Was killing Newt and Hicks Alien 3’s boldest move or its unforgivable mistake and why has the film found so many passionate defenders over the years?
yeah it was fine, why would they have a happy ending in a dark scifi universe
>>221801608Very underrated movie, i love how hopeless it is
>>221801608thats not a nice thing to say about Sigourney Weaver
>>221801608Aliens turning the alien into a bug is the unforgivable mistake.
one movie of newt was more than enough
>>221801608this was the first alien movie I saw back when it was released on VHS, so the Newt/Kyle Reese thing never bothered me. I love the movie, but I wish we got to see more Charles Dance.t. unc
>>221801608>muh newt>muh hicksGrow up
I saw the movie just the other day and it was fine, I guess, 6/10. I really disliked the last 15minutes, which had lots of meandering nonsense in a tunnel. Also, the Alien creature in A3 kind of sucks: it's either rather bad CGI or a plain man-in-a-suit.
>>221801608I like Alien 3, the novelization of William Gibson's script, that is; movie is complete dogshit, though.
>>221802917Is mostly a poorly composited rod puppet, look it up.
The movie is like a grunge horror movie. I loved watching the Legacy cut
>>221801608I was 12 when Alien 3 was released. My best mate's big brother would rent films and we would watch them in his bedroom. I absolutely loved this movie when I first saw it. The following week, he rented Alien and Aliens. I enjoyed those, too, but I thought Alien 3 was the best of the trio. I never watched Alien 3 again until I was around 23, and when I did, I thought it was fuckin' shite. The xenomorph isn't remotely intimidating; and the CGI is appalling. I found the 'Assembly Cut' to be the better version, but still, I really do not like this film. On another note, I hated Alien Resurrection upon release, but I like it now.
>>221801608newt went on to his best role in tombstone so it turned out ok. alien 3 sucked but alien resurrection was a little better
>>221803869one of the versions had an absolute majestic scene when the xeno births and the funeral happens at the same time, I think that is the director's cut
>>221801608I like it because it has Paul McGann in it
>>221801608Focusing on Ripley again after Aliens was the mistake. Her story was over, how much longer can you drag it?
>>221803869It's not CG, a rod puppet, yadda yadda, but it does look like shit.
>>221803954It happens in both versions.The only difference is the thing it births from, either the dog or the ox.Always happens during the speech.Amen>I think that is the director's cutThere's no director's cut because the director disowned the movie and wants no part in it, so he obviously never provided a director's cut.There's only the theater cut or the assembly cut, which was cobbled together as best as they could in the absence of the director.
>>221803596A whippet is the worst possible dog they could've picked kek. The little guys are absolute wimps and some of the least threatening dogs ever.
>>221803883>newt went on to his best role in tombstoneMichael Biehn didn't play Newt.
>>221801608>>221801881>why has the film found so many passionate defenders over the years?Because it's a truer sequel to Alien than Aliens.Watch the Legacy Edit.
>>221803954>>221805332>>221805450>Replacing kino dog chestburster scene with some dead ox and deleting the alien queen bursting out of Ripley at the endExtended cut worst cut.
>>221801728It had some kino cinematography moments like Tywin's walk on the docks and Ripley's rescue in the special edition's intro. That alone could be the seed for a stand-alone novel/film/vidya.
>>221805529>and deleting the alien queen bursting out of Ripley at the endI'm conflicted on it1. It could be seen as kinda gratuitous 2. The one thing Ripley had managed to avoid for so long finally happens to her is weirdly poetic as she embraces her own death as well
>>221801608Unforgivable mistake is retaining Ripley. This fucking universe is smaller than the one in stuh wuhz
>>221804077This, the Alien franchise just became the Sigourney Weaver Show and suffered for it. Ripley was a great character but her arc was finished.It would have been better to pivot to Hicks and Newt like in pic related and carry on from there with the Earth being infested. Would have ramped up the stakes like Aliens did with AlienAlso fuck changing the xenomorphs, that killed the whole franchise for me and led to some serious retardation down the line, the original design of the aliens was perfect as it was https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aliens:_Earth_Hive
The soundtrack is so good in this movie. The movie is bleak and oppressive but the music elevates it to a classic tragedy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hi4g0Bv-fshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLdBpiL30kI&list=RDqLdBpiL30kI
>>221801608Better than Aliens.
>>221801941mostly
>>221801608>boldest move or its unforgivable mistakeNeither. I don't understand what people expected, a constantly expanding cast of characters with plot armor surrounding Ripley? Maybe the autopsy scene was a bit much, but its a movie with rape-goggles, so all bets are off.
>>221805401They wanted something scrawny and spindly so the rubber suit wouldn't look as bulky. It was also just going to be used in a few scenes after it hatches and is just running around.
>>221801608It didn't need to have Ripley in it at all. In fact, the whole plot hinges on a hole just to facilitate her presence in the story. How did the eggs get onboard the Sulaco? The queen's ovipositor was destroyed, and it was clearly not carrying any in the shot just before Bishop shows up in the dropship. It's also just a painfully boring movie, with a dull-as-dishwater cast of interchangeable bald brits yelling "fuck" in the dark, whereas both 1 and 2 had a well-rounded cast of characters who complemented other well, and brought their own distinct energy into the mix. I like the stuff from the lead works onward in 3, but everything before that is painful to sit through.It's a painfully mediocre movie that is carried by its production design, cinematography, score, and the admittedly effective finale. All the contrarian zoomies in this thread can get fucked, there's a reason why it has been disowned by basically everyone involved.
>>221801728>I love how hopeless it isThat’s what makes it almost unwatchable, but keep on having that opinion though.
>>221804077>>221805999>>221806059>>221808805>The third movie in a franchise should've ditched it's main heroine!Dumb take.
>>221808975So are you accounting the second movie?Cause if so, you shouldn't condone the third one. They are not so wrong, it got compromised when it became a Ripley story.
>Literally directed by Alan Smitheelol. lmao, even.
>>221809072>it got compromised when it became a Ripley storyI.e at the end of Alien (1979)?
>>2218016083 sucks, it’s just boring and wonky which is unfortunate because there’s lots of fine ideas for a movie in thereI can see people liking it now since as bad as it is it’s probably still more engaging than most of what we have today.Resurrection is underrated kino, a perfect direction for a worn out horror series, it could have led perfectly into live action Kenner style alien films
Ching Cong Ding Dong, Weera is Ruterant Lipery?
>>221808862I share that opinion, it's great
>>221801608I like 3, it felt moody and gloomy after the action of Aliens. The 4 or 5 new characters who got focus and development were good, but the dozen identical bald men gave the Alien too much fodder to stay threatening. The Alien puppet looked awful and distracting except for in the clinic scene, and the chasing people POV was just confusing as everything and everyone looked the same.
>>221805450Alien 3 is kino. It truly is fitting for the Alien being a nightmare engine of destruction that haunts Ripley and destroys her life, and the atmosphere and characters were unforgettable. Modern pedowood faggots couldn't make something this dark and effective now if they wanted to.
>>221809159>Resurrection is better than 3>live-action Kennerholy shit get a load of this literal fucking retardthis guy scratches his asshole then smells his finger
>>221809156Are you accounting the second movie then?
>>221805450Comparing something to Aliens is a very low bar. Cameron just did not understand the tone these movies are supposed to have at all. >>221809305The Prometheus movies and Romulous are far better. David would be up there with villains like Thanos and Darth Vader if we had gotten that third movie
>>221809278>but the dozen identical bald men gave the Alien too much fodder to stay threateningYeah, it turned into a lazy slasher movie at the end. But they ending wrapped everything up perfectly so it's all good.
>>221809328>this guy scratches his asshole then smells his fingerWhat's wrong with that?
>>221809405How did she survive this?
>>221808975>Calls others dumb>Doesn’t consider for a second that it didn’t need to be a trilogy to start with
>>221809332Yes, why wouldn't i?
>>221809518They cloned her. I turned Alien 4 off after like 15 minutes and never went back. Whedon turned it into fucking Buffy
>>221801608This movie is pure kino and I refuse to elaborate. It's a depressing movie about how man will always fail to draw on his God given virtues. We are all in hell and we are all already dead.
>le royale egg, le royale facehugger...How did the facefag get in Ripley's pod btw?
>>221809578You don't seem to
>>221801941Somehow, Newt has returned in android form
>>221801608Killing those characters was just revenge for the actors backing out of an obviously shitty project. It was very poorly handled and left a bad taste at the very start of the movie. Yes Alien 3 wanted to get back to the tone of the first movie and distance itself from the action sequel, but that was a terrible way to do it especially when 3 ended up being dogshit unable to justify itself.The theatrical release was an embarrassment. The assembly cut barely manages to salvage the movie into something mediocre and tolerable, still far worse than both movies that came before it.
>>221809601It's retard kino and your life is emptier for having never watched it. Has the best not-quite-sex scene too.
>>221810058Based Wincott.
>>221809601Why would cloning her even mean she grows with an alien in her? why would that be in her DNA?
>>221810208Kino mug.
>>221810308Well if you watch the movie you can see all the failed clones and realize they basically had a soup of alien and ripley dna and just slowly separated the two over years of genetic experiments
>>221801608Whoever decided to kill off Hicks & Newt is my hero. Their sappy inclusion in Aliens completely destroyed the horror atmosphere that the first film established—accentuated by the fact that they’re not really characters…like, at all. Their props for Ripley’s drama. There’s a reason why any time someone wrote new seguel stories with Hicks & Newt in the Alien media of the 80s and 90s, be it in novel or Dark Horse comic form, the first thing they would do was give both characters new personalities and motives.You know why every author did that? Because Hicks and Newt barely had any personality in the film they were in. It’s no wonder they had such a short lifespan in the franchise, because they barely have any creative utility beyond the film they debuted in. They’re not characters. They’re throwaway caricatures meant to grant domestic warmth to Ripley—nothing more. Thin, facile, anemic empty objects for plot. Just like all of Cameron’s characters.
>>221810840>Thin, facile, anemic empty objects for plotBut enough about all of Ridley's characters after Gladiator.
>>221805529the legacy cut has the dog birth and highly improved the creature puppet effects
>>221810309his best role aside from in robin hood. alien resurrection won. alien3 lost
>>221810058The movie should've bit the bullet and showed her getting fucked. Her and Ripley and Call.
>>221812197>and RipleyI mean...
>>221806059Agreed. They could have used any actress they wanted for adult Newt. Having a time gap between Alien and Aliens was a great choice, then having a big gap between Aliens and Alien 3 could have allowed them to do any interesting new story, setting, characters. Instead the actual Alien 3 just ran the series into a brick wall and it never recovered. So much potential wasted.
>>221810367>ey boss I got dis DNA soup of Ripley but it also has some really weird cells in itWell she had an alien burst out of her as she died right? just separate the cells>Uhhh i can't dey too similarBitch are you telling me that these superevolved killing machines has 46 pairs of chromosomes Identical to humans and these autists couldnt figure out how to separate the two
>>221813394Sounds like you are the autistYou know you can have dna outside a cell right? Have you never done the strawberry experiment? They probably just found gene fragments.
>>221813521you're telling me that they didnt have enough fully formed human DNA that they started randomly shoving in fragments? Not only that but these fragments have the same chemical properties as human DNA? That sounds pretty fucking stupid if you ask me
>>221813521>>221813602None of you understand what was happening in the movie.
Resurrection is overhated. It is retarded as fuck but it's entertaining and bizarrely French. My favorite running gag is Winona Ryder constantly getting finger-banged.
>>221814201Ok, what is happening in the movie?
>>221808805Why don’t you just admit you wanted another action sci-fi blockbuster?
>>221814511Aliens wasn't action though. It was more scary than Alien
One of the shittiest movies ever made.
>>221801608>Was killing Newt and Hicks Alien 3’s boldest moveIt's bold, if it's done for some purpose other than "we couldn't get the actors back". Which it wasn't, since there was no plan and the filming was a shitshow.> why has the film found so many passionate defendersBecause it went back to an alien being a near mythical unstoppable force instead of getting jobbed by the dozens once you have a gun. The whole pseudo-family happy forever ending of Aliens is alright if you're gonna end the franchise forever, but since they didn't it wasn't, and they needed a big reason for Ripley to be back in the same shit again.Having her infected with a queen is kind of a jank ass solution given the ending of 2 as well, but it's at least justified in giving her a way to kill herself forever (lel) taking the aliums with her.
>>221814390Alien rewrites the host's DNA.
>>221801608Ngl this movie's got some mad drip. Everyone's dressed straight up fire deadass
>>221814633It does genetically alter the host to create the chestburster, I suppose that’s a better way of saying what I am saying, that the alien absorbs the dna of the host so the stuff is tangled together.
>>221801608It's funny how all the "dogshit" movies of the past, that were criticized and mocked for decades by audiences and critics alike, now look like absolute masterpieces compared to modern movies. Even the very best movies today barely scratch the surface of the slop from the past. It's not like these movies were ever bad, but because we had it so good in the past with great movies coming out just about every weekend, the standards and expectations were set so high that even decent movies would get torn apart unfairly.
>>221814511Why don't you admit that you're just a contrarian?
>>221814559It's not mythical nor unstoppable in this. It's not even that in the first movie. The Alien has ALWAYS been pathetically easy to kill and needed vast plot armor and contrived scenarios to ensure it doesn't get killed immediately. In the first movie they are overly concerned about puncturing the hull with their guns or the Alien's acid blood, plus Ash protecting it. In Alien 3, they could easily kill it too but le prisoners don't have guns. You morons always misunderstood it and created idiotic headcanon that it's some invincible, immortal, lovecraftian eternity monster. And Alien 3 was made with zero consideration and zero respect towards the previous movies as well as zero thought towarda a coherent series. The guy wanted to make some stupid prison monk movie, so he did. He didn't care what contrived bullshit he had to pull out of his ass to make it happen. Magic eggs appear out of nowhere? Do it. Magically next to a planet and magic fire starts to dump the survivor onto the planet? Sounds great. It was a tragically moronic movie and ruined the series for going on half a century.
>>221814633That makes more sense I guess - that said, you wouldnt be able to rewrite the DNA of every single cell in the body unless the chestburster acts like a giant fucking virusRegardless of the fact that the facehugger implants someone with a parasite that grows inside the host, there is no way that this animal would find a way to penetrate the DNA of every single cell of a host. It literally makes zero sense.And yeah I know I know 'ITS A MOVIE' but this is the reason I didnt understand it in the first fucking place - because it's stupid.
>>221801608Shit movie, I regret watching it.
>>221801655yeah it diddnt work at all for the first two movies rofl lol lmao just kill everyone off and bring it to a crashing shitty end, just after aliens got everyone hyped for more.FUCK alien 3 and anyone who likes it.
>>221814993The alien IS framed like the devil in this movie. All this talk of "dragon" and the insane prisoner worshipping him and the place being full of smoke and brimstone.
>>221801608Alien 3 did what was best for the series: killing off Ripley.Alien doesn't need a main character and it is the hallmark of terrible writing to need a crutch like that, when you could come up with something original.Then Resurrection brought her back because terrible writers needed their main character crutch.
>>221810840they should have killed em all then ripley toowhy the fuck clinging so much on heryou could have had a sequel without them all entirely you fuckwit faggot
>>221808805>Muh ovipositorIt's an egg sac you sperg, the ovipositor is between her legs and can lay an egg just fine without an egg sac to mature in.Not outlandish for her to drop a couple eggs in transit and they developed during hypersleep
>>221814559>unstoppable forceit never wasnot even in the first movieit's all in your fuck head man
>>221814968Because that’s an external designation that borders on solipsism, where only (you)r opinions are genuine and everything else exists only to upset (you).
>>221816118the older i get the more i despise and loathe fincher
>>221814539>aliens wasn’t action because it was scarynigger what
>>221816220>Alien 3 did what was best for the series: killing off Ripley.but it didn't fucking need toliterallyit could have just done anything else without her entirelyjesus fucking christ
>>221816220literally the irony in your post dude
>>221816432le royale egg??le royale facefugger??it can breed two times nowalright got itfuck gimme a break
I like the movie but killing off Newt and Hickswas a terrible idea. Fincher's idea, apparently,but Sig gave it her approval.
>>221813394I took it as they needed to restore denatured (read: cooked) protein chains from what would’ve been ash and that’s why they had trouble isolating the human and alien dna. Also there’s the “it won’t kill me” bits in alien 3 which indicates the parasite does also change something about the host so drones can tell who’s infected or not.
friendly reminder
>>221816740she destroyed the franchise, she would do anything for a quick buck, to this very day she is still hustling .
>>221801728Exactly this, I wouldn't expect everyone to like it but half the reason I love the original so much is because of how ludicrously bleak it is. I like Aliens a lot taken on its own but it kind of shits on the murky cosmic horror angle and turns into military sci fi that happens to have xenos getting blown up. How often do you get a big budget second sequel that basically tells the audience fuck themselves and doubles down on the grimness instead of just running on brand recognition and spectacle? I love it even if it was a total mistake in general
>>221801608>why has the film found so many passionate defenders over the yearsGood question. The only 3 good movies in the Alien franchise are Alien, Aliens and Prometheus and they are all good for entirely different reasons. Alien 3 has a good atmosphere, but beyond that it's strictly worse than Alien in every regard.>>221809387>RomulousA very solid premise with incredible art direction that turned into a "greatest moments" Youtube compilation of Alien tropes. If the writers had any ambition and attempted to tell at least a somewhat novel story - it could've been the best Alien movie since the original.
Its a worser movie than Aliens but a better sequel. It also has the best soundtrack of any alien movie period.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PaD_mtNHaiY
>>221817245The mistake was fox editors thinking it needed to be 90 minutes long.
>>221817628Go to bed Lindelof you’re drunk
>>221816811that makes the most sense i guess, building her back up from scratch from barely recognizable genetic materialI think its just one of those things that the more you think about it the sillier it seems. Jurassic Park never had that problem.
>>221818018And the ensuing clusterfuck in all aspects of its production from start to finish. When I call it a 'mistake' that's not a criticism, I think knowing what a shitshow it all was adds to its mystique.
>>221818291It’s quite easy to think there’s also a viral load that alters the host’s dna but since the host will be dead soon it can’t do more than make their infection detectable.
>>221817245>all comsic horror has to be the exact same with the same ending where everyone diesThere's no gayer "genre" than this. And both Alien and Aliens end with a ray of hope ending anyways, yeah some people died and there's corporate fuckery just like IRL, doesnt mean everyone should die from being raped kikeslaves 24/7/365
>>221813394>Bitch are you telling me that these superevolved killing machines has 46 pairs of chromosomes Identical to humans and these autists couldnt figure out how to separate the twoI thought it was accepted that xenos were genetically related to their host organism, hence biped humanoid xenos most of the time, and quadriped dog/ox xeno in Alium 3.Also you're not supposed to think too much about it, it's a space alium movie with spaceships, androids, terraforming, hibernation, independently targeting particle-beam phalanx and phased plasma rifles in the 40 watt range.
>>221816650There is no irony there you illiterate cunt >>221816678You mentioned them, not me.You're the one building goalposts just to heft them around.There's nothing saying they NEED the egg sac to work. But it's a simple implication that she lays a small egg into the sac, it matures and grows and gets placed over time.
>>221818406You are a clod and I'd have you beaten in public. The enitre point of Alien was that her 'reward' for survival was to go into totally unconscious hypersleep and drift in blackness forever, having made up a comforting scenario about possibly being found. It was Cameron who looked at that and thought "hey what if that but then she WAKES UP then everyone has a big fight with like GUNS and shit".
>>221816678The egg sack is just a royal jelly factory for mass egg laying. She lays a couple eggs, vomits some royal jelly on them, and they’re good to go.
>>221801608>why has the film found so many passionate defenders over the years?If you watch the Assembly cut it’s an extremely good movie. If you watched the theatre version on release I imagine it was a letdown. But, for everyone who got into the series late, we have the benefit of seeing the full film.
>>221818574You couldn't have anyone beaten up in public you giant queer.
>suddenly>daily Alien threads with in-depth discussion>againJust like in the run up to the Alien Earth abomination. For YEARS we barely had any Alien threads and then bam, suddenly there were almost daily ones, sometimes multiple, for months before the series came out. Very organic.I guess the astroturfing and subconscious shilling for S2 has begun.Also everyone in this (and all other) thread is a bot.
>>221818774I'm going out right now to antagonise someone into kicking my teeth in and if you pull any 'spirit of the rules' shit with me I swear to god
>>221801608Aliens sort of slam dunked on the whole Newt/Hicks/Ripley thing, i think the only solution to it was to have them get back to earth and live happily ever after which was kind of implied. Would have been stupid to just revive them all somewhere and have them all go through it again, i think Ripley was all you needed to go forward with a new film and casting newt with a new actress would have been unworkable imo, and the crash landing/deaths/prison colony setting worked well imo. I enjoyed all the cuts too. Lance Henrikson's Bishop does return briefly which is a nice connection to the second film but i just dont know how you would pitch a sequel which wasnt just about Ripley moving on again.
>>221818901Go ahead, make my day cunt. And im still right about the movie too.
>>221805450>Watch the Legacy Edit.No, fuck off, lol.
>Alien 3 did what was best for the series: killing off Ripley.>Alien doesn't need a main character and it is the hallmark of terrible writing to need a crutch like that, when you could come up with something original.>>221818509>There is no irony there you illiterate cuntif it doesn't need a main character why do you account the third movie (and thus the previous one) with the main character just to have it killed you bitch>>221818634that's all a given btw
>>221806059Perry's trilogy is the perfect follow up to Aliens and it's peak gay that they had to rename the characters to not conflict with the A3 (dis)continuity.
>>221818634Also the queen of a bee hive personally determines which eggs will develop into queens by changing the shape of a cell. Which means any egg can be a queen as long as it is allowed to develop into one.
>>221801608>Was killing Newt and Hicks Alien 3’s boldest move or its unforgivable mistakeUnforgivable. Destroys the ending of Aliens. >and why has the film found so many passionate defenders over the years?It's still an effective movie with a lot of grit and edge. I've always enjoyed it, even if fans and the director didn't.
>>221807114>We're all gonna die, the only question is when. This is as good a place as any to take your first steps to heaven. The only question is how you check out. Do you wanna go on your feet? Or on your fucking knees, begging? I ain't much for begging! Nobody ever gave me nothin! So I say fuck that thing! Let's fight it!
>>221810058The only genuinely bad thing about Resurrection is the Joss Whedon script, which he has officially apologized for before reworking it and eventually turning it into firefly.
>>221801608Yeah. I'm glad they got rid of them. They renewed the franchise in a good way. I don't even want to imagine them in any of the sequels. They served their purpose enough in the Aliens.
>>221810840This. Newt kills the tension because a soulless corporate giant like Fox would never, ever let a child get murdered on screen. They barely let Alien happen.
>>221823072>tbeyd never let a kid get killed on screen!>immediately kill her on screen in the sequel
>>2218231281986 was peak corprate America soullessness. 1992 was Dirt.
>>221816626Yeah, /tv/ anons can't grasp the concept of a sequel not containing the same actor/character and not doing the exact same thing. They can't comprehend a character's story being finished, without them dying, the character moving on, the story focusing on someone new. It breaks their little brains to think about this and makes them seethe like crazy. It's why they are still mad that Predator 2 didn't have Arnold in it. "What do you mean he could just fight it one time and never see it again in his life?! As long as he is alive he must fight monsters dozens of times until it's getting ridiculous then die! Only then is it a good story!" Is what they inevitably whine
>>221801608i rewatched it couple days ago, holy fuck it's bad, not really bad, but really really dull
I'm a fan, it has some iconic scenes and I like the bleak nihilistic vibehttps://www.youtube.com/shorts/KAkrTnhBY-ofollow me bros I post kino horror clips all the time
>>221814559They jumped through all sorts of hoops just to have Ripley kill herself in the end anyways. She already got her redemption arc from the second movie; why bring her back at all?
>>221825417They shouldn't. It needed another time skip, new location, new source of eggs, and new characters. They dropped the ball hard by hiring Fincher and him just making up any random shit, not caring about the series whatsoever
The fans who hated it wanted slop on the level of the Avengers or some shit.
>>221825784this. it's a horror franchise, why would anyone assume it's gonna have a happy ending based on the material?
>>221801608Assembly Cut is the defacto cut. Alien 3 will easily filter those who grew too attached to the killed off characters from Aliens but what this film does is make it a horror title again, create the most bleak and near surrealist environment that I can't hate and appreciate how bold it is in its execution. Gets a pass from me and it's the 2nd best Alien installation.
