Not only is Yelmalio proven to get his ass beaten constantly in his own stinkin myths, he is portrayed as a proven enemy of the Storm Tribe afterwards. Why the hell would Sartarites bear to have them in their midst as potential destabilizing elements when his worshippers sell themselves to the highest bidder when the Occupation begins ?GLORANTHA Thread
>>97832773Still dont get why Jeff has such a hate boner for Elmal. Let people enjoy their cult of the loyal thane rather than Yelmalio if they choose so.
>>97832836I swear it's like a God Learning disease specifically for Elmal. I know that elmal only existed as a stop gap measure for possible fire rune orlanthi so they don't have to worship an enemy god for their light but c'mon. So what, now every fire rune nigga has to just leave the clan, town, tribe he was born in and saunter on over to be taught a foreign belief structure contrary to all his kin ?
Any new and exciting JC release ? Nochet Noir, Rhigos doko ? Is Ian Thomson done with his Pavis grand plan re-release project ?
>>97832958I couldn't tell you. I've only recently started buying the new books for glorantha after realizing I was behind by several years. The cult books specifically. As far as I can tell, their still working on the Gods of Glorantha book and I hear people constantly meming on the "coming soon" tm statements.
How was Runequest WarlordsI was hoping it would attract new players to the ttrpg
>>97834047Probably one of the worst tactical rpg of the last decade. They should have backed another David Dunham game instead.
>>97832836>Why creator has his favourites and playing them?
>>97834047If anything, that game did a fuckload of damage, being barely functional mess
>>97834410Honestly even if he was his favorite, There are already Praxian Yelmalians and Esrolian ones out there. Why does a prominent local cult have to suffer for an obvious foreigner cult ? Humakt is seen as a foreigner since he kut his kinship ties but is still a proper orlanthi god. I don't see why Yelmalio couldn't be written the same way.( in Sartar at the very least)
Give me a rundown because I keep hearing people complaining about two gods being the same in the new edition but apparently they weren't for decadesI don't feel embarrassed for asking because glorantha lore is fucking dense and hard to find in one single place
>>97838878Basically, Elmal was the sun-god worshipped by the Orlanthi; he is originally a member of their traditional enemies, the "Sky Gods" or "Fire Tribe" of the Dara-Happan pantheon, but was befriended by orlanth, and became his thane.There is also another fire-tribe god called Yelmalio, who left the fire tribe proper, and lost his "heat" in a fight with the Trollish demon-god Zorak Zoran; in some versions Zorak Zoran ganked him after he had already lost a fight with Orlanth.They had similar portfolios, though Elmal was never denuded of his fire, and the cult of Yelmalio tended to organize itself as independant temple-communities, the most famous of which are the sun-domes.Some bright spark developer then decided to come along and declare that Elmal is actually just an Orlanthicized form of Yelmalio, and reduce his cult to something that's been pushed out and largely subsumed into irrelevance, leaving the Orlanthi without a -proper- sun god of their own, which a lot of people think sucks.Elmal was a cool god; he is the patron of watchmen and the fyrd, and is associated with the spear, and because of his fire rune affinity, also horses, though his affinity for them is not as strong as many other fire-tribe gods, and most (but not all) Orlanthi cultures are indifferent horsemen.
>>97832836Yeah, I've never got it, either; I'm a bit of a late comer to all of this, but, going back through old forums posts, and dredging up old articles, even back in the day, Jeff seems to have this hype-focused hate for the guy. Pretty much everything else, he's normally pretty diplomatic, and very much focused on "Your Glorantha Will Vary", but Elmal? There's always this undercurrent - or just current - of "You're fucking doing this wrong, and you should feel bad for doing it." Hell, almost every time I've seen him talk about it - even decades ago - he seems to go out of his way to emphasise how 'wrong' people are for liking Elmal, while also doing everything he can to misinterpret peoples arguments or statements.Has there ever been any explanation for it? I know he's said quite a few times how tired he is of people asking about Elmal, but, again, even going back two/three decades, he seems to fucking detest the fucker.
there is a episode or two dedicated to Elmal in the Godlearner podcast
>>97832773Eh, they made Elmal gay, I just can't care about Glorantha at all, they can't even have Orlanth and Elmal be bros anymore (that's just to tumblr ghoul behavior). I just will play King of Dragon pass and ungay the cool parts of glorantha and strip them of the commiefornia and the rest of post-modern stuff. A pity because Glorantha had lots of great ideas, but hte execution of them all is just shit.Also posting in 4chan is a pain, this stupid captcha and I can't even post pics because some one in my op range must be posting some wicked shit.
>>97832773At least he got some kind of writeup for RQG, unlike most Darkness, Water and Chaos gods.
>>97834741Well I took a second look at his works and it looks like Yelmalians don't have to leave their clan if they initiate to yelmalio."Religiously, the average clan's 600 adults typically follow a distribution of 200 initiates of Orlanth and 200 initiates of Ernalda, with smaller numbers dedicated to Yelmalio (30)"At least they aren't completely divorced from the basic building block of orlanthi society.
>>97841338From what I have read, Elmal is not completely gone as he once was in the Runegate area of Sartar, so at least they threw the sun thane a bone in this way I guess. If anything, if the different ages of Glorantha show anything at all, Yelmalio gets butt fucked and mostly disappears pretty frequently so maybe this is just another highpoint of Little Yelm
>>97842282* He's not completely gone since he is as we was for Orlanthi in the Runegate Area. OOps. Not ESL I swear.
>>97842282they do end up being a bit of 5th collumnists
Newfag speaking. What are the real world cultural analogs for peoples in Glorantha? So far I know Orlanthi = Celtic/Nordic, and Lunarians = Grecco-Roman but also Persian? or something
>>97844921Doesn't matter much because they changed it all, the Orlanthies of Dragon pass than started were different as the orlanthies of KoDP than are very different as the orlanties of whatever is than they are doing now (micenan/minon/hindu).As an advise, I would just make my own shit inspired in the cool bits of glorantha. I make my own images using what I find it cool of the cultures of glorantha and porting them to my Hyborian age inspried setting, like the Rams in Ride like the Wind.As a setting glorantha just has to many drawbacks.
>>97844921I think malkioni people are supposed to feel somewhat Orthodox byzantines now ? Loskalm excepted, which has retained in part the flavor of an Arthurian utopia mixed with a more modern meritocratic social order.
When it comes to aesthetics, I do prefer the original 90's view of them but I can also see the rational for wanting something more unique in order to stand out.
>>97850739It's not only the aestethics, wich is a grave sin already, but the whole vibe of the religion even in the only place than is been explored (dragon pass). It's all a bad, uncleaned mess than they try to cover with your glorantha will vary, wich is admiting you better take it as a kit for your own setting than using it as it is.
>>97852641You drunk, bro?
Kinda surprised some people didn't like multi armed Orlanth. I thought he was cool. Very Indra.
This guy comes to your stead and slaps your local Earth Priestess on the ass. What do you do?
I'm gonna try out King of Dragon Pass
>>97864478It's good.Apparently the GOG version is superior, as the Steam one is based off some newfangled Mobile version that's almost but not quite feature complete to the original, though the details elude me.Peace clan is the easiest route, and you can get information on what choices to make in Heroquests by reading the ingame myth compendium, which is worth installing the game for in and of itself, but success in the act also depends on the Heroquester's personal attributes and suitability for the task; if I remember rightly some quests can also be "won wrong", which can lead to alternative secondary rewards, but usually counts as a fail condition for the ritual.
>>97863551Challenge him to a series of contests.Trick him into a confrontation on the Hero Plane where I, playing the role of Orlanth, reenact the slaying of Yelm with him as proxy, which inadvertently leads to a localized miniature Storm-Age.
Elmal turns up as a local variant of Yelmalio in A Darkness at Runegate.Which is about the best we can get.
>>97869133It just occurred to me that it could be as simple as Elmal's name being too similar to Eurmal.
>>97832773What is runequest like?
>>97874156Depends on the edition, and your DM.But broadly, it's more mythologically oriented than D&D, and most magic comes from spirits or gods.The world is a cube floating upon the primordial waters, the underworld is beneath, and the sky world is above, and outside that; primordial chaos.A few thousand years ago the Godtime ended due to a deific fuckup, and the gods and mortals were separated by The Great Compromise, which had to be made to keep Primordial Chaos out of the world.It's an old as fuck setting, and you will run into things that you recognize conceptually from Warhammer; know that Runequest, specifically the setting Glorantha did it first.That is - ripping off Moorcock's "Chaos" but less shamelessly, and also some feature creatures like "Broo" who's old metal miniatures were made by GW, and became the first line of Beastmen once that contract ended and the molds were repurposed.The company running Runequest right now is Chaosium; very woke people, and the current edition is sorta over-elaborate in the first releases, when Greg Stafford was still alive, then after he died I think the quality of products fell, and they began putting more overt woke shit in the books.Greg himself was a 20th century liberal, not a woke.I'd get the reprint of "Runequest Classic" myself.Glorantha really is a great world and RQ a great system, and it has decades of detailed materials to explore.
>>97874941>That is - ripping off Moorcock's "Chaos" but less shamelessly, To be fair, so did D&D. Elric was huge back then and Moorcock is in Appendix N if I remember right. D&D just added some Poul Anderson spice to alignment stuff, while Runequest went straight to Moorcock. But yeah I do agree that Warhammer got Chaos stuff filtered through Runequest first, considering they were literally publishing Runequest in the UK.>and also some feature creatures like "Broo" who's old metal miniatures were made by GW, and became the first line of Beastmen once that contract ended and the molds were repurposed.I also think broo are way cooler than beastmen, but I'm just not a warhammer guyAnother thing I think Warhammer got from Runequest is dwarves with guns, but I'm not entirely sure.
Isn't RQG also compatible with the first two RQ editions?
>>97879217>>97879220Warhammer also loves making everything big and gruesome, I prefer the generic stereotypical broo: some goat headed man in normal armor. Feels more menacing, like running across a wild animal while walking in the woods and it staring at you, because you know what they're capable of doing.
>>97879220Not entirely, I think the main RQ gamebook has conversion rules. Something about hit locations or armor was the main difference, iirc.
>>97839654I think it comes down to just Yelmalio coming first. Didn't Elmal first appear in King of Dragon's Pass? He probably is just seething over secondaries engaging with and trying to exert control over the setting, but it's a losing battle since Elmal is just cooler than Yelmalio.
>>97833247My understanding was that the Gods of Glorantha books have just been cancelled so we will be seeing no more from that line. >>97834047Not terrible, not very good, not really anything to really pull new players into the setting. Sold poorly from what I understood and the developer pretty much abandoned it soon after release. >>97864478Make sure to check out the Six Ages games if you enjoy KoDP. They are made by the same guys and are pretty much the Prequels to KoDP. Six Ages 2 is probably the best in the series.
>>97882015I believe Cults will resume once RQ lite has been released, but given how much of a trainwreck RQG publishing schedule has been since 2018, nothing is guaranteed.Again, I don’t understand what the fuck Jeff is doing with RQ - starting with the 2 -> 10 Cult books when anything RQ-related is already difficult to sell.
>>97880221I think Elmal is just the rallying point of people who appreciated that weird era of Greg going full anthropological mysticism with a myriad of alts and sub-cults for each god, and Jeff just hate the thane on principle because he thinks a ‘simpler’ Glorantha would sell more.
>>97880221I don't get it. Six Ages came out just a few years ago and they didn't seem to change anything to emphasize Yelmalio over Elmal. If he really didn't like it why didn't he mandate a change?
>>97882015Also, Six Ages 2 has a great take on flesh man/ginna jar and the end of the world, back before the lifebringers quest.
>>97883356He wasn’t involved.David Dunham has a long history in the fandom (he had his own Gloranthan fanzine, back in the 90s), and I think he negotiated the rights to use the setting directly with Greg. I believe Greg’s name was associated with A sharp legal status, not sure if it has changed since his death ?
>>97883396No, my mistake : Jeff is credited as consultant on both episodes of 6 Ages.
Even with the Elmal erasure, I take consolation in the fact that thanks to Six Ages 3 being cancelled, the duology we have is the biggest, most blatant Elmal epic in the entire Glorantha canon.In the first game you follow a culture wholly dedicated to him, and the second game is beat by bear a retelling of Elmal Guards the Stead upgrade to a cosmic scale, bringing you right to the end of the world and its rebirth. Like, what the fuck Yelmalio or even Orlanth got in comparison? I really hope that Jeff is aware of this forever and ever.
>>97880221Elmal came out of the game Greg was runnignabout the KoDP era of Sartar being founded. The notes were used verbatium for Hero Wars/Heroquest.Thereby Elmal goes from being a historic thing to being a modern thing.
Not getting SA3 means we never get to see the Jeralong Dynasty and how the cultural fusion of Rider/Wheel-Orlanthi/Pelorians spin off into weird groups.
>>97879217The unicorn headed one makes me think it's supposed to represent Ralzakarks And that tapir looking guy looks like a Morokanth thrown into the broo batch
Runequest has elves, aldryamiDwarves, the mostaliDurulz were made to fill the hobbit niche in Glorantha, but as ducksWhat are the orc equivalents? The evil chao rape goats like the broo? Or the tapir guys who can remove sentience from humans and enslave them?
>>97883505those games made me a Elmal worshipper
>>97883505I never bought Six Ages 1 or 2.I was afraid of what Nu-Chaosium's writing and art departments were gonna do to it, and some of the initial feedback gave me cold feet.
>>97885199nah man. It feels like old chaosium. except one-two events
>>97885206>One or two eventsI got personal reasons to be sussy about 'em, since it was before they came out I had an argument with the developers about some content in the equipment book, but this was thoroughly discussed in previous editions of /rqg/
>>97885233dont think they had much to do with the vidya
>>97885199If it makes you feel better it's not Nu-Chaosium who wrote and made it. It's the original guys who did KoDP and it feels very much in the same boat.Honestly Six Ages 2 is probably the best thing to come out of the setting. >>97885047Trolls and tusk raiders. The morocanth don't really go around enslaving and removing the sentience from people anymore than the other Prax nomads go around enlightening animals. They just have a very bad reputation for being on the winning side of the survival covenant.
>>97886205Pretty sure there's some lore of them using magic to turn regular humans into animal ones.
>>97886561There is, but it's the exception not the rule. The community has generally got it in their heads that they are running around Prax snatching people and turning them into glorified mules. That's not supported by the lore. Their priests and equivalents have limited access to the rune magic that would allow them to do it as it reflects what happened in the Survival Covenant. Herd men are not people they are animals that look like humans.Remember that the other Prax tribes are able to remove the enlightenment from intelligent animals too, but they aren't really doing that either. (They could also return the intellect to their herd beasts but won't). And human equivalence intelligent animals do exist in Glorantha.
>>97886959Adding on to this the animal/ human divide in Glorantha is kind of fuzzy and not very well explored. If you were to speak to the Huschen people who are arguably the first people they would usually tell you that they are their totem animals and are also sometimes human. That there is no real difference. Their usual myths is that humanity eventually forgot that they were animals when they started listening to the Gods and adopting things such as agriculture and bronze working. They can still communicate just fine with their totem animals and sometimes with others too.
Orlanthi are Proto-Indo-Europeans
>>97893360Correct.
>>97893360They are Indo-European. Some mix of Mycenaen and Celtic. The Pure Horse People are more Proto-Indo-European.
>>97897505Correcter.
Can ghosts retain sorcery they knew in life? If so, can regular spirits learn it?
>>97899194Good question. I am skewed towards no. Westerners don't see ghosts and shades as true human souls, and they either ignore or are outright hostile towards the spirits. Sorcery is supposed to be this intellectual human achievement, mind over matter, expression of the will of the sorcerer, and spirits and ghosts don't really have it. The mindset of the sorcerer and that of a shaman are in direct opposition to each other
I don't know guys, having god learner philosophies, draconic mystic knowledge and arkati insights alongside orlanth powers doesn't sound like a good idea....
>>97886205Trolls aren't really inherently evil like orcs are usually characterized, not in Trollpak at least While at best broo are just shock troops for the Lunars
>>97900856Well, they aren't like, metaphysical transcendental evil at least, like a Chaos being.They're just mundane worldly natural evil; they're brutish, cannibalistic, sadistic and avaricious.These are traits that are traditionally considered Evil, but they are comprehensible, digestible, and can be dealt with inside the context of the social and natural order.Unlike beings from/infected by the stuff outside reality, that barge into creation inventing new crimes against nature as they go, and sprouting novel and heretofore unnamed appendages to commit them with.
I always thought Elmal was obviously an Orlanthicised version of yELMALio, and it's not like Gods can't have different aspects.Sure, Purists might go hard on insisting the Sun Domers have the primary authority on their deity but who cares what sun-tribe wackos think? Obviously they'd deny that he left them for the superior tribe, but that's cope.
>>97886959I always liked the idea that the Morocanth are the least likely of the Prax tribes to actually eat the herdmen, and only do so for ritual reasons. Praxians don't eat their own herds, they raid the other tribes so that they can eat theirs.
>>97902949It would be more interesting if Jeff was to accept that people are unlikely to just accept that their interpretation of their god is wrong. There should be both a Elmal and Yelmalio cult in Satar with doctrinal disagreement about who is right. It's not like it would be the first time the setting has a God who has changed it's role (Grandfather Mortal/ Daka Fal) or who is understood differently by different groups (Entekos). >>97904627My understanding is that they sell far more herd men meat than they eat themselves. Something that probably horrifies outsiders to the region when they learn they ask what's in the stew. For Praxians there is no issue in eating herd men.
>>97904676It's not even that their interpretation of their god has to be wrong per se. Glorantha is possibly the premier setting in which two things can be true at once.
Is current RuneQuest actually woke or are people just shitposting? I'm interested in getting into it but I would like to know if they're trying to push some kind of agenda.
>>97910540That highly depends on your definition of "woke". There's stuff in it that would offend people with "traditional values (tm)" (trans people are canon).On the other hand, it also has stuff that offends SJWs.
>>97912185>it also has stuff that offends SJWsNot really saying much.
>>97912185>There's stuff in it that would offend people with "traditional values (tm)"Not really saying much.
>>97912394>>97912420>Not really saying much.That's because grifters on both sides are willing to complain about nearly everything.
>>97910540Everyone has their own metric on whatever the fuck that means, especially on this place. The other anon is right. There's stuff people I see people call woke in other games but have been in RQ since day 1. Female warriors on the cover is a common motif even up to the Avalon Hill days, women with beards are in the lore, "trolls are people too". I think the closest to egregious change is the lore of the broo originally being spawned by Thed as revenge for her rape to being her children who later go tainted by Chaos like her. But broo are still disease ridden monsters who procreate through rape and love sadism. They don't say "these SODOMITES love RAVAGING you with their STD RIDDEN RAPIST COCKS and IMPREGNATE YOU WITH THEIR BASTARD SPAWN", but the message is still very clear what they love to do(RAPE) and why you should either stay away(BROO LARVAE BURSTING FROM YOUR BODY) or kill them on sight if you can. There's this blog I've been reading by a RQ grog and that seems to be the only thing he noticed too, overall he was positive about everything else.
>>97914938There's also some Lunar Empire apologia that RQG likes to engage in sometimes, but if you think that's woke I don't know what to tell you. And it's also some stuff that's been around for decades, allegedly when British fans started contributing Glorantha's lore iirc. I actually like the influences on a lot of the new art, it makes sense when you think about how someone like Orlanth isn't really Thor, he isn't Zeus either, because he's actually both, because he is also Indra, he's THE storm father deity. Another thing I'm stealing from the grog. There's still Nordic and Roman style art too
>>97910540They expanded and focused more on the orlanthi "other genders" these past few years, and while it's quite annoying given that they are openly treating it as a counterpart of real tranny shit, it isn't as bad as it could be.
>>97910540The closer you're related to the almighty holy sun, the whiter and blonder you are. All women recieve magic specifically for lighting cooking fires and you can buy slaves. Is it woke because of all the people of color(blue)? Those guys are also mostly slaves.>>97915045I like to present the lunar empire as being on the wrong side of a conversion speech from a naruto or steven universe type, a la Beat-Pot.
>>97915045Honestly the Lunars are pretty 1:1 with wokeism, their whole deal is about the same kind of power pragmatism that doesn't care about evil so long as it benefits them and their oppressive regime
>>97915881Very British indeed
Here's my Aldryami
>>97915919ValidElves can be green but also D&D people (RQ2) or tree-people that happen to be mobile (deep lore Stafford and Jeff).
For all of Jeff’s comments that the Kitori are dead, having been wiped out and enslaved by the Sun Domers. And the reference to the being replaced with trolls.A Darkness at Runegate still mentions them as a Darkness-worshipping Orlanthi people. So while we probably won’t get the triple-shapechangers, they still might be there.
>>97834047lost six ages 3 to this utter slop
>>97879217Another thing Glorantha created did first was dragonewts, which Japan enjoyed enough that they appear hear and there in anime and other mediaI only bring this up because whoever wrote https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dragonewt doesn't seem to have ever learned that order.
Do morocanth milk herdwomen?
>>97864478It's the only good thing to come out of the Glorantha IP.
>>97918155Yeah, but they normally find it gross, since Morocanth have six nipples on their bellies.
>>97832836>>97832931>>97839654Seriously? But he is the Loyal Thane. He is Wingman: The God. How can anyone hate him? Not care for him sure, but hate seems a little much.
If someone is worried about something being woke, Glorantha is the wrong setting.
>>97916348Kitori are not slaves anymore. they removed the Helots because thats offensive.
>>97918887Correct, because it's quite woke.
>>97918887It's a "worry" that's kinda hard not to giggle at. Obviously different to how things are annoyingly done nowadays, ie the concern being getting good boy points. But at its core, it's a setting made by 60's college kid fascinated by pre-Christian religions, not a Midwestern Jehovah's Witness convert. It's like getting mad at spotting 70's George Lucas' sympathies for the Vietnamese or something, which honestly is what the Satar vs Lunar conflict reminds me of personally.
>>97918887>>97919841The trouble with this sentiment is that Glorantha isn't woke. It has some representation and nations of empowered matriarchs for example, but their power is tied to the divinity of motherhood and not the vicious anti-natalism of modern leftism.Hell, the setting's most iconic villains are the progressive accept-everyone faction.
there are some things here and there. Like the griffin plateu adventure one of the potential earth wives is someone who seemlessly transitions between all genders. continiously. even though clothing is supposed to be gendered.and if you read the guide to glorantha you will notice how often the fluf text to images eagerly point out that there are both men and women among the warriors in the image, even in images were it is clearly only men.the problem is tha there are for sure many progressives (bluehairs) in chaosium today and their type fundamentally cannot agree to the divine male and female duality.
>>97921114>how dare the folks at chaosium not adhere to outdated retarded ideologies glorantha was never fro you anon.It was for the liberal and progressive university student that liked history and mythology and wanted to participate in an epic instead of graverobbing his way social relevancy and a position of power
>>97921149you talk like a Lunar
>>97921114>divine male and female dualityEven Orlanth has a feminine aspect.
>>97921149>glorantha was never fro youI think your interpretation of Greg's beautiful, fantastical bronze age world is deeply flawed because you can't help but see it through your modern lens - and i'm sad for you.
>>97921201anon how much do you know about glorantha? there are the arthurian lands that are early medieval, many lands are in the iron age in term of technology etc.The setting isn't bronze age, it's mythic age and uses most of the popular european and near east civilisations as basis for it's cultures.It's the quintessential "i read mythology and found these cultures cool and so i will mash them all in one setting".If you don't appreciate mythology for the sense of wonder it evokes and you want your neotraditional values in a fake bronze age setting glorantha isn't actually for you>>97921184the Lunara are probably the coolest in the setting
>>97921260Don't preach now. I grew up with Glorantha.I acknowledge that you're somewhat clever - maybe 110 IQ or so - but I can plainly recognise that you shift your tactics shamelessly, referencing whatever's most convenient in the moment for your preconceived notions of how the setting ought to be.In one breath, you condemn the traditional high fantasy heroism of delving ruins for treasure, conveniently ignoring the existence of Pavis. In the next you mention those civilisations on the periphery of the setting that more resemble traditional fantasy fare because you think it's a "dunk" to pretend that Glorantha isn't a bronze age setting.I commend you on your Lunar LARP, but your representation in this setting is the Broo.
>>97921280>In one breath, you condemn the traditional high fantasy heroism of delving ruins for treasurehow is original dnd traditional exactly? how many myths are about gravecrawling for loot?it is oldschool as a theme in rpgs but that's as far as it goesi dont mention them because they resemble traditional fantasy. i mention them because the era which is depicted in the setting is based entirely on when their most important and resonant myths lie. That's why it's the arthurian legends for the fake brits for example, while for the Mediterraneans it's the iron age and for others the bell beaker europeans it's the iron age.AKA the most mythical era for each civilisation.Glorantha is as much a bronze age setting as much dnd is a medieval one and i dont mean that as a dunk on the setting. I quite like it because faux mythology is cool.It isn't a setting about representing modern western traditional protestant christian values into ancient cultures or talking like the nature of sex and sexuality as well as the position of genders hasn't always been fluid in the history of humankind.You are as bad as the sjws that dont want slavery in pseudohistorical settings because it's bad and the us progressives still have somewhat of a shore spot over it
>>97921364Your shifting form will avail you naught with me.I know your secret, deceiver. You are empty inside.
>>97921676He comes from a milieu that does not speak conventional language.In his mouth, words are only tools to affect the desired outcome.
>>97921677Exhausting, but we don't fight Chaos because it's easy.
>>97910540They've added troon stuff that wasn't there before mostly dealing with Heler/Orlanthi trannies which is constant in 3rd party adventures but still gets mentioned in core.If you try and use something shills push like Six Seasons or Red Cow you are going to find troon character holy cows that can do no wrong and are better at being women than actual women.They've revised the peoples tons of times to make them less white though the art shifts back and forth on this and they keep blathering on about how the Orlanthi are actually persians/x/y group without any support in the books they publish, 99.9% of content say "Extra Tribal Norsemen but..". Same with the Lunars not being Romans. It's so trite because you can go and read his original campaigns (which show Greg was a hyper-railroader who ran quite shitty games btw) where he outright cites the norse sagas that inspired both the Orlanthi and the very game Runequest to begin with, Grettir's Saga.And if you try to discuss things on their official forums expect handwringers to go on about how Greg was bad because he had the male gaze and his writing of women was badwrong for actually liking women as women. They'll quickly skim over that Greg spent the 60s chummmying up to open child rapists like the Zimmer-Bradleys, which he never disavowed, though.Other than that the setting is fine.I actually think the bigger issue, moreso than all that annoying crap, is that the setting is surprisingly underbaked for actual gaming.Most of it isn't developed at all and the parts that are either have a 'history' but very little present defined or pretty much say you have to be a local herdsman doing nothing but internal clan politics or you have no place there.Even the Gods are surprisingly weak on specifics outside of the major few.For instance there's very little practical material on actually running a heroquest and what tertiary material exists is mostly narrativist railroad crap.
>>97921788>very little practical material on actually running a heroquestA perennial frustration.It's not even concretely defined whether it's an astral-projection spirit quest or an endeavour in the real world that you perform while borderline possessed by your deity.
>>97921788Tbh, the entire Science Fiction and Fantasy Writers of America (SFWA) are inculcated in the Breendoggle affair, and that started back in the 60's.Left wing geeks turning out to be seedy nonces is nothing new.
>>97921415Based slayer of the Teller of Lies
>>97921676>The whole point of tradition is that it's a continuum, an inherited legacy.So is Confucianism and then you have neoconfucionism in the 15th century Traditionalism involves a lot of larping and approximations
>>97920956The trouble with the sentiment is that there's 20 million definitions of what woke is to different people. So someone won't find Stafford woke because he was a guy from the 70's, while someone else will disagree because college hippies are still woke to themYou find the Lunars woke because they have matriarchs, I personally don't find the Lunars woke because they're an expansionist empire. Kids who played Runequest in the 70's and 80's either saw the USSR or the USA in Vietnam in them. Which desu, shows the Rorschach test that is Glorantha RQG still has broo rape in the Bestiary, and you have have slaves in Weapons and Equipment. That doesn't sound woke. They also say slavery is bad but Bronze Age slavery was different than our view of slavery. Is that woke? To someone, who knows. I think the broo lore change is kinda cringe, that's woke in my mind. Someone like Varg doesn't like Glorantha's view of mythology unsurprisingly, but also likes that Greg Stafford was a white guy. At a certain point you just gotta sit back and let people come to their own conclusion.
>>97925214It's less that there's "twenty million definitions" - the symptoms are clear; postmodern deconstructionist language, victim hierarchy dominance struggles, the weaponized language of "compassion" and "safety", there are many tells.It's a hydra though, and it manifests in many forms, which is why it is important to identify the underlying ideology, which is essentially, a form of implicit marxism, "Cultural" Marxism that is.
Giant Floppy Broo Cock....
>>97925745Petersonian
>>97925971Giant Floppy Broo Cock(Female)
>>97834047They would have been better off chasing trends and slapping together some kind of orlanthi farmslop game. Now with grazelander slave dlc!
>>97926250female broo do happen sometimes
>>97925114AKA Wewussing if other people are doing it.
>>97926630They do, though relatively rarely and iirc live isolated. Considering most broo are mishmash nonsense of generations of interspecies rape, chances are one could look like a vaguely human goat girl, I know they do pop up with human faces sometimes And yeah I do realize I'm basically reverse engineering satyr, who do exist in Glorantha and probably get mistaken for broo and accidentally killed. But they're not as fun as broo okay
>>97921673>You disagree with me? You're against Israel!I guess the LARP nation would be insulted the most
>>97918155Better question. Do you think human men with little fears nor moral quarrels sneak into Morokanth camps and do the herdswoman version of sheep shagging? No? Just curious.
>>97926964>picIsn't that basically what Lunars do to them through illumination?
>>97925214>there's 20 million definitions of what woke isNo, Woke is easily defined but the followers of that psychopathic doctrine like to play definitional games to try and escape responsibility for the horrors that they inflict on the world in the name of "progress.">You find the Lunars woke because they have matriarchsIncorrect, if you read my post again you might see I was using Esrolia as an example of something that a Bluehair would probably claim as woke despite not understanding that it's antithetical to their antihuman doctrine.>expansionist empireBeing an expansionist empire is entirely compatible with being woke. Woke tries to push their doctrine everywhere. They seek to dominate, to oppress, until "their truth" is the only acceptable one. In this way, the advocates of woke are extremely imperialist - and they deceptively claim to do it in the name of "love, progress and equity" - almost an exact copy of the Lunar "We are all us" doctrine.>VargI don't know him, so I couldn't comment. I just like my tabletop games and hate when they're infiltrated and ruined by whiny political activists.>let people come to their own conclusionThey always do. Nobody can make you do anything.Laying out the facts helps people to come to better conclusions.
>>97927040>>there's 20 million definitions of what woke is>No, Woke is easily defined but the followers of that psychopathic doctrine like to play definitional games to try and escape responsibility for the horrors that they inflict on the world in the name of "progress."20 million and 1, now.
>>97927051Please engage your brain. That was commentary, not a definition.
>>97927056>Please engage your brain.I have plenty of thoughts, but I really do not want to derail this thread in a conversation/argument that will do nothing but waste bumps and change neither of our minds at all. Even you definition would include certain things that many people would get angry at for calling woke, ironically except someone like Varg. There's literally nothing more I can say. Herdwomen milking is healthier to a thread than this.
>>97926964Nah probably they look like a female broo. aka, any other animal is their "mother".What their stance on rape is or how their pregnancies work, however, is a mystery.
>>97927070As I predicted, you cannot admit you are wrong.
>>97927083I'm sure you've predicted a lot of things. You're free to think them.
>>97927089
>>97927071The possibilities are arguably endless with these things.
>>97927040>Woke tries to push their doctrine everywhere. They seek to dominate, to oppress, until "their truth" is the only acceptable one. In this way, the advocates of woke are extremely imperialist - and they deceptively claim to do it in the name of "love, progress and equity"Christian colonialism is woke
>>97927195No, just because woke is culturally chauvinist doesn't mean that every culturally chauvinist movement is woke. I understand how someone might make that elementary mistake but I suspect that you are simply arguing in bad faith.
who let /pol/tards in? actually remind me why posting offtopic /pol/ bullshit doesnt get you automatically banned in tg?
>>97927283there are no mods anymore
>>97927265I was verifying the 'eregeshi helots aren't Canon anymore' claim and this British faggot is one of the moderators of an old thread in which Jeff says they no longer are. A guy was trying to keep the lore consistent and this British cigarette just drops a ' slavery is uncomfortable to a modern audience line". Check his profile and he lives in fucking london of course. " Have fun pressing natives" he says smarmily to a guy saying it's retarded to retcon that. God i wish those islands sank.
>>97927345It makes perfect sense for the Sun Domers to have a Worker Class supporting their Martial Exceptionalism, and it's arguably not even a bad deal for the helots."Slavery Bad" displays such a lack of nuance and understanding of the material.
What I would really like from Chaosium (other than them to give us some actually playable stuff like heroquesting etc and clean up the rules) is to focus on some other area of the map other than Dragon Pass for a book or two. Tell us what happens in the West or North West. I've had enough of Satar and Prax.
>>97927617give us heroquest rules
>>97927631>Be 40 year old game.>Still wont give basic mechanics or guidelines for the iconic feature that is literally the title of the game.>Won't even mention heroquesting in the newist edition core rulebook.>Wonder why the game has such difficulty maintaing a foothold with new players.>Fix with 11 more encyclopedic books about the settings cults.
>>97927617>>97927642To play Devil's Advocate for a second, once you're capable of Heroquesting you're arguably "beyond" the ability of a system to accurately model.Being a powerful runelord or priest could be seen as a win condition the same way becoming a significant member of landed high nobility is in Pendragon.But yeah, it's weird that they don't even put out guidelines about this stuff.
>>97927668Yeah it's a bit of an issue with the current ruleset. They are pretty grounded and the PC are very mortal and fragile. There is very much a hard ceiling on what you can play in the current edition. You will never get to the level of Kallyr or Argrath by playing it.But I would argue that you don't have to be a capital H hero to Heroquest. Tribal initiations, rites in sacred time, heroquesting without crossing over to an otherworld, even minor heroquests all count. They aren't all emulating the long lightbringers quest. Which you will almost certainly fail or curse everyone around you if you aren't a group of 'Heros' or have the full backing of powerful groups. The act of becoming a Hero itself pretty much requires to person to have successfully Heroquested several times or be able to Heroquest without following a predetermined path. I can understand the confusion however as they never actually bother to give guidelines as to what heroquesting is.
>>97927631Once you are ready to run a heroquest, you will realise that you never needed specific rules for them.The Hero Planes/Godtime are more fluid than the world of Glorantha.As a result, I run them by more GM fiat: there was a time when I was well read on Gloranthan myths and freshly revised, so it was easy enough for me to run a handful of heroquests by ear.To run a heroquest by ear, the GM must understand the story on a thematic/symbolic level, and the key attributes of the deific or spirit entities involved.Traditionally the reward for completion of a heroquest should be thematic with the terms of success, or the abilities of the god, and the failure penalty likewise.It's no different to running a dreamlike adventure in an illusory landscape, where you temporarily gain appropriate powers depending on how well you roleplay your assigned part.
>>97927722cool story bro. But most gamers want game rules.
>>97927722The problem is at no point do the games even begin to approach what it is or how to do it. They are reliant on you digging up 30 year old email exchanges or material which has been out of print before most of the people in the hobby were born.Most of this could be resolved with a simple chapter in a book. The corebook or a major source book. And a simple guideline on how to initiate, structure and reward such an act with the understanding that if the GM has a better idea they should run with that. Such a core aspect of the setting and play loop shouldn't be ignored.
>>97927745You already have all the rules.What, you don't understand how to apply a temporary God-buff in a percentile system?You just add a hundred percent to your relevant skill, since whatever you're engaged in mythic struggle with, will also be a superhuman entity.Handling skills over 100% is as simple as adding your excess over 100 to your opponent's roll, and if both are still over 100, you add the runover from the opponent's opposing skill, from your roll likewise.Bam, that gives you a workable scale.Once you come outta the Godtime, most of your God buffs evaporate, leaving a remnant as your permanent reward for the Heroquest.Like, duh.Are you even an rpg gamer?
>>97927757Buy KODP on steam, it has an ingame myth library and you literally walk through them.Of course, everybody has played KODP.You could just warez a copy of The Book of Heortling Myths, or any of the other colour paper volumes.I believe they were being reprinted though.
>>97927780I get what you're saying, but it highlights the problem. I'm not looking for how to do it, I have a pretty good idea of how to run my own. The problem is that it should be foundational information. The solution to onboarding new players/ GMs is not to send them to play a 25 year old game in another medium. Things like The Book of Heortling Myths are not sold anywhere outside a obscure part of their own site and nothing in the current editions direct you towards that. Most people won't even know it exists. They don't even describe what heroquesting is so how would new people know to look up a book of in setting myths.
>>97927755>mods take the invaders sideI hate it, this is literally Blackmoor's Rule of Sartar all over again.
>>97927845Well, what did you expect from Tranny Janny?
>>97927834Eh, that's Chaosium's problem.I can onboard people just fine, but I'm not onboarding them into Chaosium's system is all.They give me the ick.
My people settle in Dragon Pass. In honour of the thread theme, we chiefly venerate the deities who came to us from the Sun-Tribe - Elmal and Chalana Arroy. We stood with our living deity to fight the Darkness, learning the ways of war and earning the enmity of trolls.After the Lightbringers succeeded, we lent our magic to reawakening Issaries in the hopes that the God of Communication would help us coexist with our Orlanthi kin despite the difference in our Ways.If anybody has spare magic for our first Sacred Time in this strange new land, we will be grateful for any prayers for our success.
>>97928080It didn't take long before we were approached by a prophet, who set us about the task of Tribe-making.Assembling a moot of our near neighbours, we formed the Kultain tribe, the process eased by gifts of cattle drawn from those careless enough to feud with us.Not to slight Orlanth after he gave our quester his blessing for tribe-making, we decided to take our God's role of loyal thane in the selection of the first King. As such, we supported the mightiest of the Orlanthi clans to lead us: The Gorinds.
We've had a tough few years, our chief died attempting the rites of Kingship - and then we had a couple of failed Heroquests.Nice to know the ancestors are still proud of us.
>>97832773Woke game woke setting. Everyone who likes it is a faggot in denial at best, just a plain faggot usually.
>>97931408kys
>>97832773Bump
