No I was not bullied by woofs. I dont know what youre talking about..

waning crescent

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Okay since the last thread didn't have any replies

Does anyone have more art of Kindred with guns like this one?
Pic is from the last thread but I don't have anything to show myself

>>98419221
Philodox. The most favored by Luna

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Anyone read this? Is it as shit as Lore of the Traditions?

>TQ
Actually, I do know this one. It was a new moon, though it was during the day, and the rain stopped at the same time. Clouds parting, the whole thing. It was very important.

>>98419221
>thread question
>crescent
guess im a shaman. makes sense to me with my interest in the occult and mage the ascension

>>98419221
Dam, guess I'm a Ragabash

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>>98419269

>>98419221
>>98419301
I was born near midnight (00:17) during a thunderstorm and which google tells me was during a full moon as well

...we probably shouldn't meet

>>98419298
>Is it as shit as Lore of the Traditions?
Much worse. Lore of the Traditions just makes the Traditions a little more liberal and ethical, so that they're no longer quite so objectively wrong when compared to the Technocracy. Forbidden and Forgotten Orders just boils down all of the Crafts into their most generic stereotype. The Solificati are more drug-addled than the Cult of Ecstasy ever were, Hollow Ones are boiled down to obnoxious hipsters, the Knights Templar are frothing-at-the-mouth deus vult crusaders and so on.

>>98419221
Galliard / Cahalith it seems but that doesn't really fit me at all

>>98419221
Man I fucking hate World of Darkness.
Lore is fascinating and reading the rulebooks, you can't help but feel sucked in, but damn, they're written in the most unhelpful way possible. Last time I tried to read a book for World of Darkness, there was an entire bloody chapter about something that has a very strange name, and was essentially just a foot in the door. Like someone owing you a favour, and that someone happens to know a professor you need to interrogate about something.
Fucking world of darkness goes "ummmm no it's not a school of magic, it's a sphere!"

>>98419301
>>98419331
They're gonna fuck ^o^

>just a bunch of frauds
Everyone knows Galliards (Gibbous) are the real warriors of Gaia.

>>98419335
I expected as such. Guess I'm not missing much with the book not being in the megas,

>>98419340
cool story bro

>>98419340
Very valid criticism, sadly. WoD's book were always written to be insanely pretentious.

>>98419343
Average Ahroun after accidentally beating one too many kinfolk

>>98419340
I really hate the first person narrative story telling they adopt in like 2nd edition or so. So many words get wasted on not lore. It makes them awful to skim through if you need a refresher.

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Curseborne bros...

>>98419298
i would say it's even worse i been going bad it wrote the Solificati on here before and i am genuinely worried what will happen when the one anon we had on here who really liked the revised hollow ones finds out what they did to them in this book

and the rest is also awful as it looks like all sensible people in these crafts went to the traditions while all mouth breathers went to the alliance, but the book itself doesn't seem self aware of this fact and instead tries to sell you on this being the true scotsman version of these concepts

>>98419353
I didn't get that feeling from reading sorcerers crusade but I also think Will Durant was taking one of the writers for a ride through good chunks of it

>>98419347
it is in the wod20 trove if you are like me morbidly curious

>>98419361
Curseborn feels like a real competitor to V5 in the "this was made to appeal to nobody" way.

>>98419361
>the title
>the ''werewolf'' in the image
>matthew dawkins at the bottom
what a perfect distillation of trash this is lol

>>98419377
I can respect that it just tries to be generic supernatural shit the RPG with no deeplore, but yeah not sure who it's meant for

>>98419335
>Lore of the Traditions just makes the Traditions a little more liberal and ethical, so that they're no longer quite so objectively wrong when compared to the Technocracy
But the entire appeal of the Traditions is that they're self-defeating retards. Who wants to play mages when they're actually half-decent people with more than a single brain cell?

>>98419298
For starters, they made the leader of the Templars a lesbian with a batini gf

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>>98419366
I don't see the issue with a wheel chair hunter.

>>98419221
I was born under the crescent moon, a loyal scion of Grandfather Thunder’s chosen

>>98419301
>>98419331
It’s a portent, brothers. You are actually meant to form a pack and accomplish great deeds for the Shadow Lords

>>98419344
Listen here you dipshit, your gifts do no come for free and we theurges are the ones who know the correct chiminage for the spirits

>>98419408
The staging is so weird, looks less like a fight to the death and more like the found the werewolf's lapdancing to be so shitty he flew into a murderous rage.

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>TQ
Funny you ask that. I'm dipping my toes into my first W20 game (solo because I have no time for a real game with people ;_;) and was thinking of a troubled teenager getting inducted into the whole Garou thing by their deadbeat parent returning after leaving him as a kid. Using the Rite of Passage book. Bit of a generic backstory but I'm going for something easy to learn the splat with so nothing gimmicky yet. Still undecided between Bone Gnawer or Silent Strider Rabagash. Theurge was attractive too but I'm trying not to get overwhelmed with the whole Umbra and Spirits thing, and it seemed a tad more interesting than a full unga bunga Get or RT Ahroun, or not as complex as a Glass Walker enchanted minigun wielder.

Still gotta find some more character to put into the character beyond "troubled teen", yknow?

>>98419444
*and more like the cripple found the werewolf's lapdancing to be so shitty he flew into a murderous rage

>>98419408
>vampire lair has stairs
>fucking dies

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Wew, even the reddit normies that blindly gulp any wod related content have woken up to M20 being shit.

>>98419301
I was born during an eclipse

>>98419455
Exactly.

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>>98419221
This is the shity reality deviants get worked up over? Moon phases? Who even comes up with keeping track of this shit? Some people you just can't help without extensive Mind procedures.

>>98419455
Yeah, almost everyone acknowledges that the biggest issue with M20 is that it's full of garbage editing and Brucato either waxing poetic about the majesty of true magick or bitching about how everyone who plays Mage is an asshole powergamer.

It's still functional as a system, it's just most of the book's content is superfluous, pretentious, and/or hostile towards the reader.

>>98419455
>>98419480
filtered

>>98419408
why that werewolf kinda caked up?

Is there a way to be immune to bashing?

>>98419502
Publish high quality work.

>>98419450
>That pic
The most normal thing you’ll see in a Tzimisce’s Haven.

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>>98419454
>vampire lair has stairs
Is that a... ?!?

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>>98419455
Seriously, we have autists that make entire Clanbooks, CofD/WoD conversions, and even their own reboot. Has no one Frankensteined their own M20 rules cheatsheet without all of Brucato's gay nonsense?

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So my insurance wont cover corporate sorcery to undo the lingering magic from when that Verbena turned me into a cat, meow. They did have an alchemist that was covered by my insurance but he was this creepy looking old guy with short light brown hair, a gold tooth, and thick glasses that obscured his crossed eyes. He gave me these red suppository pills that should absorb the lingering magic but I just feel like shit, meow. On the bright side, my tentacles really like playing with the laser pointer.

Who is brucato and why is he /wodg/'s boogeyman?

>>98419565
>Has no one Frankensteined their own M20 rules cheatsheet without all of Brucato's gay nonsense?
Yes.

>>98419565
why would anyone when revised is right there?

>>98419566
>creepy looking old guy with short light brown hair, a gold tooth, and thick glasses that obscured his crossed eyes. He gave me these red suppository pills

Are youbsure he wasnt wall-eyed?

I don’t care what you think, the Goatman being a creepy sex pest who seriously believes in chaos magick is what made Mage Sovlfvl.

>>98419408
>>98419366
If I were in a cell and a hunter rolled up in a wheelchair, I'd see if we could use him as overwatch, or if he could be our fast talker with law enforcement, or if we could turn his physical therapy into an alibi, or something. There are way more things a hunter can do than face check a monster

>>98419565
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1_GzPNZoPabVMAKxk_y1aBpl0jic5QD8Y1TyLpCQUuKg/

>>98419601
he can be Barbara Gordon I guess

>>98419577
He's only one part of the unholy trinity that caused White-Wolf to go bankrupt in the first place, thus allowing paracucks to eventually buy it.
Brucato, Achilli, and Travis Williams. They are the 3 lords of terrible writing and business retardation.

>>98419340
The social maneuvering and Doors rules from GMC?

>>98419590
Yeah that sounds right. Do you know him by any chance? I dont think the pills are working. While the tentacles have stopped attacking my tail, the cat ears are still there. I also keep hearing a voice in my head that keeps repeating "Zoo" and "Low..."

>>98419591
Like George Lucas, every Sovlfvl writer needs a technocrat proffessional editorto argue with and ground him in reality. Without that, you get the dogshit like the prequels.
Without the Sovlfvl writer, the technocrat editor doesn't have anything to work eith and you get generic sloppa #23465468
Without the Sovlfvl writer OR the technocrat efitor, you get modern hollywood writing.

>>98419591
Maybe, but he makes his best content under the supervision of someone relatively sane who can keep his mind focused and his prose simple

>>98419609
I know about Brucato's awful writing, but what are his awful business decisions?

>>98419624
Issue is, getting a dynamic and a static to work together instead of trying to kill each other is a miracle in itself.

>>98419361
Kek. Glad I'm making my own WoD with hookers and more violence. No more of this fucking weak panzy shit

>>98419621
YES, THAT!
They call that "door" but it feels like either a borrowed word or a really weird translation, so it comes off as really weird. Like using the word "dog" to refer to a cow.

>>98419522
Lol. But I seriously know ive read it somewhere theres some power or whatever that makes you immune to bashing damage

>>98419372
its not. i tried looking

How bad of a discipline Bardo is? Other than making animal blood better, the rest do not seem worth the benefit of losing the ability to make other vampires and maintaining a strict humanity path. It honestly seems kinda lame

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>>98419604
>>98419582
Holy canoli, I see it yet don't believe it. Playable Mage 20. Thanks anon. Maybe now I can try this mess of a game.

>>98419897
I'm on a solid 4 on the fool scale, that bad bros?

>>98419557
Even more ironic considering Polnareff's fate.

>>98419609
What did these three do specifically besides whacky shit like Hermione masturbation?

>>98419221
New mooner, I was born to give people a hard time and an occasional smile.

>>98419566
Bakeslave you have to stop trusting corporate, I'm pretty sure you're turning into a science experience and a boardroom bet.

>>98419936
Which page is that one?

Rolled 8 (1d8)

>>98419897

>>98419221
which version did it better?
auspice determined by moon phase at birth
auspice determined by moon phase at first change

>>98419897
are m20 rules even that different from revised or is the controversy just over the word vomit and the schizo chaos magickian saying rpgs are real magick and have an effect on your soul

>>98419966
auspice at birth so kinfolk can have an auspice even if it doesnt do anything mechanically

>>98419951
I thought he already was one, wasn’t that how he got turned into a formori?

>>98419848
Animal blood & Humanity retention is honestly really good. Degeneration rolls have a habit of piling up & reclaiming humanity is usually in the hands of ST fiat to begin with, so this helps you keep yourself from drowning. Plus animal blood is not hard to get ahold of, & doesnt get you in nearly as much trouble.

I wonder what the best animal for drinking is. Vitae is equal to health levels. Where can I find a bunch of animal stats?

>>98419979
That's scattered through a lot of books. The animal book might be bygone bestiary but i'm not sure. I think the best animal to drink that case is probably a bird or something similar. You'll drain it dry and to death but it's much easier to get rid of and three birds can more or less keep you fed for a week. The issue is unless animals heal like mortals do there's not any animals I can think of that you can cycle without them having a bad time.

>>98419435
I've never met a Theurge that wasn't jerking off to the thought of Gaia, not sure I can trust these words.

>>98419978
I thought he got captured by Tzimisce first, turned into a femboy, then experimented on by the company to make him a fomor, and then experimented some more for his failures to get the tentacles.

>>98419969
Not really, which is kind of the worse sin. It's not like the other *20 books where it's an overstuffed version of Revised given a tune-up and a lolmodernized lore explainer.

There's nothing wrong with using Revised, but like, what was the point of this book? Look what happens, people think "oh I'll get M20 it's the newest version" and get something that veers between insufferably twee and relitigating internet arguments that he doesn't bother to even explain.

>>98419624
>>98419628
If you ask me the Mage Braintrust was supposed to be the ones telling Brucato to stop fucking around. They all seem to have stories where they came to him with real issues and he brushed them off.

>>98420004
Please talk with theurges other than Children of Gaia ones, for your sanity’s sake

>>98419978
Correct. They were just going to recycle Bakeslave but he has a higher capacity for Banes than a normal person (Unpossessed is such a great merit) so they want to see if he can become a Fomarch.

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>>98419897
5

>>98420022
But they're the only ones that I know and are relatively friendly... the Uktena ones scare me

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>>98419951
>>98420012
>magic cat with tentacles
pentex is clearly trying to make a displacer beast

>>98420048
2/10 no wheelchair

>>98420045
What is the endgoal here? They already have liches.

>>98419998
Maybe keep a chicken coop? Feeding one bruised level from even say 10 Chickens would be more than enough. Or you could go with something like rats which breed fast just in case you killed a few. If you have a ranch with big livestock I don't think itd even be worth keeping track

>>98420014
m20 is still the one with the nephandi/widderslainte player guide (even if it says its not)

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>>98420048
Sovl...

<...and sovlless.

>>98420060
>cool write up from hermetic perspective
>word vomit trying to encapsulate all mages

>>98420095
aesthetically and the flow of the writing is also a lot worse

>>98420067
turning reality into a dnd amusement park to be able to charge everyone tickets for existing
and to be able to remove the world's consensus shield, letting in all the eldritch beings

>>98420067
Endgoal? Anon, pentex is run by a boomer death cult. They don't give a shit how it all ends(for now), as long as they get to ride first class the entire way there.

>>98419966
>auspice determined by moon phase at first change
This one. It makes it easier to self insert if you were born under a shitty auspice, like me.

>>98420146
Just change your auspice bro, it's not that hard

>>98420045
The Verbena witch was the one to turn me into a cat. As of right meow I am just a neko femboy. Im not sure what Pentex's goal for him is. I like to think they see his potential as a powerful fomor with his Bane capacity but keep getting frustrated by his fuck ups. Were it not for the fact his Malleate venom helps cut production costs of cosmetics by 15% they would have definitely recycled him by now.

So the level three Theurge gift, Exorcism, will rip a Bane out of a fomor. Also deal ten aggravated damage, one a turn for ten turns.
The level one Theurge gift, Mother's Touch, should heal enough damage to survive. Might take two castings.
Three or four castings ought to heal the ex-fomor all the way up and even prevent scars.
But while I have them in this position, can I shove something else in there, instead of a Bane? The mortal's will is probably fucked up from being possessed in the first place, and filling the hole can prevent a new Bane from slithering in

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>>98419825
you are probably in the wrong trove

Okay follow me here. What if... a Hunter gets put in a wheelchair by a monster and refuses to stop hunting. He's going to keep doing this until it kills him, legs be damned.

>>98420209
it appears i am and just been looking through the 3 mega links in the op. where is the link for this? stv content folders im assuming?

>>98420210
That's when you MacGyver a pair of shotguns to the armrests.

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>>98420209
the Sorcerer cover is another massive downgrade

When you think about it every auspice is kinda shitty and predisposes you to certain behaviors. I guess ultimately it doesn't matter for the good of Gaia but it'd be hard to be actual friends with an Ahroun or a Ragabash.

>>98420207
>But while I have them in this position, can I shove something else in there, instead of a Bane?
Anon...
>The mortal's will is probably fucked up from being possessed in the first place, and filling the hole can prevent a new Bane from slithering in
For fucks sake, Phrasing!

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>>98420214
the picture name... ah screw it here are all the current owlnon wod troves

>>98420227
not really into werewolf so this is a honest question: do they influence your personality or do they just give you gifts that are tailor made for a certain role that makes the garou nation and spirit pact expect you to behave in a certain way to gain renown?

because i been told both before

>>98420229
Faces look kinda ai

>>98420210
sounds like a badass storyteller character thats a mentor to PCs and saves their asses a couple of times too many and ends up getting killed to save the life of a party member

>>98420227
Anon, Auspices are literally just D&D character classes translated to WoD.
Ragabashes are Rogues
Theurges are Druids
Phildoxes are Paladins
Galliards are Bards
Ahrouns are Barbarians
They didn't even try very hard to hide the thing they were aping when they can up with names(with the exception of Ahrouns, which are just a slight editting of the "Awoo" wolf noise).

>>98420237
It's some weird chicken and egg situation where the moon you were born under determines your auspice which is actually spiritually tied to your personality. So if you were born a Ragabash, it was because you were always going to be a sneaky dicking rogue.

On the other hand, the way gifts are sort of tailored for you as well as the expectations of Garou society will make you act a certain way that reinforces the stereotype. It's kind of fatalist in a way. You are a Ragabash/Ahroun/Whatever because you were always meant to be one but also because society made you one.

It's not like it determines your entire personality though, you don't need to play Ahrouns as raging barbarians or Philodoxes as extremely methodical lawyers.

>>98420239
they are. It's just a throw away pic because bots can read out the links if you type them and some troves have been killed despite the link having been turned into 1337 speech before

>>98420222
m20 is pure late onyx path i don't think anyone ever said anything positive about their art

>>98420245
>Ragabash
Cunt, thief, perpetual liar, twinkish, untrustworthy.
>Theurges
Power hungry, myopic, religious nutjobs who suck off spirits
>Philodoxes
Control freaks with a kink for arguing over Garou skubs and muh Litany
>Galliards
Boastful, overconfident, irresponsible, etc
>Ahrouns
Angry, muscle-brained, gayer than average, no patience
Joking aside, yeah you're right. They are kinda DnD archetypes reframed around a somewhat deeper familial structure

>>98420229
thank you sir.

>>98420209
>the books of femboys

For the anon wondering if vampires can spot vampires. It was bugging me cause I thought there was something & I found it.

Players Guide, 3 dot Merit, Vampire Recognition

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>>98420251
>ahroun
>gayer than average

Not only a truke, it's also canon (pic related is from Book of Auspices)

>>98420250
how can a group of people have such awful taste?

>>98420295
i would say it's budget, but then again they have budget for curseborne and print shit like this >>98419361

which is very confusing to me because dawkins had commissioned art from Cobb for the world below so they have a line to the guy who made wraith the oblivion's art style what it is and don't use him for their "urban horror" games not even for the spooky ghosts

Man, Satyros is such a fucking weenie

>>98420320
I think they genuinely think that this is cool based on what I've seen from them

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FVmWBSRuC4
the dnd crossover video by the guys who made it

>>98420347
that might be true but i refuse to believe it because otherwise i might end up like a lovecraft protagonist

>>98420352
>by the guys who made it
Why would anyone take this stuff seriously? Not just for this D&D thing, in general. Like the people who cite developer diaries as to why a video game will be good. No shit, the people trying to sell you something say it's good.

>>98419361
>pictured: the werewolf that goes online to complain about vampires

>>98419897
I'm in no way defending M20, as it is poorly edited and poorly written. It's full of purple prose and smug pretension and genuine hostility for the player.

However, are you saying that you were legitimately incapable of reading through M20 and learning the game? I could still sit down and actually read the thing from cover to cover.

>>98420358
i posted it because they explain most of the rules of the class and subclasses in this and i thought some people might have opinions on this

>>98420352
>clans at level 3
>level 18 for one 5th dot discipline like feature
i haven't played dnd in forever but like wtf?

>>98420374
5e has the most retarded balance known to man that doesn't work anyway. this is just to limit the god like abilities PCs get at like level 5.

>>98420352
https://youtu.be/1FVmWBSRuC4?t=341
A LLM wrote this script.

>>98420374
>>98420384
DnD 5th Ed is pretty weirdly balanced, it's more freeform RP-skewed than focused on mechanical dungeon crawling, but it's a rules-light system to make it more approachable. IMO, it's just about serviceable

>>98420368
You're fine I just wanted to vent. I've seen a lot of people shilling stuff based on what the people making something have said about it and it ticks me off.

Trying to cram VtM into 5e's system, I wouldn't even bother to balance it against fighters and wizards and whatnot, I'd just make an attempt to balance the clans against one another and maybe the disciplines

>>98420352
>no malkavian diviner
>no tremere wizard
>no salubri cleric
>no tzimisce transmuter
>none of the necromantic clans
>no followers of set (I could imagine them fitting the yaun-ti perfectly)
Disappointing.

So if I wanted to play Superman in a MtAsc game, how should I proceed?

I’ve been watching My Adventures with Superman and I kinda dig the way they do Kryptonian tech and the way they give powers. Even partly what made Clark special compared to Kara was him receiving the latest gene engineering and nanotechnology.

I figured Immunity at the cost of 10, to replicate Superman’s durability. What else should I have? I know I can replicate most of the powers with the spheres, and I will do that, but I’m looking for things that’ll generate less paradox if I save people in broad daylight. Things that I’ll probably do constantly… like flying?

5e is so generic, this is just another class with its own "unique" resource points to power spell-like abilites.
I'd more curious to see FR in Storyteller lol

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>>98420363
I refuse to expose my brain to shit just to say I tasted it. Could've gone for revised but I like the 20thaniv convenience of having everything in one book. Shame it didn't apply to mage and all 6 of the Wraith players apparently also dislike W20.

>>98420421
>The 4 more interesting clans aren't available
A bit sad

>>98420352
>30 bucks for this
this will never get shared in the sharethread will it?

>>98420426
Spirit 4 lets you make fetishes. There's a rank 4 fetish which is a cape that lets you fly. Fetishes do not accrue Paradox no matter how brazen you are with them. You will get tired and cramp up, so also make the fetish that keeps you from getting tired or ever needing to sleep. With those two you can fly all over the place and save people and your only worry will be Lex Luthor and his Technocract goons.

https://mega.nz/file/aAdFCIiR#dBoO5lQ6llzCr7SIX3Bb_fVP8TNj6zqZrW5wYQ5ZZcM

Here's the VtM D&D5e book converted to 5etools json, it should import cleanly as homebrew. Sorry, no PDF.

>>98420426
>My Adventures with Superman
Honest question: other than Kara raping the journalist guy, what's the appeal?

>>98420426
>So if I wanted to play Superman in a MtAsc game, how should I proceed?
Forces. Literally just go all in on forces magic. You'll need one dot in life and another in matter to make sure your forces effects "stick" properly in edge cases, but all his powers are Forces 3 effects.
You'll want to pump up your arete and find some exploit to increase your dicepool for arete rolls. Maybe have a high dot sorcerer relic artifact as an alien organ?(Mages can't add to arete rolls, dynamic magic can't affect it)

>>98420456
>other than Kara raping the journalist guy
Why would that be appealing? I'm just insulted they erased yet another redhead with a race swap.

>>98420456
>>98420467
It's a cute and straightforward Superman cartoon that's written in a way that appeals to zoomer faggots.

I don't like their version of Livewire (she's a lesbian merc with kryptonian shit embedded in her shoulders instead of an asshole shock jock) but besides that it's comfy enough. But Kara in it is basically Power Girl, which is the way to my heart.

>>98420440
>Walk up to a guy while you have spirit 4
>Make him want to fuck dogs
You're welcome you Gaian fucks

>>98420467
Femdom is femdom.
It's not like I have lots of options in cartoons.

>>98420465
Some groups go with an Arete + highest Sphere dice pool instead. Significantly increases the power level of on-the-fly magic, at the cost of completely derailing the game's balance and turning every mage capable of agg damage spells into a glass cannon.

>>98420474
>>98420479
2nding here, Kara kind of acts more like Power Girl and it's mostly a pretty neat cartoon. I'm not going in there expecting Kino like ATLA but it's enjoyable enough.

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>>98420456
Light brown tomboys.

>>98420465
Time 3 wpuld also be good for simulating superspeed. Forces might let you move from point A to Point B really fast, but it won't let you do the superman "Read a book on bomb defusal and defuse the bomb in one second" thing like Time 3 could.

>>98420428
All it took for me was for one guy to say "hey, want to play M20?" and I thought "sure, why not" and put aside a day off to go through the book, front to back. I don't think I'm a gigabrain or an autist for being able to chew through a poorly written book, but I don't see the virtue in absolutely refusing to read a book even though you want to play a game using its system.

>>98420440
Oh yeah I know that fetish! The cape! Don’t know about the other though… I know there’s a merit to make you not never needing sleep again, but it probably doesn’t work on physical exhaustion.

I was thinking less about creating the items and simply being born with the abilities (or having the genes/nanites in me). The fetishes/wonders would be implanted.

And yeah I’d love to face my own Lex Luthor from the Technocracy.

>>98420456
I like the lighthearted take this has. And like stated previously I am fond of its take on superpowers. How every villain is powered in some way by kryptonian tech, or from humans reverse engineering the alien tech. It feels like Iron Man: Armoured Adventures with how almost every enemy had their powers related to power suits like Tony.

>>98420465
Oh? An artefact that would pump up arete? Please say more! Also how much freebies it costs.

Out of the 6 starting dots of spheres I was thinking 3 force (most powers), 1 matter, 1 life and 1 correspondence (I want to increase this one for super senses and to go very fast)

>>98420487
Time 3 huh? Well I don’t necessarily want to do the learn an entire book in a nanosecond but I want to be fast and to react fast. Like if a steel beam fall on someone and I can save them just in time.

>>98420048
>>98420091
First one looks like a bunch of people from wildly different walks of life that were brought together by coincidence after a brush with the supernatural. Second one looks like a candid photo of the Onyx Path writing room.

>>98420505
>Oh? An artefact that would pump up arete? Please say more! Also how much freebies it costs.
Sorcerer Enchants are treated as Talismans under mage rules. They're more limited than Mages artifacts, but one thing they're Really good at it adding to dice pools and lowering difficulties. A 5 dot Sorcerer artifact can add 5 dice to all arete rolls and another 3 dot Sorcerer artifact can lower all arete rolls by 3(This means buying a separate 5 dot and 3 dot rating in the artifact background)
Fluff them as alien-organ relics that are part of your Kryptonian biology and enjoy using 8 dice for diff 3 arete rolls.

>>98420519
>writing room
lmao there wasn't even a shared discord server

>>98420551
>A 5 dot Sorcerer artifact can add 5 dice to all arete rolls
If your ST lets you get away with that, hopefully the rest of your group picks up similar artifacts, otherwise the power disparity between your characters is going to be absolutely insane.

>>98420578
Reminder that the Order of Hermes has an army of the guys who can make these, but rather than curbstomping the setting they're so redarrded about their mage superiority complex that they constantly awaken master sorcerers into pleb mage apprentices.
The traditions are literally only losing because they do more damage to themselves than the technocracy, crafts, and even the nephandi could ever hope to achieve.

>>98420590
can't sorcerers turn their path dots into sphere dots and can still do their sorcerer shit but as rotes? it just feels retarded if you can learn all these neat spells but suddenly they stop working when you get more metaphysically enlightened

>>98420590
Reminder that literally any tradition could do that if it was true. Yet somehow we don't see anybody making such artifacts. Curious.

>>98420590
>>98420611
Alternatively, maybe it's the writers who are the retards who didn't consider the consequences allowing sorcerers to make magical items that can effortlessly increase the power stat central to Mage, which isn't supposed to be something that can be increased through any easy means.
It's like if there was a merit for ghouls which reduces the generation of any vampire who blood binds them by 1 for every dot in the merit. It's game-breaking nonsense written by someone who didn't consider the consequences of such an item.

>>98420608
kinda, but in most editions you only get half the exp you had as a sorcerer when you change splat and sorcerer paths only translate into exp for 1 sphere even when the effect would need several spheres to replicate and ... well you are arete 1 upon awakening

>>98420608
>can't sorcerers turn their path dots into sphere dots
Yes, but awakening at arete 1 or 2 means 90% of that xp is still lost. Maybe only 50% lost if you mega-awaken straight to arete 3.
>and can still do their sorcerer shit but as rotes?
Nope. True Magick is explicitly incapable of 1. Creating static magic effects in any way or 2. Adding to their arete dicepool in any way. The exploit for both are obvious.
Sorcerers, and Only sorcerers, can make the +5 to arete talismans.
>it just feels retarded if you can learn all these neat spells but suddenly they stop working when you get more metaphysically enlightened
Yep.

>>98420614
woah anon, no I would never have considered that wod writers could or would make a mistake in some obscure book somewhere which combined with another obscure book somewhere produces major problems. We should institute some sort of referee that sanitychecks mechanics to make sure the worldbuilding doesn't make highly competetive superhuman factions look like retarded 12 year olds with down syndrome.

>>98420614
>It's like if there was a merit for ghouls which reduces the generation of any vampire who blood binds them by 1 for every dot in the merit.
..."If"?
Read Ghouls and Revenants for VtM 20th anon. You may find it... "Enlightening".

>>98420627
so why are RAW so retarded and convoluted. someone said that sorcerer revised was clear about sorcerers NOT being shittier mages but it seems like they are in most ways and objectively just better than mages in others.

>>98420637
In which case, what's stopping a 13th generation neonate from blood binding half a dozen of them and usurping Caine?

>>98420633
>to make sure the worldbuilding doesn't make highly competetive superhuman factions look like retarded 12 year olds with down syndrome.
Anon, that's exactly how most WoD factions are in the CANON lore. This os honestly just reinforcing that.
Remember, the people in WoD don't see the mechanics cleanly laid out for them. We're like aliens frustrated that human scientists can't figure out the theory of everything "because it's so obvious".

>>98420639
>but it seems like they are in most ways and objectively just better than mages in others.
That's why they aren't just shittier mages anon. Both have clear strengths and weaknesses.
Mages are more versitiles, but sorcerers are more powerful in their specific feilds of autistic hyperfixation.

>>98420649
In this case, can we also call the Technocracy retarded for not pumping out legions of Myrmidon Exoskeletons to wipe out their enemies, that are entirely static and don't rely on true magic in order to function, if we're blaming factions in the World of Darkness for not exploiting poorly written mechanics designed by writers who don't know what they're doing?

>>98420644
Anon, that's not how the background works. It doesn't magically lower an existing vampires age, it summons a generic vampire of appropriaye generation from the NPC toolbox dimension.

>>98420657
sorcerers seem highly versatile depending on the specific power but they have pretty wide use case, especially since you can just learn multiple paths.

>>98420663
Then the mechanic that you suggested is not the hypothetical mechanic that I postulated.

>>98420659
>In this case, can we also call the Technocracy retarded for not pumping out legions of Myrmidon Exoskeletons to wipe out their enemies, that are entirely static and don't rely on true magic in order to function
Yes, you absolutely can and they Are retarded for it.
Anon, the top brass of the traditions and technocracy being retarded is Central To The Game. It's genuonely written into the setting that they're Supposed to be retarded and only barely holding together because low level grunts are the ones actually doing the work to keep it that way.
High level mages are specifically written as a commentary on people who get into high level positions of power and start losing touch with reality when the world seemingly bends to your will.

>>98420663
>It doesn't magically lower an existing vampires age
I think thats what anon was trying to say. A merit that let a ghoul do that would be ridiculous...

>>98420672
>>98420682
Oh, true. Carry on.

>>98420681
>Anon, the top brass of the traditions and technocracy being retarded is Central To The Game.
...That explains a lot.

>>98420657
Sorcerers are linear and mages are quadratic, potential wise. A mage needs to pay the billion sphere tax but once he has his rituals can do literally anything, basically.

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>>98420352
>>98420438
Here you go. I posted before as >>98420455 but it was the wrong version, so here's the fixed version with replies so you guys see that I granted your wish. I was curious too, and it seems well-executed for what it is at the very least.

>>98419998
>>98420068
>open fancy farm-to-table organic chicken restaurant
>"slaughter and dress" the chickens yourself
>more blood and money than you'll know what to do with
Downside is that you'll never be able to get the taste of chicken out of your mouth for the rest of your unlife.

>>98420709
Aaaand I forgot the link.

https://mega.nz/file/aAdFCIiR#dBoO5lQ6llzCr7SIX3Bb_fVP8TNj6zqZrW5wYQ5ZZcM

>>98420681
There are very different types of being retarded. There is retarded for not seeing broken game mechanics and abusing them (not supposed to work like that you faggot) and then there is retarded in the bureaucratic and organizational sense.

In any and all cases where you portray a major faction as stupid for not engaging in some sort of inane convoluted powergaming scheme the ST can and should call you out for your shit. It's toxic to the setting and immersion.

>>98420608
Yeah but sorcerers and their artifacts don't have to deal with paradox...

>>98420724
if a sorcerer artifact or spell would have caused paradox, the difficulty increases instead, or just outright fails.

>>98420280

I really wonder sometimes if the gay stuff that is present in world of darkness is due to anne rice's influence or not. Or maybe writers just wanted to make splats gay

>>98420750
It's 80% on the writers.

>>98420750
Nah, monsters are gay. I don't make the rules. It says so write on the gamebook

>>98420750
imo, the gay Ahrouns at least make some sense. Natural conclusion to being a murder-hungry monster who's options for relationships are future victims, illegal, or other murder-hungry monsters. It's kind of a reasonable in-universe thing given all the bullshit. Definitely a good amount on the writers though, like the other anon pointed out.

thank god im not a furfag into werewolves but hate how m20 sometimes references or uses werewolf terms and rules that i have to reference.

I found a way to have "hammer space" as was asked about in the previous thread.

Pickpocket's Ring in Demon the Fallen Players Guide. Lets you hide one item that you can hold in one hand.

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>>98420805
Dont lie anon. I have the photographs of your last 'camping' trip.

>>98420551
Would you mind quoting the book or posting the page number? Id like to look into this more deeply

Could a sorcerer create an object that grants an Arete rating to whoever holds it, like he Staff of the World Tree?

G-guys, I think there's a nosferatu here with embarrassing shit on us all >>98420818

>>98420829
epstein had a nosferatu spy network this whole time. thats why there wasn't any security footage, there were no cameras on the island, only nosferatu.

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>YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE CONSENSUS!
>Son, we live in a carefully crafted reality that has walls, and those walls have to be guarded by Men-in-Black with laser guns. Who's gonna do it? You? Your hippy-sex-magic posse of misfits? I have a greater responsibility than you could possibly fathom.
>You weep for the loss of Paradox-free occult, and you curse the Technocracy. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know. That the casualties caused by my organization, while tragic, probably saved lives. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, *saves lives*. You don't want the truth because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that Horizon Barrier. You *need* me on that horizon barrier.
>We use words like "common good", "incentive", "protection". We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very security that I provide, and then questions the Paradigm in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you", and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a suit, and get to work. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to!

>>98420867
how is he wrong in any way, shape, or form.

>>98420867
>Did you purge the Craftmasons?
>I did the job I was sent to do—
>DID YOU PURGE THE CRAFTMASONS?!
>YOU'RE GODDAMN RIGHT I DID!

>>98420828
Like many old world mechanics, maybe. Sevel 6 abilities are vague enough that would be possible.

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The World of Darkness has a sense of humor

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>>98420929
I first read this ten years ago and misremembered it as this guy running afoul of the local vampires

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Hi anons, I don’t play the games since they aren’t available in my country, but I do like werewolf lore very much.The Bone Gnawers, Glass Walkers, Silver Fangs, Shadow Lords, Fianna, Winter Claws, Red Talons, Wendingo, Uktena are very cool. But may I ask what’s the point of the children of Gaia and the Star gazers? Like, since when are werewolves associated with hippies man? And their history kinda suck balls. It seem like they don’t really achieve anything. Same with the star gazers, I don’t really get the whole werewolf monk thingy, and I live in a country with many monks. Also, why didn’t White Wolf make a tribe based on the countries with Romance langue like Greece, Italy, Spain? We have Celts, Norse, Eastern European, 2 Indian tribes but not one for Rome and stuffs. I guess the Furies exist, but they are more like a feminist tribe. Sorry for the rant.

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>>98420999
>Romance langue like Greece

>>98420999
You have the Black Furies and Silver Fangs for Greece and Rome.
Play a Child of Gaia if you want to be a healer. Oriental stuff was big in the 90s so they had werewolf martial artists (They followed through with Werewolf Samurai which I wish were more developed). They just added stuff they thought would be cool or fun to play. Like, a rage-beast with unicorn for a totem, the image for the CoG in W20 is a wolf embraced by rainbows and stuff.

>>98420999
>Winter Claws
Who?

>>98421033
The secret 16th tribe with a bloodline more rarer than the remaining oc donut steel uncorrupted white howlers.

>>98421015
Yeah, but Silver Fangs are more Russians nowadays, and Black Furies are woman only
>>98421049
It’s the Gets. The white guy who introduced me to the game hates their original name and keep calling them that

>>98420999
what do you mean not available in your country? What? Are there people who actually buy the paperbacks?

>>98421068
I live in a third world country anon. Nobody in my country play the game :)) btw my favorite tribe are the Bone Gnawers

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>>98421059
>but the Silver Fangs are more Russians nowadays
the russians havent been relevant since baba yaga spatially isolated them for multiple decades lmao. the silver fangs still have major septs in other parts of the world with non-russian bloodlines.

>>98421076
there are autistics everywhere. im sure you have some friends that know of d&d even if they haven't played it and would be interested in playing a game as werewolves if you showed them how to play, just download the books you need and read them together or print off or make a cheat sheet for rules

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>>98421049

>>98421079
Yeah, but that make them more like the noble leader tribe, like how the bone gnawers are the homeless underdog tribe, or the glass walkers are the tech bros, rich guy tribe. I’m talking about a tribe like the Fianna, Gets, Uktena and Wendingo, the tribes who focus on certain ethnic groups

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>>98421076
>ignorant
>poor
>lacking good taste

>>98421059
>white guy
>hates their original name
You sure he’s white?

>>98421090
Instead of being ice indians, now these guys are more about the ultimate hunter archetype huh? So how are they different from the red talons then? I thought the whole Hunter thing belong to the talons

>>98421106
Not sure if you would like mafioso glass walkers, since that's a historical camp, but the carparthian region was predominated by shadow lords fighting a centuries old war against the vampires.

>>98421168
I just find it sad that the Southern European don’t have a tribe that represents them the same way the Irish and the Swedes do. There are many cool werewolf myths in that region, like the good walkers for example. Meanwhile, there’s a tribe of werewolf monks for some reasons

>>98421152
Red Talons are saboteurs now. Of the smashing infrastructure sort.

>>98421130
Thanks for the (you), but what’s wrong with liking Bone Gnawers? They are short sighted, poor, dumb but very resilient and crafty

>>98421198
Lame, I thought that shit belong to the bone gnawers or the shadow lords. What idiot change them man

>>98421200
Jesus said being poor is a sign of low morals

>>98421208
You'll probably hate to hear that Red Talons are letting homids in now.

>>98421208
New gens of players complained that W20 was too racist so the guy in charge of W5 tried to remove all culture from the game but was he mega-racist so it didn't really work

>>98421209
Good thing I don’t live in a Christian country lel

>>98421209
but he said a rich man could never enter heaven

>>98421209
No he didn't

>>98421192
>There are many cool werewolf myths in that region, like the good walkers for example
anon the glass walkers were literally named after the benandanti. you can probably just retcon the loss of the tetrasomians from the italian renaissance and say that they still exist as a camp if you want to play as such.

>>98421213
>>98421216
Man fuck that shit. If you want to make vamps, werewolf and wizards feel natural, you need to give them some connections to real world cultures. They are turning owod into nwod, when these are the weakest parts of the new game lines

>>98421200
Low IQ.
Also, they smell.

>>98421200
Bro I swear some of them look like dogs
A fucking golden retriever can't call himself Garou, hell no.

>>98421233
Ah, understandable. I guess you are a glass walkers kinda guy

can wolf-dogs be kinfolk?

>>98421242
I'm a "stop having sex with dogs and take a bath" kind of guy".
I also despise werewolves in general.

>>98421242
you're talking to our resident technocracy mage

>>98421228
I know, but they are more like the tech bros, rich city werewolf tribe now. What I kinda want is a tribe based on the Southern European culture like the Fianna and the Gets

>>98421076
What country do you live in? We wont dox you

>>98421252
According to the Bone Gnawers tribe book, yes they can

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>>98421252
Y
Amazing, right?

>>98421219
No, woke made that up, my evangelical pastor told me so

>>98421270
I’m Charlie :))

>>98421280
Vietnam, really?
I take back my insults.

>>98421284
Yes, we have autists and weirdoes in Viet Nam too, that said, not so many people care about White Wolf games. Warhammer 40k is the new hotness now, to the youngsters at least

>>98421168
I feel like the Wise Guys and Corporate Wolves can be better represented by the Shadow Lords for some reason. I mean, I always find Batman and Al Capone to be Shadow Lords kinda guys. Maybe Silver Fangs in Bruce’s case

>>98421295
>we have autists and weirdoes in Viet Nam too
Never doubted that, but I was under the impression RPGs were extremely niche in Vietnam. I've seen anons from many shitholes (I'm from a big shithole myself), but Vietnam is a first. Sorry for the previous teasing.
But yeah, you'll have to adapt the tribes. The dirty bone gnawers could reasonably be from almost anywhere.

>>98421316
> RPGs were extremely niche in Vietnam
Oh they are. I don’t think I have ever seen anyone in my country cares about White Wolf games. But people do play Warhammer though, young ones have money to buy the minis now. Nothing wrong with the tease anon, we’re 4chan after all

>>98421340
>I don’t think I have ever seen anyone in my country cares about White Wolf games.
And how did you find out about WoD? Tried to go to /d/, had a hard time using the mouse with your non dominant hand and ended up here?

>>98421352
A white guy I know tell me about it. One thing lewd to another and now I’m here

>>98421364
I see.
Have you given Masquerade a chance?
Honestly, the fact the 7 main kindred clans are only very loosely associated with specific locations was always a bonus in my head. Just ignore the kuei jin stupidity.
Play with your friend. Tell him he can be a cute toreafag.

>>98419221
>tq:
I was assigned philodox at birth but transitioned to theurge.

does anyone give a shit about euthanatos

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>>98421379
I don’t like leeches, so yeah, probably not. That said, I do like the V5 art the Japanese got. Why don’t they just let the nips do the art since anime are huge these days!

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>>98421432

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>>98421440
>Why don’t they just let the nips do the art
V6's supposed to move away from the ridiculous art V5 had, so there's some (small) hope.

>>98420867
>Earth. Shit. I'm only on Earth. Every time, I think I'm gonna wake up back in the Deep Universe. When I was home after my first tour, it was worse. I'd wake up and there'd be nothing. I hardly said a word to my wife until I said yes to a divorce. When I was here, I wanted to be there. When I was there, all I could think of was getting back into the Beyond. I'm here a week now. Waiting for a mission. Getting softer. Every minute I stay in this room, I get weaker. And every minute RD squats in the Deep, he gets stronger. Each time I looked around, the walls moved in a little tighter.

>>98421440
>Why don’t they just let the nips do the art since anime are huge these days!
Unlike CDPR turning to the Japs to save their reputation with Edgerunners, Paradox cut their losses immediately with their big videogame disaster. Bloodlines 2 wouldn't benefit from an anime at this point because all further plans for it were scuttled, so there's no point to a tie-in anime in their eyes.

>>98421432
they have a few cool rotes like transforming into a hindu God for Asura's Wrath tier combat and an entropy mine that melts people but only explodes when in contact with the intended target due to Entropy 5 shenanigans. Otherwise no.

>>98421440
This cover art specifically is giving me strong Tokyo Ghoul vibes for some reason.
Looks better than the photobashed stuff by light years.

>>98421526
>No Tokyo Ghoul inspired discipline
Seriously all of this vampire shit and no hardblood discipline to fuck around with?

>>98421440
>>98421450
I think this is good art, but I also like my WoD art to be moody, and it's hard to associate anime style with that, so I don't think it's good for Vampire

>>98421534
>Tokyo Ghoul inspired discipline
First dot gives you a set of tentacles. At base they just help you grapple, like that one fomori mutation. All the advancements are about letting you do wacky shit with the tentacles

>>98421534
>Tokyo Ghoul inspired discipline
Isn't that basically the Asakku? I don't think you're gonna want to play one they're pretty fucked up.

>>98421588
I mean, let's see.
>Potence to give it supernatural strength
>Vicissitude to control the blood and connect it to the body
>Protean for the on-the-fly transformation aspect
The only problem is that each "ghoul" has a unique set of tentacle weapon things, so you'd have to have a whole customisation element to it. It's a bit messy.

>>98421624
Vicissitude has been folded into Protean in the new edition IIRC. Vicissitude changes are effectively custom-made by and for the fleshcrafter that may or may not reflect their individual Beast.

>>98421624
IIRC they were unique, but still could be categorized into sets that operated similarly.
I.e. splitting (usually shooters), grabbers, whip(s), armor, and so on.
Rest is largely visual flavor and presentation, such as some splitters taking form of pseudo-wings.
Build some basic types and let the players add the visual flavor after picking the type.
>something something Progenitors going full CCG and making weapons out of severed fleshcrafted bioweapons

I feel like the Glass Walkers are actually the most Wyld aligned of all the tribes. They seem to be the only ones who constantly change and evolve with the times, regularly changing their names and adapting their ways. Meanwhile, the other tribes remain deeply rooted in their ancient traditions and rarely change.

>>98421835
Technology bad.
Primitivism good.

>>98421868
T. red talons

>>98420999
>Rome
Didn't the Glass Walkers begin in Rome?

>>98421076
fair enough

>>98420681
By that logic, the only version of the World of Darkness that isn't retarded is a Tippyverse version of it, where everyone is mechanically optimised and does the mechanically optimal thing at every opportunity and the entire setting hinges on exploitable poorly written rules that become the cornerstones of society.

I've got to wonder, how did such a narrative-focused game end up attracting so many optimisation lovers?

Out of curiosity, if third world countries play tabletop games which ones do they play?