>>729406940
pokemon at least still makes money
nobody cares about ff anymore

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Pokémon, no contest.
The first 20 years and six generations of this franchise will forever live in my heart.

>>729406940
Ofc it's FF, pokemon is literally the same game since the 90's

>>729406940
Pokemon has the shittier games, but is still faar more relevant than nu-FF.

Final Fantasy and it's not even close.

>>729407163
this can't be real

>>729406940
Pokemon

>>729406940
Final Fantasy has been under an ancient curse since Sakaguchi was punted.

>>729406940
No one here plays Final Fantasy so they'll all say Pokemon.

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>>729407163
XY/Z > OS > DP = PM23/Horizons > AG = PM19/Journeys > BW > powergap >>> SM

>>729406940
Zoo Aids was the lolz of this shitty gaming year

>>729406940
pokemon, anyone that says otherwise is functionally retarded. 16 was so much better than za it's not funny.

>>729406940
At least Final Fantasy still produces high budget games. Pokémon doesn't even have voice acting which FF has had for 25 years now.

Is has to be Pokemon, yes its still popular but the decline in quality is 100% greater to the point that they have to sue a chink game called palworld to save face.

>>729406940
FF had forgettable titles but it is kind of staying afloat with 14, and there's also people who seem to enjoy the 7 remake. Modern Pokemon is just pure shovelware slop now. Absolutely no effort. Every time a new one comes out it's the same cycle of people hating how cheaply made it is and the only lasting impact is one or two characters that become FOTMs

>>729407154
>RBY
Broken but interesting and nostalgic.
>GS
Best world, story, etc, but gameplay is still pretty broken. Peak early pokemon.
>RSE
Good solid games, too much water.
>DPP
Introduced phsyical special split, so kino for that, and platinum was nice, but the pokemon designs really started to plummet here.
>HGSS
GS but with physicla special split and more content. Absolute peak of the whole series.
>BWB2W2
Visuals are hardcore trash and designs at very hit or miss.
>XY
Trash
>ORAS
Kino, close to peak, but visuals are still worse than HGSS and there's still too much water.
>everything else
Crap crap crap

>>729406940
Pokemon. Final fantasy was always trash.

>>729406940
Pokemon easily. Final Fantasy just lost relevance due dumb "too big to fail" mindset with a constant stream of low quality games for what the series was known for. Pokemon only makes money; only saving grace to the holders, laughingstock for everyone

>>729406940
The one that's obviously been in jeopardy for years. I'm trying to figure out how this even happened to the FF series.

FF had the greater fall. Pokemon mainline games are still mostly the same, which is another issue sure. But with FF you couldn't convince someone that the last few would even be in the series.

>>729406940
one is the biggest media franchise ever the other has a 100 page shitpost to swing stock prices. or are you asking me personally? I can play sword and shield right now and actually make a fun time out of it somehow. I'd rather do a lot of other shit before playing FF16. I'd probably be a janny before playing ff16 it's that rough.

>>729407990
>GS best story
I love Silver as a rival but is that enough for it?

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>>729406940
For what its worth, Pokemon is still Pokemon.

Final Fantasy is just raped. Tried to sell out to a different audience that hates Final Fantasy and then failed at it. Utterly pathetic.

>>729408647
I feel like with how much money Pokemon makes, the low quality of the games is a bigger showcase of the series falling. With the leaked budgets we know that they spent less than 1% of what Scarlet and Violet made to make ZA. There's no excuse for that, it's honestly the biggest insult in all of gaming. ZA has some good ideas and an okay base but it's a repetitive low quality kusoge that's a tech demo for something that could have been amazing. The fact that they're charging $100 for the entire package is mind boggling.

Rebirth is also better than anything Pokemon has put out in the past decade. Fuck, Stranger of Paradise was better. Let Team Ninja make some edgy grimdark Pokemon game, Nintendo. That would have been a more interesting Ditto game than Pokopia, if you transform into different pokemon for different movesets to swap between.

>>729406940
FF. But only because the best FF games are better than the best pokemon games by a country mile.

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I, BITCHachu-sama, mascot of the HIGHEST-GROSSING FRANCHISE and JOBBER of the vidya industry humbly kneel to:

Shuntaro Furukawa-sama, former employee of TPC, current Nintendo CEO, and my master.

TPC-sama, my one and only true love and other master.

Atlus-sama, who I shamelessly ripped off via SMT for my gameplay only for them to strike back with CHADsona.

Palworld-sama, who my daddy Furukawa warned me about.

Enix-sama, who easily manhandled me with Dragon Quest Monsters.

Yugi Muto and Kazuki Takahashi-sama, who anally raped me and first awakened my wish to become a TCG and merchandising franchise first and foremost.

Junichi Masuda-sama, who argued with me and his employees at GameFreak so hard, his departure started to cause the quality of my games to decrease and got me attracted to MEN...

Squaresoft-sama, whose incomparabily soulful JRPGs in the 90s crushed my ass-womb entirely to the point I STILL cannot SUPRASS them, even 22 years after merging with Enix-sama.

Bamco-sama, whose hour-long beatings from the recent Digimon gamed gave me uncontrollable orgasms so massive even the anal rape from Furukawa-sama can't compare.

Itoi-sama, for his Mother Trilogy is the superior JRPG series of my Nintendo MASTERS, and has single-handedly inspired more Indie RPGs than even I have...

Level-5-sama, whose power I am scared of (I am glad they stopped making Yokai Watch and didn't kill my beloved masters, as I was too scared to help them…)

Sandfall-sama, who revenge-raped and mindbroke me and my fanbase via E33 from the sheer pleasure of being made into an onahole after Legends Z-A FLOPPED in France. (I was so sad about it...)

and finally, Monolithsoft-sama, for they will FUCK ME up on the world stage once they release their Zelda RPG and expose me and GameFreak for the frauds we are. (God I hope so…)

>>729406940
Pokemon never had a real decline to speak of, because it basically stagnated right out of the gate. It's not really a decline when you just continue to flop laterally, is it?

So FF kind of wins this one by default.

>>729408756
Yes. Less is more.

>>729409858
>Pokemon never had a real decline to speak of
>from games aiming for more to "people just rather play on their phone"

>>729409858
It’s still kind of amazing how Pokemon can shit out the most dog shit games that are massively buggy but people will still buy millions of copies

>>729409858
gsc is more ambitious than basically every game that came afterwards

>>729409267
>I feel like with how much money Pokemon makes, the low quality of the games is a bigger showcase of the series falling.
too cheap to fail.

>Rebirth is also better than anything
oh uhhhh hmmm nevermind I won't be continuing this discussion. not with you

I would argue FF is still trying to make new and different games, while Pokemon seems to have put in minimal effort for the last ten years. The new games get relentlessly ridiculed for their graphics and linear gameplay.

>>729407781
And not just that, as far as we can tell they're fucking LOSING against the chink game, both in the lawsuit and in the comparison of quality, meanwhile the chink game is doing everything pokemon fans have actually wanted for years, including making an actual dating sim for the monsters (no matter how many people tell you they dont want to fuck them)
If that ends up having actual porn in it too, it's just categorically over, theyll've lost completely.

>>729406940
FF easily. Pokemon just needs more staff. It hasn't expanded along with its success. The original games had like 5 programmers.

>>729411340
>doing everything pokemon fans have actually wanted for years, including making an actual dating sim for the monsters
/v/ really thinks the industry revolves around it huh

>>729411859
The numbers dont lie, people wanna fuck the monsters. They may not have asked for a dating sim but its exactly what they've wanted for years

>>729409751
what in the absolute fagfiction holy hell am I even reading?

losing your way is infinitely worse than underdelivering.

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>>729407056
>pokemon at least still makes money
It also lost out the biggest. Zoomies have no idea what it was like for a single IP to have such a massive stranglehold on global culture because there's never been anything like it since.
They had EVERYTHING and they fucked up.

>>729412298
you must not live in reality.

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>>729406940
pokemon, and you already know why

Final Fantasy shifted genre and tanked in sales. Pokémon was always mid, with some ok/good games in the GBA/DS era
So FF.

>>729410832
Pfft ahahaha no. Gen 3 had abilities, double battles and natures, all of which mogged night/day and holding berries (which gen 3 also made into something good instead of a 1 note joke like it was in gen 2).

>>729409858
this is actually a really accurate description of the "mainline" series. Legends is still a fairly early spinoff series one of many. The main series sort of just kept doing the same game with only second gen and fifth gen really "trying" something. All the others are just red and blue again with a single new feature. They also constantly add and remove features as well. It's a very bizarre practice they have to sell plushies and toys.

>>729406940
Final fantasy has been bad for longer than Pokemon

>>729412417
It's still the most profitable IP in the world purely because of the nostalgia funkopop millennials have for that time period.
The IP is fucked when those fat fucks start getting heart attacks though.

>>729412417
He's kinda right, for a year or 2 the entire world revolved around Pokemon. Red and Blue are still the best selling games in the franchise because of that.

>>729407506
SM was the last game where you could catch 'em all (or rather all the Pokemon were implemented) before they just forgot most of the Pokemon.

>>729409858
>because it basically stagnated right out of the gate
Pokemon would get far less hate if the games were the same shit with better graphics every generation. The games however just keep getting worse. They've gotten so bad that even normalfags are starting to notice, that's when you know it's dire.

>>729412296
even pokemon lost its way

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Final Fantasy was never good, so I guess Pokémon wins by default.

>>729412417
He's not far; from how big Pokemania was and the second wave with gen 4 games, the current state is nothing. Only 20 millions meme and that's about it when back then it was the games, the anime and the spin offs.

Final Fantasy actually used to be good. The actual games were the worst part of the Pokemon franchise.

>>729412969
there were a lot less gamers back then too and you didn't have china and india propping up numbers and shit.

>>729407506
XY/Z > OS Kanto > DP > Horizons > AG > OS Johto > Journeys >>>> Powergap > BW >>>>> Powergap > SM

OS Kanto was basically a shounen, OS Johto is where they started to not know where to go.

>>729406940
pokeslop still makes money, final faggotry doesnt

>>729407990
>XY
>Trash
fuck you, X/Y alongside ORAS is the best from 3DS, is not a huge accomplishment but it is one nonetheless, also it hit more than missed.

>>729406940
Pokemon. Like, at least modern Final Fantasy titles have good production values and still fucking function. Pokemon games look worse than student projects and have bugs and glitches out the ass.

>>729406940
Final Fantasy.
Pokemon is still good

>>729406940
Final Fantasy still has its spin-offs to carry the water for them.

if we're talking sales wise no contest Final Fantasy but quality wise Pokemon and is not even close.

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Pokemon peaked with Clover

>>729406940
Pokémon, I say this less off the past and more that I have slightly more hope for final fantasy getting better than I do for Pokémon, not the least of reasons being that Pokémon fans have made clear they will buy it anyway

>>729406940
>Pokémon is bad nowadays!
>Why?
>Because... because I say so!

>>729406940
People don't pretend FF is good anymore, can't say the same for pokemon.

pokemon hasn't had good games since emerald
final fantasy had good entries here and there even if they on average got way worse

>>729413590
Back to /vp/, yawnfag.

>>729413697
It's crazy to see that people still defend the series after Scarlet and Violet's state on release.

>>729411257
not that anon but kill yourself tonight. rebirth is one of the best games ever made. die

>>729413115
>OS Johto is where they started to not know where to go.
Midway through the original anime team began to move on from the show. Last episode they wrote was the one of the Slowpoke temple. It's surprising the cracks on the anime showed much later tbqh it had THAT much of a momentum due the great job they were doing until they left.

>all that Team Rocket shithousery

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>>729407056
>nobody cares about ff anymore
that's why it gets hourly seethe threads and will keep getting games long after everyone on this board is dead.

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>>729413184
Final Fantasy makes more on merch sales than other jrpg companies make on game sales.

>>729414186
niggers have actually gone insane. I was excited for the 7 remakes but the action ATB thing was ass in the first one. I was told later that rebirth included not only yellow paint but ubisoft towers. I intend to play them one day at a ridiculous discount for all three games. but it got the fucking hobbit treatment bloated and messy meandering with a bunch of MMO fetch quest shit in it. It made sense for midgar to stretch out everything the city had to offer but did disc two really need that? Sure I haven't played them all the way through but when I dropped the first remix at market street I was absolutely baffled by some of the decisions to chase god of war design was unbelievable. The craziest part was I was able to enjoy 15 because of the bros on a roadtrip and characterizing their bros above all story. The remakes seem like movie games in some of the worst ways. Why can't we get good turn based final fantasy games

>>729406940
no one’s cared about final fantasy since the ps2.

>>729415981
You sound like an idiot, sorry. Rebirth was pretty great and better than any Pokemon game this decade.

As many have said, in sales it’s not even close - but no video game franchise can come out ahead of Pokémon’s sales. But at least FF is trying new shit, their games have production value and their teams seem to have a vision. Pokemon looks exactly like what it is: slop.

>>729415981
youre retarded. each quest is entirely different in rebirth. theres no god of war design. you are braindead

>>729413590
It’s bad nowadays because they charge AAA prices for indie-quality games. The fact they still don’t have voice acting for Pokemon games in 2025 is inexcusable.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tC9vQmmvvfI

>>729407056
Fpbp

>>729413590
Based

>>729415981
NTA but Rebirth shits all over Remake. It's such a better game and was my game of the year last year over Metaphor which is bogged down by recycled content.

Remake/Rebirth have menu based combat and it's really good, especially in Rebirth where characters other than Tifa are fun to use(especially Yuffie). Final Fantasy stopped being turn based with 4 introducing ATB and Square Enix has a plethora of other turn based franchises. People complaining about Final Fantasy doing new and experimental things are such fucking retards, that's what the series was known for. 5 had the job system, 6 had fucking street fighter commands and magicite, 7 had materia and the golden saucer/snowboarding, 8 had junction and triple triad, 9 had the abilities tied to equipment, 10 had the sphere grid and blitzball, 11 was a fucking mmo, 12 had the gambit system, etc.

Play fucking Dragon Quest, Bravely Default, or Octopath. Final Fantasy outside of 10 has been more action oriented since fucking 1991.

>>729406940
FF easy. Pokemon may be trash now but they are still making games for their fanbase.
FF stopped making turn based games and it has been shit ever since.

>>729416502
>5 had the job system
Well I guess 3 had it first but 5 was a much better and complete implementation of it where it became sandboxy. And 2 was really out there with how combat skills leveled up based on using them.

>>729412596
>numerous battle mechanics such as weather, hazards, and items
>new types
>breeding
>pokemon transfer
>shinies
>mystery gift
>everything that comes from the Pokegear such as trainer rematches, additional dialogue, and extra music
>your mom
>move tutors
>animated sprites that are far more impressive than the ones in Gen 3
lol gtfo

>>729416687
>they are still making games for their fanbase
The real fans just want them to go back to making games as good as Gen 5.

>>729406940
Pokemon, since it's stale, makes shittons of money regardless of quality and since ownership is split between three companies (with GameFreak being lazy cunts), it's harder to fix.

All FF has to do is going back to its roots of 4 niggas in a row. Basically Octopath Traveler, but in a FF setting and with an actual budget.

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>FF stopped making turn based games and it has been shit ever since.
kill yourself turd based sissy.

>>729416839
Bro Metaphor won more than Rebirth and it was garbage.

>>729416687
>Pokemon may be trash now but they are still making games for their fanbase.
brother the last pokemon game was rollslop with mmo quests and cooldown based xenoblade combat and the upcoming game is some animal crossing dq builders shit. pokemon is the epitome of making a game for your shareholders, which is why they're all cheap as fuck lazy cashgrabs.

>>729416910
Metaphor was turnBASED so it was an easy sweep.

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>>729416502
it's not the new experimental that's the problem it's the primarily action directed design. Like I have a love hate relationship with 13 it's good I hate to admit it. Experimenting with a crazy jenk ATB rhythm game is experimenting I can actually defend. Choices in the FF7 remakes are too close to the garbage choices they made in FF16.

Hearing it was your GOTY just reinforces my previously unstated but long held complaint 2024 was a game desert it was rough. I actually played DW3 and 1 on a backlit gameboy color because new games last year were so disappointing. I actually really ought to get into bravely/octo at some point.

>>729416146
>>729416169
>who had the worst decline
I mean I'm staying on topic. You may not like it but FF had a huge fall from grace and I still think it was the losing the JRPG from the fucking JRGP powerhouse it has a history for. There's arguments to be made that
>FF = crystals, summons, over the top moves and cinematics
but man I might only have 5 more mainline releases before I die the way they come out and it doesn't look like any of them will be titles I'll look forward to. I might get into the spinoff titles where the real experimentation really happens too.

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>>729416910
>metaflop
troon journos always faglus a bonus, game still got it's royal edition cancelled because nobody remembers it.

>>729416717
2 was really a romancing saga game let's be real. Kawazu gonna kawaz'

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>>729406940
Pokémon but FF isn't exactly above par.

>>729413873
Yawndaddy got you revved i fear.

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>>729412940
Look out!

>>729412817
“Games keep getting worse” is a forced attempt at a metanarrative driven by rage against the nat dex cut and doesn’t hold up under scrutiny. Both legends games are significantly better spinoffs than anything that came before and Swsh/SV both shined in multiplayer.

>>729416183
I actually perfer no voice acting since I can decide how I want someone to sound. I think I'm just more into ye olde style turn based jrpg direction. Wandering around clicking on things finding lil bits.

>>729417423
People who want VA in Pokemon are fucking stupid it’s such a waste of time and money
>but they make so much money
I don’t care nigger I can READ I don’t like audiobooks either I don’t want to listen to some shitty 30 year old pretending to be 12 like every fucking English dub

>>729406940
Final fantasy, easily. Pokemon games could be better obviously but do the job at very least. FF could've done what they wanted to do in FF-X/FF-X2 (romance routes etc) and they've not even done that. Waste of an IP aside from good music here and there.

>>729417075
>FF7 remakes are too close to the garbage choices they made in FF16.
I thought FF16 was just okay because the end was a bit of a letdown but then I saw the budget leak earlier this year and it was only $59 million. FF13 was around the same and FF15 was around double so they really didn't give FF16 a real budget which explains a lot about the FF14 design related choices they made for it.

Rebirth is a very high budget game though, it's clear that's where Square's focus was and FF16 was an afterthought. Rebirth is closer to a Final Fantasy skinned Yakuza game than anything with the sheer breadth of varied content in it. Traversal keeps changing in each area too with the chocobos having unique abilities, which keeps exploration fun whereas FF16 had very unrewarding exploration.

>Hearing it was your GOTY just reinforces my previously unstated but long held complaint 2024 was a game desert it was rough
Yeah, it was a pretty shit year. Rebirth was legitimately a fantastic game though. I do recommend it, I think you might be pleasantly surprised if you get to it.

>>729407056
fpbp

>>729416932
the two titles you mentioned are still spinoffs though. The mainline titles still adhere to the winning formula. The spinoffs are where they "try" and I say that very loosely try to shake things up. They have tons of liquidity and so they can afford to fuck up on one offs. Squeenix keeps making these huge money blackhole projects where pokemon is literally too cheap to fail. Pokemon minecraft kusoge edition is probably gonna do gangbusters. I'm genuinely curious to see the next mainline game on the switch 2 based on the leaks we saw from their product plans. Hell if they add back the option to toggle off "battle animations" it will be better than scarjohansen versions

>>729416502
>triple triad
This should be the standard card game in all are FFs. Queens Blood is trash.

>>729417769
tbf if the games run properly they will be an improvement over scarlet/violet. that was a bethesda level release. what a rushed and buggy mess that was, jesus christ.

>>729417848
S/V was not actually buggy other than graphically on emulators playing multiplayer

>>729417875
bitch i played the game, who do you think you're gaslighting?

>>729417906
I played it more.

>>729416784
>animated sprites that are far more impressive than the ones in Gen 3

Why are pokefags incapable of making a game for console/PC? All I ever wanted since Yellow. Pokémon Stadium was the best game in the entire fucking series.

>>729406940
Final Fantasy. Its pretty much dead now outside the mmo’s that some people still play. I don’t mind, I’ll always have the older games.

>>729406940
the sad part is that its FF despite me liking World of FF more than most the 3d pokemon games

>>729417423
>>729417516
If they don’t want to do voice acting than they should at least not show characters moving their lips. It looks so fucking awkward when you hear nothing coming out of their mouths as they move them.

>>729416784
>>new types
you mean new type combos? fairy wasn't until xy and dark steel was GSC

>>729417256
FF7 Rebirth is giving nigger fatigue. Barrett should be the only colored person in the game.

>>729416784
>>729418091
oh shit im retarded your talking to the gen 3 stan ignore me I need sleep. BUT I CARE ABOUT FF AND POGEYMUNS.

>>729406940
Pokemon because they've just been coasting. Also they still haven't brought back the battle frontier to the mainline games

>>729406940
Final Fantasy obviously. What kind of a dumbass question is this?
No matter how you feel about the new pokemon games they still have that core gameplay and a solid chunk of mon to find and capture.

FF stopped evolving at 7 when they just copied 6's gameplay, casualised it to shit and went "woo" graphics for the kids.
Nowadays 15 and 16 can't even be considered final fantasy games since they've strayed so far away from their roots and the style of gameplay everyone wanted from the series.

>>729417875
brother I guess you never played it for more than an hour, in multiplayer, and closed the game from time to time. That shit had laughable issues it's true. You literally had to close the game if you wanted to play for more than some obtuse 2-4 hour time frame or some overflow issue could just crash the game and waste all the shit you did.
>>729417848
bethesda level of incompetence is blowing it way too far. I wish it was bethesda levels of bugs and absolute shit code strung together with bus hats. I really would have enjoyed the shitposting and absolute shit show of an experience if that was the case.

>>729406940
FF
there's like one good pokemon game over 30 years

>>729414226
You can tell they wanted to almost go in a new direction with Hoenn. But that quickly got stomped out for the status quo soon enough.

>>729412940
Starmie running like his life depends on it.

>>729418124
agreed. a token was always fine so that you don't forget to donate food to africa but more than that and it diminishes the product.

>>729410832
>gsc is more ambitious than basically every game that came afterwards
Are you kidding? No not at all. It was probably one of the least ambitious games which is why they padded it out with gimmicks to cover up how little there actually was and how much they gutted kanto.

>>729418920
Not to mention most of it's new dex is literally the scraps they didnt end up using for the first game

>>729406940
The one of the two that did product placement for Nissin Cup Noodles.

>>729418920
>gimmicks
Basically every mechanic introduced in Gen 2 has been in every subsequent mainline entry since. The same cannot be said for Gen 3 with actual gimmicks such as Secret Bases and Contests being scrapped starting from Gen 5

>>729406940
Pokemon hasn't declined. Stumbled a few times with gen 6 and gen 8, but never actually fell to any real degree.
So Final Fantasy by default, which fucking nosedived over the last 15 years and I can't figure out what the fuck anyone at SE is thinking.

>>729419909
>Contests
Technically those evolved into the musicals in Gen 5, then Gen 6 dropped it unless you count ORAS bringing them back

>>729406940
Pokemon is bigger than ever
Final Fantasy has fallen out of common knowledge
If we're talking purely quality, it's debatable, but I'd say Final Fantasy is still doing the worst, relatively speaking

>>729412298
zoomers legit grew up with the hoenn region at the earliest dumb millenial. I used to watch advanced battle when they aired episodes right before I left for school. We were there for pokemons peak and it's downfall

>>729413203
ORAS is the best pokemon 3ds game definitely, but that's not a high bar. XY were trash, just somewhat better trash than the others.

>>729412782
You've never been able to solo the pokedex in a single game pre switch though, like, not even the regional dex.
The only games in this franchise that allow that are the Legends.

>>729406940
XVI is an absolute trash game while ZA is honestly a fine game even with shit graphics. Final Fantasy is far more dead than Pokémon.

>>729415598
I wanted to get some XIV cards but I learned that normal booster packs don't have any cool rarities and for those you need to buy the way more expensive collector booster packs
Why is Magic allowed to do this? I've never heard of Pokemon or Yugioh doing domething that... Well, Jewish.

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Do none of you collect Pokemon cards? People are actually robbing each other over them, it's been a year now since it started and it's still almost impossible to find cards in stock except the ones resold by scalpers.

>>729412596
Nah, Gen 2 is more of a leap than Gen 3 game desigh wise
Of course Johto is a shit region with the worst pokedex of the franchise, but to be fair Hoenn isn't like, fun to explore either. The "Too much water" thing was always real, because Swimming in the 2D games is just riding a shapeless blob over an endless amount of blue tiles dealingg with the shit encounter rates before you actually get to the interesting parts of the region.
I get why pokemon went through an slump, there's a big hole of nothing region wise between Kanto and Sinnoh

>>729406940
Final Fantasy.
Modern Pokemon is technically worse, but it wasn't that amazing in the first place, even its peak B2W2 is like an 8/10 game, and mostly it just stagnated until the devs could no longer make rereleases that finish their games or keep up with 3D technology. FF at its peak was on the otherhand was 10/10 kino for like 5 games straight, so it being 5/10 mediocre slop now hurts way more.

>>729421468
Yeah, FF went from the main exponent of the JRPG to like, a somewhat niche franchise

>>729407990
XY and ORAS despite their flaws still had the best online system with the PSS that Gamefreak decided to replace with inferior shit or the future games for no reason.

>>729421075
they went digital too so anyone who wants to actually play the card game does the phone one and they give entire booster kits like the 12 packs at once like twice a week or some shit. My friend does nothing at work but watch vtubers while playing pokemon TCG on his phone

>>729409267
>Stranger of Paradise was better.
Honestly despite its very simple gameplay and premise I had way more fun with that than I have with any recent FF game (16 sucked and the two parts of 7 Remake are okay-ish at times). Cannot speak for Pokemon as the last game I tried was a friend’s copy of Sword back in 2021 and I think I got up to the third gym before giving up.

>>729421592
I would argue that FF declined right alongside the popularity of traditional turn based JRPGs. Everyone talks about the classic FFs and how timeless they are, but all those games are 2+ decades old. General audiences moved away from turn based RPGs (no, please don’t post the exceptions) in favor of action driven, live service, and movie games they didn’t have to read.

It’s not really FFs fault, as their games are still way better than most AAA slip that’s put out currently. People are just very critical of them because A: new titles are always being compared to literally some of the best games ever made and B: the company has tried to evolve the series along with changing public tastes.

Let’s face it, if all SE made was classic 4 niggas in a row, the company would already be bankrupt. It’s fine that they are trying, and stumbling, to take the genre somewhere new.

Pokemon, on the other hand, has moderately changed in 20+ years. Is this a good or a bad thing? I dunno, but I just find the franchise so boring. Look at how its gameplay has only marginally evolved while constantly being ridiculed for its graphics. However, in 20 years FF went from 1-12 and everything in between.

I just think there two different beasts and I would argue FF never really declined. Yeah, some titles were more popular than others, but even back in the 90s it was still kind of a niche, nerdy thing. Again, 4 niggas in a row is what really declined.

>>729407056
>>729406940

>Sells millions of copies
>Bad
lel. Nice try kid

>>729420898
the combat system is basically the same cooldown reliant nonsense except you one shot most of the game in za. i'm not sure how anyone can think the combat is better than xvi.

>>729421816
Absolutely trve. ORAS in particular was the peak for that. I actually completely the pokedex in that game. Then it got worse, then you started having to pay for it. At least LGPE and LA you could complete without online, thank christ.

>>729422559
>General audiences moved away from turn based RPGs (no, please don’t post the exceptions) in favor of action driven
Even with the exceptions, action RPGs still outclass those. Souls games are action RPGs and so are most AAA games now because they all copy AssCreed/Witcher 3. The market is dominated by action RPGs, even Metroidvanias which are now very popular are just 2d action rpgs most of the time.

>>729423059
Pokemon has a really decent and meaty combat system that's never used by the game design
I don't think you can actually make a bad pokemon game game design wise, the thing that fucks this franchise is everything but the fundamental gameplay

>>729423269
okay but ff16 is just swapping stances instead of pokemon and both games involve spamming moves as they come off cooldown. like fundamentally both are very similar combat systems except ff16 has a devil may cry minigame instead of standing around. most of your damage comes from skills so the dmc minigame is pretty optional all things considered. you can play both games similarly except in za you faceroll through almost everything the majority of the game.

>>729406940
final fantasy was never even close to the level that pokemon was at their respective peaks

>>729409751
this kind of reads like a dbspic meme

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>>729406940
Rebirth was the dream game we all waited for, and its just like society moved on before it was made. Im honestly as confused as the execs. I get the ornery old autists being upset becuase a single detail was changed, those fucks will never be happy. Im curios why zoomzooms hated it?

Pokemon is run by gamefreak
FF is run by Square Enix.

No matter how bad or retarded gamefreak gets, they arent the kings of retardia like SE's higher ups are.

>>729424636
Remake/Rebirth kinda sucks, and it technically isnt a remake either.
Along with it being needlessly dragged out for no good reason, its another fucking FF7 sequel no seriously that no one asked for.

>>729420991
because over 30 years ago magic players were split into two groups.

>draft
and
>whales
and the draft people told MTG that if you made it impossible to play competition with just draft we will leave
and the whales never gave a fuck about draft other than to collect it anyways.
I beat this years competition deck that cost over 400 dollars with a 50 dollar deck 3/5 games.

newsflash, if you don't play like your typical competition player. you win.

>>729423235
Rollslop FF would be my dream game. No idea why they are so dead set against it.

>>729424724
>I get the ornery old autists being upset becuase a single detail was changed, those fucks will never be happy. Im curios why zoomzooms hated it?

>>729424636
FF7R struggles because of exclusive faggotry.

I would have bought on release if it was available. I only just got it during this Steam sale because I didn't even know it was out on PC for a year.

>>729424832
Thats a good point. Still, whats wild to me though is PS5 had 60m sales when it released. Only 1/20 purchased. I do wonder if the PS5 is just a CoD / Madden machine now.

>>729407990
gen 2 is more broken than gen 1

Pokemon just needs to give the gimmicks a fucking break already. The crystal shit was just retarded. Also the new design are ugly as fuck. They need a Ken Sugimori sprite watercolour game going here or something.

>>729424636
>Split game in to three parts
>Normies who just want to play the game will buy it in 2037 when the entire trilogy is out
>OGfags dipped when Part 1 showed they would be adding Compilation shit and fucking up scenes from the original
>Cross-gen, so people who bought Part 1 on PS4 and didn't want to buy a PS5 are SOL
>As a bonus, the insane people who wanted the changes pro.ised by the ending of Part 1 will now probably not buy Part 3 now that Square is pussyfooting around and not actually changing shit
All they had to do was release Remake as one reasonably-budgeted game. That's it.

>>729406940
I feel like Pokemon’s is worse because it won’t be able to die, itll basically become a swamp of poisoned games each more soulless and unfinished than the last.

Final Fantasy at least is able to get some sparks of life every once in a while like Shadowbringers before they inevitably snuff it out with something like Dawntrail from the very same game

Pokemon doesn’t even get the benefit of high highs

>>729423440
Don't be a retard, Anon. XVI doesn't even have elemental weakness, the most basic mechanic in any rpg. You can't even build your own party. you play as one guy, with one weapon and the same one combo the entire game. It's absolute garbage game design at its finest and they're still gaslighting people into calling it an rpg

Pokemon is still an rpg no matter how much they revamp the core gameplay. They’re not comparable with XVI, not even slightly. The only fair comparison for ZA is a good game like Xenoblade.

Final Fantasy went woke and gay. Idk about Pokemon but it's important to always take a shit on FF whenerver the opportunity presents itself.

>>729424832
first one released as exclusive too. it's sales in the same period were worse because ssplitting the game up was a retarded idea. only people that completed the first one would even be intrerested in the next chapter. it's the same pitfall episodic games run into but far worse.

>>729425209
Tell me what was woke and gay in XVI

>>729425304
The faggots kissing.

>>729425304
The men look too hot

you can tell majority of the people whining their asses off about pokemon were kids when xy came out because they include it in the 'golden age' now despite it being considered rock bottom of the series at one point

>>729425318
Ok but besides the anal sex scene what else?

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>>729424636
Zoomers are tired of being bombarded with homosexual propaganda.

>>729406940
Final Fantasy
Pokemon is still Pokemon at the end of the day

Final Fantasy is that thing "uncs" like you and me said was "no cap skibidi bussin'" back in our old man days

>>729425363
Im debating getting z-a, how is it? I haven't played since black 2.

>>729425378
>besides the gay part, what was gay about it
That could be said for anything, anon

>>729425363
hindsight is a thing. the 3ds games at least weren't nearly as embarassing to look at as any of the switch games

>>729425378
Ultima is a transgender and Odin sucked on his toes.

>>729425434
having sex with a man isn't even in the top 10 gayest things you can do

>>729421836
Why do cucks watch shit they can play themselves. Holy shit, pathetic.

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I can still find enjoyment and admire the huge spectacle of modern ff games while modern pokemon is literally unplayable. The first 2 hours of ff xvi will give you more entertainment than every pokemon game released from gen 6 to now

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>>729425459
Time to replay with my fleshlight.

>>729425531
XVI was one of the most boring games I ever played.

>>729406940
People still try to hack Game Freak 24/7 for new Pokemon leaks, while no hacker would ever bother with Square Enix

>>729425524
You talking about the tcg or the vtuber part?

>>729425548
>t. Im 14

>>729425548
I said the first 2 hours aka what the demo covers not the entire game brainlet. you may disagree but i believe most people will agree the first 2 hours is fun

>>729425624
They made the game to appeal to younger audiences though they would probably like it if they were 14

>>729425524
???? he watches a vtuber to hear a womans voice while he plays the tcg game while getting money. Did you not understand what I posted? He sent me a screenshot he has like 900 wins already and I thought that shit came out this month. Then in the top left halfway hanging off the bezel of the screen is an anime girl vtuber. he's playing pokemon listening to girls pretend to be cute and kind. He's been gifted like hundreds of subs just leaving women talking on in the background while they performative female about anime and videogames.

>>729425636
compare it to the first 2 hours of the new pokemon legends game where you dont even get to play

>>729421075
The cards are dangerously overvalued while also being in the most unplayable state they've ever been in.

>>729425548
I dont disagree. It's a movie game slop, and that's what it should've been anyway. The game ruined my respect for the franchise in a lot of ways.

>>729425636
First 15% was the funniest FF I ever played. When melee mattered before the second summon was pure unadulterated kino.

>>729425387
>pander to gayme journos for easy accolades
>lose goty to astrobot
>lose rpgoty to metaphor
>flop due to lgbt content
Simply brilliant

>>729412298
>Zoomies have no idea what it was like for a single IP to have such a massive stranglehold on global culture because there's never been anything like it since.
Minecraft and Fortnite were bigger than Pokemania regardless of what balding millennial retards say

16 was good, fuck off haters

>>729421134
Kanto wasn't good either, it's extremely bland with nothing memorable about it unless it was your first pokemon game. Hoenn and Sinnoh are peak.

>>729425668
Im just saying bad games today have nothing on nes/snes/PS1 grinding.
Game was shit becuase it was made to get people hooked on MMO's. FF14 keeps the lights on, this was just a single player MMO add for it. Still my GotY though despite the awful timer countdown combat.

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Reminder that XVI bombed on PC because Steamies filter LGBTQ games.

>>729425730
I think its time to work out the trauma with your older brother. You are clearly not a happy person and maybe that would help.

>>729425826
some autists like grinding you know

>>729425879
>Has 2 jesters in the screenshot
>The actual post only has 1 now

>>729406940
Pokemon became a bad series much faster

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>>729425714
>>lose rpgoty to metaphor
>>flop due to lgbt content
it's getting a sequel and metaflop isn't.

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>>729425879

>>729425941
No. Im an autist who enjoyed BoF2. The grinding got meditative as you hit a flow state. Not sure I'd call that liking it though?
That said not even I can play Disgea End Game so I know it does get much much more autistic than BoF2.
Also what do you think the grindiest RPG is, anything top BoF2?

>>729426056
Pokemon was bad from the start. People don't unironically think Gen 1 is good right?

>>729425879>>729426092
>it's getting a sequel
No shit lol that's what trilogy means, retard.

>>729426154
>t. that weird smelly kid who always wanted to talk about digimon but everyone else was too busy playing pokemon

>>729407056
I care about it to hate YoshitPiss every day.

>>729406940
>Barry and Eric in the same room
Gem thread, keep it alive guys.

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>>729425784
Go back to your general, Larry. Your game is still trash.

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>>729426092
;)

>>729426154
I thought it was the greatest game ever made. I played it again in college, could not believe how awful it was. So many repetitive random encounters over and over and over again. The zubat fights were unreal.

>>729426296
Remake sucked dick and Rebirth is just Remake: Ubisoft edition. Of course it flopped.

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>>729426260
>Ecelebs hate a game
Bro, Im not even going to insult you. You just need to do better, for your sake. Cut the YouTube chord, you are better than that.

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no wonder they cancelled the royal edition for this dogshit

>>729406940
Pokemon

Final Fantasy can always reinvent itself with the next iteration and is still made with an above average level of competence. Have they always been a 10? No, but even a piece of shit like 13 looked like a miracle running on a fucking 360.
Pokemon is stuck with all it's shit choices and trash ass designs forever and is so technically retarded and ass dragging it would unironically be better outsourced to a jeetshop at this point.

>>729426296
Guess we're not getting a Vincent DLC now. They'll probably just rush part 3 out at this point.

>>729407781
>>729411340
>>729412015
>palcucks are this retarded

>>729426502
DLC was cancelled so they can rush part 3 out since they expect it will sell less than 1m copies based on how few people returned for Rebirth.

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>>729426415
If you can't tell the difference between the fandom's and ecelebs' least favorite game, then it's about time you get your brain checked.

>>729426313
>thought the game was excellent when you were in the target demographic
>no longer felt the same way when you were no longer in this demographic
It served its purpose perfectly.

>>729425363
>XY
>included in the golden age

...No? When the fuck was this ever a common sentiment? XY and SwSh are basically exempt when that type of discussion pops up. Are there really people saying XY is goated? And yeah, people will get increasingly annoyed when the general quality of the games continues to stagnate and decline past their already declining expectations. What a surprise.

>>729426154
Why are you comparing the standards of modern titles from an established lucrative franchise, to the standards of a fucking 30-year old gameboy game released as a new IP?

>>729426502
Future is Gacha, GAAS and MMOs. We are lucky we got what we got. Future is AA like E33 as the worlds just too retarded for a 200m RPG.

>>729425784
No controllable party members.
Stuck with only one weapon.
Barely any RPG elements.
No exploration with absolute dogshit level design.
No minigames.
No cities to visit. Sanbrsque capital cannot be entered and game shoves you into a shitty ugly mine instead.
Only two costumes for Clive.
Every enemy is a bullet sponge in this game and all strategy boils down to stagger and dump canned animations.
Basterdised DMC combat system where you only have three Eikon abilities available to you. The rest you have to assign to buttons on a menu.
Elemental weakness and resistences mean nothing in a game about elements eikons.
Absolute nonsensical game of thrones knock off story.

Worst FF.

>>729406940
Final Fantasy. Pokemon has been slop for more than a decade

>>729406940
Pokemon still is a turn-based rpg and all central elements are still the same, it's just that the visuals don't match the tech.
FF has become a bastardized shell of its former self that plays like a dumbed down version of Kingdom Hearts.

>>729426592
>Posts an eceleb picture
>Upset I didnt go straight to sales numbers???
What is wrong with you?

>>729426313
Pokemon was not intended for adults. It was Tajiri's passion project, a way to pass on his own nostalgic his feelings of adventure collecting strange new insects in the rural areas around Tokyo during urban encroachment. He wanted to help the youth of the 90s who were spending way more time indoors to understand that feeling. Adults only play it out of nostalgia/autistic fixation.

>>729407781
>the decline in quality
Has it really declined in quality though? It’s been the same shit for multiple games now. game freak refuses to innovate

>>729426758
Nothing I posted mentioned anything about sales numbers. Does playing a shitty game ruin your brain this much? Go get help.

>>729426602
Perfect would have me loved it both times. Still, point taken. It definitely fulfilled its role.

>>729426863
>Perfect would have me loved it both times.
It was perfect for what it was intended to be. >>729426775

>>729426860
Are you ESL? You are clearly uneducated. You communicate so poorly only a 22yrold 88 IQ ESL brown phone poster makes sence. That is you correct? You are litterally not making sence.

>>729426860
anon you just posted some random numbers and expect us to know what they are

>>729406940
no matter how many people bitch and cry about their childhood, pokemon was always meh at best. it's still the same but they aren't kids anymore. it still makes gorillions of dollars and people die trying to get pokemon cards in modern day just like at its peak

squeenix was never that big in the west outside of ff7 which remains like 90% of normie's first and only jrpg

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>>729406940
Pokemon and its not even fucking remotely close

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>>729425705
because most pokemon collectors don't even care about the game, they just want the cool rare cards

>>729426962
Calling someone ESL when you can’t prove it is the perfect sign of low IQ which makes sense why you’d defend a trash game like XVI.

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>>729417256
Pokemon has this too btw

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Pokemon, just because of Pokefags, literally the bottom of the barrel as it can get in gaming, the games are also horseshit

Turns out I can only really enjoy the Pokemon games just set in Japan (Gens 1-4). Not even a weeb thing, the others just seem like shit, maybe it's the region designs. The Japanese game devs naturally know how to do more cool stuff with a Japan-based region than overseas-based regions, which end up feeling like linear theme parks since they're places the devs go on vacations to and don't really understand the nuance of. The increasingly dumb battle gimmicks they seem obligated to introduce with each new game don't help either.

>>729406940
FF.
Pokemon is still interesting even with bad games and it has a lot more going for it.

Pokemon will always be the worse at anything

>>729407056
>pokemon at least still makes money
How is that relevant on a good quality game? Those shitheads are fucking lazy and do the bare minimum. With Square Enix they at least put a whole lot more effort into it even if their intentions is for a broader audience.

>>729406940
Final Fantasy. I could conceivably pick any Pokémon game and it'll still be pretty much exactly how I'd imagine a Pokémon game would be. I have no idea what Final Fantasy even is anymore.

>>729406940
Final Fantasy still has some redeeming qualities, I would still recommend that people giving FF16 a try. I would be honest about what I like and don't like. I would have more negative than positive things to say about the game. I would not feel that would ruin my integrity to recommend it. I can not good faith do the same thing for any Pokemon title in recent years. If these games did not have the pokemon brand or title on them, I wouldn't have played them. Having the brand recognition works. It gets me play absolute trash for the small morsels that feed the brain worms the franchise put in my brain as a child.

>>729406940
Depends.

FF had a decline in sales/popularity but the worst FF game is still way better game than the best Pokemon game. But when it comes to sales even the worst Pokemon game has sold more than even the best FF game.

So when it comes to decline in Quality then Pokemon by far and is not even close how fucking terrible and stale this series has been for years but still selling bonkers.

When it comes to sales and popularity then FF had the bigger decline going from selling 10 millions per game to now less than 3 millions per game. But Quality wise FF16-FF7R are 2 of the finest Jrpg's in the last 10-15 years.