Is gameplay really the only thing that matters?
No.
>>732229345Only gay retards deal in absolutes
Of course not. Gameplay is given meaning through visuals, narrative, sound. It emerges from the world you create. Gameplayfags are low IQ and lack artistic literacy.
Music leaves more of a lasting impact than gameplay.
>>732229345To some degree. But when some components i.e. the writing is abysmally dogshit it turns even the best gameplay into a slog. Doom wouldn't be the game it was if doomguy spent the entirety of it schizophrenically alternating between sobbing about his dead bunny to show his gentle interior and cracking marvel quips to show his tough exterior.
No, but it still matters more than everything else. To the point where the other parts' sucking makes the gameplay suck. It's all connected with the playability at the core.
>>732229571>Doom wouldn't be the game it was if doomguyBut would it be the game it is if it didn't have the demon theme, and doomguy as the protagonist, and the music? Basically if it looked like this and had no music
>>732229345No, music and graphics are also important. Which are both really good in cuphead
>>732229345Half of cuphead's appeal is its presentation
>>732229635This is wrong, more people will drop a game if it's e.g. themed like Concord than if it plays badly People will tolerate bad gameplay if it's a premise they like, with story and characters they enjoy, and has music they love, no one will tolerate a bad premise, ugly graphics, earrape music just because the gameplay is good
>>732229345There is no such thing as an ugly game with good gameplay. Never has been, never will be. People who put too much stock in visuals will always wind up playing boring snake oil.
>>732229698And it's consequently a terrible and boring game
>>732229794>There is no such thing as an ugly game with good gameplay.Isaac? Hollow Knight? Vampire Survivors? Megabonk?
>>732229664No, it would be a different game. But it would likely be a better game than if it had ten thousand post-processing effects cluttering your screen and loud orchestrals trying way too hard to sound menacing. Some things benefit from less.
>>732229858>IsaacAwful game, one of the worst games ever made>Vampire SurvivorsNot even a video>Megabonk Not even a video gameGood game design naturally looks visually appealing. The geometry of a well designed level is inherently appealing. There is beauty in that. Colors should contrast to enhance visibility, sounds should be easily recognizable. Following these rules results is an overall aesthetic package. Everything else is superficial.
>>732229794dwarf fortressaurora 4xmount and blade warband
>>732230051>d-d-d-d-doesn't c-c-count!!Concession accepted, never post again
>>732229743Presentation is for drawing people in the playing is what keeps people in. The games that focus on presentation are almost always one-and-done deals. You aren't really gonna replay Hylics 2 that much, but you will try to beat Dragon Quest 3 with a different party a couple of times. Compare Monster Hunter play times to that of shit like Chibi-Robo. I like all these games, but I play the ones that want to be toys a lot more for a reason.Also, aren't you describing Dwarf Fortress? Or Space Station 13?
>>732230051>shmups aren't video gamesinteresting attempt at begging for attention
>>732230173Dwarf Fortress is a lovely looking game. Aurora4x is a dunning kruger simulator and mnb is shallow slav slop.
>>732230201You didn't address any of my points and instead attacked a strawman, tells me all I need to know about your knowledge on the topic
>>732230332All the days of my life, ever since I've been born, I've never seen a man with taste this bad before
>>732230332why'd you post a modded tileset thoughever
>>732229345last year's goty had some dog ass gameplay
>>732230223Actual shmups, real ones, have a profound and complex understanding of visual clarity, color composition, and audio to make it easy to understand extremely dense amounts of information being thrown at the player at all times. Additionally, they live and die by their bullet patterns, not their art, as bullets are what will be blanketing the screen 90% of the time, and here we see that beautiful geometry. Like if you compare the hush to a bullet pattern in a cave game the different is obvious pretty quickly and it becomes apparent that Isaac is a hack fraud lazily designed game.
>>732230373A strawman would be me pulling up that reddit post aa guy made going off about how he loves games and wants to be more than toys then the other guy says "it sounds like you don't like video games" I didn't say shit about snooty fart huffers who want all games to be walking sims and VNs about being gay in nepal. Do you even get what a strawman is?
>>732229858isaac and hollow knight are not ugly games
>>732229345A system isn't reliant on novelty, presentation is.
>>732231349Only a profoundly ugly game made by a profoundly ugly person would have a basic ass spiral pattern with bullets that match the background colour. The gameplay is as ugly as the style.
>>732229467buh-buh-buh-based
>>732231587actually you're right, ugly is probably what I would call isaac's style but it's also the point of the style. I don't think this is really the right discussion to have. I think that onimai poster should have reworded his post. Maybe low effort visuals and sound is a better thing to argue.
>>732229794tranny
>>732231918I am the onimai poster and when I see a low effort bullet pattern that doesn't understand basic color composition I think "wow that's ugly". Like here's a well designed shmuphttps://youtu.be/kwASRYR5H1ALook at the colors>beige background>Blue bullets>green shot>yellow enemiesIt's impossible for anything to sneak through here, but since these colors contrast really well, it also winds up looking really vibrant. And then we have the bullets themselves, there are like 10 different types of bullets in patterns and you can intuitively distinguish them by shape and know how they're going to behave. All of this allows for complex and dazzling patterns. And you could have a cheaply made version of a CAVE game and would similiarly be visually attractive. Like look at blue revolverhttps://youtu.be/eFvY_dEhk-8Most of the ships are literally just straight up rectangles but it still looks great because the gameplay necessitates that it looks great.When I play isaac all I can think is>wow this is really ugly game design, this guy just doesn't care
>>732232456shut the fuck up, troontrump is your president whether you like it or not
>>732232456>this guy just doesn't caredraw isaac in 4 angles in ms paint right now
>>732232456and that picture you posted has a glow and drop shadow around all the bullets, they aren't hard to see at all and if you're posting full videos can you post the video of that isaac fight?
>>732232456Genuine tranny core games.
>>732232840What part of this fight do you think wasn't designed so a 3 year old could clear it?https://youtu.be/KPZ8vKy9mQgThe lanes are literally UNIRONICALLY 1/4 the size of the screen. Who though this is good design? I mean Jesus, compare this to the final boss in espgaloody
>>732233378Looks better than tranny memoslop.
>>732233378nigga you are male, stop wearing womens clothes you fucking freak
I find it funny that every time I ask a self-professed gameplayfag what their favorite games are, they list a bunch of titles that everyone agrees they have astounding audiovisuals, atmosphere and/or narratives.
>>732233928Yeah this game was known for it's narrative
>>732229345yesyou can play games in ASCII and still have fun, as long as the game itself is good
Yes. If the gameplay isn't fun, all the GRAFIX in the world won't save your game.
>>732233928I'm a self-professed gameplayfag and most of my favorite games are NES games with no narratives.Get fucked, movienigger.
>>732235582Why are you here nigger, >>>/vr/
>>732235481If the game was entirely in wireframe mode, you would get bored of it quickly>>732235582NES games that were astounding at time of release, and because you experienced at the time, you don't see them as ugly. Just the sense of nostalgia alone adds to the product. That's why you don't play indies following the NES mould, you go directly yo what you played as a kid. Also you can't read since the post said "OR".
>>732235684Not him but I can't talk about Donut Dodo there and there's too many British people who hate color there.>>732235747Isn't there a rail shooter in that art style that looks really cool. Also Vib-Ribbon.
Making a game look good proves you caredIf a game is actively visually offputting enough you don't want to play it that's a different problem than gameplay being "the most important thing"Next time if you want to have a thread where people compare prototypes to finish games don't be a nigger.
>>732235998The point is to call out niggers who claim only gameplay is important by making them face the reality of what that means
bad gameplay cant be saved with presentationgames with good gameplay are still good even with poor presentationgood gameplay is elevated further by good presentation
>>732229794>>732230051https://arch.b4k.dev/v/search/filename/%20Onii-chan%20Is%20Done%20For%21/
>>732238201I sunk probably over 500 hours into galaga as a child. Do you understand what that means? Luke when I got metroid prime for gamecube I thought the game was shit and never even bothered to finish it and just played the nes rom that was included on the disc instead. And I don't even like that game any more. I think you severely underestimate how little I care about presentation. You simply can't imagine not being a shallow shit eater.
>>732240779> Do you understand what that means?Yeah it means you're a colossal cock-sucking avatar faggot. Tie that rope ASAP.
>>732229345A good looking game with bad gameplay is pointless.A bad looking game with good gameplay is at least fun, even if it's a pain to look at.Gameplay is more important by far, but a good artstyle is only ever an improvement.
