>falls off after acquiring the lordvesselwhy?
>>729084771ngl u kinda spittin it fell off after acquiring the lordvessel desu
>>729084771Fast travel makes exploration a lot less engaging because you're no longer worried about being stuck in a tough spot without an easy way to get out. That relative lack of tension is palpable in every subsequent DS game that lets you fast travel right away too.
>>729084771Because you repeat this meme until you gaslight yourself into believing it's true. In fact most of the best/most memorable levels (New Londo, Tomb of the Giants, Dukes Archive, Painted world) are in the second half. The only crappy stage is Lost Izalith and the Demon Ruins.
>>729084931This, I'll always remember how fucking isolated I felt whenever I was at the bottom of the depths for my first time and my only options are to backtrack through some stinking sewers or continue headfirst into the river of shit in blight town.Have some consequences to the path you take makes the game so much more interesting and memorable.New Londo is fairly interesting, but Demon Ruins is just it's own isolated region with no interaction between other zones, just one major shortcut that leads to itself. Similar situation for the Archives, they're isolated with one enterance.Tomb/Crypts has the strange balancing where Crypts expects you to visit sooner so it's trivial if you wait until you actually need to visit, especially if you put it off until you have a sunlight bug I have no idea if that's the expected progression or what.Deep darkroot is pretty cool.
>>729085050Most players go through Painted World before beating O&S for the Lordvessel DOE
>>729085336I have literally never done painted world before O&S, in all the 20 playthroughs I've done of this game.
>>729085419why not
>>729084771That type of level design is difficult if you don’t scope for it and design around the fact that it takes a lot of playtesting. Fromsoft essentially in my uninformed opinion tried to make that looping level design twice. They met roadblocks for the second and we got what we gotYou can see parallels with RE1 PS1 where it starts as a looping level concept and then sequentially focus down into zones after the initial mansion. Which is essentially what DS1 did but stumbled their way ass backwards into it.Gamers and DS1 fags don’t like to hear it but that type of looping for game design is immensely difficult and time consuming. It can be offset by studying Dungeon design and FPS level design pre-2013 before it all became 3 lane corridors
>>729085694he's a guide eating retard
>>729085419You want to revist asylum asap because you can get the rusty ring for the swamp, might as well grab the doll too. Painted world isn't particularly hard that you want to delay it.
>>729085419You've never thought to do the Asylum runback before Blighttown so you can have the rusted iron ring for the swamp section? I always grab the peculiar doll while I'm at it. I assume you just pick the master key and go straight to Quelaag's from Valley of Drakes, right?
>>729085694I dunno. I guess I never did a Lifehunt Scythe Build?
>>729084771Because the second half of the game is either filled with obnoxious gimmicks like Tomb of the Giants being dark as fuck, annoying to traverse, like New Anor Londo, or a mixture of both along with being rushed, like Lost Izalith Game is still great but it takes a big drop in quality and only survives that drop thanks to the fantastic Library and Crystal Caves at the end
>>729085830>>729085837I go back to the asylum on the return from Parish usually. I just think it's weird to start Anor Londo then leave for the painting halfway through. Especially when you have the Giant Blacksmith unlock at the end of Anor Londo. It doesn't make sense to go do Painted World first unless you have some build related thing you want.
>>729086251>halfway through.It's barely that, you haven't even started Anor Londo.
>>729086419What a strange hill to die on.
>>729084771it doesn't.
>>729084771The core design philosophy of DS1 only has enough steam to last until Sen's Fortress. Anor Londo feels like a natural conclusion to the game and it would probably be better if it ended there. The post-AL areas have to rely on gimmicks that don't really work and aren't much fun (TotG, New Londo, Archives) or are just plain unfinished (Lost Izalith).
>>729084771I wish OP falls off a cliff
>>729086462Just my opinion, I don't see how it interrupts Anor Londo at all when that zone hasn't even started before you do the silly greatbow run across the roof.
>>729086251I always look forward to Painted World in my playthroughs. It's brief, tightly designed, and entirely self-contained, so it can be completed in under 2 hours without a hitch. Comparatively, Anor Londo is a slog.>>729086462What are you blabbering about? He's right. You just take an elevator, fight a gargoyle, and kill some painting guardians to get to the Painted World. You haven't reached Anor Londo proper yet.
>>729084771that's when the interconnectedness of the level design no longer has value. The shortcuts you unlock are redundant and not valuable when you can just warp everywhere.
>>729085830you can clear the game fine without rusted ring. It’s not riveting game wading through the swamp or trying to fight the hydra, but it’s doable.
>>729086580In the old Metroidvania sense it's not a bad idea, like in SotN once you reach the top of the castle and beat Richter, the situation changes, you get a new objective, you have to re-explore the castle under a new condition with new abilities and fight on again until you reach the real final boss.I see the lordvessel as an attempt to do the same thing, only you don't gain any new exploration abilities and nothing in the world changes it's just a few roadblocks have been opened.Good idea, terrible execution.
>>729086791You can clear the game fine without picking up the doll too.
>>729085050You can do new londo before the lord vessel if you kill the NPC on top of the church
>>729086960But if you do that then you can't do the DLC before Sif and you miss out on the few frames of bonus cutscene.
ironically I played through the two best areas in the game (painted world and catacombs) after getting the lordvessel
>>729086791You can beat the game in a diaper and ringless but it's not very fun.
>falls off right at the beginning of the game
>>729087651Getting ganked is not so bad when the enemies are so slow, if this were in ER these guys would dash at you within an instant and immediately start doing a 5 hit combo.
>>729087651>13k souls>9 estus flasks>+1lol
>>729086960I thinks it's a little disingenuous to say these areas aren't allowed to be counted in the second half because you can technically do them before O&S. By your definition the second half of the game is just Lost Izalith, Tomb of the Giants and Duke's Archives.
>>729087852>if this were a good game than the enemies would be enemiesWow amazing analysis
>the first half is good j-just trust me broand yet there's not one single webm of this mythical "first half" that has ever made the game look good.
I like the capra demon boss fight.
Painted World is kino.
>if you run instead of fighting the enemies...you run instead of fighting enemiesfascinating
>>729087150that always bothered me, kind of wish they made the alternate cutscene for the Sif fight the main one if you have the DLC installed, just because the chosen undead hasn't been to oolacile yet doesn't mean they won't later, Plus it'd leave new players wondering "why did the giant wolf do that?"
>>729084771Because they ran out of time, Miyazaki himself said so in the designworks doc. Funnily enough, his simps leave that part out when they insist Izalith was actually "le great".
Why can't we save Quelaag and reason with her?
>>729084771cause fast travel is boring and ruins the game (play DS2 no-bonfires)cause you pretty much max out and dont progress anymoresome crappy/unfinished levels
>>729088265no one cares about you clowning for clipsits a great game with fun combat
It does but people exaggerate by how much. I find that the decline in quality is lower than say post-Drangleic Castle in DS2 but you don't see as many people specifically complaining about that. Bloodborne also falls off once you step inside Yahar'gul (except for the kidnap event) and Sekiro's endgame has so much recycled content in Ashina Castle that it's possibly the most egregious case of fall off in quality on the second half but nobody talks about it.In other words, how infamous Dark Souls 1's second half is shows the power of memes more than anything else. People repeat it because they hear it.>>729085830I do this too nowadays but you have literally no way of knowing this on your first playthrough. You're already in a minority if you find that you can revisit the asylum at all to begin with, let alone the most optimal time to go on a first playthrough.
>>729088069>By your definition the second half of the game is just Lost Izalith, Tomb of the Giants and Duke's Archives.Yes.
>>729089847I feel like finding the asylum revisit is easier than progressing, I know I found it by exploring when I was putting off exploring darkroot or the depths. Firelink seems designed to encourage you to explore it, not to mention player signs.
>>729090973Finding that you can reach that place is one thing, but to not assume you're missing something and just have to wait a long time to trigger the cutscene is the harder part. Especially if you did the Catacombs first and saw that nothing happens if you stay in the coffin no matter how long unless you have the right item.
>>729088265>webmswho caresThere's some guy here who posts webms of Dark Souls 2 all day, and one of them is the old knights in Heide Tower who aggro together if you move too far forward. He claims that this makes DS2 better. Well guess what, that's one, scripted enemy encounter, and I'm currently playing through DS2 and every single unscripted enemy does the same shit as in any other FromSoft game: ignoring that you attacked their friends right in front of them unless you walk into their bubble. Earthen Peak is full of it.Webms don't represent the games accurately, they're almost always cherrypicked footage by autists arguing in bad faith, especially when they're trying to portray something in a negative light.
>>729084771they didn't finish it properlyoh well, it happens
Lost Izalith gets the criticism (I think one of the developers said something?) but it's like the 2nd most developed area.
>>729084931It's fantastic how blighttown is oh god that area while also giving you the most fun you can get out of DS
>>729086656who cares though lol
>>729088265>anon is surprised when low int enemy act like a low int enemy
>>729092860giant puddle of lava full of unfinished enemies, yeah, 2nd most developed area
Because everything up to the lordvessel is a gradual layered mystery that is carefully ordered to inform the player of the world they are exploring. By the time you get the lordvessel and talk to Frampt the player NEEDS to understand the weight of what they are doing. The player needs to be guided through the world and shown the areas of importance and the masters who rule them. After the lordvessel it's "you know what to do, take this big cup to these four locations (in any order you want) then you can fight the final boss". The writing doesn't need to be interesting anymore
>>729088082damn this guy fucking sucks
>>729093161I mean the tomb of the giants area is a ledge and cave with pinwheels. Maybe you could shoot for 3rd if you like drained new londo.
>>729084771>[The hate is] overblown. I think people dislike it just because of the ability to warp changing the feeling of the game. The only areas that are worse in quality are Lost Izalith and the Demon Ruins, but i. I accidentally rushed through them both, ii. they're really short anyways, and iii, I did them last so they didn't really 'sour' the rest of the second half for me. I do like them conceptually and to a certain extent aesthetically--cities built into rock walls are just really interesting--but the bonfires, the dragon legs, and the frequent bosses caught me off guard. It honestly reminded me of Dark Souls II. Bed of Chaos sucked though. It just wasn't fun. I also died too many times before realizing that the orbs (?) didn't reset, but that can be attributed to me being dumb.>The other areas are on par with the first half imo, it just becomes somewhat of a different game with the warping ability. Not worse, just different.
>>729085050This. I don't know which breadtuber started this meme, but I'm tired of people regurgitating it as if its their own idea. It feels like bitter DS2 and DS3 truthers trying to take shots at the more influential game
>>729092860>Enter area>Dozens of dragon legs aggro >After killing them explore the area>Nothing>Go upstairs>Looks pretty cool>It's just two hallways with basic bitch enemiesThey went for a larger scale while simultaniously putting in less than previous areas. It just makes it feel rushed. The squidpit was cool but also empty though
>>729093896>breadtuberUnironically Hbomberguy in his defense of DS2
>>729093896>This. I don't know which breadtuber started this meme, but I'm tired of people regurgitating it as if its their own ideaYoutubers just reguritate whatever the common sentiment of the masses who played the game at the time of release was.
