Like it or not, Super Mario Sunshine is the only true sequel to Super Mario 64 in terms of gameplay and development. This was the last 3d Mario game to be made by the team that made 64, ie: Nintendo EAD, and thus it's the last 3d Mario to directly develop on the gameplay mechanics introduced in it>In Super Mario 64, you were kicked out of levels after getting a star because occasionally levels would change, Bob-Omb Battlefield being an example of this. >Super Mario Sunshine builds upon this by having the levels change with every single mission. You can no longer do as many missions in any order, but in exchange the missions are more interesting and significant with each mission having some form of story >Fludd allows players to experiment more with how they beat levels. Fludd was actually inspired by devs seeing how players found different ways to get into Peace's castle. They wanted to give players a tool to experiment more and also a handicap for less skilled players >The secret levels are an evolution of the Bowser levels in 64. They're platforming levels meant to test your skill and force you to get better at the game outside of Fludd One of the reasons why Sunshine was so negatively received was the misconception that 3d Mario games are collectathons like Banjo-Kazooie. The main focus of Mario 64 was not the collecting aspect; it was the missions. The same is true for Sunshine. People who label Super Mario Odyssey as the true successor to 64 don't understand 64.
>>721911119Nigga its just a game, chill. you are not wrong though
>>721911119Mario Sunshine is abominable dogshit. Not only is it not the best, it's actually the worst one. It's worse than all the 2D entries too, it's that bad.
agreed. mario never felt the same after this. something is missing.
>>721911726Explain how it's bad in your own words
>>721911119>big empty levelscheck>unskippable cutscenescheck>shitty blue coin padding for literally 50% of the gamecheck>coin layout autismcheck>worse moveset than mario 64check>pointlessly huge levels that are only made that big to justify the casual jet pack for baby mode playerscheck>only good sections are fluddless undergroundscheck>ruin those anyway with gimmickscheckYeah I'm thinking we found all the reasons why the gamecube failed lmao.
>>721912436Do I really need to, it should be self explanatory if you don't ignore all of the game's very apparent problems
>>721911726The 2D games usually are leagues better than the 3D titles anyway, though.
>>721912440>big empty levelsThey're not empty. >shitty blue coin padding for literally 50% of the gameYou're not forced to do the blue coins to finish the main story. Just like you're not forced to collect all the 100 coin Star missions in Mario 64. >worse moveset than mario 64Subjective. I prefer wall jumping in Super Mario Sunshine. Also, losing the long jump in favor of fludd is a fair trade off. You have the spin jump too. >pointlessly huge levels that are only made that big to justify the casual jet pack for baby mode players How are they pointlessly huge? They're well crafted and immersive worlds. The only exceptionally large one I can think of is the ancient mountain. >ruin those anyway with gimmicksThe only one I can think of is chuck ya
>>721912589Explain in your own words. I'll happily explain why Super Mario Odyssey is the worst
>>721911119Being unable to collect shines out of order completely killed sunshine and galaxy IMO.
>>721911119That's a really boomer take. I tried replaying Sunshine recently and the shooting controls aged really horribly. If it played like Splatoon it could be decent, but as it is I can't really recommend it to anyone who didn't grow up in that era.
>>721913010>They're not empty.
>>721913127That was never the point of 3d Mario. You can't complete all the stars in 64 out of order either. It's about the missions. If you want a collectathon, play Banjo Kazooie or Mario Odyssey. Pure 3d Mario is not a collectathon focused on freedom. >>721913304You're filtered. It plays just fine. I'm 21. >>721913581I said that the mountain level was large, but it's not useless. That level teaches you how boats work and the space allows you experiment. There's also an underwater section where you fight a boss.
>>721911119>Super Mario Sunshine is the only true sequel to Super Mario 64 in terms of gameplay and development>less worlds>still managed to pad the game with two red coin missions per world as well as 1/5 of the shines being tied to blue coins>vast majority of worlds are flat with zero or minimal platforming and only one has a bottomless pit>Ricco Harbor, the one world with significant platforming, has no way for you to actually die outside of deliberate drowning or the blooper which is a different style of gameplay>the bloopers are a prime example of the game underutilizing the unlockable nozzles; no reason for it to not have been a Turbo mission>secret areas completely isolated from actual worlds>making every mission slightly change the level makes getting the 100 coin shines a chore because not all missions provide enough coins and there are more locations you can get locked out of>all the "difficult" missions are a result of janky physics related to a specific object, not actual challenging platforming
>>721911119>One of the reasons why Sunshine was so negatively received was the misconception that 3d Mario games are collectathons like Banjo-Kazooie.No, it was criticized for being more restrictive than 64 thanks to the mandatory 7 stars per level, the voice acting, the camera (despite it being pretty good), and ironically for being too safe of a 3D platformer
>>721914009>I'm 21.A 21 year old cubekid in 2025? What will they think of next.
>>721914124>vast majority of worlds are flat with zero or minimal platforming and only one has a bottomless pitObjectively false. >Ricco Harbor, the one world with significant platforming, has no way for you to actually die outside of deliberate drowning or the blooper which is a different style of gameplayNo? Not having bottomless pits in every world doesn't make it a different style of gameplay. >secret areas completely isolated from actual worldsOh, shut up. You're regurgitating that shitty Mathew mc autist video. This is such a dumb complaint and is not objective. >>all the "difficult" missions are a result of janky physics related to a specific object, not actual challenging platformingFiltered
>>721914474Freedom does not = better. I'd rather play well crafted linear content than a multitude of mediocre content that I can do in any order. >>721914556I did have a GameCube growing up. Is that hard to believe? I also had a Wii as well.
>>721914618>You're regurgitating that shitty Mathew mc autist video.So if we're going by your retarded logic, you're just regurgitating what Arlo said by praising Sunshine.
>>721911119>Temu Konpeto
We just never get anyone insisting Techromancer was a great game. Nobody ever bending over backwards to say "brooo if you ignore half the game it's totally the best thing ever." Just saying, Techromancer fans just don't do this.It's always people who grew up with a fucking Gamecube.
>>721914869I don't watch Arlo because he's a homosexual >>721915060How is sunshine objectively bad? It was well received at the time. It's YouTube essayists and pseudo intellectuals who insist on trying to say it's a bad game
>>721914618>Not having bottomless pits in every world doesn't make it a different style of gameplayI was talking about the blooper surfing.>This is such a dumb complaintOutside of the aforementioned Ricco Harbor, give me another world on the level of Tiny, Huge Island, Wet-Dry World, Tick-Tock Clock, or Rainbow Ride. Those all managed to balance the sandbox collecting with platforming that wasn't shoved in a magical door that warps you to a separate challenge room.>FilteredI specifically put "difficult" in quotation marks for this reason. Riding Yoshi on boats to get to the poison river to collect red coins isn't hard, it's tedious. The sandbird has a bunch of clouds around and you can use FLUDD. It still has weird slope detection and you can even clip above it. The pachinko machine is more likely to just dump you in an empty slot to go back to the start than kill you at the bottom.
>>721915178>It's YouTube essayists and pseudo intellectuals who insist on trying to say it's a bad gameExcept now they're doing the opposite and saying it's overhated or an unpolished gem. Which means you are now obligated to hate Sunshine because it's the contrarian option.
>>721915178but you watch matthewmattosis?
>>721915232>Outside of the aforementioned Ricco Harbor, give me another world on the level of Tiny, Huge Island, Wet-Dry World, Tick-Tock Clock, or Rainbow Ride. Those all managed to balance the sandbox collecting with platforming that wasn't shoved in a magical door that warps you to a separate challenge room.Ok>Noki Bay>Pianta Village>I specifically put "difficult" in quotation marks for this reason. Riding Yoshi on boats to get to the poison river to collect red coins isn't hard, it's tedious. The sandbird has a bunch of clouds around and you can use FLUDD. It still has weird slope detection and you can even clip above it. The pachinko machine is more likely to just dump you in an empty slot to go back to the start than kill you at the bottom.It's funny how when people say Sunshine is jank, they can't use any examples outside of >Sand bird >pachinko machine >Pods>Chuck ya Corona mountain isn't even jank if you understand the games very simple physics.
>>721915416I watched his review of Sunshine partially and stopped because it was pseudo intellectual mumbo jumno that didn't really say anything meaningful
>>721913104>Super Mario Odyssey is the worstYou're nuts
>>721915607So that's two to the four I listed. Including Ricco makes five. Meanwhile 64 still has Whomp's Fortress, Cool, Cool Mountain, Lethal Lava Land, and Shifting Sand Land. Plus the 3 Bowser levels that Corona Mountain doesn't even come close to in terms of obstacle variety.>It's funny how when people say Sunshine is jank, they can't use any examples outside ofThey all have wonky physics and buggy terrain, difficult or not. Go to the pachinko launcher and try a ground pound or wall slide down onto it. It's pretty funny. Same goes for the watermelons and how Mario's momentum and hitbox affect them similar to how you interact with durian. The Chuck Yas are just positioning, their throw arcs are consistent.
>>721914009>non linear objective completing wasn't the point of the 3D sandboxesAND you're retarded.
>>721915178>How is sunshine objectively bad?it has less content than its predecessor for the same price pointit relies on gimmick shit like all 6th gen scrimblo bimblos that felt obligated to innovate with worthless additions
Mario Sunshine is like the developers attempted to make their own Sonic Adventure without understanding anything of why it's fun.
>the first 7 missions of each world are MANDATORY, NO EXCEPTIONS>you WILL do the boring Shadow Mario chases>you HAVE to go to Pinna ParkPlot gates in Mario are cancer. Sunshine kills all 3D Mario freedom. Still not as bad as Galaxy 2's fucking straight line of a map though.
>>721915996It is. The missions are mediocre and so many of them are copy and pasted. Yess, you have the freedom to do things out of order? But at what cost? There's no missions to look forward to when you replay the game. It's just mindless collecting. >>721916071The watermelon physics were fine and that was a fun mission. Again, nitpicking a few select missions to prove it's janky. Also exposing how you were filtered. >>721916089It wasn't? 64 kicked you out for a reason. They didn't intend for you to play missions out of order. You could thanks to technical limitations and not in all cases. >>721916223The missions are beefier and more interesting than 64's. >>721916416Sonic Adventure is fun if you chug Tylenol
>>721916416>bad voice acting>beach aesthetic>talking robot>more focus on story>you can fall glitch through the floor just by playingkek you're right
>>721916603Well crafted linear levels are better than muh freedom. Freedom is not objectively good
>>721916836>The watermelon physics were fine and that was a fun mission.Did I say it wasn't?>Again, nitpicking a few select missions to prove it's janky. Also exposing how you were filteredYou're really under the impression that I found the missions hard when I'm describing what filtered others. Are you seriously incapable of accepting that someone can praise AND criticize the game? Is the latter what's making you defensive? Because Sunshine is objectively not perfect.
>>721916974I never said it was perfect. I'd say Sunshine is 8/10
>>721916920>Well crafted linear levels are better than muh freedomYeah, which is why Galaxy 2, 3D Land, and 3D World are better than Sunshine.
>>721913581>look away from the map>it's emptyno shit retard
>>721912440>shitty blue coin padding for literally 50% of the gameBut enough about Odyssey's moons.
>>721916836>They didn't intend for you to play missions out of order.The development team literally said they focused on Mario first, then made the levels as they got ideas. The whole idea behind 64 was freedom.
>>721917073They're different kinds of games. Sunshine is a 3d sandbox game. The mission structure is linear, but the areas themselves are more open and immersive. You couldn't really recreate some of the highs of Sunshine in Galaxy or 3d world
>>721917286>The mission structure is linear, but the areas themselves are more open and immersive.Which was a mistake. The juxtaposition does not work, something Galaxy 1 proved. Bowser's Fury is how 3D Mario should be structured if it wants to be a sandbox, not the way Odyssey did it.
>>721917273Freedom of movement which is what Sunshine builds upon. Freedom of mission structure and doing missions out of order was not the focus. As made obvious by how some missions are only unlocked by finishing missions before them
>>721916836>But at what cost?I guess a game being fun is a high price to pay? fuck everything about Sunshine, I want to have fun, I will replay Mario 64 again.
>>721917404Bowser's Fury is fucking horrible. Mediocre piss easy platforming and brainless copy and pasted objectives that you can do in any order. Sunshine actually has interesting missions such as the hotel haunted by ghosts which is very reminiscent of Zelda.Or fighting Bowser on the roller coaster. There's nothing like that in Bowser's Fury. It's just a mush of forgettable repetitive missions. "BUT YOU CAN DO THEM IN ANY ORDER WOOOAH"I don't get this obsession with non linearity Or the
>>721917487Super Mario Odyssey is not fun for me. The thing I like about 3d Mario is the missions. I don't care about collecting. I hate collectathons like Banjo Kazooie. I want interesting memorable missions
>>721917190Moons were great because you could do the ones you enjoyed and skip the others. Not a single one was as generic as the blue coins, spray a red triangle and run to where it dropped, WEEEEE. Odyssey even fixes blue coins by having them just be your life counter, which fixes two birds with one stone, the regular coins. Don't ever try to criticize Odyssey when you praise something as bad as Sunshine.
>>721917609>Sunshine actually has interesting missions such as the hotel haunted by ghosts which is very reminiscent of Zelda.You mean the one where the ghosts are completely passive and you just have to jump onto a glowing hole at the top of the hotel? That you can reach without even using the boos?>Or fighting Bowser on the roller coasterThe one where you just dpam the trigger and win?
>>721917736The moons were mediocre because they were not proper stars and there's barely any interesting or memorable missions tied to them. In Sunshine and 64, a star or sun sprite would be significant. Especially in sunshine, where the level would be changed and built around them. Again, this obsession with freedom over actual quality is ridiculous. Super Mario Odyssey is a very mediocre and shallow game in comparison to either Sunshine or 64.
>>721917415>Freedom of mission structure and doing missions out of order was not the focusIt was for 64, which you brought upDon't spout bullshit, nigger>We thought that half the people would just go straight into the castle, and half would hang out and explore outside, as you described. We made the game with that latter half of players in mind. I’m not saying that either way is “correct”, of course.
>>721917715They don't even get more memorable than Odyssey, fighting a garden flower abducting UFO as a plant that alters the base movement into something unique just for that level. The entire game is like that. You can just do the main objectives, there's an intended path that rewards grand moons to power the ship and unlock the next level.
>>721917885You just don't understand Odyssey at all it would seem.
>>721917609It was really innovative Sunshine had you go halfway through a level to fight a goo piranha plant reskin, get kicked out, go back in, then fight the boss instead of just having you go up the mountain to fight the boss as the first mission like 64
>>721917821The one where you have to figure out how to hatch a Yoshi egg and get into the locked room. It's a nice change of pace.
>>721915707gonna have to have a nostalgia fap to sigurd's peach
>>721917910Exploration? Yes. Sunshine has exploration too as you have to figure out the missions. >>721917992The most memorable parts of Odyssey are the boss fights. The moons throughout the worlds are mediocre and copy and pasted. The platforming challenges are so easy they're forgettable. Compare them to the secret levels in Sunshine and you'll see a stark difference. >>721918175That was arguably filler, but you can technically skip it
>>721917609>Sunshine actually has interesting missionsSunshine has interesting SET UPS for missions. The actual missions are fucking boring.>Yoshi's Fruit Adventure>have to ground pound two containers until a specific fruit comes out, then you do like 4 jumps with Yoshi>haunted hotel>have to carry a pineapple up to Yoshi>sand bird>you never actually see it hatch and it isn't even visible in the level, you just warp onto it>the mystery of the carousel>walk up with a Yoshi and do a random obstacle courseNow that I think about it, Yoshi is tied to a lot of these.
>>721918560I find them interesting and engaging
>>721918465Odyssey even fixed those gay ass chucksters, with those fling poles, allowing you to direct the chuck sneed.
>>721918780Odyssey is brainless. There's no interesting or difficult platforming challenges. Nor is their memorable missions outside of bosses. Maybe it I huffed some gasoline I'd find it interesting
>>721918860There
>>721912440>big empty levelsstopped reading there
>>721917609>brainless copy and pasted objectivesHow many times did Sunshine make you fight these again? Or kill the Monty Mole in the tank the exact same way? Or fight Gooper Blooper? Don't forget returning to both secret stages to hit red coin switches or chasing Shadow Mario through unchanged levels. Should I mention spraying Ms off walls? How about Xs and Os? Why did it do this again? It's on better hardware.
>>721918860At this point, I'm sure you haven't played Odyssey.
>>721918992Despite Sunshine and 64 both having copy and pasted content, they're not as obnoxious as Super Mario Odyssey simply because they have more interesting original missions. What do you look forward to in replaying Super Mario Odyssey outside of boss fights?
Some games you consider replaying, and then you remember "that part" so you decide against it. Mario Sunshine is That Part: The Game.
Can we stop pretending the secret courses in Sunshine were some massive tests of platforming? A lot of them involved waiting on blocks or jumping across slowly rotating things. They even made the weird choice to let you do the red coins with F.L.U.D.D. which completely removes all challenge.
>>721919362They get harder near the end with the sand platforms and trickier jumps
>>721919160The journey from cap kingdom to the wedding on the moon. The celebration in new donk city. Exploring every nook and cranny only to discover, egad, there's a reward for doing so. A lot of the boss fights are good, but they are literally icing on the cake for a ridiculously incredible game.
>>721919160I don't like Odyssey. I think it's the peak of blatant game time bloat. However, Sunshine did the same thing years ago and people lauded it as a great sequel which is not true. It has even more padding than the previous game which is unacceptable.
>>72191916064 had an excuse: console limitationsSunshine and Odyssey don't
>>721919362Those stages were so fucking obnoxious because for some fucking reason the developers decided to give Mario zero acceleration, he just runs when you lightly tap the analog stick. Grabbing collectibles at the edge of platforms is atrocious, you either have to do a u-turn maneuver running along the edge or you have to tap the joystick like 10 times to baby it.
>>721919501Mindless copy and pasted slop that you collect like a good goy. It's mediocre. I hate collectathons. People who like collectathons have no soul. >>721919540Sunshine compensates by having interesting missions and not just mindless collectathon gameplay. The main focus of sunshine was not blue coins
>>721919639Sunshine was rushed.
>>721919736Bitch how many shadow mario chases? how many blue coins? how many RED COINS? why the FUCK does the hotel level spawn you on the FUCKING BEACH outside the FUCKING HOTEL? why the FUCK DOES THE CAMERA GET STUCK ON EVERYTHING? WHY THE FUCK would you EVER even THINK to criticize a game as superior to Sunshine as Odyssey using examples that are AT THEIR FUCKING WORST IN THE GAME YOU'RE DEFENDING. please would you kindly kill yourself
I love Sunshine. I replayed it at the beginning of the summer. The only thing I don't like about it is the final battle. Its very anticlimactic.
Sunshine also has:>Strong level themes that are all under the overarching Isle Delfino theme>Open spaces to flex movement, which were largely absent up until Odyssey>Levels that fold over themselves, which enable freedom of movement and reward layout familiarity>Continuous movement that enables flow>Many original settings, enemies, and NPCs, which were also absent until OdysseyI loved playing it again with the Eclipse mod. That quick jump you can do with the hover nozzle is so nifty that I'll never play vanilla again.
>>721919896The shadow Mario levels are fun. If blue coins were the main focus of Sunshine than it would be mediocre and akin to Super Mario copy and paste Odyssey. However, they're not.
>>721919898Same. >>721919973The Eclipse is trash made by banjo spergs
>>721919736>Sunshine compensates by having interesting missionsIf there were more missions like scaling the amusement park or the fake eggs being turtles, sure. However, some worlds can have up to 4 red coin missions. Every world has a Shadow Mario mission. That's a good chunk. I also don't like when some worlds repeat a gimmick but bigger like the Chomps in Pianta Village. That could have been one mission, not two.
>>721920020>The shadow Mario levels are funNTA, but no they aren't. He goes down in like five seconds, has one small route, and doesn't even fight back.
Sunshine began the now established tradition of having bonus levels be completely detached form the level you find them in, just boring-ass blocks and structures floating in an endless featureless void. I hate it and now every nintendo game has them, and it's Sunshine's fucking fault
>>721920135There's more original and engaging missions than in Super Mario Odyssey
>>721919362It's not that they're "massive tests", they stand out because you get to take a break from Sunshine's bullshit to do some actual platforming.
>>721920280I already told you I don't care about Odyssey. Stop using it as an excuse.
>im ur momma!?!!? :OEven as a kid, this moment solidifed the death of Peach to me.The graceful Mario 64 royalty was gone.
>>721917885Finally someone said it. I played Odyssey after borrowing the cartridge from a friend, I couldn't help but feel unbelievably underwhelmed, it is by no means a terrible game but the movement feels so boring, they gave Mario a fucking sonic spin dash and some dumb bounce on the hat to gain height bs. How can anyone defend that? Plus the moons for the most part are completely boring at least sunshine and 64 have the decency of making the movement fun
>>721920260Foids is fun. Especially on GameCube where the level of water he squirts is decided by the pressure you place onto the triggers. I find any opportunity to use him fun. >>721920279They're not bonus levels.
>>721920313>you get to take a break from Sunshine's bullshit to do some actual platformingWhat bullshit? All the things people complain about are in the secret areas. The main courses are kinda boring..
>>721917885>Again, this obsession with freedomFreedom to sequence objectives shouldn't be confused with freedom in general. Sunshine engenders more freedom in how you approach its average mission than any freedom enabled by Odyssey's wide-open spaces.So, it's not that freedom is unimportant; it's that shallow freedom is getting too much attention from plebs and normies.
>>721920487Call them whatever you want, you know what I'm talking about
>>721920479Super Mario Odyssey is made by the team who developed Galaxy and 3d world who had no previous experience making sandbox games. You can tell.
>>721920527Truth nuke.
>>721920479>sonic spin dash and some dumb bounce on the hat to gain height bsTbf, these two mechanics are in complete opposition.The spindash is pretty cool since it lets you roll down hills.The hat jump is ass because it kills all momentum and is encouraged all of the time.It could've been way better if:>Hat jump is alternate to high jump (hold jump to go higher)>Instead of gaining height AFTER hitting an enemy, Mario would toss his hat in one smooth motion and generate a makeshift platform
>>721915060What the fuck is wrong with Tech Romancer? It blew my mind as a kid and turned me into a mecha dork forever.
My main issue with Sunshine is how disjointed everything feels. The platforming challenges are in some pocket dimension, but the game tries really hard to make a believable setting where you can see different worlds in the distance. Also blue coins were shit and it has one of the worst Bowser fights in the entire series.
>>721920920Mathew mc' autist
>>721920892Nothing, it's awesome. The point is there's something in the fucking Nintendo Gamecube water.
>>721921120What?
>>721920509>The main courses are kinda boring..This. This bullshit exactly. I'm not playing a 3D platformer to piss on flowers or push watermelons across a flat beach or ground pound three tiles and grab a chili pepper or wander through cramped rooms and air ducts in a hotel, I want to do some platforming.
>>721920670He fucking lied harder than any cubekiddie has ever lied
>>721921353OP has this retarded mentality where you can't criticize Sunshine because ecelebs did it, but you can praise Sunshine even though ecelebs did it.
>>721918236>He still uploadsAll is good in the world
>>721911119>ITT: People seethe that Mario Sunshine was too kino and hard for them>>721911214fpbp
>>721919501When everything is special, nothing is special. Imagine if you filled every accessible xyz cordinate with a moon. That's basically what you're defending with "There's so much to explore and there's a reward for it"
>>721922238more like>ITT OP dismisses all criticism with nuh uh and keeps screeching about Odyssey as if it and Sunshine weren't equally shit
>>721921369You can't appreciate soulful kino. That's your issue. >>721921698Because I can tell when someone's copying an opinion from Mathew Mc' autist.
>>721922548>Because I can tell when someone's copying an opinion from Mathew Mc' autist.So is this the point where I point out your constant moon complaints are regurgitating what he said himself?
>When everything is special, nothing is special.I'm hard pressed to remember ever hearing anything so appallingly retarded in my life.
>>721922660It's true. Moons in Odyssey hold no weight
>>721911119>>721914009>>721914618>>721915178>>721915707>>721916836>>721919736>>721921120>>721922548Arlo detected.
>>721922434>Odyssey as if it and Sunshine weren't equally shit>Odyssey is also bad tooYeah thanks for confirming you're a giant shitposter.
>>721923670Super Mario Odyssey is bad and you have an IQ below 90 if you enjoy it
>>721923670>NOOOO MY HECKIN SUNSHINEfuck off arlo tendie
>>721923670Odyssey and Sunshine are both bad for similar reasons, yes.
>>721923890How so? Sunshine has actual well constructed missions
>>721923974That's such an Arlo-coded take.
>>721911119Cubesnoys are delusional, holy shit.
>>721924226GameCube ARYANS will inherit the earth
>>721923773>>721923783>>721923890holy lowtest
>>721923974Both try to combine sandbox with linear courses and fail at both. The obstacle courses have the challenge with zero identity. The sandboxes have all the charm, but nothing of interest.Both have blatant padding. Blue coins are just as bad as moons because Sunshine is a smaller game.Both gate players behind story-related objectives to move to the next area.Both give Mario a handful of nee mechanics are barely required for the main game. All style, no substance.Both are a chore to 100% and the reward isn't worth it.Both have Yoshi as a crappy side gimmick mostly there for nostalgia bait.
>>721923773>>721923783>>721923890>But I'll eat up Super Mario galaxy wiimote shake slop with no level design! Mmm, 70 dollars again, you shouldn't have.
>>721924485Blue Coins can't possibly be as bad as Moons because Moons did the bare minimum of giving you a menu to keep track of them and don't require you to talk to a random boring NPC just to turn them into a Shine wasting time for no reason. Blue Coins are THAT bad.
>>721923974>>721924375Reminder: Arlo believes>non-platforming shines good>separate secret courses good>story focused Mario good>gated progression good>blue coins are fun>repeated missions are not padding>64 has not aged wellSo saying any of this in defense of Sunshine means you are simply parroting him.
>>721924375You're low testosterone for not enjoying the Mario game that broke away Mario from the pussy he was entitled to in favor of a feminist message?>>721924485Yoshi in Sunshine has a unique mechanic aka the hunger mechanic >>721924754Blue coins are not the main focus of Sunshine. Moons are the main focus of Odyssey
>>721924618>proceeds to buy limited time ROM collection slop, a gamecube controller without analog triggers, and subscribes to NSO for the gamecube
>>721924990>Yoshi in Sunshine has a unique mechanic aka the hunger mechanicI believe that falls under "crappy side gimmick". If your reading comprehension is poor, I do apologize and am also very sorry for you.
>>721911119This picture is a false representation of the Mario canon. Everyone knows Peach had Bowser's baby in this game.
>>721925103Anything is a gimmick to you
>>721925207Yoshi is a gimmick. The wing cap is a gimmick. Power ups are a gimmick. Do you not know what the definition of gimmick is? Now let me continue to blow your tiny mind: a gimmick can be objectively good or bad.
>>721924990>unique mechaniccucklo defense force is here
>>721925149>This picture is a false representation of the Mario canon. Everyone knows Peach had Bowser's baby in this game.Bowser and Bowser jr themselves confirm she's not the mom, retard
