Why was the idea of rebooting Castlevania as a 3D Souls like always so reviled? Dark Souls feels like a 3D version of the NES Castlevania games
Was it? I always thought the main issue with modern Castlevania was it having no central identity. Most people would probably like a cheesy gothic soulslike, but there's like three conflicting ideas for how that would look under the Castlevania IP.
no it doesn't because Souls game have very little to no platforming, which is a core staple of the classicvania games
>>733648243The platforming in NES Castlevania was about as atrocious as Bloodborne's lol
>>733648279>hate castlevania>posts in cv threadlow effort
>>733648279Baby can't handle challenging games where you need to commit to your jump arc and not just bounce through everything like a retard?
>>733648050Sorry but I don't see the connection between Castlevania and a 3d exploration heavy rpg, unless you specifically only meant Castlevania 2 when you say "Castlevania games"
>>733648317>>733648351I like Castlevania but it is objectively designed around the jump being atrocious. It's not like they had no idea it wasn't as easy as Mario's jump.Let's say "rigid" if you don't like that word. Bloodborne's jumping is about as "rigid" as NES Castlevania games
>>733648050>Why was the idea of rebooting Castlevania as a 3D Souls like always so reviled?It wasn't, zoomer.People hated it because the games themselves fucking SUCKED, not because they hated the idea of it shifting from 2D to 3D.
That's what I would do, OP.But I'd also go heavy on the horror tone.
Souls shit sucks
>>733648050Dark Souls is fucking miserable and has been tediously copied way too many times. No one wants Lords of the Fallen with a Castlevania skin. There have been more than enough 3D games in the series to show what it should be.
>>733648050>Dark Souls feels like a 3D version of the NES Castlevania gamesyou mean like a 3D version of Legend of Zelda
>>733648050Just take away the rollslop and force players to use a backstep/flip with no i frames, the game designs itself
>>733648050>Dark Souls feels like a 3D version of the NES Castlevania gamesNo it doesn't. DMC1 is closer to Castlevania than any Souls game.>>733648429Konami weren't bad programmers or designers in the 80s, they made Simon move the way he did deliberately and designed the game around it. Compare CV1 to Mega Man 1 where the movement isn't all there yet and Rock falls like a stone in the same way Simon does but a lot of the platforming isn't built to accommodate it.
>>733649718Yes that's why I said "rigid" in case you were too autistic to not take it as a personal insult against your character
>>733649809The way your post was written implied the movement wasn't made that way on purpose and they designed the levels around it after the fact instead of changing it. I could've just read it wrong though.
>>733650238Duskblood won't sell because no one wants to squad up on the battle bus and grind for lootboxes, they want Bloodborne 2
>>733648050Shut the fuck up and kill yourself.
>>733648050Castlevania are Platformers, first and foremost. Even the Metroidvanias are exploration focused platformers -- enemies are generally obstacles to be removed in order to progress more than the focus of the game. That's part of why Lords of Shadow failed -- it tried to make Castlevania into God of War, when that wasn't really what the series is about. Combat should never be the focus of a Castlevania game -- it should be about exploration and movement. The Arkham games, especially the first, get the closest to nailing the way exploration, movement and progression should feel in a Castlevania game. The combat focus is a little too heavy even there, but I think that feeling of "I have a new ability, I can now get these areas I saw blocked off on my way here," is really prevalent there. The Souls games are ABOUT combat and survival. You explore to get stronger, more than to be able to unlock the ability to explore further. Exploration is blocked by locked doors needing keys or ladders you need to drop; you don't gain a new ability that has some utility in combat, but primarily makes you more capable of exploring, generally speaking. And obviously platforming is an afterthought at best, and intentionally bad at worst.
I want another Lament of Innocence rather that a Soulsvania
>>733648583>the games themselves fucking SUCKEDwhat the fuck are you yapping about?there is no 3D soulslike castlevania game, it's something that people discuss hypothetically. that's what this thread is about, pay attention.
>>733648182Yeah, I think this is a big part of it. The branding is "weak" because if you make a sequel, there will be at least two groups of fans disappointed in what you made. Right now you have:Classic NES/arcade fans (probably smallest group)SotN/"Metroidvania" fans (probably largest group)3D fans (probably another small group)Netflix fans (probably a huge untapped group of normalfags that would buy a moviegame with the show characters)Simon's Quest fans (lmao jk)
I want a new Castlevania to have a level system. I dont get why no indie metroidvania copy the RPG side of the SOTN formula
>>733648050They already made 3D Castlevania. It’s called Dark Souls.
>>733651473Not only did you not even read OP's two-sentence post all the way through you're even more wrong than he is
>>733648050no they should make a Castlevania Immersive Sim instead of Souls-like
>>733648050Souls games suck. Castlevania is not souls, its a platformer series, there is no overlap. The only reason to do this is for sales for greed, i don't care about a corporations sales. I'd rather it remain dead and keep its identity intact. Why would I want to see one of my fav series get fucking cucked for newage retards that think dodgeroll games are the peak of difficulty. They're not.And no, lords of shadow are not good precedents.
>>733651457action RPGs are a dogshit genre that's fundamentally at odds with itself. exploiting the RPG elements undermines the action and getting good at the action undermines the superficial RPG elements. on top of this the role playing is nonexistent. it's a compromised genre that combines the worst of both and i would rather never see another action RPG again.
>>733651457SotN is stupid easy because Alucard can gain stats way too fast. Smart designers just set the character's attack power so they hit as hard as they should.
>>733651319I'm surprised they haven't done a CV3 retelling using sprites modeled after the show and making the story loosely follow its plot.
>>733648050Platforming is also my favorite part of the Dark Souls franchise.
>>733651457Genuinely wondering, have you played Bloodstained? >>733651831SotN isn't an action RPG. It's an exploration platformer with RPG elements. You can make a Metroidvania with RPG elements challenging, i.e. Order of Ecclesia and Curse of the Moon, but part of the point is the feeling of progression as you power your character up over time. >>733652007See above. If you remove the RPG elements from a Metroidvania, it's just a Metroid-like -- all of the exploration elements came from Metroid. What SotN and its subsequent sequels added was the RPG elements.
>>733651831>>733652007Play more Castlevania games >>733652468Yeah I love Bloodstained
>>733648050Castlevania 64 was terrible, Lament of Innocence was pretty bad, and Lord of Shadows basically killed the series. Castlevania has been pretty terrible in 3D, while most 2D Castlevanias have been pretty good. It's not surprising that most people would react poorly to a 3D Castlevania and act better towards a 2D Castlevania.Also, throwing away anything that makes a game similar to any previous Castlevania and just making yet another Dark Souls knockoff isn't exciting anybody. There's already hundreds or thousands of Dark Souls knockoff games. Scrubbing the name off one and calling it Castlevania isn't going to make any one of them any better.
>>733652468You're retarded. Metroidvania is a type of game structure shared by BOTH Metroid and Castlevania games, it doesn't matter what either of them "contributed" other than the metroidvania structure itself. The RPG elements are completely irrelevant, you brain damaged tool.
I just got the domino's collection or whatever on switch 2. Which games should I play first if I've never played the classic castlevanias?
>3D version of the NES Castlevania gamesLiterally CV64/LoDJust stop being a bitch and play them
>>733654785Buy the set that has Rondo of Blood and SotN
>>733654785THE BEST OF THE BEST
The combat in souls is literally the evolution of Castlevania in 3D. However, everything else would need to be different.
>>733648050>Dark Souls feels like a 3D version of the NES Castlevania gamesNot even remotely>>733651319Netflix fans aren't interested in videogames, let alone hard games at all>>733654785Haunted castle revisited is the easiest castlevania game in existence and takes 30 minutes to complete. Play that. With F1 you can make it harder (different enemies spawn/locations) and turn off continues.>>733651457Belmont's curse has level ups>>733653323Castlevania 64 is what 3D Castlevania should look like, albeit it requires much refinement.But honestly why are we talking about 3d...? Let's see if Konami is able to give us a decent 2D metroidvania first. The classicvania in dominus was good albeit too short.
>>733654785Dawn of Sorrow is an inferior sequel to a GBA gamePortrait of Ruin is a sequel to a classicvania gameOrder of Ecclesia is a weird monstrosity mess of a game that should never in a million years be your first CastlevaniaHaunted Castle Revisited is Castlevania for newborns Drop the collection and start the series proper by playing Castlevania 1 (US version) and 3 (Japanese version)
>>733648050>Dark Souls feels like a 3D version of the NES Castlevania gamesNo lmao. Castlevania was a platformer where the combat was centered on long-range attacks. You can't even jump in Dark Soul and its all about melee.
>>733655223>Castlevania 1 (US version) and 3 (Japanese version)He'll get tilted, he should play them after SCIV and Rondo to get familiar with the movement
>>733654785The DS Castlevanias are all metroidvanias, so playing or being familiar with the classicvania games isn't really relevant.As for which game to start, Portrait of Ruin is the most basic in design (meaning, you don't collect souls and so it's just finding equipment on the map) so if you start there, the rest are going to be improvements. Dawn of Sorrow is the earliest game, and the one that is the most fun, but that's more related to if you play on replaying it. I'd personally prefer and recommend DoS first, since you can go back and still have fun, while playing PoR first means you'll probably never touch it again.Also, Haunted Castle sucks. Think of it as a bonus for series fans who wanted to see a piece of history, and the DS collection just being for 3 games.
>>733651127I mean yes but no. Classicvanias had little exploration and the companions of 3 were defined by how they fight.Also, saying Castlevania should not have combat is stupid, since one of of the most famous reboot of all was Ninja Gaiden, who was a similar platformer-with-combat game, whose reboot was combat-centric.
>>733655230Also applies to the later castlevanias. How the fuck do you make someone like Soma, Shanoa or Alucard in a soulslike lmao
>>733655387>He'll get tiltedBabying people around is not how you introduce them to a series. It's how you turn them into a tourist secondary. There are entries he needs to play, and if he gets it, he gets it.
My ideal 3D Castlevania would be basically classic Tomb Raider
>>733652468RPGs can definitely be harder than Symphony of the Night. Shin Megami Tensei proves that constantly. The point is that people interested in a 2D platformer would probably rather have set stats with no experience. Even Castlevania eventually implemented a "level 1" mode that removes experience gain completely.
>>733655000It's the devolution. Common things like being able to jump and collect hearts from candles massively improve the game. Souls is built around pressing the invincible dodge button at the right time and then getting one hit in. Maneuvering around an enemy by jumping and ducking just doesn't work in that situation.
>>733648050>Belmont's Curse doesn't have contact damagedead on arrival, the devs have zero clue on what they're doing
>>733656945i wonder how tf medusa heads work
>>733658165They're only there for you to "sick grapple with yo whip™", otherwise they'll just pass through you like every other enemy.
>>733648050I think it makes sense for the series, but for one thing the series has been dormant for a while, so bringing it back with a game that's a different genre than what the series is known for would probably rub people the wrong way. I think it would be something that would be worth giving a go if Belmont's Curse gives the series some footing again.
>>733648050Probably because people have Soulslike fatigue in general. Honestly though I don't hate the idea. I mean, maybe you don't have to make the combat too much like Souls but keeping the structure sounds like a good idea, like a Metroidvania with bonfires, like Bloodborne or something.
>>733648050It makes more sense to me with Platinum or Team Ninja. It should be fast paced combat.
bump
>>733656927Huh, I've actually never thought about the fact that early Castlevania doesn't have a Dodge button
>>733648351A fixed jump arc filters people regardless of the high quality of the game. Specially modern platformers that are forcused in giving movement tools to the player like air control, forgiving ledges and commitment cancel options.You see it in any other game other than Castlevania that uses the same jump system, like Prinny, those have a double jump but you are still commited to arcs and direction.Commited jumps demand an skill gate that most people are not willing to accept.
DUDE. CASTLEVANIA REBOOT WITH SERIOUS REALISTIC GRAPHICS! IMAGINE THAT. IMAGINE DARK, SERIOUS, AND DEEPLY MATURE STORYTELLING, WRITING, CHARACTERS, WORDBUILDING, LORE, AND DIALOGUE FOR A DEEPLY MATURE ADULT LIKE ME! IMAGINE A DEEPLY COMPLEX COMBAT SYSTEM AND LEVEL DESIGN THAT RIVALS THE BEST CINEMATIC RPGS LIKE DARK SOULS FROM LEGENDARY VIDEO GAME STUDIOS LIKE FROMSOFTWARE! CHALLENGING USE OF STAMINA BAR! SATISFYING REALISTIC MEATY ATTACK ANIMATIONS WITH REALISTIC WEIGHT! ENEMIES AND BOSSES THAT REQUIRE PERFECTLY TIMED DODGES AND PARRIES! MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN! IT WOULD BE EPIC!!!111!!1!!
Tbh. Action Castlevania could work. Ninja Gaiden managed to do it so I see no reason why it wouldn't work out, aside from skill issues.
>>733669150Didn't the new Ninja Gaiden bomb>>733667334No one is saying realistic graphics
>>733669552>Didn't the new Ninja Gaiden bombAccording to sales jeets. Personally, idc since it was fun.
>>733669150Lament of Innocence tried exactly this, and you can throw in Curse of Darkness and Lords of Shadow and whatever else. The most obvious problem is that Konami isn't throwing money at these, and the related problem is that they don't seem to have anyone who knows what to do. Ninja Gaiden 2004 was worked on by people who just finished a Dead or Alive. Konami could not make a fighting game. Even though it could work, it won't.
>>733669552Did the new Shinobi game bomb as well?
>>733648050>Dark Souls feels like a 3D version of the NES Castlevania gamesNo it doesn't. It's more Legacy of the Wizard than Castlevania.
>>733651209That game is utter dogshit dude
>>733656927Lmao get the fuck outta here balding boomer, Souls games mog the shit out of your archaic slop
