We need to address the Silksong pricing problem...
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Holy fuck kill yourself you niggerty nigger
>>719565861KWAB, get fucked
silksong can afford to be 20 dollars because it's going to sell infinity copies, but what about other games?
>>719565861I'd rather pay $40 on this guy indie than $10 on memesong.
>>719565861sell it for 5 buck, but i bet its worth 2poorfag development budget = poorfag pricing
>>719565861this meme is not particularly funny
50% of all sales is taken by Gaben and the VAT fees
>pricing your game based on what other games are priced atnot going to make it
>>7195658611 hour = $1If your game is 15 hours long, you should only pay $15 for it.
>>719565861Why are all these faggots crying? Make a good game and people won't care. If you just made a worse "metroidvania" then people weren't going to buy it anyways.
>I can't afford to give it away for freeMeanwhile Cave Story.
>>719565861Guys dumb as shit. I will definitely buy a more humble game for 20 still. I just won't buy a more humble game for 35 Silksong didn't change that. It just made them aware of what was already happening
>>719565861$20 is finesilksong can afford to bite the cost because they know they'll sell a lot of copies
>>719565861>People complaining about a game being too cheapUnreal. These people should be tarred and feathered.
I can't wait till people play this game and realize its probably about 5-8h of game play total and that's why it's $20 lmaoo
>>719565861This guy should be so lucky that people compare his game to Silksong.
>>719566398this has always been a stupid mentality in buying games and has caused otherwise well paced games to try and bloat their games with bull crapjust give a game replayability and its got infinite hours
>>719565861the whole pricing drama is even more funny since most indie games are in the 15-30 dollar price range anywaysit's dev mass psychosis
>>719566553Who cares about "cost" they want it to be price at 20, so the while package could be sold at 40. It's stupid that these faggots are crying on twitter. Nobody cared or has even looked at their games.
>look up his game>it's a HK ripoff>as in it just copies HK, not just because it's a metroidvania
>>719565861Pricing doesn't matter within a close enough range, if someone likes your game enough to but it he'll but it weather it's 5$ or 20$, the problem lies if your game is 40$~50$ in which case the consumer has to like your game even more and be confident that it's actually good, but 40$~50$ are basically the same, in regards to competing with silksong you're not competing for the consumer's money but rather his time and enjoyment, why should i play your game for 10 hours when silksong is the same genere and better? People don't have infinite time and with jobs and the like now taking more time then ever consumers will choose the better games to spent their time on
>>719566727That's why I don't bother with indie games anymore. It's all the same crap. Here's my unique farming sim!, here my unique metroidvania!, here my unique rougelike!. For being indie its all variations of itself.
>>719566727whats wrong with people trying to imitate a game they like especially if its a very small team?
>>719566398>league of legends costs 1 3,000$>TF2 costs 10,000$>the average gachafag will have to pay 1 million because of all the dailiesit's over
>>719566848When they're charging $20 for it it just means I'm not going to buy it.Especially when it's the same price as the game they're literally ripping off.
>>719566808yeah there's so much more variety in AAA...
>>719566848Nothing. Just don't start crying when the game you're copying gets a sequel.
>>719566927i don't think they're crying
>it's another combat focused Metroidvania with a dash move and grapple jump
>>719566918That's not the point or issue though. If all these games are copying the same base like hollow knight and slay the spire then whats there to look forward to? AAA gaming sucks but modern indie games are worse.
>>719566918>>719567032Case in point
>>719565861Lone Fungus sucks. Just like HK. Fucking subpar metroidvanias.
>>719567035indie ranges from literal one man armies, to small dev teams, to moderately sized teams that don't have a major publishermaybe start paying attention to games you like lol
>>719567148That doesn't mean they all have to make the same game. Indie gaming sucks dude. All the good ideas ran out a while ago.
You price it at 20 dollars anyways. This isn't some deliberate undercutting of industry standards to sap players away from other games, 20 bucks is pretty much baseline for indies.
I priced mine at $3 and keep throwing it on sale. Any indie dev thinking their first garbage unoriginal metroidbania is worth anything is delusional
>>719565861>but I'm a poor single dev, I can't just give away my gameSure you can and if it's good, it will succeed
>>719566398Kill yourself
The world is in a cost of living crisis with inflation running rampant in most areas. Undercutting your competition and not trying to maximise your profit per unit will actually more likely than not result in a better profit through increased sales.It's the underlying thought behind Silksong's aggressive pricing. Given that prices here in Australia for average games have exploded recently.For instance MGS3 remake is $120.
>>719567189>someone decides to make a game based off a game they like>other people want to see games based off ones they like to see what people like>UMMM DIDN'T YOU FORGET TO ASK SOMEONE FOR PERMISSION
>>719565861If you're a solo indie dev making yet ANOTHER metroidvania then you should be happy anyone is willing to play your game for free
WHOFUCKINGCARES
>>719565861Someone tell this guy comparison is the thief of joy. If he thought $20 was a fair price, he should price it at that.Silksong is priced at $20 because Team Cherry knows it'll sell a gorillion copies.
>>719567402Nobody is saying to ask for permission. The issue is the market is flooded with these same games "inspired" by each other who are equally making the same freaking game.
>>719565861than sell it for 10$ if you dont want give it out for free lmao
>I WORKED HARD ON MY GAMESo keep it $20, you fucking baby. Was this guy crying when other metroidvanias came out?
hollow knight launched at 15 bucks why is suddenly a problem
Just price it as much as you think it truly worth
>>719565861I'm not gonna play Silksong but the indie dev butthurt is golden>OH NOOOOO THIS GAME MOGS MY GAAAME NOW I GOTTA PRICE IT AT $1.99 BECAUSE IT SUCKS COMPARED TO SILKSOOOOONG
>>719565861KekThis "dev" is probably a faggot or a tranny.
>>719565861what is Cave Story?
people don't want to make games they want to be multimillionaires the true craftsman makes the game he wants to play
>>719565861>orange man wins>woke shit being cracked down on >people genuinely excited for a game that's coming out>/v/ has to come up with shit to be angry aboutthis is what happens when you finally get your way
>>719567402I hope you never complain about eshops being flooded with trash making it impossible to find decent games
>>719567520its retarded to treat people who are essentially doing someone as a hobby as if they should be concerned with "muh marketability" you must get really pissy when your mom cooks burgers when mcdonalds is still aroundor when you start seeing a kid start learning to play guitar because "wow its so cringe you're doing that when i have a radio"the guy who is doing something out of their basement is not someone who should be thinking about the market
>>719567726>who are essentially doing someone as a hobbyThey're charging money for it.The fuck?
>>719565861If you make games as a solo dev for money you are retarded.
>>719567702It's zoomers who think funny and part of the culture to be mad at everything instead of just the game that deserve it
>>719566882Yeah that tracks, actually, just not up front
>>719567778how mad does this make you?
>>719567726Please don't dobsonI'M SO FAT, I SEE FOOD
>>719567726You are making a product that is being sold. You always, ALWAYS, need to think about the market.
>>719567708the slop in the eshop isn't caused by passionate indie devs trying to make a homage of games they loved.its caused by low effort cynical people just making asset flips
>>719567906Did this nigga just compare a grown ass man to little kids running a lemonade stand?
>>719567315>>719566882>>719566675You also should never pay more than $20 for a video game. Goes without saying that $20 is the maximum price for ANY game, AAA or indie.
>>719567947>literally stopped reading when they got triggered
>>719568004>anon goes to facebook marketplace just to message to the people that they're retarded to do this when walmart exists
If you’re an amateur dev, why not just release your game for free?Exposure is a powerful thing if you’re an unknown.
>>719567906> LEMON> ADE
>>719565861I'd rather play a 10/10 game that is only 10 hours long compared to a 9/10 game that is 50 hours long.
>>719567032Honestly with a name like that no wonder it's DOA.
Somewhat related but would a Braid spiritual successor be a successful game in today's indie climate?
>>719568171Plenty of free games that no one plays
>>719568171Cost also factors into appeal, anon. Some people see a game is put out for free and they'll avoid it because freeware nowadays is associated with shovelware.
>>719568240name them
>>719568147If I go to a swap meet or a tag sale or a farmer's market it's usually assumed that I'm still expecting a certain level of quality, and if it's not there then I just won't buy. If you're selling squash and it looks worse and smaller and of shittier quality than the squash I'm growing in my fucking backyard, I'm probably not going to buy it.Why do indie devs not understand this simple concept?
>>719568019Go to bed, Guybrush.
>>719568171>Exposure is a powerful thing if you’re an unknown.it literally isn't
>>719566479PixelGAWDS
>>719568275Just scroll around on itch.io you'll find em
>>719568004https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lW5S2Wby4DMthis shit is serious business
Indie devs crack me up
>>719568275https://epcc.itch.io/idu
>>719568171>release your game for freemost reasonable gamers have put "free to play" in their store filter to get rid of shovelware trash
metroidvania peaked with la mulana.
>>719568042No one is triggered. It's just silly to get mad at silksong or the audience for not wanting your games if you're just making worse derivates of better games.
>>719567980>its caused by low effort cynical people just making asset flipsi hope you're ready for ai to make it much, much worse. just wait for unity to integrate AI tools into their editor!
>>719568406metroidvania peaked with zero mission
>>719568290>If you're selling squash and it looks worse and smaller and of shittier quality than the squash I'm growing in my fucking backyard, I'm probably not going to buy it.BUT I GREW THAT SQUASH ALL BY MYSELF! I'M ENTITLED TO A SALE!
>>719568341God, Riley's such a little faggot. No wonder why he's gay.
>>719568443as soon as you saw FOOD ANALOGY! you stopped reading ignoring the next analogy
>>719565861That would be fairly priced if it was a really good game even if it was made by one person.I sincerely doubt that this retarded twitter faggot had made a really good game.
https://store.steampowered.com/app/2463220/Lone_Fungus_Melody_of_Spores/The game in question that hhe contemplates to sell for 20$ btw
>>719568290>I just won't buy. If you're selling squashsee>>719567947
>>719565861Price it, they spent 10K on OTK marketing
>>719568275https://store.steampowered.com/app/1962920/Kemono_Friends_Cellien_May_Cry/Unironically a pretty fun and cute action game about leading a bunch of Friends around to kick ass.
People forgot the concept of price it what you think it's worth or what price you think you can get the most sales out of it? If you're not even confident in your pricing with a game of similar price then you're certainly not confident your game is worth that much
Lone Fungus was fun, he should charge $40 if he makes anotherdon't chase cheapskates, they're cheap
>>719568525who you calling gay nigga?
>>719568581If he considered making the protagonist a cute girl, I'd actually consider buying it.
>>7195686125 bucks
>>719565861>"fairly" priced at $20>10 hours long>oversaturated genre with numerous games at 20+ hoursRetarded developer. Unless your indie game caters to an extremely niche audience and you're providing something almost nobody else is or it's fan-fucking-tastic and stands out as a shining example of what games in the genre should aspire to be no indie game deserves to be higher than $10-15. Terraria, Hollow Knight and Stardew Valley are examples of how to do pricing correctly.
>>719568701nigga wearing a bra and hangs out with men who bat for the other team.
>>719565861$20 is still a reasonable price if the game is decent, and "Lone Fungus" should charge that.And to address OP's faggotry, the Silksong developers do not have a responsibility to charge extra in order to prime the market for other developers.
>>719568703If he was half-naked - may be
>>719565861Not my problem.
>>719568004>It's another anon deliberately misunderstands an analogy because he thinks acting dumb makes him look smart episode
>>719568581Axiom Verge was also made by one person btw
>>719568612$-20
silk bros...what now?
>>719565861Just release it for $20 if you have even an ounce of confidence in your game. Yeah your game might be lesser than Silksong. Maybe even considerably so. But this idea that Silksong will somehow kill the entire indie market with its low price point is silly. We already went through this song and dance when Hollow Knight became the indie darling. And there have been other examples as well. People might view your game as a worse deal than Silksong, but Silksong will ultimately be viewed as an outlier. People won't stop buying other games just because they can't measure up to Silksong. If your game is fun, people will appreciate it, even if it isn't Silksong.
>>719568703game name? grapple gun seems fun
>>719568171>Exposure is a powerful thing if you’re an unknown.Yeah but then you're deferring profit until you make a whole other game, which could take years.
>>719568581Looks decent. Would prefer a more humanized mushroom like Toad but 20 seems fair for a 1-man job with smooth animations and decent level design. Too bad about having to compete with the hype machine.
>>719568290you're not making your own games, you're buying from other places as far as the FOOD goes there are also other people who are buying it and lots of other people appreciate people still grow their own thingsor brining it back to games, make games they want to makewhy would you concern yourself over what other people make, and other people buy when you're not buying it?
>>719565861Every dev that starts whining and crying about Silksong is putting a big fat turd of a stain on their own game. These people SUCK at PR.>abloobloo please buy our game too it can't fail and can you please pay 100 dollars
>>719568871NTA but it's called Rusted Moss
>>719566256Do it then
>>719568858>It was originally a DLC guys, cut us some slack>We spent most of it's development time vacationing
>>719568841Yeah, it was.It was made by one person who had absolutely 0 idea about elvel/world design and, as a matter of fact, as evident by second game, had no desire or aspiration to learn.That's why I dropped this game after just a 1hr of play into the trash, here it belongs, and blacklisted that indie hack
>>719568925thanks man
>>719568858the game has 40 bosses and over 200 enemy typesit's not going to be 3 hours long, stop taking devs joke comments seriously
>>719568868Devs saw $30 Hades II and wanted that to be the norm. But here we are.
>>719568871Rusted Moss. You can do a shitload of sequence breaking if you're actually good with fucking around with the grappling hook (without any upgrades for it to boot), but good luck.
>>719568841axiom verge just sucks to play though. idk why anyone recommends it
>>719568868This. I feel the same with Monster Train. Didn't know of the IP until Monster Train 2 but still gave it a shot on gamepass and had fun with it. If your game is fun people will show up to play it. Maybe do abit of shilling like Notch did when he was working on Minecraft back in the day
>>719568984that looks sick
SS devs are leaving a lot of money on the table at $20 desu, but i guess they don't really care
>>719569049Has NES Metroid atmosphere but more fun weapons.
I think the one thing that makes me hesitant about making a game is asking the question of “why would someone play this when there are alternatives out there”. The idea might not even be bad, but I question if people would find it interesting enough to sink their teeth into.
>>719569194Hollow Knight was 15 bucks20 bucks isn't much of a stretch from that price pointRetarded, indie devs expected them to be greedy and price it on hype factor so they could price their own indie Metroidvania higher
>>719568581I resent paying $20 for any indie game, because I still carry the torch of resentment over not owning my games and think digital copies are overpricedBUTLooking beyond my own bullshit, $20 seems like a reasonable price for this.
>>719569215Metroid wasn't really fun until it got to 16-bit sadly
>>719569127Honestly one of my more favorite indie metroidvanias in recent memory, especially after how much Lost Ruins disappointed me. It took me 15-ish hours to do most of the content, but since they added more shit I think it's about 20+ hours now? Haven't touched it since 2024. I wish someone would make more porn of the game; I feel bad having my shit scribbles being the only art of it on Pixiv.
>>719569194Their first game wasn't even $20
>>719568895Then don't bitch about someone else's pricepoint, if your game has an audience, it will attract them.If it doesn't, then it will fail.It's that simple.
>>719569269Just like you don't eat just one meal your entire life (unless you're severely autistic), you don't just play one game your entire life.Gamers are always looking to play new and unique games in their preferred genre
>>719565861Good. Total indieslop death. The only way this could get any funnier is if GTA 6 is priced at $60.
>>719569269stupid mentality and its a same so many crabs here have poisoned the well for youjust make what you want no one who made a "doom clone" or jrpg ever thought this wayits insane the kind of self important retards who never made anything in their life think they get to say what other people make or buy
>>719569269For every big group looking to play the big names there'll always be another group looking to try an unfamiliar brand even if it's a clone product. See Irate Gamer after AVGN as an example.
>>719566808>unique rougelikeI hate that genre. Its the laziest attempt at making a game feel longer by just throwing a bunch of retries with different modifiers.
>>719569342>Hollow Knight was 15 bucksfrom an unknown studio with no hype and a minimal marketing budget, back when $15 was worth more than $20 today>greedyif it sells the price is fair
>>719567035indie games can never be worse simply because you can find some niche shit that suits you. find me a tripleA game that isn't open world or a cinematic moviegame
>>719569416how is the guy bitching about the price point you projecting fuck?seems like a genuine question by someone not sure what would be a fair price for their game
>>719566398i fucking hate this normalfag mentality, kill yourself
>>719568868>But this idea that Silksong will somehow kill the entire indie market with its low price point is silly.Anon you're retarded. Do you know why so many AAA devs are waiting on concrete GTA6 news? Do you know why so many indies have suddenly decided to delay their game? You do not want to compete with a major release. This is especially true for indies because abso-fucking-lutely nobody is going to be talking about your game and if nobody is talking about your game you've got a dud release. You missed your one chance to gain momentum. It's better to delay your game by several months if need be(you can expect a lot of indies to delay their game until January/February because the end of the year is a godawful time for a small, unheard of studio to release a game) than it is to try competing. It's a horrible idea. You don't do it.
>>719565861dollar per hour is fair if it's good
>>719569269>I think the one thing that makes me hesitant about making a game is asking the question of “why would someone play this when there are alternatives out there”.>The idea might not even be bad, but I question if people would find it interesting enough to sink their teeth into.I think the bigger problem is people even knowing it exists in the first place. I'm sure if you can get eyes on it, there will be people who would want to play it (if the price is right). The issue is getting exposure at all. There are a fuckton of games to sift through now.
>>719569376I'll get it soon, if only because the best indie games I've played always get recommended by one guy on /v/ lol
>>719569359Well yeah but the point is the visual appeal of the game is that of NES Metroid which was pretty cool to see. The gameplay is pretty decent too.
>>719569490If they priced it any higher they'd probably get community backlashYou don't price games on reputation, you price them on their individual valueSilksong is probably similar in length and quality to Hollow Knight, possibly with a bit more or less.
>>719569376>Lost Ruins disappointed meFiltered. You love to see it.
>>719569645>You don't price games on reputation, you price them on their individual valuetrillion dollar marketing industry btfo
>>719566398This. Objectively the only metric that applies to video game pricing. I do not pay asymmetrically, if your game is more expensive than the minimum amount of time I could play, then I will not buy it.
>>719568895Just grow a good squash if you want people to buy it. Simple as.
>NOOO YOU CAN'T DO THAT ULTIMA ALREADY EXISTS!!!>THE MARKET! THE MARKET IS BEING FLOODED AHHHHH
>>719565861Did everyone just turn retarded recently?
the metroidvania problem: they exist and people keep making them for some reasonstop making boring, tedious platformers
>>719567293meanwhile, in america
>>719569785see>>719567402
>>719569269Ideally it'd fill a niche and have artistic integrity to stand on its own and distinguish itself. You could make a final fantasy clone, a metroidvania, a mario clone, even a puzzle game like tetris or bejeweled, games that have been made a thousand times before and will be made again, the ones that succeed follow those formulas well, they don't try anything dumb or gimmicky, they just execute what people enjoy, and it's made fresh with good art, music, etc.
>>719567293and today pixel is a wage slave, in spite of making on of the best games of the decade
>>719569613I'd also strongly recommend ASTLIBRA if you're ever in the mood for 00s AJRPG kino. Its OST alone is god-tier despite being composed entirely of freeware music. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0Xpj3S0IWM
>>719566398Based. Look at all the tranny failures seething at this truth.
>>719569739This is what the industry is heading towards.Individually priced AAA games.Nintendo has taken the lead with this pricing strategy, and you already see talks of GTA6 getting priced at around $100 because apparently it's going to be huge
The weak should fear the strong.
>>719567032>vinesauce colorsLel
>>719569867Never should've sold his baby to jews
>>719569645Silksong is a standalone dlc, it will be 3 hours long at most
>>719565861why the fuck would you think your shitty tiny metroidvania dick is worthe 20 dollars20 dollars is AAAA price for indie gamesyour game should be 10 dollars at most
>>719569761Kind of based but at the same time wasn't FF called as such because it would be Squaresoft's last gamble before sunsetting?
>>719565861a solo dev should never ask for more than 15 dollar for a game
>>719569921hollow knight sucks
>>719570028now this is some anklebiter loser thinking
>>719570021pretty sure thats a myth and they only choose Final Fantasy because they liked the alliteration
>>719569785I get why the genre is popular and everyone wants to make one, but it sucks that it's oversaturated to the point of tedium now
>>719568868I'm not even sure why this is a concern. Release the game for $20, see who bites, then adjust accordingly. If you're releasing a game on steam you should already be prepared to put it on sale since that's where games get the most traction.
>>719569761Final Fantasy 1 was made with nothing to lose. That's why it was called FINAL Fantasy.
>>719569269The key is for your game to have a gimmick that makes it unique or different enough to buy. Look at factorio. It got made because modded Minecraft was too limiting. Satisfactory copied factorio and went with 3D with no polish and a higher price tag.Dyson sphere program copied factorio and went with a much more casual easy game with a focus on spectacle and some combat while being dirt cheap. Captain of industry copied factorio but went with terrain deformation and a death spiral mechanic while being more complicated with a cheaper price. Sahpez2 is diet factorio Mindustry is factorio for phone fags. Each of these games has secured a fanbase but typically you have a large portion that will buy the others too because they're similar but not TOO similar.
>>719565861LOL at only 15 hours it should be priced like $8 what the fuck are they thinking. If you price your shit right you sell more copies and make more money, use the digital platform with low manufacturing cost to your advantage
>>719569761>retardUltima was basically only played in the West. Final Fantasy was basically only played in the East. You could remove outside markets from both games and they both would have succeeded. The world is a very different place now.
>>719565861>indie game class warfare between minor and more successful indie gamesI fucking called it, knew this would happen. The whole indie scene is crab bucket mentality
Honestly, looking at the last few indie/AA games I bought, $20 for this guy's game is probably too much.>Abiotic Factor: $30>Labyrinth of the Demon King: $17>Samurai Bringer: $9>Metal Bringer: $18>Dolls Nest: $20>Beyond Citadel: $13I think $10-$15 is probably more feasible for what this is.
>>719565861People complaining about pricing are fucking retarded. Just buy the shit on sale. I do it all the time. Even with Nintendo games.
>>719569896This is how it used to be back in the day when physical media storage was still an issue for game development. I remember looking at SNES and Genesis games and they were all over the place in terms of prices, because bigger games needed bigger capacity carts and were therefore more expensive to produce, and then in early days of disc-based games you had games with multiple discs (usually JRPGs) that were more expensive.
>>719569807Iji is fuckin' great
>>719570193What if they don't do sales?
>STOP MAKING THAT! DON'T YOU KNOW DOOM ALREADY EXISTS>THE MARKET! THE MARKET GUYS! ITS BEING FLOODED!!!
The narrative changed from Toby Fox kindly releasing two free chapters to now releasing an incomplete game for $25. Maybe the narrative hasn't changed but it has in my head.Now chapter 1+2 are just a demo (as labeled on Steam) for a $25 incomplete game that's years from being complete. It's easy to compare negatively to Silksong too because frankly, all four Deltarune chapters is still way shorter than Hollow Knight was for $15 that got free DLC. And Silksong is releasing complete for $5 less than Deltarune. Toby Fox is just an overrated hack. I honestly don't even believe Undertale was worth the $10 I played. Game was extremely short and it was more just random retarded comedy sections glued together that all of a sudden wants to pull at your heartstrings at the end than an actual flowing game.I played just like someone fucking around in game maker. Undertale should have been a free game, it should have cost less than Cave Story did as in Toby should have paid people to play it.
>>719565861>pricingAnon, pirate it. Pirate all games on steam if possible. Steam is anti-consumer. If you put your game on steam, you are against playing video games at fair prices.
It looks fine, I guess. But 15 hours of this isn't worth 30 bucks.
>>719570137>>719570115
>>719565861I shouldn't have to say this, but you have to price the game for what's it worth, you can't just play pretend a 10 hours long game is worth 20$ when I could say a lot of AAA 100 hours long games aren't even worth 20$.Why yes I understand that he needs to make money, but games have a subjective value most people would want to pay, you can't expect people to pay discount big AAA game prices for an small game, the comparison will kill your sales.And for me, I don't like soulshit, but being objective here, silksong isn't worth more than 20$, even if it took them 8 years to make.
>>719569807Remake never ever. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86IxmklUgEMI regret doing a pacifist run for my first playthrough, to be honest.
>>719570115it was a last hurrah but the game was supposed to be fighting fantasy, then realized the name was taken so called it final fantasy to keep the FF alliteration
>>719569886looks kino. reminds me of Hat World but with a bigger budget
>>719565861>another shitty indie metroidvania maybe try to make an original game that doesn't fill the same niche of an already satured market???????
>>719567032I looked at the Steam page. It looks boring. The screenshots and art style aren't very good. This guy should consider himself lucky anyone bought it at all. $5-$10 would have been a much more appropriate price, but even still I would personally have no interest. Metroidvanias are oversaturated, its a market you need to be extremely competitive in to get noticed. And this isn't competitive. For the record, I didn't think Hollow Knight was good at all and I have no interest in Silksong. But in a genre where other recent games like Prince of Persia: The Lost Crown and Shinobi: Art of Vengeance exist, nothing else really touches them anyway. Least of all Silksong or this mushroom game.
Sell for what you think it's worth. It's that simple.
>>719566250>but what about other games?are those games good?
>>719569269>asking the question of “why would someone play this>I question if people would find it interesting enoughit's a bad sign to be asking that question, the answer is most certainly a resounding yes
>>719566398$1 per hour is too expensive now. $0.25 per hour is a better starting rate especially since basically every developer in the last 25 years can't be trusted to make anything good.
>>719565861>aislop
>>719568984>>719569127the devs are trannies btw, look it up
>>719568171>paying in exposureI wonder who's behind that post.
>>719570441Somehow, the dev for ASTLIBRA managed to get one of art directors from Vanillaware to redo all the character/boss art, which is why it might look familiar at times. Zero idea what the freeware version of the game looks but it's still available if you wanna play that instead (no English translation for that, though).
>>719570261>DON'T YOU KNOW DOOM ALREADY EXISTS>posts 3D, which came out years after most of the actual Doom clones diedYou should've posted the original Duke if you wanted to make a point and even then Carmack himself helped
>>719570483The market changed with HKSS's pricing. His game is now not worth the time and investment he put into it.
>go on Steam>look up games below 15€>can get plenty of games, including some AAA for that priceYou'll never make any decision if somehow another game existence is enough to make you waver.
>>719565861well, sounds like the only option is to scrap it
>>719570601Who the fuck cares?
>>719570674>The market changed with HKSS's pricing.Only in their head
>>719566398Close, but not quite.1 hour of FUN =$1, not 1 hour of gameplay.Bloated bullshit like the average ubisoft game has lots of gameplay time, but very little fun. Hollow Knight, to contrast, has quite a lot of it.
>>719570338these type of games used to be free on miniclip
>>719570630>Somehow, the dev for ASTLIBRA managed to get one of art directors from Vanillaware to redo all the character/boss artShigatake liked the game.
I can't wait to see the copeposting from every indie metroidvania dev after their game doesn't sell from now onthey will all blame Silksong
>>719570405I don't think it needs a remake.
original splinter cell is 5 bucksthat's a good base to start out on
>>719568581It doesn't look bad but it's competing with a billion other games that look similar and have basically the exact same mechanics. It's not going to sell a lot at any price but $5 would be fair.
>>719570820It's not even just metroidvania devs. There are unironically devs with games in completely unrelated genres delaying because of Silksong. As if that's the reason their shitty farm sim would bomb.
>>719570758inflation introduced some amount of cost
>>719570942I mean, I play both shitty farm sims and shitty metroidvania...
>>719569886Finished and 100%'d this game last thursday. Fucking kino experience all the way through, will play the DLC in the future.
>>719570473>The screenshots and art style aren't very goodI think the art style is decent. It's not super evocative, but the palette is nice and some of the backgrounds are pretty. It's just inconsistent, with some areas looking bland.But I don't immediately see any of the glaring issues found in 90% of "pixel art" games made by people who apparently never saw a fucking pixel in their lives, so it's already ahead of the pack in that regard.
>>719570804>ShigatakeGod, imagine how good it must feel having a fucking legend loving your shit enough to volunteer to giving it a graphical touch-up. I think I recall hearing he even did all of it for free too.
I downloaded Hollow Knight last week and beat it. I thought the combat and setting was good; less thrilled by the areas and music. The white palace trial and error, and the amount of bosses you have to fight just for an attempt at the superbosses is pretty AIDS.
>>719571028No, no, NO! Gamers only play one game! Once Silksong is released, they'll keep on playing the 3 hour campaign forever! They'll never move on! Because Silksong is just THAT FUCKING GOOD! You can only buy and play one game! Oh fuck my indie dev career is over before it even started, DAMN YOU TEAM CHERRY, YOU CRASHED THE INDIE MARKET
>>719565861$20 is still asking too much for Silksong. I bought the first Hollow Knight for around $7 and didn't even enjoy it enough to finish because it was both a bad Metroidvania and a bad attempt at a Soulslike (the combat alone was shit). The only thing HK and Silksong have going for them are art style/animations and music. All style, no substance. And I would still never choose to play them. So what hopes does a game with no style in the same genre even have? This guy should have considered that maybe his game was poorly conceived from the start. If you've picked a genre that has probably thousands of games in it at this point then you need to do things with it that truly stand out. A bad art style is the kiss of death for these. Moral of the story is, maybe pick a different genre than Metroidvania for your solo developer independent game that you need to make money on to not starve.
>>719570538>it's a bad sign to be asking that question, the answer is most certainly a resounding yesI'm having difficulty interpreting your post, are you saying "if you're asking that question, you're probably right that nobody would play it"?Because I don't think that's true, sometimes people just underestimate themselves
>>719570638no point still stands, as far as the retards here are concerned anything that is derivative counts as a cloneit makes me ABSOLUTELY SICK that games like Borderlands, Call of Duty, Team Fortress, Overwatch, so many others exist when Doom already doesWHY ARE THEY LETTING SO MANY CLONES EXIST
>>719570942I don't know, I sort of get it when we live in a period where people don't have as much money to spend on vidya as they did not too long ago. Might as well err on the side of caution.
>>719569807>What about selling Iji and/or porting it to a console?>No-one, not even myself, is ever allowed to make money on Iji (the original game). Ever. It will not be ported to any console nor get any sort of remake. I'd buy a remake, or just a steam release for more publicity in a heartbeat desu.
>>719571250Yeah, that's why Silksong should be 40 dollars! So they buy MY GAME at 20 instead!
thank god that warner bros had the foresight to patent the nemesis system so the MARKET couldn't be FLOODED with CLONES
>>719570717>Who the fuck cares?NTA, but I do. I have a policy of not buying from people who are likely to be unhinged ideologues who hate me for being sane. But I still think it's dumb to bring it up unprompted.
>>719571171ure so cool
>>719570167how does that make difference, square SHOULD BE ASHAMED that they continue to FLOOD the MARKET with so many CLONES
I think $15 to $25 at most is a fair price for a game like that. $20 is the sweet spot for the most id be willing to spend on a random indie game I think could be interesting.$25 to $30+ dollars would require extreme confidence either in the developer, or in the unique gameplay systems on display.The measure of a game isnt strictly in its content.There are tons of old games that were priced for like $70 while being like 10 hours long.For classic Nintendo, I can imagine some of that pricing was to recuperate costs of R&D for making and producing their console themselves. But that doesnt make sense since Playstation doesnt make its own games. BUT if playstation is taking a cut from devs making games on its platform to recuperate for selling consoles at a loss. Then devs would need to bump up the price to make up for their own cost so maybe itd even out.Either that. Of videogames cost a lot more to make back in the day even for a 5 to 10 hour "adventure". Which doesnt sound right.Either way. The market is currently too bloated.Cont'd ->
>>719570674Did it? Are people going to stop buying older $20 games because Silksong is $20? Are people going to stop buying inferior $60 games? The answer to both of these are no.The market doesn't change when a single person offers a good deal.
>>719571364He's right though. Seems like you're a bit mad.
>>719565861So before they were complaining that games were too expensive, and now they're saying this one is too cheap?
Some shitty indie metroidvania should be like $10 tops
>>719565861If you have to worry about selling your one man game at $10, you were never selling that many copies in the first place
>>719565861>but it was made by one personShouldn't that mean they can get away with making it cheaper, because they only have to pay one person?
>>719571513Indie devs hoping to undercut a 40 dollar price point are the only ones complainingAnd honestly, fuck em
>>719570259Who does this besides Factorio devs?
>>719569807Isn't the dev Swedish?
>>719565861I wish everyone that posted about Silk Song killed themselves.
>>719570338It's weird, I like the look of the game but the cover art pisses me offIt's like it's trying too hard to make it serious and epic, whereas the game itself doesn't convey that
>>719565861>making a metroidvaniastopped reading thereDOA
>>719571513Any mental gymnastics to try and convince people that game prices should keep rising. It's time to tune these people out. I'm never paying more than $10 for some indie metroidvania, I'm never spending $80 for Nintendo's bing bing wahoos, and I'm never spending $100+ for Grand Theft Auto. $60 AAA, less than $20 indie. Simple as. They can seethe and cry about it all they want, I truly don't care.
>>719571669Yes. And I'm pretty sure they made that smash clone with warner bros characters. Or was it Nikelodeon?
>>719570338if he had made the name a pun off of "fungi -> funguy", he'd probably have sold 50% more copies off that alone
indie games are starting to balloon in price and encouraging this is a retarded fucking idea, your game made by 2 people that cost 50 thousand dollars shouldn't cost 20 dollars, your overhead is piss poor and your margins are extremeyou aren't in a niche and you do not have an underserved audience, you're not being competitive herevalve's fault, too, the algorithm changes benefit higher priced games and fuck over cheaply, fairer priced games
>719571430Cont'd ->Team Cherry is still in a unique position. I dont understand all these threads and complaints popping up all of a sudden, since Team Cherry was arguably in a similar or possibly even worse position than some of these devs. I will always pity a solo dev, its probably the saddest thing ever to see one person put so much effort into something and it not be truly appreciated. I look at a game like Iconoclasts with its insane pixel art, basically doing almost every gameplay aspect perfectly, offering lots of variety not just per level, but even per room. Having not just some of the best designed, but THE best designed boss fights in all of indie for me, just because of the sheer amount plus variety and creativity, whereas despite enjoying Hollow Knight, every single boss fight can be reduced to "Wack him with your stick". But Iconoclasts incorporates almost every acquired item and ability you use in the boss fights itself and it gets no credit for how much well it genuinely does.So I understand and sympathize with the plight of the solo dev, but.Team Cherry wasnt far off from your position when they released Hollow Knight. And it was still $15 on release. Somehow I have no idea why, they thought their game deserved no more, and HK also has some of the most aggressive sales of any indie ever.Its honestly genuinely kind of astonishing HKs success. On release day it got 2k players, which is so unbelievably rare.The game took much longer than people realize to truly drum up its grand status currently, but it was basically a hit for indie standards from the get go.But thats it. Games CAN succeed and infact WILL succeed even more for you profit wise as a solo dev the lower you release the price, because the cost HAS to be fundamentally low as a solo dev, thats truly team cherry succeeded. $15 was enough even when they only sold 100k copies. Because Hollow Knights kickstarter was 50k, and they were living off of whatever they could afford.
>>719571809well, he hasn't sold copies yet, but you know what I mean
All this does is scream "I'm not confident in my product." People will happily fork over $20 if the game is well made, even if it's short.
>>719568230literally no one would care about Braid if it released today, it's one of the most "right time, right place" games ever released
>>719569592>It's better to delay your gameDid I claim otherwise? My post had nothing to do with this whatsoever. Are you even a real person?
>>719570726HK is also bloated, you're just niggercattle so you can't recognize it without having someone point it out for you
>>719572042>retardOh okay so you were just constructing your straw man and I made a mistake in giving you the benefit of the doubt. Got it. Carry on being a fucking moron.
>>719570338The saddest part is when the game isn't bad, so you can gleefully shit on it, it's something like this. Like that looks okay I guess. Graphics, combat shown in the trailer, music, description. It's not bad, but it's so mediocre? uninspired? I just don't see myself buying it.
>>719572145>your straw manGenuinely. What do you think I was arguing?
Whatever happened to good ol fashioned competition?These indie devs have zero faith in their gameIf they believed it was truly a good game, they would face Silksong head on and drop it on the same day.
Are most indie devs just rich kids with no conception of what price people not in Los Angeles are willing to pay for things? Because that'd explain a lot
>>719571847nigger if you are going to cry like a bitch at least compare it to a good game like Rabi-Ribi or ESA
>>719567381Silksong could be 5 or 10 and it'd still sell millions. If I made an indie game, by myself, I'd charge 5 if I felt it was actually the best I could do at the time. 20? Nah, I better be some top ace mastercraft mother fucker putting out Cave Story as my first project.
>>719566808>he forgot the Deck-builder genre the true indie-slop
It's unfair competition, no matter how you look at it. Hollow Knight sold, what, 17 million copies? They can set the price as low as they want and out-compete all other developers in the industry who can't afford rent or food if they set prices that low to compete. If this happened in any other business, it would be illegal. A shame lawmakers are too fucking stupid to regulate video games.
>>719572431Why should they raise the price? Because of hype? That's retarded.Hollow Knight released at $15.Silksong will be $20.This is completely reasonable.
>>719572548They're killing other, smaller, poorer indie devs. Have a heart.
>>719571796Yeah he's one of the founders of Ludosity
>>719572374Exactly. This is how you succeed. That success means taking a huge risk that you could fail, but having the confidence in what you made gets you noticed. You don't see Battlefield or Call of Duty backing down on release dates. They are one of the oldest rivalries in gaming at this point and both know that to compete you have to show up. Crying about how its "unfair" just makes you look like a worthless failure and makes your game look like garbage.
>>719572648That's business babyIf you can't make a game as good as Silksong, then you can't competeThe lack of confidence in indie game devs need to be studiedAre they working on a game they secretly think is shit? That really makes me have zero faith that their game will be worth my time.Looking at every indie dev who delayed their game or is complaining about the price.You fuckers disgust me.
Who are these 2 losers?
If you think your effort is worth $20, set the price at $20. Worst case scenario is that most people end up disagreeing which just forces you to swallow your pride and reduce the price, either with frequent discounts or permanently.
>>719572350You said>But this idea that Silksong will somehow kill the entire indie market with its low price point is silly. I gave you the benefit of the doubt and assumed this was hyperbole because nobody is seriously arguing that Silksong is actually killing the entire indie scene. Nobody is unironically making the claim that indies are just fucking done after Silksong so it's a retarded statement to bring up and make an argument against.
>>719570259then they're based and deserve the extra money. fuck coupon hunting like some post-soviet pensioner
who cares? i'll just pirate them anyway
>>719572431Fucking lmao, what an embarrassing post. There is nothing unfair or illegal about this. The Silksong price is very fair to consumers and reflects the value of the product. If your game doesn't compete with even something as mediocre as Hollow Knight, then you should find a new job.
>>719572374Knowing when to release is an integral part of any commercial release. It applies on all levels from indie to AAA shit. Some games get lucky and receive more attention if released during a dry spell and vice versa, getting overshadowed by a long awaited hyped release can and has sunk games. That said, it's always hilarious when indiefags are so afraid of the notion of competition and whine about being owed sales just because they made something.
>I don't know what to price my game atThen I won't be buying. Have faith in your game.
>>719572824>Worst case scenariois when no one buys it, By the time you reduce the price, it's already forgotten so you make no money
>>719572818Lost interest in Mina once I realized it's just Zelda for furries. Wasn't there already an indie game like that?
>>719572818Constancy looked fun but its a hollow knight clone. I think but with a paint brush.
I played his first game since it was on a metroidvania humble bundle remember when he announced the kickstarter for the new game and everyone was disappointed because it looks like a downgrade (old game on top and new on bottom) and he did a terrible job in the trailer not showing any of the movement options so the game looked much slower, then later he redid the trailer but the game still looked like a downgrade and the kickstarter failed
>>719566043it's more of a discussion prompt
>>719571430>For classic Nintendoa lot of it was that the carts were fairly expensive to manufacture, ate up several bucks by themselves
>>719571809but at the cost of his dignity
>>719573248damn, I bet if he did it the other way around (starting with a lower resolution and then going higher in the sequel) they'd have cut him some slackDowngrading the graphics for a sequel is kind of a silly move
>>719573367>Downgrading the graphics for a sequel is kind of a silly moveit tells me that he realized just how much of LF's dev time was spent solely on spriting
>>719565861If the game is really good.People are going to buy it, even if it is more expensive than Silksong.This tranny has no confidence in his game, so no one else should.
>>719572995There's plenty of stories about games that got a second wind due to someone finding it at the right time. Sure, there's at least as many stories about games that never got one, but I like to believe life throws bones at whoever's willing to catch them.
>>719565861>>719570338What's insane to me is that this is the second game by this guy. He already put out a Lone Fungus in 2023, the one he's talking about now is a prequel or a sequel. The first one looks mediocre and is $20 with ~1100 reviews on Steam, but now he's having a crisis over what to set for the price of this new one, which means the first wasn't very successful and should have been priced lower. But he's got too much pride and ego to accept it and do that, so now he's begging the twitter tranny echo chamber for validation on why he shouldn't lower his prices to compete instead of just doing it.
>>719568627FUCK KADOKAWA
>>7195734861100 reviews is a success for an indie dev regardless of how cynical you are
>>719566398That was my mentality in high school when I had lots of time and fuck all cash. It resulted in me playing a lot of Ubislop. As a busy full time worker, give me 8 hours of replayable godliness.
>>719572853>Nobody is unironically making the claim that indies are just fucking done after Silksong so it's a retarded statement to bring up and make an argument against.I have seen more than a few people arguing that it'll deal irreparable harm to the indie market. But that doesn't change how I was talking about the PRICE, and then you made a huge ass reply about the release DATE. Why the fuck did you do that?
>>719573486you're presuming that lower price means more revenue. this is by no means neccessarily the case.
>>719566398ah yes the famous poorfag NEET theorem
>>719565861Is it good? I will pay whatever your price point is. Is it not very good? I won't pay anythingSimple as.
>>719573619Literally answered that. Do you lack reading comprehension? Don't answer that. It was a rhetorical question. I'm just going to accept your concession here and stop feeding you (You)s to sperg out over with your fallacies.
>>719573486Ironically, a lower price point could convince more people to try it, thus potentially making him more money in the long run
>>719573753So because you think my argument was dumb, you replied with something entirely off-topic that wasn't being discussed? Smooth.
>>719572995Bayonetta was forgotten until it hit bargain bins and now has representation in Smash Bros.
>>719573475There's no way it sucks, right? Hollow Knight isn't that good, it won't be hard to surpass it now that they've had time and a budget not scraped from kickstarter compromises.
>>719573486A thousand reviews is great success for a no name indie dev.Some are much less lucky.
>>719565861Bold of devs to assume i'd pay anything more than 1-to-5 bucks during a sale even if i have to wait a year, and that's assuming i'm not just straight up pirating. So as far as i'm concerned, they can price it however they want.
>>719573907Veritus was such a disappointment holy shit, Prodigal is still their best game. Backed Claire a la Mode anyways, these devs are cool poppas
>>719573961if you're not willing to pay more than a pittance, why should they care what you think?
>>719573842What does "representation" mean in a gaming sense? What a stupid word. Second the only reason why bayonetta is in smash is because nintendo practically owns her after funding 2 and 3. This is because sega and others refused publishing after the first one bombed. Nintendo wanted exclusives for the wii u and told them why not?
>>719573481Yeah hoping for that is like when every other dev hoped that their cube building game was going to be the next minecraft or terraria.
>>719574050They cared enough to ask, should have been more specific ;)
>>719574061*publishing and funding
>>719569490The idea that you have to price a game higher because your game and studio is more known is prime retardation. Team Cherry is based for keeping it in the same price range instead of becoming mega jews
>>719566398>Paid 10€ for it
>>719574170>tiempo de juegofuck off sanchez
>>719569807
>>719574170What the hell is a "logro"?
>marketing pajeets and retranera trolls trying to astroturf paying more for games in this thoroughly enshittified game era of overpriced unfinished games with content constantly cut and resold.
>>719574170basado despite your argument being faggot poorfag cope>>719574221cheevo
>>719574015Colorgrave had an hard life.
>>719572824The worst case scenario is definitely not just having to reduce the price. A bad launch can completely kill a game and games getting second winds rely completely on luck and is not something you should be banking on.
>>719574061Being in Super Smash Bros is a big deal. Getting published by Nintendo is an even greater deal. Think about it. Despite being a spiritual successor to DMC, Bayonetta now gets to represent the character action genre in one of gaming history's most celebrated IPs. Going from a bargain bin niche title to a series that would be a Game Awards Show regular is pretty huge.
>>719574286Oh okay. Rune factory 4 was the last good one so carry on friend
>everyone knows GTAV2 will cost at least $100>rockstar sells it for $50>AAA sphere implodes
>>719574221>What the hell is a "logro"?Are you per chance... retarded? Don´t you see the trophy icon under that text? Of course it´s achievements
>>719574330Not really. It just means they own her ass now.
>>719571319>...I still think it's dumb to bring it up unprompted.>...So let me bring up my beliefs unprompted on why I'm not going to buy this game that has nothing to do with the actual game.You were never going to buy it in the first place, go suck a nigger dick, tardboy.
>>719574389No I just noticed that one. I saw the bottom right one first
>>719574404The point I'm making is that it's a story of an IP that went from rags to riches despite initially not taking off. I'm sure Sega's other devs would've killed to have their games be picked up by Nintendo and be immortalized in Smash (Vanquish, Binary Domain, Valkyria Chronicles, etc).
>>719574379They could get away with it.GTAV made most of its money on Shark Cards, not game sales.
People pay $150 for RimWorld
>>719574473>So let me bring up my beliefs unpromptedYou said "who the fuck cares" (unprompted) to shame the anon who mentioned it. I told you I care and I told you why. And you're mad about it because you are one of the aforementioned unhinged ideologues who can't stand wrongthink.>You were never going to buy it in the first placeAt a glance I wasn't impressed, but when anons say games are good I'm usually willing to give them a chance. When they're not made by trannies, that is.
>>719565861>I can't afford to give it away for free.Moron was supposed to keep his day job and have his indieshit pay for beers unless he won the indieshit lottery then maybe make bigger plans. These people really think they aren't 2 decades late to the ship.
>>719573757Without a doubt. I agree. I think this guy just needs to swallow his pride and price it at $10-$12. He'd sell more, he'd get more people trying his games, and eventually maybe he'll have the reputation and money to make games that are both worth $20+ and have fans willing to pay that price for. People never want to work their way up from the bottom, but in indie development you simply don't have a choice, especially if your resources are highly limited to begin with. He has the wrong mindset and wants to be considered an equal to major multi-million dollar productions from the jump.
>>719565861this mentality is genuinely ruining Indies' brainsI've been listening to a lot of people like the one on the OP and the people they listen to because I'm making a game and want to to learn about stuff.It's very clear to me that this side of indie games, the 'how to sell your game', 'how to do marketing' and so on, is just full of crap. All the stuff you hear is scary, all these people talking about numbers and time frames, release windows and all this shit, they talk about games like a rice, or potatoes, not one of them mentions that a good game will sell more than a bad game either. No wonder people like that guy get scared shitless, they forget why they're making a game, have no fucking clue how much their work is worth, they don't even know what they're doing anymore, they just look at graphs and trend data.
>>719574807Rimworld caters to a special kind of autism and managed to stand out in an autism genre. Not just anyone can do that. It's the success story Dwarf Fortress could have been if the devs weren't lazy shits.
>>719568581honestly, the stylization looks much more consistent than the previous game and i genuinely think it looks decent. The music was pretty lame though
>>719565861xe should make it free so at least a couple of people play it. nobody cares about your shitty metroidvania, let alone for 20 usd
>>719565861>abloo abloo what about meee?you either produce something people want to play, or you go out of business, you narcissistic faggot.the customer is king.
>>719574207>fuck off sanchezYes, I say that a lot.
>>719565861>15-15 hours$5 and I'm being generous, mostly paying for his effort.
>>719575050It makes me wonder if their hearts are truly in itAre they making a game because it's trendy and the cool thing to do?Are they making a game because they want to make money?Do they really even know what a video game is? I guess the word for these types of indie games would simply be: shallow
>>719575050>not one of them mentions that a good game will sell more than a bad game eitherA scary amount of developers seem unable to distinguish between good and bad, because they live in a land of forced positivity where criticism is a mean and nasty thing that serves no purpose. If you can't understand when something is bad, you also can't understand when something is good, the distinction just isn't there.These people create without thought or the spark of passion. All they can do is check the boxes for what they think a game is "supposed" to be. They are going through the motions to imitate something they liked as a child, and to cloak themselves in the status of "game developer".
>>719566479>doesn't post Cave Story
>>719565861Since when are Metroidvanias 15 fucking hours?Wasn't the whole point of the genre that they were games designed to be optimized to lower and lower times with each run?
>>719575696Is just greed. The same shit is trying to be pushed by everyone, nintendo, rockstar, borderlands...
>>719575368>the customer is kingI don't get why companies and retarded indie devs fail to understand that.
>>719575840Game prices just haven't kept up with inflation. Games are still significantly cheaper than when I was a kid.This has never been disproven.
>>719568581it seems fleshed and no offense to the dev but but $20 for a derivative like this is crazy. even at $15 it would be pushing it. $10 seems fair
>>719575050You need marketing unless you want to rely on pure luck that either some streamer plays the game (having no marketing reduces the odds of him even hearing about it) or it explodes through word of mouth purely (which usually also involves some kind of marketing, at least shilling it on 4chan or something :^) ). Shit is just too oversaturated nowadays to silently release your game no matter how great it is. Like are you going to tell me that you personally scan new releases daily on steam and other stores and then try them all out to keep in touch with all the games there are and not rely on pesky marketing?
>>719575840Greed is often the cause, but there are still a bunch of developers who just want to shit out something that checks boxes and call themselves a developer.Both types can't conceive of quality mattering to a game's sales because they can't conceive of quality, the concept is completely beyond them.
>>719575050>not one of them mentions that a good game will sell more than a bad game either.because the consensus on what constitutes a "good indie game" is generally what's commercially popular, making the whole idea circular. ask someone to name a good indie game that didn't sell well and they will fail to do so; ask someone to name a bad indie game that did sell well, and they'll be ostracised by their peers for daring to say Blue Prince was dice-rolling for MtG addicts.
>>719565861Price it however you want, nigga. Who the fuck cares about [other game] except the fanboys?
>>71957629199.9% of indie games that didnt sell well, did so because they dont deserve itanyway, Haneda Girl. Even then its debatableIf you want a truly very great game with relatively poor sales, theres Intravenous 1. But then the dev used the good will and attention to be able to work on IV2 and sell much more
Roblox
>>719575907>Blablabla inflation
>>719574927>You said "who the fuck cares" (unprompted) to shame the anon who mentioned it..Shockingly, not everyone on /v/ is the same person, and you missed your mark, try again, fag.
>>719568581If Silksong didn't come out this year, what would he have blamed for the inevitable failure of his game?
>>719566043>>719566103Cry about it
>>719565861Team Cherry is literally just making a game, and somehow this warrants constant attacks. It's amazing to see.
>>719576635>not everyone on /v/ is the same personSo you chose to butt in, unprompted, to reprimand me for giving my opinion unprompted even though it was, in fact, prompted.Genius move.And you're definitely not butthurt that someone doesn't buy tranny games.
>>719576409This. Its insane how v doesnt get how scary this is.
>>719576782>inevitable How do you know that? Just because it's not a well known IP doesn't mean it couldn't be a success in its own right. It's supposedly a sequel/prequel/whatever meaning the first game had to have been at least somewhat successful
>>719576903The enshittification of taste begins with the youth
>>719576782who knows
>>719566398nah obviously the cost of things should be proportional to an individuals salary
>>719566387>AAA companies have literally said they hope GTA is $100 so they can charge more for their games
>>719577024That's what I like to see, competitionPublished by Atari as well, or should I say, the zombified corpse of Atari
>>719569774The long term effects of the vax are finally catching up to people.
>>719576903Kind of numb to it at this point.
>>719565861If we listened to ‘devs’ on Twitter, games shouldn’t be cheap, get too many updates, or be shadow-dropped.
>>719577137>they will surely die in september>they will surely die next year>they will surely die within 5 years
>>719577249>your game should be worse than my game
>>719577137Maybe, but society has been a breeding ground for abject retardation since before that, it's just reaching critical mass now
>>719565861just sell it for 10-15 dollars???
Indie games should be $5, especially if they're solo dev games.
>>719577024>AtariOHHHH YEAAAAHHHH
>>719575907>reddit spacing>retarded inflation fagThe reason games were expensive pensive is because cartridges were expensive as fuck to manufacture. That was the whole reason Playstation & PC had cheap games because they switched to cds. Then by the time valve rolled around & the 6th Gen of consoles Sony & nintendo invented standardized pricing for software which eventually bled into the pc market which was shifting to digital with no manufacturing cost. Essentially you were getting fucked. You are genuinely retarded if you fell for the inflation meme, one because inflation isnt real. Since the dawn of time its been supply & demand with luxury goods being priced in such a way that you have to pay it because piracy isn't an option. In the last generation or so of unhackable consoles many a game even on pc has not seen price cuts or sales period but im sure your jew overlords would be pleased you're a hyper tard that fell for it
>>719577389He can't afford to give it away for free anon...He took out loans and bought a new car, please understand that it NEEDS to be $20 or I'm going to default
>>719566250Factorio can afford to be 35 dollars because it's selling infinity copies, but what about other games?
>>719566882Honestly this would be better because only the whales would play them and we wouldn't pretend these types of games care about having a player base at all
I legit have no idea how Hollow Knight even became so big when it's just a fucking generic as fuck metroid-vania with really ugly characters
>>719575050Just make a good game bro. Why did you make a bad game when you could have made it good bro
>>719566675>has caused otherwise well paced games to try and bloat their gamesFor shit devs, yeah. Just don't play their slop.>just give a game replayability and its got infinite hoursYeah, it's really a non-issue
>>719577457I think we can safely assume all Atari games are currently undergoing some sort of shill campaignThere ain't no love for Atari here fuckwad, and especially not for the modern Atari
>>719577462TECHNICALLY.Inflation is real in a sense that people who get paid more than they did before can afford things they couldn't, thus raising prices.That's why those free trump bucks a while back screwed the system because everyone used to it splurge than pay their bills.
If anything this is a healthy reality checks for these indie devsNobody, NOBODY is paying over 20 dollars for a no-name indie game from a single dev with no marketing push behind itYou see games like this going on sale for literally 1 dollar all the time because the hard cold truth is simply that people will only buy games like these if they are way cheaper than the now infinity of high quality AA / AAA / popular indie titles from years past that also go on sale all the time for less than twenty buckslike an average gamer who doesn't have say X-COM 2 or Ace Attorney Trilogy or Assassin's Creed Black Flag in his collection will always be much more tempted to spend 15 bucks on one of those than on some low budget metroidvania with GBA graphics that they've never heard about anywhere beforetl;dr if you're making a game by yourself as a passion project, sell it for 5 - 10 bucks tops
>>719577545Trannies. Not even joking. Tranny video essayists managed to hook a bunch of autists into the fanbase. That and humble bundle. It's been in like 4 or 5 bundles
>>719577462You're wrong and I'm right. Learn about inflation, and then about carts vs CDs beyond what some youtuber lied to you about.
>>719569194Straight Shota devs?Where?
>inflation isn't real
>>719565861>$20 for thisDELUSIONAL
>>719570726It's implied you turbo wizard
>>719569867He always was, he made Cave Story during his free time.
>>719577545It has a distinct enough identity, is quirky enough and is a good enough game to gain viral popularity, even if I agree that it's not that great.A game with the right elements, in the right place at right time.
>>719576409It was just WoW before thatThe children yearn for the multislop
>>719577545The "hype" for Silksong is artificial and heavily astroturfed. Most people who own or have played Hollow Knight bought it on sale for $5, got it free from PS+, or got it in some Humble Bundle. It was truly unremarkable. There are tranny discords that have spammed it here for years.
>>719577786The ones to prove that is on you retard. Youre retarded world view is being challenged, not the other way around.>>719577616Wow holy based, number went up because someone else raised the number arbitrarily so you had to make number go up to keep up with the fake man made numbers going up? Must be inflation & definitely not jew magic
Why is this suddenly an issue for indie devs? Its no different in AAA games. Like elden ring was priced 60 dollars despite its wealth of content that ni other 80 dollar AAA could compare to.Like wise this year you had E33 which was 40 dollars. I do remembee AA devs also bitching about that because they have to sell their shit for 50 or 60 and could not compete with e33.
>>719577925>It has a distinct enough identityIt literally doesn't do a single unique thing, there's not even a single unique mechanic nor does it do them in a really well done way
>>719568612Less than 20 bucks
>>719566398>1 hour = $1If this was ever the case, nobody would bat an eye at monthly sub models.
>>719577607...you had to be alive back then. Or at least your father.
>>719566479>
>>719566882>league of legends costs 1 3,000$Logic checks out
>>719577825>DELUSIONALI don't see the problem from the screenshot alone. Worse looking games have gained huge followings. It's the content of the game that really matters.But it doesn't seem to have a lot of charisma, I guess. It's hard to gain a following if you don't create a strong impression.
>>719578048If the same rate of people buy it at a higher price with no lose, why not keep it high?Its just business, anon.
>>719578191take it /vr/ grandpa
>>719565861That's still not a bad situation. AAA studios will be trying to sell their garbage for twice the Clair Obscur's price.
>>719578043It's very impressive, honestly. The dedication to pathologically bring up Silksong in every situation, regardless of context, for 5 years.
>>719578274Thats what im arguing is happening. Inflation is just made up shit by jews to kvetch retards that want to sound smart.
>>719578306They've somehow out performed the Earthbound fanbase when it comes to never ever shutting up about it
>>719571284>>No-one, not even myself, is ever allowed to make money on Iji (the original game). Ever. It will not be ported to any console nor get any sort of remake.What a fucking god.
>>719578078Identity isn't just about mechanical uniqueness though. Presentation is a big part of it, and it has a pretty unique look. It has a "vibe", as the zoomers might say, and that's half the battle.I guess what I'm saying is, big followings aren't necessarily based on substance. It's more about impression.
>>719566479That is not Cave Story, retard.
>>719578187Based Guybrush.
>>719568581>https://store.steampowered.com/app/2463220/Lone_Fungus_Melody_of_Spores/what the hell, and I thought I was crazy for thinking about asking for 8-12$ for my game once it's finished.
>>719565861$2.99 or less.
>>719578429Holy shit, I knew Iji was a great game but I didn't know the developer was so based
>>719565861I will buy indie games that look good for ten bucks or less. I will buy you impacted asshole looking game with good gameplay for under five. No exceptions.
So what's the difference between an indie game that passes through the night unnoticed and one that sells 17 million copies?
>>719578794Youtubers
>>719568868this, it's the equivalent of not wanting to produce music because michael jackson existed
>>719565861He should be legally obligated to give it away for free after this tweet because he's an annoying faggot with more ego than skill.
>>719572731Sex....with queen of explosions....
>>719568868this, it's the equivalent of not wanting to diddle boys because michael jackson existed
>>719566398>mfw when I realize I owe Atlus hundreds of dollars because they sell 100 hour long jrpgsGames are priced according to production values, dipshit. We've only had the minor league baseball AA/AAA language for decades, it's time you fucking understand what it means.
>>71956586199% of indie is shit, back in my times it would be freeware
>>719577024Imagine not delaying this. Bro are they retarded?
>>719577506Factorio was around $10 when it wasn't known how well it would sell.
>>719576291>ask someone to name a bad indie game that did sell welleverytime i see someone say that vampire survivor is a good game i instantly know i'm talking to an easily-addicted gatcha-playing retard
>>719579645I absolutely despise gacha games but I like Vampire Survivors, it's a great value for how much fun it is. I'm also a SaGa fan so the crossover they had blew me away
>>719566398>gabe is gonna fine me $3000 for TF2
price it for free because im pirating it anyway
>>719580067Imaging this on the steam launcher.One hour = 1 steam bucks.
>>719580204Pirating indie games is a sin.
>>719580397Piracy started out as the only option that made any sense, and it's only makes more and more sense the worse they make the experience of actually paying for games.
>>719580397Stealing from redditors is always the morally correct action.
>>719580397Are these real lines from Racketeer?Should I play Racketeer?
>>719578163And they don't, they never did
>>719580701It's from the end of the demo and yes you should.
Silksong is going to kill GTA 6
>>719580397I would do sinful things...
>>719580918She's French...
>>719570137Actually an urban legend the internet made up. They just thought it sounded cool.
>>719580905silksong is niche, gta is not. i will pay the one hundred dollary doos for the Bang a Latina rpg, but you couldn't pay me to play bugfuckers metroid
>>719580994Sur Dix!
Silksong was in development almost as long as Concord, do you think it will be almost as good?
>>719565861this nigga's game has no identity, yeah, the combat and the platforming looks decent, but that doesn't make it look appealing.If an indie game wants to standout it should either have a groundbreaking visual or actual new gameplay ideas.
>>719565861>MetroidvaniaRogue like Hard pass especially from small time or solo indie Devs. I don't know which has more trash games visual novel or rogue like\metroidvania or visual novel. But so many are forgettable and not worth playing.
>>719581720>the best genres attract the largest number of failed imitatorsshocking
if your game is good, 15 to 20 dollars is enough. People will pay it.
>>719565861Without reading, I know people in this thread are saying that a little 15 hour game isn't worth 20 bucks. But to that, I counter with this: Metroid Dread is a 15 hour game. And that's for completion. Metroid Dread cost a whole 60 bucks.
>>719582469>Metroid Dread is a 15 hour game. And that's for completion. Metroid Dread cost a whole 60 bucks.tendie game
>>719582469Games aren't priced per hour retard
>>719582469metroid dread wasn't very good so i'm not sure what your point is here
>>719578794a marketing budget 3x the dev budget, usually
>>719566398Nah you are wrong.It should be $0.10 per hour
>>719578794one is actually good game
>>719577389if he was clever he'd sell it for $30
>>719582671Very few people were opposed to Nintendo charging 60 dollars for a 15 hour game. However, you're all suddenly very opposed when an indie game does likewise. Double standards.>>719582607OK, if you want to measure by quality, well Metroid Dread doesn't do anything exceptional. it's a rather mediocre game if you ask me. I couldn't even muster the energy to complete a second playthrough.
>>719580397You just reminded me I still haven't finished Recettear. Guess I will start over and say farewell to my 7h save
>>719583008quite a lot of people brought up that it was overpriced m8
>>719583008tendies are not people
>>719582469Normalfags comprise most of 4chan for longer than it hasn't, and they believe AAA games are fine at $60+ but GOD FORBID an indie game charge even half.
>>719578794One has a western autistic dev (https://store.steampowered.com/app/2769780/CleanFall/)while the other has an eastern autistic dev (https://store.steampowered.com/app/2719060/Mirage_Feathers/)You should support both.
>>719583096Not enough clearly. When the game ended up being the highest selling Metroid in the series. Despite it's high price, and middling quality, and short length.
>>719583128there's no moral component to pricing, you charge what people are willing to pay. indie games are higher variability and don't get to charge the AAA reliability premium
>>719583128i don't think this is a normalfag thing, normalfags just pay or don't. this is a seething NEET thing. and ironically (implying) communists are strongly overrepresented in bitching about someone making good money directly from their own labor
>>719583276>there's no moral component to pricingnow you made the communists and national socialists mad at the same time
>>719568581So if he wants to sell it for 20 dollars he should sell it for 20 dollars? I'd pay 15 for that. Seems like it could be fun. But not a penny more.
>>719568171You are actually a braindead retard who has no experience and no talent.
>>719569470Roguelike should've just be an extra side mode for real games outside the campaign, like NG+ or Boss Rush, not the only gamemode in an entire game.
>>719583609yeah lemme just play campaign mode balatro, come the fuck on
Whoever uses the word "Metroidvania" deserves to have their skull caved in with a sledgehammer.
>>719568886you also take your game from something the player is invested in and might talk to someone about, to something they try once, say "that was neat", and probably don't start a second session. (this applies to good games too).
>>719583276>>719583379It's not a one way street. Sellers can groom the market by making customers accustomed to certain prices. You say there is no moral component to pricing, but that's actually impossible. Because humans are the ones choosing the prices. And you never know what reasons one might have to setting a price. It could include moral components. It's difficult to imagine that a moral component wasn't involved in choosing the 20 dollar price tag for silk song. As I believe that they could *easily* sell the game for 40 dollars without losing their customer base. The fact that they didn't charge more can only be explained by some kind of idea that they're doing a moral good.
>>719565861roflmao
>>719565861Why the fuck have we looped back around to the Braid pricing controversy? Is it 2008 again?
>>719583683You're still mad about that? You fags have been complaining about that term for over a decade now. Let it go. You lost.
>>719583683>what no not me i typed it in quo-c'mere big boy
>>719565861Looking at his game that he put out in 2023, this guy made over $300k. WILDLY successful for an indie game that looks like his. What the hell is he complaining about?
>>719583732if i believe that having porridge for supper is a moral good, does that make it so?
>>719583008>OK, if you want to measure by qualityGames are priced by production values anon. The devs who can make games that look as good as any of their competitors at the moment all call what they make AAA and charge the most they can, 70 or 80 now I guess. Nintendo is shameless and charges this too. Devs who can't reach that level call their games AA and charge 40-60, hello games was shameless and charged 60 which was then AAA price for no man's sky. Indie games don't have anywhere close to even AA production values and charge 30 and below. This is how it's always been. Shit then gets sorted out by the market and you see bigger and bigger sales for games that aren't moving at their MSRP.
>>719583276>AAA reliabilityWhat is reliable about AAA these days?
hey dipshits guess what. the game is $20 because they know people will pay $20 for it. that's how the economy works. people will only pay what they are willing to pay. could they price it at $30? maybe, but not as many people would buy it for that price, so their return on investment would not pay out as well.>hurr so just make it $10 then everyone will buy it for that pricewell strawman, if they made it $10, how many more people would purchase it, that wouldn't have bought it for $20? would it be enough to cover the $10 you would lose for every person that would have purchased it for $20? the answer is "no"
>>719583935they're reliably shit
>>719583732sounds like retarded commies fucking up their own bottom line for no reason, but i don't really care. if they're happy with the price and the customer is happy with the price then you've reached equilibrium. whatever retarded ideology provoked the outcome the price still carries no true moral weight, it's just a number both sides agree is fair
>>719583935you do know precisely what you're getting with AAA, it's not a surprise
>>719583837iirc he's one of the guys who sold loads of copies at a massive discount, so he didn't make close to list price
>>719583837People who are not good with their money will spend all that in one year.
>>719583683I think the term is a bit dumb too, but so is "beat 'em up" and "shoot 'em up". "Role playing game" is profoundly non-descriptive, and is just a holdover from its pen and paper cousins.Genres need categorizing and we use the terms that gained momentum. What would you use instead?
>>719583956I think you're reasoning with a game like silksong is flawed. You think 33% of the people would not buy SilkSong because it's priced at $30, rather than $20? I highly doubt that.
>>719584151maybe they know they have a disappointment on their hands and are pricing to minimize the brand cost
>>719572731He left Ludosity a year or two ago. He's now working on a new game called Tower of Gold which looks promising. It's an adventure game with dungeon crawler exploration and sidescroller puzzle platforming dungeons.
>>719566398Solid formula for indies, breaks down when applied to other games.
>>719583960>>719584046So I'm paying a premium for a game I know is going to be garbage, as opposed to a game that might have a chance of being good. Cool.I guess you could say AAA games have a grander scope. You're going to get "more" of something, even if that something is shit
>Original post isn't even complaining, merely just asking a question about what a justifiable price is, but people talk about it as if it's complaining for 500 postsWhat if I was asking what a reasonable price for a hotdog should be, would that be complaining?
>>719584538in the context of a bunch of other people complaining about bad hotdog prices it would be
>>719583128You pay more for the brand retard. Literally who indies are worth less
>>719583891No, it doesn't.However, just because you ate porridge for supper, that doesn't mean porridge was the most nourishing meal you could have ate that day. You ate it because you thought it was a moral good. Not because it was the most nourishing.Similarly, just because you set a price, that doesn't mean it's magically the most advantageous price you could have set. It was just *a* price. And if you were motivated by moralistic reasons, then it's very likely that the price doesn't benefit you to the fullest.>>719583997And if the customers are willing to pay more, then why not charge more?
>>719565861nobody was going to pay 20 dollars for lone fungals. Most are going to wait for sell in the single digits.
>>719584652if a customer will pay more there is no reason not to charge more. and if a distributor is willing to charge less there's no reason to demand more
>>719584652its fascinating that you can type all that shit and still miss the point
>>719583176It's a shame CleanFall is a early access game, I enjoyed the demo but I don't buy EA games anymore
>>719584519literally yes, certainty is valuable
>>719565861that fag's game is already out and it looks like shit. I love indie tears so much. get FUCKED, indies
>>719584767>if a customer will pay more there is no reason not to charge moreIn a pure capitalistic view, yes. >and if a distributor is willing to charge less there's no reason to demand moreFrom a customer's perspective, I can see how you would think that. But as a creator, one would hope that some fools don't come along and ruin the market by charging too small of a price for their product.
>>719584994sour grapes: the post
>>719584146exploration-focused upgradelike obviously
>>719585084look if you want to inflict ethics on market pricing, go ahead, but I'm going to slit your throat if i ever meet you in real life
>>719565861uh oh
>>719585290i want to say based and marketpilled but at the same time he's just saying that the property owner can set whatever fool price he wants
>>719585231Unironically not awful, it's descriptive and can just be shortened to EFUSadly, I value efficient communication wherein I can be understood by others, so I am going to use the term "metroidvania" and cringe a little every time
>>719585107shut up, fungus. your game SUCKS
>>719566727I looked it up, too, and it looks nothing like Hollow Knight, you're retarded.
>>719586213i actually played it and it's a hk ripoff. played ok.
Charge 20 cuckbucks anyway
>>719566043Until they start vanning people from twitter, which WILL happen because the reason they've allowed people to be anti-loxist is because they're building databases for when they incite rebellion, twitter is now more based than here. You get slightly shadowbanned on twitter when it detects you say slurs. It's not a glownigger mod getting upset and banning people talking about how niggers and jews are bioweapons against the people who literally discovered electricity and invented this internet.
