>>97733380They are, in actual practice. Just propped up with different euphemisms, excuses, and lies.
>>97733390That anon is dumb.>>97733405This.
Dark Eldar are the True Fascists of the setting. While most people look at the Imperium for the "aesthetic" of fascism, or the Tau technocracy, neither of them is truly fascist. The Dark Eldar actually embody the visceral philosophy of fascism in a way almost no other faction does.Fascism, at its core, rejects rationalism in favor of "vitalism": the idea that life is defined by struggle, energy, and action.They don't just use violence for territory; they use it for spiritual rejuvenation. Without the "action" of the raid and the "vitality" stolen from others, they literally wither away. Their entire culture is built on the thrill of the hunt. They aren't trying to build a stable utopia; they are keeping a dying spark alive through constant, aggressive movement.While the Imperium hates the "unfit" for religious reasons, the Drukhari hate the weak because they view them as FUEL. In Drukhari society, if you are captured or enslaved, it is proof of your inherent inferiority.Commorragh is the ultimate "survival of the fittest" arena. There is no social safety net, no "Greater Good," and no mercy. If you cannot defend your position, you deserve to be a laboratory specimen for a Haemonculus.The Dark Eldar don't just think they are better than humans (mon-keigh); they think they are the only "real" people in the galaxy. Vect’s rule isn't based on a constitution; it’s based on the total suppression of any competing power through fear, surveillance, and overwhelming force.Fascism sought to create a "New Man": physically perfect, hardened, and devoid of "decadent" liberal empathy. The Dark Eldar have mastered flesh-crafting. They are the pinnacle of physical grace and speed, having purged the "weakness" of psychic potential (which they view as a liability) in favor of pure, honed physical lethality.
>>97733390Contempt for the weak isn’t a fascist doctrine. There’s literally a short little book called the Doctrine of Fascism that you can read that tells you all about it. It’s not about what lefties on reddit think it’s about.
I don't hate them. It's just that they don't really belong and most stuff around them is boring compared to literally every other faction. They are just lame and if they went away I probably wouldn't even notice.
>>97732046All 40k factions are meant to appeal to a certain mindset, aesthetic taste, etc. Tau are the 40k faction for people who don't like the 40k setting.
>>97733409The main difference is that fascism doesn’t prescribe an end utopia but instead sees the methods themselves as the end, while communism basically promises heaven on earth that never actually comes but which justifies all of their atrocities. You can see this in action between the Tau and Imperium as well. The Greater Good ideology is not an end-goal, it describes the method by which Tau society operates, it is not an end-utopia but rather the daily system that guides Tau living.The Imperium by contrast was all about that Utopianism. The Emperor promised a world of bliss and peace with no Chaos and no war, and of course failed to deliver while doing all kinds of authoritarian atrocities in service of his goals. And then much like other commie dictators when he died they deified him and created a cult of personality around him.
>>97733549This is true for all political systems. Even fascism is about the creation of the "New Man", embrace of futurism and progress in its own way. And call backs of the past and seeing modernity as a corruption? Common as dirt. People have always used the past to build legitimacy and have labelled their own predecessors as the worst thing imaginable. They didn't just want to go back to the woods; they wanted to go back to the woods in a high-speed jet. Just see how every ideology ever promises "The end of history". Humans are wired for teleology: the belief that history is heading somewhere specific. If a politician tells you, "Things are okay, and we'll make a 4% incremental improvement," they might be right, but they won't start a movement. If they tell you, "We are the chosen generation meant to reclaim our lost glory and build a paradise," they tap into a near-religious fervor.We traded "The Kingdom of God" for "The Workers' Paradise," "The Great Society," or "The New Frontier." We will keep doing this up to our extinction.
>>97732223>>97732235I think two things sadly killed off the auxiliaries. Don't know if anything has ever been publicly said but they clearly didn't sell well, or at least nowhere near as much as the battlesuits. Logically, perhaps ('auxiliary'; the clue is in the name), but spreadsheet is spreadsheet.And secondly, the move to plastics. The old saw was that metals were cheap moulds but expensive material (so better for low quantity items you could dripfeed from as and when) whereas plastics were the opposite. Much like how we lost the variant Guard regiments. Couple that with the contemporary emphasis for visual faction identity (suits look like the rest of the range. Kroot and Vespid don't) and here we are.
>>97732046S10 AP1 from multiple sources in the same faction.
>>97732046Warhammer 40k is written with a fairly left-wing audience in mind and the Tau come across as too fascistic and reactionary
>>97732046>I will never truly understand Tau Hate.I don't understand Tau hate in 2026. At this point they've been in the game longer than some players have been alive, they have never known the game without them. I could understand it coming from veterans who actually had to deal with Fish of Fury and Triptide and Taudar and Savior Protocols (awful, clunky, faction warping rule), but it typically doesn't. There are people who hate Tau and have never seen them on the table.>>97732235>group of many races working togetherThe thing that sticks in my craw about auxillary units is how underutilized they are. They allow Tau to "cheat" at faction identity, but this is never used effectively. We have fragile scout skirmishers (used to have infiltrate, and another attack, and +1 cover save) and a deep strike unit that shoots (something we already have) and that's the extent of the grand alliance. Tau could have any number of units for all kinds of non-shooting roles covered by auxiliaries, and they could be anything, and they simply don't. They don't even have units of drones anymore, another missed opportunity. You'd think that sort of thing would be useful with the Death Guard at your doorstep.
>>97732046Same reason people hate the Helghast, they’re evil but they get a lot of simps anyways
>>97732235>Now all they have is one unit of Kroot that no one uses.Are you people living under a fucking rock
I hate the Tau because they don't interact with every phase of the game. Pick up a fucking sword you cowards
>>97732811>society is stratified by occupation >society is divided up into guilds>have literal philosopher kingsCome off it.
>>97732046Basically this >>97732235Instead of being a union of all sorts of different aliens, they get relegated to auxiliaries and even then there's really only two anyone talks about, and another that got retconned into being votan.I never had much issue with them on the moral side. Mostly because I just wasn't interested in the tau but an evil/insidious UFP isn't difficult to pull off. There's the classic root beer conversation or the Terran Empire if you want to be more overt. Even their warp god T'au'va is supposed to be a tau with a bunch of alien arms, but they never lean into it. There's room for mechs AND aliens in the tau
>>97733261>But it is rarely, if ever explored.A story concept I thought would be a amusing gimmick is a romance story that reveals at the end it is actually set in the 40k universe just for a different view of the universe. It's never going to happen though since >cruelest and most bloody regime imaginable and >there is only war. It's a franchise about space wars and that's fine.
The basic idea is fine because people with actual worldviews fighting each other is more interesting than 900 flavors of basically indistinguishable wacky space bullshit, but they kind of flounder on the follow-through. Plus their visual language is insufficiently old-timey (part of the appeal of 40k for me personally is the mix of sci fi and pseudohistorical elements) and a little boring, though xenos factions seem to struggle with that across the board.>>97733426Solid argument
>>97732235Not at all you fucking secondary. Non-Tau were always called "Auxillaries". Do you know what that word even means?
>>97733251This also fits in with the fascist mindset the Tau have compared to the communist mindset the Imperium has.In the Imperium’s eyes, they outnumber their enemies, and all they have to do is leverage their numbers and their enemy is doomed. It doesn’t matter if you gun down 100 of them, 1,000 more will be behind them. This both matches the communist mindset of the human wave attacks they are fond of, and also their idea of a “worker’s revolution” where they overthrow the capitalists even if they have to jam the guns with their bodies. By contrast, the Tau have much more of a fascist siege mentality. They are surrounded on all sides by enemies, so they need to make sure their soldiers are the highest quality they can, they need to strike while the match is hot and while their enemies are at their weakest, and they need to recruit auxiliaries to help in their struggle. For the Tau, their Greater Good is an eternal struggle against the commie hoards in which they can never falter for even a moment
It's because they sit on the deployment line and shoot you until the game is over.An incredibly boring match up.
>>97732046I don't really understand hating any faction like that. The point is that they're all different.
>>97732422>>97732716>>97733426Maybe the real fascists were the friends we made along the way
>>97732046tau fans are everything they accuse marinefags of being but theyre right so i hate the army
>>97732046I like the Tau for two reasons, one playing as a alien faction is nice and two, they got mechs, carrying big guns killing monsters Don't care them being commies, or 'le good guys' or fucking waifus that dweebs and creeps draw them having anime style haircuts and big boobs, I LIKE BIG GUNS AND KILLING SHIT WITH BIG GUNS!
>>97732046Look nobody makes threads like these about Tau without being hideously misinformed, so I'm going to try not just vomiting all over you.The Tau are not a misunderstood utopian federation beset on all sides by an uncaring and belligerent universe. That is literally the propaganda that is a central part of what's awful about them; they are a naive alien coalition establishing a collectivist police state ironically identical but opposed to the Imperium. Their 'good intention' are roughly equivalent to the Imperium's.I say this as a person who plays Tau and likes Tau. People keep talking shit over it but there are no 'good guy' factions in 40k; there's legitimate grievance and bloody history among all the factions, even the relatively new Votaan (though people can probably be forgiven for not knowing anything about it because Votaan are practically fucking invisible in the lore at large "oh they had bolt weapons and the tau learned ion weapons from them and their machine gods want them to eat planets" yeah what the fuck ever dude I have no idea how that's supposed to fit into a larger galaxy and unlike OG Necrons they can't be literally popping out of the ground to show up to the function).So hop in your battlesuit, send several dozen cannibal bird people to kill and eat the first wave of rag-tag defenders and then blast the remaining troops with a million rounds a minute gattling gun or four; this backwater needs pacified for the greater good, which in this case, is staging troops for the invasion of three other wartorn hellholes before any credible defense can arrive. You can also do us a favor and smash that orphanage so we can get the Earth caste on with building a command bunker.
>>97735323Tau only play like that on the bad 40k editions. (So most of them) Originally all tau guns were weaker short range versions of imperial weapons except for the pulse rifle and the rail gun. The point of the army is combined arms, fire and maneuver with sort range guns and some ocasional long range support. Even the lore states, tau do not hold ground.
I like their battlesuits, but that's it. Might at some point make a Farsight Cadre army of just battlesuits and /mydudes/them as a group of imperials that got tired of not getting what they think they deserve, but also not stupid enough to join up with literal soul eating monsters.
>>97732046To understand it you had to be around before Tau were introduced. 40k pre-Tau had a completely different vibe to it.It was like a heavy metal album cover. Gothic space knights blasting space orks and space elves and some cosmic horror like Tyranids and Chaos.Tau were introduced in a kinda cynical move to make a faction that wasn't 40k but more like star wars. To appeal to people that didn't like 40k, thats exactly who they attracted people that hate 40k. Visually Tau do not look like something from the setting. Every faction had skulls as a design motif (even the Eldar). Tau don't. they are flat, generic, and safe scifi.
>>97733848Fish of Fury was trash, I still play 4th edition, because honestly it's the only decent version of this game. Fish of fury does not shield your firewarriors against enemy fire, in fact they disembark in a blob ready to disintegrate as soon as a template falls on top of them. Also if you rotate the devilfish for maximum meme protection you expose the weaker side armour to enemy AT guns. Additionally firewarriors struggle to hit anything and perform like shit against MEQ.
>>97736490see for me i only like some of their battlesuits. Of i get a Tau force, im having few suits, only a commander and broadsides. The rest will be kroot because i imagine the Tau love cynically using them as canon fodder. Maybe a pathfinder team as spotters and because railgun infantry are cool. I want Tau on the board to be minimal because i imagine the Tau place a higher value on themselves than their auxiliaries
>>97736524In the lore suits are some sort of special support units. The base of the army is a USA at iraq mechanized platoon with devil fish and firewarriors instead of bradleys. High mobility, quality infantty, guided ammunitions, air support, very low casualties.
>>97736524Commander suit or Shadowsun with the O'Kais style head?
>>97736615i like the commander suit. i believe it's plastic nowadays
>>97736586But nu 40k no longer has history bufs behind it so everything has become a parody of a parody of a parody. Now tau make gunlines and can't melee (even if they were superior to guards in melee thanks to the 4+ armour save originally) we have characters with retarded names like El miyamoto or kabuto, giant robots instead of close air support etc it's the same for other factions like krigs wanting to die for meme reasons, or necrons with egipcian names and pokebolls. Current 40k is trash, and 90% of the players are unaware of it. Not even aware that literally the bast majority of games are just better.
>>97732530Even based on your fucking retarded premise. What are space marines dumbass?Since when are fascists known for being well trained? Literally the only example has been the nazis, every other fascist country ever has been a pack of incompetent retards.
>>97736586I'd like a variant closer to the BMP-3, personally. Maybe a plasma or ion gun would do the job.
>>97736586That's just modern warfare in a nutshell. If anything. They are closer to the Soviets where the whole squad fits their APC/IFV instead of being subdivided amongst multiple vehicles.
>>97736502Actually retarded troglodytes will look at the Gundam faction and think it is Star Wars
>>97736635>But nu 40k no longer has history bufsGood.
>>97736686Have you ever seen gundam? Tau don't look like that
>>97736855Tau don’t even have mechs, they have power suits. They’re more like iron men then they are on the mecha spectrum. The few big robots they have also require multiple hands to operate them, which isn’t very standard for mechs as well.
>>97736878NTA but what makes the comparison funny is that 40K has two gundam armies already. Their 'regular' units in the lore are a few feet shorter than mobile suits.
>>97732622>>97735237>>97735914Fascism does not have a clear definition and the "Gold Standard" was created by an annoying Italian who's definition is meaningless in how broad it is. Most people see militarism and say it's fascist. The Imperium is effectively a neo-feudal empire. The emperor is far away on the golden throne, so don't fuck up too much, pay your tithe, or we'll send someone to kill you.The Tau are poorly written, but basically operate as the Dutch East India Company. You do business with them or they get you by hook or crook. My issue with the Tau is that fundamentally they are the "If" faction. They've barely interacted with the setting the 20 years they've been present in it. They don't really interact with shit beyond to tease "OH! OH! They might get steam rolled by chaos!" Only for some Chaos Space Marines to fuck off because they saw an Ultramarines fart or something on a sensor. They never actually commit to them and basically go back and forth on them. Originally it literally was conditioning, pheramones, and social order that made Tau so bizarrely loyal. They the backtracked on that and then backtracked on the backtrack. You do get the Tau effectively killing parents and brainwashing kids of humans they capture being alluded too. They get random ass psychic auxillaries to do some brainwashing (despite having the polar bears, they invent new ones). The FTL shit was annoying with how they've retconned it and gave them a fucking perfect wormhole. My ultimate issues are that they never actually deal with shit. Like they never interact with the Eldar, Dark Eldar, or Chaos in a meaningful way. It's like flavor text or a paragraph in a short story. They don't actually deal with the consequences of existing in 40K. They somehow have billions of humans, but no psykers turning into a demon portal because.
>>97732046I hate the Tau because Taufags are almost as insufferable as Guardfags.
>>97737060>They somehow have billions of humans, but no psykers turning into a demon portal because.They do know how psykers work and have their own naturally psyker auxillary races (like the Nicassar) handle it. The big problem is that to know this you'd have to be super familiar with obscure Tau lore.
>>97737060>They somehow have billions of humans, but no psykers turning into a demon portal because.They actually do. But it's now causing this problem in which the humans are manifesting a miniature chaos entity modeled after the Greater Good.
>>97732046Players HATED jump shoot jump. Despite the tau being a "literally cannot win" tier codex for its first 3 editions people could not handle this new mechanic and hated it. They never got over this.
>>97737060>the "Gold Standard" was created by an annoying Italian who's definition is meaningless in how broad it is.Ur-Fascism? Yeah the takeaway from the article is the humanity is an inherently fascistic species if apparently having some the qualities described makes a particular society a fascist one.
>>97736906Are you talking about knights? Because IIRC they’re only half the size of a mobile suit. Your average mobile suit is a little taller than a Warhound Titan.
>>97737537>>97737547The issue is more than in universe human psykers are the favored choice of Chaos due to humans being that perfect mix of "shouldn't be psykers, yet" and psychically powerful enough to attract chaos. A single human fucking around can become a portal for demon invasion. The concept that the Tau somehow haven't had some worlds eaten by chaos because they did reddit atheism better than the Emperor is retarded. The concept of them having billions of humans, but none ever having a psychic awakening that goes wrong is just boring and "lucky".The entire thing with the Tau is either they are realy fucking proud and can't admit the 40K universe is irrational like the Emperor, they are some mystery box faction with the Etherals being genetically engineered, or they intentionally trained everyone wrong, as a joke. IIRC every psychic race they have as an auxillary is either ignorant of the dangers (Polar Bears and brain worms), have some idea but know that the Tau are dangerous retards (Kroot), or actually trained correctly by accident but are largely ignorant (humans). The Tau just suck because they really haven't been developed. They are a faction that basically has few interactions with any faction beyond the Imperium. It's a faction that really doesn't understand the setting and doesn't want to interact with it. It's the JJ Abrams Star Trek Federation with a whole bunch of mystery box bullshit.>>97737719It's vague and basically describes any hierarchical power structure. If you are an anarchist than yeah everything is a boogeyman, but it fails to describe anything.
>>97737577>(New mechanic) What a fucking no games retard. Eldars had it first.
>>97737719>the takeaway from the article is the humanity is an inherently fascistic speciesNo, retardThe point is that there isn't a unique boogieman called fascism. There's a variety of things used by fascists to get to power and are still being regularly exploited to some degree. Those things are the issue, not the made up super evil ideology that wasn't even fully shared between fascists. The point is that the label hides the direct issues, instead of adressing real thing people get bogged in terminology and definitions that weren't in consideration when some dudes slapped a name on things.
>>97737939>It's vague and basically describes any hierarchical power structure.That's a product of communists calling anything they don't like fascist throughout the 1900's. Not because it doesn't actually have a definition.A fascist regime is an authoritarian corporatist state. National and corporate power are fused together and the nation abandons class antagonism. Society is stratified into socialized trade unions, but every union works in service to the state, because the state and the people are considered one. GW allowing Tau to be written as fascist and players then confusing them as communist is divine comedy
>>97737773Gundams are 60ft~, big knights range between 40-60ft.
>>97732716The Tau are not communist! Who will destroy the Imperium?
Tau are Communists. Every citizen is provided for. There is no "poverty" or "homelessness", as the state ensures everyone has what they need to function. The individual is secondary to the needs of the species. The Ethereals aren't exactly "Lounge-Chair Dictators" sipping cocktails while everyone else does the work. They are often on the front lines, and their presence is what keeps the entire T'au war machine from collapsing into panic. Ethereals often live lives of discipline. Their "luxury" is more philosophical and spatial.
>>97732046The issue isn't Tau, it's Tau players
>>97736878>Signed, guy who doesn't know jack shit about mecha
>>97736503>Fish of fury does not shield your firewarriors against enemy fireCorrect, it shielded them from assaults. If they charged the fish they hit it on 6s because skimmers were silly good. Tau were allergic to sweeping advance (I2, like Orks) and hiding behind fish was a good way to prevent that. It was never supposed to protect you from enemy fire.>in fact they disembark in a blob ready to disintegrate as soon as a template falls on top of them. I did this with Whirlwinds and Submunition rounds all the time. 2s to kill no save. Deep strikers used to eat shit too when they had to be deployed base to base.>Also if you rotate the devilfish for maximum meme protection you expose the weaker side armour to enemy AT guns. AV12 v AV11 wasn't too crazy a difference, they're not chimmys. Glancing hits only if they moved because lol skimmers. It opened up getting glanced by heavy bolters (and you took D-pods and Decoy launchers for that nonsense, rip vehicle armouries), but heavy bolters were fire warrior killing machines and usually went directly into my infantry for three easy kills.You had to take the 'fish for Pathfinders anyway, the FW just had to load up turn 1. Great template target there too.Rhinos were way the fuck better at it, 35 point LOS blockers that stuck around as LOS blocking terrain when they died. People were down on them because rhino rush was kill, but they were great.>Additionally firewarriors struggle to hit anythingI'm not blowing two marker tokens to fix that either, they got the scraps. Markerlights were for guiding real guns.>perform like shit against MEQ.One time I dropped 48 pulse rifle shots into a 5 man tac squad and killed none of them. 3+ saves used to be really good before the new AP system, and Tau had neutron blasters for AP3 on a T4 5+ bolter bait squad. If you wanted to kill Marines you had to go plasma+fusion suits or start firing antitank at them, hoping they failed saves was a fool's errand.
>>97732046I've always liked the tau fire warriors, kroot, and battle suits. The paint schemes my bro made for some of his models were really cool, and the kroot especially nail that feral reptile look. My first minis, though I've never played them.>>97733620>>97733848This is a fair breakdown for the game/faction design failures, which are the essential failings for the Tau overall because that impacts the HOBBY, the whole activity. Literally, the "fluff" of the setting, its different narratives, alone, are the weakest and least interesting points to fixate on.What gets pushed hard with the "lore" or some kind of narrative that the Tau are supposed to be attached to and is expressed by their concept of the "Greater Good", and that this is what the faction or their place in the game is supposed to live or die on. But whether its the Tau or Imperium, the same problem emerges with tons of secondaries and faggots getting hung up on this or that component of ideology; some stunted analogue for their own beliefs which are with few exceptions not relevant to the hobby or the setting---because it deals with and draws on a very rich set of cultural/historical subjects.One exception would be chaos cults, because these represent all of the failings/sins brought on by faithlessness, pride, and habitual weakness, which are compounded by ignorance and malicious influence. There is less satire and more ironic tragedy; the inquisition has to root this out but serves an emperor in superposition, who rules over trillions that may have to be condemned by His servants not arbitrarily but for the simple necessity of mitigation and triage at a galactic scale. Lofty goals and comically bad outcomes. In this respect the Tau are kind of weak from what I remember. More focus on the impossible balancing act of a diverse coalition would be interesting and help the faction. When is the last time rogue Kroot devoured an entire Tau sept under chaos influence?
>>97739242And now that I think about it, if half or more of the tau empire fractured into a dozen or more farsight enclaves all selling their own greater good, that would be really cool. 100 competing chinese cantons and ethereal chaebols trying to brainwash, trade war, and use auxiliary race corporate military proxies to undermine each other. I'd would buy a Tau army but that could just as well be its own game since that's just a second imperium, notwithstanding a little difficulty that'll always be present in integrating chinese/indian caste and assimilationist dynamics into the setting.
>>97732223>I wouldn’t hate them as much if they were just deldar
I like mecha and clean sci fi aesthetics. I also enjoy the more modern mechanized infantry thing they kinda have going on.
>>97736647>What are space marines The equivalent of that one Soviet attempt to crossbreed gorillas and humans
>>97738680The Tau are fascists. Everything falls under the umbrella of the state, and is designed for the state’s be benefit. Their society is disciplined and militaristic, and actively imperialist and expansionist. They provide for their citizens only insofar as it makes them better workers and soldiers for the state. Their “Greater Good” is not a desired end-utopia like the Imperial Creed, but rather an active life philosophy of struggle.
>>97738186Yeh yeh a technicality, but no one seemed to notice because it was on shitty 12" range guardian jetbikes...Also the only thing people hate more than eldar is tau.
>>97738265The Knight Dominus is 12m tall. That puts it at just shy of 40ft and leaving it two meters shorter than the small mobile suits like F91.
>>97738929I would adore the tau if battlesuits were like ATs. Slap some anti-grav hover skates and a metric ton of explodium on them
>>97738929Do tau even carry weapons or are they all integrated into the power suits
>>97732235I enjoy this image
>>97736686>being an actual retarded troglodyte that doesn't understand Tau are the trade federation from Star Wars
>>97742307Integrated, but much more modular and streamlined than e.g. Battletech's. So for the smaller suits, exchanging a weapon can be done in a few minutes, provided the suit itself isn't too damaged.
They should grow some balls and actually go and make a Farsight's Republic. Still, I wonder if it would be possible to reintegrate Ethereals in some way.
>>97743990Famous Star Wars Mecha
their weeb shit robot suits and philosophy don't fit the settingsimple as
>>97746015>fascism doesn't fit the settingRetard
>>97736686True>>97736855Also true, Tau mechs look too cool to be gundams, which is why you'll see weebs complain about them sometimes
>>97746796>facism>it's actually dothead ching chong shit>>>>>>>>>>/r/sixmarxism
>>97746872>An imperialistic government where all aspects of life are within the state and for the state, the definition of fascism according to the Doctrine of Fascism>Not fascist
>>97746015Silence
>>97732046Tau-hate is pretty much entirely fueled by redditors who want to purge 40k of any fascist references
>>97732046If Tau were white humans you would not hear the end of how based they were. People without the capacity to have good taste get upset over nothing and make it everyone else's problem. You should know this having browsed 4chan for however long you've been here.
>>97736502>>Tau were introduced in a kinda cynical move to make a faction that wasn't 40k but more like star wars. To appeal to people that didn't like 40k, thats exactly who they attracted people that hate 40k.>>Visually Tau do not look like something from the setting. Every faction had skulls as a design motif (even the Eldar). Tau don't. they are flat, generic, and safe scifi./thread
>>97749202>>97736502They do have skulls. All skulls are concentrated on the Kroot.
>>97732046They positioned them as a group who have to win every lore encounter because they get squashed by the Imperium, so it seems like they have really strong plot armour.Their auxiliary system and more modern and unique for 40K tactics of vehicles and fire-teams were replaced with increasingly large mecha models. When the Tau were originally portrayed as not being over the top with giant baroque robots.
>>97750190The Tau actually lose more than the Imperium
>>97732046Neither Tau nor Eldar fit with 40k. They're too clean and 'good', and both exist in the narrative solely because of plot armor. They have nothing to actually offer 40k and are simply filler NPCs that should be excised.
>>97751746>Fascism>"Good"Weird self-report but okay
>>97751757Hence 'good' being highlighted. They're 'good' in the setting of 40k.
>>97751835They're objectively worse than Imperirum.
>>97751881That's wrong by nearly every source.
>>97751890The Imperium isn't nearly as totalitarian as the Tau are. The Imperium has freedom of religion so long as whatever religion you have loosely can be associated with the Emperor. The Imperium gives their planets the freedom to govern themselves so long as they pay their tithes. The Imperium has freedom of culture.The Tau have none of that. They enforce their culture and way of life on those they subjugate.
>>97751746>They're too clean and 'good'Anon, this is the poster boy of the franchise. He walks around in colorful, bright, shiny armor and yaps about "courage" and "honor". He is treated as the objectively morally good combatant in pretty much every engagement he's ever been in. Your setting is not grimdark, sorry.
>>97751911This is also wrong by nearly every source.
>>97752008Compare the Imperium military with the Tau military.The Imperium military has arab raiders, guys that look like they're from Starship Troopers, WW1 trench troopers, WW2 troopers, Conan-esque barbarians, drug-gangs, Scottish guerillas, etc.The Tau has slightly different color variations of fire warriors. Even humans are put in fire warrior armor.The Imperium is far, FAR more tolerant of cultural differences.
>>97732046Tau are the 40k product for the customers who don't like 40k.
>>97752068Nah, Tau-hate is the product of redditors who want to purge 40k of all the 'problematic' elements
>>97751746Neither the Eldar nor the Tau are meant to be "clean" or "good."The Eldar (Craftworld and Exodite) were meant to be the survivors of the previous "utopian" galactic empire that collapsed in an apocalyptic disaster of their own making. Craftworld were the cultural elite refuges (turned hard "better than you" moralists) still fleeing from the disaster. Exodites were the rural hicks distant enough from the disaster that they were pretty much unaffected.The Tau were meant to be the naive up-and-coming progressive Empire who believed they were to unify the galaxy with a Utopian ideal and moral methods, but the shadowy truth was far worse to the point that a splinter faction had already broken off due to difference in opinion.>>97752035Not really tolerant, the Imperium is more decayed to the point that, rather than having a unified galactic military, it has a bunch of different planetary armies "donated" too them and is trying to use them as a coalition force. It even has a specialized group of officers outside the chain of command meant to maintain coalition unity under threat of execution.
>>97752035Anon, the Tau has literally aliens cannibal .
>>97752221The Imperium also has cannibals, that's nothing special.
>>97751956Young mind poisoned by nuLore. Sad!
>>97752699It's not nu-lore, anon. Dark Imperium came out a fucking decade ago. What I described is just the setting of 40k now. It's not grimdark and hasn't been for years.
>>97732816>tauismBRAVO KOJIMA
>>97751956Yes, but they're also Human. They're supposed to be the good. Eldar and Tau are not human, ergo they're not good.
>>97753561That's the point. The Tau are aliens with human culture, government, and tactics. And yet they feel more 'hostile' than a human civilization with alien government, culture, and tactics.
>>97753561>Space Marines>HumanThey're mutant aberrations and they'll be purged the day they stop being useful.
>>97732046The Tau are lame because they're a woke cope.Warhammer 40K has always been "everyone is evil and everything sucks, but your loyalty is still to humanity because YOU ARE HUMAN."Then they tried to turn the Tau into a "erm ackshually sweetie, there's an enlightened race of weeaboo aliens with Japanese aesthetics that are actually good guys. They only slaughter humans because humans are irredeemably evil, see? Doesn't that make you also want to hate yourself for being human, you stupid goy- I mean fellow Warhammer Enjoyer?"
>>97754034>but your loyalty is still to humanity because YOU ARE HUMAN.This was never the pitch.
>>97754034Lmao, no. I got no obligation to root for the Imperium just because they are humans. I root for the Eldar, because they are objectively the superior race plus they have better aesthetics. I despise the look of almost all imperial shit and I hate space marines.
>>97732775>the most authoritarian and totalitarian The imperium is literally right there.Tau are definitely an authoritarian autocracy, but the average imperial citizen is way less free in comparison. The Tau represents a group going down the same path the Imperium once did.
>>97754034That's the pitch from HFY tards on /tg/, anyway. The creators reveled in playing green soccer hooligans.
>>97754034You're a retard who can't see past your "hurr durr my guys are just like me!" attitude. It's a fictional setting, these are fictional characters, you aren't going to be slaughtered by the fictional Tyranids because you didn't support your fictional species' fighting effort. Take a step back and get some perspective.
>>97754084The Imperium isn't totalitarian, they're too feudal and decentralized for that. Ironically the Imperium is less 'free' precisely because they're less totalitarian. The Tau have one fascist government that tyrannizes you. The Imperium has the local gang, the local space marine chapter, the local governor, the inquisition, the ecclesiarchy, and the high lords of terra. The Tau are way more centralized and able to control more of your daily life, but they at least protect you from every two-bit gangster that would otherwise torment you.
Tau hate comes from three things:>Their rules and playstyle were disgusting for a long time to play against>Their aesthetic doesn't match 40k>They're so insignificant in the 40k universe that they have to win every big war or they'd get wiped out so they're mary sues
>>97739349Deldar aren't an explicit coalition faction, they have mutant slaves not minor xenos regiments of renown
>>97754219The last one isn't even true, statistically they win less in lore than the Imperium does
>>97733291>Without BIG E, and the hundreds of thousands of psykers scarified each years to keep the Astronomicon running, there's no Imperium.Which is a physical, practical requirement, not an ideological one. They dont feed the chair payers because that's part of worship, though it may have eventually been conflate with it, they feed it payers because its literally the only way they know to keep the lighthouse running.Ethereal must enforce their philosophy over the lesser castes and races or else everyone will realize the guiding theory of their civilization is hollow bullshit. Meanwhile the imperium is an actual empire, its too big to genuinely care that everyone is ideologically consistent it just cares if you pay your tithes and pays lip service to the religion. It prefers if you genuinely worship the Emperor as he and the Cardinals instruct but if the savage feral worlders make him a storm God, king of their pantheon, or some garden world makes him into some divine muse of beauty, both are fine so long as they provide men, material, or staging grounds.All worlds act completely differently in their intimate mechanics but so long as they check boxes to the administratum bureaucrat then it doesn't matter. Tau genuinely need each world to embody the utopian concept to sell their foundational concept.
>>97754225Now maybe, but their first codexes were nothing but victories.
>>97735914>You can also do us a favor and smash that orphanage so we can get the Earth caste on with building a command bunker.They should play up more their "utopian" city planning as a kind of idiotic feng shui that demands certain 'energies' and shit that works perfectly fine in a completely level field with a freshly printed city and requires constant wasteful demolition and terraforming anywhere else.>that human hab block can comfortably house thousands with minimal renovations and will stand for a thousand years>yes but the dragon in his seat at the capitol must have a view of the mountains, only a small café for water caste officials may go there, TEAR IT DOWN
>>97754296Well yeah, they were their codexes, they're not gonna introduce a faction by showing how much they suck at fighting.
>>97754302Being wasteful or displaying unnecessary opulence is badly seen by the tau society, including auxiliars.
>>97754475But its not wasteful, the Greater Good energies flow most effectively when low density urban services replace brutality but utilitarian dense housing nearer to the city center! It basks the surroundings in the warm aura of Unity and Idealism. This man clearly has gone mad to not understand such basic flows of ethereachi and requires re-education.
>>97732622>occupy the space in the setting that's typically reserved for humans: young, newly-spacefaring, secular, logical, lucky, and naive when it comes to galactic politics (or, in the case of 40k, the utter lack thereof).This would work if the galaxy wasn't already full to the bursting point with empires that have billions if not trillions or even quadrillions of soldiers to field. The Tau simply don't have the numbers to stand up against any force, not just in terms of troops but in terms of material and worlds. And it's not like they're some fledgling backwater power either: they have weaponry that's able to stand up to the strongest powers of the day. No one would ignore the Tau, they're obviously a threat to every major power in the galaxy in terms of tech but they also lack the sheer numbers to protect themselves against any concerted attack by any of the myriad factions. They would attract attention, and said attention would handily wipe them out. The only reason they haven't is because of plot armor which has cheapened the very nature of the setting by its existence.
The T'au probably have a population in trillions, if we take into account planets like Sa'cea, or the Enclaves. It's a small, but densely populated region of space. Also much of the rest of the galaxy is grossly underpopulated, except for the hive worlds.
>>97754742>The only reason they haven't is because of plot armorThat applies to everyone though. Humanity should've been crushed like 50 times but didn't because...the xenos were just feeling nice.
>>97754864Also, the Tau have armies of robot workers.
>>97752035>guys that look like they're from Starship TroopersYou mean the shitty ST "satire" movie that got everything about the actual portrayal of the troops wrong. Because the Starship Troopers in the book are actually more consistent with Tau battlesuits, with their description of them basically being a crisis suit.
>>97754219>Their aesthetic doesn't match 40kThis is the most retarded complaint people make about the tau. By same logic tyranid, or eldar aesthetic do not fit 40k.
>>97732223>Space Marines are effectively a Zaku IIExplain yourself
>>97754219Ah yes the civilization on the upswing is the Mary Sue faction as opposed to Roboute Guilliman
>>97755613They look pretty similiar no?
>>97732046I never did either but this may because I have so much hatred for the tyranids, chaos and votann that the tau seem fine by comparison as they're distinct in tech and society and have some neat elements to them. A flicker of light drowning in the darkness of the galaxy, fighting to burn bright even as they risk being snuffed out by the cosmic blight.
>>97754034Do people even see the IoM as a pure evil? They are played off as a tragedy usually from what I can tell. The Tau come off as an echo of humanity in the dark age of technology, which is what is neat to me about them. They are what humans once were. And they only don't fall into something more grim because the clock is never advanced.
>>97757718The votann feel like considerably worse offenders, but they're also undercooked as fuck still so it's hard to know what to think about them. Stubborn refusal to learn from the past failings of the dark age of technology perhaps? Holding onto tech that is probably causing them suffering more than they can ever admit due to their codependency on it?There is probably an interesting angle with the votann to play into tragedy with it, but currently I just don't know what to think of them.
>>97754034>t. YouTube “lore” watcher
>>97732046It’s just people who’d rather hate on the “Mary Sue” faction while unironically spout Krieg shovel memes (wtf is a steel legion) and geek out at how epic the latest primarus ultramarine sets are.
>>97757718I do consider the Imperium to be evil. Some of their bs can be justified as necessary but far more often than not, the atrocities the Imperium commits are in no way necessary or morally justifiable. The imperium is a decadent, and morally abhorrent empire that has reduced 99 percent of humanity into slavery, squalor and zealous ignorance, where retardation and foolishness is enforced as doctrine. There is nothing aspirational about the state of humanity in 40k, they are fucking pathetic, disgusting slaves, that enshrine and celebrate their serfdom.
>>97732046I hate them because they're pointlessly unaesthetic. Beneath the armor and mechsuits you've got a race of gross-looking lame cow people. Tau fans endlessly cope by trying to make them more appealing than GW wants them to be, but at the end of the day nobody likes these fuckers, people just like their outer shells. Even if you like and play Tau, that uncomfortable reality will ping you the few times you see an unhelmed Tau on a game box or gaming table. That is inevitably their greatest problem; if they as a race looked more cool you'd see a ton more engagement and interest, guaranteed.
>>97744618I would love to see that, Farsight is a cool character, yeah he bit of a mary sue but most major 40k named characters tend to be mary sues in their own right but he by far one of the coolest Tau characters along with his own little hermit kingdom he got going on and they be cooler if they were their own faction and unique units than just being a sub faction within the tau empire codex, which I believe they still are it been years since i read their codex It wouldn't be hard to make lore for why mainly due to the recent events going across the galaxy, it time for the enclaves to expand it borders for it own safety and others from the clutches of those dreaded ethereal and commit mass genocide on the Orks along the way
>>97739226>that stuck around as LOS blocking terrain when they diedI don't think vehicles stuck around after being destroyed back then.
because they never actually became grimdark. they hinted at the "the ethereals are actually mind controlling everyone into space communism" theory but never actually did it. combined with the sleek designs, especially when first released compared to everyone else and they came across as "generic future sci fi army".
>>97732046What TAU COULD HAVE BEEN!!
>>97732054to me, they're dirty chinksbut being streetshitters would make my hatred work just as well
>>97733426>Dark Eldar are the True Fascists of the settingnot even closethe complete opposite, evenfascism is ALL about valuing the group more than its individual constituents (which makes both communism and democracy fascist to the marrow, fwiw)it's in the fucking name, ffsDark Eldar are about ultra-individualism, pushed into egotism, and ultra-freedom, pushed into assumed degeneracy
>>97764328I'm so sick of seeing this excuse. The grimdark element of the Tau was the fact that they were naive, hopeful newcomers in a galaxy that held nothing but horrors for them. Every optimistic foray into the wider galaxy results in a new discovery of the grotesque, the irrational, and the pure evil. They could have been the guro faction, but retards fucked it up by making them le morally grey.
>>97757921I wonder if a reason for contempt for any faction that isn't overly gratuitous with their evil is that it undermines the sense of legitimization of the IoM's behavior as an empire. When it is stuff like orks, chaos or tyranids out there it is easier to go "see, besieged by clear existential threats that justify the existence of the IoM" but xenos who are simply rational actors capable of diplomacy and pacts etc. make that narrative strain. To be fair, Temporary alliances happen quite a bit and the IoM's feudalism means there is a lot of "lifestyle variation" across it.
>>97765122I am almost certain that a lot of the imperiumfags hate the Tau and the Craftworld Eldar precisely because their mere existence and the way they operate showcases that the whole "eternal war against all xenos" is not an inevetability but a result of the culture of the Imperium itself. The eldar and especially the Tau also arguably treat the average human under their power better than the imperium does. There are multiple instances of Exodite Eldar tolerating primitive human populations in their worlds or even co-existing with them in harmony, and even the most militant Craftworlds like Biel-Tan tend to not always go with a "lets kill them all" mindset when it comes to human civilians. Tau obivously fully embrace humans that join them and grant them a place within their society that is almost objectively superior in terms of living quality than 99 percent of imperial citizens get. Whereas the Imperial go to policy towards all xenos is just total genocide if they can get away with it.
>>97759438This, aesthetics are the single most important factor that decides if a faction is liked or not. Even something as disgusting as Chaos can become genuinely popular just because it looks cool (at least to some people).Its a shame too because the armor and mechs of the Tau look amazing but then they take the helmets off and its ruined.
>>97765161co-existance with the Tau isn't possible. both sides think that
>>97765122The amusing thing about Warhammer 40k is that it ends up making the argument that fascism is actually the best government in certain circumstances. The Imperium isn’t fascist and it ends up being MORE dystopian for it, not less, while the Tau who do fulfill that fascist ideology end up being basically the only “order-aligned” faction in the setting that isn’t slowly dying.
>>97765326Humans can live in Tau empire though and arguably are less repressed than they would be in the Imperium.
>>97765331A stable authoritarian government isn't a fascist government per say, they have castes and client species they integrate for the greater good in a fashion that isn't the kind of purity of blood that fascism usually is connotative with.
>>97765780Tbf racism and ethno-nationalism was never actually an intrinsic part of fascism. You can have a civic nationalist fascist state.
>>97765780they are fascist to the marrow, because through their stenchy puppeteering, ethereals have these numbnuts believe only the group matters; no individuality whatsoever (except ethereals', lol)taus are the most evil and repulsive faction of 40k, by very far, and that's saying a lotthey deserve to be hunted and exterminated, and so do their playerssimple as
>>97765936sounds more commie than fascist. Where's the scapegoat? The central charismatic leader? The deranged esoteric conspiracies?
>>97765959communism very much is a kind of fascism, inherentlythis is clear enough in that it values the group more than its individual constituents (it's in the name)which is the very geist of fascism (it's in the name as well)
>>97765573Mossa makes some damn good 40k fanart
>>97764938this guy gets it, the more powerful and the more cynical they become, the less interesting the Tau get
>>97764938>>97766872"We are the naive good guys constantly getting fucked in the ass by a galaxy full of unexpected ass rape" would actually be the most annoying possible faction identity imaginable. There has to be some nuance and gradient in the same way Space Marine chapters vary from sparkling blue boys with shiny white teeth and black men that volunteer at the soup kitchen to the murderfucks of planet fuckmurdera and the actual spanish inquisition. If there's nothing wrong in the empire and everything is actually this fuckass perfect space federation struggling in a galaxy that UGH JUST DOESN'T GET IT, they'd legitimately be the aggravating caricature the haters strawman all the time on here."My dudes" are a 4th sphere expansion battlegroup turned space pirates when they got scattered through the warp and had to survive on their own for a few centuries. The Farsight Enclaves are a rogue splinter following the cult of personality of one strong military leader. Each Sept has to have something fucking going for them to not all just be the same tasteless blob. "Actually right" is not an interesting faction identity.
>>97732046For me their hardcore, their fanatical collectivism gives me the willies.>The ideal human is sterilized, drugged up, and used as a meat shield. What, is that selfish ambition I hear?It makes me really wonder about the people who say they're the good guys of the setting.Plus, they're nearly immune to chaos and then smug about how they're so much more reasonable than humans. Same as Votann.I want to see Tau that go full USSR with the collectivism. Resources stretched paper thin, everyone knows chaos, genestealers etc. exist and are straight up gaslit by leadership. Sturdy-ass equipment that is nevertheless worn to within an inch of its life, and worth more than the person carrying it. You want grimdark collectivists, make grimdark collectivists.>>97766125I can't even tell if this is a parody of DR3.
>>97767562While they are fanatically collectivist and outright fascist, the sterilization shit is basically a meme with no canonical support.
>>97767496At times I realize these discussions are like people arguing over the temperature of a thermostat.There isn't an optimal tau, some will say they're too naive, others too greyed and GW has no way to please either group
>>97767591*thin* canonical support.I think it's telling that it stuck in the gestalt and has never been contradicted.At the very least they drug them with tranquility wafers.
>>97767607It never even made much sense, the Tau might be fascist but they're not retards, their #1 problem is a lack of manpower, they wouldn't deliberately gimp themselves with sterilization.
>>97767595They're both naive and grey due to ideology so personally I think it works.The only people who get hated on are the people who say the Tau set the thermostat perfectly and everyone who had it set to a different temperature is stupid.The Tau were essentially given a massive gift with chaos-proof souls and a homeworld beneath the Imperium's notice. It's not some sort of triumph of the Tau's philosophy, they got stupidly lucky and now they have to contend with that.I like the picture for whatever it's worth. Fantastical banality.
>>97767631>I like the picture for whatever it's worth. Fantastical banality.Meant for >>97767614.
>>97757727The Votann literally cannot live without their tech (or more accurately, the LoV cannot live without the Votann).Their entire race, flesh or iron, are replicated by a handful of supercomputers that they're abusing by bombarding them with more brain uploads than they were ever supposed to.Everyone sees them as the high-tech faction but they're basically technical debt: the faction.The (baseline) human DAoT ended when the AI rebelled, which is unlikely to happen to the LoV but the AI can still go insane. That's the retconned story for what killed the squats, during a Tyranid attack it got overloaded by uploading too many brains at once.There's some interesting ideas there. I hope they survive long enough to get cooked a little better. Their rollout was rough. I wish GW would just drop the viking shit.
>>97767595I appreciate you got my point. The only thing I'll add is that the 'good guy' debate is especially tiresome because there's not a lot of point to it. 40k isn't a venue primarily for ideological exploration and ethical testing, it's about putting little dudes on a table and making violent sounds after rolling some dice to decide how many of each died. When the flavor gets in the way and people get butthurt about what forces "SHOULD" win or how much "BETTER" the galaxy would be if they won are missing the point entirely.At the expense of sounding like some redshirt: In the Grim Darkness of the 41st Millennium there is only War. The fight is what matters.
>>97767705>what forces "SHOULD" win or how much "BETTER" the galaxy would be if they won are missing the point entirely.I recently checked in on Adeptus Ridiculous after a break long enough to forget why I took a break, and they did this and it annoyed me.At the start of the Plague War the smurfs healed plague victims instead of killing them, and AdRic started moralfagging about how that's an improvement but it "shouldn't" be, and it's just cringe. What, prey tell, "should" the sci-fi totalitarian regime be like?Then they dropped the pretense and started dropping ice cold takes about IRL politics and I just left.The point is, don't moralfag about a world run by a giant dead guy in a gold chair.
>>97764938their 1984 hypno toad totalitarian state thing has been hinted from the very beginning,The problem is pinko Tautists cant interpret the lore correctly because they are fucking retarded>>97754084People loke you just dont get 40k and just regurgitate misinfo from redit.Objectovely the Tau are more authoritarian than the Imperium.The Imperium largely doesnt give a single fuck about what goes on for most of its population, its pretty anarchic and you potentially have much more freedom in the imperium if you play your cards right.Tau has none of that, they have SEVERAL layers of mind control including indoctrinating their entire population, literal mind control from the Ethereal and several technological forms of mind control.And what happens when Tau dont have Ethereals to control them? they revert to extremist xenophobes so extreme theyd make even the most fanatical marine blush. Species supremacists whose The Tau's EYES LITERALLY BULGE OUT OF THEIR HEADS and veins bulge on their foreheads from hatred.
>>97767725nta but the Marines were supposed to be always largely morally good dudes.The idea marines are immoral evil dudes is reddit made up lore and 3rd party lore trying to smear the setting.
>>97767562Even with resources spread thin, the average Tau citizen should have a higher quality of life and goods than even a planetary governor. of the Imperium
>>97768215theres no evidence in the lore that anyone in the Tau Empire has a good life. Since the Tau produce propaganda do its all unreliable.In fact this is why the "unreliable narrator" meme blew up when 40k always had reliable narrators. It was the Tau who were written as deliberately unreliable and suspicious. Tau fags butthurt over this fact falsely claim the entire setting is unreliable. They really have done irreparable damage to 40k with their autistic lying.
>>97768215Also claiming the average citizen would be better off than a Governor is absurd
>>97768231The Imperium is openly shown as backwards, monstrously inefficient, and barbaric, relaying on human hardware. The Tau are highly automated and robotized. That alone gives them a massive, massive manufacturing advantage.>>97768246The average first world citizen has better a better quality of life than kings during the Middle Ages. It is not absurd at all.
>>97768231The Imperium views advanced AI (Abominable Intelligence) as heresy, leading them to use Servitors and slaves. To build a skyscraper, the Imperium uses 10,000 slaves and a prayer.By contrast, the T'au use Earth Caste engineers and specialized Drones. This automation allows for precision manufacturing and mass production that the Imperium simply can't match on a per-capita basis. A T'au citizen’s "standard issue" housing is climate-controlled, ergonomically designed, and integrated with tech that a Planetary Governor might only see in ancient, inherited relics.While the Governor has more power, the T'au citizen likely has a more stable and comfortable daily existence. The Governor might live in a palace the size of a city, but that palace is likely drafty, filled with gothic gargoyles, and lit by flickering candles because the wiring was lost in M38.The only reason the Imperium stays afloat is sheer, "monstrous" scale.A medieval king had 500 servants but couldn't get an aspirin or a hot shower with consistent water pressure. A Planetary Governor has 500 slaves but might still be breathing recycled air that smells like 10,000 years of incense and sweat.
>>97768250We are talking about the Tau empire you fucking retard communist.Also claiming the average Tau is as wealthy as a governor is absurd you are actually low iq and not a true fan.
>>97768258again we are talking about the Tau empire not the imperium you mentally ill communist retard.
>>97768259Sorry, anon, a lifespan expectancy of mid-30 years according to Imperium OWN CODEX and being well-managed and "bastion of stability" doesn't paint the Imperium in a good light.
>>97768269Planetary Governors live for hundreds of years, the entire upper crust of Imperial worlds has access to rejuvenate technology you fucking subhuman lying retard. Gtfo fake fan
>>97768115Which is exactly why the Imperium doesn't belong, 40k is meant to be grimdark, not some hippy dippy liberal paradise
>>97768300stop making low effort retard posts
>>97768292Planetary Governors DEFECT to the Tau Empire anon. The T'au are so successful at "poaching" Imperial worlds that it’s a major point of friction in the lore. They don't just wait for a planet to fall; they Water Caste actively lobby Imperium leadership until they flip without needing to send a single firewarrior. The most common defectors are anonymous Governors of "Fringe Worlds" who realize that the Emperor is 50,000 lightyears away, but the T'au are right next door with a box of aspirin and a working climate control unit.
Most Gue'vesa actually report being happier under T'au rule, simply because they get three meals a day and their neighbors aren't being turned into Arco-flagellants. The T’au Empire doesn't even need to be a utopia; it just needs to be "not a nightmare."
>>97768308>>97768321just stfu brainlet tautist, fuck off back to redit>governors defectbecause tau bribe them. thats what the tau do. So they must have to bribe them with more than the fortune they already have
>>97768321>1984 zero freedom mind control alien dystopia>not a nightmareRetard
>>97768368It's just a standard fascist state, no need to try to compare it to 1984. By the standards of the setting fascism is a pretty good deal.
>>97768308>>97768389you know the Tau tried to bribe daemons. It is therefore provable that the Tau lie constantly to other people.The Tau presenting their society is better is PROPAGANDA Not true. They will say anything go convince other aliens to join them.If you fall for in universe propaganda you are actually a retarded person
>>97768394Not relevant at all to what I was saying but okay.
>>97768395it is relevant because tau are communists. They use media propaganda to deceive their enemies, which is all other life. If that doesnt work they threaten a war, if that doesnt work they start killing people. If that doesnt work they genocide you.
The average Imperial citizen lives in a Hive City where the air is recycled smog, the food is "corpse-starch," and "freedom of speech" is a fast track to being turned into a lobotomized cyborg (Servitor).Compared to the Imperium, Orwell’s 1984 looks like a summer camp. In 1984, the state wants to control your mind; in the Imperium, the state wants to control your mind, your soul, and your afterlife, and then use your skull as a floating lightbulb after you're dead or even while you are alive.Even if the Ethereals were 100% sinister puppet masters that made Ingsoc and the Ministry of Truth blush, a T’au citizen still gets three square meals and a bed that isn't shared by ten other people in a shifting work cycle while breathing radioactive air.
>>97768412In the Imperium, joining the army is optional, they dont have conscription.They also have a largely lawless anarchic society where people can do whatever they want.Theres even a profession in the Imperium for doing whatever you want called Rogue trader. You are retarded. The Imperium isnt a mass surveillance state like the Tau Empire. They dont have the resources or care to do that. They also dont employ mind control like the Tau.Most Imperial worlds are fairly nice and boring, many are the equal to our world.Also by our standards most Imperial worlds would be better than our world, as they havent known war for hundreds of years. While our world has constant warfare on it every year.
>tautists cant address the faults of the Tau >male every discussion into whatabout da imperiumCommunists are retarded in discussion about fiction.
>>97768431make*
>>97768399The Tau are fascist, not communist. Although you might argue they are effectively the same thing.
>>97768426>They also have a largely lawless anarchic society where people can do whatever they want.Which is precisely why they suck so much. The Imperium is 100 little tyrannies all overlapping and fighting each other. The local gangs and planetary governors and Inquisition and Space Marines and Ecclesiarchy and High Lords and Adeptus Arbites all with overlapping control over you.The Tau might be a fascist authoritarian state, but at least they're the only ones you have to worry about, it's the same reason the Mafia opposed Mussolini, fascism might enforce its own sense of order and control but it will in the process push out the hundred other little tyrants who would try to impose themselves upon you in the process.
>>97732046Lack of grimdark has nothing to do with it. They're just lame catering to weebs.
>>97732046Why are you capitalizing random letters? This reads like Trump's tweets.
>>97732046>Indian>Commie>Weeb>shooting onlyIt's truly a mystery
>>97768533>Greek>Fascist>Weeb>Mostly shootyFTFY
Why is there still no Chaos Tau?>inb4 they're immune because ethereals blah blah blahShut up and give me Chaos Tau, hopefully they'll be a bit less gay
>>97768533why would they be indian when they are divided into Taoist elements and speak like ching chongs>>97768553theres examples, its entirely plausible, they are only slightly resistance to Chaos but have no immunity to chaos and are naive and ignorant.
>>97768531>random TDS out of fucking nowhere
>>97768368I mean the Ethereal mind control doesn't work on humans does it?
>>97768621one of the books implies it does but not as powerful as it affects Tau.Ethereal have to basically touch a human and be very close and they subtly manipulate them.The Tau have also invented a number of devices to essentially cover that, like brain parasites and mind control helmets. Mind control is fundamental for their civilisation to work
The two main things that make the Tau evil>they are essentially practicing mass slavery of other species and plan to enslave the entire galaxy. You also have zero say in it they'll just genocide you if you resist.>they use multiple layers of mass mind control. Ranging from education and ideology to actual mind control. Their entire civilisation is built on it, to glue it together.
>>97768571Well, while such wouldn't be entirely unexpected in a thread like this, I will play doubles advocate and note that anon did not say he dislikes le orange man, just noted a similarity to his iconic typing style. Thank you for your attention to this matter!
>>97768665another thing is Tau believe any attempt to subvert the Tau'va is justification for genocide
>>97768568>why would they be indian when they are divided into Taoist elements and speak like ching chongsCaste system? They're a mishmash of various Asian countries.
>>97768693castes are not unique to india. In fact ironically north east asian countries have their own castes and its a huge topic of complaint and criticism in their societies.
>>97768571don't care about orange man, but Writing like this looks Kind of Retarded
>>97733426This is referencing the spritual aspect of the Nazi-ideology at best. Not fascism.Fascism is primarily as political system, secondary an ideology.The ideological part is focused on the centralization of every aspect of existing on the state (totalitarianism). It can be basically anything and still stays fascism, as long as you keep the state as the center of everything.Which is btw also why socialists can't grasp the concept of fascism and claim there can't be a clear definition.. but that's besides the point.You can argue Dark Eldar are the most racist faction since they don't see anybody else (including other Eldar) as a person. But that has little to do with fascism.Mussolini was even specific about fascism not having anything to do with race. Only the Germans had it as part of their political and ideological system (Spain didn't either).You can argue the Dark Kin are the closest to Nazis. That I could agree with.
>>97768699Okay, but their armor is obviously curry colored. Not sure how GW got away with this btw.
>>97768718No its worse its the unspeakable colour.. beige
>>97768717Deldar are utilitarianists and atheists. Interpreting everything as fascism is the hall ark of a fuckwit and a reditor
>>97768728hallmark*
>>97733426Nonsense. Deldars are extremely egoistic hedonists, not exactly patriots willing to die for their state. Their vibe is more that of a decadent aristocrat than a fascist oppressor. They're pretty much Marquis de Sade in space: the faction. If anything, they're closer to anarchy than fascism.>inb4 but they're very racist towards other species and live in some hierarchySo does almost everyone else. Are orkz fascists too? And it's not like actual non-nazi fascists were particularly racist.
i dont know how bringing up castes is a valid point. Usually castes in human history have been tools of oppression.In Tau society castes are supposedly all equal (except the Ethereal)Its basically a classless society because of this (though not entirely true in practice since rank exists and this could be interpreted as class)
>>97768745dont think you know what utilitarianism means.The Deldar think skinning one man (or eldar) alive in gladiatorial combat is justified because it makes everyone in their society happy.This is ironically an actual explanation of utilitarianism So for the Deldar torturing and killing slaves is vital for their societies overall happiness whoch is utilitarianism.
>>97768718>>97768723i think they were originally supposed to be more beige but gw keeps yellowing them up. What did GW mean by this btw
>>97765331but the Tau are slowly dying. The wheels and new paint is slowly coming off their empire. They are literally slowly feeling the repercussions of their lies.Examples:The Supreme Leader of the Tau is an Ai.The Farsight Enclaves, break way factionsThe failed 4th sphere expedition basically making a mockery of their stupid ideology. Since they can't handle chaos, or even their own natures.They needed to make their own inquisition to put Tau in body bags for seeing the wrong thing (daemons)
>>97768827>The Supreme Leader of the Tau is an Ai.Do they know?
>>97768839no they dont which is the point, their entire empire is built on lies.Even the ai doesnt realise it and actually attempted to mind control Tau and failed.So its an entire civilisation thats being run by an ai and its covered up.
The whole point of 40K is that BIGE was a retard who made things for humanity worse. He banned religion thinking it would kill off Chaos. Not only he failed, he made Chaos stronger with his choices. Chaos doesn't care about religion. It cares about emotions. By banning religions he starved out benevolent Warp entities protecting humanity. He tried to scam Chaos to make the Space Marines, putting a mark on all humanity in the process. He exterminated Star Trek civilization s who knew Chaos better than he did. His own Imperial Truth became Imperial Faith. He set up a system that basically stagnated humanity when he became mortality wounded.The Emperor’s plan was always "My way or the highway." He built a system so centralized around his own psychic might and vision that when he fell, there was no "Plan B."The Imperium became a machine that keeps itself running through sheer inertia and suffering. He wanted to guide humanity to a psychic evolution; instead, he became a golden life-support machine for a dying empire.
>>97768863But redditor The Emperor protects literally belief in him protects humanity like a shield and its also a sword against chaos, The entire Imperium is like a psychic manifestation of the Emperor that feeds him and in turn becomes moe adapted to fighting it enemies (btw i was banned from r/40klore for stating this fact after having schizo abuse hurled at me)
The Tau are a Mary Sue faction. The only other example i know of is the NCR in Fallout. Its made worse by parts of their fanbase who insist they are perfect and can do no wrong
>>97768827they actually edited footage of their failed warped gate sucking in their entire expedition fleet, to make it look like nothing happened. This was live after everyone in their empire saw it.Essentially gaslighting their entire empire live on tv lol.Not only are ethereals evil, they are slightly incompetent too
>>97768412So they live in a Charles Dickens novel but with less people freezing or starving to death, less sickness, homeless and poverty to the point of selling off your children and criminals are getting put to use instead of overcrowding prisons or roaming free.1984 is a dystopia around totalitarianism, not about life being a summer camp or not.It's almost as if you never read classic literature and base your opinions of videos and reddit posts.
>>97732046>Because its interesting and fun to see a Star Trek Federation type force be in 40k
>>97768855I meant more that AI can be corrupted by chaos when they are so smug about being "immune" to it.
>>97769250This has never made any sense even in the retardation of 40k.
>>97769250Tau are not immune to Chaos corruption. They are by default "stealthy" because their souls are hard to detect FROM the warp, and most Tau are fanatically loyal to the Greater Good, which partially shields them from regular manipulation and direct mental corruption, but physical Chaos corruption (direct physical contact with daemons, warp artifacts, possessed items, etc.) is fair game for everyone and anything (that isn't someone like Custodes or Grey Knights), Tau included. And yes, even AI or code itself can be corrupted, physically, by Chaos, as can any material object.
>>97768365They don't need to give them even more money. They just need to give them ways to spend the money that they didn't already have. It doesn't matter how wealthy a planetary governor is if he can't buy anything that isn't another servitor or more varieties of alcohol. All the Tau need to do is show up with some consumer electronics and suddenly they've given the governor far more options for luxury spending.
>>97768827The 4th sphere was still a success in expanding their empire despite that. Even when they fail they still tend to succeed in some fashion.
>>97768748The Tau Castes are modeled after Plato’s Republic anyways, they’re not Indian, they’re classical Greece
>>97768250>The average first world citizen has better a better quality of life than kings during the Middle Ages. It is not absurd at all.You have been lied to so much it's unreal.
>>97768999Interesting comparison because the Imperium is like the Legion of Caesar in a lot of ways.>Roman aesthetic>technological hangups>central figure the whole thing collapses withoutThe most relevant commonality is that writers of both factions are split on whether they are a necessary evil or just evil.Other than the smurfs who are literally Space NCR.>>97770604>All the Tau need to do is show up with some consumer electronics and suddenly they've given the governor far more options for luxury spending.>the Tau sterilize you and give you a Nintendo Switch>reddit insists they're the good guysIt's all starting to make sense.
The Imperium is such a nightmare, that the Tau could be Oceania, Nazi Germany, North Korea, or some other place like this and still be better than the Imperium.
>>97771353The Tau don’t sterilize you
>faction of based retards who are gimmicky and strongly thematic due to their extremist ideology>doesn't fit into 40kI thought the Tau were funny and 3ed was p cool. I also stopped playing in 5ed so I have no clue how retarded they are now. Super retarded, I'm sure.
>>97732046They have explicit castes, which makes them pajeets in my eyes
>>97772225They're based on Greek castes
>>97771353The NCR is like the Tau because they just constantly expand and never lose. They also are just good at everything with no explanation and no flaws.It's terrible writing that is made worse by the fans of each faction insisting they are even more perfect.
>>97772225the US also has castes, the value of your house defines what level of education you are allowed. Did you think Bill Gates got to use Xerox's PC tech because they liked his attitude? His mom got him there, and she got there becase of her parents and so on. It was always castes.
I have only seen one person interested in tau in my local warhammer shop and that person was a tranny
>>97773466>muh whataboutism imperium>muh whataboutism USthats not the definition of caste you retard
>>97773491every single Tau fag ive ever known irl was a commie
>>97773431commies also latch onto both the Tau and NCR. Ironically the NCR is supposed to be like a neo-US state
>>97773466actually, mostly because of her father, who was a prominent jewish central bankerand do you know his family name, and thus bill gate's mother's maiden name?maxwell, lolso... maybe not just the value of their house, lmaojustsaiyan.tiff
>>97768753>justified because it makes everyone in their society happy.They think it's justified because it's not happening to them and they directly benefit from it. Their "value system" is a very hedonistic kind of social darwinism, at best. Vect will (and has) gladly kill off entire sub-realms of Commorragh if it keeps him in power. As much as the other dark elder claim he is a Tyrant, they'd do the exact same in his place. If you told even the lowliest tank-born that they have to die for the good of the many, they'd do everything in their power to survive and, if they succeed, seek revenge afterwards.
>>97773466>>97773626thats not what a caste is you reddit retards. Caste is a hereditary system defined by profession and surname with strict rules imposed on them
>>97773662nope.jpg it literally makes them happy as in they need to feel happy about it to survive so its for the good of their society
>>97773529Tau is more of a fascist state than a commie one, the commies are typically more fans of the Imperium
>>97773673They don't care about "the good of their society", retard. They do it out of an individualistic need for survival. Everything Dark Eldar do is for self-aggrandizement. Every Wych that walks into the arena is there to make a name for her/himself, every Kabalite that risks getting killed on a raid is trying to climb the ranks, every Archon that hosts a gladiatorial event does it for clout.
>>97773693Tau are commies. >>97773707You are retarded and cant read. The Deldar need to do that to survive to keep away slaanesh and prolong their lives. So yes gladiatorial combat and other forms of murder are justified in their society for the good of their society.
>>97773693>the commies are typically more fans of the Imperiumstraight up trolling and gaslighting. Retard.
>>97773728>Tau are commies.False, they are textbook fascists. Unless you're suggesting that communism and fascism are the same thing
>>97773728You're the biggest lorelet pseud I've seen in some time. Dark Eldar are rat race: the faction. Calling them utilitarian is laughably stupid, they do not care about the greatest good for the greatest number of Dark Eldar. Every single member of their race would fuck over an unlimited number of their fellows to get ahead.
>>97773748They have commissars, are ruled by an enlightened atheist dictator that is now venerated as godlike similar to many commie dictators, they don't care much about cultural differences, they love using human wave tactics and life is cheap to them, they fight for a utopian end-goal which will never actually exist, and they're defended by people who don't have to live in their regime claiming that they didn't do anything wrong and blame everyone else for what's wrong with their society.
>>97773668>defined by professioncentral banker certainly is one>and surnameberg, witz, baum, stein, etc>with strict rules imposed on themthe rule is they can do whatever they wantagain, justsaiyan.tiff
>>97773780you dont know what utilitarian means because you are a Dunning-Kruger.It literally means hedonism you fucking retard redditor
>>97773758they are textbook communists.>>97773797actual faggot>>97773821Gates isnt a banker. you antisemitic fart huffing dumbass
>>97773876to be fair, central bankers aren't real bankers: just crooks and thievesand that's what billy is, on top of being rich as a bank
>>97773895If Gates was in a caste. There would be this entire group called the Gates. That would live in their own community and theyd have the same profession. They wouldnt marry any one outside of the caste.
>>97773912Ok, ranjeeit
itt redditors try to think with catastrophic results.
>>97773863>It literally means hedonismIt literally doesn't.
>>97773929>muh jeetsKeeping this on topic but GW most likely was inspired by Japanese and Korean caste system for the Tau castes, and themed them around Taoist 5 elements.In North east asian society they had caste systems and it still persists to this day. In those examples castes for example were all the shitty jobs like tanner, butcher etc. They were in their own caste. Eg Japanese BurakuminI wonder if GW was inspired reading about them, they even have their own Buraku Liberation League.It'd be cool if in Tau society there was a caste liberation group secretly trying to end the caste system
>>97773979it literally does>Utilitarian hedonism, also called classical utilitarianism, asserts that everyone's happiness matters. Its a framework of hedonism
>>97774010Hedonism = pleasure is the only intrinsic goodUtilitarianism = maximizing happiness for the greatest number of people is bestThese are not the same concept, bud. Furthermore, thinking the "everyone's happiness matters" is what the Dark Eldar fucking believe requires a complete disregard for the entire body of their lore. As I said, lorelet and a pseud. Have fun fishing for >(You)s.
>>97773876>they are textbook communists.Then you are saying that fascism is the same thing as communism.
>>97774086You still dont understand, Deldar justify murder in their society like they justify gladiator combat.Gladiatorial combat is utilitarianism.These needs of the many outweigh the few because the happiness generated by a person being killed in the arena is greater than that persons suffering
>>97773987they're communist and stinky fish pypotaus are just chinksduh
>>97774185they're even basically soulless, lol
>>97774185They fascists and bovines
>>97774724communism is a kind of fascism
>>97774753Correct, but it's not the Tau's type of fascism.
>>97765573I look like this and have this tattoo
>>97739312>100 competing chinese cantons and ethereal chaebols trying to brainwash, trade war, and use auxiliary race corporate military proxies to undermine each other.You know what.TAU ROMANCE OF THE THREE KINGDOMS NOW!WHO HOLDS THE MANDATE OF HEAVEN?WHEN WILL WE GET TAU/KROOT LU BU USUNG A BIG FUCK OFF POLE ARM?MILLIONS OF CIVILIANS DEVOURED!
>>97732046I personally really like the whole multi alien species coalition thing and speaking in funny Chinese accents, but I honestly don't care too much for their vehicles design and tactics
>>97767614Why the fuck would the already outnumbered tau want to be even more outnumbered by the second class citizens? The Greater Good is the same thing as The Great Plan and in that same fashion the only true adherents are the first ones there, everyone else is lesser and liable to fuck it up. Human beings aren't trve tau blood and soil, they're selfish monkeys looking for the best personal deal and if they ever figure out they have the real power in numbers they'll slaughter innocent tau citizens and demand more. Controlling their population if for no other reason than the tau being physically incapable of feeding and housing them all according to their utopian standards, is the most harmonius long term plan
>>97768215>than even a planetary governorNot even of some bumkin feral world. Governors have riches and degeneracies that would put the bohemian grove visitors to shame
>>97768308>Planetary Governors DEFECT to the Tau Empire anon.Because they want POWER you stupid fucking moron. Feudal vassals dont betray their lords because they'll get to eat more mutton they betray because they're greedy fucks who want to count even more coins because they're sick of paying taxes to some other cunt.
>>97776759If that were true we wouldn’t see the Tau bother to give them Firewarrior weapons and armor in the first place, but they do.
>>97778441No, they bother because auxiliaries are divided in specific ways to be incapable of mass organization of an uprising or better indoctrinated. A human auxiliary who is part of one platoon dying on the frontline isn't a threat the same way trillions of humans, a not insignificant fraction of which are violent and proud hive gangers, could be if they figured out that there are only a few tens of millions of tau
I feel like the issue is a failure to commit. The Tau kind of were created to get broken by the Galaxy and would honestly be better if some Space Marine or Inquistor with knowledge of the Great Crusade would obnoxiously ponder "HMMMMMM I WONDER IF THIS IS WHY THE EMPEROR SAID NO TOLERANCE/ NO AI" as a Tau Chaos corrupted AI starts lobotomizing auxilaries to turn into crude combat servators using implants or HUDS in their armor to further torture the occupant. For me the Tau are just blue balls the faction. At most they exist to be OC Mary sues to criticize the Imperium by getting handwaved reasons why they don't suffer problems. They really haven't had to deal with a chaos warband or even chaos cults subverting them. The excuses given are boring. That's the worst part. Dim souls, Etherals have some John Grammaticus power that's dumb as shit, or AI despite AI being literally vulnerable to chaos. I want some Water Caste having a panic attack realizing that the Universe is irrational and the Imperium aren't cruel retards (they are cruel, uncaring assholes mostly within reason) and a Fire Warrior watching EC's hollow out an Etheral while the boring psychic auxilaries they have fall to chaos.Also have the Eldar think up slurs to call them. We really need that moment where the Eldar call them something that denotes how ignorant they are of the warp. They aren't psychic. Probably something like hylic.
