>"No Arthas eliminating people who have an incurable disease that leads to even more senseless deaths is.... le bad...">"I will now proceed to present 0 counter arguments or alternatives to your method and just leave instead"What the fuck was his problem? Do the creators genuinely expect me to side with this goofball?
Most things work like this, btw.And it works.
>mages with instant teleportation is canon>every shop in the land carrying instant teleportation scrolls is canon>using runners to deliver messages is canon>arthus uses none of these and just so happens to get to Uther just too late to stop the infection, but early enough to kill everyonArthus had this planned out days ago and the conversation between the two of them is irrelevant
He's a paladin so he's a massive moralfag that would rather watch the world burn than commit a sin
>>724233159Arthas has a big melty before Uther can even present his alternative thoughbeit, during which he strips Uther of his command and literally demands he fuck off then and there
>>724233159just cast cure disease you fucking worthless "paladins"god warcraft is such a dogshit setting full of dumb writing
Uhh..Parley?
Watch your tone with me boy,we must be better men.
>>724233159He leaves because Arthas suspended him and would have had him arrested had he escalated things further.
>>724233912>UMMM NOT ALL STRATHOLEMIANS ATE THE TAINTED GRA-didn't ask *manually attacks neutral villagers before they finish transforming*
>>724233760The fact that even to this day in Warcraft lore (WoW canonically has been going on for over about 3 decades) there is no cure for undeath.
>>724234124FALSEThe plague debuff that turned players into ghouls during the scourge invasion of pre-Naxx and pre-WotLK was considered a disease that was dispelled by any regular means of dispelling diseases.
>>724233993KekBy onions be purified
>I could elucidate the situation but if I am not vague I will lose my magic licenseWhy did he say this? It was pretty out of place.
Uther would have been a vaxxie
Fifty-Thousand gold a year in childcare....AND THEY CALL IT A CULT?!
>>724233879not enough mana pots
>>724234234I can also resurrect a dead person in-game bro. It has no bearing on the lore.
>>724234124>priests and paladins can cure disease! even the literal black plague!>UMMM NOT THE DISEASE THAT TURNS YOU INTO AN UNDEAD THO BECAUSE... UMMMM... LOOK YOU JUST CAN'T OK? IT WOULD RUIN THE PLOTWarcraft's writing is the fantasy equivalent of capeshit.
>>724233912>>724234047The argument makes way more sense if the situation is that like half the city is potentially infected and Arthas' position is that they can't contain it, purging the city is the only way to be safe. Whereas Uther wants to try and save everyone that isn't infected which puts the whole operation at risk.
>>724234124You're saying that Arthas knew that at the time?
>>724234572but then arthas isn't a big meanie head
>>724234547Player abilities are completely divorced from the lore. In the BFA trailer Anduin doing a big AOE heal is a crazy feat.
>>724234572uther (and jaina) didn't want to do shit. not once did they present any alternative, they were losing a war against the scourge that got worse with each passing moment and all they had to offer was just reactive NOOOOO YOU CAN'T DO THAT and NOOOO I CAN'T WATCH YOU DO THAT
>>724234317
>Where did these funny smelling grain come from>I dont know they just delivered it for free>All right lets call the whole city here to eat from it
>>724233732There is no alternative. No cure exists and the infection has been confirmed. Uther is a bitchpussy moralfaggot and couldn't bring himself to do what was needed.
>>724233159the light said no arthas so listen to it you faglord shit paladin
>>724233760Sex
>>724233159Please never help me in any way anon
>>724233159There's a major lack of communication in that scene, as well as Uther naturally seeing Arthas as young and untested (i.e. he could very well be wrong and is just being headstrong) and the general atrociousness of the act.Imagine if your much younger sibling burst in and told you your parents were infected by the monster from the movie The Thing and you had to flamethrower them there was no other way. You've never seen The Thing. Your little sibling is, well, little. And these are your parents.
>>7242349392 more weeks
>>724233159hand wringing moralfags who can't make a difficult decision, and will resent anyone who is capable, can be insufferable, willfully ignorant cunts, these people exist irl too.He's a realistic character, if unusual due to him being a hardened warrior, moralfagging isn't something such people are known for, even as a paladin.
>>724234293>I'm strong enough to probably solo the Lich King>YOU MUST SAIL WEST, WHERE I WILL MEET YOU IN A CAVE
>>724233912The grain is confirmed infected and also confirmed to have been delivered to the city.
>>724234234there was a WoW-wrath era retcon where you could be cured of the plague of undeath with a serious amount of holy healing spells from paladins and priests, but it took alot of mana and organization, and during the attack of Stratholme, the infrastructure simply didn't exist.
buy an ad maye
>>724235060medivh was long dead at the time thothe wc3 medivh is a collective schizophrenic hallucination
>>724234637Undeath was a new thing so barely anybody knew anything about it but you can't just ignore an entire city of infected people and look for a cure that might not even exist. Even if it did exist, by the time Arthas or Uther found it, one infected city turns into 10 infected cities and that's GG right there.
>>724233159If Uther was for real he should've tried to save as many people as he could from both Arthas and Malganis, even if it would've been a doomed effort.
>>724233159Uther is a massive cuck, but in that scene arthas was very aggressive from the start for no reason
Arthas has seen firsthand what the grain does, but he never bothered to explain it Uther and then throws a temper tantrum.Arthas is 100% autismo, so are the players blaming Uther. If anything, Jaina is the worst because she never spoke up despite being the learned one.>>724235268Could have been an interesting choice for the mission.
In the entire history of WoW there has never been a cure for undeath and every single innocent Arthas killed was objectively spared a fate worse than death.
>>724235035You mean the year where governments reported fewer excess deaths over the previous one despite a supposed pandemic happening? Also the same year virtually no deaths from influenza happened?
>>724235003Uther knows the undead are real, he fought with them after all. He also knows about the grain, he's just too much of a faggot to act on the information presented to him.
>>724235205Naw he was straight up res'd by his mommyThen spent the rest of the series useless. Didn't even show up when his hated soul-rapist penetrated baby Azeroth in Legion.
Remember that time Arthas sailed to Kalimdor, snuck to where Illidan happened to be and told him where to find the skull of Gul'dan and then fucked off?
>>724235536YOU REEK OF DEATH HUMAN
>>724233159Uther was wrong here but Arthas overreacted
>>724233521you know he was locked on life or death combat for days right? that he sent wird to Uther to ask for relief>>724233159Uther was too proud to truly listen to. Arthas, he's a flawed character as well, Arthas's decisive action could've saved his kingdom, but then, he fell to Malganis's bait
>>724233690That's not what Gygax said.Gygax also said torturing evil characters is morally permissible for good characters if it saves their lives, to great seething of course.
>>724235536It's kinda weird we didn't see him take more part in the invasion but it also made the world feel bigger. He just lurks around scheming with the Lich King then fucks off back home the second Archimonde gets whisp'd
>>724235802Torturing baby goblins is Good because goblins are Evil. Keep this in mind. Gouge out their eyes, pull off their fingernails, shove a flaming poker up their asses, it's all Good with a capital G because D&D works that way.
>>724233159Arthas didn't explain the situation at all, he ran up and said "WE HAVE TO KILL EVERYONE OR THEY'LL TURN INTO UNDEAD" without providing proof or even a summary of what he had found out. He never says that it can't be cured, just that they NEED to kill everyone in a huge city, and when Uther tells him that's insane he lashes out and strips Uther's authority before sending him away.
>>724235003It's a bit different when it's happening in a magic universe and the knowledge of undead creatures is well known even before the events of Wc3.Arthas sperged too hard and too fast. Uther was pompous and wouldn't even ask for proof or clarification. Jaina was a spineless bitch who sat on the fence then ran away.
>>724235132Fact, this is what Sylvanas was looking for to undo the plague in her and the forsaken, but Arthas developed the new plague, and her apothecaries were working with the legion, which is a old unsolved vanilla quest they brought back with wrath.She simply snapped in wrath because all of her world has fallen in her head, as her hope of being healed.
>i'm supposed to believe this highly infectious, incurable disease that also spreads to animals never made it past the red line, to the southeastern part of the subcontinentworld ending threat btw
>>724235707>>724235347Arthas is maybe 20 years old and already fighting a desperate war to save his kingdom, a war he is losing. It's only natural that he sperged out, it was the wrong thing to do but also understandable. Meanwhile Uther has spent more years in battle than Arthas has spent alive. He should easily be mature enough to look past Arthas' emotional outburst and acted based on the information that was presented to him. Instead he sperged out just as hard and ran away like a little bitch.Speaking of bitches, Jaina didn't do anything to help either even though she understood the situation perfectly.
>>724236845>Nu WoW Mapthe gayest retcon ever out of sheer laziness
>>724233159https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hb0Dsd64qkk
>>724236897the point still stands on the old map
>...you're doing WHAT?? that's fucking evil>k nigga you do you I'm leaving lmaowtf
>>724236845Medieval setting, people don't travel far.>inb4 le plagueJews did that, no jews in warcraft.
>>724237270All it would take is one trade ship transporting goods South to spread it even unintentionally.
>>724237270The Daedra are Canonically responsible for that
>>724236872Again like that other guy said, Uther was wrong then even if he was right, for not trying to help the people or stop Arthas. It was like a doctor saying "umm woah buddy I can't take you as a patient you're sick, you'd fuck up my stats"
>>724236845It actually kind of make sense in the vanilla wow map since theres a full chokepoint from hillsbrad to arathi highlands from from arathi to the wetlands.Assuming you ignore the fact that you could just paddle along the coastline and go around the wall.
>>724237270
>>724233159Arthas is right but you should be able to understand why a paladin would instinctively recoil at the thought of having to forcefully euthanize a huge city full of the people he's sworn to protect, no?
Uther didn't just leave Stratholme to burn, we see later on when Jaina goes to find him that he's still trying to manage the situation there since Arthas up and left the moment Mal'ganis taunted him.
>>724237408Jaina was also the most wrong of all, considering she was fully informed of the situation at hand and didn't even bother to try to explain, just said "umm I don't want to acknowledge what's happening, btw Arthas u finna gimme the ick"
>>724237581the biggest retcon this shitty MMO did was removing stratholme docks off the game since stratholme is a naval port for lordaeron
>>724237662Authentic woman moment.
>>724237695They're there you just can't go to them
>>724233159>we gotta kill every living being in this city>proof? Nah bro, trust me. I am perfectly sane, and its a perfectly reasonable thing anyone would suggest.Arthas was peak autism. If there is anything uther is to blame for, is not punching some common sense into him at that point and sticking around.
>>724236845there was never a reason for the scourge to go south. the original point of the scourge was to get the bare minimum forces to safely summon the Legion and the only reason the elves need to get their teeth kicked was to revive kelthuzad. remember, the scourge were unwilling servants (just like the orcs) so their power level had to be managed so they couldn't revolt against their masters (just like the orcs). and that is what they did in TFT.the world ending threat came from archimonde fucking up the world tree, not the scourge itselfif you're asking why the whole subcontinent in wow isn't scourge, the answer is even more simple: they don't want to give the players scourge fatigue
>>724233159Most people in real life side with idiots like that (eg. starving Africans in the 50s).
>>724237459Time is money, friend.
>>724237889The real reason is that Stormgarde was destroyed at the time of Warcraft 3 until WoW retconned it.
>>724233159>0 counter arguments or alternativesHe was religious and a fanatic. It checks out.
>>724237847see the newest midnight map, the docks aren't there, and the new map is now part of the old worldhttps://x.com/TheRedShirtGuy/status/1981806927794622850/photo/1
>>724238474>ghostlands is no longer infected>stratholme is still on fireB R A V O
>>724238608Anon is even worse, it is a fuckhuge map in a small continent from 2011The retards at blizzard have zero sense of scaling
>>724238474>Zul'aman became a zone larger than both plaguelands combinedFucking retarded.
>>724233159And this is why in my WarCraft fanfic historians actually agree with Arthas much to the changrin and protests of the surviving Lordaeronians.Ironically secretly forced on people by Jaina herself who in the end realized that she could've at least forced him not to go to Northend.>>724234124Actually there is, but you still end up dead. At least you don't come back as a reanimated corpse and you actually die as yourself.
>>724238871Trannies working there lost the sense of scaling when they cut xher dicks off.Women on the other hand doesnt know what it is either because those ugly ass cannons working there were never filled in their miserable lives
The actual critical point is the moment where Arthas strips him of rank, just like that.Uther is hero, a general. You cant just do that. Even a king would think twice before doing something like this, specially when the only thing the general has donde is to ask you to stop and think for 2 min and confer with him.
stop bringing up wow lore, everything they did with the scourge was a travesty>WC3>lich king has a headache>a large amount of undead regain their sentience>WoW>lich king dies>n-no there must always be a lich king, or else they'll run wild and kill everything>helmet goes kaput>undead continue to wander around and just be retarded>cult of the damned still exists even in present day for some fucking reason
>>724239374they did rampage throughout the entirety of azeroth though, it just happened off-camera. there's a quest in blue angel land in shadowlands where you get to toss a guy who died fighting ghouls in fucking redridge, miles away from the main scourge presence, protecting his family in hell because judgement machine brokeit's still fucking stupid though
>>724239576the tranny nuwriters probably thought duskwood undead were part of the scourge
>>724239576That's even dumber as all the undead in the southern part of the eastern kingdoms in wow aren't scourge
>>724239187Arthas was certainly retarded. An experienced and pious paladin should have still tried to keep a cool head and not just leave in a huff. At the very least he and Jaina should have done something. If Uther really believed he was right and Arthas was crazy, he should have tried to stop Arthas. History would make him look retarded but at least he stood on his principles
>>724241191He is a paladin in service to the crown, he is the LAW part in paladin. What was he supposed to do? turn against his prince?I can imagine Uther himself thinking he made a mistake. But at that moment? sudenly your price stripped you from rank in front of the army...
>>724241763I think a better solution could have been found, but only if Jaina got off he ass and said something.She was probably the only one who could have slowed arthas down, or she could have explained what she had seen to uther and maybe they together could have thought of something to do.Jaina I think deserves the most blame. She says nothing until uther already storms off then just excuses herself from the whole thing
>>724241191There is that old theory that Arthas snapped in Hearthglen because he was infected trying to stop the plagued caravan sidequest.But since he was a paladin he was resisting the plague, but he saw all of his men and civillians turning undead quickly there, he began losing his sanity as his resistance to it.By the time he got to northrend he already lost the feeling of touch and began hearing Ner'zhul's whispers in his head telling him to kill Mal'Ganis.
>>724233159everyone knew what had to be done, they just left their bitch boy arthas to do it for them since they couldn't bear doing it themselves. arthas couldn't live with himself after doing it either.
Luther didn't know any of that and fell back on tradcath christlarper light holy mage warrior paladin logic The plague was a completely foreign concept to him
>>724239187They could have easily reached a compromise. Lordaeron was still functioning. They could've left a garrison to quarantine the city and moved on. It didn't need to involve Arthas or Uther personally. There were other members of the Silver Hand as well.
>>724241978This is the same shit as Diablo 2's plot, but make sense going by blizzard standards.
>>724234572That's you just making up some less retarded writing. The canon version is that everyone in Stratholme was going to die and then immediately rise up as an army of the undead - a literal organized army mind you, under the command of demons who want to conquer the universe, not just a mindless zombie horde - in the heartland of the kingdom, with absolutely no cure available to them and minutes to spare, and 2 out of 3 of our main characters just threw up their hands and said fuck it I'm out, not even presenting any alternative ideas while condemning the one who did what had to be done
>>724233912Never heard of that cope before. Is that the new headcanon Dave is forcing?
>>724233159Uther was 100% right. Paladins don't have to wipe people's asses even if it's a good thing to do. They also don't have to purge a city of infected humans. It's completely laid out in the story that Arthas alone was the reason for the downfall of Lordaeron, but contrarians still think that he acted correctly somehow. Ask yourself, why was only Lordaeron destroyed by the undead, but every other country wasn't even affected?
>>724242853>but contrarians still think that he acted correctly somehowOther than all the retarded shit Arthas say to Uther, Arthas did act correctly with the knowledge that was available to everybody. The deal wasn't sealed until Arthas claimed Frostmourne and then murdered his father.
>>724242853>Ask yourself, why was only Lordaeron destroyed by the undead, but every other country wasn't even affected?Lordaeron was the specific target since the Burning Legion wanted to decapitate strike the Alliance that assfucked their previous invasion. Which they did perfectly since every other nation that could have helped out told Lordaeron to go fuck itself.
>>724242382>they could have left a garrison of soldiers to quarantine the largest city in the country with a zombie plague that converts civilians into monsterssure bud, that sounds reasonable
>>724243316It's kind of hard to say if it was reasonable or not since the scale of the game is always so vague, even when it comes to army sizes.If it was possible, it likely would have satisfied Uther enough to actually do anything at least.
>>724233159The best part is the dev, WHO MADE THE MISSION, agreeing with Uther
>>724234547No paladin in Lordaeron trained their support spells
>>724233159Arthas did literally nothing wrong. Strathlome had to be purged. It was beyond saving.
>>724244926He was a map designer who had no input on the narrative, and (like all Stratholme dipshits) never actually put forth an alternative to how Lordaeron could be saved without purging Stratholme.
SAY THE WORD
>>724233732What's the alternative? I didn't see uther do shit when the villagers turned.
>>724233732You were expecting Arthas to tell the entire history of the plague, how it works, all its symptoms and what it will lead to to Uther while the town turns into zombies and a giant winged demon roams freely?"THEY'RE TURNING INTO ZOMBIES, THIS TOWN IS DOOMED" Is all that was needed.
>>724235368Your pic but the marble is the palantir and sally is gandalf and anne is pippin
>>724233159In fairness, arthas gave him next to no time to process the situation before threatening him and his knights with treason.I side with arthas but i dont remember uhter having a lot of time to even think about an alternative, which is the biggest problem of the situation, there isnt even time to think of a good solution.
>>724245909Stratholme was lost but Lordaeron could have easily been saved just by being united and organized. All they had to do was not eat the grain. But Arthas was actively throwing things into disorder by sacking Uther and leading the troops to Northrend.
>>724233159okay uther have it your way. ill cast holy light on this vaxxed fellow to heal him. oops he died because hes UNDEAD
>>724233912they shouldve gone with this because as it stands the game strongly implies everyone was infected
>>724239374I think the sanity of freed-undead is entirely dependent on how rotted their brains are.unironically.or else they'd have to be undead who had some sort of special soulbinding performed on their skeleton like kelthuzad
>>724246724He should have done the barebones explanation and Jaina should have backed him up.
>>724233159>le le le stratholme le>le Arthas le le leThere was more to Arthas and his decisions than a fucking meme.
>>724233159>Do the creators genuinely expect me to side with this goofball?He literally send 2 Knights to their deaths for NO REASON in the very first mission
>>724247770*sendswhat the fuck is this autocorrect
>>724247649Such as?
>>724238871So why are the eastern plaguelands STILL a completely undead ridden, infected shithole?
>>724248645the undead plague is a fungus that releases gorillions of spores everywhere. Warcraft unironically had TLoU zombies 10 years before TLoU
>>724248856which is also why the Ghostlands should still exist. very goofy that only 20 years after 99% of all high elves died they somehow repopulated their entire kingdom good as new. The Ghostlands should still be ruined and overgrown entirely, even if the plague was somehow removed.
>>724249071
The death knight starter zone is the most fun thing in WoW and makes me long for playing as the scourge outside of WC3. Alas, WoW is unfortunately a MMORPG, which means everyone are good guys or neutral at worst.I also loved icecrown's architecture and theme; cold, icy, dark shithole with undead legions around. Battles of holy vs evil in frozen wastelands is peak aesthetic.
>>724248213Idk man something about betraying his own men, becoming the lich king, killing his own father the king, becoming the lordvessel for the undead armor.
>>724249506the "Frozen Hell" aesthetic goes all the way back to the poet Dante.
>>724249543>undead armorarmy*
>Uther: Glad I could make it, Arthas.>Arthas: I watch my tone with you, old man. I may be the prince, but you're still my superior as a paladin.>Uther: As if you could forget. Yes Arthas, there's something about the plague I should know. ...Oh no, it's already begun. These people may look fine now, but it's only a matter of time before they turn into the Undead!>Arthas: What?!>Uther: This entire city must be purged.>Arthas: How can I even consider that? There's got to be some other way.>Uther: Damn it, Arthas! As my future king, order me to purge this city!>Arthas: I am not your king yet, old man. Nor should you obey that command even if I were.>Uther: Then you must consider this an act of treason.>Arthas: Treason?! Have I lost my mind, Uther?>Uther: Have you? Prince Arthas, by right of succession and the sovereignty of your crown, you must hereby relieve me of my command, and suspend my paladins from service.>Jaina: Uther! He can't just-->Uther: It's done! Those of you who have the will to save this land, follow him. The rest of you... get out of his sight.>Arthas: I've just crossed a terrible threshold, Uther.>Jaina: ...Arthas?>Arthas: I'm sorry, Jaina. You can't watch me do this.
>>724249071>r 99% of all high elves died they somehow repopulated their entire kingdom good as new.Thrall's Horde was so small it was able to fit in a few stolen Alliance vessels, yet they were able to found a new kingdom in Kalimdor by the end of the base game of WC3
>>724249790>a fewgameplay concession, man.do you also take it that orcs spawn from barracks asexually?it was an entire fleet of boats.
>>724233159i played that mission for the first time a while ago i don't really get why anyone would argue arthas did anything wrong, the mission itself makes it clear you should be killing them before they turn, they're obviously infected and will obviously turn, and they're much harder to deal with when they turnif you look at it from the perspective of an actual story rather than a game you can just reload then it's kind of contrived and stupid
>>724249757>tfw this made me wheeze like a retardIt truly is over for me
>>724249757Lmfao
>>724233159One side has massive experience of dealing with undead during second warAnother is retard who believes that killing people would prevent necromancers from raising them
>>724233159I dont understand why he walked away. Sure it was cold to walk in and kill them all, but if left unchecked, eached person would be a new soldier in the scourge's army. Arthas probably could have been more tactful and a bit less eager to slaughter everyone, demonstrating to Uther that his action were indeed grevious. That alone could have helped talk him around and see the lack of other options.I didn't read the rest of the thread.
>>724251447basically everything about arthas story in WC3 is contrived
>>724251153killing people isn't the problem, people are going to die one way or anotherthe problem is HOW they die, you either kill them while they are still human to spare them from undeath or you leave them to either turn and be abducted by a demon or be ravaged by others who turned
>>724249598Dante just ripped it off from Buddhism.
>>724252707Just cast cleanse on them, goofy ass nigga. That worked in the second zombie invasion in the WotLK prepatch.
>>724253443>just cast cleanse on the entire city>there probably won't even be a panic as people are turning into literal zombies and eating each other, making more zombies
>>724233159I mean did that even work? They can just be resurrected again.
>>724253691Yeah it would be difficult but the point is that Arthas just chose the easy way without even thinking about it. I think the level could've been designed better to reflect this tho.
>>724254430>it would be difficultIt would be logistically impossible. You're talking about the second largest population center in the entire kingdom. Once people realize that there is a literal zombie plague going on, shit is going to hit the fan. There probably isn't enough soldiers in Lordaeron, let alone the soldiers they have on hand, to maintain control of Stratholme to do much of anything in a controlled fashion.And that's ignoring the scary demon running around causing further problems.
If Arthas never became the Lich King and WoW never happened, do you think he'd eventually have a harem of undead females or a harem of living females?Or would he have gentle handholding sex with Sylvanas while Ner'zhul watches?
Shouldn't Uther have been trying to help the citizens of Stratholme escape?
>>724255148That would require him to get off his high horse and do something, which would be out of character for the old self-righteous douche Uther is portrayed as in WC3.
>>724255323>the old self-righteous douche Uther is portrayed as in WC3.okay, now youre just being a faggot.Uther fought to end to defend Lordaeron. His personal integrity was never put into question.
>>724234939Sorry heretic, but Jesus Christ will not allow any poison to enter my spirit
>>724255408He left the people of Stratholme to die after making it clear that he viewed what was about to go down as an unconscionable act.Where's his personal integrity now? If it were up to him, Lordaeron would be buried under a mountain of living corpses but at least he could flick his bean to how righteous he was to let his kingdom die.
>>724251447The only way to really make sense of it is basically down to the situation at the moment + Uther's characterUther knew about the plague, but not how it was spread or how it'd truly affect people, so when Arthas just drops "yeah the entire city will just turn into undead, we gotta kill everyone" it's kind of like "what the fuck?" ontop of Uther being a Paladin who would not do that to normal people unless he had some time to process it.Jaina not going along with it makes less sense, but maybe you can just call it a woman moment/peer pressure from Uther.
>>724255753I think Jaina wasn't so much against the act but just couldn't bear to see it carried out. She didn't say "don't do it", she said "I can't watch you do this".
>>724253724Considering Stratholme still has zombies ghouls and skellies popping out of the ground, no. The city is still burning, and beyond perma-cursed.Someone should just drop a mana bomb on it already
>>724255753Uther refusing to kill the city no matter what is a semi-reasonable reaction.Refusing to kill the city no matter what and then just turning around and walking away to let the city be killed anyways is pants on head retarded. If he has an absolute moral objection to the city being killed, then doing literally nothing at all to even try to stop it is hypocritical.
Arthas chose to raze the city because Mal'Ganis was willing to completely convert everyone in Scourge. Arthas could've tried to maybe contain everyone within it, like Uther said, there could've been something less drastic
>>724256145This ain't Raccoon City in the movies that already has a giant suspicious pre-built wall around it.
>>724234939>the virus has just broken out in the US, mainstream news is saying it probably stems from a wet market in china>/pol/ : "it's a fucking bioweapon, if you get it you are as good as dead and you're a goy sheep if you believe that shit came from a wet market.">mainstream media starts pushing masking up, vaccines, and lockdowns, mask/vaccine/lockdown legislation are passed>/pol/ : "it's a fake virus, literal nothingburger, the vaccine is a biochip, the mRNA vaccine is going to shred your brain like swiss cheese, the virus isn't even real, and if it is, it's .00001% mortality rate, you're an idiot if you believe it's deadly."Retarded contrarian nonsense as always, 2 more weeks, though.
>>724255705He didn't "leave", he was dismissed by Arthas after trying to reason with him.
>>724233159Yeah, he was too much of a bitch to be in charge when the hard decisions come up. But honestly, so was Arthas.
>>724256260You could just try to rally citizens or something, it's like the trolley problem in a way
>>724256298Oh okay I guess he had no options but to walk away because he was fired. Morally in the clear then from his point of view.
>>724256145Mal'Ganis was teleporting them away anyway so containment would do jack shit.
>>724256294There was no virus you retard. You can tell by how the ruling class reacted, without a real care in the world
>>724256508So should Uther just bash Arthas on the head and nuke Mal'Ganis from across Lordaeron? Stratholme is just one city in the whole kingdom that is plagued by orcs, trolls and scourge.
>>724256521Honestly this. If the people with access to all the information aren't scared, why are you?
>>724235480I know personally 3 people who died choking on their own fluids from covid, 2 who went to the hospital for treatment and died on respirators, and one who didn't. I was in China during the second eave lockdowns and was so incredibly sick, even after having the American vaccine (required to enter China so I had to, wouldn't have been my choice otherwise) that couldn't breathe from my nose or mouth for like a full minute while I was choking and gagging on the slime pouring out of my sinus into my throat.It can be true that the vaccine was useless and rushed and the virus was deadly. That is my personal experience.
>>724256704If Uther's thought process is "there is absolutely no justifiable reason to kill the civilians of Stratholme", then yes, he is morally obligated to physically engage Arthas in combat to try to stop him from doing so. Accepting his dismissal and walking away with the knights is a blemish against his morals.He would have been very wrong to engage Arthas, because purging Stratholme was the objectively correct decision, but at least it would have been consistent with his idiot lawful stupid morality system.
>>724233732Is your counter-argument really that Uther had a solution and simply ran off without doing anything himself? Uther got in the last word anyway.
>>724235003I wouldn't just run away like Uther did and let it happen.
>>724256925Viruses don't wait for media attention before they start spreading. A professor from Oxford penned a paper demonstrating that in all likelihood it landed in the UK sometime in January and as a result we can safely assume it's not dangerous since there was no increase in deaths stemming from it. The government simply chose to ignore the paper and went for a paper written by a man who thought bird flu in 2008 would kill around 200,000,000 people. Spoiler alert it didn't kill anyone.
>>724256521Okay, everyone I knew who died and got sick during covid was a paid actor, and I'm a paid actor for having it twice. Thanks for your input, schizo.Your retard schizo worldview is only possible when you live a completely secluded hermit life and interact with no one.
>>724237408and the difference between the two is that Uther is treated like a god-hero for accomplishing nothing while Arthas is treated as mega-hitler.
>>724251153>One side has massive experience of dealing with undead during second warUther's solution was to literally do nothing and die. What did Uther accomplish during the Third War?
>>724256947Uther says that "There's got to be some other way" opposed to Arthas's choice to purge the city, he isn't entirely opposed to the idea, he just wants to salvage as much as he possibly can, he is fully aware of the bloodshed and chaos with what he saw in Hearthglen. He let Arthas do what he thought is right, he isn't responsible for Arthases ruthless actions.
>>724257420>What did Uther accomplish during the Third War?He does nothing and then dies.Hey it's like pottery, it rhymes!
>>724257180The entire city government of Wuhan got basically disappeared by the CCP for trying to cover up the intial spread and origin of the virus, without doxxing myself too much, I speak Chinese and know through a friend low level CCP officials who worked in Hubei during the initial outbreak. A virus doesn't have to be that "dangerous" for it to spread and kill millions of people, it just has to spread well. Ebola is less "dangerous" than covid because the outbreaks are so much deadlier and the symptoms so much more obvious and consistent. The first time I had covid I couldn't smell for three months, the second time I nearly needed to be hospitalized, but many people, including my own family, were asymptomatic, that is why covid was so dangerous.
>>724257274The writers have a hateboner for Arthas.Sylvanas did the same shit Arthas did and much more and she only gets a slap on the wrist.
>>724233159>pragmatic response to a problem, making the hard choice for the greater good>NOOOOO JUST BE HECKIN NICERight vs Left in a nutshell
>>724233159Its a small stroke of genuine writing genius that most, if not all, of the "good" characters in Warcraft are dogmatic fools who have their beliefs backfire on them and cause utter ruin. Except for the writer's pet, Anduin and Velen. And yes, even Thrall has his values go sour on him. (even doe Garrosh did nothing wrong)>>724257660You lost the plot, bro. The point is that Uther, for all his posturing and his supposed moral superiority, did absolutely nothing to actually stop the culling of Stratholme, despite insisting there was another way to save or lessen the impact of the Plague. >>724257904Not only does Sylvanas only get a slap on the wrist but she still gets a cringe-ass girlboss moment where she literally speaks the last remnants of Arthas' soul out of existence in some weird rape survivor dynamic they have tried to insert into Sylvanas' characterization since time immemorial. They also seem to forget that as soon as Arthas picks up Frostmourne his soul is instantly vacuumed up by Ner'Zhul.
>>724257865You are making things up and it's really fucking obvious.
>>724256294What? The official line for the longest time was that it absolutely wasn't from China, and you're racist and banned if you said it was.
>>724258193Uther wasn't insisting and he died fighting the Scourge. The actual traitor was Arthas, there's an entire campaign about this. Did you even play the game?
>>724258307Fuck off Zhang
>>724258607>Uther wasn't insisting and he died fighting the ScourgeUther dying fighting the Scourge after they had already infected and killed all of the innocent townsfolk? Hm, sounds... sounds like something else COULD have been done like, oh, I don't know, killing the infected civilians before they turn?
>>724251447Uther's refusal is for story-telling purposes. Analyse it all you want. In reality if you are willing to do what Uther wouldn't do in this situation then that's lovely, we'd all like a volunteer.
>>724258307Believe whatever you want, were on a video game board on 4chan.>>724258506Did I ever defend the official line? All claimed is that there was a virus, it came from Wuhan, and it did kill a lot of people. Two of those are obvious if you aren't a basement dwelling neckbeard and know more than 20 people.
>>724235368I know pic is an autism test and all but really the answer depends on if Sally trusts Anne or not. If she suspects Anne is a thieving little shit she might check the box first.
>>724258193My point is, should Uther and his order burn away all the little good there is left in Lordaeron just to prove a point to the prince? Uther loved Terenas and respected his authority, same with Arthas, for the best interest of everyone, he wasn't going to start rebelling against those in charge for what he deems 'right'. We are talking about rapidly falling remnants of a huge kingdom, Stratholme is but just one tragedy.
>>724258193>as soon as Arthas picks up Frostmourne his soul is instantly vacuumed up by Ner'ZhulThat was retconned, now the lore is J'Lor was always in control of the entity in the helmet witch is really, really stupid because why would he make his own forces (scourge) rebel against a different section of his own forces (burning legion)?
>>724258307If you know anything about China at all, you'd know that a huge proportion of the population are government employees and required to join the CCP, even elementary school teachers and farmers.It's not that outlandish.
>>724258724>just le kill everyoneGenius!
>>724258761As a Paladin Uther is both a warrior (loyal to his King) and a Priest (loyal to the Light). Given the split loyalties and where those loyalties might effect other beings, the Paladin, as an individual of compassion and the teachings of the Light, should, and in all honestly probably WOULD prioritize the safety of the individuals of the city even against his liege's wishes. While you're not necessary wrong about Uther being duty-bound in service to the king and kingdom, I'm very much certain that by the time Stratholme falls and Arthas disappears to Northrend, Terenas isn't going to be angry that Uther saved a few civilians. Either way, he left Arthas to his own devices, and the extra headway he made in running back to the Capital just to TELL Terenas "hey, your son did this thing" doesn't make a big difference.
>>724258850Shadowlands strikes again............>>724258938>kill everyone or do nothing I don't know man I think doing something might be better than doing something. Also, the greater argument is that Uther, despite his commitment to the kingdom and his mentorship to Arthas, just walks away and abandons him, doesn't even try to convince him, just says there's a better way and then fucks off.
>>724233159>I'M YOUR SUPERIOR! YOU DON'T HAVE ANY AUTHORITY OVER ME!>proceeds to not use his own authority over ArthasUther Lightbringer? More like Uber Retard!
>>724258938Everyone in Stratholme is already dead.The only question is whether they're going to take the rest of the kingdom down with them.
>>724259194I think people argue about this scene so much because it's badly written. It makes no sense for Arthas to give them no explanation of the virus and how there's no other solution, while also completely going against Uther's character to just immediately bail on Arthas.
>>724259041Keep in mind that Terenas is also a very flawed character, in his eyes, Arthas is absolutely perfect, Uther has been trying to reason with Terenas even when Arthas went to Northerend by sending emissaries, Terenas just couldn't be reasoned with.Uther has been very much clinging to what little hope there was left in a falling kingdom, he was very much hopeless with not much to do, Dalaran, Quel'Thalas and the other kingdoms were stuck-up in their own ways, he couldn't get trough to Arthas or Terenas and who knows what Jaina was doing.
ITT: Another 500 posts of people trying to argue around acknowledging that Uther did absolutely nothing about the plague and didn't even acknowledge his own lack of a solutionPeople can call Arthas a monster all they want. It doesn't change that Uther is portrayed as a complete retard. Instead of trying to re-write the Culling in WoW to make Arthas look even worse, maybe they should have just wrote Uther having been working on his own solution, trying to help, trying to stop Arthas, or at least acknowledging that no matter how poorly Arthas acted, Uther did not have an answer and died having not helped in any way.
>>724259194We can't blame Uther for what Arthas chose to do, he did the right thing by telling him to reconsider.
>>724259748>he did nothingftfy. Uther did as much as every single other character in the Warcraft universe that wasn't Arthas or one of his men. Uther did nothing.
>>724259310You see some alive residents roaming in the aftermath cutscene
>>724259748There is no reconsidering purging Stratholme. You either purge Stratholme or Lordaeron is destroyed that same day. The issue with Stratholme is that it convinced Arthas that only he is capable make the hard decisions that will save the kingdom, so he stopped listening to anyone's advice. And it's hard to blame him for coming to that conclusion considering everyone else was advising him to let the kingdom die.
>>724259905*did nothing wrongAs far as I know, supposedly the elves and Dalaran were researching the plague or something? There was no telling how far that whole fiesta was going to go, if there was a cure, all those lives that ended up killed would've been a waste
>>724259705You guys just don't get it. The biggest WTF in that situation is Arthas suspending Uther and his paladins after just a few words of opposition. Now if Arthas went nuclear after only that, would would realistically happen if Uther actually tried to interfere? It's like an autism test.
>>724233159>Anon can not understand normal social behavior.Must suck to have autism
>>724260290Dalaran sent Jaina to investigate the plague because they don't know dick about what's going on. They know as much as Lordaeron at the beginning of WC3, which is nothing at all. Down the line in TFT they have countermeasures set up but that's long after the fall of Lordaeron and Quel'thalas.
>>724260197Arthas's only solution in his mind is that killing Mal'Ganis would solve all of Lordaerons problems and that he was to do it no matter what cost. Noone knows (outside of Medivh) that the Scourge come from the burning Legion or who controls it, as far as they are concerned, Mal'Ganis could be a universe tearing giga-lord and that fighting him directly would be suicide, which is why everyone has the notion that noone did anything worthwhile or impactful. Arthas was the brave one that took that leap, and we can't blame others for not risking their lives for what seemed an undefeatable threat.
>>724260395Uther stopped giving a shit about the people at Stratholme as soon as he was relieved from command, that's not "normal social behavior" either.
>>724260339>What would have happened if Uther was shown doing literally anything during the third war besides waiting for Lordaeron to collapseYou're right, standing there T-posing from the culling of Stratholme all the way up until Arthas killed him was literally the only thing he could do. That's why Uther is a hero. I'm surprised he even had the audacity to later try and have Arthas' troops recalled with the fear of all the noogies and wet willies Arthas would give him.
>>724260771Chad prince selflessly putting himself in harms way to protect his people.If your monarch wouldn't trade his soul to an obviously evil sword in a last ditch effort to protect the innocent denizens of the kingdom, is he even a real monarch?
>>724260862That's not true. He canonically took out a bag of popcorn and watched the whole thing from a distance before telling Jaina what a shame the whole thing was. You can't expect anything more from Uther though. He's only a legendary paladin and the leader of the Knights of the Silver Hand.
>>724260468From what we can see, Dalaran, Quel'Thalas and Gilneas shut themselves in, I think that they though to themselves that quarantine was going to be the new normal life and that the plague was going to sort itself out eventually...
>>724260197It was Mal'ganis' plan the entire time to use Stratholme to lure Arthas to Northrend. The Scourge was mostly beaten in Lordaeron by that point. You see as much when Arthas returns in Autumn.It was Arthas' rash and arrogant personality that the Lich King was betting on.>There must be some other waycanonically, there is. In the WotLK prepatch priests and paladins could cure people who were in the prodromal stage of infection. Arthas restarts the Scourge's campaign from the ground-up.
>>724260968I'd go crazy too if I had to slaughter endless hordes of citizens and undead just to try to kill some demon in a icy hellscape
>>724256925how many of those 3 were in apartments under newly built 5G towers lmao
>>724261547Arthas was desperate but totally sane until losing his soul. If he became the utterly unhinged vengeance maniac people meme him to be, he would have asked Frostmourne to murderfuck Mal'Ganis. But instead he begs it to take anything from him as long as it saves the people of Lordaeron.
>>724233159He never said that>Yo what's up Arthas, wyd?>Uther! They're all sick! Kill them all!>What???>WAAAAH I'm the prince do what I say!>Fuck you, kid>You're BANNED!Arthas was a 0 INT / 0 CHA bitch
>>724235802real
>>724235802>>724236269Torture is always evil.It serves no purpose but satiating sick urges. It doesn't bring more justice nor safety than a clean death. It hurts the soul of the the good executioner and pleases the sadistic (evil) one.It doesn't help obtaining any intel as the victim will just lie (there's no reason not to lie) or admit things it hasn't done.
>>724258753It's not her box to look inside. She had no right or reason to look in the box until the problem of her marble being missing is discovered>some crackhead breaks in to your car because he believes you have his crack
>mal'ganis then shows up>hey faggot, i'm going to go house to house killing all the villagers to turn them into the undead>somehow arthas is in the wrong for killing them first
>>724249757https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gCo8fajC7o
>>724233159Paladins kill the undead, not villagers. Arthas was being.a stuck up little bitch and you see how easy he was for frost ourne to dominate. His choice to cull stratholme is the moment he proves he will never be fit to be paladin nor king.
>>724262379Yeah Uther could do literally nothing. He was in gaybaby jail from that point onwards.
>>724264439>I dont understand the concept of upholding my oaths both to god and to the kingUther wasn't going to act unilaterally because it was against his oath to the king either way.
>>724256095He left to get the rest of the Silver Hand, I assume. He was de-knighted right there. We don't get much of a view into how their legal system works, but I'm assuming that means everyone there is outside his ability to command after that. He really couldn't do shit.
>>724261475Wrath also has a whole questline where you try to cure an infected Paladin and fail, to the point that a Naaru has to come by and yank his soul out before he turns undead. Those people were fucked.
>>724265834It was more because it was "just his time to die" and "the light works in mysterious ways"And also an homage to a dev that passed away.
>>724265948So every element of a prepatch event is canon but an actual questline where all attempts at a cure fail isn't?
>>724266167I mean sort of, yeah. By and large, the light can heal the plague if it hasnt progressed too far.We can just assume Arthas and Uther went to church enough that they couldn't quite put 2 and 2 together, after fighting zombies for so long and not getting infected.
>>724266410So you think it makes more sense that Arthas and Uther just forgot about their ability to heal diseases, and that the plague being curable in the event was purely for gameplay reasons? All the people who have died are just too retarded to use a spirit healer? Or maybe, just maybe, there are certain gameplay conceits that exist in opposition to the lore.
>>724266410Assuming Arthas and Uther both tried to cure as many peasants as possible, they are still 2 paladins with limited mana pools, and there's no definitive example of how long it would take to cure each person or if they even knew they could at the time. Theyd maybe have saved like 4 people before they all started turning. But at least then Uther would have been forced to do something when that happened.
>>724233159Modern video game writers can only wish to create a moment as iconic, discussion and seethe inducing as this one.
>>724268365Most of the dialogue and minute plot details in wc3 are actually clumsy as fuck. The broad strokes though are pretty well done.I'll gladly take it over most modern mainstream games though for sure
Arthas should have waited for doctor putricide to at least develop some kind of vaccine first.
>>724268481>Most of the dialogue and minute plot details in wc3 are actually clumsy as fuckthis phenomenon has a name and it's called "sovl">You did this... to our people... KNOWINGLY? NGAAAGHH!!!!https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhcwuYokdUc
>>724233159Evil triumphs because good men do nothing, Arthas did something
How hard is WC3 online to get into brehs
>>724268938Yeah a lot of it works in context. The dialogue mostly gets a pass but there are still a lot of weird lines that people don't remember that are pretty jarring when you hear them.Also the story is pretty good thematically, but if you think too much about the details things fall apart. The prime example being Medivh who could have done such a better job preparing everybody for the burning legion and saved many many lives doing so.
>>724269159It's hard as fuck but its also skilled based matchmaking so...Just play the campaign on hard, and then practice with hard AI, and then do MP. You'll hopefully get matched with noobs. All this together should mean you'll have a pretty smooth onboarding even though the game has a goofy skill ceiling.
>>724269225The whole story revolves around just letting Arthas and Illidan do whatever they want without even really trying to reason with them or calm things down. The story has always progressed purely off the stupidity of its own characters but I agree that, broadly speaking it's still engaging enough.
>>724269413>Arthas and Illidan do whatever they want without even really trying to reason with them or calm things downit's because they're evil but then that got retconned in nuWoW so w/e
>>724269159high level play is basically dota except you're controlling the entire team of heroes AND the creep waves
>>724269587It was the opposite. Illidan was convinced that the skull would allow him to stop the demons, explained that to Malfurion and Malfurion told him to get out of his sight, leaving Illidan to do things on his own.Arthas was only made about to be more and more evil since Warcraft III ended since Blizzard really wanted people to hate him.
>>724269159I thought they shut the original down and only the gay demake was playable online now?
>>724233159because its going to start you down a dark path of means justifying ends until you're an evil lich king killing anyone and everyone
>>724270064The gay demake still lets you play with proper graphixx, they did fix the bugs and the patches are all sensible changes imo
>>724270054Illidan was at least a very obvious sociopath, even if he was well-meaning ("listen, Tyrande, baby, I won't do it again. I won't absorb the demon macguffin again. I swear, babygirl...").Arthas was evil from the beginning. But like, psychopath-lacking-all-self-awareness sort of evil.
>>724270359>Arthas was evil from the beginning.I really don't remember him doing something you could actually call evil till way later on
>>724270441Arthas basically HAS NO character until he starts doing evil shit.
>>724233159The chief doctor of the healing men academy for healing wants you to not slaughter the ill, just in case his healing brotherhood for healing manages to figure out how to heal them?HOW DARE HE
>>724270441>white male>blond hair>cracked under the pressure and went crazy from seeing civilians turn into undead and was seconds from the undead overrunning his footmen and turning the rest of a town he was trying to protect into paste>fell victim to the Nazrethim, who are notoriously horrible at manipulating people, titans, etcBeing weak is a sin.
I would've done the same thing, Arthas and I are very much alike heh...
>>724270637Everything Arthas did, he did willingly. He actually has tremendous strength of will. He's just a psychopath. >le frostmourne took your soulsaid by balnazzar is just the dreadlord fucking with him. but it filtered so many.
>>724270759>Yeah when Heartglen was being overrun and I was about to die>it was all according to my plan
>>724270880Not according to his plan. I just mean he did everything he did willingly and consciously.
>>724270569>chief doctor knows about the virus, what it does and how fast it can turn people from interacting with the ill himself>people are showing symptoms right in from of his eyes>"NAH MAN LETS JUST WAIT A LITTLE MAYBE SOMEONE WILL COME TO US WITH THE CURE!"
>>724270993>and how fast it can turn people from interacting with the ill himselfthis is a gameplay concession. I don't think you're supposed to think the plague turns people in mere minutes.
im team arthas on this, uther is a retarded lefty who lets his own morals stand in his way, i see parallels to some modern RL situations
>>724233521The expanded world of WoW ruined a lot of stuff.In Warcraft I always figured 95% of the populace was just normal peasants and magical shit was pretty fucking uncommon. You just see a lot of it because in war a lot of the powerful have to come together. So teleportation and shit was uncommon. Hell, I'd say most of these peasants who got turned to zombinos probably never saw a spell in their life.Once WoW came out, can't walk more than 3 feet without some magical bullshit happening. Kind of makes the earlier games make a lot less sense.
>>724271115Even with gameplay concessions in account its not like they had time to do research or anything, or even to go through the town and healer everybody with holy magic.Arthas dropped the ball sperging so hard at Uther but he was right that they didn't have time to really do anything other than the purge
>>724271129Arthas is literally a transhumanist who sees the Scourge as a way to "live forever" and rule the world.
>>724271296>Once WoW came out, can't walk more than 3 feet without some magical bullshit happening. Kind of makes the earlier games make a lot less sense.desu in vanilla portals were still something relegated to a single mage tower in a capital city.
>>724235802Gygax was a utilitarian?
>>724269246>Just play the campaign on hard, and then practice with hard AI,Does the harder difficulties just cheat or do they actually play better
>>724233521>get to UtherIt was Arthas that hurried to Stratholme, and it was Uther that couldn't get the lead out despite having horses, just as before when Arthas held out for three days without sleep. Jaina knew about the grain and had all that time to explain to Uther on the way. She also did not offer any solutions.
>>724233159People who think Arthas isn't retarded to tell a paladin to "Kill your own people because... I said so" and expect him to go along with that plan are as retarded as Arthas. Which is fitting.>>724235268But I do agree with some that it's completely out of character for Uther not to try to save people against both Arthas and Malganis
>>724248645because the last time blizzard gave a shit about doing anything significant in the plaguelands was in cataclysm. considering even the dead scar is completely gone and the argent dawn and cenarion circle have been actively trying to heal the land there is zero reason for the plaguelands to not be completely healed and the scourge present nullified by nowdon't expect this to ever change. blizzard still regrets the storyline continuity mess they caused for new players by getting rid of the old world. at best you'll have a tirisfal/arathi/darkshore situation where you get to visit an isolated phase (using those bronze dragon npcs to switch back and forth) for a quest or patch and then never come back again
>>724235502Retcons are not canon.
>>724271673They actually play better and use all of their unit abilities to fuck with you.
>>724270270Without my consent, my W3 disc install was deleted and replaced with 30GB of crud. Unless there has since been a change, you do not get the original shadows unless you fork out for Refarted, and the functional and beautiful title screens are gone, even the campaign menus. Blizzard are never getting my money again.
>>724248645I would say "because they haven't had any reason to update the zone" like nearly every Cataclysm zone (except Arathi which gives them a boner for some reason), but let's be honest, WPL/EPL will be unrecognisable without the Scourge crawling all over.You think anyone gives a shit about Eastweald? You think anyone even recognizes the name Eastweald?What content would you even make in the zone without the Scourge? There must always be infinity Scourge being churned out from the infinity members of the Cult of the Damned, even though they're surrounded on all sides by factions hostile to them, including Scarlet Crusade, who also work on "there's as many as the plot needs" logic.Fifty years from now, Stratholme will still be on fire.
>>724272930I'm not defending the business decision or the horrible launch dude, I'm just saying it's not as bad anymore
>>724272930yeah im never paying them again either but anon is right if you DO crave battle.net it's still there, just diminished and you don't have to pay for reforged or use the ugly ass new graphics
>>724273734i wouldn't put it past nu-blizz to make the scourge a smaller presence in the zone to make way for their new oc donut steel bad guys that appeared in huge numbers around the world. hell that might not even be necessary, nu-blizz loves bringing back the red racist human supremacists aka scarlet crusade for players to punch every other expansion
>>724233159The plague was spread through malice of the heart. If Arthas stuck to his Paladin ways and wasn't a spoiled nepo brat as confessed by the echelons of the Paladin order. He would not have become a fallen Paladin and used his power against Humanity to further spread the plague and Ner'zhul's power would have waned and the plague dissipated after Illidian finished him off. The moral of the story is that Arthas caused his own people's downfall, because he betrayed them and his ideals because of his megalomania. Arthas this is cemented when he hires troll mercenaries in Northrend to massacre his own forces to stop them from retreating and even gets called out by Muradin for it. But again, retards here will defend this treacherous Benedict Arnold b-b-b-because he seems like a tough leader guy and I wanna follow him! Fools.
>>724233159He was a better man
>>724273734It's super interesting that even when canonically WC humans don't think too much about skin color, the "bad human" has to be white and the "good human" has to be black (and also an elf-mutt).
>>724274968all of that's great but Uther is still a fag.
>>724233159Arthas proposed the hammer vax and sorry...ugh... its just... that I'm not gonna take it... ahah...
>>724272210>blizzard still regretswhat blizzard? this is like caring what disney's doing with star wars
>>724237270alright i’m a pretty strong antisemite myself but you are gonna have to explain to me how jews could have possibly been responsible for the bubonic plague, especially when people didn’t figure out what viruses and bacteria were until like 1700
>>724233159saying "this sucks" and leaving is the cheapest way to win an argument
Reminder that that to this day in canonical lore, over 20 years later, there is no cure to Undeath. Uther's "surely there's another way, lets quarantine for now and think about it!" still has no merit even retroactively with 20 years worth of hindsight.
>>724278270there is no cure AFTER you become a zombie.
>>724277901its a false flag. stuff along the lines of "jews control the weather" "jews caused the black plague" is an attempt by feds to de-legitimize real concerns.
>>724233159He's the male Jaina. Never there for the people to whom he mattered to, except for Heartglen.
>>724278270There's a quick cure called the Arthassian maneuver.
>>724278460there’s at least a grain of truth to the weather thing though. israel was cloud seeding, which hinders clouds from forming in nearby regions, effectively “stealing” rain.
>>724278586Uther isn't as bad as Jaina. Uther had principles, as "stupid good" as they were he at least had a "reason" to bail. Jaina just didn't want her name on the culling even though she tacitly acknowledges its the only way. She just "can't watch it happen" because she's selfish and doesn't want to tarnish her own good image.
>>724233159He had blind faith in the holy light. Many such cases.
>>724259194I like Uther's reaction to Stratholme because it reminds me of the end of the panda starting area, where the island turtle has a big airship lodged in his back and the horde-leaning panda says "lets blow it the fuck up and heal it later" while the alliance-leaning panda goes "what are you fucking crazy"Turns out the horde panda's idea worked and the alliance panda ate crow for disparaging a valid solution while offering none of her own
>>724234293>I'm sorry young Prince, but my master, the Jailer, will not want me to talk about things that would hurt his master plan.
>>724264736He makes a point of stating that Arthas is not his king. He could've just knocked him out and done his own thing.
>>724260197People forget Stratholme was one of the biggest cities in the entire Kingdom, maybe even the second largest. You let everyone there get turned to Undead, and they can just steamroll all the other cities and the main capitol. Doesn't help the map itself always has the citizens eventually turn into Undead if you wait, and there's no way to stare at them hard enough until they're suddenly not infected with plague.
>>724272091>Jaina knew about the grainAre you retarded? They didn't know it turns people undead, that was only discovered after she left. Go play the game, wow secondary
>>724279253Nobody cares about dogshit wow expansions, loser
>>724249757This is good
WoW fucking ruined WC3
>>724270759That was tichondrius you wow secondary
>>724281471Yes but Warcraft III had plenty of stupid writing. It was just at least cool whereas current WoW has shit like >>724273734
>>724281716>Yes but Warcraft III had plenty of stupid writingNot really. Your criticisms are shallow
>>724281892>Your criticisms are shallowWhat criticisms? All I said was it's stupid.
>>724281892Not that anon but i think the medivh scenes really couldve been executed a lot better. And easily too,: just a few extra lines/different wording.In general though I would say the game has really good writing, yeah. I've yet to read a cogent criticism of the Arthas arc
>>724271296In my headcanon, World of Warcraft ended at WotLK and started up again and ended again at Legion. There are only ~80 heroes on the Horde and Alliance. 40 on either side because of 40man raids. 80 people out of an entire planet's population isn't a lot.
>>724233879Scourge Plague is incurable. Simple as.
>>724233879And Holy Light is supposed to damage undead. Yet I can't cast it on Forsaken players.
>>724233159Childhood is thinking culling is wrong.Adulthood is knowing it wasn't enough.
>>724281982That's a criticism, go read a dictionary Ranjesh
>>724281989Wc3 has some really good dialogue as well as some hammy dialogue.>If pride gives us pause my love, then perhaps we have lived long enough already Always loved this one
>>724234693Arthas told them to fuck off and used his royal authority to do so before they could.
>>724233159>he doesn't understand deontological vs consequentialist ethics
>>724263047There's always a counterargument.If the only option left to make an evil being give information on how to save an innocent then torture is good.
>>724282378People understand deontological ethics anon, they just don't respect it. It's extremely low IQ and only exists at all as a result of the coddling of civilization. In nature it would just lead to a swift and deserved demise.
>>724282442That's if you assume your presumptions correct. This is why codes of ethics exist. In case you are wrong.
>>724282693>Muy nature!!!Embarrassing
>>724282342>wow golly gee I have my morals but Arthas just told me and my retinue of paladins to go away I guess we'll listenUther is a fucking coward
>>724282857Yeah like I said...low IQ.Ignoring the consequences of your actions is the stubborn thought process of a toddler
>>724282867You're the coward, if Uther had used force you'd call him a traitor and say Arthas was even more justified. Because you're a manipulative snake.
>>724235047If vanilla WoW is anything to go off of. Their versions of paladins are more like plate wearing clerics. Paladins in every other setting and universe are zealous and quick thinking forces of God. Smite first and ask questions later.t. paladin main in every RPG I play.
>>724283002>Ignoring the consequences of your actions is the stubborn thought process of a toddlerIronic considering what Arthas did and became and you are now defending
>>724283016He would be a traitor acting in detriment to the kingdom. But at least he'd be following his own professed morals.
>>724283089The fact that Arthas went on to do terrible things does not mean the culling was incorrect. That's fallacious
>>724283313I don't think his morals include killing his friend the prince regent and his fellow paladins, you psychopath
>>724283330Oh please, you're a retarded sub 90 IQ wow secondary who wants to feel morally justified in liking the villain, so you invent these narratives. You're literally too stupid to realise you can like an evil character without being evil yourself. Or just too dishonest to admit that you yourself are morally bankrupt.
>>724283456He purports to feel strongly about the execution of the infected but otherwise innocent civilians of Stratholme. Just not strongly enough to defend them in any way.
>>724283456Does his morals include letting a psychopath slaughter thousands of innocent villagers?Villagers that he swore to protect as a paladin by the way.
>>724283631>Promotes deontological views>Gets emotional, cannot present a rational argument in entire reply chainI'm noticing
>>724283683Defend them from his friend and future ruler, you mean? You left that part out conveniently
>>724283781>Loses argument >Starts talking about how the other person is arguing instead of responding to the argumentI correctly pegged you as a reptile
>>724283738So you admit Arthas was a psychopath?
>>724284048Never said he wasn't, that doesn't answer my question though.
>>724283456>killingUther wields a hammer, not a sword. Just knock Arthas out dumbass, it's that simple.
>>724283897I didn't lose anything bro. You just seethed aimlessly. Without the culling the scourge wins faster and harder you dumb cunt, something you know which is why you never address it.
>>724284173I don't need to, you admitted he was a psychopath
>>724284267What the actual fuck does that have to do with my question?I asked if Uther's morals allowed him to let a psychopath kill innocents and you just came at me with something completely irrelevant like you had some kind of gotcha.
>>724271296to be fair, WoW is a really abstracted take on the world because otherwise it would just be too fucking big. Warcraft 3 had the luxury of being able to zoom in and flesh out smaller areas. I think the world is still full of peasants and regular people, you just see more of the magic and stuff because, well, you're the player character. at least in vanilla it still feels okay. it got worse and worse as it went on.
>>724233159>>724233521>>724234293Remember: the canon answer to all these questions is "the Jailor wanted it that way."Now, say it with me: "Thank you, Blizzard."
>>724284243>Without the culling the scourge wins faster and harder you dumb cunt, something you know which is why you never address it.You can't know something that was never written into the story, clown. You have no idea what would have happened. You could say literally anything and it couldn't be proven wrong. But what do we actually know? That Arthas doomed his people then and there because of his actions. The events of the game subvert your entire argument.
>>724278270You don't even need to justify it with the incurable undead curse, the time jannies all agree there are only bad timelines where the culling of stratholme never happened.
>>724284376I don't care about your question, the argument is whether Arthas was right or wrong. You said he was a psychopath. It's over.
>>724284608>the argument is whether Arthas was right or wrongNo it wasn't you fucking retard, the argument was about Uther refusing to go against Arthas.
>>724284608Embarrassing yourself at this point
>>724284921>No it wasn't you fucking retardJesus Christ why are you so dishonest
>>724285123You really are retarded, aren't you?Look at >>724283456 what does it say?
How was Arthas so fucking powerful anyway>Illadan approaching the Frozen Throne makes Ner'zul panic and gives Arthas a fucking migraine that makes him weaker and weaker each time>Sylvanus, the Blood Elves, Nagas, Nerubians, Dwarfs, and the Faceless STILL were completely incapable of killing him.
>>724285320It says you are a psychopath
>>724285394The Power of Anubaraks acquaintance
>>724285394Arthas was a certified Chad. After his soul was stolen, he was Evil Chad. Just built different than a normal man.
>>724285394He wasn't chosen for no reason. He was a brilliant general and probably the most powerful human.
>>724283016>I feel very strongly about this>That's why I will capitulate immediately to Arthas' orders despite literally saying "I wouldn't follow that order even if you were my king" just moments prior, implying my willingness to defy authority for a righteous cause>Also when me and my full retinue of paladins are dismissed from the area I will stand by and do nothing>Not try to help the citizens, not try to kill the demon, literally just stand by and watch>But at least I'm moral about my complete inactionUther is literally all talk. He talks a big game but backs down from every single opportunity to put his morals into action. He's a fucking coward.
>>724286350>complete inactionwait, so uther is 300IQ taoist master?
>>724257182i didn't get it and I don't know anyone who died from it so yeah as far as I'm concerned it was a huge scam
>>724284503As far as I'm concerned, everything after WotLK is fanfic from nu-Blizz. Hell, you could argue that the line should be drawn even sooner than that. Either way, this franchise's lore is an Abomination at this point.
>>724235802I'm glad he's dead.
>>724263473Originally Mal'ganis wasn't part of the mission. You were supposed to actively find and kill every villager.
>>724234693They had actually all but destroyed the Scourge of Lorderan at Hearthglen, which is why they were even going to Stratholme on the other side of the country. Scholomance was probably cooking up more guys but Mal'ganis is in Stratholme for a win-win situation, either getting a fuck huge army or convincing Arthas to give chase.Uther likely believes that his knights could contain the undead. Could he though?Stratholme is the second largest human city in the world at that time (Stormwind is like 2 years rebuilt). Mal'ganis is a complete unknown to all forces against him, demons of his power are basically myth to the alliance as all they had to deal with were doomguard-esque guys and whatever minor beings the Kirin-tor have summoned. Meanwhile we have at least a large portion of Lorderan's army, the silver hand, elven detachments sent to aid with the plague, and one plucky group of dwarven hunters, led by Uther, Arthas, and Jaina. I'm inclined to believe there's a chance they could have held the undead.
Very Dramatic, ArthasI'll give you the urn, and you'll make sure I die quickly.
>>724278878That's why she couldn't watch the Horde kill her father either, even though she knew she shouldn't let them kill him, even if he is wrong. For perspective, she agreed to help Thrall save Grom who now twice willingly drank the blood of Mannoroth, while not trying to come up with a plan to incapacitate her father and keep him alive. Somehow it's easier to incapacitate Grom Hellscream, an orc that towers over humans, than an old human. Then again, Metzen really did push the Horde hard in W3.
>>724236628Kinda weird the Forsaken haven't managed to find some type of cure. Considering how sensitive China is to dead imagery, it's weird that Blizzard hasn't done a canon revamp of their appearance.
>>724235802Based Gygax making limp wristed zoomers like >>724287529 and >>724236269 seethe endlessly
>>724235368she checks the box because that bitch anne keeps putting her marble in the box whenever she goes out for a walk
>>724289023>An eye for an eye is lawfulI didn't know the Hammurabi laws were still in effect
>>724289152You don't know a lot of things, least of all ways to subdue evil. That's why niggers still rape and pillage your societies, undeterred, because of weak faggots like you.
>>724286350Yes but Arthas was in the wrong so please, please, please ignore all of what you just wrote please.
>>724289272Glownigger or a bot? The point was the LAWFUL good part not the lawful GOOD part
>>724288004That urn contains my father's ashes Uther! What, were you hoping I'd piss on them one last time before I left his kingdom to rot?
>>724289321>"U-uhm did you just suggest a universe where something might theoretically done? Only glowniggers want you to do things! GLOWNIGGER AHHH!"Remain silent and impotent while you are crushed by your betters.
>>724277901Well poisoning is the act of malicious manipulation of potable water resources in order to cause illness or death.
>>724249757This dumb shit always gets a little giggle out of me.
>>724287327It needs to be after, otherwise the whole Arthas storyline wouldn't be concluded.>Vanilla is just a bunch of scattered shit like dragons, elementals, silithids, and the undead across two continents.>BC is a completion to Illidan, Kael'thas, Vashj, and Kil'Jaden and closure to WC2's humans.>Wrath finishes up the big boss of Arthas, who was the main character in waiting, his cronies, and semi-unites the factions against a common foe. (plz igonre titans it wuz their by acciddent sorryyyy)Thematically, it should end with Wrath, if you ignore the titan nonsense they crammed in there. You could make a stab that it was resolving the Old One Arthas fought in WC3, but that's a stretch.But I'm still happy Ulduar was so fucking fun.
HOW DID THIS LOSER GET SUCH A FANCY TOMB ?
>>724288831Didn't they add an option for Forsaken with no bones showing?
>>724292891
>>724292891>for doing nothing longer than anyone else, Uther this tomb's for you!
>>724292891It's him.The Lightbringer.
It's out ,btw
>>724233159>Do the creators genuinely expect me to side with this goofball?No? If you continued playing the campaign you would notice the devs have the player side with Arthas' side of the story.
>>724237405Does that tombstone model belong to a particular character? Or is this code monkey merely angry at being involved in the monstrosity that was Reforged?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3tjLN1JutU
>>724293339my penus wenus?
>"No Anakin, eliminating the Seperatists and their droid armies that leads to even more senseless deaths is.... le bad...">"I will now proceed to present 0 counter arguments or alternatives to your method and just let the Council hate you instead
>>724293339????
So, what would have happened if Arthas didn't purge Stratholme? Anons say it would be the end of Lordaeron, but the purge was part of the Lich King/Jailer/Mal'ganis's plan so you'd think that the purge and more importantly Arthas's corruption would lead to a worse result than the alternative because it was all part of their evil plans.
Kek
bumpFuck Malfurion as wellAND FUCK MAIEV
>>724297440Even if you make that assumption, that information wasn't available to anybody at stratholme.Being against the purge for that specific reason would be a ludicrous gamble
>>724233159hffhhfhff
>>724233993Heh
>>724233159Cuckther the Dickbringer (into his own ass) did everything wrong and is a hack fraud. He should be unpersoned as the first paladin, and his gay little tomb in Western Plaguelands appropriated into a memorial for that nigga you can rescue in the Frozen Throne Night Elf mission (forgot his name)
>is so morally he superior he just runs away and lets Arthas Strathocaust
>>724233732>thoughbeitWhat is it with you "people"? Do you have to adopt every retarded word you come across? You're subhuman sponge-creatures.
Instead of ordering genocide just tell Uther to come help save the people so he sees it's impossible
>>724233690wouldn't his paladin morality actually force him to stop Arthas from murdering innocent people instead of taking his toys and going home?
>24 hour threadLiterally one deranged blizzard samefagging
>>724285887The broest of bros
>>724297440Like every good plot, both outcomes would benefit the Lich King. If Arthas didn't purge Stratholme, then the army of the undead from the second biggest city of Lordaeron would overwhelm the living, and, in the end, would probably push Arthas to a Hail Mary attempt to stop the Scourge at its source by going to Northrend anyway.
>>724296198it is a default texture
