Where is hedgefag

>>98757858
reunited with their fetch, bakeslave

>>98757706
Like I said here there is a new spider chapter in spacebattles
Link is in the OP if youre curious

>Time manipulation is a thing in multiple splats. Has anyone ever had any ideas or played in a game involving time travel?
No but I am planning on our motley in my changeling the lost game going back to the 1200s for a while as our motleys Ogre is from that time period

>>98757803
>is dark ages v20 really that different
It really isn't but it rebalances a few busted disciplines like Celerity and some Obtenebration powers, simplifies magical disciplines, fluffs up the paths/roads while making them more versatile, expands a few clans/bloodlines of the dark ages while only omitting a couple modern night ones like Daughters of Cacophony/Blood Brothers/Samedi you can check out in V20 core anyways. And like >>98757725 says, it has a god damn index.

Mechanically, it's the superior game. And you can easily pageturn V20 and its .pdfs if you really want the modern nights setting, or more options for paths/weapons or the modern status of the clans. The index is a serious lifesaver.
>>98757692
>there are some splatlines in nwod/cofd that have gone through some larger changes between the two editions
Yes, that's what's held me back, thanks for the help.
>It outsold H5
LMAO

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>>98757853
>>Thread Question
>Time manipulation is a thing in multiple splats. Has anyone ever had any ideas or played in a game involving time travel?
True Brujah aren't real and you can't convince me otherwise. You can't even do [The World] with Temporis which is like, the one instance I'd allow for a vamp with time manipulation powers.

Time travel seems like a handy tool for Mummy the Curse or CtL fuckery tho, but I have no experience with those games.

>@everyone

>Greetings Kindred,

>After many years of bringing the World of Darkness to tabletops together, White Wolf and Renegade Game Studios are parting ways at the end of 2026. Starting next year, White Wolf's studio will lead the development of the World of Darkness tabletop line, beginning with the new edition of Vampire: The Masquerade, which is already in progress.

>Until then, the two teams are working closely together to make the handover seamless for players. Renegade continues to support World of Darkness tabletop roleplaying products through the end of the year, and all existing products, orders, and previously announced commitments will be honored. Stay tuned to the [World of Darkness website](https://www.paradoxinteractive.com/games/world-of-darkness/about) for updates.

>White Wolf thanks Renegade for years of creativity, craft, and dedication to the World of Darkness. Both companies are proud of what they built together, and grateful to the community whose passion carried the partnership every step of the way.

>- The White Wolf Team

>[Read Renegade's statement here](https://renegadegamestudios.com/blog/an-update-on-renegade-and-world-of-darkness/)

Are we so back, or is it so over?

>>98757853
>TQ
I've been sitting on this one for a long time:

A clan or ancient sect of vampires that built a great underground Cainite civilization, the one beyond any in the nights of mortal cities, Carthage or Rome. No other clan or sect could be mightier, not within the last 3000 years. At some point, they disappeared and they had no legacy. This is why nobody could even think that they existed... until now.
Though it was more like the ruins came back into this timeline - since they disappeared completely, their appearance was completely unpredictable. Mortal archaeologists find vast underground tombs and massive piles of corpses - all Kindred who know of these ruins race to uncover their secrets.

Nobody knows how or why exactly they disappeared, or how old they really are, but they seemingly wiped themselves out of time and space. But someone turned the time dial back.

-

The shtick is that they are kind of just the Yith. I didn't think much of it but from an outside perspective, it might be too blatant.

>>98757853
I thought there was some huge mega-Janny that fucks you up if you engage in time travel?

>>98758045
it just means they'll get a new publisher

>>98758045
as the cursed one who reads v5 out of morbid curiosity i think renegade was not amazing but their later output was kinda better than previous v5 books (not that this is saying something) i think that they would have been okay but they had to work with the gamelines paradox had given them and there is only so much you can do if the foundation is made out of actual shit.. but i heard some of the spin off games (board and card) been good but i never played any of them

so from a gameline perspective this is a nothing burger that we knew was comming since the new white wolf was founded, but if you really liked those small spin off games they did then it kinda sucks

>>98758045
>WHITE WOLF STUDIO
>literally nobody who created these games is still working there
Why are corposhitstains like this

>>98758189
something something evil can't create

>>98757916
>LMAO
yeah h5 and htv2 came out only 4 months from each other and the comparisons really did not help h5 at all

>>98758045

At least for WtA, which is the only 5E thing I've suffered through, Renegade has consistently put out some absolute dogshit that shows a large amount of contempt for the source material and think any of its fans are cringe losers, so I don't think axing them is too much of a loss.

That said, I also have zero faith Paradox isn't just as terrible, and some of the shit they had in that V6 playtest doesn't give me much hope, so really it makes no difference either way.

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>>98758197
>White Wolf is full of True Fae

>>98758248
Renegade is publishing wod5 but they only wrote v5

werewolf and hunter been written by a what remained of the anchill team after he left who decided to stay of social media after w5 came out which is however also why the output is so painfully slow

>Has anyone ever had any ideas or played in a game involving time travel?
Isn't time travel half the premise of Mummy: the Curse?

>>98758045
Goodbye, renegade.
You are not going to be missed.

>>98758248
Honestly disagree.
Renegade has put out some highly confused bullshit based on a half-hearted reading of the source material, but they don't actively hate WtA. This is just a job for them, they don't care about the game at all.
It was the Paradox in-house team, Karim and Justin, who actively despised WtA and made W5 as a middle finger to it.

The fursecution is real!

>>98758277
well non linear time from the pov of your character but same difference

but lol at everyone playing mummy the curse. If the book itself points out that it's going to be niche you know that this is just a novelty product

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What draws you to MtA?

>>98758321
Honestly? The whole battle for reality is a pretty cool concept.

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I̷ ̴d̵o̶n̵t̵ ̷t̴h̴i̶n̶k̵ ̴t̴h̴i̷s̷ ̵p̴a̵t̵t̴e̵r̴n̷ ̵s̸p̷i̶d̵e̴r̸'̷s̵ ̸e̷s̷s̷e̵n̵c̵e̷ ̷i̵s̶ ̸s̵i̴t̷t̵i̵n̶g̶ ̴r̵i̸g̴h̶t̸ ̴w̶i̴t̶h̵ ̷m̸e̴.̷ ̸M̴y̶ ̴t̵h̸o̵u̶g̶h̸t̴ ̸p̸r̶o̵c̶e̵s̵s̷e̸s̶ ̶f̶e̶e̴l̷ ̸r̷i̶g̶i̷d̴ ̵a̴n̶d̵ ̷a̸l̴l̴ ̷t̷h̵e̷ ̵c̸o̴m̵p̶u̷t̷e̸r̸ ̵s̶c̷r̵e̶e̴n̸s̷ ̴h̶e̸r̵e̶ ̴e̵i̵t̴h̶e̷r̴ ̸d̶i̴s̸p̴l̷a̴y̷ ̷p̷e̶r̷f̵e̵c̷t̷ ̷c̴i̷r̸c̴l̵e̸s̸ ̵o̴r̵ ̸"̸Y̶O̶U̵ ̷A̶R̴E̵ ̵N̵O̴T̴ ̵S̴U̶P̸P̶O̸S̷E̸D̸ ̵T̵O̴ ̸B̵E̷ ̵H̸E̶R̸E̸"̷

I̸ ̷f̴e̴e̵l̶ ̸l̶i̷k̶e̷ ̷s̸o̸m̵e̷t̴h̴i̴n̶g̴ ̷i̴s̴ ̶w̸a̶t̵c̵h̴i̷n̵g̶ ̷m̴e̴.̶ ̸I̵ ̶k̸e̶e̷p̸ ̸s̷e̶e̵i̵n̶g̷ ̷h̵a̵n̷d̴s̵ ̵r̴e̵a̶c̷h̶ ̷o̸u̵t̷ ̷t̵o̵ ̴m̵e̶ ̸f̵r̸o̵m̸ ̴t̸h̴e̸ ̵c̸o̴r̴n̵e̵r̴s̷ ̵o̴f̴ ̶m̶y̸ ̵e̶y̶e̴s̵ ̶b̷u̷t̶ ̸w̴h̴e̷n̵ ̶I̸ ̷t̶u̷r̴n̸ ̵m̵y̴ ̵h̴e̴a̷d̷,̶ ̴n̵o̴t̵h̷i̴n̴g̴ ̶i̷s̶ ̵t̴h̷e̶r̷e̶.̶

>>98758414
Is that a moth

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>>98758286
Well since we're talking about Wta I habe some goood news on that frount://bsky.app/profile/werewolfessentials.bsky.social/post/3mwqrcme44c23.

So yeah book one (of 5) of the WtE project is going to be released this Halloween. Now the book itself doesn't contain any of the core rules needed to play the game due to the rules dark pack the wod fan games must adhere to. But it can be supplemented with w20 corbook or even W5 (though the books are written for w20 in mind)

Now one could argue that this game is gentrifying WtA to some degree due to the general positive/ sanitized portrayal of the gaous. Though that's still better W5 enshittification of W5 since the team don't actively hate wta.

>>98758321
The blend of sci-fi and magic, with the versitility of playing everything from urban fantasy to political space opera to steampunk adventures. Plus the system is incredibly fun when you have a competent ST

>>98758362
>>98758586
I can understand playing the games where you play as some defined creature. We all know what vampires, elves, ghosts are, but what makes playing an ordinary dude making magic the better choice? I am very conflicted when it comes to lines such as Mage, Sorcerer, Hunter, Mafia, Gypsy. Those are just people. I don't know how they fit.

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What draws you to MtAw?

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why didn't the technocracy just drone strike the ravnos antediluvian?

>>98758631
>Hunter
Reckoning hunters are explicitly supernatural since they are awakened by something (not metaphorically) to the world of darkness. From what I know, they also do have some... powers... but I never played it.
Now more generally and for Hunter: the Vigil, you get to play as the underdog that most splats love fucking over. You always fight a more powerful and scarier enemy (well, should), unlike other splats where its more dependent on the storyteller.
So it gives you a VERY different perspective on the World of Darkness and thats part of why it is interesting.
Plus, you can be very average unlike other splats. Vampires are vampires, werewolves are werewolves, but hunters are humans. That makes a big difference in a setting where the players are assumed to be either superhumans or supernatural entities.
Also it is way closer to traditional horror (you fight the monster and you arent the monster) so that gives a very wide range of inspiration.

>>98757853
>Has anyone ever had any ideas or played in a game involving time travel?
Not time 'travel' in the usual sense; but we just had a story that involved temporal distortions centered around this one house in the suburbs. Like when we arrived to talk to the family at the epicenter, they already knew who we all were and why we were there; because we'd arrived an hour earlier, had the same conversation that we were about to have again, and left. Her neighbor meanwhile had come home from work to find her own car parked in the driveway.

>>98758632
The fact that the mechanics required less adjudication. Unfortunately my GM had everything else about it.

>>98758743
>had
Sorry, meant 'hated'.

>>98758738
Best part of V5 is that the SI just fucking drone strikes the Tremere chantry. No bullshit. Just fuck 'em up Obama-style. It's amazing.

>>98758631
>but what makes playing an ordinary dude making magic the better choice?
Because it's fun? Some people like to go around and try to change the world to suit them while others might be going on a quest for true understanding. You get to do wizard shit in the "modern" world. Hunter (both HH and HtR) focus on you being the little guy, fighting against something much more powerful. You have to be smarter and more cunnimg to win since you can't just DBZspic your way through encounters.

>>98758738
guy was inside "the worst storm the world had ever seen"

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>>98758756
i still can't believe they just handwaved away all the magical bullshit in vienna by just saying Arcanum did it (where they literally say they are lesser than vampire sorcerers a bit later)

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>when you are all edgy and stuff, but you can never achieve a true edginess, because your ante is a fucking pony

>>98758756
sadly they didn't the SI book said that they own arcanists did it and later book heavily imply that it was a tremere inside job by lord tremere, meerlinda and schreck to try to kill saulot

>>98758808
...saulot?

>>98758738
They tried... A few times.

>>98758802
>>98758834
I'd say handwaving it makes it even funnier but since they acknowledge it had to be defeated by arcanoids it's just stupid. Like V5.

But imagine.
"Regent? Uh, Vienna is gone. Yes. Yes, they just fuckin' hit it with a drone. It's all gone, all the wards are gone. TV says it was ISIS. No, I don't know where Tremere went-"

>>98757892
The scene where he makes a little nest in the truck's back is cute

>>98758802
>Arcanum does something (lol)
>The SoL gets all the cool shit
Taking Ls even when they're winning lmao

>>98758874
Honestly, if it had implications of technocracy fuckery it could make sense, since if anyone could just drone strike a pocket dimension it would be them

>>98757853
My Mage group built a fortress in the post-apocalyptic future they were trying to stop because I let the Hermetic travel to 'possible' futures. So they ducked the Technocracy for the whole campaign from the year 2116, a world where the Gauntlet had come down and civilization had collapsed. They built up the shrine maiden's shrine in southern California into a base and recruited some spirits from the Digital Web who were running around the ruins (a tribe of Ugandun Knuckles who lived in an Ewoks style society) as guards.

>>98758890
honestly a lot of SI stuff would be enlightened science in owod but for some reason v5 just decided that CIA has better tools than project valkyre in nwod and that this is completely normal and mundane

hell some of their gear like the sonic anti discipline device is better than anything the technocrats had for vampire hunting on a grunt to operative level

>>98758738
too busy drone striking Vienna chantry

>Be the USA government
>Get raped by Vietnamize rice farmers
>Get raped by goat herders
>Get raped by mountain dwellers again in 2026
Daily reminder that you don't even need to be a vampire to humiliate, destroy and defeat the American empire and all its money and OMG technology. Nu-WW and Paradox are pro-fascist and pro-corporation dictatorship, their fanfic doesn't align with reality.

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>>98758980
That's crazy neonate

>>98758980
If 3D-printed $500 drones can utterly rape the United States of Israel and their gorillion dollar tanks, planes and helicopters, imagine the absolute horrors the average Cam stronghold can visit on any piggies who come a-knockin'. Better yet? Imagine what the Sabbat can do to them.

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>>98758980
>tfw the Technocracy gets defeated full scale because non-mages invented a flying dorito

>>98758980
Kinda, but it's a bit more complicated than that.
All 3 of those instances were america's government trying to set up a Forever War that they could use as an on-call crisis for easy votes and an eternal money sink they could use to line their own pockets with military contractor kickbacks.

If the USA actually stopped ham-stringing itself to drag things out, it has the firepower necessary to turn all 3 of those locations into craters made of molten glass instead of wasting money with boots on the ground. Genocide would probably be unpopular with voters though, even if it's the most strategically sound option.

>>98759011
"Yeah so my Prince, I used Obfuscate on the drone and basically we own the MIC (again)."

>>98759023
>even if it's the most strategically sound option.
ITX spotted.

>>98759023
This poster's breath smells like crayons.

>>98759023
My black ass. That's always the cope the US uses. If only we were even more recklessly immoral and violent we could have won! Bullshit. They don't do that shit because the retaliation would fuck them, its why the President has TACO'd like six times now on Bridge and Powerplant Day. War isn't about killing, its about achieving objectives. If you can't achieve your objectives, you lose. Saying 'Yeah but I could have committed mass slaughter and still not achieved my objectives so I win' is cope of the highest order.

>>98759044
>recklessly immoral
>retaliation
>achieving objectives
>committed mass slaughter
Smaller words please, you're talking to a jarhead.

>>98758808
Lasombra...
You know what, I like it.

>>98759023
You technically do have a point, US got nukes, which is the "I win" button against any country that doesn't, so if winning was the only things they cared about, political backlash be damned, they totally could.

>>98759044
>My black ass.
I'm sorry to hear about your disability.
>War isn't about killing, its about achieving objectives.
Yes, and the notable thing about the mentioned wars is thst there Were No Objectives.
The Viet-Cong didn't have centralized structures to bomb, they were rice farmers woth weapons handed to them by china.
The goat fuckers of the desert and goat fuvker of the mountain are the russia and CIA dlc of the same.
Their only unifying principle is a religious fervor to oppose america. There literally are no win conditions other than gemocide. Anything else is just an endless cycle of more fighting.

>>98759057
To be fair, jarheads have better test and iq scores than the average college grad in modern times...holy fuck we've fallen so far...

>>98759064
Nukes are cope bombs, we have conventional bombs that are far more effective for the same result, you just use more of them. If we wanted to reduce a country to a sea of glass we wouldn't bother with nukes. The dirty secret of geopolitics is that they're far more useful as psychological weapons then tools of war. Even back when we bombed Japan the Tokyo firebombings killed more people, but all people remember is the wunderwaffen that poisoned heaven and earth. Nukes are far smaller than most people think. The biggest nuke ever had a fireball 16 miles wide. You could drop a hundred tsar bombas on Iran and achieve no more than a conventional bombing run and save yourself the ecological impact while you're at it.

>>98759069
>Anything else is just an endless cycle of more fighting.
Which was the goal. The US Government wanted a forever conflict for easy political and financial capital.

>>98759069
There was objectives. We wanted to prevent the spread of communism, to stop terrorism, to force Iran to negotiate on its nuclear program. What you're describing is battlefield conditions that totally prevented reaching those goals or creating practical plans for doing so.

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>>98759069
>Their only unifying principle is a religious fervor to oppose america.
To be fair, those same goat herders opposed Soviet Union not so long ago. Witch same zeal and stubbornness. So it's not specifically against murrica, it's against any foreign force that meddles too much.

>>98759085
Funniest story is between the nuke and strapping bombs to bats, the latter was deemed too inhumane to use in WW2 because of how destructive it was.

>>98759097
>or creating practical plans for doing so.
Anon did mention the One plan that would have succeeded in all 3 of those goals...

>>98759098
>any foreign force that meddles too much.
More like anyone that isn't part of the assamite cult. They're more than happy to attack peaceful nations that didn't mettle with them.

>>98759106
It wouldn't have though, that's the funny part. You could do this madman tough guy shit and it still would not achieve the listed objectives.

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>>98759097
>There was objectives.
there was casus belli, but strategic objectives were either pointless (kill count in 'nam) or unrealistic (winning "hearts and souls" of people in Afghanistan by stationing long term occupation of the country)

>>98759024
I mean, think about it.
>Animalism
Congrats, the wildlife of the entire fucking region hates you and wants you dead. Get ready to waste ammo constantly taking out birds of prey kamikaze'ing your patrols, dogs ambushing your personnel the second they set foot outside a vehicle, and smaller animals spying on your bases and relaying info about troop movements back to their masters. Ghouled animals are even worse. And you can never be sure you've gotten them all.

>Auspex
Any vampire with dots in it has a full suite of advanced surveilance equipment for scouting and intel gathering purposes, with no EM signature to boot. Worse, any captured officers will give them a wealth of information thanks to Auspex's powers of telepathy. And with astral projection at 5 dots, you're fucked because that power has the capabilities of any surveilance drone with no easy way to counter it.

>Celerity
One vampire with dots in Celerity is a nightmare to fight, especially if he gets the drop on you. A squad of vampires with Celerity? It's over. Your entire platoon is in pieces before you can sound the alarm.

>Dominate
Nice SERE training bro, but the local Ventrue just has to lock eyes with your commanding officer and he'll tell them everything about your unit's operations in the region in falsetto.

>Fortitude
You better hope if you're fighting a vamp with this he'll keel over after the first volley, because you won't get to fire a second.

>Obfuscate
Fun fact: Even today commanders want nice clean battlefields with clear battle lines. A single Noss with a knife can take out a whole base if he's minimally skilled. Pray you don't have any vampire enemies especially trained in this Discipline, because they'll bring friends.

>Potence
Millions and millions of dollars down the drain as a single Brujah shoulder-checks your Abrams/Merkava and flips it over before ripping the cupula off and turning you and your crew into ground beef.

Just talking about the most common Disciplines btw

>>98759097
Wasn't the problem with afghanistan that the terrorists periodically retreated to Iran to refill their numbers and just came back and did this endlessly for decades? Meanwhile the U.S just stayed in Afghanistan instead of deciding to bomb yet another country and because of that the problem never truly went away. That's the version I heard

>>98759125
Yeah my assumption for this stuff is that "mortal power" is extremely dangerous, but its mostly something supernatural beings aim at each other because by itself its just too easy to subvert. There's nothing more asinine in WoD than mortals with no supernatural powers making any kind of serious gains on the paranormal *without* their own vanguard of paranormal to play interference. In my imagining (because WoD has no such thing as consistent canon) the reason influence in mortals is so prized is because its an awesome weapon, not because its a threat by itself in human hands.

>>98759157
>that the terrorists periodically retreated to Iran
Wasn't justbiran. It was Every assamite country from pakistan to palestine. The USA was trying to fight like they were at war with a country, but the other side was every member of a religion in the middle east aiding in a holy war.
Ending that conflict would have requored converting or killing every assamite until all that were left had True Faith 1 in christianity or buddhism.

>>98758321
Paradigms. It's one of those systems that you get more out of, the more that you put into it. I enjoy researching esoteric material, so I have a lot of fun exploring the World of Darkness from the perspective of a genuine Hermetic true believer, or a warlock of the Verbena. It's one of the reasons why I'm not nearly as excited by the Technocracy, I don't find it nearly as fun to play a characters with conventional beliefs in Mage.

>>98758265
>stay off social media after publishing dogshit
Cowardice, guilt, idiocy, or just malicious?

>>98759189
To be fair, the conventions only barely have conventional beliefs. The voidies believe you can spawn things out of thin air in a pinch and the syndicate I hear are really creepy and can get stupid esoteric since they genuinely have econ bro magical thinking bullshit going on

>>98759184
>Ending that conflict would have required converting or killing every assamite until all that were left had True Faith 1 in christianity or buddhism.
Honestly? With the shit the assamites have pulled, that sounds like the good ending. The camarilla and technocracy has been way too soft on the fucked up middle eastern clan.
The ravnos need to be deleted too. The week of nightmares wasn't enough.

>>98759011
I think demons would be one of the most interested parties in Vampires not controlling the entire world. And is more believable than the government being competent enough to stall any form of supernatural threat.

>>98758631
Hunters, precisely because they're humans, they don't automatically spook a bunch of "lesser" creatures which don't have splats, so they get to interact with those AND every single splat.

>>98759125
>>98759177

sorry what's the actual number of vamps in a city again? 50ish? And how many of them are neonates with 3 dots of disciplines total? What the fuck do you think dogs and eagles will do (how many dots of animalism do you need for this sort of effect? Six? Oh..) Do you think Aurareading some police chud will help you? Do you think being twice as fast as any human will help you when they firebomb your haven in broad daylight and bring in 500 people against the three vamps in your coterie?
Do you think your dominate will help you as 20 people hold you at gunpoint? You can't even dominate them all. Do you think fortitude 3 will save you from 10 shotguns pointed your way, god forbid an incendiary grenade or something. Did you forget that lower level uses of obfuscate basically require you to make 0 mistakes, since the power is immediatly broken if you make any noise? Also how many dots of potence do you think you'll need to break a tank?

tldr: vampire cope, there's a reason the books very clearly say humanity would curbstomp every non elder vamp, and they fucking btfo'd them with torches and swords. The average leech is superhuman but not enough to not get exploded. Heck, fucking streetbanger schizo retards in groups of five routinely final death vampires just because they didn't account for them.

>>98758575
Now the question is would you prefer Garou be good boy well-meaning heroes or morally dubious schizo protagonists who say one thing and hypocritically do another?

>>98759198
no central character to base their team identity around + general backlash to their work would be my guess

so Cowardice?

I was reading Dark Ages Vampire and holy shit, the thing is railroad and bad writting central. The core book is nice and it actually encourages open ended gameplay, but the inmediate supplements like by Night are filled with shitty superpowered mary sue characters you can't fucking touch. What do you mean the ventrue ruler got trapped, got liberated off screen and then turned untouchable? Of course this character is a woman too. 0 actual adventures in the goddam game and being a dumb errand boy. How can you fuck this up in the middle ages?

>>98759242
>sorry what's the actual number of vamps in a city again? 50ish?
around 30 if we go with the average in the city by night books around 15 for san francisco sized book if we go by the 2e corebook
>And how many of them are neonates with 3 dots of disciplines total?
between zero going again by the by night books where every single vampire is a established character and 90% if we go by what a lasombra tells it's childe in one of the books

and then we have vtmbs 2 with like 6 vampires and 200 thinbloods and ghouls

>>98759242
Vampsloppers forgetting why they have a masquerade again. If you're not gen 5 or lower you are utterly and completely fucked if the masquerade ever fully breaks. 90% of the vamp population would be ash in a year. The rest would have to be extra careful for the rest of their existence as without getting blasted back to a dark age humanity would never forget they exist.

>>98759273
A few are the former the rest would like to think they are former but are in reality the latter.

>>98759215
Even the less conventional Technocratic beliefs are still built on scientific principles and logical interpretations of empiric observations. A lot of Traditional paradigms aren't materialistic or logical in nature, they're fundamentally spiritual and defy conventional thinking. A Syndicate operative's magic is ultimately grounded in economic theory, but a Dreamspeaker shaman has to have a sturdy framework for their animistic beliefs so that they don't fall apart on contact with contemporary society or the paradigms of other mages. It's a challenge that Technocrats tend to lack, especially when their reaction to other paradigms is usually just "RD, frag on sight."

>>98759097
>force Iran to negotiate on its nuclear program
It's always scary seeing someone with no long term memory

The Paradox shills are here in force, I see. Stop trying to push the SI on people who aren't even playing V5. If we wanted to play misery porn, we'd be playing your game in the first place.

>>98758808
>>98759059
>edge incarnate (not really)
>hardest anyone have ever jobbed in his franchise
>and to magical horse girl, no less
Bring back the JJK fags, I'd rather have Gojo than this quadrupedal failure of a dictator.

>>98759285
I think that's more or less the case here, it's understandable wanting to avoid backlash but it's a bit like plugging in your ears or shoving your head underground.

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What draws you to PtC?

>>98759215
>and the syndicate I hear are really creepy and can get stupid esoteric since they genuinely have econ bro magical thinking bullshit going on
That mostly applies to hyper economics or primal field theory. Explaining prime can get tricky (not that they're not trying to tie it to science) so other conventions have to trust them on this one. Other spheres are pretty normal with the exception of certain entropy procedures.

>>98759467
Does it mean you've left the elf thread alone with your "is elf law more complicated then human law?" or some other inane question that can only be answered in context of a specific game or setting?
Or do you just go around the catalog to shit into a thread with your questions? Or maybe even shit out a "Is dwarf coffee good for you?" thread.

>>98759467
I like the idea of becoming a real human bean.

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>>98759535

>>98758738
The guys he was fighting were doing things like tossing hurricanes condensed into spears at him. Drone strikes were just bonus fireworks at that point.

>>98758738
Because they nooked it?

>>98758387
That's why you don't interact with alien entities.

>someone really reformatted the tvtropes page of the clans to be v5 conform the day wod 5 is announced to be truly dead

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How do we make Wraith: the Oblivion the most popular game?

>>98759467
It reminded me a lot of Planescape: Torment, name aside. Feels thematically very similar

>>98759888
Really the main things holding the game back are
>Lack of ways to meaningfully interact with the skinlands
>The Shadow, one of the more sovlful parts of Wraith
The setting is simply not crafted to be popular

>>98759888
Put a chick in it and make her lame and gay?

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>>98759958
Welcome to the new Wraith's development team.

>>98759888
I've got some ideas:
1. Charon needs to be louder, angrier and have access to a maelstrom-generating machine
2. Whenever Charon's not in the scene all the player characters need to be asking 'Where's Charon?'

>>98759332
>Vampsloppers forgetting why they have a masquerade again. If you're not gen 5 or lower you are utterly and completely fucked if the masquerade ever fully breaks. 90% of the vamp population would be ash in a year. The rest would have to be extra careful for the rest of their existence as without getting blasted back to a dark age humanity would never forget they exist.
Isn't their strategy for if the masquerade breaks and mass hunts start up to go straight for the global supply chains that stop a few billion people from dying of hunger? The best the goobers can do is MAD.

>>98759302
>set a game in the time when elders are even stronger than the modern day
>expect them not to walk all over things

>>98760033
Nice try, Itchy & Scratchy executives.

>>98757359
>>98757362
>>98757416
>>98757691
I'm currently leaning towards V2. I'm really enjoying how the book is formatted. Very atmospheric, and while I have not looked at the newest versions, I am guessing they lose a lot of the character the same way other TTRPGs did.
Thanks for the advice.

>>98760193
Make a PC and post here.

>>98760193
>V2
Is 2e kid, V2 is Paracuckold terminology. But you did a good choice.
Is not as convenient as the new editions with good little buttons that take you exactly where you need to be, and clans are distributed between different supplements. But this is the way that MAN like it, rather than being spoonfeed everything. You feel like an archeologist discovering the ancient ruins.

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>>98759242
>>98759332
Yeah that's the fucking *point*. Vampires are not physical powerhouses by the standards of the World of Darkness, but they have esoteric powers against which humanity has no defense. Most of the splats do. Its not a contradiction to say that ten guys with machine guns will kill every non-Elder vampire (and half the Elder ones) on one hand and to also state the Kindred's influence over human society and ability to leverage their weird powers means that short of a total masquerade breach there's basically nothing to fear of US military equipment or tacticool bullshit because there's no way to meaningfully deploy it at scale. If some mortal official in the military or political structure stood up tomorrow and said 'There's vampires in the city, send in the army' the order would be laughed off, subverted, or otherwise intercepted long before it came to be. This dichotomy between being masterful manipulators and physically vulnerable is the entire reason there is a Masquerade (as well as the point of the game).

TLDR: Amerifats proving the original point (about vampires being better Taliban than the Taliban) by failing yet again to understand asymmetric tactics or forms of conflict besides lining up and shooting each other.

>>98759888
When this came out, "another player plays your Spectre" was innovative, but I think ideas like that are more common now

>>98760247
>that picture
Animal abuse is not cool, man.

>>98760223
Are you Russkyan?

>>98760247
>Forcing V5 garbage again
Is all so tiresome...

>>98760366
I've never even read V5, what part of that is supposed to be off?

>>98760247
tldr: have you even read VtM? The moment there is any Vampire on the radar, they get owned. The book makes this clear so fucking often. "Nothing to fear of military equipment." Except when they die in droves to it. Any order to purge vampires laughed off, until it's not. We know there is government vampire hunting orgs, we know they kill vampires. We know the inquisition happened.. The book says vampires hide because they would be wiped off the map.

What more do you want? You're directly going against the entire material to larp about some weird american thing nobody is even talking about.

>>98760414
1) The Inquisition involved Inquisitors, extremely powerful beings using True Faith derived powers. It involved a breach in the masquerade and organized groups of humans who knew what they were dealing with. It involved vampires pointing the Inquisition at each other.

2) Read up, the entire conversation started over the V5 destruction of the Vienna Chantry and how it logically should not have went down as depicted. Not because a drone wouldn't kill vampires, but because such a plot would have ran up against social and mystical interference the books took no real effort to justify working around. This led to a general conversation on vampires and their interactions with the military which boiled down to 'Vampires have many ways of preventing conflicts from turning into the kinds of situations in which mortals stomp.

Which again is the entire thesis of the game. That if the conflict remains opaque and obscure, vampires tend to win; and if the conflict goes open they generally do not.

Seriously at least read the conversation you're responding to.

>>98760371
The part where 10 guys with machine guns can easily kill vampires or even elders (lol). A guy with a machine gun or any other automatic weapon can barely kill a well trained neonate, they're easy food for any elder.

Also, vampire are not powerhouses but they're not physically vulnerable either.
Vampires have natural protections that come with being a vampire.
Mages are just normal humans, they can only protect themselves with their powers which are subject to different restrictions.
The powerhouses are Werewolves, who are near invulnerable to anything. Vampires are in the middle.

>>98760414
Ok, maybe this guy is the actual V5 tard.

>>98760442
No, you can't make generalized statements about vampire powers and then retreat into a position "actually I mean only this very egregious example of retarded writing", you were clearly talking about vampires in generals, made no references to a specific situation except at the start. What you wrote couldn't even be conceived of a continuation of it.It was entirely a self-standing argument about how vampires would win against this or that.

You are also shifting the goal from "well if they're seen they'll still mindcontrol the cops" to "obviously they need to never be found out."

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Talking about V5 you heard the recent announcement on Renegade games site?

"Our publishing partnership with White Wolf will be wrapping up at the end of 2026. White Wolf will be bringing World of Darkness tabletop RPG development and publishing in-house

Starting in 2027, White Wolf will be bringing World of Darkness tabletop RPG development and publishing in-house.

We'll continue supporting World of Darkness through the rest of 2026 and working closely with the White Wolf team to make the transition as smooth as possible.

This marks the end of an important chapter for both of our teams, and one we're very proud of. Together, we've had the opportunity to work on Vampire: The Masquerade, Werewolf: The Apocalypse, Hunter: The Reckoning, and other World of Darkness projects with an incredibly talented group of writers, designers, artists, developers, and partners.

Most of all, we're grateful to everyone in the community who has played these games, shared them, talked about them, and supported them over the years. Thank you for being part of this chapter with us.

We wish the White Wolf team all the best with what comes next, and we hope you'll continue to join us for the other games and worlds we're working on.

For questions about World of Darkness going forward, you can reach out to White Wolf at info@white-wolf.com for more information."

In short development on V5 al least has effectively ended for as white wolf takes all future development in house while W5 & H5 future are uncertain.

>>98760461
My first post is right here >>98759177 and my second is right here >>98760247. In both posts my argument is the same. Mortal power kicks ass but its way too easy to subvert if there's nobody supernatural on Team /k/-fag. If you can find what part of either post says "Vampires no diff an open fight with the military" I'd love to see it.
>>98760450
I don't entirely disagree, but to be clear. A typical 'guy with machine gun' lets say has 7 dice in Dex+Firearm. So thats 17 dice against Difficulty 8 on full auto, or about 5 successes [-1 or 2 for 1s subtracting]. Or about 11-13 base damage. Any vampire worth his fangs can dodge the initial attack roll with Celerity, but against ten attackers you will run out of actions. At which point you're relying on Soak and vampires halving firearms to get you through. There are vampires who mulch these guys but most neonates and ancilla and a good portion of elders would get killed if put into a firing squad situation. The true advantage of the Kindred is its not exactly easy to get a wary vampire into that situation in the first place.

But I agree. There *are* WoD inhabitants who can no diff a fight with the military and a few of them are very ancient vampires. Running ExWoD gave me a lot of experience with the 'Fucking really?' side of the power scale which does kind of call into question the initial premise of Masquerade. I just tend to assume a little friendly help from Garou/Mages/True Faith/etc helps paper over the like twenty vampires who otherwise have no need of the Masquerade.

>>98760482
You slow motherfucker: >>98758045

>>98760482
jesus christ just die already you swedish dogs.

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>>98758045

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>>98760571

>>98760482
>They were trying to drop that on a Military HQ in South America, hit Australia instead

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>>98760482
>W5 & H5 future are uncertain.

>>98760484
>good portion of elders would get killed if put into a firing squad situation
And why the hell a vampire would stay still while they're being shoot? These situations only work when you turn vampires retarded and put them into the worst scenario possible and the so called "military" acts more like Marvel's Avengers. In reality a vampire would see a retard walking around with a fucking machine gun from the other side of town and do something before he gets to shoot the first round. And we're talking about "military" here, they're not going to be subtle. You're talking about soaking, but soaking is not going to happen, an elder is going to murder them before they shot anything. And a neonate can't just not be retarded. They're shooting with a difficulty of 9 after all (full auto adds 2 points to difficulty and biggest machine guns have 7 base difficulty). Unless they're going to shoot a mannequin, this whole situation is nonsensical and the guys are dead before anything else happens.

The damage vampires are supposed to be wary of is aggravated damage, not guns from /k/ucks with tiny dicks pretending to be G.I. Joes.

>>98759332
>Vampsloppers forgetting why they have a masquerade again
To keep the Camarilla elders in power.

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S̷͓̓o̸̪͋m̷̦̓e̷͛͜t̶̹͒ḥ̶̓ï̶̢ñ̸͇ǵ̸̗ ̶͎͛i̸̩̋s̵̫̿ ̸͔͌h̵̹̽ú̵̮n̴̺t̵͍̉i̶̳͐n̴̰̔g̷̛̯ ̸̡̍m̵̢̉ẹ̶͑.̵̰͐ ̴̖͛I̶̫̿ ̵̪͠d̶̯͌o̶͌͜n̷͒͜'̴̱́ṫ̶ͅ ̸̢̑k̷͍̎n̶̙̆o̶̼̓w̸̤̒ ̶̣͌w̵̛̫h̷̪̕a̶̞͋ṭ̴̑ ̷̝͊i̴͉͝ṭ̷͌ ̶͚͂i̵̥̍s̵̱͛ ̵̨̉ỏ̵̫r̵̘̃ ̵͎͒h̷̛͚o̶̩͑w̴̗͗ ̶̞̇m̵̯̐a̸͇͛n̵̹͌y̴̳͐ ̴̤͑t̷̰̚h̸̨̽e̴̮̾ŗ̴͆e̸̟̓ ̷͙̆a̸͈r̵̫͗ȩ̶͒ ̴͕̏b̶̘̒u̵̻͝t̶̝̍ ̴̣͠s̵̨̏ó̶̥m̸͚͋e̶̱͒ṫ̶̙ẖ̶̈ǐ̸͖ṋ̶̀g̶͚̓ ̸̙̏r̶̩̈i̸͇p̶͇͝p̵͈̈́e̷̞͊d̶̖̈ ̴͙̀ì̸n̴̥̏t̶̙̎ȏ̶̜ ̷̖̀m̸̗̉y̴̺̿ ̸͇ả̷̻r̶͝m̴̮̈ ̸̧̑a̶̺͒n̶̢̒d̵̺̀ ̵͕͛a̴̗͝n̸͔̍ȯ̴̹t̵̢͑h̵̨̕é̷̹r̸͔̓ ̵̢t̶̬͝o̵͉͂r̸̄e̷̛̺ ̷̪̿o̸̝͛u̴̢̍t̶̺̾ ̶͔m̵͓͑y̵̺̎ ̵̟͆l̵͎̓e̷̳͠f̶̗͋ẗ̷̢ ̸̛̘e̴̳̎y̶̩͝e̶̩̔!̴͙͗ ̶͇̋I̸̙̽ ̷̖͋c̶̳̐a̶̬͐n̴̳͝ ̴̳̉ẖ̵̈́ȅ̶̞a̷̳̎ŕ̷ͅ ̶̨ī̷̖t̵͈̒ ̸̹̍m̶̺͌u̷̙͗r̴̼͗m̶̫̊ṷ̸̌r̶̨̾ȉ̵̹n̴͐ͅg̸͔̐ ̵̠͋b̶̮̆u̶̞̔t̵͇̃ ̴͋ͅÎ̸̠ ̵̥̆c̵̤̈á̷͈ṋ̸̚t̸̙̒ ̷̗̐m̴̳͌a̵͘ͅķ̵̔e̶̝̐ ̸̬̉o̶̥̊u̵̫̚t̷̬́ ̷͎̄ẇ̷̨h̵̦̍ả̸͕t̶̨̆ ̸̣͌ḯ̷͈t̴̟͌ŝ̶͔ ̵̘̕s̵̞̒a̷͕͑y̸̧̔i̸̛̜n̷͕͌g̸̻͒!̷̬͆

plain text version: Something is hunting me. I don't know what it is or how many there are but something ripped into my arm and another tore out my left eye! I can hear it murmuring but I cant make out what its saying!

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September was thirty-three years ago

>>98760665
Essentially, yes. If they went public their asses would be stuck going consensualist or the cops show up. No properly disciplining the fledglings either. It'd be the end of the world for them.

>>98760872
You would get billionaires and politicians demanding the Embrace

>>98760882
On the otherhand, billioaires and politicians bloodharvesting neonates in the thousands to ghoul themselves. It would be fucking hilarious if that's why vampires are hunted to extinction.

>>98760892
>hunted
You say that like the vamps wouldn't get in on embracing fresh meat and handing them over to get drained for a quick buck

>>98760892
>>98760900
An elder makes a neonate
The elder offers the neonate to the billionaires
The billionaires milk its vitae to exhaustion
Quenching the Lambent Flame is already a ritual, there's surely some way for an 8th gen or so to directly sire a 13th gen

>>98760892
>>98760900
>>98760909
>said neonate somehow escapes
>he's got now a thirst for blood, but also for… REVENGE!
>at long last, Deviant the Renegade becomes relevant

>>98760909
>>98760900
the antediluvians wake up due to the rampant kindred consumption. Billionaires completely hopped up on vitae want to vitae-drain the antediluvians. The Rothschild Superghouls etc. vs Ventrue himself.

>>98760212
I plan to read it cover to cover, and maybe some ancillary material, before making any characters.
>>98760223
I could just be old and more comfortable with language and ideas from my time than whatever modern writing could be called. Or perhaps it really is just that terrible haha.

m6 isn't real
m6 isn't real
m6 can't hurt me

>>98761041
Don't worry, local consensus will protect us.

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>>98761041
>M6 isn't real, yet.

>>98760039
No it's to rely on the last 20 (now 40) years of media that portrays Vampires as being 'just people with a condition' to basically diplomacy their way into a True Blood type setting.

Depending on who you ask that's their ultimate long term plan full stop; as the Masquerade about existence becomes harder and harder to enforce, the Cam is preparing to transition into a Masquerade of truth and intent. People might know Vampires are real, but not a lot about what they truly do or deal with internally, Beast and that.

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>>98758255

Question for some of the Vampire bros here, whats your favorite antitribu clan and why? I'm personally a big fan of the Tremere, Ventrue and Salubri, I find the Tremere and Ventrue antitribu to generally be more interesting compared to their parent clan, and for the Salubri I really enjoy a Angel of vengeance being corrupted by said vengeance but still bear a small aspect of kindness of the clan they used to be.

>>98761213
>Lasombra Antitribu
I get to be edgy AND on the winning side.

>>98761189
I think I have an idea for a Pooka character now

>>98761213
Tremere antitribu are probably my favorite faction in all of VtM i really enjoy the generally darker but freer approch they have to blood magic and goratrix himself is a very fun character to read about even if or maybe especially because he is a hilariously awful person in private

in general i really like how the books don't shy from showing that their way of doing has pros and cons compared to the normal tremere in that they have acess to a smaller number of common paths on average and because of the lack of oversight and even heavier disregard for ethics they tend to have a even bigger infernalism problem than their parent clan, but in turn that also makes their talented members be able to expand more and reach higher highs compared to what they would be able to do in the mainline tremere (but their below average members tend to explode or atleast be even less below average then they would be in house tremere) and made them very good at making new paths and ritual sor cleansing dark thaum and turn them in normal thaumaturgy and goratrix and his coterie himself as credited with creating thaumaturgical demon binding and wards back in the dark age

i also liked how the books in 2e and the dark ages didn't just made them and the tzimisce mortal enemies, although revised did retcon that into having their dynamic after the Tremere antitribu already died... instead 2e played into the lasombra and tzimisce having a bit of a custody battle over the bloodline and the rest of the sabbat went mostly "oh yeah those guys really hate the tremere" while the dark age book had them have common ground with some tzimisce who also thought that the omen war was stupid and a time costly distraction that kept them out of their laboratories which is also shows in the opening text for rites of blood where the blood sorcery obsessed tzimisce methusulah who dipped out of tzimisce politics by faking his death knows goratrix personally

not sure if there is much interest here but we talked a bit about it on the last thread and another anon said that even if the book itself might not make the game playable perhabs some of the factions might be salvagable

and onyx path did a teaser for the covenants in curseborne the first is a very small choose your own adventure stuff and the later is a draft akin to what backers normally get on the same topic
>https://www.curseborne.com/covenant
>https://www.curseborne.com/post/conspiracie
haven't had time to read the draft myself yet but some of the covenants in the coya sounded okay to interesting

>>98761387
Missed a s on that second link.
I'm sure some of this is salvageable, but reading over it, nothing really grabs my attention. It's just portrayed in that soulless modern youth conversationalist voice that might be throwing me off. The concepts are meh and their writeups are so-so. Most of them do not feel like real horror conspiracies but rather gay little cliques, even the nominally evil ones.

my favorite conspiracies from the draft (quick readover)
>guys who believe the sun is fa(k)e and gay, just because that's funny.
>people who make themselves attractive targets for supernaturals to bait them into attacking, then striking back. Because that's a fun antagonist at least once.

>>98761501
yeah the sunless really are my standout too. i remember wod also did a anti sun conspiracy that sadly went nowhere and i played sunless sea and skies so it's not the first time i killed a sun. i just hope those guys have locomotives

in general the fae stuff seems a lot more interesting to me than the politic stuff and i think i like the idea of a multisplat "we are being invaded" chronicle

>>98761387
Absolutely mediocre

>>98761213
what is the consensus here do old clan tzimisce count as antitribu? if so then them i just really like the idea of a classical vampire lord having to deal with the modern reality and koldunism fucks

if not then gangrel because the city and country split makes the antitribu more interesting than the main clan for me

>>98761213
Absolutely Ventrue antitribu. They're very cool and evil.

>>98761213
malkavian antitribu been so much better than the main clan that they retconned the antitribu into being the main clan

>>98761361
>enjoy the generally darker but freer approch they have to blood magic
What the fuck are they doing to be darker when the average chantry being an absolute charnel house is just one of those background details?

>>98761768
beside infernalism which they do A LOT both the traditional pact one and the forcing demons into submission kind they also don't have to give a shit about humanity because they are sabbat so human sacrifices and worse are someting they can just do with ease in a way mainline tremere can't

there are several sabbat thaumaturgy rituals like the creation rite for the blood brothers (which is really fucked up) that cost humanity without a roll and the only way to cast these several times without becoming a wright is becoming a path nigger i mean follower

they are also unlike the tremere still making monsters with blood magic without having to hide it although gargoyles are only made from camarilla kindred and sometimes given full sabbat status

>>98758631
You know how many animals died out because hunting them was hardcore?
Its just human nature to dream about bonking mammoth with a stick, and Hunter provides that.

Other good urban fantasy settings that aren't unknown armies, urban shadows, Delta green, laundry files?

>>98761833
Monster High.

>>98761833
Fear itself/ Esoterrorists and Kult.

>>98761795
Hang on tremere antis are infernalists?

I didn't read about them besides Mexico by Night where they just disappear

>>98762510
not universal but a lot of them are they don't have any taboo against summoning demons and dealing with demons or binding thems (and never had even in the dark ages when they been a conspiracy in the clan) and only care to hide it from the rest of the sabbat due to the sabbat inqusition (and even then early sabbat books only had slavery to a demon being illegal)

it actually used to be universal very early but only for one book i think but this is why dark thaumaturgy is called that instead of something else like demonic sorcery or whatever

>>98762534
Huh...
Is it "I don't care, demons are just another way to enlighten oneself" or actually "I have a demon in my backyard" infernalist?

>>98762556
depends on the book and the tremere

when they first got introduced in the og sabbat books infernalism was tied to the path of evil revelation and all the smart loopholes didn't exist yet, but later in books like ashen cult and dav20 france by night they had it all they had "yeah i invted the spell that allows one to summon a demon in a warden circle and make it do ones bidding" "i am working with a demon on a favor for favor basis" and "yes my lord your will be done"

>>98760868
He needs to learn some cable management.

>>98762649
Silly anon, cable spaghetti is an instrument too.

>>98758738
because drone's didn't exist commonly back then and the spheres' required for one include forces, mind, correspondence and possibly matter, let alone a swarm of them

WtF 6th went well last night. The group split into two groups to begin with, Baz -our Rahu- spent 14 hours trying to get his Hunting Ground rite off the ground, walking around Maylandsea for the entire duration to mark the packs territory. Dodge - Ithauer- accompanied him in intervals. Dolly and Stray - Cahalith and Irraka - tended to some personal matters, and then spotted somebody on a small boat in the creek. Their Totem's creek. They watched her upend a rucksack of tightly wrapped plastic packages and metals into the river, where they swiftly sunk. They caught up with her and exchanged greetings. Her name is Blaid, she's a smuggler running guns and gear from Edinburgh and Newcastle down to London by sea, and she's wolf-blooded. Once a week she offers the river spirit drugs and guns in exchange for it not eating her small boat when she docks it.

The sun was beginning to rise when all four Uratha heard the mournful howling of wolves from within the small seaside town. Baz and Dodge were closer, and encountered two policemen in their vehicle. The officers had a rifle, which is definitely unusual in the UK, and explained that they were there to hunt wolves. Baz and Dodge posed as drunks and ambled away. Shortly after, the officers pulled up and investigated an alleyway. Wolf-based violence followed shortly after. The whole town heard the panicked rifle-shots, and those closer heard the screams.

Still in two groups, Baz and Dodge, and Dolly and Stray responded to the gunfire. Stray found a dead Officer in an alleyway, his blood painting the walls, his arm still twitching. A mangy black wolf was feasting on his guts. Several streets away, Baz and Dodge approached the rifle-wielding officer to investigate further. He pushed them back in a panic, and Baz began to wrestle with him for control of the rifle. Dodge moved to flank, and was jumped by a wolf from an alleyway. It damn near one-shot him, dealing 9 lethal damage in one hit.

>>98762920
Shenanigans ensued, as another officer was tackled by two wolves. Baz continued to wrestle, shifting into Dalu form and incapacitating the officer. Dodge shifted into Gauru form and elbow-dropped the attacking wolf from a first storey fire-escape. Stray and Dolly split up, both getting jumped respectively by wolves. While the Wolves hit hard, they couldn't take a hit nearly as well and rapidly retreated if they couldn't maim their target sufficiently. Baz noted that one the wolves peered into the eyes of a dying officer intently. More police cars began to show up, drawn by the gun-shots and the screaming. Dolly's player asked "are we going to stick about for wave-defence against the Essex Police department?", etching an all-timer into the groups meme-culture.

Instead, as the group fled, they could taste a word. It scratched their minds, an intuitive understanding. Shartha. Dodge recalled his time in the war, meeting tribes in Europe. They had been dealing with Shartha there, rats that fed on the mass graves of the dead. But these were wolves. Dolly remembered that when she'd previously seen these wolves, it had been night time and they had vanished into thin air. As the sun rose, they had howled mournfully, and made no effort to vanish, instead escaping by conventional means. What could it mean?

Wrapping things up, the group returned to town. Stray noted a senior Police Officer in a vehicle, recognising him as one of the officers who had abducted him prior to the campaign. A dramatic failure meant the officer noticed him too, but Stray escaped before he could be apprehended. Dolly investigated construction efforts near the creek, quantity surveyors taking samples from the creek and barriers being erected. What could it be for? What would construction benefit the creek? Nothing good, that's for sure.

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>>98758738
What is Technocracy's tax policy?

>>98761213
(Country) Gangrel or Brujah. Hear me out. Gangrel that actually go full ooga booga torture savage is great, exemplifies the Sabbat, and makes up a large contingent of Nomad Sabbat, which are my favorite type of Sabbat.

Brujah Antitribu are interesting because they simultaneously have as good a claim on founding the Sabbat as the Lasombra and Tzimisce, but find themselves largely in the unwashed masses of the sect rather than as its leaders. The Camarilla Brujah saw the true face of revolution, and turned away from it in horror. The Brujah Antitribu on the other hand decided it didn't go far enough, all while being less insufferable /pol/posters and more unhinged angry mobs.

>>98761213
i like the idea of serpents of the light because they allow me be a silly snake cultist without having to either be a outsider or pretend to be member of another clan, but i never got to play one

the fact that they get unique vodoo magic as out of clan stuff they can learn is also a nice bonus

We've one document of the weremoths, but surely there are more, right?
There can't be just one guy who wrote things and collected stuff from the previous threads.

>>98761833
>Delta Green
Not urban fantasy.
>>98762275
>Esoterrorist
Not urban fantasy either.

>>98761213
>whatsyour favorite antitribu clan
Ventrue antitribu, Order of St Gustav specifically.
>why?
I like the knightly aesthetic and they're true believers in The Sabbat's goal of destroying the Antediluvians.

So... What ACTUAL vampires do for Halloween?

>>98763346
sabbat do go trick or treating and if you don't have candy they'll kill you

>>98763346
They embrace random anons.

>>98763346
my local setite temple is hosting the blood rave from blade

True Fae loli wife

>>98763402
Crossing my fingers here

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>>98760247
Reminds me of this.

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>>98763346
>>98763354

>>98760247
I’ve always found that whole “Vampires or werewolves can be easily shot down” thing kind of dumb. These are beings who can hurl literal cars at each other. At that point a bullet should be nothing

>>98763520
t. never handled a gun before in his life

>>98763512
i love the silly sabbat games they are so whimsical and evil for no reason

>>98763497
Translation of the funny slavic runes?

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>>98763558
What do you mean? I'm a pro.

>>98763558
>t. /K/uck thinking he's Rambo

>>98763602
No, it's just the cold hard truth that there's no organic matter that could hope to stop a round of the right caliber.

>>98763620
Is also true you're not Rambo even if your mom tell you otherwise.

>>98763649
I agree, and I'm glad that you agree with me too.

>>98763520
>can be easily shot down
Yeah, if you're strafing them with an A10. Remind me, when was the last time anyone did that?

>>98763593
>"I'm emo-nazi-punk!"
>"I'm anarchist-ska-goth!"
>"I'm visual-cyber-gop!"
>"Underage retards the bunch of you are fug!)))"
Kind of WoD larpers general.

>>98763620
they are both magical creatures
it really just depends on if they are able to soak it or not

>>98763597
Why is this shot like gravure?

>>98763862
+5% accuracy

>>98763663
I didn't agree with /k/uck. Guns are largely irrelevant to vampires unlike Werewolves claws for example. Read the books if you know how to read.

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Where do vampires go at dawn?
To the Land of Nod.

>>98763945
I chuckled.

>>98763907
A high enough caliber says otherwise.

>>98752709
>The Technocracy, the Marauders and the Nephandi all wish to make the earth a hellhole.
Technocracybros!? How do we recover our narrative? Should we give more money to Pentex? Torture another fairy?

>>98763970
Make another Epstein Island, that'll show 'em.

>>98763970
>>98763979
Retards who have never heard of an unreliable narrator. It's common knowledge that the core material is written from a Traditions propaganda perspective.

>>98764003
Even the Technocracy pov books agree they were scum before the Avatar Storm.

>>98764003
That's one of the writers explaining the premise of the game thoughbeit.

>>98763964
Did you play any splat ever in your life
Because I'm sure you didn't

>>98764010
Yes, explaining the premise of the game from the Traditions perspective.
>>98764005
Retarded Brucato Traditions apologia. Guide to the Technocracy makes it clear that all other books are Traditions propaganda.

>[Technocracy Propaganda] makes it clear that all other books are Traditions propaganda.

>>98764041
>The only book that looks at things from a Technocratic perspective is Technocratic propaganda!
Convenient.

>>98764036
>Mage is one of the most impressive games I've seen to date. It is unique in that it develops a philosophy for a campaign setting. The philosophy is that reality is decided by majority consensus, with the majority being manipulated by the bad guys.
Cope. This is the writers describing the basic concept of the game.

Technocucks sure get really angry when you repeat their own words back at them.

>>98764061
>Writers would never talk about the game from the perspective of the fundamentally flawed player characters!

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>>98763970
It's very simple, we kill deviants like (You).

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>chilling in technocracy office
>RD ALERT
>footage from drone comes in
>an elf saw a fussy baby and made her giggle by conjuring whimsical butterflies
>send in agents to capture him (and the baby too, just to be sure)
>lock him up, feed only corn syrup and fluoride water and force to read books on why liberal democracy is the end of history and nothing will ever happen
>his """""fae soul""""" dies
>delete memories of the encounter
>give him a job application and send towards the nearest o'Tolley
Just another day of protecting humanity.

>>98763945
How do you call present werewolves?
Arewolves.

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>>98764205
>>give him a job application and send towards the nearest o'Tolley
Keep your hands off my newest test subject.

>>98763597
That's like... what, 2 bashing per turn assuming soak rolls fail? Not a lot.

>>98763964
>moves from "guns" to "high caliber"
Next thing you're going to cry about is throwing nukes lol. Fucking /k/uck loser.
btw wolf claws are still more dangerous to vampires than high caliber weapons. cry harder.

>>98764368
I'm not crying, just pointing out that WoD was made by noguns who don't understanding their killing power.

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>>98764003
>>98764036
>>98764127
>>98764205
>>98764247
Always remember who you're fighting for. :)

>>98764383
the metaphysical property of forces being enacted by mass and accleration is inherently a magic rote itself in this setting. anything magical enough can just say no u to a mundane piece of metal shrapnel. if you want to actually do damage to a vampire or werewolf try dragon's breath rounds or silver bullets

>>98764383
Didn't read, /k/uck.

>>98764368
what is your mental fixation with /k/? are you mentally ill?

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>>98764392
those aren't the top dogs, these are the fall guys, effigies for the masses to burn. you'll never know who's the top dog, neither how bad it can truly get

>>98764383
Anon, a being that can survive getting struck head-on by a train is going to no-sell a gun

>>98764410
Just stop spamming your /k/uck garbage and you won't be called /k/uck, cuck.

>>98764392
>He thinks these are "top" men
You're exactly why the masses need someone directing then

>>98764422
an incredibly predictable response. The only one even thinking about /k/ is you. You keep acting like anybody cares about wolf claws being aggravated or something, in comparison to guns. Keep repeating guns being largely irrelevant. It's really fucking weird. What's the point? Do you think there is some /k/ conspiracy going on?

It's not even true if you examine it further. You can headshot vamps for lethal damage, or use incendiary ammo like dragonsbreath to completely rape them for unsoakable aggravated, which is sort of like how Garou get gaped by silver bullets.

>>98759023
If you think every politician, every billionaire and every general isn't about to turn traitor for a chance and immortality and super powers in an all out war against vampires you haven't been paying attention

>>98762920
>>98762924
Nice work anon, the intrigue in your game seems to be going pretty well.

>>98759242
>sorry what's the actual number of vamps in a city again? 50ish?
All they have to do is hit the mass embrace button and that becomes 2,000 in a single night on the low end

>>98764036
>Guide to the Technocracy makes it clear that all other books are Traditions propaganda.
And you know who is completely impartial and trustworthy? The guys who have a dedicated propaganda department.

>>98764557
>The guys who have a dedicated propaganda department.
Yeah, the Order of Hermes is fucking psychotic.

>>98764585
It can't be OoH propaganda, they'd have fucked up and doxxed themselves at least three times per book.

>>98764522
Is a game about supernatural monsters, not about your rambo fantasy buckbroken /k/uck. That's all I'm saying.

>>98764522
Unfortunately the vampire is either also using your gun strats + vampire bullshit or they've hit the point where guns are a handicap.

>>98764611
>or they've hit the point where guns are a handicap.
*Resource sink.
Gun in classic world of darkness can scale to absurd levels, but get progressively rarer and exponentially more expensive.

>>98764611
that isn't the point I think? What the real point to this is I've yet to determine, truth be told. I think the point is that werewolf claws deal aggravated and this owns "rambo /k/ucks" because.. I don't know. Nevermind the fact guns may or may not deal aggravated or whatever based on ammo. That mortals are in most situations weaker than monsters is obvious, though nightfolk have specific weaknesses such as fire or sunlight in the case of vamps which humans don't so your statement about vamps using the same strats isn't necessarily true.

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>get slammed with a couple of big bills that ate about 1/3 of my finances over the weekend
>friend has been losing his shit for a month
>trying to talk him through it but feels like a sisyphean task and slowly getting worn down in the process
>start getting depressed tuesday
>ideas are getting lost in the mists but try to throw something out to spite the depression
>unsatisfied with my efforts, rapidly losing focus, and the mists are only getting thicker
>get told this morning my grandfather's health has taken a sharp decline and he doesnt have much time left
>ideation kicking into overdrive and the thought of walking into traffic is becoming more appealing because whats the fucking point

Should I even finish this little cyberspace arc? Only thing I can think to do is get ripped apart and schizo post until Im reassembled by... i dont even really know.

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>>98757853
What if Garou invented a ritual that made Kindred Wyrm-free and didn't destroy them? Would they try to ally?

>>98764890
Unlikely. A vampire above 7 humanity does not register as wyrm tainted but will still be destroyed. Garou destroy anything they find offensive to their religion, pretty much. Which includes any type of unliving creature.
You could probably cure a vampire of vampirism itself and the garou would still kill the vampire for being tainted, just to be sure.

That being said, even Garou are forced to be pragmatic sometimes, and they certainly care less about destroying you if you aren't actively wyrm-tainted. But that's really more of a priorities thing. Garou are warriors by nature, they can't not be spergs and fight everything.

>>98764890
humanity 10 kindred are already wyrm free. the wyrm is just an inherent force of destruction that is vital to the functionality to the world and is thus already in everything. wyrm taint is just the imbalance and corrupted version of this force that shows up if someone acts akin to it, and thus any vampire that engages in dubious behavior will immediately become tainted again

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>>98764905
Then what if the Tremere invented a ritual that removed their autism?

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>>98764878
hopefully things will get better

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>>98764878
Don't fret over time and effort spent on those who can't be helped - whether it's because they won't listen to reason, or because inevitable passage of time can't be staved off any longer.
Focus on where you can make a difference, for yourself, your next of kin, or whichever subset of mankind you sympathise with.
Or just go get some sleep. Tomorrow may be wiser one way or another.

>>98764915
They'd stop bodying everyone who fights them

>>98764915
The rage is a spiritual component inbuilt to being a woof. If a woof loses it's fighting autism (rage) it can no longer shapeshift and loses touch with its innermost nature. It will probably get werewolf super depression. So no, that will not make werewolves ally with you.

If anything, werewolves will consider it a sort of spiritual rape and attack you.

>>98764878
Sometimes a friend needs a punch to the face. I mean this in a non sarcastic way. Trying to "reason" with people has its limits and sometimes you need to lose your shit yourself. Now talking about insulting, just lose your own shit and make it known that you also feel bad and there's a million reasons to feel bad but there's no reason to be an asshole because if you're an asshole then you lost the game.

My condolences that shit fucking sucks and don't let any idiot and guru shitter tell you otherwise. Unironically the best way to cope is feel like you're doing something for yourself and others that you care about. The worst way is to stay sitting in a corner doing nothing. So do whatever you need to do and don't spend much time thinking.

>>98764878
Damn man, that sucks. You can't off yourself yet though, I'd hate to have your dude in my game only for you to not find out what happens to him.

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>>98757853
What are Asian Garou like? Are they super nature warriors because pollution is even worse there?

>>98764890
What if werewolves got horny instead of bloodlust when a big titty vampire is in front of them?

>>98763620
But what if the organic matter is briefly turned inorganic or attains supernatural resistance? One might say it could harden in response to physical trauma?

>>98764368
NTA but I still think mouth to mouth with a shotgun could be quite lethal for a leech, more than getting grazed briefly by a Garou's swing

>>98765050
Garou in the Beast courts are called Hakken. The principle difference is that they can cooperate with other changing breeds better, because that's the cultural norm over there.
>>98765052
Thrall of the Wyrm (for Metis) is a canonical frenzy for a werewolf where they rape everything in front of them. So technically.. if you make a werewolf frenzy hard enough and it happens to be Metis..

>>98764890
This is surprisingly good unhorny art of a werewolf, I'm pretty impressed.
>>98764954
Counter-point, if they are spiritually-raped and depressed how could they summon the willpower to attack you?

>>98765050
asia is an alternate dimension operating on wuxia first principles that looks like it was randomly glued to this one

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Did a little more work on Shark's new body. Sorry, it's going slow; still not feeling great.

>>98764878
Sorry to hear that things are rough right now. Please try to take care of yourself. I wish I could offer some useful advice; but try to take a step back and catch your breath.

>>98764890
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPE11mzU_Hk

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>>98764890
What if there were werehorses and they were friendly himbos/bimbos who want to fuck and have kids and have fun?

>>98765075
Oh no, if you actually take a werewolfs rage that werewolf will not attack you. Probably. It's in super depression. It's the other werewolves which will sperg the fuck out and hunt you down. Remember that werewolves are not like leeches and generally care deeply if you fuck with one of them, especially in a way that disgraces them all or is considered profane.

This is why generally older vamps do not fuck with lupines, you kill one and they all come to gank you. It's just not worth the trouble. The tremere would probably kick the offending ritualist out to the wolves and let him get eaten instead of taking the brunt themselves.

>>98765089
Built for domination loss in an anime or VN where she gets betrayed by her second in command imo, but I know she's just a murderhobo so there's no one who could betray her(it?)

>>98765068
Then you're retarded and don't know how dangerous wolves are. But what can be expected? /k/ucks here don't like reading. They think this is a facebook group for /k/ucks to parede around with their AKs after stealing their family's savings.

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>>98765138
If you can't handle her at her best...

>>98765162
Context matters anon

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>>98765180
... you don't deserve her at her worst. Or something along those lines.

Though I'm pretty sure that's not the actual inspiration behind Shark, just coincidently similar vibes.

>>98765162
>>98764368
Boy, furries get really angry if you imply wolves aren't the sole yiffy paragon of destruction...

>>98765287
This is a porn wolf is it? Someone right now is jacking off to this wolf. You can't deny it.

A werewolf and a vampire having sex is a kino story.

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>>98765326
seems lore accurate to pre-w5

>>98765326
No lewd, only feral bloodlust
>>98765339
True

>>98765326
Yes, I am coming to your house right now to jack you off to this wolf. Be prepared.

>>98764878
I acknowledge your suffering. That's awful and must hurt a lot. You deserve better

>>98765339
NOW THESE WOLVES I can jerk it to.

>>98764878
I wish you good luck and if there's anythings I can do to help you just let me know.
Hang in there Anon, things will get better.

>>98765485
Just tell me what you want, spirit.
I'm not a fucking mind reader.

>>98765339
Shadow Lords get all the bitches hot and bothered.

Silver Fags could NEVER

>>98762928
I think there's an entire book dedicated to that.

Is it true that werewolves are the biggest dumbasses in owod? What about nwod?

>>98765287
>>98765326
The artist actually draws fairly little porn, it's just vaguely lewd

>>98765774
>What about nwod?
Well Beast kith changelings objectively take penalties to Int related rolls, so possibly them?

>>98765786
>>98765774
I remember 1st edition Requiem gangrel being quite dull.

>>98765774
Do you not know how retarded werewolves are? The Garou are responsible for everything wrong with the World of Darkness, at least everything wrong with Werewolf the Apocalypse, that's how retarded they are. Basically the only retarded thing that they're not responsible for is God cursing Caine, but I think a part of Caine's curse is cursing him to exist on the same retarded planet as the fucking Garou. It's their retardation that is responsible for the Weaver going mad, which led to the Wyrm going mad. It's their retardation that is responsible for the biggest genocide in almost any fictional setting, so severe and so retarded that they literally made humans so scared of their retardation that it's encoded into their genetic memory. It's their retardation that is responsible for the War of Rage and wiping out all of the other Fera who are nowhere near as retarded and actually did the fucking jobs that Gaia assigned them, unlike the retarded Garou. If the Garou didn't do any single one of those three majorly retarded sins, the World of Darkness wouldn't exist because everything would be sunshine and roses, but no, it's their retardation that is responsible for everything going back. It doesn't stop there either. They're so retarded that they're constantly battling each other over territory even though they have an apocalypse to stop. They're so retarded that they cling to the most retarded traditions imaginable even though it cripples their ability to stop any apocalypse. They're so retarded that even though they're the strongest splat straight out of character creation, they're still fucking losing and failing to stop the Apocalypse. They're so retarded that they have literally never done anything good for Gaia at once in their miserable fucking history even though that's the sole thing that they exist for. It's fucking offensive that you think that any other splat could ever come anywhere close to being as retarded as the werewolves are.