In games that have them, why are tanks and healers more rare than DPS? Like it never seems to matter what game but any game that has holy trinity is like that it seems. Even PvP games like Marvel Riivals or Overwatch are like that. Healers and tanks just aren't as numerous from a player base standpoint. What is it about those roles that just make people not want to play them? Has there ever been a game that has gotten the roles "right" enough that all are played equally? From what I gather, most people think you'd have to be a masochist to enjoy playing tank. Most people think healers have a god complex of some sort and a lot of people think DPS players are assholes. So whats really going on?
Just installed this mod :D
>>722615067You are unbelievably gay and a furry.
why the fuck do games even bother with tanks or healer?healing is never a win conditiontanking is never a win conditionthe win condition is always to kill, i.e. damage your opponents. why don't you just make a jumper class who can jump more than everyone else for other irrelevant shit?
>>722615389I think its just to make a distinction between characters. Like beefier characters should probably have more HP but you can't just make a character have more HP and deal equal damage so something has to give somehow. At least from a balancing standpoint.
>>722614969DPS only needs to worry about killing things and not dying, healers and tanks need to worry about actually supporting the teammost people just wanna kill shit instead of having to tard wrangle (or get yelled at for not tard wrangling well enough)
>>722614969As a tank player, it's because you're easy to blame. Healer/tank are lower in numbers, and easier to blame. A bad DPS can have the slack picked up by a good one.In WoW or other MMOs, you also have raid/dungeon numbers. 1/5 tanks for dungeons, but 2/20+ for raids, fucks up the numbers. Additionally, tanks and healers have to swap roles more. There's often bosses that can be 1 tanked, or healers numbers vary from 3-5, so you either play your off role or get benched for a boss. In PvP games, tanks and healers typically don't get kills. It requires a higher level of play to feel the satisfaction from really good CC or clutch saves that you get, both in MMOs and shooters/MOBAs. The low hanging fruit is damage number big kill number big. Thus it gets better at high levels of play in terms of role spread, but is awful at low levels. Floundering as a tank also feels really fucking bad. It just means you die a ton, and accomplish nothing. Particularly in team games, if you try to engage but it's bad and nobody follows you just die, and then your death count gets high and your team flames you, especially with randoms who don't here you say 'go in' or the like. Likewise if someone dies without getting healed in the past X seconds they're apt to complain, without regard to the healer's CC status/mana/CDs/range/etc. Meanwhile a great healer or tank gets less praise since it's harder to notice well chained CC or making a catch where many wouldn't, or preempting damage well.
I play on TurtleWoW and even with 10k+ people online and cross faction grouping, with shamans and paladins combined making up 47% of the server, there are no fucking tanks and healers.
>>722614969Most people prefer to play for themselves and do kills instead of working for the team. I think it's that simple.
Because it fucking sucks. DPS is fun.Tanking:>need to know the dungeon by memory, have nobody guiding you>need to be properly geared and speccd, which usually makes you suck ass at dealing damage, which in turn makes leveling worse>fully responsible for pulls, if you get too many mobs its your fault>micromanaging tab targeting threat on different mobs is a nightmare, especially on older mmos where stuff doesn't even update frequently or easily display threat across all mobs in the fight>dps can easily fuck you over by going full retard and targeting the wrong shit/pumping too muchHealing:>boring as shit>literally just watching bars>if the tank isn't geared/speccd properly your job is 10x harder>if the tank loses threat, due to his fault or dps, you are in hell>even worse at leveling than tanks, no real offensive capabilities at all>retards will frequently overpull or not let you recover between fights, making your job 10x harder
>>722614969>DPS is the main role for advancing the win condition>DPS is the most competitive role with the most room for improvement>DPS has the most wiggle room in class design, so there's more likely to be a class you likeIt doesn't make sense...why don't people like playing whack a mole with green bars...
>>722616476>Playing tank>My ranged DPS nigger is running ahead and pulling everything forcing everyone to work 10 times harderAs is the tradition of the DPSoid
>>722616476In regard to the tank portion, I do believe this is a result of just shit developer decisions. I think tanking can be fun if more of the intricacies were mechanically driven. Like when I played some MMO's, it felt like I actually didn't have very much onus in keeping myself alive. I think a better move would be to make tanks more defensive / reactive so that healers wouldn't have to watch them as hard. But then in turn make the damage that other party members take a bit higher. It has just always felt like I am just getting punched in the head but not really defending myself from being punched in the head. Sure, there are tank cooldowns etc but they always felt like oh shit buttons instead of interesting and useful abilities.
>>722615389The Trinity is in place because it opens up design space within more difficult content.If everyone is a DPS and the only purpose is to kill the boss, focus fire on specific mechanics or avoid mechanics independently, then there's less you can do with the boss.In comparison, when you have classes built for it, you can have things like a tank being required to pull aggro or succeed specific mechanics by surviving where no other class would, or healers being brought in to allow much higher damage from the boss.Inevitably however, playing a healer or tank is always, ALWAYS worse mechanically and visually than playing other classes. If nothing else, because it's much easier and more satisfying to see damage number go up in comparison to making your micro skills 1% better.
TF2's medic is fun. You control the flow of the match, create power spikes, have multiple options for how you power spike with different mediguns, and the crossbow is satisfying for its burst healing. Why don't more games copy this design? Is it because having a bunch of different healing classes limits what you can give them individually so they don't overlap too much?
>>722614969It's fun to play the class that is focused on fighting and killing the enemy. Tanks are focused on taking hits to the face and usually dealing way lower damage than the DPS, while healers are focused on managing other people's health bars. Those things aren't as interesting as being the one actually killing the enemies, like you normally do in other games which aren't based on the MMO trinity system.Sure you can have healer and tanks and even DPS designs that are more hybridized and don't stick exclusively to their "canonical" role but ultimately they will still lean more towards their primary purpose. There also seems to be a lot more variety in the DPS role in most games (multiple kinds of melee, ranged, magic, etc. DPS classes), whether that's inherent to the opportunities available in the archetype or just laziness / lack of imagination on the designer's side I'm not necessarily sure.
>>722617106>If nothing else, because it's much easier and more satisfying to see damage number go up in comparison to making your micro skills 1% better.This is the biggest thing.If you optimize boss movement as a tank, you may increase the entire raid's DPS by 2%. But since it's spread across the entire raid, you don't notice it nearly as easily as one guy seeing he used a CD differently and did 2% more DPS that pull.
>>722615067what a downgrade
Game design crutch. Pokemon competitive has so many intricacies, and while there ARE Pokemon that would fit the archetype of tank and healer, you're never forced into bringing 2 stall, 2 sweeper, 2 healer.There are other roles, like a mon who is there to set up hazards or to spin away those rocks, I guess some people would call that a tank since you're taking/making space. But even then, you can just ignore that if you have a different strategy, the game is lot more open ended than tankhealerdps, so there are just more things that can be done with the game. Weather? Stat boosting for pure dps? Swapping to a mon that is stronger and can trap the opponent and force a ko? Using a mon with a held item that counter the enemy? If a game relies on "the holy trinity" then you can assume the team are bad at balancing and are just defaulting to "easy" balance.
>>722618041>Breathes in>Fanfic meta
>>722615389>healing is never a win conditionIt is on Marvel Rivals. Right now the meta is 2 tanks, 1 dps, and 3 supports. You have no clue what you're talking about.
