JC Denton canonically kills people.Adam Jensen doesn't kill people and is a pacifist, he'd stick to non-lethal tools.These conclusions are derived from the character's backgrounds and demeanors from their respective games.
>>726039495pussies
>>726039686Killing people is based though. The Hacker is a cuck who only shot at robots and corpses.
>>726039495JC kills children
>>726039686Shut the fuck up, animal.
>>726039495>These conclusions are derived from the character's backgrounds and demeanorsAdam let the mute chick bleed out in front of him when Eliza asked if he'd save her
>>726040126What was he supposed to save her with?
>>726040210Human Revolution is Eliza's journey to understand the way humanity thinks through Adam, ergo the question would have been pointless if he didn't have the means to do so. So let's assume he could have pumped her full of hipostims
>>726041005>So let's assume he could have pumped her full of hipostimsI don't think they work that way. She was either riddled with bullet holes and/or shocked to death. Even if Adam gave her the hypnostims, she'd still choke on her own blood anyway.
>>726039495>JC Denton canonically kills people.>Adam Jensen doesn't kill peopleWhat about Alex D?
>>726042191He canonically kills arabs
>>726039495You think an ex swat officer would care about killing people?
I think it makes sense for JC to kill people until he gets redpilled and stops being a glowie thug
>>726042563He has guilt over his past. It's made explicit in his conversation with Wayne Haas but permeates throughout the entirety of both games.JC Denton is an oligophrenic test tube baby raised zogbots.
>>726039495JC Denton canonically bottoms.Adam Jensen doesn't like things in his butt, he'd stick to being a top.These conclusions are derived from the character's backgrounds and demeanors from their respective games.
>>726042820Kys fag
>>726039686He didn't kill a single person in his game>>726039787The hacker is the system shock 1 protag, the system shock 2 protagonist is just some random soldier
>>726039495Replay HR intro sequence without killing, upload proof, then come back and try that again.
>>726039495JC Denton is canonicalthat other faggot isn't
>>726042887It's actually pretty easy to sneak past everyone or even straight up run past everyone
>>726042917Tranny.
>>726042868equal amount of analysis to the op, friend
>>726042995Yet you were the one to make it about faggotry.
>>726042434Giga ChadI can't believe people dislike Invisible war
>>726039495>Adam Jensen doesn't kill people and is a pacifistBut killing bosses in HR is mandatory, whereas in OG you can completely bypass certain boss fights.Both of them are capable of killing when necessary. IMO, Jensen would beat Denton in a fight though just because of the Typhoon ability alone.
>>726043750>But killing bosses in HR is mandatoryNot in the Director's Cut version.
>>726043246Pretty easy to believe when you actually play it
>>726043819You still have to kill them. It just lets you kill them through means other than mag dumping and typhoon spam.Both HR and OG have boss that you NEED to kill in some way or other. You have to kill Anna Navarre eventually for example, even if you keep putting it off.
>>726044221Then we can look at it as a "tendency" to kill people that each character has. Sure, when both of them are cornered I can concede that both with resort to violence canonically, but I believe that Jensen is far more likely to go non-lethal in his adventures canonically than Denton is.
>>726042873>He didn't kill a single person in his gameHe committed genocide and got rid of all the other humans, corrupted or otherwise
>>726039495And yet Jensen always be inferior to JC even after two games and novels. KWAB
>>726044745I wasn't trying to imply one was superior than the other.
>>726039495This
>>726044408The many are not people
>>726045607speciest
>>726039495Yeah I never really got the obsession stealth games had with going nonlethal after the days of Deus Ex and Tenchu, I mean I guess it it makes sense for Hitman where the whole concept is you performing a targeted killing and trying to not to draw too much heat to yourself after the mission, but for something like new Deus Ex or Metal Gear? It's just dumb
>>726046097needless moralizinglike alpha protocoldude, they are literal fucking terrorists: killing them is a net positive to the world
>>726046097Made sense in dishonored since the idea is that if you kill loads of guards they can't police the city and the chaos of the world increases. There's also some non-killing things you can do that increase chaos like poisoning the still of that one gang
>>726042191He showers people
>>726039495I'm killing everyone
>>726046317And you can literally teleport away from enemies and climb while they can't.Killing them is entirely an optional thing.
>>726043750>just because of the Typhoon ability alone.Wouldn't the ADS counter it?
>>726046363I seriously don't understand how people go through Mankind Divided non-violently. Popping heads with the silenced pistol is just too satisfying.
>>726046363Basedhttps://youtu.be/aBl7XvH_4aQ?si=HPhMsD3HxaSKC_4_
>>726039495When HR came out you had to kill bosses. They only added non lethal ways to kill them after people complained.
>>726039495I don't see why you think JC would be more likely, he has Paul actively pushing him towards nonlethality. Jensen has his grips over Mexicantown but his only weaponry as an unaugmented bodyguard is an FR27 rifle, a lethal weapon, so he's willing to kill if necessary
>>726039495>Adam Jensen doesn't kill people and is a pacifistlil bro.....https://youtu.be/uvSs5b6y-YM?si=U4Zp-dhEIntGPqvq
>>726046661JC is a soulless schizo test tube baby. Adam shows remorse and compassion in certain moments in HR and MD. Denton doesn't.
>>726046773The trailer is not canon. Marchenko never appears in the Dvali theatre hideout in person in the actual game.
>>726046775The delivery is very stoic because JC is meant as a self-insert. He can be as compassionate or as ruthless as you want him to, but IIRC he's shaken if Paul dies
>>726039495>Adam Jensen doesn't kill people and is a pacifist, he'd stick to non-lethal tools.he has blades built into his arms
>>726047135He didn't ask for them. Now, however, breaking a guy's neck whenever he punches through a wall is entirely his choice
>>726047030>he's shaken if Paul diesOf course, that's his brother. He doesn't give a shit about anyone else though.>The delivery is very stoic because JC is meant as a self-insert. I know, but it doesn't work. JC is too defined of a character to be a "self-insert". To me at least.
>>726047135He quite literally never asked for those. The truth is though that his body is built for both lethal and non-lethal approaches. He’s basically the perfect super soldier (until Denton came along, but even the Denton brothers were built using Jensen as a prototype).
Does anyone have that image where someone combined Alex, JC and Paul's faces and the result was Adam?
>>726047135Those are for cutting energy bars.
>HR is a prequel to the original gamehow the fuck does that work
>>726047229He’s not as defined of a character as Jensen. Jensen has a gf, several friends, a traumatic past during his time in the SWAT, implied PTSD and so on. Really the only things you can change in him as the player is wheter his augs turn him into a decent person or a corrupt glowie assassin. He’s basically like Corvo from Dishonored.Denton meanwhile has no past aside from having a brother and being made in a lab, and his only personality trait is being a stoic dude who occasionally makes action movie one-liners.
>>726039495Adam kills people in the cinematic trailers
>>726047842Tech degradation. The world has gone to absolute shit by the time the events of the original game come around. Plus, you’re visiting more upscale places in HR. In the OG game, you spend most of the game in either slums or labs.
>>726039495you cannot spare the boss fights in Mankind Divided. Jensen canonically kills people. It is literally impossible not to.
>>726047854I still can't take him as a compassionate person given how he acts and talks in the game. They really should've given him just a bit more emotional so he doesn't come off as a psycho.
>>726039495Most story beats in Deus Ex suggest JC prefers minimizing casualties. Paul explicitly encourages him to avoid killing when possible, the philosophical themes emphasize questioning orders and valuing human life. His characterization leans toward reluctant agent who grows increasingly disillusioned. So it makes sense that JC will kill but only when necessary, he's a professional not a psychopath.
>>726048018>Tech degradation.People tend to forget that the world in original DX is basically post-apocalypse setting.Of course that does not explain the whole "90's monitors" and shit like that (you really can't prevent this unless you actively want to go out of your way to make a retro-sci-fi feel). But in terms of overal state of society... DX is an explicitly post-collapse society. It's just two shades of yellow away from a Fallout world.
>>726048518>o it makes sense that JC will kill but only when necessary, he's a professional not a psychopath.Eh, not really. I mean you are not wrong about thematic beats, but the presentation paints a very different picture, of JC being very much removed from humanity. I get that it's partly because of the comparatively just brutally lower production values (DX's voiceacting quality has been mocked for two decades now with good reasons), but also partially because the game is pushing the blank slate idea as part of it's core gameplay focus. JC isn't completely and hilariously robotic just because the voiceactor is incompetent, its also because he really needs to actively cover any playstyle possible, from an absolute psycho to a deeply caring and fundamentally moral character, as that was the biggest selling point of the whole game. "Play it your own way" is the absolute essense of the "im-sim" genre, or at least it was back in the day.The fact that the game treats solution like learning the self-destruct codes for Navarra and Herman as the "pacifist" options however does suggest they do envision JC to be more pragmatic than idealist.
>>726042815Stfu Gunther you Laptuan MachineYou only glaze Adam cause hes a mech aug like your rust bucket ass
>>726039495Jensen: non-lethalJC: only kill Anna to save Lebedev, the rest is non-lethalAlex: non-lethal
>>726052112>he doesn't put a bullet through every globalist zogbot in dx1 he comes acrossCuck faggot.
>>726039495JC is like a robotic character with no personality, poorly written and a self insert for the player.Jensen on the other hand has charisma and well written, hes just stuck in mediocre games.
>>726041005https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_SMt8TJGqOg
>>726039495There is no "canon" outside of Deus Ex itself. The sequels and prequels and Deus Ex Bible are all apocrypha.
>>726039495What about the invisible war guyAlex or something
>>726047842It doesn't, all Deus Ex content produced after June 22, 2000 is non-canon
>>726050961Actually they met in the novels and IIRC Gunther tried to kill Adam.
>>726052819>the novelskys
>>726052803tranny
>>726052943>erm ackshually it's NU DOOS EX that's tranny! owned ya chud!
>>726052112didn't Invisible War make all three endings of the original canon somehow? If so, JC definitely killed Bob Page
>>726053013>I know you've gone through a lot of physical changes of late, but you didn't become a woman
>>726052907Dude, I'm not going to kiss my sister. Fuck off.
>>726053050Invisible War is not canon>>726053176HR/MD is a retcon and not canon
I believe it isn't so black and white. I always saw jensen as someone who kills when he has to. After all he has a police background. He's put in a lot of situations where killing your enemies would be ideal. Look at the terrorist attack on sarrif industries as an example. They are killing the employees you are supposed to protect. Would jensen really take the extra time to subdue all of these guys who are indiscriminately killing unarmed people? I don't think so.Jc was created and trained to be a killing machine of the illuminati's enemies. I think he's a killer from the start, but becomes more pacifist as the game goes on once he learns hes being used for evil.
>>726052563>JC is like a robotic character with no personality, poorly written and a self insert for the player.JC isn't poorly written. The writing in DX is actually pretty good.JC however is not a character. As in, he is not intended to have a developed psychological profile. Not out of incompetence, but due to the game's literal genre and core gameplay selling point.He is however, absolutely horribly voiced. Everyone in the game is. They did not have budget for good voiceactors. Hell, professional voiceacting was generally a rarity in gaming at that era. Sure, you do have games like Homeworld and Soul Reaver, but those were absolutely exceptional cases. The idea of having cinema-tier quality voice direction as a norm is really a product of 7th gen gaming.
>>726053505>HR/MD is a retcon and not canonI'm okay with it. I enjoyed my time with HR and MD but I can aknowledge that they're way too different from DE to feel like different parts of the same.
>>726052426Edgy school-shooter nigger
>>726042191She honey traps innocent coffee shop owners
>>726053797Deus Ex has better voicing acting than any nu slop full of the same 5 union voice actors
>>726053615>I think he's a killer from the start, but becomes more pacifist as the game goes on once he learns hes being used for evil.to the contrary as the game goes on there's less people telling him to tone down the violence. Sam Carter is the big one obviously and he's basically not in the second half of the game. Also most of the dialogue in the game assumes you've killed people even if you just knock them out, IIRC this happens with Jojo for example
>>726053050>didn't Invisible War make all three endings of the original canon somehow?The main ending is Helios one, it's just so happened that after that the world order collapsed and Illuminati took over, like in other endings.
>>726054240Wrong, within IW he blows up the place Tong-style after merging. But it's a moot point because IW is not canon.
Is IW worth a playtrough on its own merit?
>>726053929>school-shooterAlso why IW is the best part, absolute freedomhttps://youtu.be/bWGpTI60j3g?si=UcOgALRpwhP4703c
>>726054843its an extremely basic "version" of an imsim. Its basically a console fps with a few abilities. Won't take more than an afternoon, so why not give it a spin if nothing else but or the history lesson.
>>726054843>Is IW worth a playtrough on its own merit?Yes, it was better than most games of its time and still better than what comes out today
I was a big fan of Human Revolution but never touched Mankind Divided. Was it any good?
>>726039495In one of the trailers of Mankind Divided, Jensen kills multiple people and goes on some monologue about embracing the monster you’ve become. Jensen has absolutely killed people. Also JC is a complete and utter psychopath so of course he’s also killed people
>>726055329Mostly better gameplay wise and exploration wise. Worse in main campaign department.Also, has some rather cool side-quests.
>>726040126That scene felt so weird. I could’ve sworn the game would’ve given you an option to save her but then the game just immediately forgets she exists the next minute. It was probably cut out or something
>>726053973>Deus Ex has better voicing acting than any nu slop full of the same 5 union voice actorsI don't know what games are you playing, having recently finished a few games like CP77 and KCD2... noooooo... in fact DX's voiceacting was actually so bad it was mocked even at its own era. Which was an era where you generally did not expect ANY voiceacting from an RPG.The simple, mechanical and technical quality of VA has grown exponentially in the last two decades. Just fucking compare OpFor to HL2 and you'll see the difference just those 5 years made, and HL2 was the beginning. It's not a mater of taste, it's a mater of technical skill. I'd personally prefer that games DIDN'T go this direction. I think the contemporary standards and expectations for VA quality are actively harming the industry, by posing absolutely unneccessary strain on dev budget that could be used far better. Full voiceacting was literally the first and definitive sign that TES games are dead.I'd take a world where TES was never voiced, and even relatively high budget titles would get away with DX1 tier voiceacting - if it meant we get more games with DX tier gameplay.But 7th gen decided that gaming on the whole will go a different direction, and here we are. With incredibly high-quality expectations for voiceacting, but absolutely ZERO expectations on actual writing behind it.
>>726046363>>726046443Next time I replay Mankind Divided I’m killing everyone. I only killed those aug super soldiers but normally went out of my way to not kill anyone else. Next time Im gonna just go guns blazing and leave a trail of bodies behind
>>726055771Not killing the police in Ruzicka station at the start is okay but killing at any other point is fine. I also think killing ARC members is fine too but I prefer the dialogue with Rucker when you don't.
>>726054843i mean, you might as well play it at this point. not like we’re drowning in deus ex titles
>>726055329It plays a lot smoother and has way better side quests. But the level design is a hit or miss and the story is just horrid. I still loved it though, flawed as it was
>>726055979Yeah, I mean I guess I’ll go by context. I’m not shooting the cops in the crime scene obviously but I’ll try and not think too hard about the others
>>726056052>not like we’re drowning in deus ex titlesThere's Peripeteia, it's exactly like Deus Ex, go play that.
>>726055665> having recently finished a few games like CP77Tryhard slophttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQyavYwlfScRandom hobos in Deus Ex are more convincing than that>in fact DX's voiceacting was actually so bad it was mocked even at its own eraBy idiot reviewers who think broken Engrish from rando Chinese is bad.
Kind of crazy how Jensen was the only self insert in the history of vidya that worked.
Just once I’d like a game that gives you non-lethal and lethal options and doesn’t judge you for going lethal. I want to be able to massacre an entire base of bad guys without some faggot boat runner saying “you’re le just like them!” and shooting into the air to reveal my position. I guess the original Deus Ex kinda does that. Yeah, characters often give you shit for killing people, but a lot of the times you can kill people and get away with. I guess you could argue that HR and MD do the same as well, people give you shit sometimes and you might get locked out of certain content but the worst you’ll get is Jensen being slightly more of an edgelord with his monologue in the Mass Effect tier endings
>>726056425It's more like EYE.
>>726056425I tried that. It’s got potential and I adore the style, but the levels are too fucking spacious and enormous for no reason. Also I hate Polish people and Europeans in general
the thing that pissed me off about those faggots in montreal is they removed the imsim elements from the game. killing people should be a personal choice, not a gameplay decision to get more exp. same with stealth. niggas were more or less telling you to be some stealth assassin like you're playing skyrim or some shitthose faggot at eidos montreal fucked up HR/MD with their moral BS.
>>726039495>before the airportPacifist>after going to the NSF headquarters for the 2nd timeKill on sight, simple as.
>>726056675EXP system is the worst part of Jensen games.
>>726056554Nobody really gives you much shit for going lethal in Mankind Divided with the exception of the Ruzicka train station and Talos Rucker in Golem City. The reason you feel that way is because the game design itself rewards non-lethal playthroughs more with more XP (which is an objective failing by Eidos that I even as a MD defender admit, why they didn't remove this in MD is beyond me). In fact rewarding every kill/takedown with XP is just retarded IMO.
>>726046775JC is a self-insert. if he's schizo, so are youAdam is a cringelord attempt to sound cool and badass
>>726055329MD is more of the same. The only real addition to the gameplay is an automated move between cover option. Also the hacking minigame was made even shittier than it already was, but on the other hand, you now also get experience rewards for simply using a found password instead, so you can skip more of it if you want
>>726056668>It’s got potentialIt's got none>I adore the styleWhat style? The lack of one?
>>726056468>Tryhard slopYou are not a very smart person, are you?Sure, cling desperately to empty buzzwords, child. I'm sure that will work wonders for you.
>>726057275Acting isn't real life. CP2077 is an interactive movie game with interactive movie actors. Deus Ex is a game about reality featuring rough realistic characters. They each have the voice actors they deserve.
>>726056928the thing about passwords is that you miss out on data caches which often contain exp. at times, 500xp or more so you still feel kinda bad for using passwords
>>726056468Fun fact. That speech is not supposed to be convincing, because it isn't true. It is supposed to be bullshit. Something that Johnny, a person fundamentally dishonest about every aspect of his life and personality, is trying to trick you and like himself with. He always used anti-corpo sentiments as an excuse for his own selfishness, and his genuine motivation to actually actively DO something about it (attack on Arasaka) was ENTIRELY prompted by Alt's fate. Which he actually thought was HIS fault (he literally had no idea Alt was far, FAR more important than he was, he was so self-obsessed he did not notice she is the most important netrunner since Barth), making even that motivation dishonest - he could not swallow the idea that (in his view of things), his own unhingend selfish acts led to death of someone he genuinely did care about.So yeah, that voiceacting is exceptional and 100% on point. You just don't know the story of the game at fucking all.
>>726057662>the voice acting is good because it conveys the dishonest writing
>>726057662What's crazy is what you described is clearly spelled out to you buy other characters. They directly say it to you in cutscenes. Yet SOMEHOW people miss it. I'm truly fascinated by how even the most obvious, direct and basic plots go right over the heads of gamers.>inb4 he didn't play the gameWhy comment on a game you didn't fucking play at all?
>>726039495They're different people with different jobs and backgrounds. JC Denton is a super-glowie, it'd be drilled into his head that some people have to die. Adam Jenson's an ex-cop, he would've had it drilled into his head to always seek a nonlethal option where possible.
>>726057407>Acting isn't real life.Wow, REALLY?! Holy shit, I never fucking realized that, jesus christ, how absolutely brilliant of a deduction of you!I'm so impressed with your brilliant and unique insights and opinions.>CP2077 is an interactive movie game with interactive movie actors.There is a lot more to that game actually, you should play it eventually. But yeah, cinematic production values are extremely important to it, they did not skimp on that. Absolutely fucking irrelevant to this discussion. >Deus Ex is a game about reality featuring rough realistic characters.Genuinely, thank you for the laugh. That is actually some comedy gold.But let's be real for a moment.Why do you pretend like you have played either of these games? What is the point? Because you sure as fuck aren't convincing ANYONE that you know what the fuck you are talking about.
>>726058052>There is a lot more to that game actually, you should play it eventually. But yeah, cinematic production values are extremely important to it, they did not skimp on that. Absolutely fucking irrelevant to this discussion.Post good voice acting from the game>Genuinely, thank you for the laugh. That is actually some comedy gold.Name one game that conveys and has better predicted reality than Deus Ex
>>726057736>the voice acting is good because it conveys the dishonest writingDo you have an actual checkbox of "dumb things children on /v/ say"? >>726057881>Yet SOMEHOW people miss it. I'm truly fascinated by how even the most obvious, direct and basic plots go right over the heads of gamers.Unfortunately, you actually explained how that happened yourself, even if you don't want to believe the answer.It is actually simple. He just didn't play the game. At all. 99% of the time people talk dumb shit about a game here, it's not because they failed to understand it, but because they haven't played it. >Why comment on a game you didn't fucking play at all?Attention. You get attention by saying "strong opinions" you picked up from others when they got attention for them.Monkey see, monkey do. And the sole and only motivation behind all of it is just... engagement. The most addictive drug in the world, as we are painfully learning now.Social media engagement highjacks human reward systems in the same way skinner box reward does - e.g. it's a similar "exploit" of human mental heuristics as gambling is, and similarly addictive and similarly dangerous.
>>726055771>just go guns blazingI tried that and then I found out that while these games allow for a regular shooter approach, devs clearly didn't actually expect people to commit to it. In other words, these games fucking suck as shooters and clearly meant to be played mostly stealthily. Only Dishonored actually delivers two proper distinct playstyles, which they just had to fuck up in the shitty sequel.
>>726039787technically the hacker is a mass murderer by proxy
>>726046097Thief had systems built around nonlethality because the idea was Garret isn't meant to fight people, he just wants to get rich and picking fights would be obstructive to that. The best rewards came from following this logic - this meant players developed a compulsion (in an attempt to maximize reward) to avoid combat and/or killing people entirely. This progressed into people competing to see how nonlethal they could be, resulting in ghost runs. The competitive communities at the time were on PC and with custom levels being a whole thing, there was now a lot more independent creatives coming up with nonlethality measures (and Looking Glass themselves seeing that their playerbase is up to that challenge).Convergently, the first Metal Gear Solid - meant to iterate on Metal Gear 1 and 2 which boasted simulatory elements (not true simulation, just "If you do X, then Y happens! How inventive!") which meant one of the most basic interactions in the game (confronting enemies) would need that same level of engagement: Hence nonlethality. It also offered greater reward since it meant you could save up more resources for the boss encounters, while also offering a way to make the game harder by not being allowed to remove potential enemies. Funnily enough, full no-kill wasn't really expected (Foxhound/Big Boss rank actually could be given with up to 25 enemy kills) but with seeing people actually do it with well under that (including no kills at all), the devs realized similarly to above they had players up to the challenge and made more incentives and systems for it.Funny that you mentioned Hitman, because Eneroth worked on Thief and Deus Ex and was part of that initial group who saw that nonlethality serves as a potential challenge.tl;dr: It's an easy way to make a game harder.
>>726044408they respawned, it's fine
>>726058409>Post good voice acting from the gameMy experience with the game is from actually playing it, not watching some clips on youtube, so I don't have archives of video footage "evidence" (in fact, source in your case) at the ready.But the entire segment after you collapse at the end of the meeting with Hanako, everything between you waking up at Vik to Misty leaving you up on the roof to make your choice, and holy shit the epilogue if you take the short way out, especially from Judy if you romanced her, holy shit.Also, literally everything if you take Hanako's deal and get the treatment. That whole testing loop, V cracking and losing her shit... fucking hell man. There is a lot wrong with CP77, but that is some absolutely amazing work, actually exceptional by ANY media standard - game, movie, theater, you don't get much better voice performance than that.Quite literally Homeworld "Kharak is burning" level shit. At least the female V. I never played as a male V, now that I think about it.
>>726039495Both characters have every reason to kill people in the intro mission especially Jensen.
>>726056425>it's exactly like Deus Exi wish people would stop saying this. it really isn't anything at all like deus ex.
>>726059095Says the guy citing muh video game reviewers to criticize Deus Ex. The only poser here is you
>people unironically defending the voice acting in the originalA few of the characters are fine. Page is good, John Galt's fake chinese accent isn't that bad, and honestly Paul is fine. But holy shit there's a lot of bad voice acting, made even worse by the protagonist being given absolutely retarded direction that just results in it sounding bad on purpose because autistic game designers thought that would make him more of a blank slate. Don't get me wrong, I like it, but I like it because it's bad, not because it's good.
>>726059095>My experience with the game is from actually playing itAnd what, you have such strong dementia you can't remember a quote or anything?
>>726039495I play Deus Ex the way I feel the plot justifies it: non-lethal against the NSF, because a good cop should exercise restraint. The Wall Cloud is the point where the gloves go off, as JC realizes that the stakes are too high: all MJ12 and those who assist the conspiracy must die.
>>726059326>muh "A bomb!"99% of the voice acting is fine
Official tie in comics have him shooting people without issue
>>726039495>Adam Jensen doesn't kill peopleHe kills the bosses in Human Revolution due to bad game design
>>726059326JC and Paul are the same guy
>>726059747Read nigga read. JC only sounds the way he does because they specifically told him to make JC deadpan at all times no matter what because they thought that it would help the player self-insert, I know it's not the actor's fault.
>>726059850>they thought that it would help the player self-insertAnd they were right
>>726058985they can make the game harder by adding more niggers to kill. removing imsim elements and rewarding exp is just gay
>>726059326>>726059747I could never guess. It's impressive how he managed to sound like two completely different people. But some of the female NPCs are very obviously the same actress, very poorly faking a different accent.
>>726059945Shush, whiny little baby. If you're literally just walking through levels without being seen then you get enough XP to buy some email reading upgrades or invisbility. It's the same fucking non-issue as the people who whinge about how just killing people is less XP than takedowns. You're not using the XP, you don't need it. You're hyperfixating on Numbers Go Up like some kind of autistic toddler.
>>726059273>Says the guy citing muh video game reviewers to criticize Deus Ex.What the FUCK are you talking about? Are you high or having a psychotic episode? Where the fuck has ANYTHING about "muh videogame reviewers" or "criticizing DX" come from? The actual fuck is wrong with you?>>726059349>And what, you have such strong dementia you can't remember a quote or anything?Why would I memorize individual lines from a game I finished weeks ago?Again - I get that you get ALL of your knowledge of these games from a handful of youtube vidoes, but normal people don't. I genuinely think you don't have a clue how people actually interact with games. I don't think you understand the basic nature of the thing at all. No, I don't remember direct quotes, other than Judy's "I can't do this..." from that suicide ending. Not to mention, why do you need quotes. Best peformance by V is genuinely barely coherent of "no, fuck you, let me go" etc... during the examination loop. Voiceacting isn't about lines, it's about how they are delivered. And CP77 has a LOT of them. Just the three endings I got each have between 30 minutes to 2 hours of dialogue unique to each, and most of it exceptionally well delivered. Who the fuck would memorize any of that shit.
>>726060309>Why would I memorize individual lines from a game I finished weeks ago?With fans like you who says CP2077 needs detractors lmao
>>726060309>Why would I memorize individual lines from a game I finished weeks ago?What, was the voice acting so bad you immediately forgot anything that might've sounded interesting or struck out to you as a good example of voice acting?
>>726039495Adam goes nonlethal with basic security/cops/gangs but lethal on spec ops like the ones that attacked Sarif Industries in the opening.
>>726055665>voice acting is so badit will lend itself to a scripted unplayable game, much like the obsession with motion capture has. Even desu ex's cutscenes could be interrupted by a security guard. What modern game even permits that now?
>>726046171the word "terrorist" is something political regimes fling at their opponents or whoever is an inconvenience to them. it's a power game, and you're a retard for attaching a moral value to it.
>>726061649spoken like a terrorist
>>726061680by your logic the founding fathers were terrorists too.
>>726061764>organized rebellion against British military forces are the same as bombing centers of civilian activity
>>726060494>With fans like you who says CP2077 needs detractors lmaoAgain. You are having a conversation with one of the many, many voices in your completely broken head.Because you sure as fuck aren't actually talking to me, or about me.You need to have your head checked.>>726060506>What, was the voice acting so bad you immediately forgot anything that might've sounded interesting or struck out to you as a good example of voice acting?I don't think you actually know what voiceacting is.>>726060664>it will lend itself to a scripted unplayable game,Not inherently. High production values aren't not INHERENTLY detrimental to game experiences. CP77 is very deliberately very cinematic. Another game with equally exceptional voiceacting is Homeworld, which is a game from 1999 that is everything but scripted unplayable linear game.As I said: I actually don't think the generally very high expectations on VA is a positive trend in modern gaming. In fact I already explicitly said that for the most part, I think it's a negative trend. One of many, MANY negative trends stemming from legacy of 7th gen gaming.In case of CP77, or in case of Homeworld, or in case of the old Soul Reaver games, or in case of those few stellar moments in Fallout 1 (you know, the whole Master dialogue), absolutely fantastic VA is not a detriment.But then you have a lot more cases more in line with where TES and beth-era Fallout games went. Not to mention the endless flood of PS epic cinematic slop like The Last of Us...If I have to chose, I will always chose better gameplay, or better writting over better VA. Unfortunately, the OVERAL trend is opposite: better VA, better mocap, higher fidelity graphics, at the expense of substance either story, or gameplay wise.None of that changes the fact that DX VA is hilariously bad. That is just a fact. Anyone who played DX will confirm that. Like a lot of ancient grandpa games, I have DX in my top 3 best games ever, but the VA is bad.
>>726061934>b-but it's differentOrganized rebellion, terrorism, the terms are interchangeable these days, used to justify any actions against any opponent. That's my whole point.
>>726046097People took "don't be detected" to both its logical and unnecessary extreme. It's why Thief has Supreme Ghost challenges, where not only are you not allowed to kill anyone, but you can't knock them out, you can't use any items that leave evidence behind, you can't extinguish torches,and you even have to put back all items and keys, along with relocking every door.It makes sense, but it's also really dumb and gay. It's a very shallow take on what being good at stealth is. I ascribe more to the camp that the Iron run is more indicative of things, and that being able to escape and re-hide after getting caught is more of a challenge than slipping through undetected in the first place, which is usually more a measure of patience and tedium anyways (the only way they've found to alleviate this being that people challenge each other to go faster).
>>726062396cool story bro
>>726056675I agree the nonlethal/stealth option having more EXP is a stupid system. The game should just let you pick a path and stick to it, not encourage one over the other by dangling more EXP. I understand the game punishing you for using lethal options though, at least in the sense that it’ll lock you to a certain path, not outright just lecture you about killing digital people
>>726062396No the fuck it isn’t, dumbass. Organized rebellion is committing violent acts against a ruling government body. Terrorism is just going around shooting random innocents to make a statement. It’s like saying George Washington and that kike puppet Brenton Tarrant are the same
>>726065063>the Pentagon being bombed wasn't a violent act against a ruling government body>the financial sector being bombed wasn't a violent act against a ruling government body
>>726039495Jensen shot and killed a kid before the game
>>726042191He stuffs innocent people into dumpsters
>>726057881>What's crazy is what you described is clearly spelled out to you buy other charactersEven better, this fucking rant happens AFTER Johny takes you to Pacifica to prove to you he is absolutely, 100% commited to not interfere with V's agency, in fact the notion that Saka can break one's fundamental personal integrity is what PROMPTS this rant. So he is literally saying "If I have to take over your body I will!" is a DIRECT CONTINUATION of him talking about how taking control of your life is what he sees as the biggest evil in the world, a direct continuation of a dialog that starts with him trying to convince he will never, EVER take over your body, or more precisely, deny you the choice.You don't even have to pay attention to other characters, you can just rewind 4 minutes back and see that he is lying, that what he is saying is an explicit contradiction of what he said minutes earlier.
are we getting a deus ex game after the millennial purge is finished
>>726065981Trying to figure out a canon story for these guys is literally the exact fucking opposite of the point of these games to begin with.And every aspect that people try to use to justify their "canon" interpretation of the story is actually just a purely mechanical factor that has no story relevance.The game rewarding non-violent approach, for an instance - just like it was in Dishonored and before that, Bioshock even - stems from the incorrect assumption that non-lethal gameplay is actually more difficult, and as such should be rewarded proportionally more. There is nothing about Jensen's morality in that. It's just that at least in theory, non-violent approach makes the game harder - avoiding knock-outs entirely means bypassed enemies can still jump you, and knocked-out enemies can be revived if found by enemies, returning them to the pool, unlike dead ones, so they want to reward that THEORETICALLY more risky play with appropriate rewards... except in reality those things don't matter due to nature of the level design. Patrol paths don't cross frequently enough, and enemies don't spontaneously explore enough to make the whole "dead enemy is cross off, unconscious is merely delayed" mechanic be ACTIVELY relevant.Similarly, lack of non-lethal options for bosses isn't about making a message about Jensen being a killer. It's just that they struggled HORRIBLY with the boss-fights, notoriously so, even openly admited themselves that it was the most under-developed part of the game, they just didn't have time and resources to do better. They did plan on much more intricate approaches, but then had to ax all of that because the development was already nightmareish hell.There is nothing else to it.
>>726066659Take a tide pod and calm down, broccoliboy.
>>726066659>are we getting a deus ex game after the millennial purge is finishedProbably not. Wasn't the IP in Embracer's hands before it imploded? I'm pretty sure anything that wasn't pass down to Koch (Middle earth and friends) has been completely iced. Including a new DX game.Then again, that may be for the best. Last time anyone talked about a new DX game, they talked about going full open world, CP77 style, which... well we know how that ended. I know for a fact nobody in Middle Earth owns or works with the IP, and Middle Earth is the only part of Embracers dev suit that is actually active at the moment.
>>726066659It's been way too long. I never asked for this.
>>726066659yeah
>>726046661>>I don't see why you think JC would be more likely, he has Paul actively pushing him towards nonlethalityOnly at first, when you're dealing with the NSF.
I'd argue Jensen cares even less about killing than JC does. He was literally a SWAT officer so he would have killed dozens of people. He was also about 10 years older than JC. And I know you might bring up the thing about Jensen being fired for refusing to kill someone but that was only because the person was a kid. Jensen would give zero fucks about killing mercs and he canonically kills all the boss fights with no fucks given.
You must kill 4 people in HR to complete the game. You only have to kill 1 person in Deus Ex 1.
>>726055329If you liked HR then you will like MD. Highly recommend it. It was very clearly setting up for a sequel though.>>726055771I killed only people I could prove were guilty.
>>726060631I went lethal on the gangs once I overheard two gangbangers talking about how their initiation was just to kill a random innocent. Cleaned up the streets hardcore then.
>>726067682JC nukes the surface of area 51, which kills a lot of soldiers. This happens offscreen, but still, JC did shoot the nuke.
How did "I never asked for this" become such a legendary line? Because it was in the trailer? In game he only says it once and it's a throwaway line in a missable character dialogue.
>>726068401iconic line delivery
>>726068401Its the first line he says in the trailer
Adams games came out at the wrong time. If they came out today they would have been extremely popular.
My pitch for the third AJ game which will never ever be made. >Illuminati is now focused on Adam Jensen given that he's thwarted their plans twice. >Half of them want to kill him and the other half want to capture him>End of the game you find some Illuminati dude and slaughter your way through his bad guys to get him>He (rightly) points out that you have decimated a literal army, tells you you could join him, be a god. Why not take this power and use it to rule?I never asked for this. But now that I have it, I will make sure other people don't get their choices taken from them like I did. >Game ends with the Illuminati realizing that making everyone Augs to control them failed, decide to work on a virus to kill them all.
>>726068804They have aged extremely well. I played through both recently, they are miles ahead of any new releases from the last 5 years.
>>726066659No thanks zoomoid, a new deus ex would break the cringe scale and slop scale in ways not even thought possible
>>726046097Im Sims fell for the pacifist challenge meme even tho im sims like DX1 barely gave a shit if you killed anyone past the first 2 hours in fact going pure pacifist is impossible anyway
>>726046097It should always be that stealth might make things easier for you and killing certain characters might lock you out of quests or something but the combat should always be there and you should always have the option to go loud and try and shoot your way out. I agree Hitman should be an exception since that's his whole thing but for Deus Ex, you should be able to send a message/wipe out enemies.
>>726046097"If you kill your enemies then they win" - Sun Tzu, The Art of War
>>726069842good goyim
>>726065063terrorism is political by definition retard. the fact that the current administration in the US purposely uses it to mean "le bad guys" doesn't change reality.
>>726068804>If they came out today they would have been extremely popular.The first game WAS incredibly popular. In fact, DXHR was a LOT MORE praised than it would be today exactly and precisely because of the era when it came out. DXHR came out at the peak of 7th gen frustration. It was the first game in like 3 years to break the ice and for a moment, dislodge the overwhelming sentiment that gaming has degenerated due to consoles. People overlooked a LOT of issues with it exactly because by standards of 7th gen gaming, it was a FUCKING MIRACLE. Where as today, most of those sentiments have long since been disproven, to a point where being an im-sim lost its novelty. After Dishonored and nu-Prey, nobody would really bat an eye at HR.And MD wasn't exactly unpopular either. It came out after the 7th gen curse, so a lot of the shock value was gone, and more importantly it felt unfinished, but what was there was solid. What pissed people off was just what wasn't there - the whole fucking third act of the game was missing. Which would be just as annoying today as it was back then.
>>726070597MD is the Halo 2 problem, it sets up for a sequel. Except worse because we have no sequel.
>>726039495JC predominantly fights MJ12 soldiers who are literally the Devil's army while Adam fights more neutral parties.
>>726071425Adam fights people working for the loominarty, same shit.
>>726070957>MD is the Halo 2 problem, it sets up for a sequel.I'll take your word for that, since I never played Halo 2, at least not enough of it to pass any other judgement beyond "this is absolute garbage from a technical standpoint, quite literally unplayable by PC standards."I don't know much about Halo franchise. But this setting up for a sequel issue was - and somewhat still is, a widespread problem these days.I mean look at nu-Prey's ending for fuck sake. Or Alien Isolation. In fact, I can think of at least 3 games suffering from this "setting up a sequel and sacrificing good story in the process" per 1 that actually feels like it ends where it was supposed to end.
>>726068279War should have casualties, even captain America has killed. Just don’t relish in it.
>>726060167kys faggot. learn what an imsim is. it's about player agency
>>726042191He's too busy going through the 9000th loading screen to actually do anything of note.
>>726072902And wondering why the FUCK is his pistol using the same ammo as the god damn flame thrower.God damn Invisible War was fucking stupid.
>>726073048Wasn't a big part of the issue that they had to make everything retarded because consoles were fucking garbage? To the point the game doesn't have any actual loading screen but instead crashes and reboots the whole fucking game? Because the consoles were crap and would have been stuck at it?
>>726042191Only kills people by accidentKills a lot of mutants though
>>726046856>Marchenko never appears in the Dvali theatre hideout in person in the actual game.makes you wonder how much of the content they initially planned for MD got pushed over to the sequel that never happened
Deus Ex bros, what games capture the same feel?I tried enjoying cyberpunk years ago but it was still garbage.
>>726073137>Wasn't a big part of the issue that they had to make everything retarded because consoles were fucking garbage?Yes. That was absolutely the biggest problem of it. But by no means the sole one, just the most fucking obvious and glarring one.A lot of people tend to satisfy themselves with the console excuse. And for understandable reasons: the level design, the U.I. the general scale of things, just the whole tech behind it, all of that was indeed fault having to adjust for the shitshow that was gen 6 tech, particularly Xbox.But in the process, they also forget that there was a LOT wrong with it that cannot be excused by consoles. The universal ammo thing for an instance. A LOT of the TERRIBLE story and writing choices. The EXTREME inconsistency of the art style. The bad world building overal.It's very obvious that NOTHING was going right during the development, and desperately struggling to make something even remotely playable on those pieces of junk was just one component of a much wider shitshow.I guess the fact that the game was backed by microsoft (under the console parity demand) resulted in AWFUL scheduling and may have just demoralized the team. I know the devs talked a lot about how absurdly rushed they were by Microsoft.
>>726054843I like it. It's the most replayable in the series because it's short, you can make different builds from the start, and there are a few more choices. Plus the graphics with hard shadows are kind of cool, like Doom3 or FEAR. There's a lot of jank though.
>>726073678>I tried enjoying cyberpunk years ago but it was still garbage.Unfortunately, CP77 genuinely is the closest thing we got to DX (or at least, Jensen games). You could try nu-Prey if you haven't played that yet, it's an im-sim true and proper, though the tone is completely different, and frankly, it's much more closely related to the System Shock family than to DX.Still, it's the last big budget pure im-sim we got. There was HR, Dishonored, MD, Dishonored 2, nu-Prey, and that is where that renaissance ended. CP77 did try to pick up the pieces, and frankly, I don't think they did a terrible job of it as of 2.3 (and if you use a few mods to iron out the remaining kinks), but CP77 is chasing a lot more goals than just being a DX spiritual sequel, and as a result, it's unfocused and limited compared to DX/HR/MD. It gets the basics more-or-less right, but dilutes the formula instead of perfecting it. Besides it being mostly limited to Gigs, while most main story missions are setpiece-focused gimmicks, the gigs are too small, or the patrol paths and layouts just a bit too unrefined. They feel like either half, or a beta of a Jensen-era DX game.Which is still better than what most modern day open world RPG's give us, but not enough to satisfy the real DX itch if you have one.
>>726068804They were popular. The problem is squareenix unrealistically expected they would sell like Call of Duty instead of like Deus Ex.
>>726073678syndicate(2012) and observer are somewhat similarmaybe also hitman and mirror's edge
>>726046171Shut it flatlander woman.
>>726042191Someone needs to remake the game in DX1 engine.It will be 1000s times more playable right away.Or get a source code and redo the game.The "crashing" to load next level is so retarded. And the constant loading screens thanks to Xbox>>726044221>Anna NavarreI managed to knock her out once. What's amazing, I carried her across levels. An ass to tap for JC
>>726075315>syndicate(2012)Syndicate has a similar atmosphere but plays nothing like deus ex. Damn I wish we got a Syndicate sequel, it felt so much like the Riddick games.
>>726039495Criminals aren't people
>>726039495Jensen just humiliates opponents with his superiority. Just look at his glasses, his coat with intricate patterns. It's all about style. He can activate Typhoon or his blades at any moment
