What went wrong?
>>720800927the balance was shit and will always be shit, they made every map the same to appeal to pro-players, blizzard locked down the game to make sure they wouldnt miss another dota, the campaign story was shit, they regionlocked e-sports, and probably more that im forgetting.
>>720800927shit story
>>720800927Went from interesting and tense space politics story to boring generic woman power dindu love story
Nothing.It's a great game.
>>720800927>single playerRetcons and turning the story into good vs ancient evil>multiplayerAppealing to eposts crowd instead of regular players
>>720800927lotv
>>720800927Inject larvaShit storyKorean based instead of fun basedNot a real strategy game but more close to Guitar Hero
I played SC+BW campaigns only>Try SC2>Jim Raynor doesn't want to kill Kerrigan anymore>Jim Raynor still bitter about Mengsk when he never gave a fuck about freedom or Mengsk after Kerrigan killing Fenix>Kerrigan is now good (?)>Zeratul isn't cool anymore>No more limit cap on unit managementI did not even finish Wings of Liberty. SC2 is shit as a story and ruined the core mechanics what made SC1 great.
>>720800927Mediocre unit portraits/VA, for starters. Some BW units that I can think of from the top of my head:>Mutalisk>Goliath>Medic>Ultralisk>Overlord>Marine>Vulture>Ghost>Hydralisk>Zergling>Dark Templar>High Templar>Archon>SCV>ZealotGot neutered of soul. Some hero units like Zeratul was also a big-time downgrade. Though a handful of them was pretty cool, like the Firebat suited in the bulkier second-generation CMC-660 armor.
>>720800927It was good up until the very last cinematic where the dumb bitch lives and becomes proto-syvlanyas "sadistic irredeemably evil bitch was actually le good guy all along" so the rest of the franchise became her power fantasy. The story just plummeted like a rock. Gameplay wise half of it degraded while the other half improved with each new expansion like a retarded ouroboros.
>>720800927Choosing to try to milk the saga as much as possible and releasing each campaign as a separate game.Not only it meant that you had to buy three games to have the complete story, not only the glacial pace of release meant that by the time Legacy of the Void came out nobody really cared anymore, but it meant that the pace of each campaign was slow as fuck, which meant tons of B plots that went absolutely nowhere.Oh, and the main narrative was also pretty shit, so full of retcons and old characters being OOC (I swear that when I heard Tassadar refer to the Overmind as a "heroic creature" I almost had an aneurysm).
>>720800927Deathballs
Hybrids. Any and all mention of them ruins everything. I know technically they were introduced in BW (and the Duran exposition was retarded and set up everything wrong with them) but SC2 should have had nothing or little to do with them. Also BW was a preview for everything wrong with SC2, prophecy shit, Kerri-sue and hybrids.
>>720800927>Kill...meeeee.
>soundtrack went to shit>story and characters went to shit>gameplay was still fun at least
>>720802658this.and>>720803060this sum it up perfectly.Ill add that i found WoL (singleplayer) to be enjoyable but for every quality of life inprovement the soul of the game and skill expression was lessened. Pathfining improvements and unit collisions changes made the gameplay more responsive but also made deathblobs more effective an easier to manuver than ever.I hated that the speed of the game was set around "le e-sports pro" crowd, the time to kill in a strategy game shouldt be a "blink and your enitre army is gone".
Take me back to 2010. God fuck it’s 2025.
>>720800927they made a new character who was actually pretty popular then killed him off in the first act, in the middle of a zerg hive, and didn't once think "huh maybe making an infected version is a good idea". of course that was just one of a million stupid writing problems it had.
>>720803926i did, specters were way cooler than ghosts.
>>720804174They made an infected skin for him in Heros of the Storm too lmao.
>>720800927Blizzard got greedy and tried to control the e-sports space through licenses. So it never got that big in Korea even though the original SC was so popular there that people used to joke SC was their national sport.
>>720800927
>>720804252that's because the heroes devs were actually based. they also made the dreadlord jaina skin because the idea was way more popular than what the writers actually came up with for WoW.
>>720804318Starcraft and II are dogshit games about putting an enemy in as many of your circles as possible while avoiding theirs. 0 depth to it. Starcraft II double downed on its shallow gameplay of retardation.
are we pretending suddenly that SC2 wasn't the king of the RTS genre for 10 plus years? it's only recently that the genre has fallen off in popularity, but both SC titles were kings of competitive RTS
>>720804347I could never forgive them for shafting Duke.
>>720800927The game itself is pretty fun but the story is a complete downgrade from the first game/brood war. They should have never tried to redeem Kerrigan, have the Overmind be a slave to Amon, etc. At least the LotV cinematic was really cool.
>>720804507SC2 was the king of the MOBA genre. It's not an actual RTS. Not even RTT.
>>720804507It was the king of esports and anons are saying the focus on esports ruined it so you're not really disagreeing with them
>>720800927they weren't allowed to steal any Warhammer ideas anymore lol
>>720800927Raynor wanting to suddenly redeem Kerrigan was a horrible direction for the story to turn to and as a result the narrative became extremely formulaic and boring , gameplay was fun though
>>720800927MetzenHoes before the bros
>>720804725Why was Raynor obsessed with Mengsk being a dictator? Raynor didn't seem to care at Mengsk at all after Kerrigan murdered Fenix. Lorewise Mengsk and Raynor would have been allies against Kerrigan like in Brood War finale with Mengsk teaming up with UED.
>perfect targeting and units grouped together moving in exact synchronised mannerSOULLESSS
>>720803562>People complain about imperfect pathfinding and limited selection so they can get smooth butter ball "armies"Brood war and wc3 will always feel better to play
Korea time in 7 minutes lads
>>720800927They casualized in favor of trannies and casualsShould've kept the unit selection limitThe pathway movementThe APM intensive multiplayerAnother case of tourists killing something instead of adapting
>>720804864>Why was Raynor obsessed with Mengsk being a dictator?Because Mengsk declared him and Magistrate enemies of the state after they survived Tarsonis.>Lorewise Mengsk and Raynor would have been allies against Kerrigan like in Brood War finale with Mengsk teaming up with UED.Now, let's be honest here. Brood War story and all team ups were either a crafty ploy or desperate alliances of convenience, pretty much like UED remnants taking up last stand with protoss and terrans.
>>720804978>Because Mengsk declared him and Magistrate enemies of the state after they survived Tarsonis.Raynor and The Protagonist chose to rebel Terran Dominion. Mengsk offered them a job in his order.
>>720804640lmao alright and how did it ruin it?
Commander was the best part of it and they did nothing with it.Custom games were never even attempted.Campaign was all timed missions, which ruins the feel of strategic battles.Multiplayer was the focus, full of uber optimized tryhards and certain units were always favored when the appeal of the original was playing casually with friends.Original had more heart and soul in one cinematic than the entire 3 game run of SC2. Prime example, the music and sound direction.
>>720800927The engine is really snappy, unit control and macro are far too easy, which are all great achievements technically, but the result is that it makes it too easy to doom drop or to otherwise do game winning damage to your enemy with a ball of units, which means that everyone has to play super defensive to win, which is just boringThey tried to fix it with new units but the fundamental problem remains Also the story, holy shit what a comedown
>>720805050>Mengsk offered them a job in his order.Did he? I may be mistaken, but in OG SC1 Terran campaign you had to destroy Confederate Ion Cannon to get out of Tarsonis/
Terran Dominion should have been the playable faction.>Rebuild Terran homeworlds after fighting against UED and The Zerg>Take out the known terorrist Jim Raynor and The Magistrate for hijacking Hyperion and being in the wrong side of history>Zerg campaign being Kerrigan being a cunt and seeking revenge against Mengsk>Protoss campaign being takingg out Xel Naga with Jim Raynor's defacto Terran group.SC2 was written by people who never played SC1 campaign mode. They just checked the wikipedia article.
>>720804007Just be like Serral and don’t take the gook kantai kessen.
>>720800927I got what I wanted out of it, but I understand the complaints.
Just doesn't have the atmosphere of the original
>>720804507King by default isn't a convincing king.
>>720803060>Oh, and the main narrative was also pretty shit, so full of retcons and old characters being OOC (I swear that when I heard Tassadar refer to the Overmind as a "heroic creature" I almost had an aneurysm).Well, you can choose to be mad about retcons or being mad about being OOC, because after all is said and done, it wasn't really Tassadar.
Original drip fed you new units and kept it somewhat mysterious so the further you got in the campaign the more cool units you unlocked. Remember going through the campaign the first time and going from zealots to dragoons to reavers to templar and archons to scouts and carriers, the whole time wondering whats next and how cool it all was?Then SC2 came out and added like 4 new units to each race that were all boring to mediocre at best. Should have had "classic" races with the original units and then updated races with completely new buildings, techs, and units. Or just 3 new races or something. You basically have no mystery or wonder to the universe and units.
I got to plat as R 1v1 and decided that if I was going to spend my free time being extremely stressed I might as well make it a social experience too and play dota2 with my bros.
>>720805272>Terran Dominion should have been the playable faction.Dominion was established being as bad as Confederacy in SC1
>Jim Raynor and Magistrate joining Terran Dominion ie Bolshevik Revolution due to being sentenced to death by Confederacy ie Russian Empire>Jim Raynor and Magistrate are shocked when the Dominion revolution wasn't about freedom but just seeking power vacuum by Mengsk ie Joseph Stalin>Raynor and Magistrate are still butthurt because of a trained soldier knowing the risks was sacrificed to save thousands of soldiers for delaing an evacuation>SC2 portrays Jim Raynor and Magistrate as good guys when they were idiots all along.I just don't buy it that Jim Raynor's defacto group is doing it for the freedom.
>>720805646>sc2 needed like 4 different units, some added or significantly changed over multiple expansions, just to fill the goliath shaped hole in their roster
>>720805764>Grimdark universe>Only faction that maintains order and can defend itself from the Zerg, Protoss and Terran terrorists..Fuck off, Metzen.
>>720805951>>Grimdark universe40k, not Starcraft.>>Only faction that maintains order and can defend itself from the Zerg, Protoss and Terran terrorists..But enought about Confederacy
>>720804507It's still the king of RTS.Casuals are just eternally seething.
>>720805951Politely ignore how the Umojan Protectorate was getting along just fine throughout the Brood War.
This shit only happened because the Overmind enabled kerrigan. If she was raped into oblivion and turned into some broodmother mutant things would have been better for SC 2
>>720806037Pretty sure nowadays Age of Empires 2 Definitive Edition surpass it in popularity.
>>720806282>things would have been better for SC 2Nope
>All the plotholes of SC2 started from Brood WarStarcraft lore ended at Tassadar killing The Overmind?
>>720806560>>All the plotholes of SC2 started from Brood WarFalse.
broodwar was a setting with a couple of pawns and factions, a space opera of sorts that only people who grew up with dnd are able to imagine.sc2 story sucks because they turned it into a cringe hollywood garbage love story with "HEROES" and "DRAMA"Makes me SICK
SC2 shat all over the aesthetics of the setting. The Zerg and the Protoss especially suffered from this new cartoony art direction.
>yes, I, the fat fuck dev, will insert myself into the game replacing the most badass unit portrait
>>720804864Because Kerrigan went into hibernation after brood war and took the Zerg with her. There's a scene in the bar interludes with Tychus about it.
>>720807068high resolution 2d sprites are truly the superior aesthetics in rts and strategy gamessharp, detailed and crispy3d models just look like cheaply molded plastic kids toys
nobody denies that starcraft 2's story is genuine horse shit. it's irredeemably awful, we can all agree on that. chris metzen was garbage at writing for a long while even before he left for the first time, which is why i'm always surprised to see people beg him to come backbut the gameplay is still top of the line
The pathing was too good and units were so fucking mobile in SC2 that every match was just doom drops and deathballs unless you had 800 APM.Broodwar had shit pathing and selection limits so you could actually invest APM ahead of time to set up defensive positions.
Sziky vs OyA vs WolFix - Showmatch #3https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeRTEC1YwJE&ab_channel=Pr0nogohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biWphXbcPNc&ab_channel=ElleixGaming
>>720808383high skill high reward
I enjoyed SC2 until LotV. Most of the new units suck shit and they changed the starting worker count to take out all the fun from the early game. Can't even do a 9pool -> 6 lings -> expand anymore which was my favorite way to throw off diamond players.Me and my friends played SC1, BW, WoL and HotS all as they came out, thousands of mostly team games but it wasn't until LotV that everyone fully lost interest.
>>720800927>What went wrong?They flirted with the idea of turning the campaign into a hero focused narrative ala Dawn of War 2 or Warcraft 3 in WoL. Then come HotS and LotV they went all in on it but at that point the gameplay of Starcraft 2 wasn't built around the clear hero focused narrative they wanted to push.
>>720800927catering to e-sports fags making everything about apm and build orders + spic metzen taking over the entire project for muh movie game tier writing, the only genuinely good thing about the whole thing was co-op
>>720805112thisHowever, I didn't like the accelerating pace of the game for commanders, it felt like you weren't "playing a game" but "performing tasks" like a robot.
>>720800927E-sports and Kerrigan's character assassination
>>720800927Why do we play the bad guys again?
>>720801125Balance tweaks can't fix retarded design, which is why mirror matchups are so miserable.
