The third world soul doesn't understand why art is more important than flashy graphics and technology
>>724227416I always liked the penis cliffs in Bubsy.
>>724227416Once discussion begins on the quality of art, we soon become aware that judging its quality is not easy. Normal people don't have an adequate inventory of concepts. Their everyday language lacks the vocabulary to offer meaningful suggestions. To comment on art, people typically use vague adjectives like>good>colorful>pretty>interesting>weird>different>unique>realistic>creativeWhen they encounter art that does not "look good", they fail to provide convincing bases for such judgment. They assume that their assessment is self-evident and hope others will feel the same way. Often, someone goes "I like it!", and another "I don't like it!", and this is the point where any meaningful discussion of the art's quality breaks down.Shit like this isn't rewarding or thought-provoking for artists, and in order to advance these discussions, people just need to educate themselves and learn special concepts and vocabulary, or heaven forbid - learn to draw, paint, and so forth, which we know they will never do.
>>724227416>erm, the left is good because everything is intended, while the right is just shovelware slop! i am very smart because im leaving it as an exercise for the reader to intuit that, it is not my job to educate youLiterature is dead.
>>724227416ZELDAAAAAAs art is better than bubsy because it's fucking ZELDAAAAAAAA no i will not elaborate it takes a lot of effort to explain, totally not because i'm being a contrarian, you're just uneducated, please cum on my face daddy nintendo
>>724227416damn that's wild now compare it with a 16-bit game that isn't the designated punching bag of the industry
>>724227416Bubsychads won.
>>724230567The whole point is that high art low fidelity is better than low art high fidelity Obviously high art and high fidelity is superior to both
>>724230567
>>724227416you say that but this board is exactly like the retards on the left since it does nothing but cry about muh resolution and fps
the autism unemployment rate is so high where they'd rather write shit like this than apply for a job.
>>724231896>on the left*rightfuck
>>724230567it went over your head
>>724227416you can have both you know...
>>724229908As evident by the popularity of video games.
>>724232195You can but the ridiculous focus on tech and spectacle in order to pander to normalfags and thirdworlders meant art basically underwent an exile in vidya over the last 20 yearsThere are maybe 10-15 games released since that I would say have artistically meaningful visuals
>>724227416>the poor gba artists had to work with the shitty canvas they were given :((((don't care faggot the game looks like shitbefore i know what the premise is, i already saw it looks like shit.before i know what the gameplay looks like, i already saw it looks like shit.it doesn't fucking matter what aspect of the game you're trying to shill, the artstyle is what people see first and foremost.retards can cope and seethe all you want but it is very simple: first impressions matter
>>724230567Rayman was 32-bit
>>724234228(You)
>>724227416>The third world soul Then why do first world chuds keep pushing GRAFIX?My point is that your racism is not consistent and not substantiated. Just annoying.
>>724234357>Using ChatGPT as an argumentThe absolute state of /v/
>>724230567rayman is fucking disgusting
>>724227416This is so stupid. They should be comparing BOTH to modern indie shit. Nobody knows how to do SNES styled pixel art anymore.
>>724227416Not a problem in project Nortubel
>>724234501You'll find that GRAFIX started being pushed 1) when publishers started aiming for global audiences 2) when developers started outsourcing everything to third world studios
>>724234506well you lost an argument to a GPU congrats
>>724235123You do know that the Playstation, the Saturn, and the Jaguar (the platforms Rayman was released on) are all 32-bit consoles right, retard? Maybe next time, check to make sure the GPU you're asking is actually smarter than you.
>>724235252That's just a marketing scam. Just like the claim that Jaguar is 64 bit.
>>724229668You do not need a verbose vocabulary to describe what makes good art good. Thinking you do and needlessly making your reasoning artificially complex does nothing but make you come off like a jackass.
>>724230567>PS1 was 16-bitlah mao
I feel like this "layperson" this guy is referring too doesn't exist, at least in meaningful numbers.Also like >>724234608 says indies have shat up pixel"art" so much Bubsy genuinely looks decent.
>>724234608Stardew Valley?
>>724236718>inb4 shading retardIf it wasn't for the absolute plague of mixels, it'd be pretty close.
Bubsy doesn't look bad. The problem with Bubsy as an overall franchise is not the art for Bubsy 1 on the SNES.Yes, Link's Awakening does look better though.
Artist here. Right is better.
>>724236390layperson = normalcattle, and they absolutely will say a game looks better the more realistic (read: browner and bloomier) it isbut they are also the kind of people who look at the OP images and say both look like shit
>>724237020Anon nobody judges 2D art the same as 3D art. Not even normoids. If that's what you want to bitch about, compare two 3D games instead.
>>724235083>GRAFIX started being pushed 1) when publishers started aiming for global audiences 2) when developers started outsourcing everything to third world studiosWhen did this begin, according to you?
>>724233791>>724236962You'd think he woulda used the 16-bit zelda game for his comparison instead of the one with literally 4 colors. I wonder why?Oh.
>>724237708Late gen 6, fully underway in gen 7
>>724237859Because the 16bit Zelda game has good artistry retard, see >>724231648
>>724235748>You do not need a verbose vocabulary to describe what makes good art goodThis is true as long as you don't mind not being taken seriously.
>>724236962AI pajeets aren't artists
>>724235083Graphics over style have been pushed by the western games industry since the 80s. People have been warring over which console has the best graphics for generations.
>>724229668>Their everyday language lacks the vocabulary to offer meaningful suggestions.thinking criticism needs "vocabulary" is why we get incomprehensible self-referential buzzword nonsense like that electric underground retard. if you create extra jargon then it becomes obfuscating, load-bearing and meaningless. none of the words in pic related are coherent criticisms.an idiot admires complexity, a genius admires simplicity, simple as. if your points have any real value then you should be able explain them in simple terms, even if it means having to explain some complex underlying concepts.
>>724238789>trying to refute an argument that has its basis in intelligence with nonsensical AI slopPut on a trip or something so I can filter your retarded ass.
>>724238478No the tech wasn't there to push graphics so devs relied on artistry instead, which is why the MegaMan Legends aesthetic is still beloved and the visuals of games like GoldenEye have been considered a joke ever since the following gen of consoles dropped, despite both games releasing in 1997Starting with gen 7 there was no longer any need to push artistry to make up for what the hardware lacked, and devs went all in on global audiences and third world studio sweatshops to churn out realistic models, artistically there have been no MML tier industry games since NNK
How do I get better at drawing sprites? I made Zygomoids but the art in it is very amateur.
>>724238946>he doesn't know that some of those terms were created by a real video game "reviewer"lol
>>724227416Both look good.
>>724234357You said 16-bit game, not 16-bit graphicsAnd you're wrong regardless, because a 16-bit console would not have supported Rayman's graphics.
>>724236804These mfs were great and I won't stand for any slander. The animations were mid, yeah, but the sets? 10/10. Great parts packs, creative designs, fun gimmick, and the last time lego had small, affordable impulse buy sets- a term that doesn't even exist anymore.
>>724239050Use AI
>>724227416And that's why Darkstalkers is the best looking fighting game
>>724238789You can tell those terms were invented by bad actors just from how many of them are political (in a completely non.political context). "Checkpoint socialism", "Mechanical welfare state" - it reads like a parody.
>>724239421Some arcade machines would have.
>>724239421>a 16-bit console would not have supported Rayman's graphicsRayman does nothing graphically special. It's a bog-standard 2D platformer.
>>724229668>Often, someone goes "I like it!", and another "I don't like it!",That's literally all art discussion is, anything else is just putting fluff around these two terms
>>724239050From looking at your game you should probably clean up your line work and use a smaller resolution for that type of style.
>>724227416
>>724239990I mean my sprites are 48x48, the standard use in RPG Maker 2003, I don't know if I have the ability to make them smaller. Also how can I clean up my line work? Any tips? I've often heard that getting good at pixelart means not drawing the sprites like you would a regular drawing, how do I do that?
>>724239686yeah and those "16-bit" arcade games would still need to have a 32-bit GPU.
>>724239748Rayman himself can't be done on a 16-bit console. He's composed of six separate sprites with multiple frames. On the PS1, his intro of jumbled body parts is far too much for an SNES to achieve, not without some black magic. The initial Rayman game looked way different from the Atari game onward.
>>724240269>six sprites is imposssible on a 16-bit console!Lmao retardYou know absolutely nothing about the subject
>>724239748>>724240530You'd make a great CEO with your technical knowledge.
>>724241303I'm not going to read your stupid garbage. If you think fucking SNES can't handle six sprites on the screen at the same time you have never seen a SNES game in your life. Same for Megadrive. You're such a subhuman nogames idiot that you really should not embarrass yourself by talking.
>>724241430>I'm right!>No I'm not going to read information that proves me wrong>Who cares about background art and resolution, it's just six sprites!lmao, textbook suit mentality
>>724239421https://youtu.be/86rqaGLVdMQ
>724239085>"some of those terms"Yes, the first 5. Every single one AFTER the "more in that underground tone" line were AI generated to sound like them. You're an AI slopper and your opinion is worth less than nothing.
>>724239748>It's a bog-standard 2D platformer.On a 32-bit console with 32-bit graphics.
>>724240104>Also how can I clean up my line work? Any tips?https://pixeljoint.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=11299pic related are what smooth pixel lines look like. the first one is a basic one, you won't get a line that looks like this when you just draw a line using the MSPaint pixel tool. you'll get jagged corners and stray pixels which need to be erased and adjusted in order to look smooth like this.the second one was smoothed out even further using an extra midtone color. use this second method very sparingly at first, just focus on making a basic 1-pixel wide line that looks like the first example.>I've often heard that getting good at pixelart means not drawing the sprites like you would a regular drawing, how do I do that?because you're not supposed to just draw lines and leave it at that, you can start with lines or even an underdrawing but then you need to push and pull things around on a per-pixel basis. if there's a perfectly straight, unbroken row of pixels vertically or horizontally then you can do that as a line but you need to take extra care with any diagonals. you have to arrange each pixel to some extent.
>>724241838>SNES prototype has worse graphicsWhat point did you think you were making
>>724227416bubsy had amazing pixel art for the time and that was one of the few redeeming things it had. Why are you screen capping schizos?
>>724227416Give it a year and with AI I will prompt a better looking retro games than all that old boomer slop from 40 years ago. Fuck humans, AI forever!
>>724227416What mental illness causes someone to take a shitpost from another thread and then immediately make a new thread out of it?
>>724242652>What mental illnessBaAFD - Being an Aquafag Disorder
>>724243085>AquafagWhat is this forced meme
>>724243085>AquafagJust call them Indian.
>>724241953Mostly because of cartridge size than the actual hardware.
>>724243684Still could have been beautiful
>>724243684And things like resolution, color palette, processing powerAnon, it's okay to admit you made a mistake. You don't have to try this hard to deny it
>>724240223not all of them
>>724244115That's why I said "mostly"There are other concessions yeah, but the main problem was the cartridge size. This is reason they were going to switch to the SNES CD but I the end they just switched the development to the newer consoles.
It's fucking harrowing to see how low /v/ has fell
>>724243753The zelda tard sees this and experiences only immense pain and confusion.
>>724244115Wait a minute, was it you who said that the SNES or Mega couldn't handle six individual sprites ?Because then you are spreading incorrect information.
Anyway, the point the article was making is that Links Awakening had better use of value tones, which are well organized and clear, and cohesive sprites/assets, while the Bubsy game does not.This is specifically evident if you put the Bubsy game in grayscale, you can see how the value tones are messy and the sprites look very weird.
this thread is impressively terrible
>>724249634>Wait a minute, was it you who said that the SNES or Mega couldn't handle six individual sprites ?It was not.
>>724237859you're a fucking retarded cretin
>>724250130It's not just that, the Bubsy assets are rough and unrefined, the shading and layout makes them look flat, the color choices are uninspired, they fail to convey a sense of place or aesthetic etc, overall an amateur effort, compared to the simple yet refined sprites of LA, that make great use of silhouettes, shapes, designs, etc to make something that looks and feels genuine and makes the most of its constraints
>>724227416If people in the 3rd world had the ability to really appreciate beauty and the mental traits to make them strive after it they wouldn't be 3rd world crapholes to begin with because that striving for beauty forces a people to improve their lives in a multitude of ways.
>>724237859It's the same sprites with colour you fucking imbecile, why would he?
>>724236962PYW
>>724227416>>724250130>if i change it to look like shit, then i'll be right!wow, stellar argument.>which are well organized and clear, and cohesive sprites/assets, while the Bubsy game does not.we're comparing the sprites of the interactive world, to the flat background wallpaper, and you think thats a fair comparison? also its trying to compare a still image, and ignore the layers of parallaxing that are happening to that background which GREATLY affect the readability.
>>724251658>makes the most of its constraintsRETARD ALERT!!!anyone that bring up "constraints" and "makes the most of it" or "does the best with what it has" outs themselves as a pretentious retard that stopped looking at the images a long time ago. a pretentious retard that cares more about "the process" than the result. external factors are completely irrelevant.
>>724252597You're a retard>a movie with the best animatronics/scale models/matte paintings imaginable done by masters of their craft>a movie with meh CGI outsourced to a random overseas CGI sweatshop who happened to be the lowest bidderWhich is going to look better and be more artistically meaningful?
>>724227416*gets hit by manhole cover*FALLINGDAMAGEINAPLATFORMER!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
>>724227416>I could write a thesis/paper/book on xAnyone who uses this turn of phrase never has anything worthwhile to say about the subject in question
>>724252979>Which is going to look betterwho knows? i've seen big studios make great things, and i've seen them make slop. i've seen indy projects look great, and i've seen them look awful. who knows? the result is what matters, not where it came from. >more artistically meaningful?laughable, meaningless buzzwords.
>>724253390>who knows?Yeah you're a retard
>>724253229This is the full article, you can see the artist's work in it
>>724251658You're completely right.I just wanted to keep the post simple to understand, but you explained it better than me.
>>724240104I recommend watching this video explaining how Chrono Trigger's sprites work and demonstrating how to copy the style:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KFp_FSTD2bs>good at pixelart means not drawing the sprites like you would a regular drawing100% correct. You have to prioritize the parts of the image that are most important for clarity. Good pixel art is as much about what you leave out as what you draw.
>>724252412>if i change to look like shitI just changed it from color to grayscale.If the art is good it will remain good regardless of the absence of color or not.> we're comparing sprites of the interactive world to the flat background yada yadaIt doesn't matter, looks like shit anyways.
>>724229908did you expect a master's dissertation from a pixel artist
>>724255445In 2025? Absolutely. I expected that our collective shared knowledge would be far easier to obtain, and that all the old arts from 30 years ago would have clear pathways to mastery nowadays. But this reads more like a failure of society as a whole than a failure of individuals.
To be fair, the second Bubsy looked better art wise, if only at few times.
>>724239050>how do I get better at SKILL?By practicing SKILL. Why do retards ask questions like this? Literally everything is a skill. Fucking practice.
>>724241430Lmao
>>724255770The article is from 2015 and the pixel artist in question worked on Auro, from Dinofarm games.
>>724256187this shit looks like bubsy
>>724255892>airbenders don't kill people>get rektearthchads keep winning
>>724256316It really doesn't
>>724255076>If the art is good it will remain good regardless of the absence of color or not.thats not how it works at all, lmao
>>724256187Pretty good honestly, some of it makes me think of Metal Slug
>>724259186It does, values are a core part of visual art, this topic is a dunning-kruger magnet it seems
>>724259550>The third world soul doesn't understand why art is more important than flashy graphics and technologyIt's not the third world, it's niggers and zoomermutts. They are one step above the Ape, they can't understand culture and art.
>>724259550You're the collage autist, aren't you?
>>724259186it literally is thoughbeit. colors themselves also contain a percieved value component to them so most normal grayscale images aren't going to be 100% accurate but it's still true that values takes importance over color in every case. side anecdote but i said this to a female friend who went to art school and they didn't even teach her this, fucking kek what are modern art schools even doing?
>>724239756That's not true, there are good games/movies/books that I don't enjoy mostly due to genre. I don't say things are bad on an objective level just because I don't like something I just say the reasons I don't like it and move on
>>724261140Image on the right would have received unyielding praise back in the day.
>>724230567I always thought rayman1 looks like shit.
>>724251759its absolutely not the same sprites.
>>724229668Well said
>>724259186That's exactly how it works.Colors alone don't have value.Value works regardless of the color.Now, the best of both worlds is good value tones with good choice of colors.>>724259550Based. I'm glad that someone at 4chan still has a brain.
>>724261712Art schools are mostly scam. You get much more value (no pun intended) from watching Marco Bucci's "10 minutes to better painting" videos (all available for free on Youtube) than from an art school. Only good art schools I know of are from Japan or other Asian countries, where the style of teaching and the view of art overall is completely different.
>>724262225>graphics that are technically impossible would've impressed people
>>724261140Both look better than the Grezzo Remake.
>>724259550> that imageif they don't understand after that image they will either never understand, or they do understand and are being a trolling faggot
>>724263085Damn anon, I wish we had more modern games with pixel art like this. Feels like those old heavily detailed Amiga games. Mark Ferrari is the one who created this gif btw, the guy is very based.
>>724234357>thinking a rational response to obvious bait is obvious bait itself, but that the actual bait is accuratei hope someone breaks into your room tonight and forces you to do ass-to-ass with a cactus and your mom before killing you anyway and posting the video online
Non-artists sure feel entitled to talk about art a lot
>>724255790Eh just barely
>>724250130>put the Bubsy game in grayscale>main character is legible from the background, and the ui is clearly and easily readableYou don't know what bad pixel art is.
>>724229668Interesting. Where can I find you to chat more? Got a throwaway email?
>>724270609I agree, it isn't bad, it's terrible.And worse than Link's Awakening.
