Heretic + Hexen = ????
I want a game that looks those games but has the story of picrel
>>719529652Are these games good? They look fun but what am I in for with them?
>>719530178>what am I in forRetro Doom: Dark Ages. Worth playing for sure
>>719529652They linked up??
>>719529652I thought D'Sparil was gonna be in Doom: Eternal, but that dream is long gone now.
>>719530596I thought it would have been cool if there'd been some link to Hexen or Heretic in Dark Ages
>>719529652I love the original Doom and the aesthetics of Heretic and Hexen but I find them both honeslty kind of shit to play.
>>719531220Yeah that would activate neurons.
>>719529652Hexetic
>>719531245>Switch Hunt: The GameCV11 educated me on the hell that these games really are.
>>719529820Holy fucking shit of hell, I can't believe there's another Swano bro and cultured Crimson appreciator on this godforsaken board.
>>719529652I don't like secrets in these games, they are even more retarded than in Blood, you literally forced to run face to wall and mash E.
>>719531302>CivvieI've never seen someone have such a shit opinion when it comes to Hexen
>>719531319Real recognizes real, listening to it rn
>>719531448Swano's got some of the most kino lyrics that have really good potential to be kino games/movieshttps://youtu.be/dDh1E1GuI10?si=hQwWv7HttqCu7Z9thttps://youtu.be/K2Iynv6O5qw?si=A54n0VIWZcsiTqRUhttps://youtu.be/HBo6kVUFZ74?si=fMVZGFYM8B6w3GT5
>>719531331>>719531245
>>719531651I listen to his stuff all the time while playing vidya. I like how all the anons with good taste in music I find anywhere but /mu/
Fact: playing Heretic is funnier with tank controls
>>719531823How so?
>>719531780You enjoy retarded secrets, huh?
>>719531803I used to play Heretic shitloads of time while listening to atmospheric metal, those were really cozy times.For some reason I loved listening to these two in particular, found them really fitting the game's atmosphere.https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLp7J1_-ajtJWA-j0WKh30D3UaRMtwZ9An&si=_mYUNFJ95_0atU9Ohttps://youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_kTPQkZ7jwSO4BxtHeEwop1qf3YFQXLOUI&si=98h5yCL8NxTo0wj1
>>719529652I like the art. That's pretty cool.
>>719532076Thanks for the recs anon, will listen to these
>>719531780I just don't find the weapons or level design pleasant. I mention liking the original Doom in my post and you still got triggered.
>>719532280Original Doom is as braindead as a game can possibly get. No wonder you liked it and Herehexen filtered you out.
>>719533029I wouldn't say Doom is braindead as it has hit scanners, this requiring more tactical approach. Heretic however has better atmosphere, better level design, and better weapons impact.
>>719534173On the contrary - removing the hitscanners made the game much more skill based instead of random. You forget to consider that all of the attacks in both Heretic and Hexen were more complex than in doom, e.g. d'sparil apprentices are shooting three projectile at once, the Heretic serpents shoot three projectiles in a quick succession followed by a stronger one in the end, and Lich shoots you up the sky with a tornado, as well as shooting ice bolts that shatter in 8 directions. And don't get me started on Molotaur...
>>719533029Doom is a better game.
>>719535235No, it's rather shitty. Everyone with an ounce of taste understands that.
>>719529652Please tell me if there are some good mods for these games. Or some good doom mods that have the feel of heretic/hexen to them
>>719531331yeah, i really don't get it>mash e on walls every once in a while, some stuff looks out of place but does nothing>get to the end of a level finding 1 secret and nothing else>1/14 secrets foundshits absurd
>>719535414>secrets being secret is bad
>>719530178Heretic is basically Doom reskin, it's not bad nor good, kinda boring if you aren't in the Doom WAD mood.Hexen on the other hand is a proper game that managed to move on from Doom, you can pick classes and blast enemies with unique weapons while going through Mario 64 esque hub world.I don't want to completely disregard Heretic, as Heretic is pretty good if it was a WAD, but you could start from Hexen if you weren't up for fantasy reskin of Doom.
>>719529652Heretic married Hexen?How progressive!
Hexen has tedious combat and cryptic bullshitFuck HexenYes I got filtered
>>719535235There wouldn't be Hexen without Doom but imo Hexen is a better game than Doom.Not sure if Thy Flesh Consumed includes in your definition, but this FPS platforming nightmare was absolutely dog shit game design
>>719530596Me too guy.>Call back to the medieval age>Samuel being referred as The Heretic>The world spear makyrs dressed in similar robes as D'Sparil>Dragons and Wyrms that look similar >Gargoyles & Minotaurs>Samuel disappears after act 1 of TAGAs stupid as The Ancient Gods was, the payoff would had saved the expansions if it all had been a setup for the Heretic reboot.I am pretty sure Dark Ages was meant to be Heretic but Bethesda got cold feet.I am still waiting for Id to unfuck Dark Ages but seems like it is going to be a year.
>>719531302>>719531393Civvie stated he thought the 90s MK movie was shit and that the Fallout show was much better than any form of videogame related media and only faggots parrot eceleb opinions.Not to mention the Heretic + Hexen re-release, much like Quake 2, are not some lazy 1:1 ports. Nightdive fixed so much behind scenes it feels completely different. Better actually.Weapons are punchier, enemies are more aggressive.Even the original midis sound better.I played the original Heretic and Quake 2 and they are as boring as I remember them in contrast to the rebalanced re-releases.
>>719529652Boss Baby
>>719531331>you literally forced to run face to wall and mash EGood bait.Heretic and Hexen secrets are very different.Mashing E will get you nowhere.For Heretic there is some platforming required and walking into some dark corner you missed. Truth be told Heretic secrets are well communicated for the first part and you do not need to hit 100% unless you are on the hardest difficulty and you are not save scumming either.For Hexen there is some cryptic shit and more platforming.The only game that has an unnecessary amount of secrets is Rise of the Triad, there all there is to it is E mashing.
>>719529652Hecatomb.
>>719538775>Picture Arcane Dimensions with more wizards, magic and shiet.Too Kino.
>>719538052>Heretic is basically Doom reskinMost retarded opinion ever. You just told everyone you haven't played Heretic without telling it.
>>719529652Civvie's complaints about the Heretic changes were pedantic.Heretic was a slog and the balance changes improved it.And if he didn't like the changes he could always change them in the options menu.
>>719541368>Heretic was a slogNo, just a skill issue.
>>719541402>using 1/2 of your total ammo of all weapons combined to kill one maulotaur is good design, actually
>>719541451If you didn't notice, Heretic have separate ammo for each weapon unlike doom. It also seems like you don't use tomes of power, urns, and the shadow sphere like you should.Fighting a single Molotaur is infinitely more fun than fighting all doom monsters combined.
>>719538052Nigga?
>>719529652fun
>>719530178Heretic is DOOM but with fantasy and an inventory, same sort of level layouts, similar arsenalHeXen is more its own thing with hub levels, character classes, mix of melee and ranged weapons, etc, some nifty tricks done with the DOOM engineBoth worth playing
If you think Hexen's level design is confusing, then you are objectively retarded. It's not hard to remember where doors are. But it's kind of a boring game anyway with the tiny enemy roster and weapons being split between classes. Hexen 2 is a bit better.
>>719531302I on the other hand, actually played it, and had a good time playing my video game. Enjoy watching your video.
>>719531780the cloonkthe clooooonkI can't clooooonk
>>719541251It 100% is a Doom reskin. Even the weapons are straightforward fantasy equivalents. You have your melee, your chainsaw, your pistol, your shotgun, your chaingun, your rocket launcher, your plasma rifle, then no BFG equivalent (the only exception, as the fire mace doesn't really line up with anything in Doom). Level style and progression is also identical, down to the shareware model and episodes, with the map, 8 levels plus a secret level, your three keycards, etc. Even the Maulotaur is similar to the Cyberdemon.None of this is an insult, it manages to stand out regardless thanks to solid level design, the inventory system, and a more colorful fantasy aesthetic. But it absolutely is Doom but Fantasy. Hexen was more its own thing, moving away from the basic Doom formula.
>>719538735I just ran through all of Heretic in this new collection. Now, it's been a long time since I played through the game and I only played through the original three episodes back then, so I don't know if any secrets were made more obvious in the new "enhanced" levels, or if the improvements were solely visual flair, but I found every secret and it wasn't tough, there is plenty of indication through texturing and lighting, you get the feel of where secrets are likely to be within just a few levels of episode 1, out of five episodes, plus the new one. I only had to look up secrets maybe two or three times total.
>>719541451You really don't fight Maulotaurs that often.
>>719541793The new collection added an optional tome object in each hub where you can freely swap to the other classes, so you aren't stuck as just one for the entire game. Makes a big difference.
>>719541781>Heretic is DOOM but with fantasy and an inventory, same sort of level layouts, similar arsenal...and a different more skill based game design due to lack of hitscanning enemies and shared ammo, as well as improved engine that calculated height for enemies and objects and allowed you to run under/jump on top of them, as well as letting you fly with wings of wrath; completely different, bigger and more complex levels, and an arsenal that can be altered immensely by Tome of Power.>>719542045>It 100% is a Doom reskin. Even the weapons are straightforward fantasy equivalents.You never used tome. Even then your analysis is kinda wrong - the crossbow functions nothing like a shotgun.>Level style and progression is also identicalWrong.>Even the Maulotaur is similar to the Cyberdemon.Is that a fucking shitpost? All cyberdemons do is pew pew rockets at you. Molotaur shakes the earth, sends the fire wall that penetrates most of the level geometry, charges at you and stomps you. Play the damn game, then type.
>>719542224>and a different more skill based game designah yes, circle strafing all your enemies and popping tomes of power when there are more than 20 enemies on screen.Such skill
>>719542342>agoo gaga im filtered and im mad, doom is so much better cuz need to use brain less playing it
>>719542224A spread gun that fires one shot at a time, the crossbow is pretty similar to the shotgun and you're gonna use it in a pretty similar way to the shotgun. It's projectiles, yes, but it's still a go to punchy weapon.You're also talking about specifics of game design, none of which preclude it being a very clear "fantasy Doom". Like saying the Maulotaur has more attacks, how does that change it being a big minotaur enemy used as the final boss of episode 2, then sparingly as a miniboss enemy in certain maps after that? It's not an insult to point out they are used in a similar way in both games.It's a good game and Raven used the Doom engine well. It's still very much "here's our version of Doom". While Hexen broke out from that mold.
>>719542386Heretic is piss easy, fake boomer
>>719542342And no, you don't need to circle strafe. You just have to not be a tard and learn how to dodge - it's like with doom's mancubus.
>>719542224And by the way, Heretic is not that difficult, it has a difficulty spike in the Shadow of the Serpent Riders episodes, especially early on, but the original three episodes are pretty easy. The inventory gives you far more ways of dealing with foes than Doom does.
>>719542516Nobody calls Heretic difficultTedious, it's what it is.
>>719542419>Like saying the Maulotaur has more attacks, how does that change it being a big minotaur enemy used as the final boss of episode 2, then sparingly as a miniboss enemy in certain maps after that? It's not an insult to point out they are used in a similar way in both games.I'm pointing you out that a Molotaur is infinitely better designed enemy than anything doom has in it's bestiary. Though to be fair, any Heretic enemy has more complex attacks than their doom's "contemporaries".>"here's our version of Doom"More like "hey, we fixed doom, and actually made a full-fledged game and not a techdemo which doom is".>>719542516Even the first episode of Heretic is more difficult than shit like thy flesh consumed. And I hope you've been playing it on Black Plague with no saves to make such statements.
>>719542621>I'm pointing you out that a Molotaur is infinitely better designed enemy than anything doom has in it's bestiaryWhich still has nothing to do with what I'm talking about because they are still used in almost exactly the same way in terms of encounter design.
>>719542621>Even the first episode of Heretic is more difficult than shit like thy flesh consumedNo it isn't.
Playing Heretic for the first time and my immediate thought was "Doom but fantasy".It feels VERY VERY similar.
>>719543123
I hate when I agree with some points from both sides of a retarded argument.
>>719543123whoa..... never thought about it like that before
Heretic is literally Doom but with fantasy and magic
>>719529652He e
The sound design in hexen makes me want to cum
>>719543682What about Heretic's laughs and chain rattle?
>>719538440>Civvie stated he thought the 90s MK movie was shitWhen did he say that?
>>719538440>Nightdive fixed so much behind scenes it feels completely different. Better actually.Mocking these games with stupid mods no one asked for, hulshult's tasteless butchering of game's music and faggy rebalance is not better.
>>719530178Heretic is a cool Doom clone.Hexen is a crap attempt at non-linear level design.
>>719544637retard + faggot + shit taste
Hexen becomes infinitely more accessible with this update. Some simple map markers do it wonders. I've actually finished it now, when before I quit midway through Seven Portals.
>>719544671You can admit to liking bad games. It's fine.
>>719544878>faggot yapping
>>719544869I don't think Hexen needed markers but for what it's worth Seven Portals is the most "obtuse" hub in the entire game. It eases up considerably starting with the second hub, the Shadow Wood.
>>719531393Hexen is pretty well known as peak "where the fuck do I go".That you can play it today from memory doesnt mean it has terrible and confusing design, even for the time and 2 is much worse.
>>719545306indeed. It's a weird game that gets more comprehensive with each hub. The Necropolis is so straight forward it's basically impossible to get lost in it.
>>719529652>Heretic + Hexen
>>719541251Calm your tits, I didn't mean literally down to the technical point, I meant that in a hyperbolic way to illustrate that the game feels like a reskin lmao. Didn't you read the part I said "basically"?Items were way more prevalent I know but that didn't change the fact everything else felt like Doom, I don't like the term "Doom clone" but if Duke Nukem was considered "Doom clone" back then, Heretic was literally Doom.I played it up to Shadow of the Serpent Riders decade ago btw, it's alright but it just felt like a solid Doom mod through and through. In fact modern Doom mod would be able to make something more different from Doom than Heretic, even if Heretic was made from scratch.I can see the reason why they completely rebranded their name when they made Hexen, pretty sure even the devs knew Heretic was majorly unoriginal aside from the usage of Tomes.
>>719546121The rebrand was because Hexen, called Heretic 2 until nearly the end of development, changed so drastically from Heretic. They wanted it to still be the same series so they tacked on 'Beyond Heretic' to the title to inform people that they're the same series. Think of it like the reverse of Quake and Quake 2, where Quake 2 was originally a new ip called 'Wor' but ended up just calling it Quake 2 despite no similarities between the two.
>>719542781ok savescummer
>>719542224>an arsenal that can be altered immensely by Tome of PowerHoly shit you type like a marketing department, what a fucking retarded exaggeration for a disappointing featureTome of Power was badly implemented, they made all those alt fires for each weapons yet they relegated that into a rare consumable item with 40 second timer, which essentially made the item into a glorified invulnerability pick upOnly difference is that you dish out more power instead of having infinite health, situational usage is basically the same, what a ground breaking original concept>b... but it's togglable!! Cool minor QoL update
>>719547171>Holy shit you type like a marketing department, what a fucking retarded exaggeration for a disappointing featureNot an exaggeration, tome completely changes the behaviour of most weapons, like the claw, horned staf, phoenix rod, and the mace, as well as letting the gloves to act as a life leech. It's not that rare either, you are supposed to explore the levels properly and find the secrets. Play the game, then argue.>Only difference is that you dish out more power instead of having infinite health, situational usage is basically the same, what a ground breaking original conceptIf you'd played the game, you'd know that Heretic had an actual invulnerability item - the ring. And that the tome is hardly as OP as you assume it to be, savescumming faggot.>>b... but it's togglable!!>Cool minor QoL updateWhat the fuck is that supposed to mean? Anyways, shit bait.
>>719547421Yes I know the game had invulnerability item, which made it double stupid. It's just more common, less op invulnerability item. CrazySure tomes had more uses because the game had more bullet spongy enemies, but increasing pick ups to offset the bullet spongy enemies? Is that really an improvement?> It's not that rare either, you are supposed to explore the levels properly and find the secretsSo like any other doom item?>What the fuck is that supposed to mean?QoL means quality-of-life, do you even play games outside of Heretic? Also idk what kind of strawman you're talking to but am I a "never played heretic man" or am I a "save scumming heretic man"? Keep your insults consistent please.
>>719529652= mega mid doom clone
>>719547826>am I a "never played heretic man" or am I a "save scumming heretic man"?Just a faggot with shit taste.
>>719545862kek
>>719552143kok
>>719552828lol
>>7195296521/HE = retic + EN
DAMN YOU, D'SPARILDAMNYOU
>>719529820>buttmetal
>>719553047metal is nigger music
>>719553085sorta, 90% of modern western music is built on african american roots
>>719553149trvke but I meant that it has niggerfaggot energy
>>719529652I always get Heretic and Hexen confused. all I know is that one of them is infamous for key hunts and maze-like level design, which I found to be the worst aspects of DoomI read some massive reviews of them on backloggd and they made the argument that the maze stuff is overblown so are these actually good or what? Heretic II looks fun as fuck, at leastI'm more of a Bloodchad
>>719555192Heretic is no more or less key/switch hunt-y than Doom. Hexen is like a proto Metroid Prime, heavy emphases on exploration and key/switch hunting, but with Doom combat. If Doom/Heretic are 70/30 combat/exploration, Hexen like 40/60 combat/exploration. The complaints about getting lost are certainly exaggerated but not 100% without warrant. It just seems though that the majority of people lack basic environmental awareness and memorization. If you get the Steel Key, perhaps go to the previous level you were just in called the Guardian of Steel and check the one single door you couldn't open before. Basic shit.Heretic 2 is very different from the previous games but a ton of fun. It was basically the blueprint for Jedi Outcast: same combat, same movement, same level design, same devs, just Heretic/Hexen flavor instead of Star Wars.
>>719555712got it, thanks
This remaster serves literally no purpose because GZDoom exists, which has a SHITTON more improvements, is very mature and moddable to hell and back. I just finished Heretic act 1 yesterday without a single issue.I assume this was made to cash on technically illiterate, to which installing something outside Steam and dealing with file system is black magic.The only thing I liked (from the trailer) was the remade music, it rocks.
>>719556185Is that image supposed to be a joke?
>>719556185>GZDoom existsgzslop serves literally no purpose because DSDA and Chocolate Heretic exists.
>>719551519Good game.
>>719556185I'll never understand how people like you think everybody is even away of what a source port is. Maybe 10% of the people who even know what Doom is have ever heard of ZDoom, GZDoom, Chocolate Doom, etc.
>>719556185nigga this ai slop upscales look like absolute shit and what the fuck is with the hud, are those niggas on crack? I hope it's a meme and you're not actually playing like this
>>719529820>music album >story
>>719556286.. if one wants the authentic experience. I don't anymore (at least not necessarily).>>719556474fucking google literally tells you what to use as its first search resultyou don't have to know the term "sourceport" to use it
Sometimes when running against walls at just the right angle you gain crazy speed. Was that in the original or just a remake thing?
>>719557001https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Wallrunning
