What's the deal with neuroshima? I have the board game but it's apparently also a RPG setting.
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>>98060920
>>98060863Its Pierogi Cyberpunk v3 without the GreyGoo and Doll artNot to be confused with Baguette Cyberpunk v3 with the GreyGoo and Bandes Dessinées art
>>98061779It's more like pierogi Gamma World than Cyberpunk, for the most of it, though scattered with the occasional Zone Where Everything Is Cyberpunk or Zone of Knockoff Mega-City One. Random post-apoc kitchen sink mishmash setting.
>>98061779It's postapo, not cyberpunk. It has some cyberpunk elements like implants but few and far between.>>98060863It's basically a postapo mash-up of everything the authors thought was cool at the time (Fallout, Mad Max, Terminator and so on) so it's all over the place. Just a big postapo sandbox. I don't think people here would like it much.
>>98061807yeh, Pierogi Cyberpunk v3 without the GreyGoo and Doll art
Pierogi postapo Cyberpunk where there's big MOLOCH, AI that wants to destroy humanity
>>98060863It's a shit game that doesn't work mechanically and was written by the guy who made pic related first (in fact, it's pic related, but in post-apo)The setting is all over the place, the rules make no sense and a chargen provides you character incapable of basic tasks and with life-destroying disabilities in 99% of casesThis game, combined with Monastyr (ALSO by the same guy), pretty much almost killed Polish RPG scene, and the scars left behind are itching to this dayEventually nobody actually was running Neuro, but it was a shorthand for "i'm running my own homebrew that is in post-apo"tl;dr it's 10/shite
>>98062785Thank God almost nobody in Poland is treating this crap seriously anymore (at least from my experience), but it seriously baffles me how on Earth did it manage to catch on in the first place, it has always been ridiculous even with Polish national penchant for misery porn taken into account.
>>98062895It's simple:Magia i Miecz wrote about it (at least the early articles)Portal not only was writing about it, they build their entire early identity on it (given Trzewiczek was the owner)Trzewiczek himself was constantly wanking this shit on each and every con (and back then, it wasn't 3-4 big cons per yer, it was "regional con in random small town every weekend")Add to this the fact it is enabling the worst kind of shit as "no, you are actually great GM", and you have instant recipe for successAdd to this era-specific (not just Polish, global) edgelordism for extra impactAdd to this that internet was just picking up and Poles were juuuust slowly learning en masse that there are other options than what MAG, Portal and Copernicus are printing and other game styles than the ones they've been cooking, and you have a perfect bubble.It's basically a perfect storm of random factors that made Trzewiczek a prophet of a new religion, with entire army of overzealous neophytes this crap was enabling to have a sway and get accepted in the scene.Reminder that polter originally started as a voice of reason (sic!) against JG and JG-adjecant shit
>>98062932Trzewiczek is STILL wanking this shit to this day.It's like this guy is autistic and not in the good sense, with perpetual arrested development leaving him forever stuck somewhere in early 2002.I remember a panel with him on the Kraków gaming con 3 editions ago (so the 2024 one), where he was so fucking out of touch with not just what's in games or how they've changed since early 00s, but even in terms of "his" era, he was coming off as unhinged. Like he had his own head universe and reality that nothing and nobody could shake or affect in any way. It was like asking questions to a concrete block and people were just fucking confused if the guy is ok or maybe high or something.But what's worse is that he's in complete and utter denial on how badly he mangled Polish RPG scene. Not even on level "I refuse to take responsibility", but "what responsibility?"It's basically>Destroy nation-wide gaming scene>Refuse to elaborate>Leaves
The hex board game is pretty great though, at least was I haven't kept up with all the newer expansions. I liked the setting as teenager, fun post-apocalypse kitchen sink, not really my scene these days though and yeah I don't think anyone has ever managed to tardwrangle the system itself to work.
>>98063024I always find it amazing on so many levels>Neuroshima starts as "fuck you" to the guys that creator worked on Neuropunk, basically a mockbuster of unreleased game>It's shit, and that's being diplomatic about it>But Trzewiczek, being insane weirdo he is, decides to make it a franchise>Makes pretty much everything with it short for licensing it for books and a movie>Of all of those projects, by sheer "infinite monkeys htting infinite keyboards", Neuroshima Hex! comes to life>It's good enough to prop up the "franchise" for the next 20 years, salvage the company and make Trzewiczek rich>Third of Portal foreign releases are games re-packaged into Neuroshima, but Neuroshima Hex! in particularAnd the joke is - Poles barely play Hex!, because it was a success for outside markets and the game didn't pick up in Poland till like mid-00s, where zoomers unaffected by Neuro the RPG started to play HEX
>>98063042>mid-00s>zoomersLe wut?
>>9806304610s, typo
>>98063042>It's good enough to prop up the "franchise" for the next 20 years, salvage the company and make Trzewiczek richCan you genuinely get even somewhat rich just by making a moderately successful board game? I was always under impression that 99% of them are basically hobby projects that at best can get you some extra cash on the side, but not enough to even get by just from that
>>98063124Given how founders of board game publishers have gone on to become Private Equity investors? Yes.I would imagine Christian Peterson, Jeremy Stegmaier, and the people who founded Filosofia, Zman Games games, Days of Wonder (and took a buyout from Asmodee) are comfortably wealthy.However, I would wager that the majority of designers are just nerds with no business sense that have day jobs.
>>98063124Let me do a very short recap on Trzewik and his company, Portal>1999, autistic weirdo who's into games and has massive ego starts Portal publishing house>Focuses on TTRPG, has his own trend-setting magazine (financial failure), tries to develop two RPG games (financial failures) and a handful of ill-thought and poorly designed board-games (financial failures)>Of all those products, Neuroshima is the only thing to almost break even (still a financial failure, but prevents the company from dying here and now in 2003)>Basically a beggar with self-build claim of imprtance and inprint on the hobby and the scene, FUCKING LYING TO HIS OWN WIFE about their finances, funding everything from his dwindling savings>Still keeps going, still tries to prop himself, to at least not go bankrupt for real>Cuts whatever he can to stay afloat, including Portal magazine>One of the "throw shit on wall and see what sticks" is Neuroshima HEX>Game is functional by pure chance>Game gets published abroad by pure chance>It makes more money than any other Portal product ever since>The company figures out at this point that almost all their games are shit and that's the actual reason why they are unprofitble>They invest HEX profits into buying licenses for foreign games>Fast forward few years>Portal is one of the biggest board game publishers in Poland, 90% of their titles are just licensed gamesThink about the guy as a home-grown John Wick (the gaming one), except autistic and without yellow fever fetish, instead being into scat and humiliationAnd just like his initial "success" with JG was a random chance, so is his eventual actual success - but just as being the middle man selling games of others
>>98063178>>98063498I see, so basically the formula for success is setting up a functional publishing and production company, getting a product that's at least successful enough to give you some profit to work with and then just focusing on publishing instead of game design
>>98063498I don't have that much hate for the guy (but I also was never too much into ttrpgs, nor did I attend the cons, so I was never part of the community). I don't even think all their games are that bad, I think og Stronghold was flawed but nice (I think they basically butchered the game of all tis charm for rerelease), Imperial Settlers and Robinson Crusoe were pretty fucking successful (I have particular fondness of RC as the only coop game I could ever stomach). I liked Theseus too. But I also would like to add that part of guy's successes definitely came from building network ( his magazines, being shilled by Rebel a lot, at the time biggest and possibly even first big board games webstore in the country), attending and doing a lot of his cons an d in general just always striving to be in the spotlight. It's hard for me to argue whether this is deserved success or not, I don't really have strong feelings about him either way.
>>98063534>>98063566Yeah. Also for context, his company has been behind local editions of most of these flavor of the year, "boxes full of plastic"-style CMON games like Blood Rage, Rising Sun, Cthulhu (not WArs, the other one), and while from what I heard CMON is basically bankrupt now and the craze is gone, this sort of thing was a really good meal ticket until about covid times.
>>98063534The formula to success is to corner the market.Polish successful gaming companies>MAGThey were basically first to do this shit in an organised, dedicated manner, publishing a metric fuckload of RPGs (some games never got editions after the ones published by MAG), along with a newbie-friendly, but also very opiniated magazine, Magia i MieczSource of success: trailblazer + massive marketing by their own magazineMain success: identifying best products that are already in demand and delivering them (WFRP + CoC); everything after those was just a slide of increasing failures>RebelA gaming store that was importing board games from outside. They were like many other such stores, but they've started relatively late (2003), but were first to put heavy focus on online ordering - people were buying "their" games via online order, they were buying that game abroad, delivering and you were receiving the product. This allowed them to cut costs to almost nothing, and dictate a mark-up they wante, without having a pile of unsold games.Source of success: very practical approach to distribution, basically biggest "library" of titlesMain success: using their sale data, focusing on the most popular titles and licensing to decrease their own costs>PortalA total failure ego-driven publisher that sucked and kept sucking... until they swallowed the bitter pill that they suck, right when they finally made some money and in euro, instead of PLN. That money was put into licensing games that were known for being good, but weren't translated into Polish yet. Cut down everything that wasn't profit. Ever since when designing their own games, applying relatively strict quality control and play-tests to not waste money like in their early days on badly designed games that then nobody buys>tbc
>>98063534>>98063594Source of success: random fucking chance, swallowing the hard pill, redirecting activity of the company to profit-driven projectsMain success: Targetting know franchises and games that are know as successful abroad, decent-to-good translation teamEveryone else is either a small fry, an incidental publisher or fucked themselves over and left the scene (MAG actually left RPG when the people behind RPG section of the publishing house simply "grew out" of them an they are now just a regular publisher of fantastical novels (so fantasy and sci-fi) from importBest example: Nasza Księgarnia is a children book publisher, who by accident get into board games and they lucked the shit out by publishing Quest for El Dorado, which became their top 5th or 6th product. And they are a company that prints school textbook, so imagine their own surprise. But despite their sheer gaming revenue, they are incidental for the scene at large
>>98063534Yes, although several of these "titans" did cut their teeth in game design and its what got them their original renown.Peterson has the Twilight Imperium games in his credentials, Stegmeyer has Viticulture and Scythe (and had another recent smash hit with Vantage in 2025).Even smaller indie companies that hit middle weight class saw their owners come from startup one man operations that still dabble in design (I'm thinking Level99 Games and Plaid Hat but I am sure there are others).So maybe you can start as a designer and work up, but thats not gonna butter your bread long term unless you are one of the guys in it for the love of the game with an all syar reputation like the good Doctor Reiner Knizia (pbuh).
>>98063534The easiest way to pull this shit is a KS scam.And it's an open secret since like 2015And despite what morons claim, a properly build KS operation is pure profit, regardless of anything (quality of the game included)
Lol, lmao. You can always count on angry Polish schizos dropping the truth nukes out of blue. I came here because Hex is one of my favourite boardgames and yet, here I am with all this deep lore about Trzewiczek being a cannibal and running a cabal that annihilated the RPG scene in Poland.
>>98064040It seems like it's nearly impossible to do something like a boardgame on KS anymore and actually make money.
>>98066925The guy has a very well established reputation among people older than 35 (so the majority of Polish RPG players) and it's a reputation of a combative and obtuse autist who genuinely doesn't get people might not only do, but like things differently than he does. And the best part? He actually brags himself about most of the stuff, like the anniversary material on Neuro or his book. Not in sense of "Trust me guys, this is what happened", but "Remember when I did that? I'm fucking proud of that and I'm awesome"
>>98067170Nta, but it's very, very easy to pull, as long as you aren't autistic. You need (in no particular order)- snappy theme or promise of lore- half decent visuals for initial presentation- a social media and/or reddit presence that creates traffic around the project- calibrating it either for pump-and-dump or theme (theme, not gaming) niche- if it's not a pump-and-dump, then you also need to know a thing or two about designing board games (but I'm talking bare basics)- knowing the actual prices of printing, shipping and tariffs (if they get involved) before you even start your project (which is basic research for the scheme)Then you just reel in idiots toward your empty hype and cheaply, but hand-made visuals (avoid AI at all cost), running a quasi pyramid-scheme. If you handle your astroturf right, you now have 300-400 backers one hour after the fundraiser started and you are set, the rest is just snowball and calibrating ahead prices, fake tiers and general measurementThe trick is always the same, doesn't matter if amateur or a professional board game publisher: you need to understand this is made for money, and money only. You need to arrange your prices and tiers in such a way that you are making AT LEAST 20% of the final sum as pure profit, after deducting all costs, fees, shipping and what not. Then the rest is just making sure it's hyped enough for the funding windowIf you aren't a moron - and you would be surprised how rare it is - you are going to get no more than 5%/30 boxes (whichever smaller) of extra copies of the game (plus in the process you make it a genuinely limited product, so FOMO is at full force) over the number of people who backed it and thus it's basically "you only get this game if you backed it". You don't have to storage excess, because there is virtually no excess, and any excess you can then set up on bogus online auctions for further inflation of pricetag
>>98068555And that assuming you are planning to publish the game and not stage any given difficulties with your printer in China or whatever, so you pocket anywhere between 30 to 50% of the funds raised without delivering anything substantialOh, and obviously - use a straw guy. Not "strawman", but the fall guy that's legally tied to the project instead of you.
>>98068555>knowing the actual prices of printing, shipping and tariffs (if they get involved) before you even start your project (which is basic research for the scheme)This is the problem. This shit is so highly variable right now that it ends up constantly fucking people over. Even if they are just "scammers." I don't think as many people as you think are somehow raking in the dough. We've seen a few relatively big operations which have turned out to be nothing more than what amounts to board game ponzi schemes, funding the last Kickstarter project with the proceeds from the current one, because the price of shipping and materials had increased between when they did their initial research and when it comes time to fulfill.
>>98068639>This shit is so highly variable right nowIt actually isn't.If you are American, you then are pulling the whole scheme within the US market.If you are not, you do not get involved with the US market.It's really that simple.>I don't think as many people as you think are somehow raking in the doughI'm a regular on a handful of board gaming cons. Something tells me you are the one who would be surprised, not the other way around, about how many people are raking in cash from half-assed, near-scam projects, along with actual scams.>Rest of the postAmericans are so fucking clueless... Or I'm just too Polish to understand your issues. Look mate, part of the trick is to not over-reach. And ALL you can think about is over-reaching.
>>98068706Alright, I'll admit ignorance, I don't know about the polish scam-board-game market. Maybe there are a ton polacks making fat Kickstarter dough on scam board games. It doesn't seem to be that way over here, though.
>>98068706>>98068743Or, wait, let me rephrase; my immediate reaction to your post is because, 9 times out of 10, when I see people complaining about scam Kickstarters, it always seems far more likely that the people running the Kickstarter are just really, absolutely shit at it, not that they are somehow getting mad rich behind the scenes. The Mythic games debacle is a prime example of this: shipping, ballooning materials costs, runaway stretch goals and eventually tariffs absolutely fucked them, not because they were secretly funding yachts, but because they were fundamentally retarded. From what I've seen, and take that as the biggest goddamn caveat on the planet, but from what I've seen, incompetence is faaaaaar more likely than maliciousness. Maybe there is an entire industry of b-tier, 100000 Kickstarter scam board games that I am unaware of. It's just that quite often I see the appellation of scam applied to things that are obviously bungled projects.
>>98068773>b-tier, 100000 Kickstarter scam board games 100000 *dollar*
>>98068743So, consider it a free advice:Part of what makes any con work is knowing the subject matter of the con. If you don't, you not only shouldn't be conning, but also shouldn't be in that business venture normally.With that in mind, take a wild guess why the majority of honest crowdfunded projects fail, while scammers get away with the payday and unless they really fumble big time, nobody even notices.>>98068773>it always seems far more likely that the people running the Kickstarter are just really, absolutely shit at itBecause they actually are, and that's my point here.An actual scam runs completely undetected and without much fanfare, since that's the point.The actual scam-build-but-actually-delivering project also goes without much fanfare, it's just that the game has an absurdly jacked up price that nobody sane would pay if they were to do it without the FOMO and the whole crowdfunding mentality
>>98068795>An actual scam runs completely undetected and without much fanfare, since that's the point.>true scamunism has never been tried lol
>>98068815>Missing the point on purposeGrab a (You) thenBut in case of you being simply clueless:A scam is a nothingburger, unassuming project that asks for some modest sum of money, looks presentable and has moderate-to-low online presence prior to crowdfudingThen it earns 5-10 k bucks and it disappears a month laterNobody talks about it, because the payday was low enough to fly below radar (it might actually be low enough to fly below legal radars, too)The guy it was all registered on turns out to be some drunk who got his cut for signing his name and ID to it for the purpose of legal and financial purposes, while the art was made by some art student who did it for a box of canned soup and a couple of billsMost people, including those who got fleeced, don't care enough, it's not a big deal case, and everyone moves on.But would you pull that with, say, 50-100 k (not to mention higher), and you have instant attention and massive shitstorm.
>>98068815Different guy, but also a Pole and from the top of my head, from last decade>The party game about collecting ingredients for a cakeover 12k PLN collected and disappeared>Arkona 2e RPGover 7k PLN collected and disappeared (and this one is a special case, because it was done by just talking about the project, so it cost nothing to set up)>SlawiaAlmost 70k PLN collected then disappeared, then detected, then threatened with a class action lawsuit by really pissed people, took 6 years to deliver in the end, the game is ofc shit an cost maybe fifth of the funds, while the insane idiots who supported it of course then buy two copies each (this is some next level of fleecing the gulible)>StworzeOver 300k PLN collected (so almost enough to buy an apartment), then delivering a game with a production value of about 10k (for the all copies) and ghosting people asking about the final resultWhich also shows the pattern: if you are looking for a mark, just propose something to the "SLAVIC POWAH! UGABUGA!" crowd.But my favourite one is always the scam around the Polish release of Sleeping Gods. This game originally was an overpriced drivel with notoriously low production value, but an excellent marketing for what was a choose your own adventure with a clunky combat system. So we have here already a scam-tier project that gets used to scam people down the line.All Polish release had to translate the story book, which runs for 80 pages, plus re-printing character cards in Polish.They asked 250k PLN for doing so. Collected 320k (!)Same with expansionThat's enough to buy a house with a gardenA professional translator, working for a court with all the legal credentials, would charge you something like 6-8k for that sort of job. And it was clear as day it was translated by someone who only so-so understands English, being a home-made translation instead.The people behind it basically set themselves for years by half-assing a translation of someone's else game
>>9806902170 or 300k is worth the hassle, but 7-12k is only like 2 months worth of regular wages and not even with a particularly high salary. To me it feels hardly worth the risk of potential legal trouble, especially since you still do need to put in some work and have at least a little bit of luck for this to succeed. Unless you really are a pro at these things and can pull them of safely and continuously.But then again I never particularly cared about money besides just having enough to get by, so maybe I simply don't have the "right" mindset to get this
>>98069021>Which also shows the pattern: if you are looking for a mark, just propose something to the "SLAVIC POWAH! UGABUGA!" crowd.Don't forget about Zerywia, because that was some next level shitstorm: a game made simply to not have to auction the house bought with the crowdfunding money (they've got almost a 1 mil of złotych, since they run three different crowdfunding campaigns for the same game) due to angry crowd demanding return of their investment, but not without ghosting people for 3 years first and a detective (a real one, not Rutkowski) tracking down the people who took the money and run.Which only gets funnier when the game sold so well, it had a reprint and in total earned them another half a mil in pure profit. But the drama was something pretty much everyone was observing with popcorn, while people from Zerywia fandom are to this day considered the most gullible idiots in Poland, given how long it took them to figure out they've been had.
>>98068868Oh shit you actually think its only a scam if its not very lucrative or if no one finds out. That's adorable. Scams that are poorly thought out and fail are still scams. In the same way you are poorly thought out and fail but are still posting.
>>98069057What is better - work for 2 months, or pocket the pay for 2 months? Especially when you do it with close to no effort or drama?That's the whole trick - you go for easy money, not big money. This isn't like a money laundering scheme or a bulk trade, where more = better. It's less trace = better, and thus sums that are average pay are the exact perfect target.The Arkona guy (assuming it was a guy) had just balls of pure brass to set up a fund-raiser on something that not only he didn't own, but something he didn't consult with people holding the copyright, and was gone before anyone started asking questions. In 2022, getting 7k for writing 2 pages of text and setting up 3 photos was breaking the bank, because that was more than average pay
>>98069095I never said or even implied that.I just listed what makes a difference between running a scam and being successful at it.What's adorable is that you still don't get it. It doesn't matter how much money the scam technically collects. It's how much money you are getting away with.
>>98069095>Can make some money and disappear without a trace>Can collect big money, but then the backers come knocking and you have to pay back and/or deliver the product, while you also get your name pinnedI don't see how this is a dilemmaThe point of hustling is to run a lot of hustles, not to do some "one big last job" like in the movies.I mean shit, we recently had a really old-school case, where a bank teller was running a scam on taking out what was in the 4th digit after the decimal. It's basically a rounding error anyway, but still used in banking, but it's only up to 3 digits after the point that really "counts".But she stole this way slightly over 1.5 million across 7 years of a money that only existed on paper. She only got caught, because the bank changed the owner and there was a throughout audit. Should she leave before the change of ownership, they would be chasing a ghost, as it would be impossible to pin it to her.
>>98069168>>98069117This is a polish psychological trait. You think everyone is a rational maximizer, to the point yuo actually fuck up being rational yourselves. Its just part of your culture, I understand. But damn it is funny to see.