its pathetic how many people have been filtered by a slightly difficult mainstream title

>fight the first one
>"wait this is just that maggot defender guy from the first game with a telegraphed aoe"
>continue the rush, duo comes
>I have zanzibart man with me because I explored and he just kills them with me
>first try
What the fuck are you guys doing? Listen, it's ok if you think it's hard... BUT 99% of boss rooms I've heard others complain about have AN NPC THAT FUCKS SHIT UP FOR YOU IF YOU JUST EXPLORE. It's not like summons in souls where you gotta swallow your pride, these guys just come in out of nowhere and help.

>>721276285
>he didn't complete the warrior bitch questline to let her join you in the fight
lel

>>721276342
It’s more difficult than most mainstream platformers from the 8 bit era. Anyone that can finish this, can comfortably finish every Mega Man, Castlevania and Ninja Gaiden game on the NES. I like this game, but I’m not going to pretend that it’s not like a product of a different era. I understand why zoomers that didn’t grow up with games like those are getting filtered so hard. Some areas like Bilewater have even made me put it down for several days.

>>721276285
This is where I stopped. This room is disgusting.

>>721276285
people need to realize they're just playing a mediocre game.
Hollow Knight is mediocre as well.

>>721276285
room is bullshit so you gotta bullshit it back
poison tacks and stick to the top of the wall with that one charm

>>721278813
The gameplay of HK is middling but the exploration is godtier. For some reason the developers seemed to confuse their weakness with their strength.

LOL LMAO JUST GIT GUD
LOL LMAO JUST GIT GUD
LOL LMAO JUST GIT GUD
LOL LMAO JUST GIT GUD
LOL LMAO JUST GIT GUD
LOL LMAO JUST GIT GUD
LOL LMAO JUST GIT GUD
LOL LMAO JUST GIT GUD

>>721276285
beat it first go with Cross stitch.

>>721276647
Wait what? I had shakra with me.

>>721276342
thread

>>721276285
I didn't understand why people had trouble with this until someone I was talking to said they went there immediately and had 1 nail upgrade and like 6 health

>>721277075
I had more trouble with megaman2 than silk song, hornet's movement lets you do way more than in megamane

>>721276285
People try this fight way too early because the game in no way indicates you're essentially supposed to complete the entire map before getting the final song.

>>721276285
Just use your tacks

>>721276342
Reminds me of normies when dark souls 1 came out.

>>721276342
nu-/v/ is EXTREMELY bad at video games, for some reason. I'm guessing it's all the zoomers and third worlders who only grew up with all their video games being easy mode because they only got into vidya like 10 years ago.

>>721279381
>you're essentially supposed to complete the entire map before getting the final song.
You are? Shit
I thought what comes after the Chorus section would give you double jump (all the important upgrades are on main progression, not optional paths) to explore the other areas with

Oh well I didn't find it too hard, I just beat this part on my 2nd try

>>721276285
use your fucking tools, retard

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>>721276285
"explore"
-the devs
>>721276342
>difficult
Difficulty implies that i need to actually do something that requires skill, finding something to beat the boss to death with isn't particularly hard

>>721279739
Speedrunners are beating the game in like 1 hour. If you are gonna use skill as an argument, you have already lost.

>>721279739
>Gather 4 mask shards
>Go from 3 hits to die to 3 hits to die
Cool, thanks Anon

>>721279739
you sure good at finding excuses

>>721276285
Mods fix it.

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>>721277075
I'm a zoomer and my first metroidvania was Hollow Knight, my favorite game is skyrim, so I'm a massive casual by /v/ standards. I had no trouble with Silksong, the difficulty is massively overhyped. Most bosses I was able to beat 3 or 4 attempts

Silksong was massively hyped up beyond the niche appeal of an indie metroidvania, so the common consensus has become whatever casual redditors who've never played a hard game before think. If you have actual experience with the genre, which it sounds like you have more than me, and you're still buying into the "silksong is le hardest game ever" meme then it's probably just because what you've read online is influencing your opinion of it

>>721280076
xhe isn’t good at that either

>>721280417
wow anon ur so cool :D

>>721276342
I beat the game 100%. It absolutely has several balancing issues, retard

>get the mask from Hunter's March that lets you take one more hit
>get the injector from Whiteward that lets you heal much faster
>get the cogflies from High Halls and save all of them for one of the big guys
That's how I beat it after like 10 tries.

>>721280548
mods don’t count sis

>>721280564
So to win you just have to use guide?

>>721280013
There's an unbreakable mask that adds an extra hit on your first mask
>>721280076
Wdym? Im not OP.

>>721280652
no

>>721276285
i just used the gun and shot them both to death

>>721280529
My point is that the game isn't as hard as it's being made out to be, not that I'm an epic mlg gamer pro. I'm not typically good at hard games, Silksong has just reached such a wide audience that its difficulty is massively overrated

>>721280564
That's the intended experience. Did you like it?

>>721276285
and then somehow after facing it again and again you beat it and you want to keep playing. In time you learn to love the pain

>>721280772
it’s isn’t though

>>721276285
>use tacks
>beat first try
Easy

>>721280815
It is though

>>721280815
I had all those items before I went to high halls but I have backtrack tism

I've been playing the first HK, just beat Mantis Lords. How much harder is Silksong in comparison? So far HK has been very easy combat-wise, and I think I remember people calling it a hard game.

>>721280548
Not the guy you are talking to, but I also have 100% (even the equivalent of 112%) and the vast majority of difficulty complaints are way overblown. There's only like 2-3 bosses in the game that feel kinda "bullshit". Everything can be solved by either getting good, going back to get upgrades, or both.

>>721280950
silksong is harder but there are a couple bosses in HK that took me as many tries as silksong bosses

I used the sawblades to kill these guys, but the victory felt hollow. I had to reload and do it legitimately. Why do tools literally feel like cheating? They don't seem to mesh with the world.

>>721280950
SS is like 1.5x difficulty and sometimes 2.0x, compared to HK.

>>721276285
>>721279739
>>721280076
>"explore"
>-the devs
Yep. I got to that high halls fight, couldn't beat it after a few attempts, left and did some quests, came back later and Shakra was there to help as a quest reward, which makes the fight 10x easier.

If you just repeatedly bang your head against the wall and make no progress it's not even a skill issue, it's an IQ issue. You are too stupid to engage with the game properly, honestly I'd rather blame the devs than admit that about myself too, so I can't even hold it against you

>>721280862
Just don’t get hit
>>721280936
So did I

>>721276285
This game has a teactic to mentally overwhelm you at times which makes you die. You see those two guys lauching attacks that spam 30% of the area and jumping around feels like too much to process at once. But if you manage to remain calm and observe how to avoid each attack, it is not as hard as it first seem.

>>721281091
Play Hollow Knight again. Silksong is at least 3 times harder, at all times. The difference in the HP pools of bosses, alone, is massive.

>>721276285
Where is your Shakra? Garmond? Or Golden Sentinel? To help you.

>>721281156
also the fact that they can't hit in the air

>>721281132
Kek are you going to "explore" your way through the final boss bro ?

>>721280950
There are many more sources of 2-mask damage, and you have less i-frames on hit. You have to really pay attention or else you get raped in about five seconds.

Bro, your tacks? Your cogflies? Your sting shards?

>>721281212
this its not that hard solo but you should have an npc helper at this point

>>721281291
Unless you've already 100% the game then yes, retard

>>721276285
This isn't as bad as it's made out to be. Get the poison Cogflies and save them all for the last wave. Spam all of them to kill one of them and then just take your time with the other one. You can also upgrade your nail 2 times further by exploring the Citadel. The double jump is also helpful for this.

>>721278927
Where do I get the tacks? I keep hearing about them but I've obviously not come across them.

>>721281132
>Yep. I got to that high halls fight, couldn't beat it after a few attempts, left and did some quests, came back later and Shakra was there to help as a quest reward, which makes the fight 10x easier.
>If you just repeatedly bang your head against the wall and make no progress it's not even a skill issue, it's an IQ issue. You are too stupid to engage with the game properly,
That's what im saying
>honestly I'd rather blame the devs than admit that about myself too, so I can't even hold it against you
But we're in agreement though?

>>721281208
>Silksong is at least 3 times harder, at all times
I guess it depends on how good/bad you are at SS. I never spent more than 1 hour on any boss in SS, for example, so all these people who are crying about spending hours on bosses is completely foreign to me.

>>721281063
>but the victory felt hollow
You have fromshit brainrot.

>Why do tools literally feel like cheating?
Because you have fromshit brainrot. Devs have explicitly stated that the fault of people who find the game too difficult is not exploring to acquire various upgrades. The game is balanced with the use of tools in mind. Intended difficulty is when you kill an encounter with your tools unloaded. Also wandered crest feels very strong to people because it has only one red slot and is balanced around giving up a tool.

Got I fucking hate fromshit fanbase and its brainrot, it's definitely one of the worst things to happen with video games fandom.

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>>721281468
I kept hearing about impossible Last Judge was and I think it took me around 8 or so tries to beat her. Definitely not easy but also not extremely hard by any means. I'm not done with the game and haven't done any post game stuff yet, but I feel like people are being super hyperbolic at the difficulty. I heard that the Mount Fay platforming gauntlet was Path of Pain tier and it wasn't even close.

>>721281132
From Software brainrot. People think it's completely normal to die 20+ to the same challenge and all you have to do is bang your head against it over and over untill you win.

>>721281452
It wasn't directed at you I just quoted you to elaborate on what the devs said

>>721281503
FromSoft and their consequences have been a disaster for the human race.

>>721276285
Nobody has been able to answer this question. Can you parry their club attack with an upslash? I can picture it in my head, that seems 100% correct, but I've never regular attack parried any of their movies before.

>>721281591
>but I feel like people are being super hyperbolic at the difficulty
They are. It feels like 99% of it is people literally just refusing to learn and adapt. They will keep banging their head on a boss instead of actually being calm and learning the boss patterns, and then in the end they will likely just resort to spamming tools to get the boss down.

>I heard that the Mount Fay platforming gauntlet was Path of Pain tier and it wasn't even close.
Yeah, it's mostly just down to people being outright bad.

>>721281503
I've only ever played the first half of Dark Souls 1 bro.

>>721281625
It's funny because even Elden Rings criticism suffered from this, people complained about how margit was as if you couldn't go explore for 8 hours then come back much stronger

>>721276285
? Did you guys not do colliseum of fools? I first tried this. Just heal very high in the air

>>721281154
>Just don’t get hit
Literally impossible in 1 instance when you don't have the dash, in other instances the game's difficulty is informed by what skills/items you have, so depending on your "setup" the boss's difficulty ranges anywhere from requiring near perfect dodging to being so easy that you can literally sandbag him and kill him before he kills you.
In the beast boss fight specifically the extra enemies can literally force you to get hit unfairly if you don't have the right skills, like if the boss is about you and the enemy that has invincible spikes is to your left you're literally fucked and not having the AOE skill is a detriment.

>>721281291
>more masks
>more crests
>more needle damage
>more tools
>more charms
>more silk
Bitch are you retarded?

>>721281063
>Is using the skills explicitly unique to hornet cheating?
Are you using spells in HK cheating? N.b. heal is a spell in HK.

>>721276285
I just left it, did every quest, overpowered myself and came back there with Shakra. Whole fight took literally less than 10 seconds. But yeah, it's bullshit if you want to fight them fairly

>>721276285
You can have Garmond help you with this fight if you finish his questline in The Citadel.

>>721281861
You could have not touched it at all, it's not a result of playing those games, it's a result of communicating with their fanbase on the internet. "[Perfectly legitimate mechanic/item in a game] is playing game wrong and a victory is hollow" is a fromshit fandom meme, that they've been shitting with everywhere to the point of some people actually taking it seriously.

Also
>They don't seem to mesh with the world.
Hornet is a retarded jobber, she jobbed to the knight twice, it is given that she will use shit like this to get ahead.

>>721281938
Margit and the conductor gauntlet have the same issue desu.
In both cases, you get 'led' there earlier than you're 'supposed' to fight it. In both cases, you get skull fucked as a result.
It's on players to not just fuck off and get stronger. It's on the devs there's nothing to indicate you should fuck off and get stronger.

Game is hard if you're trying to just use nail only without wanderer. Becomes easier with wanderer. Becomes really easy with tool spam.
Game still feels too lengthy for what it offers.

>>721281291
How is this an argument? Do you cuck yourself at the final boss and not use the dash/float/nail upgrades/items etc in hopes of playing the game ""correctly"" ?

>>721281969
filtered

Can both Shakra and Garmond help or jusy one or the other? Shakra's ring attack makes me confused, i'd rather have Garmond if i can pick just one.

>>721282289
What is Wanderer?

>>721276285
I completed this room with just base hornet for the speedrun achievement

>>721282357
babby mode

>>721276285
You just need to time your parries.

>>721282328
>Using the dash and floating abilities means you're filtered
Fair enough i guess if you never reach the bosses or play the game then you could never lose

>>721282357
Wanderer is the most HK-like moveset. It trades reach for faster attack speed and a normal down pogo. It also has a hidden 2% crit component when you are above X amount of silk.

>>721282289
I never used wanderer ever since i got it desu, the shorter range just doesn't feel as good.
>>721282357
The crest you get at The far left point of the map, left of bone bottom, if you can get there from the top It gives you faster attacks with less range

>>721281837
>It feels like 99% of it is people literally just refusing to learn and adapt.
This is the main thing I don't get. If you're just patient, after a few attempts you'll win. What's the rush?

>>721282281
>It's on the devs there's nothing to indicate you should fuck off and get stronger.
The fact it's a massive difficulty spike is your indication, the devs are trusting you to actually think. Go play a modern AAA like God of War where you have a sidekick who literally yells puzzle hints at you just to make sure the player isn't accidentally left to solve a problem on their own. I don't want that in the games I like and fortunately neither to the devs despite all the backlash they get for it

>>721282748
If you kept dying to the Mantis Lords in Hollow Knight, Quirrel would show up nearby and tell you to upgrade your nail.

>>721282357
it's normal mode for normal people like me

How are you supposed to 100% this in under 30 hours? I am 30 hours in and I haven't even reached the citadel yet.

>>721282972
most of that time is not knowing what to do

>>721282441
You can parry in this game?

>>721282972
Most of that % is from tools

>>721283046
Attacking into an enemy attack at the right time will cause a parry.

>>721283142
I didn't know that. Is it important?

>>721283210
Much more than in hk at least

>>721278492
There's multiple ways to make it way easier.
>find the room that lets you permanently kill all those silk-siphoning enemies in the Citadel
>can get either Garmond or Shakra to join you in the fight
Was admittedly a bit disappointed you couldn't get both of them to help you during the fight. Would've been a little too easy but would have been kino.
Also tacks completely demolish them, but that goes for almost any enemy/boss that spends a significant amount of time on the ground.

>>721283210
>Is it important?
Not really. I played through the entire game without parrying at all. However, if you are good at parrying it definitely makes some things easier.

>>721279154
>Wait what? I had shakra with me.
Bug Quixote helps you if you've dueled him, but only if you don't have Shakra's quest done otherwise she'll be there instead.

>>721282847
Hollow Knights early game was much more linear than Silksongs, there is only one path you can take up until that point, and Quirrel is basically letting you know the world has opened up more now that you have wall climb, and that progress isn't gated behind the area boss like it was in Forgotten Crossroads and Greenpath

I don't think it was totally necessary since you'll likely find the unreachable path to the city of tears before getting wall climb, but it's also a totally different context that serves a greater purpose than just telling the player how to make winning easier

>>721281591
See, part of this is just down to different perspectives on difficulty. I think a lot of normies just aren't used to anything taking more than 3-4 tries, meanwhile for me I consider it an easy boss if it takes less than maybe 8 or so

>>721283210
It's most important for the (many) times in which the game squeezes you into a little corridor and one of those little spider niggas pop out and flurry you. If you spam attack you can "parry" him and counterstrike. Once you catch the first blow timing doesn't seem to matter.

>>721283472
Replying to my own post but I forgot to add, iirc you only need to die once to the mantis lords before you're pointed towards the city of tears

>>721280950
The game basically expects you to have finished HK and scales as such. Which makes enough sense considering Silksong was originally just supposed to be a Hollow Knight DLC.

>>721276285
I can't believe how many people do this fight and don't seem to realize that the larger bugs are almost entirely ground denial based, it's not even the slightest bit hard. Gimme a break.

>>721281591
Last Judge is easy if you aren't trying to be too aggressive. It's attacks are very telegraphed and easy to dodge, but if you're up in it's face non-stop it can hit you pretty hard.

The fucking flea minigames was the moment I truly realised the Devs had lost the plot. The entire world is dying from soul-eating spirit AIDS, everyone is dead or dying, the music has become even more depressing, and these two ozzies decide to make the comic-relief gypsy puppy festival stroke-inducingly difficult. It made me so mad. It reminded me of what is wrong with humans, fundamentally.

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>>721280950

>>721283479
I agree. So far the only thing that I would consider truly hard that I've come across is the High Halls gauntlet, but I'm also not using any tools although after reading these threads it seems that I am severely gimping myself by doing that so I'm going to start messing around with them.

>>721280950
It's a lot harder but if you thought the mantis lords were easy then Silksong will probably be more like medium level difficulty for you

>>721283883
Kek

>>721284037
>It's a lot harder but if you thought the mantis lords were easy then Silksong will probably be more like medium level difficulty for you
Mantis Lords are a very easy fight after you do the patterns once, I'm not sure it's really comparable to anything actually hard in silksong.

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This was unironically harder than any boss in Act 1 or 2.

>>721283868
Seth juggle is the one thing that I didn't complete in the entire game. Everything else I did, but I just can't be fucked with beating that high score in juggle. I got close a few times, but I was just so done.

>>721284178
You're wasting way too much time pogoing and double jumping instead of sprint jumping into dashing into clawline.

>>721284178
>Name is Sprintmaster
The nigga can FLY at the fucking SPEED OF SOUND

>>721276285
How do i get Garmond to help me? I talked to him multiple times in the Citadel and dueled him already. Anything else?

>>721284354
Are you telling me that I didn't need to pogo any of those hanging things?

Wait what? Just did this room today on my first try after 2 day break cause of work.

How fucking shit has /v/ become in videogames is unreal. Did the Frog dude at Pisswater on second try and first sinner on my first try too. Hoping for first actually hard encounter in act 3 when i get there tomorrow. Its been pretty much the perfect balance so far, everything feels fair but challenging enough to clear on first or second try if you just focus. But would like to hit my head against something at some point.

>>721284178
Hit him to slow him down

>>721284503
>Are you telling me that I didn't need to pogo any of those hanging things?
Pro tip: once you get the hook, you never really need to pogo anything again. You can just hook to them.

>>721280625
>trannies out of nowhere
mind status: broken

>>721284178
the game tricks you into thinking it's a race when it's actually about finding the optimal path that lets you hit him with your clawline

>>721284503
The issue is more the double jump than the pogo. You should be using clawline on the little balloons and the air dash to move across, the double jump barely give you any horizontal movement.

>>721284354
How do i sprint jump? I can't do it consistently

>>721284751
Just press jump while you're sprinting, there's nothing else to it.

>Deliver goods from Bellhart to Mount Fay
Please tell me this isn't as hard as it seems.

>>721284865
Yea, still can't do it 100% of the time. End up just jumping normally.

>>721285017
There's literally no reason to do the delivery quests besides the one for the weapon upgrade.

>>721285089
I'm going for 100%.

>>721285043
The only things I can think of is that you're trying to jump too early or you stop holding left/right before you jump. Idk, I never had issues doing it.

Guys, are there any interactions with the Sentinel during act 3? I see him slaughtering citadel bugs here and there, but when he's done he just flies away.

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>>721284513
>would like to hit my head against something at some point.

>>721285243
As in the 100% completion achievement? That one only requires you to do the delivery for the weapon upgrade. The only things that matter for it are things that give you character upgrades, the other deliveries just give roseries.

>>721285017
It's not that hard if you just learn the route, take your time, and don't rush. There's no time limit, it's just all about not taking hits. Go up the mountain on the right side like when you got the cloak, and then fly down on the left and you're basically there.

Oh yeah? Well I beat all bosses on my first try blindfolded
Maybe try getting gud, huh?

>>721285243
100% only requires every tool, upgrades to the max and finishing the act 3 quests.

>>721276285
I did it firat try with hunter crest, no NPCs, no cogfly, no fractured mask, no dice

GIT
GUD

>>721285370
This fight felt disappointing to me. I had set myself up to spend like an hour on it because I figured it would be hard, and then I beat it in like 3-4 tries.

I 100% the game with an arm tied behind my back
Just git gud bro

>>721285509
>no cogfly
you didn't beat it

>>721285379
>>721285420
So what is the point of this one? Just to say you did it?

>>721276342
The constant whining is so fucking annoying

>>721285698
360 rosaries
(and some dialogue with the mask guy if you break his mask)

>>721285698
I just wanted to have everything fully completed in my house. One of the "materia" is from that quest.

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There are people ITT who never learned his name.

>>721286259
Surprisingly you can save him

>>721280860
tacks are the reason ive beaten lace v2 in the first try, theyre so good i love them

>>721276342
Fpbp
But fromsloppers being ousted as shitters is pretty funny

>>721281591
mount fay was super chill. i enjoyed the platforming, and the music was good.

>>721276342
It's pathetic how many people can't simply admit a majority of the game is very poorly designed.
Most of the bosses themselves, interestingly, are not an example of that.

>>721287305
Name three (3) instances of poor design.

>>721282748
Did I say I did that? I rushed it, tried like 6 times, then fucked off for like 10 hours.

It's still on the devs, there isn't like a quest or even any dialogue at the first shrine.
You don't need yellow paint and aloy saying "hook shot gotta be" every 40 seconds to direct the player.

>>721287305
nice cope

>>721287305
Can you give like 3 concrete examples of scenarios you think are poorly designed in Silksong? I'm curious about what you are thinking of.

>>721287381
>>721287521
>moss mother (too hard)
>bell beast (too hard)
I will let you know more when I progress further

>>721287817
just admit you're bad at videogames

>>721287381
Poor progression.
Runbacks.
Normal lil guys doing two damage. Comparable to GOD, btw.

I'll list some more.
Incredibly poor pacing between Acts.
Very poor power scaling.
Very weird balance between crests and tools. Yellow tools, for example, are far too few in number, and relatively useless. Blue tools are far too varied and useful for their limited slots. No Fun Allowed.
Enemy gauntlets before bosses.
The High Halls enemy gauntlet.
Said bosses and gauntlets not rewarding you with currency to replenish your tools.
Tools costing currency to begin with.
Lack of rewards in general. Why does the Lost Judge not give a single rosary? What's the lore, lorefaggots?
Too much backtracking in a game too big to meaningfully prop it up, missing the point of backtracking entirely.
Too much bloat.
The Bilewater boss. All of it.

Every area and challenge suffers from at least a few of these.

>>721287817
I sincerely hope you are joking.

>>721287817
>he hasn't even reached the early bosses which they nerfed in a patch
Guaranteed bait, but good enough for me to hand out the (You)

>>721276342
tedious isnt the same as difficult

>regular bosses usually take me 1 try
>almost every “important” boss except for those near the start (lace and chorus) of the game have taken me 5-9 tries
Is this normal? Am I the target audience or am I a dumb little retard?

>>721276285
yeah, this game is shit. I think the people that actually stick with it are either paid bots or super autistic retards that finished the game in 2 days because they have nothing going on in life.

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>is fun and kino the whole way through

>>721276285
>getting filtered by this gauntlet
>give up and fuck off to other areas to look for upgrades
>fail to find anything meaningful
>come back and immediately stomp it
Happens every time.

>>721285618
there was one guy on here a few days ago who genuinely argued that she's harder than Eigong, I have no idea how

>>721287982
>Poor progression.
In what sense? For me the progression felt very natural and good. I felt like I was constantly evolving and getting stronger throughout the entire game, aside from maybe the last 50% of Act 3.
>Runbacks.
Can this really be called "poorly designed" when it's completely intended?
>Yellow tools, for example, are far too few in number, and relatively useless
This is is a valid complain that I fully agree with.
>Enemy gauntlets before bosses.
Valid and agreed. Way too much reliance on arenas/gauntlets. There's only like 5 or so that makes sense and the rest just feels like filler.
>Said bosses and gauntlets not rewarding you with currency to replenish your tools.
This is obviously fully intended, but I guess it does get annoying if you rely on a tool-dependent playstyle.
>Lack of rewards in general. Why does the Lost Judge not give a single rosary? What's the lore, lorefaggots?
My main complaint about the rewards is how exploration is often just "rewarded" with a few strings of rosaries that adds up to the same amount as you would have gotten from killing 2-3 normal enemies.
>Too much backtracking in a game too big to meaningfully prop it up, missing the point of backtracking entirely.
There's tons of shortcuts, along with fast travel and tube traveling. I don't really see how backtracking in a game like this is a problem.
>The Bilewater boss. All of it.
Groal? Literally the only boss in the entire game that I cheesed, and it was only because the runback was so fucked. Legit the only runback in the entire game I have felt was 100% unfair in every way.

>>721277075
>Anyone that can finish this, can comfortably finish every Mega Man, Castlevania and Ninja Gaiden game on the NES
lol no? what the fuck are you smoking?

>>721276285
When I was going through this endless gauntlet praying for it to be over and these two fags dropped from the ceiling, I quit the game for the rest of the day.

>>721288490
Based

>>721276342
there's difficult and there's artificial difficulty, this is artificial, there is literally NO REASON for basic enemies to do 2 damage other than padding your trash designed game

>puts another flyer in your path
terrible design, way too much reliance on them

>>721289257
If the enemies only did 1 damage, this game would be EXTREMELY fucking easy.

>>721288906
>Can this really be called "poorly designed" when it's completely intended?
Yes. In fact, it can. Intentional bad design is still bad design. How is this even a question?

>In what sense?
I appreciate your chill response, so I'll endeavor to be genuine as well.
I'm playing the game for the second time now, and it's shone a light on some of the progression issues that I took issue with in my first playthrough. I appreciate that the game gives you the dash relatively quickly, but then it starts to get spread out very thinly, especially if you're a player like me that likes to scour areas before moving on. So I'd spend hours before the next upgrade. Contrast this with something like Metroid or Ori, which give you a lot very quickly, even taking into account a first play. Ori 2 is so confident that it gives you all the most fun movement abilities right off the bat, and a Triple Jump fairly soon after too, and this somehow doesn't destroy the game.
As for Tools and HP/Silk upgrades, you don't get much until Act 2, and by then, there was simply too much. You had to backtrack constantly to get new things, which just padded the runtime. Hours and hours and retreading old ground, and I felt like most of it was trying to find tiny, hidden secrets, rather than returning to an old area that I need a new ability to progress through (which is my favorite part of this genre). It only had a couple of those. Then you get to Act 3, and what is your reward? "Okay, now go through the game one more time. All of it. Starting from Bone Bottom." What the fuck. I was struggling to care, and eventually I just stopped caring.

Even knowing where everything is, there's so, so much backtracking. I feel like Silksong is too big for any meaningful plotting like that. In fact, I think the Any% speedrun route is where the game should have ended. Act 3 is wholly unnecessary.

>>721289448
Enemies only did 1 damage in HK.

>>721277075
why are people comparing this game to NES platformers? I've seen this kind of post pop up recently, it's always mega man, castlevania and ninja gaiden too... they are nothing alike and just suggesting the comparison is beyond retarded

>>721289349
I forgot to mention fliers. There's a very special place in hell for people who program enemies to fly just out of reach, while still being able to attack. Once or twice, sure, but every flier for the duration of the game and SOME BOSSES do this. It's indefensible.

The hardest boss is actually that I'm just not having fun...

Hardest boss in the game? Yeah, it’s easily double grub mothers. What a shitload of fuck!

>>721288982
Castlevania 3 and Mega Man 1 (without the pause trick) are the only marginally challenging ones. You only found them difficult because you were a kid back then. Mega Man 2-6 in particular are piss easy (well, 3 spikes sometimes.) MM5 and 6 in particular are a joke. NG1 is only challenging because of the final boss. The rest of the games aren’t hard.

>>721289913
NG1 is hard because enemies respawn like Kirby but it’s not Kirby so you can’t back peddle at all. If you removed respawning enemies it’d unironically be easier than Kirby’s Adventure

i feel everything is beatable on your first try if you just reflex it well. i nearly beat karmelita on my first try but it still took me 7 attempts to beat her. even lost lace just changes her moves slightly from lace 2 and adds void shit you should already have learned from the rest of act 3

>>721277075
i defeated silksongs but to this day i still have to use cheats to finish megaman x and the non-rpg castlevanias

just admit it zoomer, it's the lowering IQ trend

>>721289606
>How is this even a question?
To me the wording "poorly designed" just seems wrong when they intentionally designed it in that way. To me "poorly designed" invokes the idea of something that was unintentional, but maybe that's just me. I guess it's just semantics.
>I appreciate that the game gives you the dash relatively quickly, but then it starts to get spread out very thinly
Oh I see what you mean. I'm guessing they spread it out because they wanted people to get really used to an ability before providing the player with another one. In addition to that, they probably also did it like that because if they just gave you all the tools like in your Ori example, it would maybe allow players to get into places that would be deemed to be too hard by the devs, so it's also kind of a way to mostly hinder people from not going to areas that are too hard too early.
>You had to backtrack constantly to get new things, which just padded the runtime
I never felt like this about tools, but maybe it was entirely due to my playstyle. I almost never used tools, so once I saw places where I could acquire new tools, I just wrote it in notepad, and then eventually came back later to buy everything at once. For masks and silk, I just noted locations down and came back over time mostly naturally.
>Then you get to Act 3, and what is your reward?
Yeah, I think it's pretty much universally agreed upon that Act 3 is not that good overall when it comes to the gameplay side. The story is nice, but going back to act 1 areas did feel kinda meh and all the infested enemies just felt annoying and tedious to deal with because of how they all had the same 2-3 dark attacks tacked onto them, and then just had their HP increased by 3x.
>Act 3 is wholly unnecessary.
It does feel like it was a bit rushed. I'm hoping that the DLC will make the Act 3 -> DLC path make sense and feel better.

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karmelita and lost lace are shit

>>721289825
>Hardest boss in the game?
For me, it was unironically the 2-3 segments where you have to platform with lava chasing your ass. I had more problems on those than I did on any bosses, except maybe Karmelita.

>>721281212
I told Garmond not to help me because I thought he'd die in the fight. Joke's on me since he gets VOIDED anyway

>>721276342
this fight in particular is a gauntlet where most of the enemies are boss tier levels with movement and the arrange of abilities and you combine them in a single room its actually challenging

i say challenging loosely because the game thinks its a proper difficulty when in fact its just bullshit lazy slop like its demons souls in 2009 again

>>721290106
>i nearly beat karmelita on my first try but it still took me 7 attempts to beat her.
Why does this happen so often? I have the theory that when you finish your first attempt, the brain starts its training phase and learning the boss patterns instead of acting by pure reaction.

>>721288490
I felt this way when I initially beat it but have gone off it over time, imo Aria feels far longer than it actually is despite its brevity. Outside of Julius I also think the bosses are broadly ass, I routinely forget the Manticore in particular is in the game at all.

>>721289913
Silksong isn't even harder than the MMX games and I played through them quite recently. OG MM is brutal in comparison.

>>721291142
The one in Far Fields (for a mask shard, or maybe a spool) was brutal for me, but I think that was mainly because I did it before I knew there was a double jump. Part of me wants to do a fresh save already just to see how easy double jump makes both the gauntlet and the climb

>>721276285
The game gives you more than full control to beat everything. Git gud.

>>721282338
Shakra takes priority.

>>721276342
Hollow Knight was slightly difficult. I'd rate it just above Mega Man 1 in terms of difficulty. Silksong is VERY hard. It took me longer to beat Karmelita than it took me to 1cc Wily Beast and Weakest Creature on Lunatic.

>>721284158
Nightmare King Grimm would be about average for an Act 3 boss.

>>721291217
The only death I didn't feel bad for in the game was the fag bugs. I tossed a Pimpillo at their corpses.

>>721276285
I'm quitting at Hunter's March. I don't like it. I don't like the pogo platforming whike being mobbed by flies that take five hits to kill, the sword bugs are too goddamn hard, the runback from Marrow is annoying, and I just haven't been having any fun yet.
Game is fucking dogshit.

>>721282289
I've been using Reaper the whole game. I can't go back to Wanderer and I just 110%'d the original right before playing Silksong. Reaper just feels so much better to use, especially in the late game when you don't have time to get 2 hits on an enemy before having to back the fuck off so the slow hits from Reaper aren't a drawback.

>>721279739
agreed
>explore
>find broken tool
>abuse broken tool
>look at me im skillful and i got good
literally the whole crux

>>721296117
You aren't supposed to be there that early. Go explore elsewhere.

>>721291046
Karmelita is harder than Nightmare King Grimm. Lost Lace is about as difficult as Radiance.

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>>721276285
>that fight
>drop all of these
>fight over

>>721276285
Bro this game is old as fuck now, stop posting about it. Everyone has already beaten it.

>>721284513
yeah i stood in the corner abusing the tool like everyone else too anon

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>>721296497
>early
Not sure what else I'm supposed to do

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>>721295279
>It took me longer to beat Karmelita than it took me to 1cc Wily Beast and Weakest Creature on Lunatic.
Fucking how? What is wrong with you people? She has like 4 attacks, dodge and punish them, respect her anti-air, it's not that hard

>>721296746
There's nothing you actually need in Hunter's March until late game. The only thing of note there is the Crutch Mask.

>>721296553
Opposite for me. Lost Lace was harder than NKG (and Pure Vessel). Karmelita wasn't too hard (even with the gauntlet)

>>721287982
hollowknight fanboys will look at everything you said and say why all of that is on purpose and its actually a good thing

>>721279340
Megaman2 is baby's first platformer wdym

>>721289606
the backtracking in this is so fuckin ass compared to many metroidvanias because of how much threading the needle is needed. theres so much shit in the way that you cant just sprint jump screw attack to areas in an instant because theres ALWAYS something that can fuckin knock your hp off in a matter of seconds.

>>721296917
Yeah, I know. And they'll think, because I'm criticizing it, I hate the game. I don't. I'm just tired of the discourse praising HK and SS as these perfect games. They're good, great, even, under a certain light, but not perfect. I don't even think they're proper classics.

I wouldn't care so much if it didn't set some kind of precedent, but because of the hype, it unfortunately does.

>>721297074
I am also tired of whirling fans and random spike pits placed merely to slow me down, or damage me, if I commit the sin of not remembering each and every one.

>>721296746
Zoom in and see where else you can go.

>>721288667
yeah and its not because you "got good" or "skill issue" its because you found some busted fuckin tool and farmed shards to spam them in the fight bypassing everything

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>>721289691
its one of my top 3 gripes with the game.
80% of the enemies and "challenge" are puttin in these fuckin type of flying enemies, in groups, in rooms either in your way or to fight.
then they decide to give half of these like more moves than a fuckin basic boss.

>>721297284
Anon specifically pointed out he didn't find any meaningful upgrades to his toolkit. That's how brain operates, you need to sleep on it for new information to get processed.

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>>721297283
I guess Far Fields

>>721277075
Slow down now. This game ain't shit compared to NES platformers

>>721276285
It doesn't really get annoying until Act 3, in my opinion. Fights like Lost Lace are conceptually cool, but the forced cutscenes and extended wars of attrition are the exact reason why I haven't liked a lot of Fromsoft's stuff. I can recognize the fact that this style of design has an audience, and obviously there are cheese strats for people who don't want to deal with learning boss patterns. Just not the kind of thing I like to play very often.

I assume Grandmother of Silk up in the Citadel is the final boss of Act 2, correct? Is there anything I absolutely need to do before I beat her? At this point I've spent so much time exploring I'm not sure there's much left. Just the courier quests and the ingredient quest.

>>721297420
Head up the big central airstream

>>721297393
you are fundamentally damaged if you think that is all he did
both you and anon(You) are disingenuous as fuck

>>721296746
You need to go to Greymoor. Go back to Far Fields and explore around some more.

>>721297541
Maybe tomorrow. I'm already bored and burned out on the game

>>721297562
I don't know why you're upset, it's a well known fact that taking breaks between learning sessions expedites the learning process.

>>721297469
cursed ending. if you already have witch crest then you missed your chance. nothing else that's worth otherwise, unless you'd like to fight shakra and garmond.

>>721297759
NTA but can you give me a hint without much spoilers what I need to look out for to get the better ending? I'm at the start of act 2.

>>721286446
wait what?

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>>721276285
I just used the spike traps and flies for this and they just absolutely melted. This is kinda the tipping point where the game starts breaking and the boss design changes and becomes 10x more punishing to deal with it.

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Not my problem.

What does building the life saving bridge in the first location do exactly? I built it and proceeded to break the fucking thing.

>>721297869
for true end? Just do everything. You can't "lock yourself out".

>>721297869
do all that you can: wishes, bosses, fleas, upgrades. eventually you'll get a wish at bellhart telling you to go to songclave

>>721298093
Got it, thanks.

>>721298116
Thank you.

>>721276285
Poison tacks my beloved

>>721297759
Ah yeah I went through that whole bullshit with the parasite. I had a feeling there was a special ending for beating the game with it but fuck that.

>>721298237
you can get all the songs and beat lace before getting cursed so the only challenge is silk without healing.

>>721296553
Karmelita isn't too hard if you stay on the walls and use saw blades which admittedly are a OP tool.

>>721298042
It's actually pretty funny to consider how different my playthrough was compared to people who used stuff like cogflies or the fractured mask. Not shaming anyone. Just pointing out another wrinkle in the discussion around difficulty. Not all runs are equal.

Why isn't the coral tower area a actual zone in the game instead of 4 gauntlets and a underwhelming boss. It's visually one of if not the coolest looking places in game. Also I preferred getting runes or whatever they are called to upgrade the dream sword over little mementos you put in the house for the endgame boss rewards. The former feels much more rewarding and there's a sense of progression while the latter is just eh.

>>721298694
>Why isn't the coral tower area a actual zone in the game
It was, but they had to cut it for some reason. You can see it in the trailer and it also has some enemies that look like Steel Soul-exclusive, but aren't actually in the game. Maybe it was pushed to the DLC instead.

Waiting for the actually good silksong thread

>>721299547
You'll be waiting longer than you did for Silksong

>>721299039
I see that's very disappointing especially when they had something good there. I understand that making it a dried out desert fits the desolated nature they were going for while the coral tower was it's past glory but it's less visually interesting to me.

>>721298658
Yeah being able to choose the correct tool for the right situation is definitely a skill. Some people are really bad at it.

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This is power

>>721276342
it's poorly balanced, not just hard.