Aonuma is right, some people just cling to their outdated childhood games instead of enjoying superior experiences now.
>>726073243cringe L bozo
I couldn't care less about BotW's "freedom". I'm playing Twilight Princess for the first time in many years and reminded what Zelda was alll about. Going forward and seeing the story, and overcoming gameplay with puzzles and combat along the way. Having a centralized map where you're expected to horse around for 100 hours doesn't make for a very cherished memory. BotW's and TotK's worlds felt empty because they're literally 100 times bigger than previous 3D Zeldas, but there's also around 0.2% the amount of storyline, and they deliberately skimp on the story just to tie it in with a Musou spinoff 2-3 years after launch in a self-advertisement model, feeding off of your stupid FOMO instincts.I just gave up on Nu-Zelda. I'm not even playing the new Hyrule Warriors. I replayed BotW/TotK when I got Switch 2 but I realize I well and truly hate them. I finished them but they feel like one giant waste of time.
>>726073617TP is infamously criticized for not being what Zelda is about, exploration, discovery, adventure. It has the best traditional 'lock & key' dungeons in the franchise though.
>>726073243This way of thinking is very common unfortunately.If you ever wonder why they refuse to make say a classic re style game or atb Final Fantasy.It's because of this stupid mindset.
>>726073841TP is what defines Zelda to a lot of people. For me it's OoT. I played the originals and ALttP later in life, and I see most of the DNA in those. TP was around the time when the progression of ideas reached a stalemate because they started questioning what Zelda was really about.Everyone will say BotW was the rediscovery of that, but to me it's just Nintendo kowtowing to industry trends and making their own Ubisoft game when they were like, the last company left NOT making those kinds of games, and that being the sole reason I still held on dearly to Nintendo. Now they're the ones trying to make every game yet-another-open world FOMO experience. Mario. "But it's Open World". "Metroid Prime 4?", "It has Open World. It's HUUUGE", "Mario Kart". "It has an Open World SANDBOX now."Nintendo is ran by the Market Research & Analytics department.You guys see "art". I just see the cynicism of business taking the last ounce of soul in the industry and running it into the ground with everything that was already on a crashing course.
well make a game better than diablo 2 and i won't have to
>>726073243He's right on the fact that BotW and TotK are the most played, most sold and had the most awards a zelda game has ever gotten. They are good
>>726073243Absolute freedom isn't all that great. Even comparing just botw and totk, I feel like totk's abilities give too much freedom so every shrine is so easily cheesed. Without any restraint I found little satisfaction in doing totk's shrines. There was a lot of freedom, but there wasn't a lot of fun.
>>726074339It was Skyrim that did them in. Like it released around the same time as Skyward Sword and it got all the attention and praise, where Skyward Sword sold very mediocre for a zelda game. To make it worse when Japanese developers were deciding their favourite games for 2011 Skyrim was the most popular choice (Dark Souls was second), but Skyward Sword was nowhere to be seen. Back in 1998 Zelda was basically THE fantasy video game series, but by 2011 it was very apparent that it did not hold that crown anymore.They can frame it as a noble return to form, but you're absolutely correct that it was them chasing industry trends that they foolishly abandoned. Funnily a lot of botw's design is rooted in 2011 games, like the shrines are basically just portal test chambers, and it was trying to give the freedom of something like minecraft or skyrim, and they chucked all that in a blender and called it Zelda.
BotW and especially TotK felt like such a chore.Kinda like work after work. Recent Pokemon games with their checklists are like that too.To be honest I was glad once the game was over... Not sure I would play another zelda game like that.
>>726073243I don't give a fuck about "freedom" in a video game
Sandboxes are generally a bore.
Aonuma is not welcome to speak opinions on video games anymore after not committing suicide in response to ToTK
>>726073243We used to have passion projects crafted with love, not copypasted slop for braindead retards
>>726074339Damn that bitch ugly
>>726075447>too much freedomno such thing, they should give the players more freedom in the next game.
>botw represents total loss of SOVL of Zelda and Nintendo>Chinese step up, grab its system and for the first time, deliver SOVLit's like something out of an epic poem. Crazy how the names genshin and honkai replaced the names Zelda and final fantasy in a 4-5 year period. Ironically this chiefly happened because the makers of Zelda and final fantasy actively hate their fans/customers.
Breath of the Wild is the best Zelda game. My first Zelda was NES. I did NOT play the n64 games because I was poor and have zero nostalgia for that era of Zelda. My second Zelda was Wind Waker and it was the best Zelda ever.Twilight Princess was ok on Wii but I didn't appreciate it until the much better Wii U version. I did not play Skyward Sword.BotW IS peak Zelda. Tears of the Kingdom is fine but I'm so burnt out on BotW that it's hard for me to get into it but it has a much better living world.It's that simple fellas. I'm not even talking about all the other 2D Zeldas after NES. Many of those are fantastic but for most of you fags Zelda is a 3D (N64) game.
What about players who missed out on many games during their childhood and played them for the first time already in their 20s, 30s or even later?
>>726077515
BOTW and TOTK are the closest games in the series to the original NES gamesI think the real problem with BOTW and TOTK is that they give you so much freedom and choice but ultimately it doesn't matter since all the game events still play out the same (just in a different order). To really bring the current zelda game style to the next level they need to implement more reactivity and agency to the world, if Link is too busy fucking around in zora domain even though hyrule castle is about to be attacked then the event should just happen without him and next time he shows up the castle is in a ruin or some npcs are dead or whatever. Make it feel like what he does is actually important and you're not just dicking around until you can finally be bothered doing a main objective
>>726073243A very powerful argument indeed.
>>726077742>ultimately it doesn't matter since all the game events still play out the sameah, like a randomizerI hear those are all the rage.
>>726073243>why do you want us to do our jobs and craft a proper experience?
>>726077215They should sell you a license to use the IP within your own imagination where you'll be free to do absolutely anything.
>>726073243He's right but he's also wrongYes, it's true, the old Zelda formula isn't interesting anymore to anyone with half a brain. Those games are just kind of slick and satisfying, but in the end all you do in them is to put the cube in the cube shaped hole over and over again. They have a knack for making you feel smart and accomplished for solving a puzzle even though what you do to solve them is toddler tier.One the other hand, too much freedom isn't good either. When I played through TotK I felt like I had to constantly restrain and gimp myself in order to not just outright skip all the fun stuff. Like there's a cool gauntlet in the gerudo canyon now that you can just completely skip over with ease if you take advantage of Link's powers. It is also no surprise that for a lot of people the most memorable moment of BotW was the gauntlet to the Zora's domain where you're kind of limited with climbing because of all the rain and therefore have to take the road the designers want you to unless you're insanely persistent. In the end, restricting the player is part of game design too. For example, if Leon in original RE4 was able to shoot while moving, but you could just restrict yourself and not move whenever you shoot if you want a challenge, that wouldn't actually be a very good argument for things being that way. Because of the freedom you have in TotK you can beat the entire game with just 2 fans and a steering element. Now granted, not everyone is going to do that, I certainly didn't. But I think a game has a responsibility to nudge players toward varied and interesting play styles should have some curated challenges.
>>726077742I don't know what you mean by "games" when 2 is pretty much linear in its dungeon order. Even zelda 1 has certain dungeons you have to do in an order. Alttp is the closest as a game to the first zelda.
>>726073243the most effective open worlds are defined by the limitations they place on the player--"player choice" isn't the end all be all of game design, and ultimately leads to a kind of toothless sandboxy game experience. think of the geological barriers of death stranding, the bottlenecks and difficulty walls of elden ring, running out of gas in days gone....these are the moments where meaning and interesting gameplay happennu-zelda felt insulting on multiple levels to me, namely bizarrely obtuse UI choices, unfun survival systems and overreliance on the player finding their own reason to care (because it's freakin zelda!) without actually giving them a reason to care. BOTW was a worthwhile experiment but it seems silly to hold it up as some inevitable evolution in game design
I hope AI will give me a good AlttP sequel.I liked the 3ds sequel too.They just took ubishart towers and were inspire by skyrim. I think most people are tired by that kinda play loop nowadays. Japs are lagging behind hard on everything recently.
>>726078318Without restrictions it isn't really a game, it's a crappy physics simulator
>>726077742The NES Zelda was shit though
>>726078430>it seems silly to hold it up as some inevitable evolution in game designIt's the same company that put out "make your own Mario game, we're busy" more than once.
>>726078478I mean it does have hundreds of handcrafted challenges but not once are you forced to actually tackle them. Also, I felt like in BotW the non intended puzzle solutions were always more ingenious than the intended ones, whereas TotK flips the script and the non intended puzzle solutions are brain-dead and easier to execute than the intended ones.
>>726078478Sandboxes are the meatiest games.
Why the fuck do the Japanese hate the foundation of what their work is built on? top of IT IS ASTOUNDINGLY frustrating how little they care about the classics.
There's shitloads of indie 2D and even 3D action adventure games that do the old Zelda formula, whether playing it straight or adding some twists like Blossom Tales having the whole "kids write the story" gimmick that lets you fuck with dungeons in a metafictcional way or Trigger Witch which swaps out the sword for guns, and even some from bigger publishers like Darksiders.But none of you guys will play them or talk about them you just want to be performative faggots on the internet because BOTW/TOTK are so popular and successful you just have to be contrarian even on an anonymous Mongolian ceramic making forum.
>>726079261most Zelda clones are trans and millennial angst coded
Look at Blizzfags. They are the perfect example of manchildren who can't move the fuck on.
>>726073617>story story storyYou don't like video games.
>>726079261>comparing Zelda to DarksidersAs if that isn't a damning statement for the series.
1. Zelda II2. Twilight Princess3. OOT4. Majora's Mask5. whatever who cares about the restBOTW was boring. I'm fairly certain MGSV was a big influence on development, and they seemed to have taken all the wrong lessons from it. I dropped it and never played TOTK.
>>726078460ff16 felt like game of thrones.by the time the game came out everybody stopped caring about that show. kek
I like Ultrahand but I think I hate it for Zelda.I play Zelda for fantasy, not building rockets and windmills
>>726076228This is accurate. I would watch your YouTube essay
>>726073243Or a lot of games in the past were more refined. Years of the kingdom has too many damn systems that just aren’t fun or aesthetic to use. Amazing programming feat, but I never thought any to play it or a game like it again. Not only is there the building which was made better by the blue print system, but all the weapons get shit smacked on them with goo.
>>726073243I can understand why someone that had his brain fully broken working on the same series for his entire career would think that. Especially when in boomlennial's opinion he peaked so early.There is a point where player freedom is expanded too far and dilutes the experience overall thoughever. Open world slop like BotW definitely shows how that can happen.
>>726073243>Why do you want immersive dungeons with complex puzzles? That's so outdated, but I understand where you're comming from.
>>726073841Zelda 1 you could traverse the whole overworld in 3 minute and almost every dungeon and point of interest was laid out on a map that came with the game.Zelda 2 was explore dungeon,get an item in the dungeon, beat boss, use said item to access new area of the overworld to find new dungeon. Repeat process until end credits. Zelda has never been a exploration, discovery, adventure series. It has always been a dungeons/bossfights game with some overworld/sidequest/puzzles/story mixed in. Zelda lost it's way when the game stopped being about the dungeons.
>>726073617>what Zelda was alll aboutFunny, it made me drop Zelda from how formulaic it was. It was OK for 3-4 games, until MM, but after that it overstayed it's welcome.BotW was a breath of fresh air, although the dungeons disappointed from how short they were.
>>726081108LmaoZelda 1 was pure adventure. The map didn't reduce the feeling of discovery or exploration, it rather enhanced it.
>>726074339Zelda was always open world. Botw just overcame the technical limitations to go all out
>>726073243>superior experiencesWhat superior experiences? The game telling me that men are bad? Niggers everywhere? Faggots shoved in my face? Girlbosses who I don't want to fuck?
>>726081108The original Zelda's were all about being what Shiggy described as a miniature garden you could return back to and you exchange secrets and discoveries with other gamers.
>>726081548It's modern gamers who are failing the spirit of Zelda, doing shit like blind playthroughs, they never understood Zelda, they latched onto the prototypical modern adventure game Ocarina of Time, and they think that it's perfect and games need to replicate it 100% or it doesn't measure up. All stupid shit.
>>726073243
>>726081986Was it too hard for you to use paint? You needed ai to put a crown on her?
>>726082164I didn't make it
>>726082164>ai ugh cringe
>>726082331You saved it
>>726082164damn, the absolute state of you fags kek.Cry some more bitch.
>>726077682drink acid
STOP PLAYING LINK TO THE PAST NOW STOP IT
>>726073617see i would agree with you if zelda's story, gameplay and puzzles weren't complete garbage only a little piss baby can enjoy. Only thing BotW has worse is puzzles, story and gameplay are so many orders of magnitude better it's not even funny
>>726083978it's on blotter, you loon
I'd happily embrace the new vision if it was any fun, but it isn't.Its a barren, boring empty world with pointless quests because all the retards are things that break, even supposed LEGENDARY weapons shatter as easily as some sword I got from a basket, and don't get me started on the fucking master sword running out of energy, the Ganon fight is also a joke, mostly just a cinematic setpiece.I got more mileage out of TOTK but that was mostly cause I enjoyed building things, once the novelty wore off I stopped caring. I'll take linear progression with a set of items in each dungeon over this new path Zelda has taken.
>>726073243>'Why do you want to back to a type of game where you're more limited or more restricted in the types of things or ways you can play?"If you really don't know the answer, that's why you lost GOTY you fucking faggot.
At least indie games give me what I want from a game.
