Archived threads in suptg here.

https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive.html?searchall=Wargame+Political+Compass

Previous thread archived here.

https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2026/98321638/

As for the weather that are not done yet, I'd propose these conditions:

>Freezing
At the beginning of every turn, roll a d3. On a roll of 3, all units must pass a strength test. If they don't pass, they get a [/]. This action is ignored if they are within 3 hexes from a "Campfire".

>Blizzard
Causes 1 obscurity to be in effect. All units have a -1 penalty to their movement.

>Deep Fog
Causes 2 obscurity to be in effect. All ranged attack have a +2 penalty to their roll.

>Sandstorm
All units have a -1 penalty to their movement. All "mechanical" units must roll a d10 every time they spend an AP. If they roll a 1, they take [/] damage.

>Frog Rain
At the beginning of every movement, roll a d3. On a 3, all units need to pass a discipline test. If failed, the player can choose to either take 1 dread or take one [/] damage to the unit.

>Alternative Scenarios
One I've had in mind for a while is an urban gamemode where you and the other expedition are guests in some sort of deep city. What that means practically is that any violence/stealing has to occur out of LoS of the neutral crowd and guard units or risk them turning hostile. It might be a headache to run though.

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>>98565791
I had a few already done from back then, and then I wrote the rest today during my shift, I can push around the "clear" results to include a few of these.
>>98567398
I was trying to come up with an "aggro" mechanic to make running "extraction" scenarios where both players are really against an AI, it sorta reminds me of that. Would the city require a different map, or would we just scatter a bunch of Deep Buildings?

>>98569182
>Would the city require a different map, or would we just scatter a bunch of Deep Buildings?
We could probably start by jigging it so that half the cavern walls placed are replaced with fortified walls, and then each player can scatter some of the Deepfolk structures like Hamlets around. Aside from that the only custom stuff that would be needed would be a guard NPC (could just take from any standard faction soldier) and a crowd terrain/blob unit which will slow, redirect, or pickpocket units that try to cross it.

Having rules about placement distances would probably be the best way to get it looking like a city. For this scenario having the normal NPC control methods I think would work since you could move guards away from your expedition when you want to do sneaky stuff or towards your opponents to increase their odds of getting caught, same with crowds to slow or distract.

As for an extraction gamemode (Sounds perfect for hordes of Lemurs) the best way to do Aggro I think would just be to have a couple spread out spawning points around the edges or center of the map, depending, and then have the spawned units always target the closest player unit. If you wanted to be complicated you could have it so that the opposing player always controls any units closer to the other player's expedition than their own but that might not work greatly.

>>98565791
>Frog Rain
Eusocial Roof-Frogs that die off in droves?

>>98573059
The mnemosynian roof frog (Dryophytes Mnemosyniensis) is a species of amphibian located in the stalagtite formations across the 3rd and 4th layers. This species of frog are minute, often the size of a man's thumb, and sporting a brownish grey hue. Its reddish eyes are bigger than other frogs', allowing them a much better vision. This heightened sense of sight allows them to hunt the many insect colonies attracted by the vegetation of the roofs, despite the refraction of the INNER SVN. It also helps them to make extraordinarily precise jumps, something of vital importance considering their habitat. Their jump strength is also considerable, although many experts believe that the spread of this species is mostly due to its ability to climb and to cling to harsh surfaces, moving from one stalagtite to the next. This species is also famous within Agartha due to the "frog rain" phenomenon. Once every year, the male frogs go into heat, and their eyes go from a deep red to a clear yellow. During this stage, they'll begin competing for females, trying to jump great heights or fight with other males for the right to mate. In this stage of frenzy, the famed precision of the roof frog is lost, and many begin to fail their jumps, plummeting to their doom. It is unknown what exactly causes this stage of excitement on them, but whatever it is, it lasts between a couple of minutes to around an hour, and it can lead to most of the male frog population falling into the ground, where they'll either die from the impact or be easy prey to the local fauna. Once this ends, the males' eyes go back to normal and reproduction takes place, with the females laying their eggs in any pool of non-frozen water they can find. During this time, the loss of a considerable part of the frog population gives rise to an equal increase in the insect population, allowing many insects to lay their larvae at the same time, perfect prey for the tadpoles.

>>98573311
Many locals see these "frog rain" events as an omen of ill fortune. Many tribes refrain from partaking in war near one of these events, and there are even tales of battles that have been halted by a sudden amphibian dounpour. The only group that is partially immune to this superstition are the sky clans. Many sky clans consider the roof frogs as creatures of ill fortune as well, but they are also gathered for the making of certain medicinal remedies. Many sky priests use the roof frog eyes to make concoctions that, in their lore, heightens the eyesight of those who drink it, though it is also considered something risky, as it can also lead to a case of intoxication, leaving the subject bedridden for at least a week or two. Many sky clan youths also keep these frogs as pets, to then hurl them down into the floor, to scare the people living below them.

>>98573349
The distribution of this species is greatly widespread across all the roof areas of Mnemosynia and Pangea, though they tend to avoid parts of the roof in frequent contact with volcanic ash and gases. Interestingly, the roof frogs are practically unheard of in the roofs of Panthalassa. Despite the deep roof vegetation and the vertical jungles of the 5th layer, this species are almost never seen in the stalagtites of Panthalassa. Many believe that the more varied wildlife, as well as more roof predators, make the roof frog unable to expand to the same level as with the other layers, especially with its mating customs causing havoc to their numbers every season.

>>98567398
It might could work with high Obscurity.
>>98573349
>Many sky clan youths also keep these frogs as pets, to then hurl them down into the floor, to scare the people living below them.
Kek, classic. The whole thing is magical.

>>98574667
>The whole thing is magical.
I debate in my head if it would be comfier to live in a Muan city-state or a Stalagmite-house of the Sky People.

If I was less iffy about heights it would absolutely be the latter. No neighbors, great lighting, the ability to drop trash on the groundlings, like a dream really.

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Been a while since we did the last chart, so here it is, the atlantean chart.

If anyone wants to propose different word ideas for the compass, feel free to say them.

>>98576658
>If anyone wants to propose different word ideas for the compass, feel free to say them.
It'd have to be Upper/Lower Class given that's the theme of the book units, right? I'd say that we replace War and Diplomacy with those two.

>>98577087
Sure, I'll change it.

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>>98579384
Noble/Commoner is what they call it in the book so that's probably best of all.

Anyways, center slot:

>The Atlantean Olm-Man
-Urbane and Polite
-Loved by Atlanteans and Players
-40 years without a model

He's supposed to be wearing a toga and a torc to represent his fancification compared with wild Olms. I think it comes across alright.

>>98579489
He's cute. The gills make it look like he's wearing a laurel wreath.

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Regarding Denmark, I have a rough timeline worked out, and some new ideas for the direction in which to take it, in other words, how to make it a better fit for the world. There’s a part of me that wants to wait until i have “something to show for myself” before saying anything, but i don’t know when that will be. The core idea is to have Christian IX abdicate in favor of his son in ‘65, and then for Fredrick VIII to go missing on a trip to doggerland, resulting in his younger brother, George I of the Hellenes becoming “George Christian I of the Hellenes and Danes”, and the end of hereditary rule in Denmark, with it reverting to an elected monarchy. Christian IX abdicates in ‘65 not only because of the Iceland/Doggerland deal being stacked on top of the disasters of ‘64, but also because of what comes to light as a result of the Fifth Abomination War, when the civil war in Italy allowed many Danish POWs to escape, along with help from some sympathetic Austrians. They return home and tell their tale, and then, presumably in response, certain letters are leaked, the Kongens Korrespondance, in which Christian XI asks Bismark (is it Bismark?) if Denmark can join the German Confederation. Apparently he really did write such a letter and send it through Leopold II, but that’s so convenient for my purposes that i find it hard to believe without having seen the letter, which i have not. On the other hand, i haven’t looked that hard, because it is a good story. Regardless of if it’s an addition to history or fiction, i say we add letters to London asking for aid in exchange for Iceland. It’s funny to imagine what those letters would look like, and it has other obvious benefits for creating a crisis.

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>>98580176
So, to sum up, there’s already this feeling of “you had one job” and “what good are you now?” surrounding him, and his heavy hand is resented, but everybody’s too tired to really do anything about it, and, hey, it could be worse. Then Iceland happens and those feelings are intensified, and then the Stromboli Survivors return and everybody realizes that it already is worse, and people get mad enough to balance out the tiredness, and then Someone (un agent de La Ombre) leaks the letters and it becomes the Ash Wednesday Crisis. Someone else has to talk the fall for that, and i was thinking maybe Leopold is blamed for this personally, resulting in him going underground, and starting his own New Mu City-State. I hear they are always looking for experienced franchisees, and it might would result in him seeing more use, having more of a place mechanically. I guess that’s really two ideas about Leopold packed together. Maybe he takes the blame voluntarily, as he already planned on going underground. Hell, maybe he really did it. We can leave it open to interpretation. I’ve skipped over a lot of details here, but i do have details in mind, like the Leopold thing. The problem is those details tend to be conflicting, and hard to present, and i’m not a good writer in the first place.

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>>98580180
Well, then there is his son Fredrick VIII, he comes in, cleans house best he can in the short time he has, then goes missing in Doggerland. I imagine he visits to promote the place, show it ain’t so bad, and try and improve his father’s reputation. This is mainly an excuse to get the crown to his younger brother, but it also adds to the atmosphere of Doggerland, and from it naturally follows the explanation for why lighthouses are special to Denmark: his brother builds a big one there in his honor. And, after all, he’s only presumed dead, so maybe this will guide him home, or else his soul to the arms of the lord. It recalls old folklore about bells, but for the people in the story it has other symbolism. Now, his brother, George Christian I of the Hellenes and Danes, and how he becomes so. The country is in crisis, so even though he’s already King of the Hellenes, the Great Powers decide it’s best if he be allowed to take the Danish crown, so long as he understands the situation. So, some very important people sit down with him to have a very important conversation, and then his name is extended by a substantial number of characters. “There is to be no Greco-Danish abomination”, is what he’s told, and he understands. There is a condition imposed, one readily accepted, that Denmark should revert to an elected monarchy. He gets advisors from abroad to help him out. Despite his inexperience he proves a good king to both peoples. He is mostly hands off, but keeps up with things, and gets involved at the right times, in the right ways. But more relevant to us, are the large expeditions he launches to find out if Doggerland can accessed from Agartha, and to establish diplomatic relations with Atlantis.

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>>98580187
This leads me to Orichalcum Bogs. This is something i imagine could be a feature of Doggerland, toxic bogs which are discovered to be so due to a high considerations of elemental orichalcum. They’re a reflection of real life iron bogs. Doggerland rose from the bottom of the sea, and orichalcum is associated with Atlantis, which is on the bottom of the sea (and/or agartha), so it makes sense to me. Narratively it introduces a real value to Doggerland, even if a slight one, as it is surely much less efficient to process Doggerland bog orichalcum than to important it from the deep. Regardless, it helps pain a picture of Doggerland, and give the colonial interactions with it some much needed structure, without relying on an entrance. And this bogs may have other treasures. I’d really like to do something with bog bodies, but i’m not sure what. Well, all this orichalcum, if it could be used in gunsmithing, might allow the use of guncotten as a propellant, in certain specialized arms, which would in turn allow implementing the Madsden in a way that i can live with. Maybe there is also some North Sea Neptunium around, but i’m not so sure about that. I imagine neptunium rapidly turns to water when take to the surface, as a result of decompression, but maybe the neptunium is under the orichalcum and has in that way been protected. I do like them having more wells. I imagine there is some Danish involvement in the nercowars, but nothing disruptive, just enough that you can taste it, you know?

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>>98580202
That’s it for lore, but i naturally have mechanical ideas as well. I don’t want to get into that, but i will say that i’d like to have the Stromboli Survivor to be the second hero, and have to the Krigsveteran get around more, being like a sort of psuedo Warfex lore-wise, but more like a Returned Noble mechanically. I view the heroes as the heart of any faction, so the rest will follow that.

I've skimmed the threads I've missed, but that's all. I'm not really seriously caught up.
I'm happy working in my little corner. I don't want to intrude. I hate to ask but I'd really appreciate it if 2eanon could update the template in the mediafire.

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>>98580243
It made me happy to see Lighthouse stuff. I think the Lighthouse Keeper should be as available as the Lighthouse itself. Rather than being exclusive to Denmark, i think it’d be better if they had the exclusive ability to take him as a Hero, maybe even a Character, freeing up the Leader slot. He’s a cool guy, it’d be a shame to hide him under a bushel.

I like the Folklorist, but it should really be a German unit, or at least not Danish: There is no Dansk Mytology. The whole thing is just too tied up with the Brothers Grimm. But something along the same lines, a Philologist, could be cool. I’m not sure what he’d do, but he’d do something. Maybe he can learn Muic Maldictions from Fragments of Forgotten Lore? It's old chart lore that the Atlantian dialect of Ancient Greek is especially hard to make out, so maybe he allows you to recruit certain Atlantian units as mercs. Maybe he just gives some kind of bonus to Parleys.

I dislike like the Damned Dane. I tried to make him work as a character, or a hero, but i couldn’t. However, i think he can be saved by focusing in on the dog, and turning him into an elite, 1800s Siris Patrol for Doggerland. He straps a candle to his dog, and goes around buffing and debuffing models as they are “illuminated by a dog”. So, that sentry a few posts up really ought to have a pup.

As for mercenaries, aside from the regular suite, Ambitious Evzones, Olm-Herders, and maybe Malcomite Rebels.

They were meant to be connected to Hyperborea through Whalurs and the Golden Syndicate, but I'm more than fine to cut that line.

>>98580252
By the way, "Scandinavia After Napoleon" and "Scandinavia and Bismark" are recommend reading. I haven't read the second one yet, but the first one was good enough that i recommend it anyway.

>>98580176
>>98580180
>>98580187
>>98580202
>>98580243
>>98580252
I like the stuff with the letter and George I for the most part, but having Leopold II go underground permanently as a result seems odd since it's not even his own nation he was messing with. I'd rather see it as just another scandal on the ever-growing pile connected to him and Leopoldville.

As for resources on Doggerland, I think having it be a white elephant that Denmark holds onto with sheer grit rather than a potential source of any profit makes for a better story, but if it was to have some sort of treasure Neptunium would make a lot more sense than Orichalcum, since the latter was originally (in real mythology) described as an alloy and in my admittedly dubious headcanon is found in deposits only in areas where hundreds of generations of Atlantean have discarded orichalcum items. Plus, North Sea Oil is a good thing to tie to Neptunium. You could even have it so that Doggerland Neptunium is what preserves the bog bodies of ancient Doggerlanders. I think that's semi-feasible from a chemical perspective.

Rules-wise I think the Stromboli Survivor thing would work better as a trait than a specific hero unit, I'm not sure how much mileage you could get out of it otherwise.

>>98580176
>>98580180
>>98580187
>>98580202
A couple of pointers taking into account the lore from the wiki and the timeline (btw, the timeline on the wiki has not been updated, I have to get on that).

>The king Fredrick VIII goes missing in Doggerland in 65

I don't think any royal would get anywhere near Doggerland after the first massacre in 1862 (hell, they probably wouldn't be allowed to). Much less before the Second Great Push, the one that actually got results.

>Changing into an elected monarchy
As long as it stays as a constitutional monarchy, I have no problem with this.

>Christian IX has to abdicate for the Kongens Korrespondance to Bismark
I have never heard of this OTL. Source? Lore-wise, I can see it working with some tweaks. Bismark was no stranger to using tweaked correspondance to push for conflict, so somehow engineering the takeover of the duchies through this would work, depending on how we word it.

>add letters to London asking for aid in exchange for Iceland
Unless we specify that the british saw these cards and used them as justification for the annexation later on (they are too weak to defend them, we don't want the prussians to own Iceland through an absorbed Denmark, and we don't want to go to war with Prussia), I'd say we don't do this.

>Leopold to take the fall and takes the fall
I don't really follow the logic here. It would have to change a lot from the Leopold II and Leopoldville lore.

>Christian I to become the king of Denmark, but cannot be the king of both Denmark and Greece
This idea terrifies me for no other reason than to add yet another factor to the Second Oriental Crisis. If he is to become king of Denmark, someone else should move into the throne of greece. "There is to be no Greco-Danish abomination" indeed.

>>98580176
>>98580180
>>98580187

>to establish diplomatic relations with Atlantis
Why that one aspect in particular? Finding out whether Doggerland has an entrance to the deep (and more importantly, to where) should come first in the Doggerland affairs. I can imagine regular diplomatic relations with Atlantis could be done through Paris.

>Orichalcum Bogs
I don't dislike the idea, but it mixes poorly with the sheer difficulty of exploring the depths of the island's forests.

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Also, here's the timeline as updated as possible.

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>>98580176
>>98580180
>>98580187
>>98580202
>>98580243
I'll read this in more detail during my shift. I had this idea about France sending a very large, mostly military Expedition in the 3rd, toward the Atlantean colonies to the far north-west, as an exercise in flexing their muscles and logistics (the more conservatives in the Armee have been making noise about how Orleans is letting everyone walk over them, how the British treaties are unfair, how Germany walking an army in Paris was an national insult, etc, etc...). The Expedition ends up being Fallen-Paris and Orleans meeting the hawks halfway, a soft demonstration of power designed to remind everyone that France is still the primary Colonial power in Mnemosynia and that it can act on its own, but also, not to actually cause any violent aggravation between the colonies. Parts of this would be that France has allowed small detachments from strategically selected nations to be embedded in the Expedition, in particular Americans, Canadians, Danes and others, in order to set up a line of trading posts along the Expedition's path (which would be an insane 10k+ km trek at a rough estimate). The stated logic behind this is to open up European markets to Atlantean goods, but its also very obviously a move to further show France being willing to "stand on its own", somewhat ironically.
In any case, this could justify the limited presence of Danes and some growing outposts/soon-to-be-colonies.
> in other news
The week was busier than I expected, I only had the time to work a bit on the main rulebook. It is still pretty far from being ready, but the Morale section should be done, I added some details to the Equipment & Loadout section regarding handing over consumable items between models,
For the Encounter Random Events (not the 3d6 list, the book) I also made a "diplomatic relations" list to be used as bonus to Control roll of NPCs spawned, the events will let you spawn player faction models as NPC.

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>>98576658
One away from the center towards Commoner, one away towards tradition

>The Olm-Wife
-Atlantis' Answer to Horse Girls
-Surprisingly influential
-Their title is often misinterpreted

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>>98582761
>>98579489
Added

>>98582614
>Canadians
Like, Canadian settlers? They would seem like an odd pick to accompany a mostly-military expedition.

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>>98585667
In the case of Canadians, it would be a small company built from veterans of the 1st Ontario and Quebec Rifles, volunteer citizen militia which joined the Wolseley Expedition in 1870 and would thus have some experience in trekking across those kinds of distances.. But the point of the international component of the Expedition would be to scatter smaller trade outposts along the river to sustain trade in those countries, trade which in some part will likely pass through Fallen-Paris and the French colonies, and over the market it has an advantage regardless.
I would like the whole thing to be a very limited form of posturing, something calculated by Orleans to seem like its a screw you to Cunningham and Wilhem to the more hawkish part of France, which I think would be waking up from torpor around this point, but would be mostly just a bit unnerving to either (the Expedition would be well under 2000 men, which could not threathen either the German or British colonies, but it does land very damn close).
All of which would inevitably get fucked over once La Ombre decides to do what La Ombre does and false flag someone while wearing modern French colours.

>>98585762
Seeing it zoomed in like that does make me realize how much of a no-man's land there is between the British and American colonies there, even with our mysterious hex scale.

>>98585878
I think I calculated a range of around 60-80km per hexes, given a 15% reduction between the layers and a complete map, so yeah, that's 1800km of coast between them.
Which would also mean the French Expedition would never come within a 100km of either borders.

>>98585667
I imagine that settling the underground is quite a big task, and manpower is always scarce. Even if the parisian colonies are the most densely populated ones in terms of epigean settlers (plus the metis and the agarthan integres), the french would use anyone willing to go into the deep. Though if they are not directly french, they should really go to Basse Abyssinie. One of the Basse Abyssinie's biggest issues is that most french colonials go to the much safer parisian colonies, and thus the french authorities have to fill it with anyone willing, even if it is from other french speaking countries (plus the ethiopean auxiliaries tied to the Treaty of Marseille).

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>>98583361
I was thinking about the fire cart too. Great minds and all.

>Alexander The LXXXVIIth
-2000 years of steady decline
-Hundreds of them, all unimpressive
-The store-brand hero unit

The easiest edit yet. Thought about replacing the lion with an Olm-Steed emblem but I'm not up to that and the Lion looks good anyways.

One towards Nobility, neither traditional nor revolutionary.

Added NETC to the wiki as per last thread's stuff on them.