Why did the MMO genre die?
>>725342402you know whygacha are more profitable for less effort
Instant Gratification for the casual players.
People becoming less social more vain apathetic and cynical in general led to “mmo” worlds feeling emptier than the real world does
because every mmo became wow clones and nobody wants to play thoseand those who do already plays wow
Unironically because WoW refused to die, stifling innovation. Left only soulless Koreans to making any attempts at penetrating the market
to me personally it started feeling like a second job so I quit
>>725342402People aren't interested in interaction with strangers anymore, even social networks now are just a feed with content
>>725342402Because its fucking retarded. The cooldown based combat is a carryover from Warcraft RTS games where you have an army fighting on cooldown attacks, but in WOW youre just one guy with cooldown attacks. So this incentives you to party up in large groups. But everyone just copied this and made a genre out of it without stopping to question "hey what if the combat wasnt fucking retarded stilted dogshit based aroundd cooldown timers what if it was like a normal action game like the rest of all combat based video games?" and you seriously wonder why this 'genre' died. Holy fuck I hate you people. In addition to this they convinced you that paying a monthly subscription is normal. So if you want to play the game for a long time you are going to pay hundreds of dollars for this dogshit combat system and justify it somehow.
TAKE ME BACKI WANT TO GO BACKAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
>>725342402ok what game is this cutie from. but yes as others have said, social interaction online isnt novel anymore and the only ones that do it now are people that didnt get the memo or terminally online weirdos.
>>725342402The league of legends mmorpg better be similar to all of their tournament videos. Just everyday looking people with customization but you get the armor that styles you into the universe.
MMOs are live service games, by definitionThere is not a large amount of competition to be had in such a space
Jews
MMO height>you are a bored teenager>discover the online world where you can forget about problems or school and hang out with friends, or make new ones on the other side of the globe because you can connect with other white people who are like minded as you.>people want to get gear and help eachother out, everything is new and different.>every day you play you learn something new about the game, your friends, or teach people how to do cool shit>time passes and you stop having time to do this shit due to work, family or other activity.>try to get back into it for old time sake, however instead you run into-Today>want to play game>all mmos are instantly solved due to data mining>streamlined gameplay to make every game just an online singleplayer game with random people filling in roles for damage or healing, because you are the hero.>talking online now gets you banned for saying simple shit like "gg ez">most players isolate to their faggot discord groups>90% of the online population is indian or chinese, so you will never form a real connection with anyone new, it's just all temporary meaningless numbers>why am I playing this when I can just play a single player game?
lost ark at launch>t1 +t2 were incredibly fun>get to the "wall">instant gook shitthat's how they get you
MMOs peaked with Tera
>>725342402because the people developing the games now forgot what made the genre fun in the first place, instead they decided put a focus on making you learn a bunch of mechanics for an endgame dungeon you need to dedicated a bunch of time towards and you can only do it in this certain timeframe and you know there's no fun thereclassic hardcore wow is still fun because it's about the journey to the endgame and having a great time until lvl 60you see a similar poison inflicting RTS games, where everything becomes about the online aspect so singleplayer enjoyment gets tossed aside, and they wonder why they can't bring in new players anymorefighting games are also going a similar way and it really doesn't help anyone that if someone wants to learn how to play against other people, they have to expect to get destroyed a bunch of times before they can start "playing" the game, whereas if they load up a singleplayer game they can start having fun immediately
>>725342919Koreans have an uncanny ability to destroy otherwise good MMOs.Take the disgusting monetisation and grinding out of Black Desert and you would unironically have a kino adventure MMO.Funnily enough they recognised this and made the single player version with Crimson Desert
>>725343060hunting BAMs in this game was satisfyingi will never forgive them for nerfing those mobs
>>725343171>made
>>725342817Lost ArkIts.... decent, for a KMMO
>>725343060is there anything that fills the void?
>>725342402People that wanted grinding and daily chores moved to gachas. People that wanted to socialize moved to fotm friendslop games, or just using discord. That only leaves the most hardcore friendless raiders still caring.
>>725343481private serversbut all of them are kinda ghost towns
How long until EOS?
>>725342914data mining existed even back in the golden days, retard.It was actually easier so was modding game files my retarded teenage self had a literal full blown custom MPQ setup in vanilla WoW turning my rank 12 armor into dreadnaught and my unstoppable force into corrupted ashbringer, I was even able to port over the old buff blood elf models from the TBC friends and family into vanilla because everything was easy as just dragging MPQs into the main master MPQ file and renaming it but the blood elf models were definitely glitchy as fuck.all of my sound effects were custom too my charge as warrior used the im the juggernaut bitch sound and I edited in the actual charge sound in the middle so both played
>>725343516most people use the other launcher, but yeah it's clear the pop is dwindlingfucking retarded how they handled this one
>>725343376The hebe island was nice to explore, wish there was more nude art/mods stuffToo bad the game itself basically require sub 100 ping so playing on a non-supported region is ass
>>725343545sure you did champ
>Pump and dump cash grabs turned into gachas rather than games they actually have to develop and maintain>Number go up dopamine also followed the path of gacha, it's just purpose built for this kind of mindset>Communities and socialization moved to discord, partially due to convenience, partially due to risking your long standing account with some retard's hurt feelings by talking in-game>"playing something with your friends" moved to fotm friendslop co-op games>RPGs in general have gone the way of action orientation, incredibly taxing to keep smooth with a network of potentially hundreds simultaneously per area>all that's left is a husk in the middle of old games people can't let go of no matter how bad it gets or how little there is left of what they once lovedTheres no one easy solution. Even if you had it, people will still stick to their old comforts.
>>725343583Really? I haven't had a huge amount of trouble from OCE with 180 ping>hebe islandWhere? I only made it to level 45
>>725343545>blah blah blahYeah man I'm sure people knew everything going into a fight to just farm gear 20 seconds after the shit released. Also who gives a fuck about WoW? >I modded the game with skins, I know what I'm talking about!>misses the pointAh, another brown, exactly what I'm talking about. Fuck I hate the Obamanet.
>>725343376the core of the game was decent, getting to that core was fucking aids
Because MMOs inevitably become huge time investments, and the fear of an MMO dying and wasting your investment forever is a thing. So, nobody plays any MMOs other than the biggest ones because they are less likely to die.
>>725343879and the people who play the biggest ones all have FOMO, as soon as new content comes out they have to drop everything immediately or they miss being "behind" which is a really fucking stupid approach to gaming
>>725343646>>725343701>zoomer posersyou know an entire guild got banned because they deleted the mpq file for a wall in AQ so they could just waltz to c'thun without clearing the dungeon right?MPQ editing was so absurdly easy and it's why blizzard made it far more difficult to do today.A lot of older stuff isn't very well documented but there's still discussion about the AQ wall on the internet, there was also a txt file you could insert into your main MPQ and it allowed horde and alliance to talk to each other.
>>725343879the oldest mmorpgs are still alive thoughUOEQAnarchy OnlineDAOCnone of them ever died and you can play your launch characters from 1999 right now if you wanted to and if you remember your account details.
>nu "mmo" in modern age>faggot devs just pay streamers to play for 3 weeks>get a following for the game>they leave>game dead
>>725344016>cries about zoomers>only talks about WoWSigh.I can tell you eat shit, at least branch out and talk about Anarchy Online, Asherons Call, Dark age of Camelot, fucking Lineage, FFXI, The Realm, Ragnarok Online, anything else. I get that you are wowdrone but fuck at least try.
>>725343681I played for a few months on launch and already quit but iirc here's what I remember:I was on ~200+ and it was hard to properly counter in raids, I basically had to predict when the boss was going to use a counterable move instead of being able to just react if I was a korean with 5 ping.>hebe islandOk not really full hebe island sadly but its Punika or something, the island with Nia on it and her 4-5 fuckable hebe friends. I think its was a main story island so you'll probably get there soon?
>Lived to see the birth of technology that could unequivocally make MMOs great>But corporate judaism has destroyed any prospect of that and the only living options are multi-decade old MMOs or Gook shit
>>725342402Casuals now just play free mobile games.Social players just use Steam as their gaming social network.Hardcore gamers generally don't like how everything is now streamlined rather than requiring players to group up and grind in places to gain levels.You could change MMOs back to the Everquest days, but you have a much smaller audience and you're just going to remove the current casual audience over trying to get back more hardcore minded players who have already left the genre. Plus, despite what it sometimes sounds like, you're competing with a huge number of other MMOs. There are still hundreds of other options out there, and even if they're functionally dead, there still needs to be a reason to play your piece of crap over playing all the other pieces of crap still floating around somewhere. And those other MMOs, very frequently, had millions of dollars put into crafting their assets and story and quests. so good luck competing with all of that.
>>725344016How is cheating in a game the same as datamining a whole patch a month before release? Why are WoW players so fucking retarded?
>>725342914>make new ones on the other side of the globe because you can connect with other white people who are like minded as you.was this ever really the case? maybe I was playing f2p kmmos where almost everyone i met when revealed was some shade of east asian to seanoid.
>>725344691>I was playing f2p kmmosI think you answered your own question.
>>725342402Everyone kept making the "safe bet" by copying WoW but nothing caught on except XIV which mixed it up by having a 300 hour singleplayer story. Even New World which tried to do something new during its alpha stage caved when the WoWfags came in and complained that it wasn't enough like WoW so they added a holy trinity and removed most of its sandboxy survival game mechanics in favor of having a bunch of shitty fetch-quests. Now it is dead.Koreans had a shot at reviving the genre but they're too greedy to make anything that isn't a painful grind unless you pay or just straight up pay to win mechanics so they always fail in the west. We haven't had a new good MMO release in ages and if we did, I'm sure most of the playerbase wouldn't move from the game they're already playing because of sunk cost.It really is a cursed genre.
>>725344739NTA but old KMMOs weren't as bad as they are now.I remember loving the fuck out of Flyff back in the day and it was actually not half bad, I kinda liked how convoluted the class system was for example
>>725342402if you want to make a mmo, the money men wants you to beat wow, runescape and ff14 and the latest FOTM koreammo. And then you have gacha....but maybe one day, peak will come back. People are a lot better at video games now.
>>725342914Yeah, this is a good summary. Internet culture as a whole is entirely different these days, plus third worlders and browns have ruined every single community.Back in the day when you came home from school/work and hopped online you knew that you'd only be dealing with other like-minded nerds. Nowadays every has a smartphone and the internet in their back pocket. The novelty online worlds is dead and infested with normies otherwise.
>>725344786A lot of the KMMOs were alright, but once the anime-esqe visual allure wore off, most of them were just very long grinders with no substance. I remember being excited for a bunch of MMOs that never made it to western shores, but that's the way she goes.
the only way to fix mmo's is to change the way the current ones are being played, they all wanna be ARPG's with forced multiplayer at certain times with all the best content locked behind gearchecks and parsing and new expansions that don't improve on old areasit needs an entirely new approach, like an mmo that's all about catching bugs and every now and then you can run into other people where you can also catch bugs and you can also release your bugs to ruin other people's ability to catch bugs, i would call it a bug's life
games are not made to be fun anymorenowadays games are made to maximize the time you spend playing and take away the most money they can get from playersnobody wants that shit
>>725342402Genuinely, until the video game bubble actually bursts, which may be sooner rather than later, you're not going to have a decent new MMO. Golden throne board members are always going to demand hyper unrealistic monetary returns for projects, and no mmo is going to get that return vs investment compared to any number of other genre cash grabs could with a fraction of manpower required. When the crash happens that we're slowly rolling our way towards, companies may actually want steady income based projects again instead of foot over head exponential growth and returns they demand now. When that comes to pass, we may see a revival.
>>725345050Leg locked babymaking sex
>>725342402(((Investors)))
>>725344787it's a ncsoft game though so if it came back it'd be some real monkey paw bs.
>>725345139Think your gif fucked up bud, because I know the one and it makes me diamonds
>>725345103unironically everything shit with the world today always has its roots in someway connected to "da joos"
>>725344209>>only talks about WoWIn terms of datamining and editing and I did earlier >>725344128nice job being retarded though
>>725344660Because that's how wowhead datamines you mongoloidfucking around with MPQs was far easier in 2004 which made it far easier to datamine.funny enough wowhead primarily used wow model viewer before they finally put together their own tools.
>>725345272>posts are 2 minutes apart>somehow editing and datamining relate to your post as you just stated the games are still aliveYes, we understand that you are brown and proud of it.>>725345384>WoW datamining>every player used this during 2004I can really tell you guys can never really understand why your genre is dead. Go back to farming your dailies.
>>725342402>Why did the MMO genre die?Everyone tried to be the "WoW killer" by...copying WoW. The people who liked WoW would try a new game, rush through all the content in a month, then quit and go back to WoW. The people who didn't like WoW got tired of every other MMO trying to be like it. And quit MMOs as a whole. Eventually you had just WoW players cycling through a few games. But mostly playing WoW.It's the same as how RTS died.
>>725342402Because of social media, you dont need to play a game anymore to socialize if you dont have friends IRL
>>725342402They stopped being about the journey and everything focused on the destination. This can be seen most clearly with how trivial levelling is in MMOs nowadays. They treat that whole aspect as an annoyance rather than the game.Nothing matters until "endgame" anymore and that's why it died.
Lost ark wouldn't have died if only they didn't censor artist...
>>725342402Oh my god.. I have to cum now... I have to..! I have to jerk off..!! I have to jerk off bros! She's just dancing like that..... those fucking polygons!!! Oh my god... uhm !F-fuck!!!! Open brave now!!!!R-rule 34!! Porn! Porn now! Porn now porn PLEASE!!! I NEED PORN!!!! I NEED PORN RIGHT FUCKING NOW!!!!!!I need PORN!!!!!! WHERE IS AN AI GENERATED IMAGE OF HER SHITTING ON A COCKVORED VERSION OF HER LOLI SELF FOR GODS SAKE!!!!! FUCKING NOW FUCKING PORN NOW NOW NOW NOW NOW OH MY GOD MY GOONSTI K NEEDS PORN OF HER NOWWWWWWWWWW!!!!
>>725342526tbf, mmo's are as boring as moisture farming
>>725345261It's pathetic how little accountability you have. Jews don't have mind control, and are not in fact mentally compelling the rich white people fucking over the rest of the first world to do so.
>>725345906NGL, besides the issue with my ping, all the retarded AGS moderation + changes was what made me decide to quit.
>>725342402How did the French manage to make the best MMORPG of 2025?
>>725345984>haha masturbation le badGo back 2 reddit.
>>725346065Holy tummy sexThis wakfu? Any gameplay to show? I had a passing look at it but thats all
>>725345906Lost Shart was doomed from the start the moment Amazon got its fingers into it. Just like all hype immediately died for Blue Protocol once people saw the trailer differences.
>>725346048find a guild faggot
>play kmmo today>you are actually punished for playing with othersnever understood this mentality with gook mmosthey do look pretty, but that's all they can do
>>725342402Because every game started having free updates, many of witch are free F2P. People don't want to have to pay a subscription service just to play a single game.
>>725342402social media
>>725346228And yet the two most popular MMOs right now are both subscription
>>725346105it's Dofusthough Wakfu has new servers and an event going on right now or something
>>725343516the way they handle the skill book and accessory slot being rng is the most retarded thing theyve ever done to revive BNS
>>725346286That's because they are ancient in videogame terms and have a strong loyal playerbase despite peaks and valleys. Younger and new MMOs can't get away with that these days.
>>725345452Every player in 2004 used Thottbot instead, WoWhead became dominant later. But stating that databases and datamining did not exist back then is idiotic. It did.
>>725345984I say this when I need to cum my goonstick to some porn
>>725345984you're missing the point
>>725346425It wasn't as much datamining as it was people writing guides for quests and stuff, I remember using thottbot and there were a lot of holes, unexplained steps and missing quests.
Here is how to fix the MMO genre>no chat outside of public>no communication outside of the game
>>725346778And how would someone achieve that? I don't want to live in a north korean-style dictatorship just to have a slightly better experience playing some old shitty MMOs.
>>725346778>Further drive player interaction onto 3rd party platforms like DiscordLiterally just making things worse
>>725342402Because no one wants to socialize despite being glued to their screens nowadays
>>725343481Porn
>>725346105The company is Ankama.Dofus is the first MMO, and recently got a revision. Wakfu is the second MMO, and is much less popular. There's also Waven, but that one didn't catch on. They went back to focus on Dofus after Waven didn't pick up many players.As far as I know, all three are still up and available to play.
>>725346874Seeing what mmofaggots do when you grant them absolute freedom, Stalinism is basically a necessity to maintain the health of the game.
>>725346425You clearly don't understand, there's a difference between a tool existing and 90% of the playerbase using it out of the box. I would bet in 2004, maybe 1 in every 1000 players even knew about it, or used it. The average player just enjoyed it for what it was. The point is barely anyone used datamining as there was no need, you would play and learn. Now it's just datamined to make a youtube video for "content" by some faggot in a basement. It's like all those dumbass "NEW META GUN LOOK AT THIS IMAGE!!!!!!!" videos you see, it's all about making money instead of playing a game. It's a factor that negatively effected the genre as a whole.Sites like ffxicyclopedia were written all by users just experimenting and letting people know about shit. Now none of it is community driven, so there's no point in engaging with it.
It's hilarious how you can tell people like >>725346778 don't even play an MMO but have an amazingly trash opinion.
>>725342919Early t3 was the peak of the game though and only the weak got culled before it. Then they went FULL gook shit in later t3 and everyone left, also the company is running on fumes and greed so everything after the early legion raids is total shit.
>>725342914You nailed it. Don't forget the neta chasing. Diablo 4, every single person of their class runs the exact same build. I just dont see the fun in copying someone else's homework
>>725346950Thottbot was extremely popular. Stop fucking coping already you muppet. It was so popular that the catchphrase of the comment chain about Stoneskin Gargoyle Cape ended up becoming its item description later.
>>725346874beatings, starting with >>725346875 and >>725346957
>>725345990calm down shlomo, you dont need to oust yourself everytime someone says "joos"
Too much grinding and meta-slaving, The World (MMO) used to be a place where you can explore and spend hours just talking with strangers while doing dungeons and discovering the story of the game.
>>725347079Ultimately, its always the %1 of the playerbase who can be blamed for many shortfalls.Meta chasing and build hyper optimisation are great examples. Complaining when content is "too easy" when said content requires an entire blog post on how to handle insta wipe mechanics and 3 hours of your time.MMOs are an elysium that could only flourish in a purer world. We will never get that
>>725347090I don't think banning communication outside of the games would fix much anyway, the problem with modern MMOs is that there isn't really much to talk about in the game so nobody does it. You enter your dungeon queue, get paired up with some randoms and do the same thing you've been doing for hundreds of hours already, there isn't anything to talk about unless they throw some curveballs at their players and force them to communicate and solve problems.
>>725343516WHY DID I BUY $LINKAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
>>725347086Yeah that's great, wowfag, you do understand I'm talking about MMOs as a whole, not just your shit game?I hated wowfags then, and it seems not much has changed. Idiots.
>>725347079There's a reason why only morons still play clicker games like POE and Diablo. 99% of the player base just follows a guide, so what is even the point?
>>725342402Because every fucking game wants you to play them like a job now, not just mmos.
>>725342914gg ez
>>725342402They're bad games at their core, which were supposed to be made up for with social interaction, but the ones left who still play the genre are carebears so the content is dumbed down further and/or able to be done solo. Massive multiplayer doesn't mean shit in the age of discord. The next successful MMO would have to be incredibly grand in scale to satisfy both PvP and PvE fags separately while still having some reason for them to both interact at times, basically at least 3 different games into one.
I was about to make a thread about it butHow come early 2000s KMMOs had these incredible fucking ost?Like, all of them had bangers in them, shit was crazy.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_XB8TwWEgEhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_XB8TwWEgEhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHd52B2ulvAhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12hdTyle52w
>>725347405The point is to whack the pinatas and watch all the shiny loot come out, you leave the theorycrafting to the autists that give a shit about simming and such.
The absolute state of mmos where I only get excited for private servers now
>>725347678Don't worry, they're doing their best to remove those servers. Korea just announced a new strategy to take them down and Blizzard has sued multiple, they'll be out of your hair soon enough.
>>725342526/thread
>>725347642Ah shit, meant to put Seal Online OST and not double LaTalehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vujtJwrWbC4
>>725342526I like being Uncle Owen thoughbiet.
>>725347734What KR slop even has private servers? I'd play lost ark if it had any. Is it just maplestory or something?
>>725347803So does most of the old school MMO players.But that doesn't make money.What makes money is shit like WoW.Instant gratification, no punishment for dying.
>>725347867I know Archeage and Tera has a bunch, there's probably lots of others cause they seem to view it as a big problem.
>>725347264Sneak in chatty AI players hehe
>>725347668Then why play those, just play an action game instead. Half of the fun is the discovery and building of character. If you automate or let someone do it for you, you might as well just watch a damn video about it.
>>725347981Because you can shut your brain off and relax while pulling the slot machine lever for some dopamine hits, the only reward you get for playing action games is sweaty clothes.
>>725347642>FlyffInsane how good the OST was for thishttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjSA1OdOorA was one of my personal favs
Dofus mogs modern MMOs so hard.>tab-target slopvs tactical combat kino
>>725348112Do you ever sleep?
>>725348147only when im playing runescape
I thought by now we would have an MMO with immense realism. By that I mean things like realistic fauna (how in ultima online if you killed wolves then deer would stop overpopulating and eating all gatherable herbs), incredibly crafting mechanics (being able to make crossbows that fire a spell which teleports enemies 30 feet into the air/magic boots which allow you to walk on water, etc), being able to build your own villages and towns and start your own kingdom. Why aren't devs making these kind of new and exciting mmos, it seems nowadays people just want to make more wow clones.
>>725348223We just can't get past world of warcrafts. Every game has to have a focus on leveling and reaching the end game where you chase after the BiS and do wow raids with 10 or 25 people which involve not standing in a green puddle.
>>725347948I want a fake MMO single player game like this a la .hackWith fake players running around, chatting, trading, buying shit in the stores...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNkyPu_gK68
>>725348067>being so fat that playing contra is a workoutlolbut seriously, that's sad, just play gambling games instead, same bullshit. Orange/Legendary drop rates in most games are just a meme and people usually end up hacking that shit anyway.
>>725343171Funny enough, the popularity of runescape proves there is a market for grind heavy MMOs in the west, you just need to not load it with disgusting monetization schemesGame devs are retarded
>>725348279why are wowfags so obnoxious? I didnt say anything about WoW, and WoW never fulfilled any of this
>>725347876>>725347803>>725342526What kind of a retarded fucking loser faggot buys a massively multiplayer online game for Star Wars and says, "I just wanna go farm moisture in the middle of the desert"? Of course nobody bought the game, it was obtuse, cryptic, incredibly dull. Pretending like this was some death knell to some super special titles is just cope.
>>725348279Simon Says gameplay is fucking gay bullshit and I wish it would die already.
>>725348365I've been playing FFXIV for 10 yearsAnd god am I tired of their simon says bullshit
>>725348429Jesus christ.That's one thing I gave up on. I played the fuck out of FFXI but I'm so glad they never had that shit.
>>725348335>you just need to not load it with disgusting monetization schemesIt's funny you say that when Runescape 3 is just there, full of this shit, and probably the only thing stopping OSRS to get the same treatment.
>>725348304The economy in these games is very real and there is a sense of progression you won't ever get from pure gambling games. To say that everyone that don't enjoy the most autistic aspect of the games should just up and quit is silly, sorry but I don't want to spend hundreds of hours fiddling with a giant passive tree or simming to find out which stats scale the best for a virtually infinite amount of talent/gear configurations.
>>725342402There's genuinely no incentive for anyone to play a WoW clone if it has 10% of the player base. All of these GAAS games are fucked because they don't realize this model really only works for the first few games to use it. It's the same reason why if you make a twitter clone, nobody is going to use it.
>>725348681name a "WoW clone"you nigger WoWfags need to fuck off, you literally think every MMO is a fucking "WoW clone"
>>725343060Good example of the genre's death actually.>full focus on "engagement metrics" aka daily chores>gradual removal of MMO aspects> marketed exclusively towards the mentally ill aka pedo coomers>nosediving player numbers yet no attempts to salvage the situation, milking the few remaining retards throught coom microtransactions instead
>>725345984it's weird that you'd say that and then post that image. It's hard to imagine a puritan tranny who hates porn yet here you are.
>>725347623that's basically fortnite
>>725346048This person must have no self awareness if he doesn't realize that people aren't talking to him because he's acting that way.
>>725348730>name a "WoW clone"Ragnarok Online 2It was a hastily remade version of the prototype RO2 that failed miserably and was scrapped before launch.It was quite literally WoW with a card system attached to it.
>>725348608If the game requires hundreds of hours to fiddle with stats for a "tree" then it was clearly designed to waste your time. A decent game will allow you to build your character through just trial and error rather than completely gimping yourself if you selected 1 wrong node.Hell even Nioh is a better game for this shit, and you can figure out a build idea within an hour of playing.
>>725348730Runes of Magic, Rift and FF14 2.0 say hello.
>>725348730Most are, it would be harder to name a semi-recent MMO that isn't a WoW clone.
>>725348756Wait, that's wrong tho?I'm pretty sure Tera stayed alive for so long because they focused on the elin players, which they then expended to other female races (and 1 male race for gunner and that one with gauntlet iirc?) Bluehole had lost most of it working force by then, and were already split by working on that one BR game I forgot the name that got popular but completely dead now and only started to reinveste in Tera 2Though IIRC there's no Elin in that one, so it will probaably flop too lmao
>>725348871Yea but the reason getting loot feels so good is because the games have all these autistic systems, you won't ever get any satisfying loot drops in Nioh as you would in PoE, it's just too simple.
>>725348935>>725348921>>725348843>literally who-tier MMOslmaoalsoCalling Ragnarok Online 2 a “WoW clone” just shows you don’t know what you’re talking about. RO2 came from Ragnarok Online, not World of Warcraft. It kept its own anime style, class system, and card mechanics. Just because it added modern MMO features doesn’t make it a clone.Notice how all the surviving MMOs today are not fucking WoW clones?>Runescape>Maplestory>EVE>Albion>New World (LMAO RIP)>T&L>GW2>Dofus/Wakfu>FFXIV>BDO>DFO
>>725348921>Runes of MagicMulti classing was pretty sick though
>>725342402Simple answer is investor money moved onto other cash cows.More complex answer is >>725348681 mixed with the inherit design challenges of MMORPGs. New players are the lifeblood of any game yet vets are the paypigs the devs need to court, and it's practically impossible to design content that fulfills both due to the hard-leveled nature of the genre.
>>725348946>stayed aliveThe bulk of the players already quit and the obvious focus on the loli race above anything else made even more people leave.As it turns out most people want to play a game, not a softcore pedo porn similator.You're also forgetting how they raped the game's main original selling point (its fluid combat) in favor of mindless power slop where you pop a powerful cooldown and delete the enemy, then wait for it to come back up.
>>725349131>>>FFXIV>Not a WoW clone?????
>>725349159But that's fundamentally wrong.
>>725349131>New World>T&L>GW2>FFXIV>BDO>not WoW clonesYou're an odd one
>>725349131>anon says no incentive to play wow clones because they're unpopular>"name a WoW clone">many get listed>"these aren't popular at all!"Are you an idiot or just a wowtard?
>>725348756>nosediving player numbers yet no attempts to salvage the situationNo, their attempts to "salvage" the situation was exactly what killed the game. Making all gameplay and the whole huge world optional and skippable to let newfags straight to the "endgame", which was then just an endless, aimless, plotless mat farm. What about when they get sick of that? Add new bling-bling-wahoo classes that obliterate game balance and hope the flashing lights keep the zoomers entertained for the next 15 minutes. Wow, that didn't last long either
>>725349131>Calling Ragnarok Online 2 a “WoW clone” just shows you don’t know what you’re talking about.You clearly never played it. Or the soulful original RO2 that never left beta testing that actually felt like its own unique game and systems. The shit they shipped out was tab target hotkeyslop, there was nothing reminiscent about the original RO aside from job and monster names and if that was all it took to make a successful sequel then boy fucking howdy Gravity is the most successful game company in the world, right?>RO2 came from Ragnarok Online, not World of Warcraft. Nevermind you are the dumbest fucker i've seen today, congrats.
>>725349290none of these games are WoW clonesit's just classic WoWfaggotry claiming everything is WoW
im lowkey excited for RO3 because I think it combines modernization with the original RO aesthetic and designthe monetization will probably kill it or some dumb dev handling like failing to handle a game breaking bug/balance
>>725349290Most WoW players are this retarded, haven't you learned?>>725349059So if the game has a shit convoluted system that you look up a guide for, but get 1 random cool drop, it's good, but a well thought out system with decent gear that doesn't instantly tick your box is simple? Are you joking? Getting that properly rolled item in Nioh to flesh out your build feels way better than the bullshit clown RNG that is POE and the like.
>>725349343>runes of magic>not a wow cloneOkay bud.
Can't wait for the next wow clone in 10 days
>>725349395>im lowkey excited for RO3 Is this before or after you learned about the autobattle system and hilariously awful cash shop because its a mobile game too
>>725348429They're getting rid of the Treasure Gocha thing in RS3. They had players vote to remove it
>>725349290>Are you an idiot or just a wowtard?What's the difference?
>>725349506I dont care about autobattle i think it's fineonly problem is how shit monetization will be and how it affects f2ps or how important it is to spend $15 a month for a full experience
>>725349523Yeah but if you read the actual article they posted you can still buy bonus XP. It's been poisoned beyond repair, and removing the cash shop isn't going to bring over the OSRS players, it's just going to shut off the cash-flow from the retards who were funding OSRS.
>>725349504>Because Pigeons were more popular than the cool Asmos, they decided to turn Asmodians into Elyos in Aion2I hate this so fucking much
>>725349624I'm be honest, I thought they removed the faction system in Aion 2 because they all look like Elyos>mfw these are the two factions
I think the casual player base discovered their needs were better met by single-player and co-op RPGs. The idea of MMORPGs was enchanting, but it inevitably devolves into ceaseless endgame grind which isn't the roleplaying experience most players are looking for. Everything becomes a gaudy rave party with none of the charm of low level adventuring.
>>725349446Why do I only get 1 random cool drop? That's a weird way to make it seem like you have a point. I get lots of drops and most of them are more interesting than the tacked on gear system in Nioh. PoE has a shitton of potential builds and thus a shitton of different gear to aquire, this makes it more interesting to see which items you get and what you can make with them.
>>725347642You are correct, despite being grind-heavy Korean MMOs had amazing OST, Talesweaver, Fly For Fun, Maplestory, Grand Chase, Ragnarok Online. I miss them, but I know if I'll play them again, the sensation won't be the same.
>>725349324Those were attempts to keep the pedo coomers. Those people don't want to play, they want to dress their lolis up, coom and log out. Streamlining gameplay was precisely what was needed to have them stay, more so with the tanked population which spells the death of any actual MMO as the game's core systems cannot be sustained anymore.>bing bing wahoo classesYour average potential new player checked the game out, saw that for some reason the little girl race is getting all the new classes and content, checked the cash shop, quickly connected the dots and never bothered trying the game out. If he did try, he was probably sexually harassed by some Elin in a swimsuit trying to kickstart faggot ERP. The remaining playerbase was mentally ill.They did their utmost to milk the corpse for as long as possible, they never tried to revitalize the game.
>>725349723They didn't, like I said they just turned Asmos into Elyos because KR cunts never liked how Asmo looked with their cool mane, red eyes and claws so in every servers the pigeons were always winning.Their solution was to erase what made Asmodian cool and just turn them into Elyos.
Its hilarious watching people with some deep seated grudge completely fabricate the average user experience for a game he can't even accurately describe how it played.
>>725349915if you've played WoW, you've played all other MMOs
I wasn't talking about you.
>>725349395Have you actually watched any video? The combat and overall mechanics are the dumbest, most simplistic and pointless mobile slop you can imagine. It has nothing to do with the original game or a MMO at all.
Is Guild Wars 2 good?
>>725349992it looks fucking great
>Aion 2Literally the slop to end all slops. The game isn't even out yet and it's already marketed exclusively towards KPOP addicted zoomers. They even filled the beta with retarded gook cosmetics already.I liked the original game so this shit is painful to watch unfold.
>>725350132You're fucking retarded then.
>>725349343Remember GW1? It was its own thing with an unique skill/class system, hub town with expeditions type game. Then they made GW2 and gave it classes like WoW, an open world like WoW, quests like WoW.>but it isn't a WoW clone because it handles its progression slightly differentlyno
>>725349958NTA but 10/10 rage bait, you got me.
>>725342402They forgot the "RPG" part, and it turns out that part is rather important.
>>725349131>That list>Not WoW clonesWow I haven't read something this retarded in a while
>>725350238>implying GW2 is a WoW clone
>>725350353>implying GW2 isn't a WoW clone
>>725342402MMOs were always carried by the social aspect. They were fun when video games were mostly weirdos, losers, and nerds. MMOs were played by them are served as little worlds said people could come together and explore together. This made them fun. As video games got popular normalfags invaded and MMOs too became infested. Because the people playing MMOs were boring so too did MMOs become boring.
>>725350190We forgot the hidden variable for the death of MMOs: people with actual shit taste.
>>725350428WoWfags are so delusional.
>>725342784That cute girl on the left wants to be raped so bad
>>725350448You could say that to the internet in general to be honest...
>>725350539At least my delusions are true
>>725350138>kmmo targets korean audiencewow. such insight.
>>725346778I have another fix for you that it guarantees actual results. Stop using social media.
>>725348285AI can do that
BDO isn't a WoW clone. BDO after release was a L2 inspired game. Current BDO is something of its own.
>>725349328At least Japanese devs don't kill their products like their east asian brothers and sisters
>>725349504Me on the right
>>725348429Then how about you....just stop playing it?
>>725351274Gravity is korean.Now if we want to talk about japanese devs prematurely killing things...
>>725351325I'm kinda trying, but I relapse from time to time.Also, one of my biggest regret as a MMO player was to not learn English earlier and play early Mabinogi on the NA server, instead of wasting me time (and money) on EU Flyff...
I would be all over the new Ragnarok Online 3 if those bitches made it available in Europe. But it's a pretty bad sign in regards to how they're going to monetise the game since they skip the entirety of Europe so they don't have to abide by insane gambling rules and shit like that.I was so fucking hyped... I've waited so long for this and then they skip us. Fuck it all man.https://youtu.be/n8PqmhQBHzc?si=nfFexA748lv__-0K
>>725342402Players accepted worse and worse monetization and cash shop schemes, to the point where the games themselves became secondary.They also demanded the games to become easier and easier, until they became little more than clickers.They also lashed out against any form of competition or griefing, so now these games have no form of negative interaction whatsoever, until they were more like single player games with shared chatrooms and markets.MMOs are dead because the people who played them killed them.
people have no money/timesense of adventure/exploration gone when a dozen wikis to minmax are active before the game launchesonline space filled with normies who just want to shit on other people for their fun and not actually enjoy the game
>>725348285there's a singleplayer WoW project that's exactly that
Shit is dire even with KMMOs.I recently tried one called Raven 2 or some shit and you literally don't even have to play it. The game plays itself while you roll for pets and outfits in the store. It's fucked
>>725351771Are you sure you didn't just play some mobile game that has a pc client?
>Playing Spiritvale because i'm tired of private RO servers being jews or getting shut down>Farm while bumping into people in different zones>Never once feel like i need a server pop of 5,000 to feel "alive"
>>725342740>true action combat mmos have never been tried before!!
>>725351771Never heard of it but I know that every phone MMO is like that. These games have built-in bots so that you only have to come online once a day to collect rewards. They functionally no different from a gacha or an idle clicker.
>>725348429The only people who still play XIV are japanese and troons
>>725348285Erenshor.
>>725348285Erenshor is exactly that, with a mod to multiplayer up to 4 people
>>725352153erenshor looks lame, it still needs to have some visual appealpretty sure these guys come out of some stock asset pack
>>725351687The games were ALWAYS secondary. They were chat rooms that had games attached from the get go. The only thing that actually changed were the people playing them.
>>725342402they stopped forcing you to group grind for exp to level up your character in the same spot with downtime to allow for chatting with strangers.
>Blue Protocol is not a heaping pile of dogshit>Gacha is surprisingly not imba as fuck>Slightly worse live action combat than Tera, but still funThe forcing people to group up to do the end game content is pretty hilarious when you see the casuals and the sweats fight in global chat about accessibility
>>725352283That's not true at all.
>>725352283the games changed because they streamlined those chatrooms out of them.You dont need those chatrooms when you are solo quest grindingYou dont need those chatrooms when you are third party chatting with people you already know.MMOs were based on joining pugs to grind to level up. Thats what gave them their community.
>>725347867Lineage II and Ragnarok Online have many times more players across their private servers than what the entire gook gaming industry manages to pull nowadays.
why did you die inside?
>>725352339Tell me anon, would you play any of these games if they weren't multiplayer? If you were just plopped down in a world and maybe had bots for party members? No one to talk to, no socializing, just utter silence? I sure as fuck wouldn't. The actual gameplay of basically every MMO is total ass.
>>725352236yeah.playing the demo though really does feel like a magical mmo experience howeveri wish they would remove mandatory beards from males
so are you fags going to play on the wakfu server when it comes out on the 12th
>>725351523>6 skills>mobile trash combat>zero mechanics>no element system>no size system>no cards (?)>no actual character buildinglmao
>>725352457I definitely wouldn't play if they weren't multiplayer because that was the point and appeal of them.My MMO background is mostly Ragnarok Online and the gameplay is solid. It was based on a single player game that came before it, and they later made single player offline ports of it.What I like about MMOs is the competition aspect of it, specially PvP but also playing the market and direct trades. I wouldn't have played these game for tens of thousands of hours if they didn't have other people, but I would still have played them.
Good times.
>>725342402It was novel playing online with many real life people at once, working towards a goal together. Internet was fresh, and gaming was getting better. White nerd men created games they enjoyed, and it was enjoyed by other white nerd men. You had to be there.>fast forward todayyou already know wtf is going on
>>725352846gook grindan
>>725343545This is my Voidwalker. circa 2005.
>>725342621wow not dying didn't stifle innovation. the limitations of the format stifles innovation, and wow did the best possible dance with those limitations.
>>725352110There's a still a few amount of old grown men like me playing it but man, don't I feel outnumbered sometimes.>Working on the mentor roulette achievement (you need to do it 2000 times to get a mount, mentor roulette basically queue you to virtually every content in the game as long as there's a new player in it)>Greet people with a "Good evening fellas">Some catgirl reply with "am girl">Jokingly reply with a "Oh I see, a "Guy In Real Life" right? Undertstood">They lose their shit, calling me a jerk and telling me that they will report me>MfwI miss the old internet...
>>725351942>mobile game that has a pc client?That's all of them now.
They just need to fire anyone that tells them to make characters ugly and it would be a renaissance in the industry. The reason FFXIV dd so well is because the amount of cute girls in it. It's not porn. Just lots of cute catgirls and au ra and potatoes in outfits that are at-most a little skimpy. No fatties, bulldykes, or political soapboxing. Then Dawntrail happened. They took one of the few prized character race slots and made it the ugliest fucking female race to ever exist in an MMO. I have yet to see a single player use them in-game. Imagine how much Dawntrail would have been redeemed if they added fairies or some shit instead of tranny-man-bear-cats. I guarantee they wouldn't have lost 50% of the players they just did.
Lack of innovation. Create more Eve Onlines and less generic WoW clones.
>>725354075It was that, and the terrible voice acting from the character (that got a large amount of screen time), and the terrible writing of the plot in general. A triple whammy. Since the game is very story focused, people got pissed. You went from Shadowbringers and Endwalker to this. To be honest I feel like real Sphene is a much better character than Wuk Lamat, but she was introduced only last patch. It feels like they were trying to make Wuk Lamat into the Naruto of the story, there's a lot of similarities. But the thing is, the player character is the main character, so you're going to have to make the NPC "main character" a lot more likeable than they did to make people give a shit. Instead, they had the opposite reaction. Or... you could just keep the player character as the main focus. That's easier.
>>725352236>pretty sure these guys come out of some stock asset packYeah its some unreal asset package. Hundreds of games use them. Some are alright though, like soulstone survivors.But still its pretty offputting
>>725352114>>725352153This Anon literally spoke my mind >>725352236I kind of want something more like .hack IMOQ or in the style of Flyff and Seal Online (pic related).Low poly and cell shaded.
How does shit like Aura Kingdom, alchemia stories, Wurm Online or literally any game from Worst MMO ever stay online when there are pretty much no players but something like the OG Blue Protocol, New World or Maple Story 2 get taken offline when the player base was small not dead?It just seems so weird how Amazon can't afford to keep a game with 10K players alive for another 2 years when Wurm Online probably hasn't had a single player in 2 years is able to keep the lights on
>>725354075Sex sells. Always has. Always will. One of the discord trannies will jump in and start screaming about gooners because cute girls are like kryptonite to them, but the phrase "sex sells" is inherently about sex itself, just tapping into our desire to see cute girls.
>>725354256Well, yeah. But if they'd simply swapped Sphene and Wuk Lumat's roles, no one would have cared that they were the main character. What made the whole thing so repulsive is that Wuk Lamat was just incredibly unlikeable on every front. No one would have cared if a good looking, likeable character like Nu-Sphene was the 'main character' for the expansion.
>>725354913Coom alone isn't enough to keep a game afloat, much less make it evolve. You need a solid system underneath that layer of coom.
>>725354891These games are super duper dirt cheap to keep running compared to newer MMOs, that's probably why.
>>725343171There's nothing interesting about BD apart from the PvPFarm braindead mobs all day erry day and do mindless fetch quests. I just installed nude mods and had a fap and uninstalled
>>725355273That's false though. AGS runs their games on pajeets, AI and life support. Hosting itself isn't expensive either. Companies just unplug the game once the CEOs realize they still had that shit running without generating any actual money.Meanwhile you have shit like private servers of a 25 years old game still being maintained and developed for despite the server having only 1 player for a decade and being a net drain on the wallet simply because the autistic owner likes the game.
I'm kinda tempted to try Flyff Universe but does anyone know if it's as P2W as old Flyff?Like, do I have to buy with real money scrolls to not have my gear and accessories break when trying to upgrade them?I remember having to pay hundreds of dollars to have a full set +10 back then, I don't want to do that ever again...
>>725344171It's because trends are so fucking fast now10 years ago I was baffled by Koreans embracing a trend and dropping it in two weeks, now the same thing is global
>>725355380I actually really enjoyed the living world they made. Genuinely the only MMO I have ever played where cities and towns felt livable. NPCs on the road is a nice touch too.Finding military outposts actually manned by full garrisons instead of six guards.I know its contentious, but the combat felt nice too, and I enjoyed the life skilling, for the most part.Really, overall it could have been great were it not for the shitty korea-nisms that infested it, like PVP focus, grinding insanity and gear insanity
>>725355447Most private servers do away with shit monetization strategies usually. If it doesn't then it tends to not keep a playerbase.If it does, find another pserverIf there isn't one, well shit
>>725355580>Most private servers do away with shit monetization strategies usually. If it doesn't then it tends to not keep a playerbaseUntrue actually. The biggest private servers are the most low-effort, P2W ridden shitholes ran by sociopaths while actually good servers ran by caring people and with very tame monetization tend to be empty.In the end most players actually seem to enjoy P2W and braindead content and the state of modern "MMOs" just confirms that.
>>725342402cause relying on 7 other niggers to not fuck up the boss fight isnt fun and neither is spending 20 hours on a boss fight tuned to be extremely tight that you could clear if you didnt have to rely on 7 other faggots also having a "perfect" fight at the same time as you. nor is spending an additional 3 hours a week reclearing that 20 hour fight fun cause yoshitpiss needs you to stay subbed for another 3 months
>>725355235Cute girls will make a good game a great game. That's the point. A turd will always be a turd.
>>725352457honestly kinda agree. old school maple is coming out soon and all the tards are talking about how excited they are for a game where the core gameplay loop was to grind for 20+ hours to level once. boss fights were holding down the attack button with the occasional potion check. buttttt one thing MMOs also do well is that progression is extremely protracted so that you really feel like you're building your character up over time. a single player game doesnt have that cause 40 hours and you've beaten all there is to beat
>>725348361Sounds like your average survival game. SWG housing is also similar to Rust/Conan Exiles/etc. base building. Why don't hardcore MMORPG fags just go play survival games? Or does it need to have MMO in it to attract all the flies?
>>725348502RS3 is doing the unthinkable and actually walking back some of its monetization, treasure hunter just got voted by players to be removed
>>725343060AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAI WANT TO GO BACK
>>725357949Dude it's been like a decade. It's time to grow up and stop being a coomer pedophile.
>>725357949The small time I had with Tera Classic was fun.
>>725342402Dropped lost ark the moment amazon decided to censor artist. They never learn. They are actually retarded and serves them rgiht that the game is fucking dead in the west.
>>725343060>>725357949>>725358059>>725358065https://www.invenglobal.com/articles/19535/krafton-greenlights-tera-2
>>725358251Don't give me hope anon. TERA 2 could never achieve its potential in the current industry. This will just bury the IP for good
>>725354913you don't even really need to say sex sells, just attractive characters sellgo look at any actual women playing any game with a custom character, i guarantee 99% will also be focusing on making their character attractive as well, basically no-one wants to play as an actual serious ugly character
>>725358251I heard about this but I don't have any interest until I see hard confirmation of Elins.
>>725358251>modern gook mmo from the creators of old, failed gook mmo>gacha systems, p2w, daily/weekly chores as the only gameplay loop because that's all they can do now>guaranteed to lose most its playerbase within two months>won't appeal to coomer pedos either because korea today is pretty puritan so lolis are off the table>most you'll get is softcore kpop plastic dollsabsolute DOA
According to PvP: CasualizationAccording to PvE: PvP
>>725358451the focus on elin is what led to the game's death
>>725358251>krafton
>>725359069>According to PVP: PVP>According to PVE: PVPPVPFags really are cancer
>>725359221Which, as I understand, is the same thing as Bluehole Studios was.
I think the whole genre just lost its novelty as whole really, it used to be chatrooms with graphics and some obtuse varying gameplay but seeing so many people in a single space was novel back then it was magical, for many people it was the first they were interacting with stranger from all over the country and even world but time progessed, chatrooms are not novel anymore, neither is seeing 100+ players at the same time, the obtuse gameplay got streamlined further and further which isn't necessarily all bad (less elitist faggots hoarding knowledge and being absolute exploiting shits about it ect.) but that made it certainly lose some "magic", also mmos probably suffer the most from the "players will optimize the fun out of the game" problem. All that plus the current retarded investor system thats raping everything under the sun stiffling innovation and only going for "safe" projects have stagnated this genre which used to be one of the more experimental out there.I think mmos are currently just in limbo, wait for the industry (potentially the entire world economy) crash and then maybe we'll get something interesting again.
>>725354075Youre a tranny desperate to self insert if you like xivEspecially pretending like the au ra dont have FAS face
>WoW has more players than ever>More alive MMORPGs than ever before>"t-the genre is dying!"!
>>725359160The focus on elin is the only thing that stopped it from dying sooner.
>>725359495theres less experimentation because we already know what works, thats the end result of 20 years of experimenting
>>725359682retard
>>725359682Elin pantsu definitely bought it an extra 2 years or so
>>725349268In what way is BDO in any way a WoW clone, you need to elaborate right now.
>>725359796Extra 2 years of what? The game was a veritable ghost town with only a bunch of brainrotted fag coomers trying to ERP with each other.
>>725359829In the World of BDO you wage War and Craft.
>>725359790The game would have died right around the time it went f2p without elin. It's quite literally the only reason it was alive.
>>725359682>cater your game to pedophiles>normal people leave>pedos don't bring in enough to keep the game afloat>EoSyeah bro, they totally saved the game
>>725359553>WoW has more players than everWhat? I never was able to capture its wotlk back, only for a brief moment with WoD before everyone left because of server problems and the game being shit down to the lowest its ever been>More alive MMORPGs than ever beforeDebatable, there are so many gacha "mmos" that just run on phones with the occasional pc client that literally auto play themselves, a lot of them pure pump and dumps running for only a couple of years before shut down (people weren't gacha'ing enough) and replaced by another one that "plays" the same but just looks slighly different>"t-the genre is dying!"!Its not dying, its dead.
>>725342402Toontown is thriving.
>>725342402Can't talk much about other MMOs but FFXIV died cause they kept re-skinning the same content over and over again. People finally cottoned on.
>>725359947You can't argue with pedos, they literally suffer from brain damage.
>>725342402Im tired of games with daily chores or checklists.
>>725342402Everybody thought WoW got the core design right and copied it. Turns out WoWs success had virtually nothing to do with the game itself and every decision they made when designing it was fundamentally flawed.
people got bored of the rehashed concept loops. its going to take another leap in tech generation, something next level immersion to make a resurgence again.
>>725360365WoW's core design included the smooth combat with distinct animations, effects and sounds as well as clean and customizable UI that allowed you to keep track of what's going on yet all the games which tried to copy it completely missed the mark when it comes to those things and only copied the bad parts of it.
>>725360576>smooth combatIts so hard to convey to someone just how smooth the game played for its time if they never played in 2004Competition at this time was EQ, AO, DAoC, UO, LineageNone of these games were as smooth and polished in its gameplay
>>725361142Never played WoW to this day, but Lineage 2 felt smooth to me.
>>725342402Replaced by live service gacha games
>>725360365>Turns out WoWs success had virtually nothing to do with the game itselfThe reason it got popular was because:>could run on potato PCs during that time>was super cartoony, colorful graphics that were appealing to kids and super casual/dumbed down>was advertised by mainstream media like Hollywood>Was THE kid game, I think the perfect example for WoW being popular is that it was the "Fortnite" back in the days. Childish game played mostly by kids
>>725360576>>725361142yeah just moving in wow feels very nice
>>725361391>>Was THE kid game, I think the perfect example for WoW being popular is that it was the "Fortnite" back in the days. Childish game played mostly by kidsFunny, recently I had some yapping video about WoWs decline in the background while I worked and one of the points was how ito originally was a gritty WARcraft game and now is a dress-up for Disney adults.
>>725360576>>725361142UO was pretty smooth in 2004 unless you were still on dialup and had bad lag.>>725361391WoW was successful because it combined grinding (for levels or equipment) with the illusion of danger (unless you are playing hardcore, you don't lose much upon death). So people with no skill and no lives, but a lot of time, loved it. Contrast it with Ultima Online, where you could max out a character in a week or less. Then the rest of the time you were hunting monsters and doing other shit. And if you died (to a monster or another player), all of your equipment stayed with your corpse. So there was an actual element of danger, gamesense, and skill involved even in just what equipment you brought with you.That's the other thing: PVP. At launch, UO's PVP was basically unrestrained outside of towns. If you were hunting daemons or trying to tame a white wyrm, a PK could come along, kill you, and loot all your shit. The "consensual PVP" shit that I believe Everquest started and other games (including UO, unfortunately) copied made the games a lot less interesting.
>>725352236The assets are from the Synty store because the developer worked a day job and didn't have time to code/develop from scratch. He developed the game for four years before EA release and it did well enough for him to quit his day job (for now.)The game is still a fully-fleshed world with many zones to explore.>>725352479>i wish they would remove mandatory beards from malesThat will be included with tomorrow's patch along with a new zone and dungeon.
>>725342665It's ironic how some people complain about MMOs not being a constant hamster wheel making it virtually a 2nd job.
Desu I feel like the main problem is that there just isn’t enough overlap in>Fun gameplay>Immersive environment and atmosphere>Doesn't feel like pulling out teeth to play>Good support for a community and socialisingSomething like WoW you can immerse yourself in but the gameplay is ass. Destiny has fun gameplay but beyond just shooting shit there isn’t much else to do so you can’t really “RP” and there isn’t any social elements to it really. FFXIV has great social elements but trying to grind through the game is such a tedious fucking chore it just makes you not want to bother.There just doesnt seem to be any MMO’s that hit all those criteria, so it always feels like they come up short, and like why bother playing a half baked MMO? Maybe I’m just a retard though, but I’ve always found it hard to get into MMO’s cause they never give off the vibe of being something like SAO
>>725349131Good list but FF14 is a WoW clone.
>>725365789>Something like WoW you can immerse yourself in but the gameplay is ass.retarded gook
>>725349131>Evedead>Albiondead>New worldlol>T&LLMAO>GW2dead>dofusgiga dead stop listening to coomers>XIV dying + the most blatant wow clone>BDO>DFOidk gookshit, white people dont play those games
>>725366174>everything I don't like is dead
>>725366174>claims to not know gookshit>but skipped over maplestorylol this entire post sounded better in your head :\
>>725366174>GW2>deadWait, really? A new expansion came out few days ago. And it seems to be where New World people are going.
>>725342526I wonder where that "lots of reading" thing came from. The game barely had any quests or lengthy texts to read and any time you talked to an NPC it was succinct.>>725348361It was the most popular MMO before WoW came out. I know you probably think it was a boomer MMO but a lot of young teenagers like myself played it and enjoyed it a lot.
>>725342402>Why did the MMO genre die?all end up in "kill god" quests at the end
>>725366259and Everquest also gets new expansionsgame is still dead, a couple deranged paypigs dont make a playerbase
MMOは誰かが言ってた「人生捨てたクソ廃人が神の如く闊歩する世界」って聞いて手を出してないな
They started to be designed around the friendless losers who wanted to solo all content because using LFG was too hard for themNo, I don't want to beat 99% of an 80+ hour games content to fight the singular encounter designed for teams in this supposedly teamwork oriented genre
>>725342402discord, trannies, and discord trannies
>>725342402>Why did the MMO genre die?Socializing only happens when you force people do to it. If you provide alternatives of getting what they want, they do not cooperate. Artistotle was a fucking idiot on this, humans aren't social animals, they are social if they need each other.No social connections/friendships made = less reasons to log back inGiving people fast and easy loot removes the investment, which means they are less likely to care about the game because everything was easily gained.Hiring idiots to write for the bazinga/netflix/morning semen milking farm audience = you lose the male audience.Hiring idiots to "localize" aka censor it for colored armpit hair social media monkeys means the game loses all the appeal = you lose the actual audience.The point is that if you pander to locust type players, you will get locust type MAUs and once they get another shiny digital toy to play with, your game gets forgotten. MMORPGS are about a marathon more than a sprint, and if you build your game around people who don't play games, you will get what you fucking deserve, i.e. people not playing your game.
>>725366118But anon I’m not Chinese
>>725342402I don’t know if anyone said it before but the thread is too long to read through. MMOs were glorified chats. You would spend most of the time running around doing nothing while chatting with guildies. Discord is what MMOs used to be
always online games have this retarded mentallity where they need like 3000 people (or more) playing the game at all times otherwise the game gets killed
>>725363232>If you were hunting daemons or trying to tame a white wyrm, a PK could come along, kill you, and loot all your shitAre there any MMO’s that still do shit like this or not really?
>>725342402it's purely a demographics issue. the number of people, as in humans on earth, under the age of 30 peaked this year at about 3 billion and is now decreasing.new things don't happen without what we used to have, which was a flood of ever increasing amounts of new people showing up and looking for new stuff to do. if instead we have decreasing amounts of people and every game is fighting over a smaller and smaller pie, because all of the people who are already around already know what they like and will play that thing they already found 20 years ago again tonight just like they have for the last 20 years, then the incentive to try and make something new and cool to capture that ever available new audience that flooding into the scene... is gone. Because that audience isn't there anymore. humanity is shrinkingthis is what happens when you have an inverted pyramid for demographics and a decreasing population. less people making stuff, less people consuming stuff, less people in each subculture, less people playing each game. the increasing amount of people in their 80s and 90s doesn't mean anything, most of those people are half-vegetable already and can barely tie their shoes or feed themselvesless people around just means less stuff for everyone, and more dead games, and more dead genres, and more dead subcultures
>>725367229nobody gives a fuck about story or writing in an MMO fag
>>725367723I doif you want me to live in your world, don't make it retarded
>>725367723there's nothing else to care about thoughdo you want people to care about mashing the skills on a hotbar when they come off cooldown? there's no fucking way that's meant to be the draw, that shit is lame as all fuck
>>725367723>I don't care so nobody caresliteral low intelligence
>>725367896>gameplay in my video game? who caresholy fuck go back
>>725367952"""""gameplay"""""
>>725342402Social media.
>>725342402god this kind of dancing is horrible kill all americans who support this
>>725367530I don't think so. Most PVP in MMOs seems to be fully "consensual" where you have to agree to a duel.UO did it in an interesting way>Felucca was the original game where PVP was pretty much free for all (including ganks, stealing, pks, etc)>Trammel came along which was an exact copy but you couldn't PVP at all>you could switch back and forth, but most people just stayed in TrammelI think some monsters/events were Felucca only but most people just stayed in Trammel because it was safer for normies. I don't know if any MMOs have a similar system (if you opt in, you can get better stuff but at higher risk from other players)
>>725367972kys retard
>>725368249keep mashing your hotbar skills then, try not to get too much drool over yourself as your brain atrophies to nothing
>want to play Blue Protocol with friend>find out it's region lockedWhat MMO can I play with my SEA buddy?
>>725342402We're they that social in times past. I started playing ff14 this summer to try and make some friends but the game is so unsocial and cliqe'y, I don't even know how to join a FC. I just started treating the game like a single player novel.
>>725368337>I hate videogames>posts on a videogame board
>>725342402They were only popular from a developer perspective because they were once the only alternative form of monetization outside boxed sales gamers tolerated, so the potential revenue stream was worth the huge risk. In an era where gamers tolerate micro and macro transactions in single player offline games they're no longer needed
>>725349324It was clear from all the female locked classes (mostly including the pedo race) they added later on they were no longer interested in keeping MMO players, they wanted to cater to the mentally ill coomers who wanted to play dress up and ERP
>>725349131>ctrl+F Mabinogi>0 I still play mabinogi (Mostly) daily but im starting to ween off from it, though i just play single player games, no other mmo had that itch mabinogi had, and i though i was a loyal final fantasy fan to play online. Well i played both, still have the CD for it, Maplestory always had this air of look at big number on screen and watch everything wipe on map. I just keep coming back to mabinogi one in a while. really hope project eternity comes sooner rather than later
>>725366174What the fuck does "dead" mean to you?
Albion is fun.PvP sandbox > PvE themepark.
>>725342402They didn't.
Discord
>>725373649I'm tired of mobile games trying to pretend to be PC MMOs
>>725342402>Explore the world, you're a special heroooo!1!!And then you enter the game, nothing you do really matter and there are 1000 copies of your character and your class in this server alone.Not to mention autists/no-lifers that use the game achievements to fill the void of real life hyperoptimize everything, treat it as a job and suck the fun out of everything.This is why I never bothered playing MMOs after middle school. They are inferior and watered down experiences at the core.
>>725373649Where Winds Meet is single player and co-op. Not a MMORPG in any way.
>>725373420Albion fucked up badly by making it a full loot game while at the same time making gear important, costly and time-consuming to acquire which just crippled the whole PvP experience and made people not want to engage.It also fucked up by making smaller guilds pure fodder that could get bullied by a zerg any time and have months of their collective progression erased instantly. Not to mention all the zone and content gatekeeping done by zergs.
>>725374541You sound like you haven't played in 5+ years.
>>725342784Private server any time now...
>>725375891I looked into trying to help the Wizardry Online preservation project or whatever but the people running it are gigantic faggots
>>725375702Yeah but who cares when that's how the game played originally, which made most people quit and never bother with it again. Whatever skeleton they may have now is irrelevant because they missed their chance.
>>725342402You know what would explode in popularity starting a trend but nobody will do it due to regional laws and initial backlash from people that don't play games? A porn MMO, particularly with the Korean MMO aesthetic. People already roleplay in mmos imagine if the game itself didn't hold you back from being a whore with other players.
>>72534240298% of MMORPGs were either predatory with their p2w garbage or DoA. They died because devs killed it, hence why no one except retards keep playing them. Why do you think 15-20year old MMORPGs are still the ones at the top in the west? (WoW, FF14 and GW2)The genre is fucking shitshow.
>>725342526>implying /v/ is hardcorey'all niggas refuse to play pvp mmos citing "le comfy" as an excuse lmao, you are exactly like the people you condemn
>>725376495They tried that. Twice. Check out Scarlet Blade and Kabod Online. Didn't work out quite so well for them.
>>725359221>greenlightsah yes can't wait to hear more in 15 years when its a beta in korea
>>725376665I imagine anon wanted full on second life rape mechanics in gameplay loop, not just tits and ass uncensored.
>MMOs are dyingThen why is FFXI exploding in population?Having to lock servers because they're too populated, and they just announced in the recent live letter that they finally got the budget to basically restart full development of the game, and rework the backend to allow for the creation of new areas.It doesn't seem dead to me.
>>725376495Thats what basically FF14 was with mod support woth roughly half of all active players using mods
>>725376641>join our soulless zerg with mandatory 4am ctaFuck off honestly. BnS was on the right track with heavy emphasis on single and small team combat in arenas and faction clothing flagging you for pvp in overworld, but ncsoft are retards and neo proved it once again.
>>725376989>mandatorylol
>>725376907>and they just announced in the recent live letter that they finally got the budget to basically restart full development of the game, and rework the backend to allow for the creation of new areas.Source? Don't give me that hope, don't you fucking give me false hope
>>725342402jews ruined it
>>725376907>they just announced in the recent live letter that they finally got the budget to basically restart full development of the game, and rework the backend to allow for the creation of new areas.I swear, if you're lying right now I'm going to explode.
>>725377260This is me >>725377101 I'm so scared that he's lying that I don't want to search for the news myself. Please find it bro, is it true?
I wish WoW wasn't the only MMO to try to make an actual fantasy setting, every other fucking MMO is just a dogshit low fantasy setting with humans or at BEST elves and dwarves, but even that shit is rare nowadays.
>>725342402subsciption/spyware online only sucks anus
>>725348429ok fella your turn to design a raid boss that isn't simon says but still has mechanics synchronized to music, a general focus on presentation, and is pretty much on a 2D arena
How do I into Runescape?
How come Korean Unreal asset flip MMOs can survive years with these numbers >>725343516 but New World, a game made in its own engine with no p2w and no fomo, gets put on maintenance mode with 40k concurrent players?
>>725378639Because gooks do combat better. New world had boring, simple combat with zero variation and zero choices.
>>725378985Wrong
>>725378639I mean there's a multitude of reasons but one is that those korean mmos typically buy the cheapest possible server hosting.
>>725378639Because New World can survive with those numbers, but the people in charge demand greater success to continue pouring support into it. It's no different from gachas that are still profitable being shut down becauseit's not successful enough.
>>725378985Korean mmo combat is flashier but very shallow. only low iq retards get fooled by it
>>725376641the fuck even is this
>>725348843>that failed miserablygotw was never even given a chance it was shut down because they ran out of funding or whatever... had way more soul than the soulless anime inspired version
>>725379350Looks like Griftion Online
>>725378602Just play one of the many idle games on steam. It's essentially the same shit but without having to interact with runecape's deliberate time wasting design and you won't have to pay $12 a month either. RS isn't an MMO its just a bunch of addicts with stockholm syndrome sharing the same lifeless world.
>>725379127>no skills>normal chop and hard chop>pretend soulslop in a mmo (???)>>725379297NW combat is also shallow but the difference is that it's clunky and feels like shit while gooks can actually animate their shit properly so it simply feels good to play.
>>725342402i dunno, but someone kitted me up in stormwind and gave me some dosh, truly respectable. went back and spread the wealth around kharanos. truly a goated gamer moment. thank you again if you read this
>>725359790he is correctme and some friends played like a month or two before the shutdown was announcedplayerbase was like 95% elins
>>725348502RS3 just removed its most malicious MTX system and have implemented worlds without cosmetic overrides and paid cosmetics
>>725379363>gotwI remember jumping through hoops to play the Korean beta (getting a valid KSSN number and so on) and while the game was very rudimentary it had SOUL and was nice to look at. The second iteration was pure ugly slop in comparison, nothing redeemable about it.
>>725359947>>725359682>>725359160>>725358451Tera is a KMMO first and formost. After that giant lawsuit with NCsoft, they just want to kill it since like all KMMO, it only exist to generate money short term, enough to make another KMMO to replace it. Its just that Elin was the thing that prevent them from closing it early. They did do many shit to discourage players from playing TERA and when they finally did, they made another KMMO, which instantly died. Many Korean MMO dev turn to Gacha since its easier to just make Jpeg for a quick buck than to just make an entire world.
>>725379708>only a few pedo coomers remain>all sane people have quit>the little development that still happens goes into loli coom outfits>that means the game is alive and wellWhat kind of mental illness is this?
>>725342402The average player stopped being someone you could relate to.In the early 2000s, it was almost exclusively fellow nerds who just wanted to play a fucking videogame.Today? Subhumans everywhere. Gamerdads constantly going AFK, failed normalfaggots who can't stop talking about their real life because nobody they know can fucking put up with their constant blogging or, god forbid, The Third-Worlder.
>>725379840Yeah it's kinda interesting how I look so fondly back on the actual process of getting into the beta.. I remember the guide as much as the game itself. Bless the kind anons way back who made those guides
>>725380074You forgot the braindead zoomers who don't even have the ability to communicate like a human being and are seemingly retarded in all walks of life.
>>725379984the argument was that if they didn't have elins the game would have shut down years agothe game having elins is what kept it alive for longer than its due date
>>725356660>Why don't hardcore MMORPG fags just go play survival games?Maybe if you had actually played either of these genres you'd know why you stupid disingenuous niggerfaggot.
>>725343168it's insane how none of the new zones can hope to get even anywhere near your picrel in terms of sovl and comfynessI have never visited Loch Modan, spent all my time in Mulgore, Barrens, some Ashenvale, Tirisfal Glades, Horde stuff, yet seeing your pic makes me feel right at home, all the old zones have a distinctive look full of so much sovl looks like it might be Cataclysm not sure but Cata still had it
>>725380257>aliveThat's not being alive, that's forced zombification of something that should been put out of its misery instead of having its memory vandalized for people who actually liked the original game.
>>725380221Zoomers don't even play MMOs. They grew up in the era where having 20+ people in the same place was no longer an MMO gimmick, but something completely normal for every multiplayer game. MMOs simply do not have any point for them.
>>725379610Korean MMOs that call themselves action combat are really just hybrid at best, they feel snappier because mobs are just brainless hordes waiting for you to nuke them with anime beams while your character does stupid acrobatics, there's no reaction at all. New world feels 'clunkier' because it is actual action combat and npc enemies can displace and stagger you so you can't just mindlessly cast skills on them and expect them to just stand there and take it without being interrupted
>>725380350if you didnt play in the beta with the /v/ and /a/ guild wars your opinion doesn't matter, retard
>>725380390>Zoomers don't even play MMOsThey absolutely fucking do sadly. I tried Throne & Liberty which advertised itself as a mass open world PvP MMO and the playerbase was largely retarded zoomers doing zoomer things while banding together in zerg mega alliances to spam zoomer memes and act like apes.It was a sight to behold. Those subhumans are much worse than Brazilians.
>>725377260>>725377573https://www.ffxiah.com/forum/topic/58699/freshly-picked-71/
>>725345384but THIS ISNT THE POINTthe point is that nowadays when a patch releases nearly everything in it is solved and seen and documented already and the major stance in the community is to consume all that info and go into the patch with itthe spirit of mystery and exploration is GONE in comparison to what it used to be before, people just goofing off exploring a huge world>well then you can just not read the wowhead datamines and guidessolves fuck all when the entire game is made around this being the case, you don't find people out in the world exploring to play >le old wow style< with, it's everyone just rushing through everything to "get their dailies get their m+ get their gear rush rush rush"leveling is fucking dead you boot up the game and then you're told to rush through levels and all of the world just so you can get to "le endgame"
>>725380572>wondering about trying tera because I never did>check tera's private server /vm/ general for 4chan guild>literally everybody is an elin in a slutmog trying to erp you up like a massive faggot>they only pretend to play the game so they have the excuse to groom you because they "helped you"The game has always been an online asylum for the mentally ill.
What went wrong? I thought MMOtards want monthly fee in new MMOs like the retarded cucks they are?
>>725342402>Why did the MMO genre die?I dont quite understand what caused the shift in mentality but people in todays world are far more socially withdrawn than they were when MMO's were at their peak. Everyone today just wants to play by themselves and never interact with anybody, basically treating the mmo like a singleplayer game that they are occasionally forced to cooperate with others to tackle content, but even then they all just play silently and go their separate ways when the job is done. And then when you try and interact with people, everyone is a overly cautious weirdo who refuses to open up and makes everything awkward.
>>725380891>joining a 4chan anything in [current year]you only have yourself to blamethis site is not what it was 15 years ago
>>725380628I don't get it. They attempted to sunset the game at least twice after Seekers, yet it refuses to die.
>>725380628SOVL
>>725380628Like a phoenix from the flames
>hurr everyone plays mmo like singleplayer these daysbecause the only people who play MMOs are uncs in today's day and age, and niggas are too busy with jobs; no one wants to poopsock anymore and most MMOs still design actual hard content around poopsockingunemployed basement dwellers are too anti-social and usually sperg out at [literally anything] so no one wants to deal with them either
>>7253482231. all that shit is incredibly computationally expensive and time-consuming to develop, code, and polish2. it completely breaks down very, very quickly when exposed to a playerbase that will explore any and all possible ways they can find to get ahead of the curve and maximize returnsyou are much much more likely to find what you're looking for from single-player games
>>725381275The devs love the game.There was an interview with... Nomura I think? Where he said there are devs who have passed up raises and promotions just to keep working on XI.
>>725380921Literally no reason to play it over City of Heroes. It's worse in every way. They would literally have to pay people to play that shit. The sub is not the main problem.
>>725381275I think it's an ideological dissonance within those companies.Remember how Blizzard coped, seethed and farted at players saying they prefer the vanilla WoW over modern retail, going as far as having CMs talk shit to players, the whole "you think you do but you don't" thing and harassing vanilla private servers like Nostalrius despite repeatedly saying you will not release a vanilla server themselves so those private servers should be of no concern since they're not competing?Then they smelled money and did 180 on their stance only to release a much shittier version of vanilla which was worse than any random private server somehow.I assume those companies just don't want to admit that their modern product they put so much time and money into is simply not as fun and engaging as their first title which people still adore and go out of their way to play. They don't want to admit that most of the "lessons" they learned are wrong and that the direction they ended up taking with their games was erroneous.Simply put it's a bunch of untalented idiots sitting on the shoulders of giants.
>>725381275Aside from filtered zoomertrannys and wowfags, XI being the superior product, despite its age, has always been true. Of course they'd rather invest in a newer IP, but they realized that a new MMO requires too much capital investment, and bringing people back to XIV is a losing battle. XI costs relatively nothing to maintain and develop for.
>>725381740>b-but ITS DIFFERENT! W-we HAVE COX, a GAME THAT DYING!Monthly fee is cuckshit and there no avoiding that.
>>725342740Has an MMO that uses a deck building combat system been made yet?
>>725381884I personally don't care either way. I have no problem with subs, but it's obviously creates a extra hurdle in getting players in. I'm just saying, with that specific game, it has bigger problems.
>>725342740cooldown based mmo combat predates wow you newfag
>>725346950trying to find faults with this but i actually cant, also lmao at the dude thinking thottbot was widely used outside of autist raiders
>>725352457>there is no middle point between being a chatroom with a secondary game attached and a turbo epic singleplayer-worthy game that is enjoyable with no players at all
>>725347642because a lot of early mmos were just meant to be chatrooms to shitpost with friends/strangers in
>>725342402money, faggots, terrorists, retardsthe corporations look at it as money and not quality entertainment, which is why everything is morphed into a money sucking machine, so the games themselves are killed in the process.faggots becoming loud and wanting to spread their propaganda doesn't help any industry or the world one bit. the human civilization should have stopped at: faggots exist. That's it. No need for names, flags, parades, propaganda, brainwashing, crime, etc. Just exist and enjoy. Now the people including escaping the reality gamers will become heavily biased and radicalized against the faggots. And that is faggots own doing. Killing MMO with your faggotry doesn't help anything.real terrorists and other extremely bad people were using online games for the steady exchange of information, planning, which throughout the 90's and early's 00's were MMORPG'S. Because FPS and other fast online games weren't suitable for prolonged exchange without in-game activity.So the governments, obviously, got involved. Feds everywhere in network gaming. I'm not saying the government itself ruins 100% of the things it touches, but it certianly doesn't help with all the censorship, etc. Can't even make jokes about aforementioned faggots. Grim. Despite gradual enshittifaction of online gaming from all sides at once over the past two decades, there are still plenty of drooling retards paying a lot of money for this half-assed attempt at entertianment of intelligent people.TL;DR: Very bad environment that I don't want to be in at all.P.S. MMO = Massive Multiplayer Online. Any online game with decent online is fucking MMO whether you want it or not. Shartnite and Fuckblox included.
I’m still going to try Aion 2
>>725382917>real terrorists used MMOs to communicateQRD?
>>725382917>>725383159Is this why you can't even chat in "MMOs" today? The in-game chat is so heavily filtered it blocks completely random shit and you can barely finish a sentence.
>greater mmo discussion hones in on FFXI being the perfect mmo experience that everybody actually wantsEvery time.
>>725383159ask any AI or any search machine. But literally one of the first serach engine results>https://www.dni.gov/files/NCTC/documents/jcat/firstresponderstoolbox/144s_-_First_Responders_Toolbox_-_Terrorist_Exploitation_of_Online_Gaming_Platforms.pdf>https://www.propublica.org/article/world-of-spycraft-intelligence-agencies-spied-in-online-games
>>725352283this, i feel like the people that argue otherwise only ever read about stuff like ultima online/eq/ro decades later.
>>725352457>would you play any of these games if they weren't multiplayer? If you were just plopped down in a world and maybe had bots for party members?I like the grinding game. Seeing numbers go up makes my brain happy.
>>725383391FFXI really does have all the makings of the perfect MMO but its held back by its own fucking retardation fo PlayOnline and eternally dogshit UI that requires dozens of third party plugins to make tolerable beyond level 40 assuming you even survive that long before quitting out of frustration.Nearly impossible to recruit friends into, which when I think about it, might be healthier for the long-term community as nobody is just there "for their friends" they're there for the love of the game and made friends inside of it.
>>725375983I thought it was just some autistic japanese dude that did most of the work. He doesn't work on it much but I see him picking away at it little by little on the commits
>>725381529yeah star citizen is the perfect example of what happens when you give a "why don't we just make an mmo that's super realistic and simulates everything and has gameplay for every possibility?" dev infinite money. it's not going well
>>725342402The middle class no longer exists and there's almost nobody left in the west who can afford food. MMO's aren't a priority.
>>725342402The MMO treadmill model only really appeals to a certain demographic that doesnt mind doing the game thing over and over again ad nauseum. Also fuck subscription fees in 2025.
>>725383857shut up jamal, mmos were never for poor people to begin with
>>725342526>>725343168Pretty much this. Reason runescape is still maintaining it's position is because its one of the few mmos with no micro transactions and is still a huge time sink.People underestimate how important it is for the player to have to work towards objectives, there is no point if you can achieve endgame in a few days, you will get bored very quickly as opposed to having long term objectives where you can interact with other who either have gone through the same challenges or are going through them as well
>>725383969They literally target poor fiscally irresponsible people and even invented the f2p model to target even poorer people. Have you fucking ever spoken with a guild in wow? 90% of those niggers don't have jobs but scrounge their sub every month
>>725383969lot of basketball americans play wizard101 because it's a card game
>>725383969>>725384195Retards always talk about MoNtHy FeE WiLl FiLtEr OuT 3Rd WoRlDeRs but Chinese gold farmers and BRs has proven time and time again that Monthly fee bullshit didn't do jack shit to prevent it.
>>725380931id say its more that modern mmos attract a different audience. everquest, ffxi, vanilla wow, ultima online, RO and lineage were first and foremost chatrooms for people to hang out with their friends (or meet new people). but hanging out and shooting the shit in a video game world is no longer the main player or developer focus, modern mmos are loot treadmills with cash shops meant to attract degenerate nerds. which means that over time population a gets replaced by population b
>>725380931>I dont quite understand what caused the shift in mentalityif you have ever had the misfortune of raiding with mentally retarded people you'd understand
>>725384361Trading gold for money is trivial in any MMO with even a modicum of popularity.
>>725384843Yes and cocksucking retards that want Monthly fee tries to justify it while ignoring how 3rd worlds are abusing the gold selling market and getting into those Monthy fee mmos in droves.
>>725384093You must not have seen RuneScape in a loooooong time. It's riddled with MTX.
>>725384626>modern mmos are loot treadmillsnigga wat0.01% drop rates for cards and equipment, RO WAS the loot treadmill MMO
How do I into FFXI if it's so great?
>>725385113Runescape = Oldschool RunescapeRunescape 3 is an abomination filled with trannies and Reddit gamer dads that's bleeding players fast and is projected to die completely within a couple of years.
>>725381172I been in alot of 4chan guilds and they been fine other than some random dude sperging that a girl was in the tera MT guild
>>725384093>Reason runescape is still maintaining it's position is because its one of the few mmos with no micro transactionsWhat the fuck is this dumb slut saying
>>725385152loot treadmill doesnt mean >le rare drops existit means>i gotta get this drop to get my gear score up or they wont let me into the hardcore mythic group
>>725385808I like xiv and how they do gearing up, you can do 99% of content just by crafting stuff and any extra is just to make fights faster
>>725385216Fuck off zoomer, we're full
>>725386057I'm 34.
>>725385808>>i gotta get this drop to get my gear score up or they wont let me into the hardcore mythic groupthis is exactly what used to happen unless you played some cuckold role in WoE because there were so many things that could fuck you up without the appropiate cards or equipmentnevermind gear, you also had to farm consumables for WoE so yeah it was one of the most insane loot treadmill games I've ever played
>>725386091then why the fuck is your dumbass posting like a zoomer faggot?
>>725347734>Blizzard has sued multiplefake news
>>725386429You're actually such a newfag it pains me.
>>725385216>>725386091If you actually like the MMO genre then go into it blind, discovering/figuring things out is what made it so fun, there's nothing at stake if you don't look at a modern "guide"
>>725386026you can do 99% of xiv's content in any gear because all the content is piss easy apart from savage lolits designed that way so even the most casual sect of tranny can complete it to get special set of kupo moon earrings every 3-6 months
>>725386026xiv is cancer
>>725385216There is quite literally guides out there for the setup (the hardest part). Other than that, go in as blind as possible until you get stuck.It is worth it to suffer through the very rough setup + early game though. FFXI is the only actual MMO left.
>>725342402The endgame of almost every MMO consists of sitting around in a hub area waiting for friends/randoms to join your party so you can run content with them, and said content only ever requires a relatively small amount of players...so if the "massively" part is irrelevant, why bother dealing with the headache of implementing it? Why not just fake it like Destiny did, with instanced multiplayer hubs and zones that match you with just enough randoms to feel populated? You can still have raids and zone events and all that, and you save a lot on server costs -- the only downside is that the game feels less like a real world, which very few people actually care about. I care about MMOs feeling like real worlds, but I realize I'm a minority, and live-service games kinda have to cater to the majority if they want to turn a profit.The biggest use case for MMOs is EVE Online-style sandboxes where player interaction *is* the content and having a large amount of players is vital for the empire-building territory-fighting mechanics, but those games will always be niche because they (A) are inherently PvP-focused, (B) require a certain amount of autistic dedication, and (C) always have shitty combat.I really wish there was a good MMOFPS out there. Planetside 2 is alright, but it's pretty long in the tooth and the playercount isn't exactly massive these days.
>>725386702Yea I’m not playing xiv for really hard content, what’s up with you people thinking only hard stuff matters in a mmo of all things?
>>725387348Don't worry dude, devs are slowly but surely waking up to the raidtranny menace that has killed every MMO in the past 15 years. Look at WoW's move to develop content that doesn't require add-ons. We're getting there, just like the vocal minority of trannys on twitter, everyone knows they're .01% of the community and nobody should give a fuck about what they want.
>>725387348It is just the mentality of people currently aged 20 - 35. Take FFXI for example, new players are always "What's good for endgame?" even though they are hundreds of hours of things to do and content to experience before they even get there. It isn't like "endgame" is even a big deal - who are you in competition with in a 20+ year old game? People who still play are doing it for the love of the game at this point, not to be #1.
>I'm tired of WoW clone themepark MMOs>haha lol no I won't play sandbox MMOssuffer
>>725387794Give me sandbox without pvp running the place.
>>725387794there's two (2) sandbox mmos, eve is a p2w multiboxfest and albion has moba combat. if there's any others that aren't "dude play my pet UO pserver, peak hours get over 50 users!" please name them because i would love to play a sandbox mmo with decent gameplay
>>725387503If it was up to me I would remove all everything above extremes because raid fags are so fucking annoying
>>725350118>Guild WarsGood game but crippled by awful performance.
>>725387348people want meaningful content that feels rewarding compared to the effort put into achieving the rewardfor example, im playing guild wars 2 right now levelling a fresh rangerevery mob i attack no matter what mob it is or how complex the fight is will always die in a handful of auto attacks or a single press of rapid fireno matter whatbecause its so easy and such a faceroll i feel no connection between myself and the game world. why are all these npcs struggling to hold back the centaur threat when i can just press tab and my autoattack and they all die?https://www.youtube.com/shorts/seDkZCpbAocthis video perfectly encapsulates the problem with modern mmos. too many of them are far too hasty giving the player instant gratification and dopamine. every world interaction becomes less and less impactful until it turns the game into a LFD teleport hub game like PoE
>>725342402This mp4 goes really well with Bad Apple
>>725388439MOBA combat is the best combat system for a PvP MMO imo.Haven&Hearth gets a new server on December 5th. It usually peaks at around 2k daily players. It's fun for a few weeks but it's not new-player friendly at all.
>>725390015Yea I don’t care, raidfags are annoying faggots that cheat most of the time for the few rewards they get
>>725388141Bitcraft I guess.
>>725390325If I wanted to play a moba, I'd play a moba
>>725342402The good days are over bros, the good days are sadly over. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKJSC_mteIg
>>725390993not everyone is in their late 30s like you.
>>725385770Are you retarded?FFXIV and WOW have mtx where you can buy pets / transmog / mounts.There is no fun in that, there were no hardships involved in getting those things and they sometimes have a higher quality then stuff you can get in the game through grinding
>>725391298>water is wet
>>725391721It's crazy how easily gamers just gave away visual progression and allowed studios to instead take that away and make them pay extra for it. You no longer see some autist with a "IMANOLIFEFAGGOT headband +2" and you just know he spent the last 4 months of his life to get it, and he might be the only person you ever see with it and think he's fucking awesome for it. All of that is basically gone now, and it annoys the shit out of me when I read people type shit like "Wellll I'm okay with micro transactions as long as they're just cosmetic"
>>725350118Lolno. They're milking all the remaining playerbase as we speak. Story is bombarded with Mary Sues, SJW, and DEI in the most retarded sensewww.youtube.com/watch?v=GxTiwKvp348>LOL STORYThe game was advertise for PERSONAL story and it fuck that up.
>>725392129>You no longer see some autist with a "IMANOLIFEFAGGOT headband +2whenever exclusivity for hardcore gameplay or veteran status (for example, I've played since launch let me have an item/skin) is brought up, the vitriol and pure rage hate from the "dads", "casuals" and "I work 3 jobs have 12 kids and a life" is so insane that if this occurred in a RL scenario they would be put on a list asap all over the world ngl. the hate faggots have for the idea of "someone is better than you and will have something you won't" is kryptonite. no memes fr, they are psychopaths.
>>725392621It brings my piss to a boil how much shit is locked behind shitty story and you have to fucking do it. Personal story was skippable at the very least with those vn dialogues but ever since HoT and everything running real time in game it become absolutely fucking insufferable slog.
>>725342402>Why did the MMO genre die?Filthy Casual Peasants too stupid to stick with their console-life and made ridiculous demands for easy-winnings so they can compete with basement dwelling neckbeards... all the while greedy corporate studios are fucking in the Cosby room, need a fresh batch of rape-bait so they comply with the Filthy Casuals, and destroy their own game in the process.This is the truth of things.
>>725392621>frost infusion>mystic infusion>polysaturating purple infusion>invisible shoes>eternal frost everything somehow less obnoxious than jar+abyssal infusion stackersI will never understand why other rich fags have such shit taste, I'm sitting on 80k gold and 4 chak eggs, but I will never ever use the visual clutter garbage infusions
>>725392129>It's crazy how easily gamers just gave away visual progression and allowed studios to instead take that away and make them pay extra for it.we didnt give away shit. the corporations simply ignored us. Maybe you forgot, but videogames use to be region specific and exclusive. So when all your white videogame players in the usa said something like 'fuck horse armor', companies like bethesda went 'sorry, forgive us'. Horse armor was a failure, but you'd never know it because theyve rewritten history to make it sound like it was highly successful. It wasn't.... until it was. And it was when they were able to side step their original fanbase by selling to other groups at a later time. Companies realized, they didnt have to listen to us. Especially with mmorpgs. Oh your customers dont like your dogshit? Thats fine. The brazilians will lap it up. The philipinos will eat it. The chinese will ching chong it up (although they will directly steal your ideas and release their own version of the game a year later but you dont care since youve already been paid).when videogames became an international thing, what the consumer wanted stopped mattering. This is why corpofaggots now whine about vtubers and streamers. The consumer can basically unionize around the streamer and their little gaming communities and dish out meaningful boycotts and stuff through popular opinion. This makes corpos seethe because they want individuals to be isolated and alone so their only source of feedback is whatever the 'community manager' tells them to think.
>>725393348>you have to fucking do itThe only mandatory story is the very first chapter of each expansion to access the zones. The ones with mounts might be needed too but I found PoF fun
>>725390325>MOBA combat is the best combat system for a PvP MMO imo.to each their own i guess, i dislike it enough that it's a dealbreaker which is unfortunate because the rest of the game seems great>Haven&Hearth gets a new server on December 5th. It usually peaks at around 2k daily players. It's fun for a few weeks but it's not new-player friendly at all.holy shit that game's still going? takes me back to the /v/ colonies back in like 2011 or whatever, i'll hop on for the nostalgia trip but unless things have changed i probably won't stick around because i had the same problem with it that i have with eve (at a certain point you needed to make alts to be competitive, i don't remember if multiboxing was officially allowed but i do remember everyone did it anyway)
>>725359947>yeah bro, they totally saved the gametera ran from 2012 to 2022, thats 10 years what the fuck are you talking about. The game was shut down because the parent company wanted everyone to move to their new game Elyon so they dumped tera into a garbage can. Kakao did the same thing with archeage.Games live and die not because they are profitable but because some corporate faggot decides that they want that game's resources working on their own project instead. its 2025, you need to stop thinking like some little kid living in the 1990s. Businesses do not function the way you think they do.Look at new world. Its not shut down but its dead even though its latest update was bringing in tons of people. Why? because some jeet ceo at amazon decided they could just shut down their entire gaming department and focus on 'casual ai games' instead of mmos.
>>725395175>need to progress End of Dragons story to unlock its masteries including jade bot unlike both HoT and PoF>need to do Secrets of the Obscure story to get weaponmaster training or no life grind wvwI peaced out after secrets, don't know how it is in janthir and new expansion.
>>725342402Sometimes a dev tries to advance one aspect of the genre beyond the same stale design choices they've gone with since the 90s, like TESO clearly put resources into quest writing, or Blade and Soul into combat or DDO into monster ai where it's not just threat tables and they'd try to run past the front line to the squishies but none of them do this with everything that makes up an mmo so you wind up with games with a couple good parts and the rest that was merely acceptable 10 or even 20 years before launch. The only ones worth playing did shit entirely differently like EVE or Archeage but they were killed eventually by their devs in once case and their western publisher and korean upgrade system in the other.
>>725353574The limitations wow faced in 2004 have been mostly gone for a long time now.
>>725380628>PlayOnline Revamps
>>725394841>Horse armor was a failureNo, it sold millions and was incredibly profitable because it cost nothing to make. The average white American thought "it looks cool and it's only $2.50, I don't give a fuck what precedent it sets because it's cheap and only nerds care about the integrity of the gaming industry". People willing to take a stand against shitty practices are a vocal minority no matter what country they're in.>incoherent schizobabble about how corporations hate streamers (their biggest free advertisers)Oh, you're just retarded.
>>725380628>fixing playonline
>>725342402I don't know but someone please post more cute artists dancing or being cute before the thread dies
>>725342402wow killed the genre
>>725373649>Goofy Wuxia MMOActually sounds kinda fun, feels like its inspired by that funny puppet movie
>>725380628Things must be really fucked for XIV if they're giving budget to XI again
>>725380628>Changes to Playonline because there's been cases of people unable to even play the game. Not showing words etc.Wait. PlayOnline actually filters people? I thought it was some dumb meme
Is that Gold World Pass thing important when starting FFXI, Is a Warp Ring importantAm I already failing by reading about this shit before even starting the game
>>725374541Full loot worked for EVE because combat was consensual if you weren't retarded. You had instas on stations and warps off of gates, your d-scanner, local channel, intel channels, scouts, the fucking map set to show ships killed and pods destroyed in the past our or a bud in a cheap frigate to scout for you. If you lost something in eve it was your fault, no other devs taking the full loot pill have ever even given players a tenth or the tools eve had.
mmos are only good if you have 0 clue whats going onpeople removed all the fun by datamining and making wikis all the fun has been optimized away
>>725397245IIRC the pass is just a way to let someone trial the game and there's other ways to get warp rings
>>725397717Well I was wondering because of https://www.bg-wiki.com/ffxi/Gold_World_PassYou apparently get some vouchers with that, and with those vouchers you can get some easy currency, to buy for example a Warp Ring
>>725396624Yeah it's a mess man. Have to queue to get on my server at every point in the day, that's how dead it is
